Re: Touch cursor support

Rui Fontes


Let me try to explain a litle more technically...

All windows are formed by several objects of various types...
By instance, NotePad is an object, composed by child objects: application
menu bar, system menu bar, text area and status bar.

When you are navigating by object, using NVDA+4, NVDA+5, NVDA+6, you are
moving to the prior object, reading the actual object or moving to the next
So, using Gene example, you start in the text area, and with NVDA+4 you will
move to the application menu bar...

NVDA+8 lets you move to the object containing the actual one. Returning to
Gene example, you go to the Untitled NotePad window.
In this level, if you use NVDA+4 or NVDA+6 you will move between the several
windows you have open on your machine...
If you press again NVDA+8, you will go up another level and you'll reach the
Desktop, the object containing all window applications, start menu and so
on. As Gene pointed, as Desktop is the object containing all others, it is
not possible to move to the prior or next object in this level since it is
the only one in this level...

To return to the NotePad application you must go down one level, pressing
NVDA+2, and then NVDA+6 to walk through the various application windows

If the object navigation is understood, we can move to the other navigation
methods, like screen review and document review...


-----Mensagem Original-----
De: Gene
Data: sábado, 2 de julho de 2016 01:14
Assunto: Re: [nvda] Touch cursor support

It's easier, in my opinion, to demonstrate how object navigation works than
to try to explain it. After it is demonstrated, an explanation might be
helpful but I learned how to use object navigation by experimentation with
very little reliance on explanations.

Do the following:
This discussion uses the desktop keyboard layout. I don't use the laptop
layout and am notfamiliar with it.
Issue the command numpad insert numpad 7. That is, hold numpad insert and
while doing so press 7. Do this until you have moved through the review
options you can move to in that way. Then move back using numpad insert
numpad one. Stop at object navigation.
Now, open some simple program everyone has on their computer. Let's use
Write the word "test."
Now, issue the command numpad insert numpad 4. You will move from the
document window to another part of the program.
Now issue the command numpad insert numpad 6. You are back in the document
window again. You have moved first to a different object, then back to the
document window, the object you started on.
Now issue the command numpad insert numpad 8.
You have moved out of the document window and are now at an object that says
untitled notepad window. Move up again with the same command. I'm not sure
what you will hear depending on your version of Windows. You may hear
desktop window. Try moving to the left and right by object with numpad 4
and 6. At least on my machine, I hear no next, no previous.
So move down one level again with numpad insert numpad 2. On my machine, I
can't move to the left but I can move to the right from where I am. If I
move to the right enough times, I get to untitled notepad window again.
Move down once to get back into the Notepad program. Start moving to the
right, I don't think you can move to the left. If you move enough times,
you will be back in the edit field with the word test you wrote awhile ago.

The point is that you first moved to the window, then continuing to move
down you moved into the window and then moved right object by object until
you got back into the edit field.

Experiment and look around. You may find that by looking around and
experimenting, things start to make sense as you conceptualize what you are
doing as you move.
Try moving around using the move left and right commands and moving up and
down and then using the move left and right commands. Note that you can
move to a lot of structures. Some you can move into and some you can't
because you are already in them.

If you get lost, you can always return to the program window where you
started by alt tabbing out of and then alt tabbing until you return to the

This demonstration may not explain things technically precisely accurately
in terms of definitions. I'm not sure I know exactly how to explain
everything technically accurately. The point is to experiment and get a
concept of what you are doing by experimentation and observation.

This may or may not allow you to understand everything. But this kind of
experimentation, along with working with a good tutorial section that
explains object navigation may allow you to understand it.

Also, note carefully that if you leave NVDA set to screen review, you can't
review the screen accurately much of the time if you intend to move
somewhere and then use the standard review commands such as numpad 8 read
current line. You must have NVDA set for object navigation to have review
work reliably. I have said before that most NVDA users don't and won't
understand this and that you should automatically be returned to object
review when you leave the window you are in. I still feel strongly about


----- Original Message -----
From: Ann Byrne
Sent: Friday, July 01, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Touch cursor support

How is each one invoked?
At 04:03 PM 7/1/2016, you wrote:
A good example is Windows 10’s Settings app
(Windows+I) where you do need to use object
navigation to read descriptions of settings.

[] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Friday, July 1, 2016 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Touch cursor support

Joseph Lee wrote: "If you are using Windows 8,
8.1 or 10, use of object navigation is essential when using newer style

Joseph, is there any material somewhere that
gives some discussion or examples of using
object navigation and the review cursor using some "real world" example?

I have not been able to get my arms around this,
and it's probably because I'm trying to use it
"in the wrong place." I strongly suspect that
had I known how to use these features the
step-by-step pizza ordering instructions for the
Pizza Hut website I was trying to create might
have been completed. I had one of those rare
"throw up my hands and walk away" moments
because I could not figure out how to get NVDA
to "play correctly" with the various pop-up
overlays, etc., and I'm almost certain it can.

Even if you could direct me to either an app or
a website that's a good sandbox for this undertaking I'd appreciate it.


I worry a lot. . . I worry that no matter how
cynical you become it's never enough to keep up.
~ Trudy, in Jane Wagner's "Search for
Signs of Intelligent Life in the Universe"

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