Ribbons in apps


Gene
 

I just found something interesting in the Microsoft Mail app for Windows 10.  I would imagine it also applies to the Windows 11 mail app.
Ribbons don't work quite the same way is in a full application.
If I am composing a message and press f6, I am placed in the ribbons on a formatting tab.

You have to down arrow to get to the lower formatting ribbon.  Then you can tab around as usual.
If I up arrow again anywhere as I tab around, I'm returned to the formatting tab.  I can right or left arrow to move to other tabs.  I can down arrow and then I can move through the tabs.

I wonder if this is typical if ribbons are used in Microsoft apps as opposed to applications.

I really don't like the mail app but someone on another list had a question about it and I found out what I'm discussing while I was looking for the answer.

Gene


 

Gene,

Universal Apps, of which the Mail App is one, use ribbons that are of "universal app" configuration, which is not the same as the ribbons we're familiar with in all the old-school installed apps.  In old-school installed apps (now called desktop apps) ALT + a letter throws focus into a specific ribbon.  That doesn't happen in the Mail App, though ALT (as well as F6) throws focus to the main ribbon where you can left/right arrow to the one of your choosing and down-arrow into it.

That same technique can be used in conventional ribbons, too, where you can think of the ribbon specifier much as you do a tab in multi-tab dialogs.  But the difference in conventional ribbons is that the "+ letter" throws focus directly into a specific ribbon, which you do have to down arrow or tab into if you wish to start traversing the first control to the last control, but you also have the option of hitting "next letter for control" to activate that control.

But for things like the individual controls (e.g., Bold formatting in the Format universal ribbon of the Mail App) the typical direct keyboard toggle, CTRL + B, still works.

I still dislike most of the universal apps, not so much because of the differences in accessibility techniques, but because they are, by and large, not as full-featured as their earlier brethern.  I despise the Windows 10/11 Mail App.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

    ~ H.L. Mencken, AKA The Sage of Baltimore


Gene
 

I don't like that app either. 

I hadn't used apps enough to run across ribbons in them and I found them while I was checking something else. 

Its interesting how they are similar and a little different.

Gene

On 1/1/2023 7:19 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

Gene,

Universal Apps, of which the Mail App is one, use ribbons that are of "universal app" configuration, which is not the same as the ribbons we're familiar with in all the old-school installed apps.  In old-school installed apps (now called desktop apps) ALT + a letter throws focus into a specific ribbon.  That doesn't happen in the Mail App, though ALT (as well as F6) throws focus to the main ribbon where you can left/right arrow to the one of your choosing and down-arrow into it.

That same technique can be used in conventional ribbons, too, where you can think of the ribbon specifier much as you do a tab in multi-tab dialogs.  But the difference in conventional ribbons is that the "+ letter" throws focus directly into a specific ribbon, which you do have to down arrow or tab into if you wish to start traversing the first control to the last control, but you also have the option of hitting "next letter for control" to activate that control.

But for things like the individual controls (e.g., Bold formatting in the Format universal ribbon of the Mail App) the typical direct keyboard toggle, CTRL + B, still works.

I still dislike most of the universal apps, not so much because of the differences in accessibility techniques, but because they are, by and large, not as full-featured as their earlier brethern.  I despise the Windows 10/11 Mail App.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

    ~ H.L. Mencken, AKA The Sage of Baltimore



Brian's Mail list account
 

Yes I tried this software a year or so back. It seems to me to offer no real ability than to read and write emails. If there is some filtering then I never found it and it seemed slow and spongy to use, its fare less featured than the old Outlook Express or even live mail was. I really don't understand why, since they make Outlook and the previous free software, they bothered with the mail app at all. They could easily have slightly tweaked something earlier to be in line with their look and feel and made it accessible.
Still as has been said many times, nobody knows the workings of the logic of large companies.
Somebody said to me once that the mail app was a bit like Rolls Royse making the Reliant Robin.
Brian

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Please address personal E-mail to:-
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@...>
To: <chat@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, January 02, 2023 1:33 AM
Subject: Re: [chat] Ribbons in apps


I don't like that app either.

I hadn't used apps enough to run across ribbons in them and I found them
while I was checking something else.

Its interesting how they are similar and a little different.

Gene

On 1/1/2023 7:19 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Gene,

Universal Apps, of which the Mail App is one, use ribbons that are of
"universal app" configuration, which is not the same as the ribbons
we're familiar with in all the old-school installed apps. In
old-school installed apps (now called desktop apps) ALT + a letter
throws focus into a specific ribbon. That doesn't happen in the Mail
App, though ALT (as well as F6) throws focus to the main ribbon where
you can left/right arrow to the one of your choosing and down-arrow
into it.

That same technique can be used in conventional ribbons, too, where
you can think of the ribbon specifier much as you do a tab in
multi-tab dialogs. But the difference in conventional ribbons is that
the "+ letter" throws focus directly into a specific ribbon, which you
do have to down arrow or tab into if you wish to start traversing the
first control to the last control, but you also have the option of
hitting "next letter for control" to activate that control.

But for things like the individual controls (e.g., Bold formatting in
the Format universal ribbon of the Mail App) the typical direct
keyboard toggle, CTRL + B, still works.

I still dislike most of the universal apps, not so much because of the
differences in accessibility techniques, but because they are, by and
large, not as full-featured as their earlier brethern. I despise the
Windows 10/11 Mail App.
--

Brian -Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

*/Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy./*

~ H.L. Mencken, AKA /The Sage of Baltimore/






 

On Mon, Jan 2, 2023 at 04:46 AM, Brian's Mail list account wrote:
Somebody said to me once that the mail app was a bit like Rolls-Royce making the Reliant Robin.
-
That about sums it up.  At the same time, for those that want a dirt simple email client without virtually any of the conventional bells and whistles, that includes an integrated inbox, the Mail App can fill the bill.

I hate it because I know so few, including myself, who don't want at least a few of the conventional bells and whistles that have remained missing from the Mail App ever since its introduction.  To me, it's the tinker toy of email clients.  There are so many better options, many of them free for home users.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

    ~ H.L. Mencken, AKA The Sage of Baltimore