Re: Yahoo password
I'm quite sure I saw a Hadley course discussed on one or more lists. This was a good while ago. It might be useful for those who know about it to verify that my memory is correct and perhaps to discuss the course.
I don't think you perpetuated anything. I wrote my first message because I wondered why you didn't mention quick navigation keys in your description. Later, I wanted to discuss the inefficiency of not using such keys. it wasn't particularly because of what you do, but because I have no idea how many other people might be following the thread and I have no idea what they do or know. But since we have discussed this now, those following the thread are well aware of our views and that is one of the points of the list, to inform through discussion and disagreements.
I appreciate you understanding my position and the exchange served a good purpose.
The course you are discussing from Freedom Scientific is called Surf's Up. I have no idea how it compares with the hadley course. I looked at a small amount of it a number of years ago and my objection to the part I looked at is that it introduced such things as the links list and used such things extensively very early in the course when I strongly believe that people should be dealing with web pages and not with artificial structures for their early learning. I don't want to discourage those who don't want to or can't take the Hadley course from using the Freedom Scientific material but if the Hadley course teaches more in the way I believe is superior, I hope that those with a choice seriously consider the hadley course.
Also, for those who are interested, awhile ago, I made a zip file available for the early part of my tutorial, separated from the rest. This early part teaches basic web page navigation and some people may want to use it. it was created before NVDA existed so I don't cover NVDA commands but the concepts may be useful.
Read the introduction before working with the tutorial. Also, keep in mind that the tutorial was done before such features as automatically entering and leaving forms mode were available. So, depending on how you move through forms, entering and leaving forms mode, as I demonstrate, may not be necessary. It may be automatic. Also, these are very old web pages and may bear little or no resemblance to the current pages. They are still good for teaching but the current pages may be quite different and may have more structures such as headings.
You may download the tutorial excerpt here:
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, September 26, 2016 11:46 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Yahoo password
Thanks, but Gene is still right in the fact that people really should learn the keystrokes to navigate webpages. It is that whole give a man a fish or teach him how to fish kind of thing. I get his frustration, But I just was not expecting to perpetuate it
I don't recall Hadley having a course on using the Internet. But, I do think that freedom scientific has a tutorial for this sort of thing. It has been years since I took it though so I have no idea if it is still there. I think it was called go surf or something.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Sep 26, 2016, at 10:33 PM, Gary Bowers <gdbowers@...> wrote:
> Melissa ,
> You are absolutely correct.
> You answered the question in a way that allowed anyone to use any preferred additional navigational skills.
> You gave them the roadmap.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: email@example.com [mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org] On Behalf Of Melissa
> Sent: Monday, September 26, 2016 5:59 PM
> To: email@example.com
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Yahoo password
> I know the one letter navigation keys, but I didn't think to put those in the list of what I did to change my password. I don't fully trust sites I'm not all that aquainted with so when I'm investigating I first go down line by line with the arrow keys. Yes, that is time-consuming, but I feel comfortable doing things that way until I learn the site better.
> Plus, there are a lot of "clickable" tags so I felt it safer to just arrow down incase I missed something. I found what I needed right away so I admit to not looking around and experimenting more. I also don't know this person very well so I don't know their level of understanding for commands and thought just a straight listing of what I did, minus keystrokes, was okay.
> I thought it was helping and I wasn't expecting a lecture about my methods to quickly get something done on a website I'm not familiar with and just stating exactly what I did. If you don't know what to search for, some sites use login, sign in, log off or sign out, and the time spent typing in possibilities to search for arrowing down could've gotten to the same place. Normally login options for sites are near the top so I didn't feel I needed to try and skip around with one letter navigation.
> Sorry if I sound defensive about this. I normally use many of the keystrokes for one letter navigation in webpages and just on my computer itself and your response just rubbed me the wrong way.
>> On 9/26/16, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
>> Why can't you simply issue the command f when at the top of the home
>> page to move to the first form field and repeat the search until you
>> get to the right one? or if you know the field you are looking for is
>> an edit field, your screen-reader may have a command such as the
>> letter e to move you to the first edit field from the top of the page.
>> If it isn't the right one, you can repeat the command until you get
>> there just as you can with the letter f.
>> If you are looking for a link you have to follow that might sign in,
>> you can use the search command from the top of the page and search for
>> what you think might be correct. If you are talking about moving to
>> something that is almost at the rtop of the page, these methods may
>> not matter but my7 point is that a lot of blind Internet users waste
>> an enormous amount of time because they don't know or use these
>> methods. I am not assuming my suggestions are the best for what we are discussing on this specific page.
>> But they will save people a lot of time if generally practiced.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Melissa
>> Sent: Monday, September 26, 2016 4:22 PM
>> To: firstname.lastname@example.org
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Yahoo password
>> What you need to do is go near the top of the home page of yahoo.com
>> and then work your way down the mass of links/options until you get to
>> where it asks you to sign in.
>> It will first ask for your username, you@..., then hit next and
>> enter in your password.
>> Once you login, and start at the beginning of the page, you can hit H
>> for headings to get to the list of options you can edit, like profile,
>> mail, and stuff like that. I only messed around enough to change my
>> password and I did that a while ago so I can't really offer a step by
>> step guide on how to change your password. I don't use yahoo mail and
>> only have the account to use yahoo groups.
>> On 9/26/16, Walmir Schultz via Groups.io
>> <wsautodidata@...> wrote:
>>> I use Thunderbird to read my e-mail.
>>> Now Yahoo is warning about the need to change passwords.
>>> How can I do it in the web site?
>>> I navigated on the page for hours and did not find where to do it.
>>> The Yahoo accessibility help is useless....