Date   

Re: strange thing happening in thunderbird

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Hi again, Jim,


I think Gene does have the right idea. That's weird that descending takes the newer messages to tetop on your windows 7 mechine but ascending does the same thing on your windows 10 computer. This is a brand-new windows 10 computer that I got recently.


I tried the mail ap too and it's not totally accessible yet. I may end up switching to seamonkey.


Rosemarie

On 11/16/2016 5:02 AM, The Gamages wrote:
Hello again rosemary,

Having checked on two different installations of Thunderbird on my two
computers, I notice that the older one on my W7 computer is set to
descending and the one on the W10 computer is set to ascending. both
show the messages as the newest at the top. So I reckon that Gene has
the right idea, if one doesn't work, try the other. It seems that the
two terms , [ascending and descending], are open to interpretation, I
find Thunderbird a bit strange in some respects, for instance, I have
set it to let me download messages, but it still does so automatically
at start up, maybe the program is a little unstable in general? I may
get sighted help to determine whether settings are working from the
keyboard.
I prefer Live mail on my W7 computer and hope that the mail app for "10
will become a little more screen reader friendly, but I'm not holding my
breath.



Best Regards, Jim.
-----Original Message-----
From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 10:16 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] strange thing happening in thunderbird

Hi, Jim,

Isn't ascending where the new messages go to the bottom?

Rosemarie



The Gamages wrote:
Hello rosemary,

Try setting it to ascending.



Best Regards, Jim.
-----Original Message-----
From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 5:52 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] strange thing happening in thunderbird

Hi, everyone,


I decided to stay with thunderbird instead of going to seamonkey. I
discovered something weird. I have the decending checked but the new
messages are going to the bottom instead of coming to the top. What
could be going wrong?


Thanks for your help in advance.


Rosemarie











Re: seamonkey and windows 10

Jeremy <icu8it2@...>
 

It's not super horrible in that you've only got to configure the ports and such once, but yeah, it is kind of frustrating that it's not handled automatically. Being that thunderbird, firefox and the email/browser parts of seamonkey are so closely related, I was really surprised when I had to configure them. It is still really a neat little program though.
Take care.

On 11/15/2016 2:42 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

That's weird. Maybe I'll end up staying with thunderbird.




On 11/15/2016 10:15 AM, Salva wrote:

Hi.

 

The only disadvantage is that in Seamonkey Email you have to configure manually imap, smtp and ports for the accounts,.

Salva

 

¡Atención! Usted está recibiendo un correo electrónico de una persona ciega. Por favor, si envía imágenes o gráficos, descríbalos al pie del mismo. ¡La inclusión la hacemos entre todos!

 

De: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] En nombre de Jeremy
Enviado el: martes, 15 de noviembre de 2016 19:11
Para: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Asunto: Re: [nvda] seamonkey and windows 10

 

Howdy, :)
Seamonkey does work pretty well with NVDA and for those who like to have their browser/email stuffed into the same package, it's pretty nice. For the most part, all of the plugins that you are used to using on firefox will work too, minus just a few that are updated in such a way as to make them only work inside the firefox specific way of doing things. Either way, it's definitely worth grabbing it and seeing what ya think.
Take care.

On 11/14/2016 7:47 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

Seamonkey and Firefox share a lot of common cyber-DNA (going all the way back to Netscape) and are both under the Mozilla Foundation.  I see no reason why it wouldn't work perfectly well under Windows 10.  I do not know how accessible it is, though, unless the scripts for Firefox work for it or there were ones written specifically for Seamonkey.

I used Seamonkey for many years before I decided I didn't need or want anything other than a web browser, at which point I started using Firefox.
--
Brian

Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.  If you’re alive, it isn’t.

    ~ Lauren Bacall

    

 

 




Re: spss inaccessibility: absolutely inexcusable

 

SPSS (if it's the same SPSS I know of, and it probably is), was originally called the Statistical Package for the Social Sciences, is ancient, and has long since come into common use for number crunching in many disciplines.  That being said, SPSS was developed long before accessibility was on virtually anyone's radar.

I was, for a very long time, under the grossly mistaken impression that screen readers had been developed such that they could make a decent attempt to read virtually anything that might pop up on a screen.  I was recently disabused of that notion when working with a client who was expected to be able to use Interaction Desktop by Interaction Intelligence and a number of custom screen-based, but not web-based, programs developed for the client company.  It became abundantly clear instantly that JAWS (in this case, but it could have been any screen reader, this isn't JAWS bashing) was utterly incapable of interpreting the first thing that was on the screen because the underlying scripting for these applications did not exist.  We take for granted the way screen readers do function with common office suites and web browsers because an untold number of hours have been dedicated to creating the scripting that ships with them to handle these programs.  There is no way that any company can develop scripts "for everything" so the focus will logically be on the things that can benefit the most people in the most settings.   SPSS is absolutely a niche market, writ large.  In the context of the population at large, blind or not, very, very few people will ever touch SPSS.  That would not be a logical place to dedicate a lot of resources to as a result.

The above being said, after my experience with the client I made reference to, I was able to determine that there are several sites that had blind individuals using the software in question and that a significant scripting base was in place already and I believe it was actually done by Freedom Scientific.  What I do not understand is why companies like Freedom Scientific, when they're doing this work, do not have some contractual language in place that allows them to add said scripts to a central repository that they would maintain.   It is insane to keep reinventing the wheel, and that's exactly what happens when it comes to relatively little used commercial software when scripts have to be created, again and again, for each blind user at each site.  I was shocked that Freedom Scientific could not tell me whether any scripts existed or whether JAWS was known to have been used over Interaction Desktop.  Screen readers themselves are niche markets in the grand scheme of things and they would be boosting their respective reputations and really serving an important function of increasing accessibility for niche products if they set themselves up as centralized script repositories, with the proviso that they are not actively maintaining said scripts, just so a baseline would exist to work with when needed.

You can't convince me that SPSS hasn't been scripted, probably hundreds of times now, but where, for what screen reader or screen readers, who knows?
--
Brian

Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.  If you’re alive, it isn’t.

    ~ Lauren Bacall

    



Re: spss inaccessibility: absolutely inexcusable

mohammad suliman
 

This link explains how to configure android studio accessibility, which is a java program. The "activate support for screen readers" section can help you also:

On Wed, 16 Nov 2016 at 15:44 Jacques <lists4js@...> wrote:
I usually don't like sending "I agree" messages to a mailing list, but
this one will have to be an exception. I fully agree with Erik, it's a
pity that some people's talents are limited to complaining.

If the commercial screen readers were so great, those thinking so should
stick to it and leave the NVDA devs and contributors to make a great
product even greater.

I've been around the block a few times, since the old Window Bridge
days, and everything and anything in between, always seeking better ways
to get the job done. NVDA is the screen reader I exclusively use now.
Folks should read the user guide and explore the wonder of the object
navigator. It has often enough got me out of a sticky situation, yes,
also where the commercial products failed.

Off my soap box.

A good day to all.


Jacques

On Wednesday, 16 November 2016 15:25, Erik burggraaf wrote:
> Why is this inexcusible?  SPSS is at least 20 years old, probably more.
> It has several iterations, including the ability to build custom web
> apps for using spss databases.  It's a monstrously expensive proprietary
> institutional software made by people with very little  demonstrated
> interest in including the blind community.
> Only part of the support we enjoy in N vda is developer direct.  Items
> like office and adobe support came to us sponsored by microsoft and
> adobe.  Other features came from third party developers , or by funding
> from private individuals.  The NVDA Remote add-on for example of one
> such project.
>
> There's a reason why freedom scientific charged thousands of dollars.
> They carried the weight of the accessibility world on their shoulders,
> and despite what you may think, they were very unsteady on their feet
> most of the time.  Still, as you say, they often got the job done.
>
> Using NVDA allows you to take charge of your own accessibility in a
> manner that jaws never did.  If you paid top dollar for jaws and found
> that it didn't meet a specific need, you filed a report and prayed
> support would come around in a year or two or three after you paid a
> little more.  Meanwhile, maybe some one with your exact issue paid
> extravigant amounts of money to a script developer to make jaws do what
> you need it to do, but the development work belonged to the corporate
> entity who developed it, and they're not making any information about it
> available because they don't think they can make money from it, and they
> don't want other companies duplicating their work for nothing.  Hooray
> for old paradigm corporate accessibility.
>
> With NVDA, you can leverage the power of a huge and highly reputible
> open source community.  In stead of making this all about your
> acceptence and your outrage, why not take charge of the issue?  Network
> with other blind students and professionals who use SPSS.  Network with
> federally funded institutions who use SPSS.  Bring some private backing
> to java or whoever makes the thing and ask for corporate support to make
> SPSS compatible with nvda, either by upgrades to the software itself,
> enhanced NVDA support, or a combination of the two.  If you approach
> people the right way, work hard, and make the right connections, you can
> make a project like this happen much faster in the NVDA system than you
> could waiting for freedom scientific to build and maintain what you need.
>
> I'm sorry it didn't work out for you right away, but NVDA is your screen
> reader.  You decide what it supports and what not.  If there is anything
> we can do to help you get the support you need, I'm sure we will be appy
> to help, but you'd better begin by accepting the situation as is if you
> want to go forward.
>
> Best,
>
> Erik
>
> Sent with AquaMail for Android
> http://www.aqua-mail.com
>
>
> On November 16, 2016 5:52:19 AM enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...>
> wrote:
>
>> hi,
>>
>> I got spss to be slightly more accessible by enabling the java access
>> bridge. However, nvda cannot read any of the controls. The log shows a
>> windows access violation error. I find this to be absolutely
>> unacceptable that nvda doesn't support such an important program.  The
>> same program works flawlessly with jaws.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>




Re: spss inaccessibility: absolutely inexcusable

Jacques <lists4js@...>
 

I usually don't like sending "I agree" messages to a mailing list, but this one will have to be an exception. I fully agree with Erik, it's a pity that some people's talents are limited to complaining.

If the commercial screen readers were so great, those thinking so should stick to it and leave the NVDA devs and contributors to make a great product even greater.

I've been around the block a few times, since the old Window Bridge days, and everything and anything in between, always seeking better ways to get the job done. NVDA is the screen reader I exclusively use now. Folks should read the user guide and explore the wonder of the object navigator. It has often enough got me out of a sticky situation, yes, also where the commercial products failed.

Off my soap box.

A good day to all.


Jacques

On Wednesday, 16 November 2016 15:25, Erik burggraaf wrote:
Why is this inexcusible? SPSS is at least 20 years old, probably more.
It has several iterations, including the ability to build custom web
apps for using spss databases. It's a monstrously expensive proprietary
institutional software made by people with very little demonstrated
interest in including the blind community.
Only part of the support we enjoy in N vda is developer direct. Items
like office and adobe support came to us sponsored by microsoft and
adobe. Other features came from third party developers , or by funding
from private individuals. The NVDA Remote add-on for example of one
such project.

There's a reason why freedom scientific charged thousands of dollars.
They carried the weight of the accessibility world on their shoulders,
and despite what you may think, they were very unsteady on their feet
most of the time. Still, as you say, they often got the job done.

Using NVDA allows you to take charge of your own accessibility in a
manner that jaws never did. If you paid top dollar for jaws and found
that it didn't meet a specific need, you filed a report and prayed
support would come around in a year or two or three after you paid a
little more. Meanwhile, maybe some one with your exact issue paid
extravigant amounts of money to a script developer to make jaws do what
you need it to do, but the development work belonged to the corporate
entity who developed it, and they're not making any information about it
available because they don't think they can make money from it, and they
don't want other companies duplicating their work for nothing. Hooray
for old paradigm corporate accessibility.

With NVDA, you can leverage the power of a huge and highly reputible
open source community. In stead of making this all about your
acceptence and your outrage, why not take charge of the issue? Network
with other blind students and professionals who use SPSS. Network with
federally funded institutions who use SPSS. Bring some private backing
to java or whoever makes the thing and ask for corporate support to make
SPSS compatible with nvda, either by upgrades to the software itself,
enhanced NVDA support, or a combination of the two. If you approach
people the right way, work hard, and make the right connections, you can
make a project like this happen much faster in the NVDA system than you
could waiting for freedom scientific to build and maintain what you need.

I'm sorry it didn't work out for you right away, but NVDA is your screen
reader. You decide what it supports and what not. If there is anything
we can do to help you get the support you need, I'm sure we will be appy
to help, but you'd better begin by accepting the situation as is if you
want to go forward.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com


On November 16, 2016 5:52:19 AM enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...>
wrote:

hi,

I got spss to be slightly more accessible by enabling the java access
bridge. However, nvda cannot read any of the controls. The log shows a
windows access violation error. I find this to be absolutely
unacceptable that nvda doesn't support such an important program. The
same program works flawlessly with jaws.







Re: spss inaccessibility: absolutely inexcusable

mohammad suliman
 

Hi,
As far as I know, this program uses java apis to support accessibility, and nvda is better than Jaws when dealing with java. So, i think that the problem is with configuring java access bridge, not nvda.
I can send you some instructions to make sure that jab is well configured, if you still facing issues.
Best


On Wed, 16 Nov 2016 at 13:58 <brennenkinch@...> wrote:
What is this program i have never hurd of it befor

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 16, 2016, at 5:51 AM, enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:
>
> hi,
>
> I got spss to be slightly more accessible by enabling the java access bridge. However, nvda cannot read any of the controls. The log shows a windows access violation error. I find this to be absolutely unacceptable that nvda doesn't support such an important program.  The same program works flawlessly with jaws.
>
>
>
>




Re: spss inaccessibility: absolutely inexcusable

erik burggraaf <erik@...>
 

Why is this inexcusible? SPSS is at least 20 years old, probably more. It has several iterations, including the ability to build custom web apps for using spss databases. It's a monstrously expensive proprietary institutional software made by people with very little demonstrated interest in including the blind community.
Only part of the support we enjoy in N vda is developer direct. Items like office and adobe support came to us sponsored by microsoft and adobe. Other features came from third party developers , or by funding from private individuals. The NVDA Remote add-on for example of one such project.

There's a reason why freedom scientific charged thousands of dollars. They carried the weight of the accessibility world on their shoulders, and despite what you may think, they were very unsteady on their feet most of the time. Still, as you say, they often got the job done.

Using NVDA allows you to take charge of your own accessibility in a manner that jaws never did. If you paid top dollar for jaws and found that it didn't meet a specific need, you filed a report and prayed support would come around in a year or two or three after you paid a little more. Meanwhile, maybe some one with your exact issue paid extravigant amounts of money to a script developer to make jaws do what you need it to do, but the development work belonged to the corporate entity who developed it, and they're not making any information about it available because they don't think they can make money from it, and they don't want other companies duplicating their work for nothing. Hooray for old paradigm corporate accessibility.

With NVDA, you can leverage the power of a huge and highly reputible open source community. In stead of making this all about your acceptence and your outrage, why not take charge of the issue? Network with other blind students and professionals who use SPSS. Network with federally funded institutions who use SPSS. Bring some private backing to java or whoever makes the thing and ask for corporate support to make SPSS compatible with nvda, either by upgrades to the software itself, enhanced NVDA support, or a combination of the two. If you approach people the right way, work hard, and make the right connections, you can make a project like this happen much faster in the NVDA system than you could waiting for freedom scientific to build and maintain what you need.

I'm sorry it didn't work out for you right away, but NVDA is your screen reader. You decide what it supports and what not. If there is anything we can do to help you get the support you need, I'm sure we will be appy to help, but you'd better begin by accepting the situation as is if you want to go forward.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On November 16, 2016 5:52:19 AM enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:

hi,

I got spss to be slightly more accessible by enabling the java access
bridge. However, nvda cannot read any of the controls. The log shows a
windows access violation error. I find this to be absolutely
unacceptable that nvda doesn't support such an important program. The
same program works flawlessly with jaws.



Re: strange thing happening in thunderbird

The Gamages
 

Hello again rosemary,

Having checked on two different installations of Thunderbird on my two
computers, I notice that the older one on my W7 computer is set to
descending and the one on the W10 computer is set to ascending. both
show the messages as the newest at the top. So I reckon that Gene has
the right idea, if one doesn't work, try the other. It seems that the
two terms , [ascending and descending], are open to interpretation, I
find Thunderbird a bit strange in some respects, for instance, I have
set it to let me download messages, but it still does so automatically
at start up, maybe the program is a little unstable in general? I may
get sighted help to determine whether settings are working from the
keyboard.
I prefer Live mail on my W7 computer and hope that the mail app for "10
will become a little more screen reader friendly, but I'm not holding my
breath.



Best Regards, Jim.

-----Original Message-----
From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 10:16 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] strange thing happening in thunderbird

Hi, Jim,

Isn't ascending where the new messages go to the bottom?

Rosemarie



The Gamages wrote:
Hello rosemary,

Try setting it to ascending.



Best Regards, Jim.
-----Original Message-----
From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 5:52 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] strange thing happening in thunderbird

Hi, everyone,


I decided to stay with thunderbird instead of going to seamonkey. I
discovered something weird. I have the decending checked but the new
messages are going to the bottom instead of coming to the top. What
could be going wrong?


Thanks for your help in advance.


Rosemarie









Re: strange thing happening in thunderbird

The Gamages
 

Hello Rosemary,

I notice you have now set to ascending and it works, if you think about
it as a list then the last item you add goes to the bottom of that list,
so the list is descending as you add items, in other words it goes down,
if you want the other way the list must go upwards, or ascending towards
the top.
I hope that's a little more clear than mud, as long as it is working,
all is well.



Best Regards, Jim.

-----Original Message-----
From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 10:16 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] strange thing happening in thunderbird

Hi, Jim,

Isn't ascending where the new messages go to the bottom?

Rosemarie



The Gamages wrote:
Hello rosemary,

Try setting it to ascending.



Best Regards, Jim.
-----Original Message-----
From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 5:52 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] strange thing happening in thunderbird

Hi, everyone,


I decided to stay with thunderbird instead of going to seamonkey. I
discovered something weird. I have the decending checked but the new
messages are going to the bottom instead of coming to the top. What
could be going wrong?


Thanks for your help in advance.


Rosemarie









Re: spss inaccessibility: absolutely inexcusable

Brennen Kinch
 

What is this program i have never hurd of it befor

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 16, 2016, at 5:51 AM, enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:

hi,

I got spss to be slightly more accessible by enabling the java access bridge. However, nvda cannot read any of the controls. The log shows a windows access violation error. I find this to be absolutely unacceptable that nvda doesn't support such an important program. The same program works flawlessly with jaws.




Re: Reading .brf books

Christo Vorster
 

I would like to correct something.

 

I did not see the original message and sent the example just for interest sake.

 

I believe that a braille-display user wil definitely find it easier to read the braille but sometimes it is necessary to read it with speech to do editing before a document, which sometimes are fifty pages or more.

 

Anyway, have a nice day

 

Christo Vorster (Worcester, South Africa)

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, 16 November 2016 11:21 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading .brf books

 

The original message said that the intention was to read the file with a Braille display.  When I saw an objection, I thought I was wrong.  But as I saw the discussion develop, it appears I was right.  All the objections seem to overlook the fact that the person is going to use a Braille display, not speech. 

 

And if there are problems with line length, using word wrap might solve those.  If there are some sort of formattng symbols used to indicate things such as line lengths that Braille displays don't display, then my idea might not work as well as it might because you might see them but I haven't heard of such symbols. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2016 12:06 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading .brf books

 

Hi Gene

 

I only got to see the comversation on reading .brf files. I actually doubt whether changing the file extension from .brf to .txt would help much. I haven’t yet tried it, but just for interest sake, below you will find the last message you sent in normal text, .txt or .docx, what ever you prefer and then the .brf equivalent, after I converted it to .brf using Duxbury 11.1

 

(print text)

I don't know what is different about grade 2 Braille files.  I thought they were text files because my recollection from using the Braille 'n Speak is that when typing with the translator on, they are just text files.  Evidently, there are some sort of differences I don't know about.

 

(braille text)

  ,i don't "k :at is di6]5t ab grade #b

,brl files4  ,i ?"\ !y 7 text files 2c

my recollec;n f us+ ! ,brl ';n ,sp1k is

t :5 typ+ ) ! translator on1 !y >e j

text files4  ,evid5tly1 "! >e "s sort (

di6];es ,i don't "k ab4

 

I know that, when using an Apex Reader, you cannot read .brf files in MS Word, it first must be converted into .txt format

 

Regards

 

Christo Vorster (Worcester, South Africa)

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, 16 November 2016 12:14 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading .brf books

 

I don't know what is different about grade 2 Braille files.  I thought they were text files because my recollection from using the Braille 'n Speak is that when typing with the translator on, they are just text files.  Evidently, there are some sort of differences I don't know about.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Dan Beaver

Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 3:10 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading .brf books

 

They are not just text files if they are in grade 2 or some other contractional format.  They do not present well in notepad if this is the case.

 

Dan Beaver

 

On 11/15/2016 3:37 PM, Gene wrote:

I would think that if you change the extension to txt, they will open in Notepad and you should be able to read them untranslated.  Braille files are just text files.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Mallard

Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 2:31 PM

Subject: [nvda] Reading .brf books

 

Hello all,

I have a number of .brf files, not from Bookshare, which I normally read
on a usb pendrive with my Touchme5 braille display.

I'f like to read them on the pc as well, but I have no idea whether
there are any programmes that would open those files, without converting
the mto txt with Wintrans, for example.

Does such software exist?
Thanks, ciao,
Ollie

 


Re: firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3

Gene
 

Actually, on further playing around, it appears that moving with either the right or left arrow or pressing escape after back spacing, changes the structure back into an edit combo box and you can move through it as usual.  I'd have to play more with this to be sure, but it appears that after backspacing as many times as you want, moving with the left and right arrow keys will allow you to move as you wish in the field and will, as in general, interrupt unwanted reading.
 
Gene

From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2016 5:16 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3

While not ideal, carrying my last message further, after you backspace as many times as you want, right arrow once.  Speech will stop and you can move with the arrow keys through the text. 
 
This appears to be some sort of strange structure; I don't know what the advantage may be for sighted users, that impeled the development team to implement it. it is first, at least using the old version of NVDA I use, announced as an edit combo box if you move to it and let the information read, then, if you type something and backspace, it is announced as a list.  My guess is that the change of the structure to a list causes the text to be read.  It may be seen as a list item that has just been moved to, from the perspective of NVDA. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2016 4:54 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3

hi,

this probablem does exist with nvda next.


On 11/16/2016 1:01 PM, Brian's Mail list account wrote:
> Definitely needs a ticket/issue raising somewhere from the sound of it.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2016 5:47 AM
> Subject: [nvda] firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3
>
>
>> Hi.
>> Well Just found the latest 50x version of firefox on the system.
>> It works ok enough but I have noticed that there are some focus issues.
>> In the address bar, for example I type an address
>> www.twitter.com/username.
>> When I delete one letter from the end of the address it maybe ok then
>> nvda will start quoting the entire url out minus the deleted content.
>> If I left arrow I then get navigation toolbar address bar and search
>> then the address so its losing focus, I can work round it by simple
>> highlighting the particular section and killing it but ff likes to
>> loose focus in some sites and forms and then if I push a key get it
>> back again.
>> FF still works, but if this continues I am going to have to find out
>> exactly how to turn off autoupdate and downgrade to 49.02 which still
>> works.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>




Re: firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3

Gene
 

While not ideal, carrying my last message further, after you backspace as many times as you want, right arrow once.  Speech will stop and you can move with the arrow keys through the text. 
 
This appears to be some sort of strange structure; I don't know what the advantage may be for sighted users, that impeled the development team to implement it. it is first, at least using the old version of NVDA I use, announced as an edit combo box if you move to it and let the information read, then, if you type something and backspace, it is announced as a list.  My guess is that the change of the structure to a list causes the text to be read.  It may be seen as a list item that has just been moved to, from the perspective of NVDA. 
 

Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2016 4:54 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3

hi,

this probablem does exist with nvda next.


On 11/16/2016 1:01 PM, Brian's Mail list account wrote:
> Definitely needs a ticket/issue raising somewhere from the sound of it.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2016 5:47 AM
> Subject: [nvda] firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3
>
>
>> Hi.
>> Well Just found the latest 50x version of firefox on the system.
>> It works ok enough but I have noticed that there are some focus issues.
>> In the address bar, for example I type an address
>> www.twitter.com/username.
>> When I delete one letter from the end of the address it maybe ok then
>> nvda will start quoting the entire url out minus the deleted content.
>> If I left arrow I then get navigation toolbar address bar and search
>> then the address so its losing focus, I can work round it by simple
>> highlighting the particular section and killing it but ff likes to
>> loose focus in some sites and forms and then if I push a key get it
>> back again.
>> FF still works, but if this continues I am going to have to find out
>> exactly how to turn off autoupdate and downgrade to 49.02 which still
>> works.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>




Re: firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3

enes sarıbaş
 

hi,

this probablem does exist with nvda next.

On 11/16/2016 1:01 PM, Brian's Mail list account wrote:
Definitely needs a ticket/issue raising somewhere from the sound of it.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2016 5:47 AM
Subject: [nvda] firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3


Hi.
Well Just found the latest 50x version of firefox on the system.
It works ok enough but I have noticed that there are some focus issues.
In the address bar, for example I type an address www.twitter.com/username.
When I delete one letter from the end of the address it maybe ok then nvda will start quoting the entire url out minus the deleted content.
If I left arrow I then get navigation toolbar address bar and search then the address so its losing focus, I can work round it by simple highlighting the particular section and killing it but ff likes to loose focus in some sites and forms and then if I push a key get it back again.
FF still works, but if this continues I am going to have to find out exactly how to turn off autoupdate and downgrade to 49.02 which still works.




spss inaccessibility: absolutely inexcusable

enes sarıbaş
 

hi,

I got spss to be slightly more accessible by enabling the java access bridge. However, nvda cannot read any of the controls. The log shows a windows access violation error. I find this to be absolutely unacceptable that nvda doesn't support such an important program. The same program works flawlessly with jaws.


firefox regression

enes sarıbaş
 

hi,

With the 50.0 version of firefox, when backspace is pressed in the address bar, everything typed is read out instead of the character deleted. Is there a fix for this?


Re: Reading .brf books

Mallard <mallard@...>
 

Thanks Pranav.

Ciao,

Ollie

Il 16/11/2016 01:45, Pranav Lal ha scritto:
Hi,

Use edsharp from empowermentzone to back translate the BRF file.

Pranav

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mallard
Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2016 2:01 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Reading .brf books

Hello all,

I have a number of .brf files, not from Bookshare, which I normally read on a
usb pendrive with my Touchme5 braille display.

I'f like to read them on the pc as well, but I have no idea whether there are
any programmes that would open those files, without converting the mto txt with
Wintrans, for example.

Does such software exist?
Thanks, ciao,
Ollie






Re: firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3

Michel Such
 

Hi,


Running a Next version of NVDA I don't get the problem.

I think this will be fixed in 2016.4, there is something about this in the changelog.

So, if you can, try a Master or Next version of NVDA and see if it works for you;


Michel SUCH

michel.such@...
Skype : michel.such
Twitter : @SuchMichel

Le 2016-11-16 à 11:04, Brian's Mail list account a écrit :

I have a suspicion its themulti processor code slowly being rolled out in Firefox.
Left hand not knowing what right hand is doing kind of problem!
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rosemarie Chavarria" <knitqueen2007@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2016 6:53 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox 50 and nvda 2016.3


Hi, Shaun,


I'm having a problem with firefox too. I'll try to type a web address and either firefox loses focus or NVDA is sluggish. Older versions of firefox didn't have this problem.


Rosemarie




On 11/15/2016 9:47 PM, Shaun Everiss wrote:
Hi.
Well Just found the latest 50x version of firefox on the system.
It works ok enough but I have noticed that there are some focus issues.
In the address bar, for example I type an address www.twitter.com/username.
When I delete one letter from the end of the address it maybe ok then nvda will start quoting the entire url out minus the deleted content.
If I left arrow I then get navigation toolbar address bar and search then the address so its losing focus, I can work round it by simple highlighting the particular section and killing it but ff likes to loose focus in some sites and forms and then if I push a key get it back again.
FF still works, but if this continues I am going to have to find out exactly how to turn off autoupdate and downgrade to 49.02 which still works.





Re: Reading .brf books

Mallard <mallard@...>
 

Christo,

*one billion to your praise for braille.

I was and still am a staunch Optacon user, but for computer use I wouldn't live without braille.

I don't want to go back to illiteracy for the blind...


I hope NVDA will continueto improve its support for braille, as I do think there's still quite a lot of room for improvement.


The use of touch cursors on braille displays, for instance, should definitely be enhanced.

Not being a programmer, I have no idea how this could be done, so I don't want to sound critical or ungrateful. I'm just thinking of people who come to NVDA from Jaws, for instance, who tell me they find it difficult to handle this feature.

I don't have Jaws, so I don't really kow what it does with touch cursors different from NVDA, but this is a remark I often get.

Ciao,

Ollie

Il 16/11/2016 06:49, Christo Vorster ha scritto:

Hi Dan

I regularly work with .brf files. One of my tasks here at the college where I work, is to translate .docx documents into braille. It is quite difficult to read .brf files in Duxbury, especially with NVDA. I used to have JAWS as my screen reader and the developers of Freedom Scientific built JAWS to be quite compatible with Duxbury in the sense that it read grade 2 braille as if it was normal print, I mean like in Word. NVDA, currently read “e d” as “dollar” or a word like “immediately” like “I m m l y”.

To be very honest, I don’t think that the move to UEBC braille was such a big thing, meaning that the braille system did not notably change, we actually lost a few contractions but we gained a lot by the new signs (bold, italics, underline, the difference between parenthesis and brackets, etc). I am involved in the training of vision impaired computer users and for us the acceptance of UEBC only has been a positive step.

The bottom line to me is that Braille before and after UEBC still is a fantastic invention and we all must applaud Louis Braille each and every day.

Have a nice day

Christo Vorster (Worcester, South Africa)

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of *Dan Beaver
*Sent:* Wednesday, 16 November 2016 12:49 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Reading .brf books

Well, grade 2 braille includes contractions like the dollar sign for the letters "ed" in what we used to call US braille at least. I am
not familiar with braille from other countries and am not very familiar with UEB yet. In a BRF file notepad displays the dollar sign as a dollar sign. See what problems this kind of contraction can cause?

Dan Beaver

On 11/15/2016 5:13 PM, Gene wrote:

I don't know what is different about grade 2 Braille files. I
thought they were text files because my recollection from using
the Braille 'n Speak is that when typing with the translator on,
they are just text files. Evidently, there are some sort of
differences I don't know about.

Gene

----- Original Message -----

*From:* Dan Beaver <mailto:dbeaver888@...>

*Sent:* Tuesday, November 15, 2016 3:10 PM

*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>

*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Reading .brf books

They are not just text files if they are in grade 2 or some other
contractional format. They do not present well in notepad if this
is the case.

Dan Beaver

On 11/15/2016 3:37 PM, Gene wrote:

I would think that if you change the extension to txt, they
will open in Notepad and you should be able to read them
untranslated. Braille files are just text files.

Gene

----- Original Message -----

*From:* Mallard <mailto:mallard@...>

*Sent:* Tuesday, November 15, 2016 2:31 PM

*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>

*Subject:* [nvda] Reading .brf books

Hello all,

I have a number of .brf files, not from Bookshare, which I
normally read
on a usb pendrive with my Touchme5 braille display.

I'f like to read them on the pc as well, but I have no idea
whether
there are any programmes that would open those files, without
converting
the mto txt with Wintrans, for example.

Does such software exist?
Thanks, ciao,
Ollie


Re: Reading .brf books

Mallard <mallard@...>
 

Quite. That's exactly what I get. A lot of dollars, which might be a good thing in other circumstances, but not when I need to study Hebrew... lol

Ciao,

Ollie

Il 16/11/2016 06:49, Christo Vorster ha scritto:

Hi Dan

I regularly work with .brf files. One of my tasks here at the college where I work, is to translate .docx documents into braille. It is quite difficult to read .brf files in Duxbury, especially with NVDA. I used to have JAWS as my screen reader and the developers of Freedom Scientific built JAWS to be quite compatible with Duxbury in the sense that it read grade 2 braille as if it was normal print, I mean like in Word. NVDA, currently read “e d” as “dollar” or a word like “immediately” like “I m m l y”.

To be very honest, I don’t think that the move to UEBC braille was such a big thing, meaning that the braille system did not notably change, we actually lost a few contractions but we gained a lot by the new signs (bold, italics, underline, the difference between parenthesis and brackets, etc). I am involved in the training of vision impaired computer users and for us the acceptance of UEBC only has been a positive step.

The bottom line to me is that Braille before and after UEBC still is a fantastic invention and we all must applaud Louis Braille each and every day.

Have a nice day

Christo Vorster (Worcester, South Africa)

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of *Dan Beaver
*Sent:* Wednesday, 16 November 2016 12:49 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Reading .brf books

Well, grade 2 braille includes contractions like the dollar sign for the letters "ed" in what we used to call US braille at least. I am
not familiar with braille from other countries and am not very familiar with UEB yet. In a BRF file notepad displays the dollar sign as a dollar sign. See what problems this kind of contraction can cause?

Dan Beaver

On 11/15/2016 5:13 PM, Gene wrote:

I don't know what is different about grade 2 Braille files. I
thought they were text files because my recollection from using
the Braille 'n Speak is that when typing with the translator on,
they are just text files. Evidently, there are some sort of
differences I don't know about.

Gene

----- Original Message -----

*From:* Dan Beaver <mailto:dbeaver888@...>

*Sent:* Tuesday, November 15, 2016 3:10 PM

*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>

*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Reading .brf books

They are not just text files if they are in grade 2 or some other
contractional format. They do not present well in notepad if this
is the case.

Dan Beaver

On 11/15/2016 3:37 PM, Gene wrote:

I would think that if you change the extension to txt, they
will open in Notepad and you should be able to read them
untranslated. Braille files are just text files.

Gene

----- Original Message -----

*From:* Mallard <mailto:mallard@...>

*Sent:* Tuesday, November 15, 2016 2:31 PM

*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>

*Subject:* [nvda] Reading .brf books

Hello all,

I have a number of .brf files, not from Bookshare, which I
normally read
on a usb pendrive with my Touchme5 braille display.

I'f like to read them on the pc as well, but I have no idea
whether
there are any programmes that would open those files, without
converting
the mto txt with Wintrans, for example.

Does such software exist?
Thanks, ciao,
Ollie