Re: competition
Well to be honest being a jaws and old hal user for a while I was always taught that all the screen needed to be intercepted by a special driver.
That the system was not accessible other wise.
With nvda in its natural state and this was back with build 400 or so, it amazed how much was actually available to me, even on xp.
Desktop access, the net, most programs, basically everything jaws can do.
There are a few things nvda could do before jaws.
Being written in a scripting language, you had sub programs to run of this and they could be compiled programs in their own right or scripts.
You could also control the reader with a library.
And while some games and a few other programs need jaws or something, technology has changed a lot.
99.9% of all programs are fully web based or at least has a web component.
Most readers I have used are still ms web browser dependant The others caught on, but only windoweyes got close to our model with programs just for the system.
Jaws does this to now but any large module, ie leasy, you need to pay the price of a digital recorder or my ocr package.
One thing which stands out for nvda is that like linux it was written with the web in mind, not an old outdated os called windows 95 or 98 and then get added on to.
Before then I had used python for games, but that was it.
This actually shows how powerfull python can be as a language and its not even a full one like c its just a script.
Its easy to learn and as far as I know nvda is quite stable compared to some programs.
I always have a dream from time to time that nvda is its own os maybe android, or linux or something like that.
Ofcause it uses keyboard, touch and is voice recognition heavy.
It can do everything it can and more.
Especially when windows gets stressfull, I want to return to the old days where the blind had their own devices for their own things.
I still would like a blindy device for things like mail, and web, and maybe some media playback though my issue is not media as such.
I'd like an easy way to choose the interface of the os without changing the os.
So I'd like to switch interfaces.
a win7 interface, xp, etc, etc without any issues switching to either.
Similar to virtual desktops.
And the ability to use it for different things.
Windows xp for media and a few other things, something modern and safe for the net, and something else for something else.
Sadly no one has thought about this.
I know I can build mods in but if it was part of the system well.
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That the system was not accessible other wise.
With nvda in its natural state and this was back with build 400 or so, it amazed how much was actually available to me, even on xp.
Desktop access, the net, most programs, basically everything jaws can do.
There are a few things nvda could do before jaws.
Being written in a scripting language, you had sub programs to run of this and they could be compiled programs in their own right or scripts.
You could also control the reader with a library.
And while some games and a few other programs need jaws or something, technology has changed a lot.
99.9% of all programs are fully web based or at least has a web component.
Most readers I have used are still ms web browser dependant The others caught on, but only windoweyes got close to our model with programs just for the system.
Jaws does this to now but any large module, ie leasy, you need to pay the price of a digital recorder or my ocr package.
One thing which stands out for nvda is that like linux it was written with the web in mind, not an old outdated os called windows 95 or 98 and then get added on to.
Before then I had used python for games, but that was it.
This actually shows how powerfull python can be as a language and its not even a full one like c its just a script.
Its easy to learn and as far as I know nvda is quite stable compared to some programs.
I always have a dream from time to time that nvda is its own os maybe android, or linux or something like that.
Ofcause it uses keyboard, touch and is voice recognition heavy.
It can do everything it can and more.
Especially when windows gets stressfull, I want to return to the old days where the blind had their own devices for their own things.
I still would like a blindy device for things like mail, and web, and maybe some media playback though my issue is not media as such.
I'd like an easy way to choose the interface of the os without changing the os.
So I'd like to switch interfaces.
a win7 interface, xp, etc, etc without any issues switching to either.
Similar to virtual desktops.
And the ability to use it for different things.
Windows xp for media and a few other things, something modern and safe for the net, and something else for something else.
Sadly no one has thought about this.
I know I can build mods in but if it was part of the system well.
On 20/12/2017 7:29 p.m., Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:
I've been hearing about the cutbacks. Yes, I'm sure these agencies will make the switch to NVDA once the money runs out.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Sky Mundell
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2017 10:13 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] competition
Hello Sarah. I have to agree with you. There are cut backs going on in education and in the agencies for the blind, and these agencies will go for NVDA once the money runs dry, trust me they will.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Sarah k Alawami
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2017 9:44 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] competition
I'm actually up for competition. It will make each product better and better as time goes by.. I didn't want to use nvda in 2006 or 2007 when it came out as jaws at the time was the best. Now I won't touch jaws with a 10 foot pole. I tried to make my work switch but their excuse was that nvda was not meant for the word place and they would not consider it.
Take care
On Dec 19, 2017, at 9:17 AM, Lino Morales <linomorales001@... <mailto:linomorales001@...> > wrote:
Yes. All you have to do is go into the prefferences menu under tools and add-ons. Tab to get add-ons and your default browser should open to the page.
On 12/18/2017 8:45 PM, Karim Lakhani wrote:
I'm not sure what language you are writing?
What screen reader are you using voice over?
The reason I didn't want to downloads is because I don't know how?
When NVDA updates I get the notification and install it without worry about finding scripts, add no's or what ever window eye's use to call it.
Does that make sense to you?
<mailto:EMAIL:karim.lakhani@...> EMAIL:karim.lakhani@...
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can control is your character.
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From: <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> nvda@nvda.groups.io [ <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Lino Morales
Sent: Monday, December 18, 2017 6:26 PM
To: <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] competition
Thir is on ly one NVDA. You want add-ons download them. What does VO have to do with it? Meanwhile as Kereme hits the nog in Canada again...
On 12/18/2017 8:22 PM, Karim Lakhani wrote:
Could we as NVDA users have the choice which version works the best for the individual?
That way we can choose which version to down load?
personally the voice over APP. with the Phone's out of the box it's great.
People can jail break and all, so as the people who code NVDA, would have to be the persons who decides what is important.
<mailto:EMAIL:karim.lakhani@...> EMAIL:karim.lakhani@...
$$$$
SKYPE: goldenace4
$$$$
Your reputation is in the hands of others. That's what a
reputation is. You can't control that. The only thing you
can control is your character.
- Wayne Walter Dyer (1940-)
_____
From: <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> nvda@nvda.groups.io [ <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Sam Taylor
Sent: Monday, December 18, 2017 4:42 PM
To: <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] competition
Karim,
They are not included because Add-ons, as the name suggests, are optional. Integrating them into the installer would mean that the installer filesize would be inflated, resulting in a much bigger download for everyone.
On 19/12/2017 9:30 am, Karim Lakhani wrote:
Hi,
Can someone explain why add are not included in the main install of the APP.
If the add on's are useable by all the community, why not add them in the main install?
I hope this doesn't come down to the amount of data you have, I know it will be cheaper then 1800.00
Some of us don't have the knowledge to accomplish these functions.
I think it's like Elisa, she only gets smarter the more you use it.
<mailto:EMAIL:karim.lakhani@...> EMAIL:karim.lakhani@...
$$$$
SKYPE: goldenace4
$$$$
Your reputation is in the hands of others. That's what a
reputation is. You can't control that. The only thing you
can control is your character.
- Wayne Walter Dyer (1940-)
_____
From: <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> nvda@nvda.groups.io [ <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mike and Jenna
Sent: Monday, December 18, 2017 10:39 AM
To: <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] competition
I have to agree with this. My wife asked to question the other day why use NVDA if I have to install addons to do the stuff I want to do then also have to keep them updated. I see this a lot with the disability place I work for part time. I have several elders after showing them nvda and jaws have chosen jaws do to the fact they don’t have to deal with addons.
From: <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> nvda@nvda.groups.io[ <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Sunday, December 17, 2017 8:15 PM
To: <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] competition
A lot of NVDA users won't ever know enough to know that there are add ons nor how to install them. You are free to remove any add ons you don't want and, for experienced users who understand the implications, a no add ons NVDA can be offered if it really matters, which I don't think it does. I'm not talking about including add on after add on in NVDA. I'm saying that some add ons should be included because you aren't serving a lot of blind people well by not doing so, meaning the large number, who will never use add ons they have to download and install. Instead of spending time and resources reinventing the wheel just to make it a part of core NVDA code, just include the add on.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: <mailto:gera1027@...> Gerardo Corripio
Sent: Sunday, December 17, 2017 6:19 PM
To: <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] competition
What I've liked and am liking of the AddOns on NVDA is the ability to install those that suits are needs, thus NVDA should be pure as always, but with each of us adding the necessary AddOns for our daily use.
El 17/12/2017 a las 06:16 p.m., Rui Fontes escribió:
Sorry, Gene, but if some of the addons will be shipped with NVDA and set to run, they should stop being addons and start being part of NVDA core...
Addon, by definition, is a piece of software to execute a specific function that does not make part of the NVDA core...
Regards,
Rui Fontes
Às 00:07 de 18/12/2017, Gene escreveu:
NVDA doesn't have to adopt every popular feature of other screen-readers to compete. I don't have much opinion about whether this feature is implemented in NVDA directly or by an add on. It is a peripheral feature and not an actual screen-reader feature. It is a proper question whether NVDA development time and resources should be put into this project. And an add on wouldn't divert NVDA time and resources. However, when it comes to add ons, NVDA should do what Window-eyes used to do, not because Window-eyes does it, but because it serves users well, is logical and there is no reason of any substance not to do it.
Window-eyes used to accomplish a number of functions by having a number of what it pretentiously called apps, they were really scripts, but they were available to users as add ons and were shipped with Window-eyes and were set to run at the time of installation. Many users of whatever screen-reader they use will never learn enough to know anything about add ons. there are a number of add ons that should be incorporated into NVDA as addons that are downloaded and are running when NVDA is run.
If this were done, the major objection against making a feature an add on would be done away with. the objection is that a lot of people will never know about add ons and never use whatever is being discussed. If this objection were done away with by having many add ons be included in NVDA as running add ons at the time of download and installation or portable use, the whole question and argument about whether something should be an add on could be done away with.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: <mailto:lmddh50@...> Don H
Sent: Sunday, December 17, 2017 4:16 PM
To: <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] competition
When it comes to the new screen shade function in Jaws 2018 and if NVDA
should also have the same function the main question is whether or not
NVDA is in competition with other screen readers in order to get more
users or is NVDA just a free screen reader for those who can't afford to
pay for a screen reader.