Date   

Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

hi jacob.
thanks so much for helping me.

can you please test many files with potplayer?
eventually for me nvda is not responding and i dont know how to solve
this problem.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi david and quentin.
i use xp and also i do all of my works with it.
i use internet, libreoffice, notepad, potplayer and one conversion
software.
i dont have the security programs because realy i dont trust them!

On 12/6/16, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
You're more of an expert on what works under XP than me Brian, that's
great
info!

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Brian's Mail list account <
bglists@...> wrote:

Well, as far as I am aware, the basic plan is to not break XP if it is
at
all possible, but just occasionally this might not be possible as the
windows code changes.
Indeed at the moment xp portable versions of even the next snapshots are
very good. Try running portable copies of nvda on, say windows 10 and
you
will find lots of things that no longer work due to the security of
that
operating system not allowing access to parts of windows from a portable
app.
the big problem at present for those using XP is the web browser.
Depending on your processor, 50 is the last version I can get to work on
xp
with intel processors, and 48 is the last one on xp with amd processors.
This is due to the lack of sse2 instruction set support on the amd
chips.
Dropbox, no matter what Dropbox say, is working fine again on xp intel
processors at version 15, though they do warn that this could change as
its officially not supported. AMD chips last working version of Dropbox
is
13, and one has to disable updates by nefarious means to keep it working
on
such hardware.

The hack to continue to get xp updates is still working for MSSE, but
his
month no xp security updates came down. whether this means they have
blocked the loophole or just they have given up I cannot say.
I notice that Flash for IE8 is seemingly not being updated by Adobe, but
seems to be working in Firefox 50 at the moment.
Adobe reader DC is not usable on XP and 11 is the last version.

I'm sure there are many other issues but that really depends on what you
are doing.
Its gratifying to note that the hacked copy of Outlook express that
works
in 10 is still supported by nvda, and its only issue is that its preview
pane has to be turned off or it will fall over sometimes.


Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David" <trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:31 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and
thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?


Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year ago -
where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP for
businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for the validity
of the article, and do not know if I even bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to update
your
security software, you might still be able to use it offline for a long
time yet. And if you only update the database of your security
software,
that software will keep rolling under XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those of us
who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer flavor of
Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging around. Personally,
I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have software
that is needed for certain tasks, which would not impose a security
risk, but which cannot be run under newer Windows. That is, my XP
machine is not going online, but I still need a screen reader for it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an OS,
whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA apparently
continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave many of us the
chance to continue using our older equipment, for tasks that totally
well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where they still
commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the upgrade of the OS, and
basically there might not be too much more holes in XP, than in any
newer flavors of Windows. According to what I read, both Win8 and 10,
seem to have open holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever
reason are not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes are
not in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you and
the
Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which OS you
are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:

Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be honest
microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now and any
computer with it will have malware and be crappy to because microsoft
says so and I really don't aggree with microsoft but its the way it
is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history, soon 7
will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:

please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the cause of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the same
one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab around
the
main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I could
play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close when I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had 2016.3 on
the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore
<jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,

Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend that
one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers cannot
do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and JAWS
or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and up -
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least could
give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible at
all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the software
at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen
reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis
encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want, give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the
high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage of a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might be
able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do what
you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen readers, do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all
provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30 to
60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader,
sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup
screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help the
tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can
describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never
tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer
menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can access to
all
menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't
ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem, but
others

running the same operating system and similar overall
configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this suggests
an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a
given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed,
etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for anything,
but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be occasions
when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you." Having
a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall









--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess




.







--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306
Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess

--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org



--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

hi david and quentin.
i use xp and also i do all of my works with it.
i use internet, libreoffice, notepad, potplayer and one conversion software.
i dont have the security programs because realy i dont trust them!

On 12/6/16, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
You're more of an expert on what works under XP than me Brian, that's great
info!

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Brian's Mail list account <
bglists@...> wrote:

Well, as far as I am aware, the basic plan is to not break XP if it is at
all possible, but just occasionally this might not be possible as the
windows code changes.
Indeed at the moment xp portable versions of even the next snapshots are
very good. Try running portable copies of nvda on, say windows 10 and you
will find lots of things that no longer work due to the security of that
operating system not allowing access to parts of windows from a portable
app.
the big problem at present for those using XP is the web browser.
Depending on your processor, 50 is the last version I can get to work on
xp
with intel processors, and 48 is the last one on xp with amd processors.
This is due to the lack of sse2 instruction set support on the amd
chips.
Dropbox, no matter what Dropbox say, is working fine again on xp intel
processors at version 15, though they do warn that this could change as
its officially not supported. AMD chips last working version of Dropbox
is
13, and one has to disable updates by nefarious means to keep it working
on
such hardware.

The hack to continue to get xp updates is still working for MSSE, but his
month no xp security updates came down. whether this means they have
blocked the loophole or just they have given up I cannot say.
I notice that Flash for IE8 is seemingly not being updated by Adobe, but
seems to be working in Firefox 50 at the moment.
Adobe reader DC is not usable on XP and 11 is the last version.

I'm sure there are many other issues but that really depends on what you
are doing.
Its gratifying to note that the hacked copy of Outlook express that works
in 10 is still supported by nvda, and its only issue is that its preview
pane has to be turned off or it will fall over sometimes.


Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David" <trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:31 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and
thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?


Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year ago -
where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP for
businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for the validity
of the article, and do not know if I even bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to update your
security software, you might still be able to use it offline for a long
time yet. And if you only update the database of your security software,
that software will keep rolling under XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those of us
who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer flavor of
Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging around. Personally, I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have software
that is needed for certain tasks, which would not impose a security
risk, but which cannot be run under newer Windows. That is, my XP
machine is not going online, but I still need a screen reader for it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an OS,
whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA apparently
continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave many of us the
chance to continue using our older equipment, for tasks that totally
well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where they still
commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the upgrade of the OS, and
basically there might not be too much more holes in XP, than in any
newer flavors of Windows. According to what I read, both Win8 and 10,
seem to have open holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever
reason are not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes are
not in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you and the
Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which OS you
are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:

Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be honest
microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now and any
computer with it will have malware and be crappy to because microsoft
says so and I really don't aggree with microsoft but its the way it is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history, soon 7
will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:

please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the cause of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the same
one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab around
the
main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I could
play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close when I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had 2016.3 on
the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore
<jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,

Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend that
one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers cannot
do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and JAWS
or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and up -
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least could
give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible at
all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the software
at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen
reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis
encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want, give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the
high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage of a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might be
able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do what you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen readers, do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all
provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30 to
60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader, sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup
screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help the
tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can
describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can access to
all
menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't
ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem, but
others

running the same operating system and similar overall
configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this suggests an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a
given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed, etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for anything,
but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be occasions
when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you." Having
a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall









--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess




.







--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306
Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess
--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: iTunes and NVDA.

ADRIAN POCOCK
 

If you are  using windows system invoke narrator to test out itunes to see if it crashes.

 

Also try it out with alternate media players because it could be a issue with audio codecs on your pc.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Clare Page
Sent: 12 September 2016 09:57
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] iTunes and NVDA.

 

Hi!

I would assume we’re all using different synthesizers. I personally find that iTunes crashes on my laptop, and can kill NVDA at the same time, if I try to do things too fast, for example searching for a song to buy while I’m downloading another. I don’t know if users of other screenreaders have the same crashing problem with iTunes that NVDA users do, but if they do that means there may be a fault with iTunes for Windows when used with screenreaders, rather than just NVDA not always being compatible. That’s my theory about iTunes, after several months of it sometimes crashing for me and sometimes not: I’d certainly be interested to know whether iTunes misbehaves with other screenreaders, something I can’t test as I only have NVDA on my PC.

Bye for now!

From Clare

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: lundi 12 septembre 2016 01:16
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] iTunes and NVDA.

 

The message describing the problem said more like silent speech.  That implies that speech is crashing.  And that raises the question of what synthesizers people are using, which may account for the different results.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

 

Sent: Sunday, September 11, 2016 1:08 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] iTunes and NVDA.

 

Strange because i use nvda all the time and i can browse and the like
picking what i want no crashs of nvda this i can prove if people so wish
me to.


On 9/11/2016 11:58 AM, Lino Morales wrote:
> That good Ron, but as already stated by me and others NVDA still will
> crash. More like silence speech. This mess has been going on since V
> 2015.3 into the current version.
>
>
> On 9/11/2016 12:15 AM, Life My Way via Groups.io wrote:
>> I am able to browse and use the Itunes store just fine with nvda, I
>> agree that Itunes needs a rewrite but the store works great for me.
>>
>>
>> On 9/10/2016 3:34 AM, Kerry Fielding wrote:
>>> Unfortunately that's Apple.  Now they are starting to do it with
>>> their hardware too.  :-(
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>> On 10 Sep 2016, at 09:11, Brian's Mail list account
>>>> <bglists@...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> It is exactly what it used to be, ie rubbish software that they
>>>> cannot leave alone and have to keep changing it so screenreaders do
>>>> not work. Bout time Apple rewrote their web site with something
>>>> normal and made it a normal commerce site instead of anodball thing
>>>> that only runs with their software.
>>>> I feel better now!
>>>> Brian
>>>>
>>>> bglists@...
>>>> Sent via blueyonder.
>>>> Please address personal email to:-
>>>> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
>>>> in the display name field.
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lino Morales"
>>>> <linomorales001@...>
>>>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>>> Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2016 12:58 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] iTunes and NVDA.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> This bull has been happening since NVDA 2015.4 and .3. Its
>>>>> annoying as hell. You can't brows the store, Apple Music, manage
>>>>> your account etc. Its a shame that NVDA sill does this. Plus
>>>>> iTunes isn't what it used to be.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 9/9/2016 9:32 AM, Matt Turner wrote:
>>>>>> Hi folks.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So i just wanted to test out iTunes, using the master snapshot of
>>>>>> nvda.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When you type into the search box, and try to review what you've
>>>>>> wrote, nvda doesn't speak.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also when looking for something in the store, nvda goes away, and
>>>>>> you need to restart it again.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm not sure how to create a log of the crash, because when nvda
>>>>>> goes away there's no speech.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>


No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7924 / Virus Database: 4664/13544 - Release Date: 12/06/16


Re: how to unsubscribe

Fanus
 

Hello list
I try to unsubscribe by using the link at the bottom of an email but I ge6t an error that the page timed out. How do I unsubscribe via email?
Regards
Fanus
 
 

From: Brian Vogel
Sent: Monday, December 5, 2016 8:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Fixing my e-mail display name issue.
 
On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 09:48 am, Gene wrote:
That isn't what is being described.

That wasn't entirely clear, either.  However, I've just changed my subscription to "all messages" via e-mail and will see what this one shows up as under Thunderbird and Windows Live Mail.
--
Brian

Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.  If you’re alive, it isn’t.

    ~ Lauren Bacall

   

 


Re: talking android x86

Antony Stone
 

I don't think Android-x86 will do anything more in terms of accessibility than
Android itself will, however you're probably better off asking this sort of
question on the Android-x86 list:

https://groups.google.com/group/android-x86

Antony.

On Tuesday 06 December 2016 at 07:44:00, Isaac wrote:

Hi, anyone have a link to a talking android x86 if so please share.
Thanks
--
I conclude that there are two ways of constructing a software design: One way
is to make it so simple that there are _obviously_ no deficiencies, and the
other way is to make it so complicated that there are no _obvious_
deficiencies.

- C A R Hoare

Please reply to the list;
please *don't* CC me.


Re: Vocalizer Expressive question?

Mallard
 

Rui,


Are you saying I will be able to upgrade for free?

Wow! That sounds like a Christmas present, if ever there was one!!! (smile).

Thanks formaking this choice...


Ciao have a lovely day!

Ollie

Il 06/12/2016 02:07, Rui Fontes ha scritto:
In Vocalizer for NVDA from Tiflotecnia, the new version will be free owners of version 3.0.

Rui Fontes
Tiflotecnia, Lda.


-----Mensagem Original----- De: Matt Turner
Data: 6 de dezembro de 2016 00:42
Para: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Assunto: [nvda] Vocalizer Expressive question?

Hi, if i buy the Vocalizer Expressive voices, will i have to pay
anything for the newer voices when they come out?







Re: talking android x86

Mallard
 

Hello,


I know there aer such emulators. I've never tried them personally, but I know I read about a few on the eyes-free mailing list.


I know there are some people here who are also on that list, so you might be able to get some good hints from them.


Ciao,

Ollie

Il 06/12/2016 10:27, Brian's Mail list account ha scritto:
By that do you mean an android emulator for windows that is screenreader friendly? I'd say that could be a bit of an ask, since the output from such a system is unlikely to have any api that a screenreader in the host operating system, ie windows could understand. I guess it might well be the case that an android emulator would have the built in voice and sounds of an android device though. That is a little off topic for here. You may be better asking on a more general list for accessibility.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Isaac" <bigikemusic@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 6:44 AM
Subject: [nvda] talking android x86


Hi, anyone have a link to a talking android x86 if so please share.
Thanks




Mouse tracking

Jacob Kruger
 

Just wondering how mouse tracking is actually triggered/handled?


And, don't mean how to turn on the features, audio tracking sounds, etc. - there are keystrokes, and, the mouse cursor settings dialogue, under preferences, but, was trying out a method/means to handle mouse movement using face detection via a webcam, which I plan on installing for a sighted quadriplegic, but, while NVDA was in fact reporting to me when I moved over screen elements, there was no audio mouse tracking to indicate mouse scrolling/movement, which I do get when using the actual mouse touchpad on this laptop, but anyway.


In other words, while this is not too likely to be too important for most of us standard NVDA users, was actually just wondering about why NVDA didn't seem to be keeping track of the mouse cursor movement, unless it has something to do with the tracking event triggering specifically having to do with physical/hardware interaction, or something?


And, if of any interest, here's the sourceforge page for enable ViaCam, which offers facial detection mouse tracking for at least windows and ubuntu:

http://eviacam.sourceforge.net/


Stay well

Jacob Kruger
Blind Biker
Skype: BlindZA
"Resistance is futile, but, acceptance is versatile..."


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Quentin Christensen
 

You're more of an expert on what works under XP than me Brian, that's great info!

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...> wrote:
Well, as far as I am aware, the basic plan is to not break XP if it is at all possible, but just occasionally this might not be possible as the windows code changes.
Indeed at the moment xp portable versions of even the next snapshots are very good. Try running portable copies of nvda on, say windows 10 and you will find lots of things that no longer work due to the  security of that operating system not allowing access to parts of windows from a portable app.
the big problem at present for those using XP is  the web browser. Depending on your processor, 50 is the last version I can get to work on xp with intel processors, and 48 is the last one on xp with amd processors. This is due to the lack of sse2  instruction set support on the amd chips.
Dropbox, no matter what Dropbox say, is working fine again on xp intel processors at version 15,  though they do warn that this could change as its officially not supported. AMD chips last working version of Dropbox is 13, and one has to disable updates by nefarious means to keep it working on such hardware.

The hack to continue to get xp updates is still working for MSSE, but his month no xp security updates came down. whether this means they have blocked the loophole or just they have given up I cannot say.
I notice that Flash for IE8 is seemingly not being updated by Adobe, but seems to be working in Firefox 50 at the moment.
Adobe reader DC is not usable on XP and 11 is the last version.

I'm sure there are many other issues but that really depends on what you are doing.
Its gratifying to note that the hacked copy of Outlook express that works in 10 is still supported by nvda, and its only issue is that its preview pane has to be turned off or it will fall over sometimes.


Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David" <trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:31 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?


Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year ago -
where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP for
businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for the validity
of the article, and do not know if I even bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to update your
security software, you might still be able to use it offline for a long
time yet. And if you only update the database of your security software,
that software will keep rolling under XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those of us
who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer flavor of
Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging around. Personally, I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have software
that is needed for certain tasks, which would not impose a security
risk, but which cannot be run under newer Windows. That is, my XP
machine is not going online, but I still need a screen reader for it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an OS,
whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA apparently
continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave many of us the
chance to continue using our older equipment, for tasks that totally
well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where they still
commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the upgrade of the OS, and
basically there might not be too much more holes in XP, than in any
newer flavors of Windows. According to what I read, both Win8 and 10,
seem to have open holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever
reason are not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes are
not in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you and the
Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which OS you
are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:
Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be honest
microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now and any
computer with it will have malware and be crappy to because microsoft
says so and I really don't aggree with microsoft but its the way it is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history, soon 7
will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:
please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene.  I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP.  That may be the cause of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the same one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab around
the
main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I could
play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close when I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1  Actually I just realised I still had 2016.3 on
the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore <jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,

Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend that one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers cannot do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and JAWS or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and up -
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least could give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible at all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the software at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want, give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage of a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might be
able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do what you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen readers, do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30 to 60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader, sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help the tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

> gene.

> thanks so much for helping me to test the program.

> i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.

> me too, use windows xp service pack 3

> you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer menus.

> you should only press the application keys and you can access to all

> menus and options by normal arrow keys.

> only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except unknown.

> i should restart nvda to work as normal.

>

> On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

>> Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't ever

>> anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's anything
wrong
with

>> that.")

>>

>> So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

>> issue with any software or combination of software:

>>

>> * if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
there's

>> virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved

>> * if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem, but
others

>> running the same operating system and similar overall configuration
that you

>> are don't have it when they perform those steps, this suggests an

>> idiosyncratic problem with your own system

>>

>> I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a given
problem

>> only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

>> are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
files >> are

>> being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed, etc.

>>

>> I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for anything, but
these

>> are factors that you must consider and there will be occasions when
"it's

>> just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you."  Having a

>> detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.

>> --

>> *Brian*

>>

>> *Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

>> you’re alive, it isn’t.*

>>

>>     ~ Lauren Bacall

>>

>












--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess








.













--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org 
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: windows live mail and windows 10

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I assume however that the windows 10 mail app does not do usenet groups, something I use all the time hence the hack to outlook express as Live mail is a bit of a pig at the best of times.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "David Moore" <jesusloves1966@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 1:19 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] windows live mail and windows 10


Hi Rosemarie,
I will help you with the mail app. I use it all the time, and it works very well.
David Moore
Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Monday, December 5, 2016 7:58 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] windows live mail and windows 10

Hi, David,

Thanks so much for your reply. I'm not sure where I'll go from here if I leave thunderbird. I've tried everything I know to organize my messages with that program but nothing I do works. Guess I could either go back to outlook or try the mail ap again.

Rosemarie



On 12/5/2016 4:54 PM, David Moore wrote:
Hi Rosemarie,
Yes it will, but there will be no more support from MS after January. It is being phased out, so if you use it, there will be no more security up dates for it.
David Moore
Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Monday, December 5, 2016 7:49 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] windows live mail and windows 10

Hi, everyone,


Will windows live mail work well with the latest version of windows 10?
I'm thinking of leaving thunderbird if windows live mail will work. I
know you can't create message filters with windows live if you have an
immap account but I can deal with it.


Thanks for your help in advance.


Rosemarie


Re: My NVDA Not Working Properly

 

iven3 is added to nvda since version 2013.2 of nvda and its the only
voice that i extremely love.

On 12/6/16, Dejan Ristic <r.dejan83@...> wrote:
All right then. It's been solved.


On 12/5/2016 11:53 PM, Travis Siegel wrote:
Ok, never mind, all three ivans are there, for some reason though,
ivan2 and ivan3 are much much higher on the list than the ivan
choice. That's why I didn't see them at first. It appears the
english-us and the english list are identical. Not sure why I missed
the ivan2 and ivan3 when I looked before. I have 52 voices in the
list of voices, ivan2 and ivan3 are numbers 10 and 11, while ivan is
number 48. Not sure why the regular ivan is so far away from ivan2
and ivan3, but that's what caused my confusion. Sorry for the trouble.



On 12/5/2016 5:07 PM, Dejan Ristic wrote:
Let me express myself once more, please,


I've just taken a look at the English US entry, and I find all the
three Ivens. What to say to that? Is it possible that our friend
member is encountering an error?


On 12/5/2016 11:01 PM, Dejan Ristic wrote:
Thank you for teaching me some new NVDA-related things.


I used to use Iven, and in order to prevent outbursts, I decreased
the volume level down to 40%, and it worked smoothly for me.


On 12/5/2016 10:42 PM, Travis Siegel wrote:
Ahh, I see. I only had a single ivan, because I was looking under
the english us. The 3 ivan voices are under the entry that just
says english. Now it makes sense. That was I was wondering where
the other ivan voices were, they don't show up under the english us
setting, only under the english by itself. Got it now. Think I'll
stick with the ivan I have, it's slightly louder than the other 2,
and slightly deeper, which I like very much.



On 12/5/2016 3:56 PM, Gene New Zealand wrote:
Hi

If the E speak nz is the preferred synth package under the synth
settings, I only notice the varients come up under the voice settings
section. I just looked and saw all 3 ivon voices there. Even
though i am
using a windows 10 pc it should not matter.

There is about 40 or 50 voices or varients under that section.

If it is the sapi 5 version they might have to be installed if
they are
there.

if not what is mentioned above i have no idea.

I can tell you if you made extra varients where to put them, but
that is
not maybe you are asking about.

Gene nz

On 6/12/2016 9:05 AM, Travis Siegel wrote:
Yeah, I know that. I was specifically asking where the ivan3 voice
was, because I only see 1 ivan voice, uneer the espeak ng
synthesizer.
You didn't answer my question.



On 12/5/2016 2:40 PM, Gene New Zealand wrote:
hi


Under the voice settings section when you go into it under the
barient
section it is a combo box open it up then arrow down the list to
hear
the different varients there. the voices will change depending
on the
synth package used.


I find my own voice Gene easy to listen 2.


Gene nz



On 6/12/2016 8:05 AM, Travis Siegel wrote:
I didn't know there was more than one ivan. I use ivan as
well, but I
only saw one of them in the list of voices. This is using the
espeak
ng. I like the ivan voice, where are the others so I may take a
look
at them as well?



On 12/5/2016 2:29 AM, Dejan Ristic wrote:
Although you said that you did not understand ESpeak, what do you
think about using some of the variants it offers us? For
instance, I
use Iven 3, which I find very clear. I have set the rate at
24. I do
not encounter any problems, probably because I use ESpeak,
which I
find very quick and responsive. Try to get used to it. Your
messages
say that your English is very good, so I think that you may
get used
to it before long. Choose between the variants, and try different
rates to make it suitable for yourself. Let me also say that I
used
ESpeak while doing some freelace translations from English to
Serbian, and vice versa. I was successful.


On 12/5/2016 5:28 AM, Ibrahim Ajayi wrote:
Hi good people:
If you can recollect, I did send a message to this group
about my
NVDA
not working properly. I did get many responses, and I thank
all of
you who found time to respond. I am sorry I mistakenly
deleted the
digest mail sent to me, and I can not reply to the mail. But I
believe some of you might remember the mail.
Actually, I got a very good response from David. He made some
suggestions which I've tried. I discovered when I switched
off NVDa
as he suggested, and I used the demo version of JAWS for
Windows,
that
the system worked very nicely, and fast.
I strongly believe that the problem must be from the
synthesiser I am
using. Actually, I use Micro sofft speech AI4 which I use
through
viavoice outloud. I appear to like the synthesiser, because
it is
very clear and it sounds like eloquence. But it appears
obsolete and
not very helpful.
I can't use the JAWS demo version, because it works in 40 minute
mode,
and one cannot usee that when doing serious work on the
computer.
I downloaded Microsoft speech version 11 but it couldn't be
installed
on my system. I did it several times but it didn't work. i
cannot
use ESpeak, because I don't understand the speech. I tried koba
speech as well, but the speech for that is also not very easy to
comprehend.
So, can anyone suggest another synthesiser. I use windows 7
32bit.
I am Ibrahim from Nigeria.



.























--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: talking android x86

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

By that do you mean an android emulator for windows that is screenreader friendly? I'd say that could be a bit of an ask, since the output from such a system is unlikely to have any api that a screenreader in the host operating system, ie windows could understand. I guess it might well be the case that an android emulator would have the built in voice and sounds of an android device though. That is a little off topic for here. You may be better asking on a more general list for accessibility.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Isaac" <bigikemusic@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 6:44 AM
Subject: [nvda] talking android x86


Hi, anyone have a link to a talking android x86 if so please share.
Thanks


Re: personal messages - Keep them OFF the list

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I'd agree with this, and I'm sure the moderators would as well.
This does generate high traffic and its the subject lines we use to sift what we need to read and what we do not, so when any topic drifts, it needs to be altered in the subject line to make this plain.

Also, and I'm not up innocent on this one, commenting multiple times on different bits of a conversation can prove tedious to read.
My one excuse here is that the feed I'm getting seems to come in batches, so I'm just making up a reply and sending it and as if by magic, a load of mail appears from before the one I've replied to, either making what I said pointless, or making it that I need to do another message.
Not ideal, but I guess it depends on the way the email system you use gets its messages and sends them to your account.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "David" <trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:14 AM
Subject: [nvda] personal messages - Keep them OFF the list


Listers,
May I be allowed to raise a polite and friendly reminder?

I have only been subscribed to this list for something like a week, but
have seen more than one message, where people get rather personal, and
sometimes little nice to other members in particular. Undortunately,
this disturbs the validity of the topic being discussed.

Could it be an idea, for those who have anything unsolved with other
listers, that you please rectify that in private, via direct mailing to
the person you aim for? Meaning, could you please, for the benefit of
all, keep posting to the list, ONLY what REALLY is meant for the public
- the general group of listers. And, please, stick to the topic being
discussed.

I just find it disappointing to read your dashing each other. And it
really does take the discussion nowhere.

Please?



Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Well, as far as I am aware, the basic plan is to not break XP if it is at all possible, but just occasionally this might not be possible as the windows code changes.
Indeed at the moment xp portable versions of even the next snapshots are very good. Try running portable copies of nvda on, say windows 10 and you will find lots of things that no longer work due to the security of that operating system not allowing access to parts of windows from a portable app.
the big problem at present for those using XP is the web browser. Depending on your processor, 50 is the last version I can get to work on xp with intel processors, and 48 is the last one on xp with amd processors. This is due to the lack of sse2 instruction set support on the amd chips.
Dropbox, no matter what Dropbox say, is working fine again on xp intel processors at version 15, though they do warn that this could change as its officially not supported. AMD chips last working version of Dropbox is 13, and one has to disable updates by nefarious means to keep it working on such hardware.

The hack to continue to get xp updates is still working for MSSE, but his month no xp security updates came down. whether this means they have blocked the loophole or just they have given up I cannot say.
I notice that Flash for IE8 is seemingly not being updated by Adobe, but seems to be working in Firefox 50 at the moment.
Adobe reader DC is not usable on XP and 11 is the last version.

I'm sure there are many other issues but that really depends on what you are doing.
Its gratifying to note that the hacked copy of Outlook express that works in 10 is still supported by nvda, and its only issue is that its preview pane has to be turned off or it will fall over sometimes.


Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "David" <trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:31 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?


Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year ago -
where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP for
businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for the validity
of the article, and do not know if I even bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to update your
security software, you might still be able to use it offline for a long
time yet. And if you only update the database of your security software,
that software will keep rolling under XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those of us
who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer flavor of
Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging around. Personally, I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have software
that is needed for certain tasks, which would not impose a security
risk, but which cannot be run under newer Windows. That is, my XP
machine is not going online, but I still need a screen reader for it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an OS,
whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA apparently
continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave many of us the
chance to continue using our older equipment, for tasks that totally
well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where they still
commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the upgrade of the OS, and
basically there might not be too much more holes in XP, than in any
newer flavors of Windows. According to what I read, both Win8 and 10,
seem to have open holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever
reason are not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes are
not in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you and the
Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which OS you
are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:
Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be honest
microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now and any
computer with it will have malware and be crappy to because microsoft
says so and I really don't aggree with microsoft but its the way it is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history, soon 7
will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:
please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the cause of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the same one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab around
the
main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I could
play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close when I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had 2016.3 on
the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore <jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,

Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend that one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers cannot do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and JAWS or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and up -
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least could give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible at all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the software at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want, give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage of a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might be
able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do what you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen readers, do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30 to 60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader, sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help the tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can access to all
menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem, but
others

running the same operating system and similar overall configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this suggests an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed, etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for anything, but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be occasions when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you." Having a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall









--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess




.



Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Quentin Christensen
 

Hi David,

All good points.  I believe I read something about businesses still being able to get support for XP, which I think runs along the lines of "you can get whatever you want if you can pay for it".  For the average user, Microsoft has ended support for XP, as have many other companies.  How safe or not you are running XP gets very murky very quickly.  Often, the potential problems are in security vulnerabilities that might not even be obvious.  For instance, here's an article from earlier this year on a vulnerability with the way Windows handles fonts and graphics: http://www.zdnet.com/article/all-versions-of-windows-hit-by-critical-security-vulnerabilities/ .  Microsoft has fixed the flaw, but ONLY for versions of Windows which are still supported, meaning if you are running Windows XP, there is nothing you can do.  Ok they said it wasn't believed to be actively being exploited in the wild, but still it's there if anyone ever does decide to.  With vulnerabilities in the operating system, it's possible (I haven't looked into it so I'm just speculating randomly) that such flaws could be deeper than an anti virus program can protect against.

It really then comes down to what you use your computer for.  If you write novels on it in Word 97 and that works for you and it never sees an internet connection - no problem, go wild, keep using it for the next 40 years if it holds up.  The problems really only start when you connect it to the internet.  If you are still using Windows XP, for whatever reason, it's important to be aware of the risks, what you can do to minimise them, and how to monitor for problems.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 7:31 PM, David <trailerdavid@...> wrote:
Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?


Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year ago -
where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP for
businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for the validity
of the article, and do not know if I even bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to update your
security software, you might still be able to use it offline for a long
time yet. And if you only update the database of your security software,
that software will keep rolling under XP for who knows how long.


 From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those of us
who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer flavor of
Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging around. Personally, I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have software
that is needed for certain tasks, which would not impose a security
risk, but which cannot be run under newer Windows. That is, my XP
machine is not going online, but I still need a screen reader for it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an OS,
whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA apparently
continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave many of us the
chance to continue using our older equipment, for tasks that totally
well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where they still
commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the upgrade of the OS, and
basically there might not be too much more holes in XP, than in any
newer flavors of Windows. According to what I read, both Win8 and 10,
seem to have open holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever
reason are not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes are
not in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you and the
Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which OS you
are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:
> Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be honest
> microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now and any
> computer with it will have malware and be crappy to because microsoft
> says so and I really don't aggree with microsoft but its the way it is.
> Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history, soon 7
> will be then we will have to struggle with 10.
>
>
>
> On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:
>> please, do not get rid of xp support.
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
>> <quentin@...>
>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
>> and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease
>>
>>
>> That's true Gene.  I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as well,
>> although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
>> Potplayer, it
>> was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of Windows
>> 7 as
>> well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
>>
>>> And, of course, you aren't testing with XP.  That may be the cause of
>>> these problems.
>>>
>>> Gene
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> *From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
>>> *Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
>>> *To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> *Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
>>> release,
>>> and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease
>>>
>>> Hi everyone,
>>>
>>> I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the same one
>>> Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.
>>>
>>> It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab around
>>> the
>>> main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
>>> However,
>>> you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there are
>>> keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.
>>>
>>> I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I could
>>> play
>>> MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close when I
>>> finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems fine?
>>> I'm
>>> using NVDA 2016.4rc1  Actually I just realised I still had 2016.3 on
>>> the
>>> Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
>>> again, I
>>> couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few songs.
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>> Quentin.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore <jesusloves1966@...>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi, That is true,
>>>>
>>>> Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
>>>> controls
>>>> that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend that one
>>>> learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
>>>> powful in
>>>> win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers cannot do.
>>>> Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and JAWS or
>>>> Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.
>>>>
>>>> David Moore
>>>>
>>>> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
>>>> Windows 10
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
>>>> *Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
>>>> *To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>>> *Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
>>>> release,
>>>> and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Just for your correction.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do
>>>>
>>>> understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely true.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and up -
>>>> holds
>>>>
>>>> Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far from
>>>>
>>>> being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you out.
>>>> For
>>>>
>>>> instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least could give
>>>>
>>>> you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible at all.
>>>>
>>>> If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the software at
>>>>
>>>> the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen reader.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis encourage
>>>>
>>>> all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want, give
>>>>
>>>> Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the high-end
>>>>
>>>> screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage of a
>>>>
>>>> software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might be
>>>> able
>>>>
>>>> to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do what you
>>>> expect.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen readers, do
>>>> have
>>>>
>>>> downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
>>>> install at
>>>>
>>>> least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
>>>> determine if
>>>>
>>>> NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all provide
>>>>
>>>> you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30 to 60
>>>>
>>>> minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
>>>> software
>>>>
>>>> is workable or not.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> In the older days, installing more than one screen reader, sometimes
>>>>
>>>> caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT the
>>>> case
>>>>
>>>> any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other words,
>>>>
>>>> encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup screen
>>>>
>>>> reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help the tech
>>>>
>>>> team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can describe
>>>>
>>>> what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never tasted
>>>>
>>>> anything but Burger-King?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> David
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > gene.
>>>>
>>>> > thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
>>>>
>>>> > i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
>>>>
>>>> > me too, use windows xp service pack 3
>>>>
>>>> > you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer menus.
>>>>
>>>> > you should only press the application keys and you can access to all
>>>>
>>>> > menus and options by normal arrow keys.
>>>>
>>>> > only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except unknown.
>>>>
>>>> > i should restart nvda to work as normal.
>>>>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> > On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >> Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't ever
>>>>
>>>> >> anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's anything
>>>> wrong
>>>> with
>>>>
>>>> >> that.")
>>>>
>>>> >>
>>>>
>>>> >> So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
>>>> encounters an
>>>>
>>>> >> issue with any software or combination of software:
>>>>
>>>> >>
>>>>
>>>> >> * if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
>>>> there's
>>>>
>>>> >> virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
>>>>
>>>> >> * if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem, but
>>>> others
>>>>
>>>> >> running the same operating system and similar overall configuration
>>>> that you
>>>>
>>>> >> are don't have it when they perform those steps, this suggests an
>>>>
>>>> >> idiosyncratic problem with your own system
>>>>
>>>> >>
>>>>
>>>> >> I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a given
>>>> problem
>>>>
>>>> >> only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
>>>> programs
>>>> that
>>>>
>>>> >> are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
>>>> files >> are
>>>>
>>>> >> being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed, etc.
>>>>
>>>> >>
>>>>
>>>> >> I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for anything, but
>>>> these
>>>>
>>>> >> are factors that you must consider and there will be occasions when
>>>> "it's
>>>>
>>>> >> just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you."  Having a
>>>>
>>>> >> detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
>>>>
>>>> >> --
>>>>
>>>> >> *Brian*
>>>>
>>>> >>
>>>>
>>>> >> *Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
>>>> complete.
>>>> If
>>>>
>>>> >> you’re alive, it isn’t.*
>>>>
>>>> >>
>>>>
>>>> >>     ~ Lauren Bacall
>>>>
>>>> >>
>>>>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Quentin Christensen
>>> Training Material Developer
>>> Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
>>> available:
>>> http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
>>>
>>> Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
>>> Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
>>> www.nvaccess.org
>>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
>>> Twitter: @NVAccess
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> .
>







--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org 
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

David <trailerdavid@...>
 

Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?


Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year ago -
where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP for
businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for the validity
of the article, and do not know if I even bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to update your
security software, you might still be able to use it offline for a long
time yet. And if you only update the database of your security software,
that software will keep rolling under XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those of us
who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer flavor of
Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging around. Personally, I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have software
that is needed for certain tasks, which would not impose a security
risk, but which cannot be run under newer Windows. That is, my XP
machine is not going online, but I still need a screen reader for it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an OS,
whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA apparently
continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave many of us the
chance to continue using our older equipment, for tasks that totally
well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where they still
commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the upgrade of the OS, and
basically there might not be too much more holes in XP, than in any
newer flavors of Windows. According to what I read, both Win8 and 10,
seem to have open holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever
reason are not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes are
not in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you and the
Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which OS you
are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:
Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be honest
microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now and any
computer with it will have malware and be crappy to because microsoft
says so and I really don't aggree with microsoft but its the way it is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history, soon 7
will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:
please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the cause of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the same one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab around
the
main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I could
play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close when I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had 2016.3 on
the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore <jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,

Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend that one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers cannot do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and JAWS or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and up -
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least could give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible at all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the software at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want, give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage of a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might be
able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do what you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen readers, do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30 to 60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader, sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help the tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can access to all
menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem, but
others

running the same operating system and similar overall configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this suggests an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed, etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for anything, but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be occasions when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you." Having a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall









--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess




.


personal messages - Keep them OFF the list

David <trailerdavid@...>
 

Listers,
May I be allowed to raise a polite and friendly reminder?

I have only been subscribed to this list for something like a week, but
have seen more than one message, where people get rather personal, and
sometimes little nice to other members in particular. Undortunately,
this disturbs the validity of the topic being discussed.

Could it be an idea, for those who have anything unsolved with other
listers, that you please rectify that in private, via direct mailing to
the person you aim for? Meaning, could you please, for the benefit of
all, keep posting to the list, ONLY what REALLY is meant for the public
- the general group of listers. And, please, stick to the topic being
discussed.

I just find it disappointing to read your dashing each other. And it
really does take the discussion nowhere.

Please?


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Quentin Christensen
 

Given that Windows XP support officially ended nearly three years ago, it's probably worth looking into why people are still using it even more than why people are using old versions of NVDA.  There are a lot more risks in using an unsupported version of Windows, even if you think you are safe.

Just to ensure everyone is on the same page on the risks and what exactly Microsoft stopping support for Windows XP means, I grabbed a couple of links for anyone interested.  Firstly Microsoft's own page on the subject: https://support.microsoft.com/en-au/help/14223/windows-xp-end-of-support


Note that the HowToGeek article talks about buying Windows 7 - obviously that was written some time ago and you pretty much can't these days.  You can buy refurbished PCs from several places such as GreenPC here in Australia which do still come with Windows 7: http://www.greenpc.com.au/catalog/pc so that may potentially be an option depending on what your reasons for still using XP are.

The HowToGeek article also offers the suggestion of using Linux.  Obviously that's one option, however, if you do that, you will need to learn a new operating system and a new screen reader.  Linux does have Orca, however, it doesn't have the same level of functionality as NVDA.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 5:43 PM, Jacob Kruger <jacob@...> wrote:
Ok, FWIW, I still have a VMWare version of windows XP here, and, installed NVDA 2016.4 RC1 under it, installed potplayer, and, if I set it playing an mp3 file, and, use alt + f4 to close it while playing, with it's accessibility settings enabled - using ooooooold MS sam voice - funny old memories invoked by hearing that horrible voice - then it all still works fine, no crashes, no error messages, etc. etc.


So, sorry, Nasrin, but, still not sure what could be causing your hassles, but, it really doesn't seem to be NVDA's background activity, or anything like that.


In any case, like mentioned before, gomplayer offers pretty much the same interface as potplayer, with additional functionality, so would, honestly, suggest you rather try that out, and, take it from there..?


Stay well


Jacob Kruger
Blind Biker
Skype: BlindZA
"Resistance is futile, but, acceptance is versatile..."

On 2016-12-06 07:52, Shaun Everiss wrote:
If I had the space I'd have a real xp unit but can't justify it.
My other plan is to get a box with enough ram to run vertual machines



On 6/12/2016 3:15 p.m., Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:
I agree. I know XP's really old, and pretty much dead, but I agree here
with Michael. There are, though rare, some instances where it can
actually be useful to have XP lying around for old legacy software that
just won't run anywhere else. Don't get me wrong. Primarily, I use
Windows 10, but once in a while I'll use my old xp machine for things.

Chris.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Capelle" <mcapelle@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 9:10 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene.  I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP.  That may be the cause of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the same one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab around the
main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I could play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close when I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems fine?  I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1  Actually I just realised I still had 2016.3 on the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore <jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,

Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend that one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers cannot do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and JAWS or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and up -
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you out. For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least could give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible at all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the software at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want, give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage of a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might be able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do what you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen readers, do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30 to 60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader, sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help the tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

> gene.

> thanks so much for helping me to test the program.

> i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.

> me too, use windows xp service pack 3

> you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer menus.

> you should only press the application keys and you can access to all

> menus and options by normal arrow keys.

> only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except unknown.

> i should restart nvda to work as normal.

>

> On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

>> Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't ever

>> anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's anything
wrong
with

>> that.")

>>

>> So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

>> issue with any software or combination of software:

>>

>> * if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
there's

>> virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved

>> * if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem, but
>> others

>> running the same operating system and similar overall configuration
that you

>> are don't have it when they perform those steps, this suggests an

>> idiosyncratic problem with your own system

>>

>> I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a given
problem

>> only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

>> are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
files >> are

>> being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed, etc.

>>

>> I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for anything, but
these

>> are factors that you must consider and there will be occasions when
"it's

>> just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you."  Having a

>> detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.

>> --

>> *Brian*

>>

>> *Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

>> you’re alive, it isn’t.*

>>

>>     ~ Lauren Bacall

>>

>












--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess





--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306
Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess








.













--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org 
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


talking android x86

Isaac <bigikemusic@...>
 

Hi, anyone have a link to a talking android x86 if so please share.
Thanks


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Jacob Kruger
 

Ok, FWIW, I still have a VMWare version of windows XP here, and, installed NVDA 2016.4 RC1 under it, installed potplayer, and, if I set it playing an mp3 file, and, use alt + f4 to close it while playing, with it's accessibility settings enabled - using ooooooold MS sam voice - funny old memories invoked by hearing that horrible voice - then it all still works fine, no crashes, no error messages, etc. etc.


So, sorry, Nasrin, but, still not sure what could be causing your hassles, but, it really doesn't seem to be NVDA's background activity, or anything like that.


In any case, like mentioned before, gomplayer offers pretty much the same interface as potplayer, with additional functionality, so would, honestly, suggest you rather try that out, and, take it from there..?


Stay well


Jacob Kruger
Blind Biker
Skype: BlindZA
"Resistance is futile, but, acceptance is versatile..."

On 2016-12-06 07:52, Shaun Everiss wrote:
If I had the space I'd have a real xp unit but can't justify it.
My other plan is to get a box with enough ram to run vertual machines



On 6/12/2016 3:15 p.m., Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:
I agree. I know XP's really old, and pretty much dead, but I agree here
with Michael. There are, though rare, some instances where it can
actually be useful to have XP lying around for old legacy software that
just won't run anywhere else. Don't get me wrong. Primarily, I use
Windows 10, but once in a while I'll use my old xp machine for things.

Chris.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Capelle" <mcapelle@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 9:10 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the cause of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the same one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab around the
main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I could play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close when I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems fine? I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had 2016.3 on the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore <jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,

Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend that one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers cannot do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and JAWS or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and up -
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you out. For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least could give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible at all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the software at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want, give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage of a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might be able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do what you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen readers, do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30 to 60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader, sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help the tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can access to
all

menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem, but
others
running the same operating system and similar overall
configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this suggests an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a
given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed, etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for anything,
but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be occasions
when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you." Having a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall









--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess



--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306
Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess






.