Re: Admin's Notes Re List Conduct, Please Read #adminnotice


On Mon, Jan 4, 2021 at 02:54 PM, Orlando Enrique Fiol wrote:
In many of these "pushback" exchanges, the pusher isn't teaching this person how to fish at all; they're just scolding them and sending them away for being piss-poor fishermen.
Exactly, and that's actually appropriate in many cases.   I am sick to death of the expectation that pervades many of these venues that I should not be able to expect that virtually anyone on them can do a basic web search and/or archive search, and particularly the former, long, long, long before they ever subscribed.

There are times where a good, solid dope slap is precisely what's needed to wake folks up from their torpor, and I have zero issue when someone elects to do so.  The guilty party should take offense, because they're being told off for having done something offensive.  Then they should think upon that and either do for themselves or ask about how they can learn to do for themselves.

And if you've never learned, and some of your best lessons, after being mocked, then you are a rare bird indeed.  Some of the most important lessons I've ever learned, particularly about how to approach asking for help, is after I've been given a firm verbal dressing down for having been lazy and rude and expecting to have things handed to me on a silver platter.  And that's not just in computing, either.

Adults need to behave like adults, and expect to be treated like same.  I've said it before and I'll say it again:  Not all venues should be considered remedial.  Most shouldn't.

And I will say that I don't treat those who are blind any differently than I do those who are sighted, with the exception of reasonable accommodations to that specific state.  Nor should I.  If I'd give a sighted person grief for a specific action then at least 99 times out of 100 the same grief should be given to an individual whose blind if they do the same thing.

Also, how we handle things as individuals, IRL (in real life) can diverge at times quite significantly from how we may present online.  There are scads of people I've helped privately but that's really not relevant to how things should work on-group.  There are reasons I have done many things privately, and that's mostly because I knew I could not answer definitively on-group because there were too many variables that could take days of back and forth but probably minutes of "let me look."  I (or you, or anyone assisting privately) get to make those decisions because they are in situations we have chosen and where two people, not over 1400, are likely involved.


Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

The depths of denial one can be pushed to by outside forces of disapproval can make you not even recognize yourself to yourself.

       ~ Brian Vogel


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