Date   

Re: nvda not panning when using a braille display in the windows 10 mail app:

Quentin Christensen
 

Hi Kenny,

Which version of NVDA are you using?  Have you tried NVDA 2016.4rc1.  I'll have to double check re any changes to Braille panning but certainly support for windows mail is improved.  Does panning work in other programs?

Regards


Quentin.

On Sat, Dec 3, 2016 at 8:25 AM, Kenny Peyattt jr. <p.wildcat1234@...> wrote:

H I I noticed that when using the windows 10 mail app in windows 10, I am not able to pann using a braille display. The display I am using is a focus display.

 

Kenny Peyatt jr.

 




--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org 
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and the next RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

The subject pretty much asks it all.

In topic after topic I see people saying that they're using old, often really old, versions of NVDA.  That is entirely their choice, and I'm not questioning that.

What I'd like to know is how many versions, if any, other than the latest stable release and the RC releases, are "officially" supported by NVAccess.

Knowing how much change occurs as releases roll out over time I know it's impossible to keep supporting prior releases in perpetuity or anything close to it.  I also know that it generally makes no sense to try to replicate a bug in a release different than the one it's been detected in except as an effort to determine if it is a "carry forward" that was previously undetected versus newly introduced.

It's almost impossible to know "what's what" unless individuals using NVDA are all using the latest stable version so far as issue reporting goes.  That's why, particularly for open-source software, I make it a habit to religiously upgrade to the latest release whether I need the latest "bells and whistles" or not.  Unless there is some really buggy release (and I'm talking generally, not NVDA in particular) it just makes everyone's lives much easier.
--
Brian

Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.  If you’re alive, it isn’t.

    ~ Lauren Bacall

    



Re: NVDA 2016.4rc1 released

Quentin Christensen
 

Can any other Windows 8.1 users please confirm (or refute?) Bhavya's findings with Skype desktop using NVDA 2016.4rc1 please?

That is: "In this release candidate, in Skype for Desktop,
on a Windows 8.1 machine, NVDA is at random yet frequent moments
constantly repeating a certain Skype name. It is also mishandling
incoming Skype chats, by announcing the sender's name twice, and then
providing the expected speech feedback."

From other comments, it seems it doesn't happen in Windows 10.  Is anyone trying this combination under Windows 7 (or for completeness, XP, since there are a couple of XP users in the thread)?

Regards

Quentin.

On Sun, Dec 4, 2016 at 7:03 AM, Bhavya shah <bhavya.shah125@...> wrote:
Hi,
This buggy behaviour is specific to NVDA version 2016.4 RC 1, and I
did not notice this while using version 2016.3. For the record, the
Skype version in use at my end is Skype™‎   Version 7.29.0.102.
Thanks.

On 12/4/16, Rui Fontes <rui.fontes@...> wrote:
> Using Windows 10, Skype 7.29, NVDA 2016.4RC1, I do not have that behaviour.
>
> Rui
>
>
> -----Mensagem Original-----
> De: Bhavya shah
> Data: 3 de dezembro de 2016 18:27
> Para: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Assunto: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2016.4rc1 released
>
> Hi,
> I would like other testers to try replicating this issue, in order to
> confirm its presence. In this release candidate, in Skype for Desktop,
> on a Windows 8.1 machine, NVDA is at random yet frequent moments
> constantly repeating a certain Skype name. It is also mishandling
> incoming Skype chats, by announcing the sender's name twice, and then
> providing the expected speech feedback. I would like to believe that
> opening of Skype for Desktop with an account receiving Skype chats
> periodically should suffice in attempts to reproduce this odd
> behaviour.
> Otherwise, all features and functionalities in NVDA version 2016.4 RC
> 1 seem well-implemented and bug-free to me.
> Thanks.
>
> On 12/3/16, Rosemarie Chavarria <knitqueen2007@...> wrote:
>> Hi, Quentin,
>>
>>
>>
>> I was able to log in to my gmail account. I didn't change my password so
>> I
>> don't know what's going on with the mail ap. It worked before so I don't
>> know what else to do. I'm glad I have outlook or thunderbird for emailing
>> for right now.
>>
>>
>>
>> Rosemarie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>> Quentin
>> Christensen
>> Sent: Friday, December 2, 2016 10:45 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2016.4rc1 released
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Rosemarie,
>>
>>
>>
>> You might need to log in with your account again?  Perhaps you have
>> changed
>> your password etc elsewhere?
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 3, 2016 at 10:22 AM, Rosemarie Chavarria
>> <knitqueen2007@... <mailto:knitqueen2007@gmail.com> > wrote:
>>
>> Hi, David,
>>
>>
>>
>> I just tried the mail ap but I got this message saying my account was out
>>
>> of
>> date. I was thinking of using it but I don't think so now.
>>
>>
>>
>> Rosemarie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> ] On Behalf Of
>> David Moore
>> Sent: Friday, December 2, 2016 3:02 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2016.4rc1 released
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Thank you so much Quenton for posting this great news. I just found out
>> that
>> NVDA 2016.4rc1 makes the weather app and the store more accessible. Also,
>> the mail app works much better with NvDA. This is so exciting. I will let
>> you know how NVDA now works in many apps.
>>
>> David Moore
>>
>> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>  for
>> Windows
>> 10
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Quentin Christensen <mailto:quentin@...>
>> Sent: Friday, December 2, 2016 2:52 AM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> Subject: [nvda] NVDA 2016.4rc1 released
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> NVDA 2016.4rc1 has just been released for testing. This is a release
>> candidate, which means that unless any critical issues are found, this
>> will be identical to the final 2016.4 release.
>>
>> See this blog post for what's new and a download link:
>>  <http://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2016-4rc1-released/>
>> http://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2016-4rc1-released/
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>>
>>
>> Quentin.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Quentin Christensen
>> Training Material Developer
>>
>> Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available:
>> http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
>>
>>
>>
>> Ph  <tel:%2B61%207%203149%203306> +61 7 3149 3306
>>
>> Direct: +61 413 904 383 <tel:+61%20413%20904%20383>
>>  <http://www.nvaccess.org/> www.nvaccess.org
>> Facebook:  <http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess>
>> http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
>> Twitter: @NVAccess
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Quentin Christensen
>> Training Material Developer
>>
>> Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available:
>> http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
>>
>>
>>
>> Ph  <tel:%2B61%207%203149%203306> +61 7 3149 3306
>>
>> Direct: +61 413 904 383
>>  <http://www.nvaccess.org/> www.nvaccess.org
>> Facebook:  <http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess>
>> http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
>> Twitter: @NVAccess
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Best Regards
> Bhavya Shah
>
> Avid Enthusiast and User of the Free NVDA Screen Reader (www.nvaccess.org)
>
> Contacting Me
> E-mail Address: bhavya.shah125@...
> Follow me on Twitter @BhavyaShah125 or www.twitter.com/BhavyaShah125
> Mobile Number: +91 7506221750
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
Best Regards
Bhavya Shah

Avid Enthusiast and User of the Free NVDA Screen Reader (www.nvaccess.org)

Contacting Me
E-mail Address: bhavya.shah125@...
Follow me on Twitter @BhavyaShah125 or www.twitter.com/BhavyaShah125
Mobile Number: +91 7506221750






--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org 
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: unhiding the main window in Chicken nugget

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

Ctrl+Windows+W, unless you remapped it to something else.

Chris.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rayette Rucker" <rayette.rucker23@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 4:07 PM
Subject: [nvda] unhiding the main window in Chicken nugget


How do I unhide the main window in Chicken Nugget?


--
Check out my blog at https://therapyramblings.wordpress.com



unhiding the main window in Chicken nugget

Rayette Rucker <rayette.rucker23@...>
 

How do I unhide the main window in Chicken Nugget?


--
Check out my blog at https://therapyramblings.wordpress.com


Re: Thank you and another problem

Gene New Zealand <hurrikennyandopo@...>
 

Hi


In which program?


Gene nz



On 5/12/2016 12:19 AM, Sakina wrote:

Thank you so much Gene for your prompt help. Thank you again very much.

Please Gene, I have another problem.

I do not know how to add, delete or organise my contact list or is it called address book.

Sorry for being ignorant.

I just rely on someone to send me an email first.

I hope you can help. And thank you for guiding me to the look back to all the older options.

With many regards

Sakina

 

 


From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene New Zealand
Sent: Saturday, December 3, 2016 7:12 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] something I discovered when going through the what's new option

 

Hi sakina

 

When NVDA is running press the nvda key + the letter N.\

 

Next arrow down to help after the preferences menu comes up, then right to where the user manual is.

next arrow down to the whats new section then press the enter key and then your browser will come up with all the info since the first version as in what has been done, bug fixes and so on.

 

 

Gene nz

 

 

On 4/12/2016 6:27 AM, Sakina wrote:

Hello Chris,

Would it be possible for you to  share this new discovery option  link as I am fairly new user and would like to look back for learning too.

Thanking you very much

sakina

 


From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Judd
Sent: Saturday, December 3, 2016 6:56 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] something I discovered when going through the what's new option

 

Hi all,

 

I was going through the what’s new option for the latest release of NVDA, and I found that all the previous release notes are there all the way back till 0.5.

It is nice to read all the accomplishments that NVDA has made over the years, and since I’m a fairly new user, I’m glad that it is there, so I can take a look, and see what the early versions were like.

Just thought I would share what I discovered.

Chris

 

Virus-free. www.avast.com

 


Virus-free. www.avast.com

-- 
<b>Check out the new location of my accessibility central website for NVDA tutorials, NVDA road tested programs, and other eyesight related topics.
http://www.accessibilitycentral.net/ If you would like to keep up to date with whats being updated on our website, you can also follow us on facebook by visiting
the following link https://en-gb.facebook.com/people/AccessibilityCentral-Net/100009727930216
Also, check out which New Zealand libraries have the NVDA screen reader available by visiting the following link http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries


Re: still a newbee

Gene New Zealand <hurrikennyandopo@...>
 

Hi


There are 2 modes in NVDA. they can be either 2 different sounds or you
can hear the words spoken such as browse mode where you can use the
single letter navigation keys or focus mode where you can say type into
fields like a form.


Depending how you have your settings done it might go into the 2
different modes automatically or you might have to change it manually


.


To force nvda between the modes you can use the nvda key + the space bar.
You can if in a edit area on the web use the escape key to go back into
browse mode.

if you look under the browse mode in nvda settings you can uncheck the
box to hear the words spoken. You will need to look for the check box
that says Audio indication of focus and browse modes.
Uncheck that if you want the words spoken.

some times nvda might get caught between modes and the words are not
spoken, so then use the nvda key + the space bar.

How to find words in webpages quickly
To locate certain words quickly in a web page with NVDA, the find
command is great for this. It helps you find certain words on the web
page very quickly.

To quickly find a certain word on a web page, press the Ctrl and Insert
and the letter F keys to bring up the find dialogue; and then type your
word and press Enter. It will find the first instance of that word.
This is called the find dialogue box.

To find the next instance of that same word, press the Insert and F3 key
to find it.


To find a previous instance of that word, press the Insert and Shift key
and the F3 key to find it.

Where i refer to the insert key this is a modifier key and can be either
the insert key, the extended insert key or the caps lock key that is
used with that key combonation.


By the way if you are interested i have written up tutorials on using
nvda with a desk top computer. there is also audio tutorials as well
along with other blindness related material.

it can be found at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net

it should get you up and running with nvda and is done step by step.

Gene nz

On 5/12/2016 3:16 AM, Don H wrote:
Running NVDA RC1 on a Win 10 system. Using Firefox and going to a web
site like Best Buy.
I first use the search Edit box on the web page to search for Vizio
TV. On the results page I can then use the NVDA find function to get
to the results. I find the TV I want to look at and press enter. I
am now on the web page for that particular model. I am not on a edit
box so if I understand it correctly I am in review mode. I now try to
use the NVDA find function and can only get the windows fine function
to come up which of course isn't what I want. I try the NVDA find
function several times with same bad results.
I am obviously doing something wrong but being a newbee with NVDA I am
lost as to the solution. Please tell me what I am doing wrong.


--
<b>Check out the new location of my accessibility central website for NVDA tutorials, NVDA road tested programs, and other eyesight related topics.
http://www.accessibilitycentral.net/ If you would like to keep up to date with whats being updated on our website, you can also follow us on facebook by visiting
the following link https://en-gb.facebook.com/people/AccessibilityCentral-Net/100009727930216
Also, check out which New Zealand libraries have the NVDA screen reader available by visiting the following link http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries


Re: regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

We don't know enough about the computer to evaluate how it should perform.  Even ten or fourteen year old computers running XP may perform well and reasonably fast when running XP.  2gb of ram is far more than the typical XP user would need.  And if the CPU is a reasonably fast one with a reasonable amount of caching, performance can be quite satisfactory. 
 
Gene

Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 11:59 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

And you always wonder why you write to the list experiencing sluggishness?

On 12/4/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
> my computer is not modern.
> i use windows xp ram 2gb and cpu 2 also.
>
> On 12/4/16, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
>> That assumption is usually wrong.  At times, an add on may cause a
>> problem
>> in performance of some sort but add ons are just small bits of code that,
>> in
>> most cases, do nothing or almost nothing unless the user takes an action
>> that gets them to do something or unless they are intended to be
>> generally
>> active such as an add on to add a certain synthesizer to NVDA.  In that
>> case, of course, the add on is always active when the synthesizer is in
>> use.
>>  But add ons should not affect adversely, performance of programs in
>> general.  Even if an add on monitors the activity in a program and
>> automatically does something when wanted or needed, modern computers are
>> so
>> fast that the activity of the add on uses such a tiny amount of the
>> capacity
>> of the computer that any possible slowing of performance is so tiny that
>> it
>> is unnoticeable.
>>
>> If add ons adversely affected performance, they wouldn't be as popular as
>> they are.  One reason people use Firefox, for example, is because of the
>> great number of add ons they have to choose from when deciding if they
>> want
>> to add features or functions.  A large number of NVDA users use add ons
>> as
>> well.
>>
>> Without good reasons, such as reports from a number of reliable users or
>> observations you make yourself, often in more than one situation, of a
>> problem or idea about how something affects performance, assumptions
>> should
>> not be made.  They are unsupported and may lead, as in this case, to
>> needlessly not getting benefits or advantages that are available.
>>
>> Gene
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: nasrin khaksar
>> Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 6:27 AM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>
>>
>> i know that its safe to install addons from the original sites.
>> but i prefer that use only programs not addons.
>> i am sure that the main program without addons are more fast, stable
>> and reliable.
>>
>> On 12/4/16, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...> wrote:
>>> I'm sure somebody will say that you need at least two browsers and you
>>> really do need an ad blocker as well.  I think you are safe with the
>>> nvda
>>> add ons from the official site, since they have been checked out.
>>>  Brian
>>>
>>> bglists@...
>>> Sent via blueyonder.
>>> Please address personal email to:-
>>> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
>>> in the display name field.
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "nasrin khaksar" <nasrinkhaksar3@...>
>>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>> Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 4:43 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>
>>>
>>> hi gene thanks so much for helping me and your helpful informations
>>> about addons and malwarebytes.
>>> i use only one browser and i try to remove another ones even internet
>>> explorer for many reasons!
>>> i tried webvisum for month and always it causes crashes for my firefox.
>>> so, i removed it many months ago!
>>> i even dont install any addon for nvda!
>>> only i use the installer version of nvda without no addons and
>>> completely i am satisfied from it.
>>>
>>> On 12/4/16, David <trailerdavid@...> wrote:
>>>> The NoScript add-on for firefox, is extremely simple to use. And it
>>>> works all by key commands, so is fully accessible. The difference with
>>>> and without it running, in certain cases could be described as nothing
>>>> less than extreme.
>>>>
>>>> Get it installed, by downloading it from the official Firefox Add-On
>>>> website. Note that if you get copies from outside that site, the add-on
>>>> might not be signed, hence will be blocked in Firefox 45 or above.
>>>>
>>>> Once installed, go ahead and do your browsing as normal. When you get
>>>> to
>>>> a page which might seem cluttered, or in any other way trouble you, do
>>>> as follow.
>>>>
>>>> Hit the App-key, alternatively Shift-F10, to open the application menu.
>>>> Arrow down to the entry that says NoScript. Hit Enter, or Right-Arrow,
>>>> to open the submenu.
>>>>
>>>> You now will see a list of all scripts that are tied to this site. For
>>>> each script, there will be two entries. One to permanently allow the
>>>> script, and one for only temporarily allowing the script running. All
>>>> scripts that has not been allowed, will automatically be blocked.
>>>>
>>>> So, scroll your way down the scripts, allowing the ones you will know
>>>> you can trust, and which will not cause trouble. If you are in doubt of
>>>> one of the entries, simply try with it blocked, and then try
>>>> temporarily
>>>> allowing it. The temporary allowance will stay in effect, long as you
>>>> are on that particular site. Leaving the site, and then revisiting it,
>>>> only the permanently allowed scripts will stay allowed. Even if you
>>>> find
>>>> that one script - which you previously have allowed - causes you some
>>>> trouble, you can easily go into the NoScript submenu and block it from
>>>> future run.
>>>>
>>>> The NoScript also has its own Options page, where you can set numerous
>>>> behavial options for the add-on's functionality. For instance, I have
>>>> set mine to give a sound signal, whenever it is blocking scripts.
>>>> Thereby I know that there might be a chance things will change, if I
>>>> try
>>>> unblocking some scripts. Useful when you hit a new site, and think it
>>>> should show more info than what is currently the case.
>>>>
>>>> One place I do see a whole big difference with the add-on running, is
>>>> when visiting sites on EBay. Some of their scripts are simply just
>>>> causing big issues with a screen reader. Blocking them with NoScript is
>>>> a matter of a breeze, and results in the EBay system to be far more
>>>> blind friendly. Other netshops, or sites that are loaded with ads,
>>>> might
>>>> be far more accessible, when you block some of all the visualizing
>>>> scripts, and other fancy-ware they love to put on modern webpages.
>>>>
>>>> Yet another good thing about NoScript, is this:
>>>> Many fo the scripts you will experience on the websites you visit, tend
>>>> to install cookies on your computer. These might in turn cause trouble.
>>>> For instance, a cookie on your computer, might cause certain background
>>>> activity to keep in business, even when you leave the website that
>>>> initiated the script. Such could be the trouble that causes a screen
>>>> reader to malfunction. Have seen this numerous times. Since NoScript
>>>> blocks the script from initiating itself, it also blocks the cookie
>>>> from
>>>> being installed on your computer, hence no further activity of that
>>>> script can take place. Your system simply might just benefit from the
>>>> less polluted environment.
>>>>
>>>> Like I said, many websites these days, tend to load your system with
>>>> numerous, less beneficial scripts. For instance, there ar many scripts
>>>> that will activate advertisements on the site. Others intend to give
>>>> the
>>>> website a more fancy look, that is, for the sighted person. For the
>>>> screen reader, it could mean the whole page to be inaccessible. Some
>>>> scripts are collecting statistical information about your browsing
>>>> behavior; who knows what they are going to use that for. And still
>>>> others will cause the page to be constantly updated, like in the case
>>>> of
>>>> EBay sites. Blocking these scripts, will cause your screen reader to
>>>> get
>>>> a more stabil webpage to read.
>>>>
>>>> For those who have not yet given the NoScript add-on for Firefox a try,
>>>> I strongly recommend it. It has been around for a number of years, is
>>>> totally free, receives frequent updates, and has been suggested for
>>>> many
>>>> a screen reader user.. In fact, it was another user who adviced I give
>>>> it a try. And I have never looked back. It is the number one add-on I
>>>> install on new installations of Firefox.
>>>>
>>>> David
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 12/3/2016 5:12 PM, Gene wrote:
>>>>  > The way you discussed enabling or disabling JAVA script in
>>>> about:config is one way.  There is a plug in named no script but I
>>>> haven't used it enough to evaluate it well.  I'm not sure how easy it
>>>> is
>>>> to use it to block scripts and unblock them.  Others will probably
>>>> comment on that.
>>>>  >
>>>>  > One convenient option is to use two different copies of Firefox
>>>> portable on your machine.  Or you could use the installed version and
>>>> have a copy of Firefox portable on the same machine.  You would have
>>>> JAVA scripts disabled in one of the programs and enabled in the other.
>>>> You could easily and conveniently use one browser on a site where you
>>>> want to use JAVA scripts and the other browser where you don't want to
>>>> use them.  You wouldn't have to then keep changing settings in the
>>>> browser.
>>>>  >
>>>>  > Gene
>>>>  >
>>>>  > From: nasrin khaksar
>>>>  > Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 9:45 AM
>>>>  > To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>>>  > Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>>  >
>>>>  > hi geen again.
>>>>  > you rescued me from a very big concern!
>>>>  > i realy pray for you and admire your help and useful informations.
>>>>  > and thanks so much for the great news about reduce use of flash in
>>>> firefox!
>>>>  > about your question, when i realy need one audio file, i select to
>>>>  > open it with the potplayer or download it.
>>>>  > and when i dont need it, i benefit from not waisting of my internet
>>>> charge!
>>>>  > and how do you activate and deactivate javascript when you need and
>>>>  > dont need it?
>>>>  > i only know that about:config and make true and false
>>>> javascript.enabled.
>>>>  >
>>>>  > On 12/3/16, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
>>>>  > > I don't see why you would have a JAVA plugin if you didn't install
>>>> the JAVA
>>>>  > > program.  The plugin is installed by JAVA.
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > > As far as JAVA settings in the about:config settings are
>>>> concerned,
>>>> as far
>>>>  > > as I can see, they all apply to JAVA script, not to JAVA, the
>>>> program.  The
>>>>  > > one I wasn't sure of, I did a Google search on and it has nothing
>>>> to do with
>>>>  > > JAVA, the program.
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > > Gene
>>>>  > > ----- Original Message -----
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > > From: nasrin khaksar
>>>>  > > Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 7:49 AM
>>>>  > > To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>>>  > > Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > > hi gene.
>>>>  > > thanks for your useful information.
>>>>  > > i never dont install java program but i am afraid always that is
>>>> it
>>>>  > > possible that java plugin works in the browser without installing
>>>> java
>>>>  > > program?
>>>>  > > if its no, whats the reason that i see java plugin in firefox
>>>>  > > about:config and i change plugin.state.java to 0?
>>>>  > > i use windows xp and the newer versions of java and also firefox
>>>> 53
>>>>  > > and later, dont support xp.
>>>>  > > which version of windows, do you use?
>>>>  > > thanks and God bless you for your help.
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > > On 12/3/16, Brice Mijares <bricemijares@...> wrote:
>>>>  > >> I read some where last week where FX will prevent adobe flash
>>>> from
>>>>  > >> working by summer of 2017.
>>>>  > >>
>>>>  > >> On 12/3/2016 12:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
>>>>  > >>> hi.
>>>>  > >>> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security
>>>> problems.
>>>>  > >>> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem
>>>> for
>>>>  > >>> this.
>>>>  > >>>
>>>>  > >>> On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@...> wrote:
>>>>  > >>>> I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this
>>>> with
>>>>  > >>>> Chrome
>>>>  > >>>> later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill
>>>>  > >>>> Windowless
>>>>  > >>>> Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be
>>>> working
>>>>  > >>>> with
>>>>  > >>>> current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded
>>>> objects if
>>>>  > >>>> you
>>>>  > >>>> don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object
>>>> Unavailable."
>>>>  > >>>> Is
>>>>  > >>>> there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently
>>>> defunct
>>>> "Kill
>>>>  > >>>> Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> hi,
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is
>>>> failing
>>>>  > >>>> to
>>>>  > >>>> access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
>>>>  > >>>> Proof of what?  I think it's likely that Flash would run
>>>> properly
>>>> in
>>>>  > >>>> Chrome
>>>>  > >>>> on the machine.  I won't have proof unless it is tried.  We
>>>> don't know
>>>>  > >>>> if
>>>>  > >>>> Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is
>>>> crashing
>>>>  > >>>> because
>>>>  > >>>> of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox.  Chrome
>>>> isn't
>>>>  > >>>> perfectly
>>>>  > >>>> accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well
>>>> when
>>>>  > >>>> used
>>>>  > >>>> on
>>>>  > >>>> sites with flash.  Chrome has quirks when working with settings
>>>> and I'm
>>>>  > >>>> not
>>>>  > >>>> sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox
>>>> but
>>>>  > >>>> when
>>>>  > >>>> used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as
>>>> accessible, as
>>>>  > >>>> Chrome.  And for this very limited use, there may be no need to
>>>> work
>>>>  > >>>> with
>>>>  > >>>> settings.
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser
>>>> currently
>>>>  > >>>> being
>>>>  > >>>> used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users
>>>> or
>>>> on a
>>>>  > >>>> site
>>>>  > >>>> like Bleeping Computer.  It would probably be faster and easier
>>>> to just
>>>>  > >>>> try
>>>>  > >>>> Chrome.
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> Gene
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@...>
>>>>  > >>>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
>>>>  > >>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>>>  > >>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> hi,
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the
>>>> same
>>>> flash
>>>>  > >>>> used
>>>>  > >>>> in chrome, I would asume  the same problems exist.  Also,
>>>> chrome
>>>> had
>>>>  > >>>> accessibility issues last I remember.
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
>>>>  > >>>> I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should
>>>> use more
>>>>  > >>>> than
>>>>  > >>>> one browser.  If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use
>>>> Flash,
>>>>  > >>>> you
>>>>  > >>>> will probably have no problem.  Flash is built into Chrome so
>>>> you don't
>>>>  > >>>> have
>>>>  > >>>> to install or update it.  It updates itself automatically
>>>> within
>>>>  > >>>> Chrome.
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> Gene
>>>>  > >>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>  > >>>> From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@...>
>>>>  > >>>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
>>>>  > >>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>>>  > >>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years
>>>> now.
>>>> It
>>>>  > >>>> always crashes
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content.
>>>> I've
>>>>  > >>>> long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has
>>>> an
>>>>  > >>>> alternate player.
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>> If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd
>>>> also be
>>>>  > >>>> very grateful.
>>>>  > >>>> On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>>>>  > >>>>> hi,
>>>>  > >>>>>
>>>>  > >>>>> The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be
>>>> working.
>>>>  > >>>>> Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as
>>>> unavailable.
>>>>  > >>>>> Is there anything I can do about this?
>>>>  > >>>>>
>>>>  > >>>>>
>>>>  > >>>>>
>>>>  > >>>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>>
>>>>  > >>>
>>>>  > >>>
>>>>  > >>
>>>>  > >>
>>>>  > >>
>>>>  > >>
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > > --
>>>>  > > we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
>>>>  > > holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
>>>>  > > in the very authentic narration is:
>>>>  > > imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
>>>>  > > best website for studying islamic book in different languages
>>>>  > > al-islam.org
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > >
>>>>  > >
>>>>  >
>>>>  >
>>>>  > --
>>>>  > we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
>>>>  > holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
>>>>  > in the very authentic narration is:
>>>>  > imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
>>>>  > best website for studying islamic book in different languages
>>>>  > al-islam.org
>>>>  >
>>>>  >
>>>>  >
>>>>  >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
>>> holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
>>> in the very authentic narration is:
>>> imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
>>> best website for studying islamic book in different languages
>>> al-islam.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
>> holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
>> in the very authentic narration is:
>> imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
>> best website for studying islamic book in different languages
>> al-islam.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
> holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
> in the very authentic narration is:
> imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
> best website for studying islamic book in different languages
> al-islam.org
>
>
>
>




Re: regression with adobe flash

Rob
 

Gene <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:
But I'm very skeptical that you will notice any difference in performance if you use add ons.
It can, in fact, impact performance in certain cases. For example, if you use Adblock Plus and have a lot of filters, the loading of new pages can be significantly slowed down, as the desired items are stripped out.


Re: regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

A computer doesn't have to be all that new or all that fast.  Add ons take very little computer resources or power.  Maybe on a really old slow machine compared with modern machines, this or that add on might slow performance of something, I don't know.  But I'm very skeptical that you will notice any difference in performance if you use add ons.  If you actually have tried using add ons and noticed slowdowns, that's something you now know.  But if you don't use them because you assume they will cause slow downs, that's an assumption and based on what add ons are and what they do, it's very likely incorrect. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 11:45 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

my computer is not modern.
i use windows xp ram 2gb and cpu 2 also.

On 12/4/16, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
> That assumption is usually wrong.  At times, an add on may cause a problem
> in performance of some sort but add ons are just small bits of code that, in
> most cases, do nothing or almost nothing unless the user takes an action
> that gets them to do something or unless they are intended to be generally
> active such as an add on to add a certain synthesizer to NVDA.  In that
> case, of course, the add on is always active when the synthesizer is in use.
>  But add ons should not affect adversely, performance of programs in
> general.  Even if an add on monitors the activity in a program and
> automatically does something when wanted or needed, modern computers are so
> fast that the activity of the add on uses such a tiny amount of the capacity
> of the computer that any possible slowing of performance is so tiny that it
> is unnoticeable.
>
> If add ons adversely affected performance, they wouldn't be as popular as
> they are.  One reason people use Firefox, for example, is because of the
> great number of add ons they have to choose from when deciding if they want
> to add features or functions.  A large number of NVDA users use add ons as
> well.
>
> Without good reasons, such as reports from a number of reliable users or
> observations you make yourself, often in more than one situation, of a
> problem or idea about how something affects performance, assumptions should
> not be made.  They are unsupported and may lead, as in this case, to
> needlessly not getting benefits or advantages that are available.
>
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: nasrin khaksar
> Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 6:27 AM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>
>
> i know that its safe to install addons from the original sites.
> but i prefer that use only programs not addons.
> i am sure that the main program without addons are more fast, stable
> and reliable.
>
> On 12/4/16, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...> wrote:
>> I'm sure somebody will say that you need at least two browsers and you
>> really do need an ad blocker as well.  I think you are safe with the nvda
>> add ons from the official site, since they have been checked out.
>>  Brian
>>
>> bglists@...
>> Sent via blueyonder.
>> Please address personal email to:-
>> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
>> in the display name field.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "nasrin khaksar" <nasrinkhaksar3@...>
>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 4:43 AM
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>
>>
>> hi gene thanks so much for helping me and your helpful informations
>> about addons and malwarebytes.
>> i use only one browser and i try to remove another ones even internet
>> explorer for many reasons!
>> i tried webvisum for month and always it causes crashes for my firefox.
>> so, i removed it many months ago!
>> i even dont install any addon for nvda!
>> only i use the installer version of nvda without no addons and
>> completely i am satisfied from it.
>>
>> On 12/4/16, David <trailerdavid@...> wrote:
>>> The NoScript add-on for firefox, is extremely simple to use. And it
>>> works all by key commands, so is fully accessible. The difference with
>>> and without it running, in certain cases could be described as nothing
>>> less than extreme.
>>>
>>> Get it installed, by downloading it from the official Firefox Add-On
>>> website. Note that if you get copies from outside that site, the add-on
>>> might not be signed, hence will be blocked in Firefox 45 or above.
>>>
>>> Once installed, go ahead and do your browsing as normal. When you get to
>>> a page which might seem cluttered, or in any other way trouble you, do
>>> as follow.
>>>
>>> Hit the App-key, alternatively Shift-F10, to open the application menu.
>>> Arrow down to the entry that says NoScript. Hit Enter, or Right-Arrow,
>>> to open the submenu.
>>>
>>> You now will see a list of all scripts that are tied to this site. For
>>> each script, there will be two entries. One to permanently allow the
>>> script, and one for only temporarily allowing the script running. All
>>> scripts that has not been allowed, will automatically be blocked.
>>>
>>> So, scroll your way down the scripts, allowing the ones you will know
>>> you can trust, and which will not cause trouble. If you are in doubt of
>>> one of the entries, simply try with it blocked, and then try temporarily
>>> allowing it. The temporary allowance will stay in effect, long as you
>>> are on that particular site. Leaving the site, and then revisiting it,
>>> only the permanently allowed scripts will stay allowed. Even if you find
>>> that one script - which you previously have allowed - causes you some
>>> trouble, you can easily go into the NoScript submenu and block it from
>>> future run.
>>>
>>> The NoScript also has its own Options page, where you can set numerous
>>> behavial options for the add-on's functionality. For instance, I have
>>> set mine to give a sound signal, whenever it is blocking scripts.
>>> Thereby I know that there might be a chance things will change, if I try
>>> unblocking some scripts. Useful when you hit a new site, and think it
>>> should show more info than what is currently the case.
>>>
>>> One place I do see a whole big difference with the add-on running, is
>>> when visiting sites on EBay. Some of their scripts are simply just
>>> causing big issues with a screen reader. Blocking them with NoScript is
>>> a matter of a breeze, and results in the EBay system to be far more
>>> blind friendly. Other netshops, or sites that are loaded with ads, might
>>> be far more accessible, when you block some of all the visualizing
>>> scripts, and other fancy-ware they love to put on modern webpages.
>>>
>>> Yet another good thing about NoScript, is this:
>>> Many fo the scripts you will experience on the websites you visit, tend
>>> to install cookies on your computer. These might in turn cause trouble.
>>> For instance, a cookie on your computer, might cause certain background
>>> activity to keep in business, even when you leave the website that
>>> initiated the script. Such could be the trouble that causes a screen
>>> reader to malfunction. Have seen this numerous times. Since NoScript
>>> blocks the script from initiating itself, it also blocks the cookie from
>>> being installed on your computer, hence no further activity of that
>>> script can take place. Your system simply might just benefit from the
>>> less polluted environment.
>>>
>>> Like I said, many websites these days, tend to load your system with
>>> numerous, less beneficial scripts. For instance, there ar many scripts
>>> that will activate advertisements on the site. Others intend to give the
>>> website a more fancy look, that is, for the sighted person. For the
>>> screen reader, it could mean the whole page to be inaccessible. Some
>>> scripts are collecting statistical information about your browsing
>>> behavior; who knows what they are going to use that for. And still
>>> others will cause the page to be constantly updated, like in the case of
>>> EBay sites. Blocking these scripts, will cause your screen reader to get
>>> a more stabil webpage to read.
>>>
>>> For those who have not yet given the NoScript add-on for Firefox a try,
>>> I strongly recommend it. It has been around for a number of years, is
>>> totally free, receives frequent updates, and has been suggested for many
>>> a screen reader user.. In fact, it was another user who adviced I give
>>> it a try. And I have never looked back. It is the number one add-on I
>>> install on new installations of Firefox.
>>>
>>> David
>>>
>>>
>>> On 12/3/2016 5:12 PM, Gene wrote:
>>>  > The way you discussed enabling or disabling JAVA script in
>>> about:config is one way.  There is a plug in named no script but I
>>> haven't used it enough to evaluate it well.  I'm not sure how easy it is
>>> to use it to block scripts and unblock them.  Others will probably
>>> comment on that.
>>>  >
>>>  > One convenient option is to use two different copies of Firefox
>>> portable on your machine.  Or you could use the installed version and
>>> have a copy of Firefox portable on the same machine.  You would have
>>> JAVA scripts disabled in one of the programs and enabled in the other.
>>> You could easily and conveniently use one browser on a site where you
>>> want to use JAVA scripts and the other browser where you don't want to
>>> use them.  You wouldn't have to then keep changing settings in the
>>> browser.
>>>  >
>>>  > Gene
>>>  >
>>>  > From: nasrin khaksar
>>>  > Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 9:45 AM
>>>  > To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>>  > Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>  >
>>>  > hi geen again.
>>>  > you rescued me from a very big concern!
>>>  > i realy pray for you and admire your help and useful informations.
>>>  > and thanks so much for the great news about reduce use of flash in
>>> firefox!
>>>  > about your question, when i realy need one audio file, i select to
>>>  > open it with the potplayer or download it.
>>>  > and when i dont need it, i benefit from not waisting of my internet
>>> charge!
>>>  > and how do you activate and deactivate javascript when you need and
>>>  > dont need it?
>>>  > i only know that about:config and make true and false
>>> javascript.enabled.
>>>  >
>>>  > On 12/3/16, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
>>>  > > I don't see why you would have a JAVA plugin if you didn't install
>>> the JAVA
>>>  > > program.  The plugin is installed by JAVA.
>>>  > >
>>>  > > As far as JAVA settings in the about:config settings are concerned,
>>> as far
>>>  > > as I can see, they all apply to JAVA script, not to JAVA, the
>>> program.  The
>>>  > > one I wasn't sure of, I did a Google search on and it has nothing
>>> to do with
>>>  > > JAVA, the program.
>>>  > >
>>>  > > Gene
>>>  > > ----- Original Message -----
>>>  > >
>>>  > > From: nasrin khaksar
>>>  > > Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 7:49 AM
>>>  > > To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>>  > > Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>  > >
>>>  > >
>>>  > > hi gene.
>>>  > > thanks for your useful information.
>>>  > > i never dont install java program but i am afraid always that is it
>>>  > > possible that java plugin works in the browser without installing
>>> java
>>>  > > program?
>>>  > > if its no, whats the reason that i see java plugin in firefox
>>>  > > about:config and i change plugin.state.java to 0?
>>>  > > i use windows xp and the newer versions of java and also firefox 53
>>>  > > and later, dont support xp.
>>>  > > which version of windows, do you use?
>>>  > > thanks and God bless you for your help.
>>>  > >
>>>  > > On 12/3/16, Brice Mijares <bricemijares@...> wrote:
>>>  > >> I read some where last week where FX will prevent adobe flash from
>>>  > >> working by summer of 2017.
>>>  > >>
>>>  > >> On 12/3/2016 12:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
>>>  > >>> hi.
>>>  > >>> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security
>>> problems.
>>>  > >>> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem
>>> for
>>>  > >>> this.
>>>  > >>>
>>>  > >>> On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@...> wrote:
>>>  > >>>> I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this
>>> with
>>>  > >>>> Chrome
>>>  > >>>> later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill
>>>  > >>>> Windowless
>>>  > >>>> Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be
>>> working
>>>  > >>>> with
>>>  > >>>> current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded
>>> objects if
>>>  > >>>> you
>>>  > >>>> don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object
>>> Unavailable."
>>>  > >>>> Is
>>>  > >>>> there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently defunct
>>> "Kill
>>>  > >>>> Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> hi,
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is
>>> failing
>>>  > >>>> to
>>>  > >>>> access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
>>>  > >>>> Proof of what?  I think it's likely that Flash would run
>>> properly
>>> in
>>>  > >>>> Chrome
>>>  > >>>> on the machine.  I won't have proof unless it is tried.  We
>>> don't know
>>>  > >>>> if
>>>  > >>>> Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is
>>> crashing
>>>  > >>>> because
>>>  > >>>> of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox.  Chrome
>>> isn't
>>>  > >>>> perfectly
>>>  > >>>> accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well
>>> when
>>>  > >>>> used
>>>  > >>>> on
>>>  > >>>> sites with flash.  Chrome has quirks when working with settings
>>> and I'm
>>>  > >>>> not
>>>  > >>>> sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox
>>> but
>>>  > >>>> when
>>>  > >>>> used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as
>>> accessible, as
>>>  > >>>> Chrome.  And for this very limited use, there may be no need to
>>> work
>>>  > >>>> with
>>>  > >>>> settings.
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser
>>> currently
>>>  > >>>> being
>>>  > >>>> used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or
>>> on a
>>>  > >>>> site
>>>  > >>>> like Bleeping Computer.  It would probably be faster and easier
>>> to just
>>>  > >>>> try
>>>  > >>>> Chrome.
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> Gene
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@...>
>>>  > >>>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
>>>  > >>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>>  > >>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> hi,
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same
>>> flash
>>>  > >>>> used
>>>  > >>>> in chrome, I would asume  the same problems exist.  Also, chrome
>>> had
>>>  > >>>> accessibility issues last I remember.
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
>>>  > >>>> I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should
>>> use more
>>>  > >>>> than
>>>  > >>>> one browser.  If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use
>>> Flash,
>>>  > >>>> you
>>>  > >>>> will probably have no problem.  Flash is built into Chrome so
>>> you don't
>>>  > >>>> have
>>>  > >>>> to install or update it.  It updates itself automatically within
>>>  > >>>> Chrome.
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> Gene
>>>  > >>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>  > >>>> From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@...>
>>>  > >>>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
>>>  > >>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>>  > >>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now.
>>> It
>>>  > >>>> always crashes
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content.
>>> I've
>>>  > >>>> long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
>>>  > >>>> alternate player.
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>> If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd
>>> also be
>>>  > >>>> very grateful.
>>>  > >>>> On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>>>  > >>>>> hi,
>>>  > >>>>>
>>>  > >>>>> The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
>>>  > >>>>> Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as
>>> unavailable.
>>>  > >>>>> Is there anything I can do about this?
>>>  > >>>>>
>>>  > >>>>>
>>>  > >>>>>
>>>  > >>>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>>
>>>  > >>>
>>>  > >>>
>>>  > >>
>>>  > >>
>>>  > >>
>>>  > >>
>>>  > >
>>>  > >
>>>  > > --
>>>  > > we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
>>>  > > holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
>>>  > > in the very authentic narration is:
>>>  > > imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
>>>  > > best website for studying islamic book in different languages
>>>  > > al-islam.org
>>>  > >
>>>  > >
>>>  > >
>>>  > >
>>>  >
>>>  >
>>>  > --
>>>  > we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
>>>  > holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
>>>  > in the very authentic narration is:
>>>  > imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
>>>  > best website for studying islamic book in different languages
>>>  > al-islam.org
>>>  >
>>>  >
>>>  >
>>>  >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
>> holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
>> in the very authentic narration is:
>> imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
>> best website for studying islamic book in different languages
>> al-islam.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
> holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
> in the very authentic narration is:
> imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
> best website for studying islamic book in different languages
> al-islam.org
>
>
>
>


--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




Re: regression with adobe flash

Andre Fisher
 

And you always wonder why you write to the list experiencing sluggishness?

On 12/4/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@gmail.com> wrote:
my computer is not modern.
i use windows xp ram 2gb and cpu 2 also.

On 12/4/16, Gene <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:
That assumption is usually wrong. At times, an add on may cause a
problem
in performance of some sort but add ons are just small bits of code that,
in
most cases, do nothing or almost nothing unless the user takes an action
that gets them to do something or unless they are intended to be
generally
active such as an add on to add a certain synthesizer to NVDA. In that
case, of course, the add on is always active when the synthesizer is in
use.
But add ons should not affect adversely, performance of programs in
general. Even if an add on monitors the activity in a program and
automatically does something when wanted or needed, modern computers are
so
fast that the activity of the add on uses such a tiny amount of the
capacity
of the computer that any possible slowing of performance is so tiny that
it
is unnoticeable.

If add ons adversely affected performance, they wouldn't be as popular as
they are. One reason people use Firefox, for example, is because of the
great number of add ons they have to choose from when deciding if they
want
to add features or functions. A large number of NVDA users use add ons
as
well.

Without good reasons, such as reports from a number of reliable users or
observations you make yourself, often in more than one situation, of a
problem or idea about how something affects performance, assumptions
should
not be made. They are unsupported and may lead, as in this case, to
needlessly not getting benefits or advantages that are available.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: nasrin khaksar
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 6:27 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash


i know that its safe to install addons from the original sites.
but i prefer that use only programs not addons.
i am sure that the main program without addons are more fast, stable
and reliable.

On 12/4/16, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
I'm sure somebody will say that you need at least two browsers and you
really do need an ad blocker as well. I think you are safe with the
nvda
add ons from the official site, since they have been checked out.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "nasrin khaksar" <nasrinkhaksar3@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 4:43 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash


hi gene thanks so much for helping me and your helpful informations
about addons and malwarebytes.
i use only one browser and i try to remove another ones even internet
explorer for many reasons!
i tried webvisum for month and always it causes crashes for my firefox.
so, i removed it many months ago!
i even dont install any addon for nvda!
only i use the installer version of nvda without no addons and
completely i am satisfied from it.

On 12/4/16, David <trailerdavid@hotmail.com> wrote:
The NoScript add-on for firefox, is extremely simple to use. And it
works all by key commands, so is fully accessible. The difference with
and without it running, in certain cases could be described as nothing
less than extreme.

Get it installed, by downloading it from the official Firefox Add-On
website. Note that if you get copies from outside that site, the add-on
might not be signed, hence will be blocked in Firefox 45 or above.

Once installed, go ahead and do your browsing as normal. When you get
to
a page which might seem cluttered, or in any other way trouble you, do
as follow.

Hit the App-key, alternatively Shift-F10, to open the application menu.
Arrow down to the entry that says NoScript. Hit Enter, or Right-Arrow,
to open the submenu.

You now will see a list of all scripts that are tied to this site. For
each script, there will be two entries. One to permanently allow the
script, and one for only temporarily allowing the script running. All
scripts that has not been allowed, will automatically be blocked.

So, scroll your way down the scripts, allowing the ones you will know
you can trust, and which will not cause trouble. If you are in doubt of
one of the entries, simply try with it blocked, and then try
temporarily
allowing it. The temporary allowance will stay in effect, long as you
are on that particular site. Leaving the site, and then revisiting it,
only the permanently allowed scripts will stay allowed. Even if you
find
that one script - which you previously have allowed - causes you some
trouble, you can easily go into the NoScript submenu and block it from
future run.

The NoScript also has its own Options page, where you can set numerous
behavial options for the add-on's functionality. For instance, I have
set mine to give a sound signal, whenever it is blocking scripts.
Thereby I know that there might be a chance things will change, if I
try
unblocking some scripts. Useful when you hit a new site, and think it
should show more info than what is currently the case.

One place I do see a whole big difference with the add-on running, is
when visiting sites on EBay. Some of their scripts are simply just
causing big issues with a screen reader. Blocking them with NoScript is
a matter of a breeze, and results in the EBay system to be far more
blind friendly. Other netshops, or sites that are loaded with ads,
might
be far more accessible, when you block some of all the visualizing
scripts, and other fancy-ware they love to put on modern webpages.

Yet another good thing about NoScript, is this:
Many fo the scripts you will experience on the websites you visit, tend
to install cookies on your computer. These might in turn cause trouble.
For instance, a cookie on your computer, might cause certain background
activity to keep in business, even when you leave the website that
initiated the script. Such could be the trouble that causes a screen
reader to malfunction. Have seen this numerous times. Since NoScript
blocks the script from initiating itself, it also blocks the cookie
from
being installed on your computer, hence no further activity of that
script can take place. Your system simply might just benefit from the
less polluted environment.

Like I said, many websites these days, tend to load your system with
numerous, less beneficial scripts. For instance, there ar many scripts
that will activate advertisements on the site. Others intend to give
the
website a more fancy look, that is, for the sighted person. For the
screen reader, it could mean the whole page to be inaccessible. Some
scripts are collecting statistical information about your browsing
behavior; who knows what they are going to use that for. And still
others will cause the page to be constantly updated, like in the case
of
EBay sites. Blocking these scripts, will cause your screen reader to
get
a more stabil webpage to read.

For those who have not yet given the NoScript add-on for Firefox a try,
I strongly recommend it. It has been around for a number of years, is
totally free, receives frequent updates, and has been suggested for
many
a screen reader user.. In fact, it was another user who adviced I give
it a try. And I have never looked back. It is the number one add-on I
install on new installations of Firefox.

David


On 12/3/2016 5:12 PM, Gene wrote:
> The way you discussed enabling or disabling JAVA script in
about:config is one way. There is a plug in named no script but I
haven't used it enough to evaluate it well. I'm not sure how easy it
is
to use it to block scripts and unblock them. Others will probably
comment on that.
>
> One convenient option is to use two different copies of Firefox
portable on your machine. Or you could use the installed version and
have a copy of Firefox portable on the same machine. You would have
JAVA scripts disabled in one of the programs and enabled in the other.
You could easily and conveniently use one browser on a site where you
want to use JAVA scripts and the other browser where you don't want to
use them. You wouldn't have to then keep changing settings in the
browser.
>
> Gene
>
> From: nasrin khaksar
> Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 9:45 AM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>
> hi geen again.
> you rescued me from a very big concern!
> i realy pray for you and admire your help and useful informations.
> and thanks so much for the great news about reduce use of flash in
firefox!
> about your question, when i realy need one audio file, i select to
> open it with the potplayer or download it.
> and when i dont need it, i benefit from not waisting of my internet
charge!
> and how do you activate and deactivate javascript when you need and
> dont need it?
> i only know that about:config and make true and false
javascript.enabled.
>
> On 12/3/16, Gene <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:
> > I don't see why you would have a JAVA plugin if you didn't install
the JAVA
> > program. The plugin is installed by JAVA.
> >
> > As far as JAVA settings in the about:config settings are
concerned,
as far
> > as I can see, they all apply to JAVA script, not to JAVA, the
program. The
> > one I wasn't sure of, I did a Google search on and it has nothing
to do with
> > JAVA, the program.
> >
> > Gene
> > ----- Original Message -----
> >
> > From: nasrin khaksar
> > Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 7:49 AM
> > To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> > Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
> >
> >
> > hi gene.
> > thanks for your useful information.
> > i never dont install java program but i am afraid always that is
it
> > possible that java plugin works in the browser without installing
java
> > program?
> > if its no, whats the reason that i see java plugin in firefox
> > about:config and i change plugin.state.java to 0?
> > i use windows xp and the newer versions of java and also firefox
53
> > and later, dont support xp.
> > which version of windows, do you use?
> > thanks and God bless you for your help.
> >
> > On 12/3/16, Brice Mijares <bricemijares@att.net> wrote:
> >> I read some where last week where FX will prevent adobe flash
from
> >> working by summer of 2017.
> >>
> >> On 12/3/2016 12:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
> >>> hi.
> >>> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security
problems.
> >>> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem
for
> >>> this.
> >>>
> >>> On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>> I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this
with
> >>>> Chrome
> >>>> later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill
> >>>> Windowless
> >>>> Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be
working
> >>>> with
> >>>> current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded
objects if
> >>>> you
> >>>> don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object
Unavailable."
> >>>> Is
> >>>> there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently
defunct
"Kill
> >>>> Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?
> >>>>
> >>>> On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> hi,
> >>>>
> >>>> let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is
failing
> >>>> to
> >>>> access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.
> >>>>
> >>>> On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
> >>>> Proof of what? I think it's likely that Flash would run
properly
in
> >>>> Chrome
> >>>> on the machine. I won't have proof unless it is tried. We
don't know
> >>>> if
> >>>> Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is
crashing
> >>>> because
> >>>> of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox. Chrome
isn't
> >>>> perfectly
> >>>> accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well
when
> >>>> used
> >>>> on
> >>>> sites with flash. Chrome has quirks when working with settings
and I'm
> >>>> not
> >>>> sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox
but
> >>>> when
> >>>> used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as
accessible, as
> >>>> Chrome. And for this very limited use, there may be no need to
work
> >>>> with
> >>>> settings.
> >>>>
> >>>> Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser
currently
> >>>> being
> >>>> used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users
or
on a
> >>>> site
> >>>> like Bleeping Computer. It would probably be faster and easier
to just
> >>>> try
> >>>> Chrome.
> >>>>
> >>>> Gene
> >>>>
> >>>> From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@gmail.com>
> >>>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
> >>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> >>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> hi,
> >>>>
> >>>> do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the
same
flash
> >>>> used
> >>>> in chrome, I would asume the same problems exist. Also,
chrome
had
> >>>> accessibility issues last I remember.
> >>>>
> >>>> On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
> >>>> I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should
use more
> >>>> than
> >>>> one browser. If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use
Flash,
> >>>> you
> >>>> will probably have no problem. Flash is built into Chrome so
you don't
> >>>> have
> >>>> to install or update it. It updates itself automatically
within
> >>>> Chrome.
> >>>>
> >>>> Gene
> >>>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>>> From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com>
> >>>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
> >>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> >>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
> >>>>
> >>>> I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years
now.
It
> >>>> always crashes
> >>>>
> >>>> if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content.
I've
> >>>> long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has
an
> >>>> alternate player.
> >>>>
> >>>> If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd
also be
> >>>> very grateful.
> >>>> On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
> >>>>> hi,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be
working.
> >>>>> Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as
unavailable.
> >>>>> Is there anything I can do about this?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
> > holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
> > in the very authentic narration is:
> > imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
> > best website for studying islamic book in different languages
> > al-islam.org
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
> holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
> in the very authentic narration is:
> imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
> best website for studying islamic book in different languages
> al-islam.org
>
>
>
>






--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org







--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




Re: My NVDA Screen reader not working properly

 

hi ibrahim again.
did you read my previous comment and the link that i sent?
could you solve the problem of your browser?
thanks!

On 12/4/16, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
There is no best any more. It just depends if you have been having issues
with a particular bit of malware and that anti malware program makes a good

job of getting rid of it.
Also some of them shove perfectly good bits of software like password
stores or some email password rminder software as a hacker type tool.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "nasrin khaksar" <nasrinkhaksar3@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 4:30 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] My NVDA Screen reader not working properly


hi gene.
but which is the best antimalware antispyware according to my cryteria?

On 12/4/16, Gene <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:
I did a Google search for a phrase like Spybot search and destroy after
seeing your comments and found contradictory information. A user forum
on
Bleeping Computer had negative comments from two or three people and no
positive ones that I recall. That was from 2014. A 2016 review in PC
Mag
gave it a really bad review. I saw two or three other reviews that gave

it
a good or very good review. So users will have to do their own research

and
make up their own minds about it.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: David
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 2:10 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] My NVDA Screen reader not working properly


Let me arrest you a whole lot on one point here.




Recently I had severe trouble with my Window-Eyes in cooperation with
both
Firefox and Thunderbird. No matter what settings I meddled with, the
trouble
kept sticky.




I ran several clean-up utilities, including both locally installed, and
online scanners. Also tried the newest version of Malwarebytes. No
chance.
The troubles persisted.




Finally, I decided to give Spybot a go, and to the highest contrary of
your
claimed statement, Spybot was that effective, that I have had no trouble
since. This all took place within the last four months. So your
statement
that the software has not been effective, at least proved itself wrong in

my
case.




Spybot further do receive updates - both to the main core software, and
the
databases - on a regular basis. If you have not given it a try for a few
years, then go and try it out, and see if you still think it is not
effective. I only can speak for my own experience, and that of which I
am
told from other users on other lists.




DavidOn 12/3/2016 5:06 PM, Gene wrote:

Spybot hasn't been effective for years. Malware Bytes is considered
an
exceptionally good program.

Gene


From: nasrin khaksar
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 9:24 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] My NVDA Screen reader not working properly


hi david.
are the antimalware which you mentioned freeware, efficient, and
accessible for us?
are they trustworthy and safe to remove only malitious files not our
healthy files?
thanks so much.

On 12/3/16, David <trailerdavid@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Sounds like you have some sort of bug on the system, or other things
> conflicting.
>
>
> Here, let me give you but one thing to try.
>
>
> Turn off NVDA, and then launch Narrator. The safest way, which will
work
> in all flavors of Windows, would be to hit the Win-R, and then type
in
> "narrator" (without the quotes), and hit Enter.
>
>
> With Narrator loaded, try to launch Internet Explorer. Does it still
> take an excessive amount of time to load? If so, the trouble sits
with
> Internet Explorer, most likely. Or, generally in your computer
system,
> somewhere.
>
>
> On the other hand, should it now be that Internet Explorer will load
> fast and smoothly, likely something is going on between the the
browser
> and NVDA.
>
>
> Secondly, let me take you a step further, if the browser is
sluggish,
> even with Narrator.
>
>
> In this case, you might want to trace possible troubles within the
> browser. Since it loads slowly anyway, you can go back to using
NVDA,
> for the further investigation.
>
>
> Not sure which flavor of Windows you are on, but if you are on Win7
and
> above, hit the Win-key, and type the first few letters in "Internet
> Explorer". When it pops up as the alternative, arrow down once or
twice,
> till you get to the entry that says something like: "Load Internet
> Expleorer without add-ons". Hit Enter here, and see if your browser
> loads fast now. If so, you might want to go through the add-ons
> installed in your browser. You will find the Add-on manager under
Tools,
> if memory serves me right.
>
>
> Should your browser still be slow and sluggish, I only could suggest
for
> you to clean out any cookies you do not fully and completely need.
>
>
> All of this, is of course made as suggestions, based on the fact
that
> you are sure to run a clean system. If not, I would strongly
recommend
> you give your computer a thorough laundry and vacuum cleaning. That
is
> to say, run at least one piece of Anti-Virus scan, and no less than
one
> Anti-Malware scan. Either use locally installed products, which you
can
> download for free, or use online services. Note, if you are on a
dial-up
> connection, please do not run online scanners, as the traffic over
the
> net will be extensive, and your phone bill will raise dramatically.
>
>
> Free anti-malware scanners that might be of interest, could be
> Malwarebytes, or Spybot Search & Destroy. You will find those and
> others, from the Ninite site, which I strongly recommend since you
then
> won't get loads of bloatware along with your installation. Ninite
you
> find here:
>
> www.ninite.com/
>
>
> Hope any of this helped you out a bit.
>
>
> David
>
> On 12/3/2016 11:40 AM, Ibrahim Ajayi wrote:
>> Hi good people:
>> I'm having teething problems with my NVDA screenreader. The
problem
>> happens when I am on the internet. Firstly, my web browser, does
not
>> launch quickly. Before NVDA launches with the browser, it takes a
>> very long time. Secondly, it can be very difficult to navigate a
web
>> page. The screenreader responds very slowly. Sometimes, I have to
>> relaunch the NVDA from the desktop, to get it working properly.
>> Thirdly, sometimes, when I am working on a site, I am taking off
the
>> site totally, and I have to go through the painful process of
>> relaunching the site again.
>> Please has anyone had these problems at any time, how did you go
about
>> resolving them. It's terrible, and I don't know what to do.
>> Looking forward to reading from you.
>> >From Ibrahim in Nigeria.
>>
>>
>>
>> .
>>
>
>
>
>
>


--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org






--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org





--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: regression with adobe flash

 

my computer is not modern.
i use windows xp ram 2gb and cpu 2 also.

On 12/4/16, Gene <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:
That assumption is usually wrong. At times, an add on may cause a problem
in performance of some sort but add ons are just small bits of code that, in
most cases, do nothing or almost nothing unless the user takes an action
that gets them to do something or unless they are intended to be generally
active such as an add on to add a certain synthesizer to NVDA. In that
case, of course, the add on is always active when the synthesizer is in use.
But add ons should not affect adversely, performance of programs in
general. Even if an add on monitors the activity in a program and
automatically does something when wanted or needed, modern computers are so
fast that the activity of the add on uses such a tiny amount of the capacity
of the computer that any possible slowing of performance is so tiny that it
is unnoticeable.

If add ons adversely affected performance, they wouldn't be as popular as
they are. One reason people use Firefox, for example, is because of the
great number of add ons they have to choose from when deciding if they want
to add features or functions. A large number of NVDA users use add ons as
well.

Without good reasons, such as reports from a number of reliable users or
observations you make yourself, often in more than one situation, of a
problem or idea about how something affects performance, assumptions should
not be made. They are unsupported and may lead, as in this case, to
needlessly not getting benefits or advantages that are available.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: nasrin khaksar
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 6:27 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash


i know that its safe to install addons from the original sites.
but i prefer that use only programs not addons.
i am sure that the main program without addons are more fast, stable
and reliable.

On 12/4/16, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
I'm sure somebody will say that you need at least two browsers and you
really do need an ad blocker as well. I think you are safe with the nvda
add ons from the official site, since they have been checked out.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "nasrin khaksar" <nasrinkhaksar3@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 4:43 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash


hi gene thanks so much for helping me and your helpful informations
about addons and malwarebytes.
i use only one browser and i try to remove another ones even internet
explorer for many reasons!
i tried webvisum for month and always it causes crashes for my firefox.
so, i removed it many months ago!
i even dont install any addon for nvda!
only i use the installer version of nvda without no addons and
completely i am satisfied from it.

On 12/4/16, David <trailerdavid@hotmail.com> wrote:
The NoScript add-on for firefox, is extremely simple to use. And it
works all by key commands, so is fully accessible. The difference with
and without it running, in certain cases could be described as nothing
less than extreme.

Get it installed, by downloading it from the official Firefox Add-On
website. Note that if you get copies from outside that site, the add-on
might not be signed, hence will be blocked in Firefox 45 or above.

Once installed, go ahead and do your browsing as normal. When you get to
a page which might seem cluttered, or in any other way trouble you, do
as follow.

Hit the App-key, alternatively Shift-F10, to open the application menu.
Arrow down to the entry that says NoScript. Hit Enter, or Right-Arrow,
to open the submenu.

You now will see a list of all scripts that are tied to this site. For
each script, there will be two entries. One to permanently allow the
script, and one for only temporarily allowing the script running. All
scripts that has not been allowed, will automatically be blocked.

So, scroll your way down the scripts, allowing the ones you will know
you can trust, and which will not cause trouble. If you are in doubt of
one of the entries, simply try with it blocked, and then try temporarily
allowing it. The temporary allowance will stay in effect, long as you
are on that particular site. Leaving the site, and then revisiting it,
only the permanently allowed scripts will stay allowed. Even if you find
that one script - which you previously have allowed - causes you some
trouble, you can easily go into the NoScript submenu and block it from
future run.

The NoScript also has its own Options page, where you can set numerous
behavial options for the add-on's functionality. For instance, I have
set mine to give a sound signal, whenever it is blocking scripts.
Thereby I know that there might be a chance things will change, if I try
unblocking some scripts. Useful when you hit a new site, and think it
should show more info than what is currently the case.

One place I do see a whole big difference with the add-on running, is
when visiting sites on EBay. Some of their scripts are simply just
causing big issues with a screen reader. Blocking them with NoScript is
a matter of a breeze, and results in the EBay system to be far more
blind friendly. Other netshops, or sites that are loaded with ads, might
be far more accessible, when you block some of all the visualizing
scripts, and other fancy-ware they love to put on modern webpages.

Yet another good thing about NoScript, is this:
Many fo the scripts you will experience on the websites you visit, tend
to install cookies on your computer. These might in turn cause trouble.
For instance, a cookie on your computer, might cause certain background
activity to keep in business, even when you leave the website that
initiated the script. Such could be the trouble that causes a screen
reader to malfunction. Have seen this numerous times. Since NoScript
blocks the script from initiating itself, it also blocks the cookie from
being installed on your computer, hence no further activity of that
script can take place. Your system simply might just benefit from the
less polluted environment.

Like I said, many websites these days, tend to load your system with
numerous, less beneficial scripts. For instance, there ar many scripts
that will activate advertisements on the site. Others intend to give the
website a more fancy look, that is, for the sighted person. For the
screen reader, it could mean the whole page to be inaccessible. Some
scripts are collecting statistical information about your browsing
behavior; who knows what they are going to use that for. And still
others will cause the page to be constantly updated, like in the case of
EBay sites. Blocking these scripts, will cause your screen reader to get
a more stabil webpage to read.

For those who have not yet given the NoScript add-on for Firefox a try,
I strongly recommend it. It has been around for a number of years, is
totally free, receives frequent updates, and has been suggested for many
a screen reader user.. In fact, it was another user who adviced I give
it a try. And I have never looked back. It is the number one add-on I
install on new installations of Firefox.

David


On 12/3/2016 5:12 PM, Gene wrote:
> The way you discussed enabling or disabling JAVA script in
about:config is one way. There is a plug in named no script but I
haven't used it enough to evaluate it well. I'm not sure how easy it is
to use it to block scripts and unblock them. Others will probably
comment on that.
>
> One convenient option is to use two different copies of Firefox
portable on your machine. Or you could use the installed version and
have a copy of Firefox portable on the same machine. You would have
JAVA scripts disabled in one of the programs and enabled in the other.
You could easily and conveniently use one browser on a site where you
want to use JAVA scripts and the other browser where you don't want to
use them. You wouldn't have to then keep changing settings in the
browser.
>
> Gene
>
> From: nasrin khaksar
> Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 9:45 AM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>
> hi geen again.
> you rescued me from a very big concern!
> i realy pray for you and admire your help and useful informations.
> and thanks so much for the great news about reduce use of flash in
firefox!
> about your question, when i realy need one audio file, i select to
> open it with the potplayer or download it.
> and when i dont need it, i benefit from not waisting of my internet
charge!
> and how do you activate and deactivate javascript when you need and
> dont need it?
> i only know that about:config and make true and false
javascript.enabled.
>
> On 12/3/16, Gene <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:
> > I don't see why you would have a JAVA plugin if you didn't install
the JAVA
> > program. The plugin is installed by JAVA.
> >
> > As far as JAVA settings in the about:config settings are concerned,
as far
> > as I can see, they all apply to JAVA script, not to JAVA, the
program. The
> > one I wasn't sure of, I did a Google search on and it has nothing
to do with
> > JAVA, the program.
> >
> > Gene
> > ----- Original Message -----
> >
> > From: nasrin khaksar
> > Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 7:49 AM
> > To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> > Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
> >
> >
> > hi gene.
> > thanks for your useful information.
> > i never dont install java program but i am afraid always that is it
> > possible that java plugin works in the browser without installing
java
> > program?
> > if its no, whats the reason that i see java plugin in firefox
> > about:config and i change plugin.state.java to 0?
> > i use windows xp and the newer versions of java and also firefox 53
> > and later, dont support xp.
> > which version of windows, do you use?
> > thanks and God bless you for your help.
> >
> > On 12/3/16, Brice Mijares <bricemijares@att.net> wrote:
> >> I read some where last week where FX will prevent adobe flash from
> >> working by summer of 2017.
> >>
> >> On 12/3/2016 12:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
> >>> hi.
> >>> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security
problems.
> >>> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem
for
> >>> this.
> >>>
> >>> On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>> I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this
with
> >>>> Chrome
> >>>> later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill
> >>>> Windowless
> >>>> Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be
working
> >>>> with
> >>>> current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded
objects if
> >>>> you
> >>>> don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object
Unavailable."
> >>>> Is
> >>>> there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently defunct
"Kill
> >>>> Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?
> >>>>
> >>>> On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> hi,
> >>>>
> >>>> let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is
failing
> >>>> to
> >>>> access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.
> >>>>
> >>>> On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
> >>>> Proof of what? I think it's likely that Flash would run
properly
in
> >>>> Chrome
> >>>> on the machine. I won't have proof unless it is tried. We
don't know
> >>>> if
> >>>> Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is
crashing
> >>>> because
> >>>> of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox. Chrome
isn't
> >>>> perfectly
> >>>> accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well
when
> >>>> used
> >>>> on
> >>>> sites with flash. Chrome has quirks when working with settings
and I'm
> >>>> not
> >>>> sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox
but
> >>>> when
> >>>> used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as
accessible, as
> >>>> Chrome. And for this very limited use, there may be no need to
work
> >>>> with
> >>>> settings.
> >>>>
> >>>> Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser
currently
> >>>> being
> >>>> used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or
on a
> >>>> site
> >>>> like Bleeping Computer. It would probably be faster and easier
to just
> >>>> try
> >>>> Chrome.
> >>>>
> >>>> Gene
> >>>>
> >>>> From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@gmail.com>
> >>>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
> >>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> >>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> hi,
> >>>>
> >>>> do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same
flash
> >>>> used
> >>>> in chrome, I would asume the same problems exist. Also, chrome
had
> >>>> accessibility issues last I remember.
> >>>>
> >>>> On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
> >>>> I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should
use more
> >>>> than
> >>>> one browser. If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use
Flash,
> >>>> you
> >>>> will probably have no problem. Flash is built into Chrome so
you don't
> >>>> have
> >>>> to install or update it. It updates itself automatically within
> >>>> Chrome.
> >>>>
> >>>> Gene
> >>>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>>> From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com>
> >>>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
> >>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> >>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
> >>>>
> >>>> I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now.
It
> >>>> always crashes
> >>>>
> >>>> if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content.
I've
> >>>> long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
> >>>> alternate player.
> >>>>
> >>>> If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd
also be
> >>>> very grateful.
> >>>> On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
> >>>>> hi,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
> >>>>> Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as
unavailable.
> >>>>> Is there anything I can do about this?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
> > holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
> > in the very authentic narration is:
> > imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
> > best website for studying islamic book in different languages
> > al-islam.org
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
> holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
> in the very authentic narration is:
> imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
> best website for studying islamic book in different languages
> al-islam.org
>
>
>
>






--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org







--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org



--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: still a newbee

Andre Fisher
 

As mentionned previously, you might not exactly be pressing the
shortcut for NVDA Find. When you don't get NVDA find, what exactly do
you hear?

Thanks.

On 12/4/16, Gene <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:
For some reason browse mode may not be coming up but you are not in review
mode. If browse mode doesn't come up, you are in the equivalent of focus
mode, the mode used when working with some fields on web pages. There is no
such thing as being in review mode in NVDA. It is always active and can be
used with the appropriate commands at any time.

Although in browsers, screen review may not give you any useable information
because of the way browsers send information to the screen.

I don't know what is stopping browse mode from being active on these pages.
Try tabbing and see if it comes on. Try using the command NVDA key space
bar and see if it comes on.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Don H
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 8:16 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] still a newbee


Running NVDA RC1 on a Win 10 system. Using Firefox and going to a web
site like Best Buy.
I first use the search Edit box on the web page to search for Vizio TV.
On the results page I can then use the NVDA find function to get to the
results. I find the TV I want to look at and press enter. I am now on
the web page for that particular model. I am not on a edit box so if I
understand it correctly I am in review mode. I now try to use the NVDA
find function and can only get the windows fine function to come up
which of course isn't what I want. I try the NVDA find function several
times with same bad results.
I am obviously doing something wrong but being a newbee with NVDA I am
lost as to the solution. Please tell me what I am doing wrong.



Re: NVDA find function

Gene
 

I don't know if there is a best version.  I simply haven't upgraded because I don't use features in newer versions.  Unless you have a reason not to, there is no reason not to use the newest version.  I use one of the version 13 series but I'm not recommending any old version in particular because almost the only reason I use this version is because I don't use programs that require the newer features in newwer versions of NVDA.  Nor do I use a version of Windows that requires later versions to work well.  I use XP and Windows 7.  This just happens to be the version I stopped upgrading.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----

Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 8:58 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA find function

gene, which version of nvda do you use and whats the best version of
it do you think?

On 12/4/16, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
> I don't think this has anything to do with code on the page.  I hadn't given
> this much thought since I can so easily get around the problem but off and
> on, using Firefox and XP and an old version of NVDA, the find command moves
> me to the top of the page or about the top of the page and doesn't move me
> where I want to go.  I simply use the repeat search command in such a case.
> I haven't played with this enough to be sure if the repeat search command
> ever doesn't work properly.  I thought this might be a general problem but
> since I hadn't seen anything about this on the list in all this time, I
> thought it might be just my problem. It may be worth looking into, or at
> least, if others have a problem, it would be worth reporting here so we can
> get an idea if it is a general problem or a very limited one In terms of
> affected users.
>
> Also, I continue to use an old version of NVDA for convenience.  I don't use
> the newer features and so I just use newer versions at times for testing
> reported problems or for learning something about changes and new features.
> So I didn't know if my experience reflected the old version and not newer
> ones.  It appears this may be a problem others are having as well.
>
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Brian's Mail list account
> Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 5:57 AM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA find function
>
>
> Yes I've noticed this. I did wonder if it may be some hidden stuff on some
> pages. Sometimes it works well though.
>
> I don't use Chrome but its better on firefox than Ie.
>  Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Don H" <lmddh50@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:50 PM
> Subject: [nvda] NVDA find function
>
>
>> Running Win 10 and use IE, Firefox and Google Chrome as my browsers.  I
>> find the NVDA find function very inconsistent with regards to finding
>> things on web pages.  I invoke the find command with NVDA key control f
>> and type in my search term.  On some occasions it finds and moves to the
>> search term and other times after pressing enter after entering the term I
>>
>> want to search for it does nothing as if I did not press enter at all.
>> Works the poorest with IE but doesn't do a lot better on Firefox and
>> Chrome.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>


--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org



Re: still a newbee

Gene
 

For some reason browse mode may not be coming up but you are not in review mode.  If browse mode doesn't come up, you are in the equivalent of focus mode, the mode used when working with some fields on web pages.  There is no such thing as being in review mode in NVDA.  It is always active and can be used with the appropriate commands at any time. 
 
Although in browsers, screen review may not give you any useable information because of the way browsers send information to the screen.
 
I don't know what is stopping browse mode from being active on these pages.  Try tabbing and see if it comes on.  Try using the command NVDA key space bar and see if it comes on. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Don H
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 8:16 AM
Subject: [nvda] still a newbee

Running NVDA RC1 on a Win 10 system.  Using Firefox and going to a web
site like Best Buy.
I first use the search Edit box on the web page to search for Vizio TV.
On the results page I can then use the NVDA find function to get to the
results.  I find the TV I want to look at and press enter.  I am now on
the web page for that particular model.  I am not on a edit box so if I
understand it correctly I am in review mode.  I now try to use the NVDA
find function and can only get the windows fine function to come up
which of course isn't what I want.  I try the NVDA find function several
times with same bad results.
I am obviously doing something wrong but being a newbee with NVDA I am
lost as to the solution.  Please tell me what I am doing wrong.



Re: regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

That assumption is usually wrong.  At times, an add on may cause a problem in performance of some sort but add ons are just small bits of code that, in most cases, do nothing or almost nothing unless the user takes an action that gets them to do something or unless they are intended to be generally active such as an add on to add a certain synthesizer to NVDA.  In that case, of course, the add on is always active when the synthesizer is in use.  But add ons should not affect adversely, performance of programs in general.  Even if an add on monitors the activity in a program and automatically does something when wanted or needed, modern computers are so fast that the activity of the add on uses such a tiny amount of the capacity of the computer that any possible slowing of performance is so tiny that it is unnoticeable. 
 
If add ons adversely affected performance, they wouldn't be as popular as they are.  One reason people use Firefox, for example, is because of the great number of add ons they have to choose from when deciding if they want to add features or functions.  A large number of NVDA users use add ons as well.
 
Without good reasons, such as reports from a number of reliable users or observations you make yourself, often in more than one situation, of a problem or idea about how something affects performance, assumptions should not be made.  They are unsupported and may lead, as in this case, to needlessly not getting benefits or advantages that are available.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 6:27 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

i know that its safe to install addons from the original sites.
but i prefer that use only programs not addons.
i am sure that the main program without addons are more fast, stable
and reliable.

On 12/4/16, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...> wrote:
> I'm sure somebody will say that you need at least two browsers and you
> really do need an ad blocker as well.  I think you are safe with the nvda
> add ons from the official site, since they have been checked out.
>  Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "nasrin khaksar" <nasrinkhaksar3@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 4:43 AM
> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>
>
> hi gene thanks so much for helping me and your helpful informations
> about addons and malwarebytes.
> i use only one browser and i try to remove another ones even internet
> explorer for many reasons!
> i tried webvisum for month and always it causes crashes for my firefox.
> so, i removed it many months ago!
> i even dont install any addon for nvda!
> only i use the installer version of nvda without no addons and
> completely i am satisfied from it.
>
> On 12/4/16, David <trailerdavid@...> wrote:
>> The NoScript add-on for firefox, is extremely simple to use. And it
>> works all by key commands, so is fully accessible. The difference with
>> and without it running, in certain cases could be described as nothing
>> less than extreme.
>>
>> Get it installed, by downloading it from the official Firefox Add-On
>> website. Note that if you get copies from outside that site, the add-on
>> might not be signed, hence will be blocked in Firefox 45 or above.
>>
>> Once installed, go ahead and do your browsing as normal. When you get to
>> a page which might seem cluttered, or in any other way trouble you, do
>> as follow.
>>
>> Hit the App-key, alternatively Shift-F10, to open the application menu.
>> Arrow down to the entry that says NoScript. Hit Enter, or Right-Arrow,
>> to open the submenu.
>>
>> You now will see a list of all scripts that are tied to this site. For
>> each script, there will be two entries. One to permanently allow the
>> script, and one for only temporarily allowing the script running. All
>> scripts that has not been allowed, will automatically be blocked.
>>
>> So, scroll your way down the scripts, allowing the ones you will know
>> you can trust, and which will not cause trouble. If you are in doubt of
>> one of the entries, simply try with it blocked, and then try temporarily
>> allowing it. The temporary allowance will stay in effect, long as you
>> are on that particular site. Leaving the site, and then revisiting it,
>> only the permanently allowed scripts will stay allowed. Even if you find
>> that one script - which you previously have allowed - causes you some
>> trouble, you can easily go into the NoScript submenu and block it from
>> future run.
>>
>> The NoScript also has its own Options page, where you can set numerous
>> behavial options for the add-on's functionality. For instance, I have
>> set mine to give a sound signal, whenever it is blocking scripts.
>> Thereby I know that there might be a chance things will change, if I try
>> unblocking some scripts. Useful when you hit a new site, and think it
>> should show more info than what is currently the case.
>>
>> One place I do see a whole big difference with the add-on running, is
>> when visiting sites on EBay. Some of their scripts are simply just
>> causing big issues with a screen reader. Blocking them with NoScript is
>> a matter of a breeze, and results in the EBay system to be far more
>> blind friendly. Other netshops, or sites that are loaded with ads, might
>> be far more accessible, when you block some of all the visualizing
>> scripts, and other fancy-ware they love to put on modern webpages.
>>
>> Yet another good thing about NoScript, is this:
>> Many fo the scripts you will experience on the websites you visit, tend
>> to install cookies on your computer. These might in turn cause trouble.
>> For instance, a cookie on your computer, might cause certain background
>> activity to keep in business, even when you leave the website that
>> initiated the script. Such could be the trouble that causes a screen
>> reader to malfunction. Have seen this numerous times. Since NoScript
>> blocks the script from initiating itself, it also blocks the cookie from
>> being installed on your computer, hence no further activity of that
>> script can take place. Your system simply might just benefit from the
>> less polluted environment.
>>
>> Like I said, many websites these days, tend to load your system with
>> numerous, less beneficial scripts. For instance, there ar many scripts
>> that will activate advertisements on the site. Others intend to give the
>> website a more fancy look, that is, for the sighted person. For the
>> screen reader, it could mean the whole page to be inaccessible. Some
>> scripts are collecting statistical information about your browsing
>> behavior; who knows what they are going to use that for. And still
>> others will cause the page to be constantly updated, like in the case of
>> EBay sites. Blocking these scripts, will cause your screen reader to get
>> a more stabil webpage to read.
>>
>> For those who have not yet given the NoScript add-on for Firefox a try,
>> I strongly recommend it. It has been around for a number of years, is
>> totally free, receives frequent updates, and has been suggested for many
>> a screen reader user.. In fact, it was another user who adviced I give
>> it a try. And I have never looked back. It is the number one add-on I
>> install on new installations of Firefox.
>>
>> David
>>
>>
>> On 12/3/2016 5:12 PM, Gene wrote:
>>  > The way you discussed enabling or disabling JAVA script in
>> about:config is one way.  There is a plug in named no script but I
>> haven't used it enough to evaluate it well.  I'm not sure how easy it is
>> to use it to block scripts and unblock them.  Others will probably
>> comment on that.
>>  >
>>  > One convenient option is to use two different copies of Firefox
>> portable on your machine.  Or you could use the installed version and
>> have a copy of Firefox portable on the same machine.  You would have
>> JAVA scripts disabled in one of the programs and enabled in the other.
>> You could easily and conveniently use one browser on a site where you
>> want to use JAVA scripts and the other browser where you don't want to
>> use them.  You wouldn't have to then keep changing settings in the
>> browser.
>>  >
>>  > Gene
>>  >
>>  > From: nasrin khaksar
>>  > Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 9:45 AM
>>  > To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>  > Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>  >
>>  > hi geen again.
>>  > you rescued me from a very big concern!
>>  > i realy pray for you and admire your help and useful informations.
>>  > and thanks so much for the great news about reduce use of flash in
>> firefox!
>>  > about your question, when i realy need one audio file, i select to
>>  > open it with the potplayer or download it.
>>  > and when i dont need it, i benefit from not waisting of my internet
>> charge!
>>  > and how do you activate and deactivate javascript when you need and
>>  > dont need it?
>>  > i only know that about:config and make true and false
>> javascript.enabled.
>>  >
>>  > On 12/3/16, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
>>  > > I don't see why you would have a JAVA plugin if you didn't install
>> the JAVA
>>  > > program.  The plugin is installed by JAVA.
>>  > >
>>  > > As far as JAVA settings in the about:config settings are concerned,
>> as far
>>  > > as I can see, they all apply to JAVA script, not to JAVA, the
>> program.  The
>>  > > one I wasn't sure of, I did a Google search on and it has nothing
>> to do with
>>  > > JAVA, the program.
>>  > >
>>  > > Gene
>>  > > ----- Original Message -----
>>  > >
>>  > > From: nasrin khaksar
>>  > > Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 7:49 AM
>>  > > To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>  > > Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>  > >
>>  > >
>>  > > hi gene.
>>  > > thanks for your useful information.
>>  > > i never dont install java program but i am afraid always that is it
>>  > > possible that java plugin works in the browser without installing
>> java
>>  > > program?
>>  > > if its no, whats the reason that i see java plugin in firefox
>>  > > about:config and i change plugin.state.java to 0?
>>  > > i use windows xp and the newer versions of java and also firefox 53
>>  > > and later, dont support xp.
>>  > > which version of windows, do you use?
>>  > > thanks and God bless you for your help.
>>  > >
>>  > > On 12/3/16, Brice Mijares <bricemijares@...> wrote:
>>  > >> I read some where last week where FX will prevent adobe flash from
>>  > >> working by summer of 2017.
>>  > >>
>>  > >> On 12/3/2016 12:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
>>  > >>> hi.
>>  > >>> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security
>> problems.
>>  > >>> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem
>> for
>>  > >>> this.
>>  > >>>
>>  > >>> On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@...> wrote:
>>  > >>>> I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this with
>>  > >>>> Chrome
>>  > >>>> later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill
>>  > >>>> Windowless
>>  > >>>> Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be
>> working
>>  > >>>> with
>>  > >>>> current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded
>> objects if
>>  > >>>> you
>>  > >>>> don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object
>> Unavailable."
>>  > >>>> Is
>>  > >>>> there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently defunct
>> "Kill
>>  > >>>> Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> hi,
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is
>> failing
>>  > >>>> to
>>  > >>>> access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
>>  > >>>> Proof of what?  I think it's likely that Flash would run properly
>> in
>>  > >>>> Chrome
>>  > >>>> on the machine.  I won't have proof unless it is tried.  We
>> don't know
>>  > >>>> if
>>  > >>>> Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is
>> crashing
>>  > >>>> because
>>  > >>>> of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox.  Chrome
>> isn't
>>  > >>>> perfectly
>>  > >>>> accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well
>> when
>>  > >>>> used
>>  > >>>> on
>>  > >>>> sites with flash.  Chrome has quirks when working with settings
>> and I'm
>>  > >>>> not
>>  > >>>> sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox
>> but
>>  > >>>> when
>>  > >>>> used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as
>> accessible, as
>>  > >>>> Chrome.  And for this very limited use, there may be no need to
>> work
>>  > >>>> with
>>  > >>>> settings.
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser
>> currently
>>  > >>>> being
>>  > >>>> used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or
>> on a
>>  > >>>> site
>>  > >>>> like Bleeping Computer.  It would probably be faster and easier
>> to just
>>  > >>>> try
>>  > >>>> Chrome.
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> Gene
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@...>
>>  > >>>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
>>  > >>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>  > >>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> hi,
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same
>> flash
>>  > >>>> used
>>  > >>>> in chrome, I would asume  the same problems exist.  Also, chrome
>> had
>>  > >>>> accessibility issues last I remember.
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
>>  > >>>> I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should
>> use more
>>  > >>>> than
>>  > >>>> one browser.  If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use
>> Flash,
>>  > >>>> you
>>  > >>>> will probably have no problem.  Flash is built into Chrome so
>> you don't
>>  > >>>> have
>>  > >>>> to install or update it.  It updates itself automatically within
>>  > >>>> Chrome.
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> Gene
>>  > >>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>  > >>>> From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@...>
>>  > >>>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
>>  > >>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>  > >>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now.
>> It
>>  > >>>> always crashes
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content.
>> I've
>>  > >>>> long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
>>  > >>>> alternate player.
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>> If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd
>> also be
>>  > >>>> very grateful.
>>  > >>>> On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>>  > >>>>> hi,
>>  > >>>>>
>>  > >>>>> The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
>>  > >>>>> Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as
>> unavailable.
>>  > >>>>> Is there anything I can do about this?
>>  > >>>>>
>>  > >>>>>
>>  > >>>>>
>>  > >>>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>>
>>  > >>>
>>  > >>>
>>  > >>
>>  > >>
>>  > >>
>>  > >>
>>  > >
>>  > >
>>  > > --
>>  > > we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
>>  > > holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
>>  > > in the very authentic narration is:
>>  > > imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
>>  > > best website for studying islamic book in different languages
>>  > > al-islam.org
>>  > >
>>  > >
>>  > >
>>  > >
>>  >
>>  >
>>  > --
>>  > we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
>>  > holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
>>  > in the very authentic narration is:
>>  > imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
>>  > best website for studying islamic book in different languages
>>  > al-islam.org
>>  >
>>  >
>>  >
>>  >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
> holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
> in the very authentic narration is:
> imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
> best website for studying islamic book in different languages
> al-islam.org
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




Re: NVDA find function

 

gene, which version of nvda do you use and whats the best version of
it do you think?

On 12/4/16, Gene <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:
I don't think this has anything to do with code on the page. I hadn't given
this much thought since I can so easily get around the problem but off and
on, using Firefox and XP and an old version of NVDA, the find command moves
me to the top of the page or about the top of the page and doesn't move me
where I want to go. I simply use the repeat search command in such a case.
I haven't played with this enough to be sure if the repeat search command
ever doesn't work properly. I thought this might be a general problem but
since I hadn't seen anything about this on the list in all this time, I
thought it might be just my problem. It may be worth looking into, or at
least, if others have a problem, it would be worth reporting here so we can
get an idea if it is a general problem or a very limited one In terms of
affected users.

Also, I continue to use an old version of NVDA for convenience. I don't use
the newer features and so I just use newer versions at times for testing
reported problems or for learning something about changes and new features.
So I didn't know if my experience reflected the old version and not newer
ones. It appears this may be a problem others are having as well.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Brian's Mail list account
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 5:57 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA find function


Yes I've noticed this. I did wonder if it may be some hidden stuff on some
pages. Sometimes it works well though.

I don't use Chrome but its better on firefox than Ie.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don H" <lmddh50@comcast.net>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:50 PM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA find function


Running Win 10 and use IE, Firefox and Google Chrome as my browsers. I
find the NVDA find function very inconsistent with regards to finding
things on web pages. I invoke the find command with NVDA key control f
and type in my search term. On some occasions it finds and moves to the
search term and other times after pressing enter after entering the term I

want to search for it does nothing as if I did not press enter at all.
Works the poorest with IE but doesn't do a lot better on Firefox and
Chrome.




--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: NVDA find function

Gene
 

I don't think this has anything to do with code on the page.  I hadn't given this much thought since I can so easily get around the problem but off and on, using Firefox and XP and an old version of NVDA, the find command moves me to the top of the page or about the top of the page and doesn't move me where I want to go.  I simply use the repeat search command in such a case.  I haven't played with this enough to be sure if the repeat search command ever doesn't work properly.  I thought this might be a general problem but since I hadn't seen anything about this on the list in all this time, I thought it might be just my problem. It may be worth looking into, or at least, if others have a problem, it would be worth reporting here so we can get an idea if it is a general problem or a very limited one In terms of affected users.
 
Also, I continue to use an old version of NVDA for convenience.  I don't use the newer features and so I just use newer versions at times for testing reported problems or for learning something about changes and new features.  So I didn't know if my experience reflected the old version and not newer ones.  It appears this may be a problem others are having as well. 
 
Gene 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2016 5:57 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA find function

Yes I've noticed this. I did wonder if it may be some hidden stuff on some
pages. Sometimes it works well though.

I don't use Chrome but its better on firefox than Ie.
 Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don H" <lmddh50@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:50 PM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA find function


> Running Win 10 and use IE, Firefox and Google Chrome as my browsers.  I
> find the NVDA find function very inconsistent with regards to finding
> things on web pages.  I invoke the find command with NVDA key control f
> and type in my search term.  On some occasions it finds and moves to the
> search term and other times after pressing enter after entering the term I
> want to search for it does nothing as if I did not press enter at all.
> Works the poorest with IE but doesn't do a lot better on Firefox and
> Chrome.
>
>
>




Re: still a newbee

David Goldfield
 

Hi, Don.

While I don't have experience with that particular Web site, I've
occasionally encountered this behavior where the NVDA find command might
not always work on Web pages. Try pressing the alt key twice, the first
time taking you to the menu bar and the second press returning your
focus, so to speak, back to the Web page. Also, try pressing the tab key
a few times, making sure that your virtual cursor is moving to some
links. Then, see if insert-ctrl-F works as expected.

David Goldfield,
Assistive Technology Specialist

Feel free to visit my Web site
WWW.DavidGoldfield.Info

On 12/4/2016 9:16 AM, Don H wrote:
Running NVDA RC1 on a Win 10 system. Using Firefox and going to a web
site like Best Buy.
I first use the search Edit box on the web page to search for Vizio
TV. On the results page I can then use the NVDA find function to get
to the results. I find the TV I want to look at and press enter. I
am now on the web page for that particular model. I am not on a edit
box so if I understand it correctly I am in review mode. I now try to
use the NVDA find function and can only get the windows fine function
to come up which of course isn't what I want. I try the NVDA find
function several times with same bad results.
I am obviously doing something wrong but being a newbee with NVDA I am
lost as to the solution. Please tell me what I am doing wrong.