Re: determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA


Gene
 

I'm not discussing when it is appropriate for a manufacturer to state a program is accessible.  and certainly, it is common for accessibility to be improperly or incompletely implemented.  I'm saying that if blind people who want to use a wide variety of programs learn to try different things and look around effectively, they will be able to use a lot of programs they either can't otherwise or not nearly as effectively. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2018 12:50 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA

I do also think, though that when you listen to people from companies like
Microsoft saying they have made this or that accessible, it should be so,
not need the person to be trying lots of different ways to make work
something which does not.
 I'm not criticising you, just saying that there are mitigating
circumstances and we are still battling against the problem of the
manufacturer not understanding the problem for us that speech is a narrow
band  feedback system unlike sight.
 Lets  use as an Example the continuously changing Skype problems as an
example!
 Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2018 1:17 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA


You are evidently talking about looking at dates in the calendar in the XP
System Restore.  This shows the importance of looking at interfaces and
finding alternative ways of doing something if they exist.  XP has a show
next and show previous day button.  it also has a show next and previous
month button.  I never used the calendar.  I used these buttons.  If I
wanted to go back two or three days, I would press the show previous day
button two times if I wanted to go back two days or three times if I wanted
to go back three days.  Then, any restore point or points would be shown as
links.  It is a web-page-like interface.  Never assume what is or isn't in
an interface.  And if one screen-reader just says button, button, try
another.  I believe that NVDA didn't see the labels for all of the buttons
in System Restore.  I'm explaining all this not because a lot of people use
XP any longer.  I'm explaining it to show how, if people assume and don't
try another screen-reader, or maybe two, they may render a task almost
undoable when it's actually quite easy.

Also regarding the buttons, my recollection is that JAWS didn't read the
labels unless you turned off the virtual PC cursor, then it did.  So you
have to do things that wouldn't be necessary if the interface were properly
accessible but it is very useable, though not properly accessible.

As I said, never assume and look around.  Those are very important things to
keep in mind.  I realize that there are people with all sorts of different
skills and knowledge on the list but there are many people who hamper
themselves, sometimes considerably, because they have the knowledge and the
underlying skills but they don't look around and they assume.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
----- Original Message -----

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2018 1:31 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA


To be honest, I don't think I've ever seen a spreadsheet where the leading -
sign is missing. If this marking as red is an alternative, it should I would
have thought be expected that  the software would be able to toggle between
marking in colour and a minus sign.


That would seem to lay this particular weirdness at Microsofts door. It is a
bit like the stupid problem in the XP system restore where in order to work
out which dates had restore points you had to find out the style of font it
was written in!

Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22590@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2018 11:53 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA


Hi,

Fixing this will require looking at not only what accessibility API’s say,
but also the object model for Excel and possible variations across Excel
releases (made a bit complicated these days thanks to Office 365 and Office
2016/2019 transition).

Cheers,

Joseph



From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2018 3:50 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA



Mary,

             I just played with this and was shocked that NVDA did not read
"negative" along with the number when this formatting is used.  It is one of
the standard formats allowed by Excel for negative numbers and the fact that
it is negative is something that the screen reader should be detecting.  The
display should be entirely secondary to the actual cell content when it
comes to what gets read.

             As far as I'm concerned this should be considered a bug.  That
being said, Narrator makes the same mistake (which is still a bug, which
I've reported via the Feedback Hub).
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763

The terrible state of public education has paid huge dividends in ignorance.
Huge.  We now have a country that can be told blatant lies — easily
checkable, blatant lies — and I’m not talking about the covert workings of
the CIA. When we have a terrorist attack, on September 11, 2001 with 19
men — 15 of them are Saudis — and five minutes later the whole country
thinks they’re from Iraq — how can you have faith in the public? This is an
easily checkable fact. The whole country is like the O.J. Simpson jurors.

      ~ Fran Lebowitz in Ruminator Magazine interview with Susannah McNeely
(Aug/Sept 2005)



















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