Re: A few observations with NVDA 2018.1

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>

Joseph, that’s perfectly fine. There’s absolutely no rush, bro. take your time. I appreciate very much what you are continually doing for the NVDA and the Windows 10 community. Further,I appreciate you looking further into this matter.





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From: Joseph Lee
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2018 11:48 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A few observations with NVDA 2018.1



This is because UIA isn’t treating it as a context menu item at all. Debug output shows that:

  1. When you move amongst context menu items, NVDA’s UIA support system will try to fetch nearest text, which happens to be the top result.
  2. Once the “text” is gathered, it’ll speak it.
  3. NVDA will then notice that item selection UIA event was fired and will look for focus movement.
  4. NVDA will announce menu item you’ve moved to.

Ultimately, according to UI Automation (not NVDA), Start menu context menu is a list powered by Edge, hence the confusion.

As for tile movements, this is because NVDA does not support UIA dragging events. I’ll cook up something that’ll at least let NVDA note down drag events for further analysis (it’ll be done this way first because I’m about to enter feature freeze for WintenApps 18.04).




From: <> On Behalf Of Jaffar Sidek
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2018 8:28 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A few observations with NVDA 2018.1


Hi.  I can confirm this.  I tried with three apps specifically, Thunderbird, This pc and Device manager.  when you press the context menu and arrow up or down, the first two letters of the app is spoken in conjunction with the context menu items, for example, "thwrite message" for Thunderbird.  Cheers!


On 3/20/2018 11:17 PM, Ronald J Glaser wrote:

Using a snap shot of nvda the out look speaking the first part still exsists as well. so I also again do agree with chrsi, this has to be a nvda issue


On 3/20/2018 9:33 AM, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:

Hey there guys.


I’m experiencing a few things with NVDA 2018.1.


Firstly, my build of Windows:


Version 1709 (OS Build 16299.192)


Two things. Firstly, when I open the start menu and then search for something, say, for example, I do a search for outlook. I then hear Outlook 2016 Desktop app, which is normal, but then here’s where the kind of strange thing is coming into play.


If I press either shift+F10 or my application’s key to open up the context menu on sed item, As I then down arrow through the context menu, I’m continuously with each press of the down arrow key hearing the first syllable of the word outlook.


So for example, instead of hearing pin to taskbar, I’d hear, out pin to taskbar. Only it’s not even the word out. It’s more like ow. The t phoneme gets cut off entirely. So, realisticly, it’s more like, alpin to taskbar. Ow open. Etc. Why in the world is it doing this? Just for reference, I don’t have this problem with JAWS 2018, so clearly, this appears from what little knowledge I know, to be an NVDA thing specifically. Now, whether this is a falt of NVDA in a whole, or a falt of the Windows 10 Essentials addon, I’m not sure. It might even be a combination of both. I just don’t know.


The other thing I am observing which really would be nice is, I’ve tried using alt+shift+arrow keys on my start screen to move my pinned tiles around and rearrange them. Though this works absolutely beautifully by the way, I find that it’s a little bit confusing as though I hear the row/column coordinants when arrowing around, and also can hear the group headers, it’s hard for one to know what row/column of a particular group header certain tiles are being moved into when using alt+shift+arrows, as NVDA won’t announce this information as you’re moving. Therefore, you have to kind of mentally in your head keep things mathematicly straight. For instance, if I’m on the second header group on a row, and in that group the tile is one row by one column big, and I know I want that item in the first columm first row of the first header group on that row, if the icon initially is in row 2 collumn 2, then I know I need to move it up one row with alt+shift+up arrow, then to get to that first group in row 1 collumn 1, I’d have to then alt+left arrow 7 times. The first press to go to column 1 of that same group, the next to scoach it over to the previous left hand group’s collum 6, then 5 more times to get it over to column 1.


Hopefully, I’ve not just made your heads explode trying to think through that. You see though my point. This is very difficult, at best, as you really don’t have any feedback from NVDA as you’re moving the icon around. So one may have to move the tile a few places, then check, and see what group/coordinants within that group the tile is now located, then either continue, or compensate for their miscounting calculation. It can be done, but it’s a major pain in the arse.


This leads me to a proposal. How hard would it be either natively in NVDA, or within the Win10 Essentials addon to get it so that NVDA, while moving the tyle, to read the coordinants as it does just by arrowing around? I think this would be great for users, as being able to rearrange those items has really sped up my workflow.




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