good post, I use the same as you as it was you that let us know about it. I can't remember if you put vipper in the list I may have the spelling wrong as nvda seems to think I do thanks for your indulgence.
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On 07/03/2016 22:25, Nimer Jaber wrote:
I am writing this not from my Admin hat, although the way this thread
degenerates may or may not change that.
MSE is very poorly rated on many levels, and it is my belief that
telling a user that it is sufficient to run it along with safe computer
practices is just inaccurate. It is very possible and likely to
contract computer infections even if one practices all safe behavior. It
no longer just takes a user engaging in risky behaviors to get malware
on a machine, and moreover even if it did and this was the only way of
contracting malware, this would mean that your expectation is that a
human is 100% safe and will do the right thing 100% of the time, which
is wildly inaccurate in my opinion. And even if you disagree with what I
am stating, having this debate about whether MSE is sufficient or not
every single week won't help us get any closer to deciding whether a
user should use it. MSE is accessible and Windows Defender is included
in newer versions of Windows. For you, this may be a reason to use it
along with your safer practices of computing. I'm okay with that if your
decision is to do so, however MSE is very, very poorly rated on many
levels by a multitude of tests that I can link to if anybody is
interested, and from a security perspective, it is irresponsible to tell
a user that MSE is good enough if they stay safe.
Anyway, a good wiki article about tools that work with NVDA and a
campaign to work with security vendors on this accessibility would not
be a bad idea. I will list some tools that I know about that are accessible.
Eset Security Suite Version 8 (9 is not accessible, and the company is
aware and says they are working on a fix)
Vipre Security Suite
I believe some reported that AVG is somewhat accessible.
Also, I believe that someone reported that Kaspersky is accessible once
you get past the installer which is inaccessible.
I use Sophos Home Cloud Anti-virus. It is my favorite for many reasons.
It is free, it is put out by a company that primarily secures larger
companies, it is cloud-based and completely accessible, and it doesn't
pack in a bunch of other products in a security suite that I do not require.
Spybot S&D and Spyware Blaster seem to work pretty well. Malware Bytes
also works well. I use WinPatrol, and that adds an extra level of
security, although I am rethinking this as it seems to be redundant to UAC.
I'm sure others can list other accessible products. Unfortunately, I
wish that others would be more accessible, however they are not at this
On 3/7/2016 4:08 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
The number of "pure" antivirus programs along with antivirus as a part
of security suites has become ridiculously large. You will also find,
if you research ratings at length, that while there is a short list of
10 to 15 that consistently get top ratings that if you pay attention
to how the ratings are performed (and that does vary) that it still
throws into question whether you have a real answer to which program
I have said before, and I will say again, that you should not be
relying on antivirus programs to give you 100% protection from viruses
as any new computer virus has the potential to make its way to your
computer before it has been identified and the signatures for that
virus get added to a given antivirus program's detection list. The
best defense is simply being careful about where you browse on the web
and what you open in terms of e-mail attachments. Never open messages
that "seem fishy" to you based upon the subject not being in character
for the person you've received it from or things coming in from an
You can actually get a pretty decent idea about your browsing and
e-mail hygiene based upon two things:
1. Have you ever been infected and, if so, how frequently?
2. Has your antivirus program ever reported an infection to you? [You
could also check the log files regarding what, if anything, has
If you're never getting (or very, very seldom) getting infected and
your existing antivirus isn't quarantining things on a frequent basis
then your own behavior is already consistent with what's wise for
avoiding infection. If this is the case, pretty much all of the
commercial antivirus programs, including Microsoft Security Essentials
(for those still on Win7) or Windows Defender (Win8 and later), will
prove to be more than adequate to give you the protection you need.
It's also wise to have an antimalware program (e.g., Malwarebytes
<https://www.malwarebytes.org/>) and an antispyware program (e.g.,
Spywareblaster <https://www.brightfort.com/spywareblaster.html> or
SuperAntiSpyware <http://superantispyware.com/>) since viruses,
malware, and spyware are not the same thing and many antivirus
programs don't look at anything but viruses and closely related attacks.
Another excellent program to have on your computer if you like to
download software, even from reputable sources, to give it a try is
Unchecky <https://unchecky.com/>. Pretty much all vendors are now
getting into the loathsome practice of bundling, where they'll have
things like toolbars, other programs, or the like bundled with the
program that you actually want and if you are not careful to uncheck
the checkboxes for things such as, "Install crazy toolbar as well,"
or, "Install free trial of premium version" [when what you really want
and need is simply the free version of something], you end up with all
sorts of crud on your computer that you really don't want. I recently
had to uninstall a lot of unwanted programs on a client's computer
that got there because he had one of his children assist him and
neither one of them were at all vigilant about the questions asked
during installation and simply answered in the affirmative to all of
them. Unchecky will notify you about what it's unchecked and you have
the option to recheck anything if that's what you want. So far no one
has told me there are any accessibility problems with Unchecky.