Date   

Re: Windows XP support was: RE: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

I really do not understand how anyone can expect active support, as opposed to passive (as in, the last version compatible with XP being available for download as legacy and no longer actively maintained), for Windows XP.  The operating system has not been supported by Microsoft for years now.  It's just by sheer luck (and some effort, but not intentional in many cases) that a lot of software has remained able to be run under XP but was developed for a later version of Windows.

Operating systems have finite lifespans.  The finite lifespan of XP as an actively supported system ended a long, long time ago.

I own a Windows XP laptop, Windows 7 laptop, three Windows 10 machines (2 laptops and 1 desktop), and a Linux box.  I am under no delusion that any support of any meaningful kind can be expected for Windows XP.   Also, I have carried forward a lot of non-screen-reader software that I liked from the XP era that still runs like a top under Windows 10.  One example of that is Microsoft Photo Editor, which deals with creating transparency more easily than any other photo editor I've ever used.  There are a number of others as well.  I would really like to hear what people have under XP that they've tried running under a later version of Windows that doesn't work either with native Windows or using compatibility mode, which I've not had to do for anything, yet.
--
Brian

Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.  If you’re alive, it isn’t.

    ~ Lauren Bacall

    



Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

antony, do you know the last version of nvda which supports xp?
whats the last version that i can use?
i realy wish that its be possible supporting of xp forever.

On 12/6/16, Supanut Leepaisomboon <@supanut2000> wrote:
Well, you get to enjoy the benefits of both OSes. Think of it this way, if
you install Windows XP mode in Windows 7, and when you go into Windows XP
and install anything, it shows up in the Windows 7 start menu so it's
relatively easy to launch; although the catch is that I think XP mode is not
available for the home editions of Windows 7, except for Windows 7 Ultimate.
From my tests in the past, NVDA does work under XP mode.

In response to a message earlier, yes, free/open source software stopped
supporting old versions of Windows later than paid ones, but eventually old
versions of Windows will not be supported. Take Firefox, Mozilla stopped
supporting Windows 2000 I think a year or 2-3 years after Windows 2000
became unsupported by Microsoft.
--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: NVDA and Open Office

Jorge Gonçalves
 

Hello,

I just got curious from your answer. I am a LibreOffice user.

What does make Open Office more accessible than LibreOffice? What are the main accessibility differences? I am only interested in the Word Processor.

Cheers,
Jorge

Às 14:41 de 06/12/2016, Robert Kingett escreveu:

It works well even if you do not have Java installed. It is more accessible than Libreoffice but Libreoffice is a better program in every other way.


Re: Google Chrome Browser

Brice Mijares
 

I too wouldn't mind a copy.
bricemijares@...


Re: Google Chrome Browser

Albert Ruel
 

I too would appreciate a copy of your document. 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Mullins
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2016 4:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Google Chrome Browser

 

Hi Andrea

I have a Word document I wrote several months ago which explains how to set Chrome up to your personal preferences which I can send in Word or text form if it’s any good to you.

 

Cheers

Chris

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Andrea Sherry
Sent: 6 December 2016 06:35
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Google Chrome Browser

 

Need a beginners' guide for the browser please.

Where can I obtain such?

Andrea


Re: NVDA and Open Office

 

It works well even if you do not have Java installed. It is more accessible than Libreoffice but Libreoffice is a better program in every other way.


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

Well, you get to enjoy the benefits of both OSes. Think of it this way, if you install Windows XP mode in Windows 7, and when you go into Windows XP and install anything, it shows up in the Windows 7 start menu so it's relatively easy to launch; although the catch is that I think XP mode is not available for the home editions of Windows 7, except for Windows 7 Ultimate. From my tests in the past, NVDA does work under XP mode.

In response to a message earlier, yes, free/open source software stopped supporting old versions of Windows later than paid ones, but eventually old versions of Windows will not be supported. Take Firefox, Mozilla stopped supporting Windows 2000 I think a year or 2-3 years after Windows 2000 became unsupported by Microsoft.


Re: Windows XP support was: RE: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

Hi,
Mostly have to do with components NVDA uses.
As for Python and other technical matters, I think it is a bit advanced for many, so let's move it to development list.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of nasrin khaksar
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2016 6:07 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: Windows XP support was: RE: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

joseph, did you mean supporting of xp is depending on the programming language that you use?
which version of python do you use now?

and did python 3 stop support of xp?
how about visual studio?
does visual studio 2015 that now you use, support xp and since which version of studio supporting of xp is stopped?

On 12/6/16, Joseph Lee <@joslee> wrote:
Hi,
The following may come across as a bit hard to swallow, but please
bear with
me:
A building that began to crumble from its foundation will soon
collapse completely, but one can save many lives by evacuating its
occupants in an orderly fashion.
Personally, I believe that we should prepare to say goodbye to XP
soon, but do understand reasons why we should continue to accept
patrons who comes from XP. In the old days, technology was a
slow-moving car, but today, it is like a dew - fresh in the beginning,
but dries up shortly after. This will accelerate more in coming months
and years (for Windows 10 users, have you asked why there are two major upgrades in a span of one year?).
In case of XP support, one of the crucial components NVDA uses is
written for latest Visual Studio in mind, and if this component moves
to drop support for XP, NV Access will need to choose between moving
on or keeping old version alive. Another thing to consider is the fact
that newer Python versions dropped support for XP, and this is an even
bigger issue, given that some developers want to move to Python 3.
Ultimately, the mindset of screen reader users will determine to what
extent NVDA and other screen readers will support XP and for how long.
Cheers,
Joseph


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
nasrin khaksar
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2016 4:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: Windows XP support was: RE: [nvda] Is any release prior
to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported?
#NVDARelease

i realy wish and request that dont stop supporting of xp.

On 12/6/16, Joseph Lee <@joslee> wrote:
Hi,
Er, ordered a hamburger but got a chicken sandwich instead...
Support for Windows XP depends on a number of things, the most
important being compiler support (NVDA isn't powered entirely by
Python; there are a couple components that are compiled by Visual
Studio compiler, and thankfully, the one NV Access uses supports
compiling NVDA to run on XP).
There will indeed come a time when NVDA will drop support for XP, and
this list will be one of the firsts to know when this happens well in
advance of end of support date. Same fate is awaiting Windows Vista
in
2017 - Windows Vista will be supported for a while though.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
nasrin khaksar
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2016 4:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

please dont stop supporting of windows xp.
nvda is extremely great, even with continuation of supporting of all
operating systems that i love and also my softwares.
quentin, i decided to migrate to linux, but i only love nvda, my
current programs and cant learn new operating system and command
lines when installing softwares.
and one people replied that even i cant use nvda via vine on linux
and via vine, i cant use my windows programs because they are not
accessible even with using orca.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi joseph.
yes, i use windows xp and i heard that .UIA is not supported on xp.
i did not change an important option for accessibility.


hi david.
my windows has problem and i dont know the reason.
but i should say that my windows has not narrator at all!
i tested this and and i am sure that i dont have narrator to test!
moreover, microsoft sam is not understandable for me and i cant
recognize what he says and what message does he read!
and also for me, i could not install another screen reader beside
nvda, because my system faces hangs, crashes and for me in my
system, screen readers are not compatible with each other.
you mentioned that having more than one screen reader does not cause
trouble, but for me it causes!


hi gene.
i tested many versions of potplayer and the result of testing all
versions, was crash of nvda since version 2015.4 so, its a
regression in nvda 2015.4, because in 2015.3 i did not face such problem.
yes. the current stable version of potplayer as you and quentin
mentioned, is 1.6.63856 but as i said i tried different versions and
could not solve the issue myself.
also, i did not change any settings in potplayer including: skins,
visual appearance, and its other settings.
vlc is not accessible for me, not has great quality and needs
powerful system.
i tried it and the result was only system resources consumption and
crashes of the program for me!
and the only satisfactory program for me is potplayer.
i found this in many month research, many program tested and going
to the many websites.
also, thanks so much for your link.
i joined this and repeated my problem.
the problem for me is only crashing of nvda, not potplayer!


hi quentin.
thanks extremely for your kindness.
i dont think that my problem is related to specific version of
windows and also specific version of potplayer.
i am sure there is one problem with nvda and potplayer which is
regression from nvda 2015.4 and later versions.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi jacob.
thanks so much for helping me.

can you please test many files with potplayer?
eventually for me nvda is not responding and i dont know how to
solve this problem.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi david and quentin.
i use xp and also i do all of my works with it.
i use internet, libreoffice, notepad, potplayer and one conversion
software.
i dont have the security programs because realy i dont trust them!

On 12/6/16, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
You're more of an expert on what works under XP than me Brian,
that's great info!

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Brian's Mail list account <
bglists@...> wrote:

Well, as far as I am aware, the basic plan is to not break XP if
it is at all possible, but just occasionally this might not be
possible as the windows code changes.
Indeed at the moment xp portable versions of even the next
snapshots are very good. Try running portable copies of nvda on,
say windows 10 and you will find lots of things that no longer
work due to the security of that operating system not allowing
access to parts of windows from a portable app.
the big problem at present for those using XP is the web browser.
Depending on your processor, 50 is the last version I can get to
work on xp with intel processors, and 48 is the last one on xp
with amd processors.
This is due to the lack of sse2 instruction set support on the
amd chips.
Dropbox, no matter what Dropbox say, is working fine again on xp
intel processors at version 15, though they do warn that this
could change as its officially not supported. AMD chips last
working version of Dropbox is 13, and one has to disable updates
by nefarious means to keep it working on such hardware.

The hack to continue to get xp updates is still working for
MSSE, but his month no xp security updates came down. whether
this means they have blocked the loophole or just they have
given up I cannot say.
I notice that Flash for IE8 is seemingly not being updated by
Adobe, but seems to be working in Firefox 50 at the moment.
Adobe reader DC is not usable on XP and 11 is the last version.

I'm sure there are many other issues but that really depends on
what you are doing.
Its gratifying to note that the hacked copy of Outlook express
that works in 10 is still supported by nvda, and its only issue
is that its preview pane has to be turned off or it will fall
over sometimes.


Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:- briang1@...,
putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David"
<trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:31 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release, and thenext RC release, officially supported?
#NVDARelease


Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?


Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year
ago - where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP
for businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for
the validity of the article, and do not know if I even
bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to
update your security software, you might still be able to use
it offline for a long time yet. And if you only update the
database of your security software, that software will keep
rolling under XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those
of us who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer
flavor of Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging
around.
Personally,
I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have
software that is needed for certain tasks, which would not
impose a security risk, but which cannot be run under newer
Windows.
That is, my XP machine is not going online, but I still need a
screen reader for it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting
an OS, whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA
apparently continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will
leave many of us the chance to continue using our older
equipment, for tasks that totally well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where
they still commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the
upgrade of the OS, and basically there might not be too much
more holes in XP, than in any newer flavors of Windows.
According to what I read, both Win8 and 10, seem to have open
holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever reason are
not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes are not
in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you
and the Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent
on which OS you are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:

Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to
be honest microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os
now and any computer with it will have malware and be crappy
to because microsoft says so and I really don't aggree with
microsoft but its the way it is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history,
soon 7 will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:

please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release, and thenext RC release, officially supported?
#NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP
as well, although when I looked back at Nasrin's original
question re Potplayer, it was using Windows 7 - although
there are multiple versions of Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the
cause of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest
stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported?
#NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was
the same one Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't
tab around the main screen to read the information which is
displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and
there are keystrokes for most things, once you know what
they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that
I could play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close
when I finished listening to a couple of songs, and
everything seems fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had
2016.3 on the Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried
with 2016.4rc1 and again, I couldn't reproduce the crash,
even after listening to a few songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore
<jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,

Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to
access controls that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA.
I highly recommend that one learn how to use Narrator,
because it is getting more and more powful in win10, and
can do a few things that high-end screen readers cannot do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA,
and JAWS or Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail
<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>
for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest
stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported?
#NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I
do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and
completely true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP
and up
-
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though
far from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help
you out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least
could give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is
accessible at all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the
software at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the
screen reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis
encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you
want, give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes
the high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the
usage of a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you
might be able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do
what you expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen
readers, do have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download
and install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they
all provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything
from
30 to
60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your
third-party software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader,
sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is
NOT the case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other
words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one
backup screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might
help the tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you
can describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you
never tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with
potplayer menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can
access to all
menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except
unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I
hadn't ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's
anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when
anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the
problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the
problem, but
others

running the same operating system and similar overall
configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this
suggests an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours
on a given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between
two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and
old DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been
fixed, etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for
anything, but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be
occasions when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you."
Having
a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life
is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall









--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books
now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess




.







--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306
Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess

--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org

--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org







--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org







--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages al-islam.org


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Antony Stone
 

There's a big difference between "most programs" and a screenreader.

Writing a standard application which can run under almost any version of
Windows is entirely feasible, but a screenreader has to hook into special
places in the operating system kernel, which change from one version of the
system to the next, and therefore the screenreader code cannot remain the same
and work across all versions of Windows.

One day there will be a choice between holding everybody back to the
capabilities supported by Windows XP, or else taking advantage of what the
latest versions of Windows provide, with the downside that the code no longer
runs on Windows XP.

After all, NVDA doesn't run under Windows 95.

People who still run Windows XP are already used to having to stick to old
versions of some applications because the new ones don't work under XP; the
same will simply become true for NVDA. Nobody's saying you won't be able to
run it any more, but you may have to stay with an outdated version to match an
outdated operating system.

Antony.

On Tuesday 06 December 2016 at 15:23:56, nasrin khaksar wrote:

one great advantage of free softwares is the freedom and choices of
there users for there operating system.
commercial programs stop the previous windows, but free programs
support them for many years later and even maybe forever!
i know some softwares that work on windows 95 until windows 10
--
Police have found a cartoonist dead in his house. They say that details are
currently sketchy.

Please reply to the list;
please *don't* CC me.


Re: NVDA and Open Office

 

hi.
openoffice and libreoffice are supported by nvda by default installation.
you dont need to use extra component for using them with nvda and only
SayAall command and tables is not supported according to my
experience.

On 12/6/16, Don H <lmddh50@...> wrote:
How well does NVDA work with Open Office? If it does work with Open
Office are there any info as to how to set up Open Office to work well?
Thanks



--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Antony Stone
 

What would be the advantage of running Windows XP inside a virtual machine,
for someone who still has hardware which is capable of running it natively?


Antony.

On Tuesday 06 December 2016 at 15:18:58, Supanut Leepaisomboon wrote:

Freedom Scientific stopped supporting XP since version 16 of Jaws, so I
think it wouldn't be strange if some day in the future NV Access stops
supporting XP. As has been mentioned in this thread, XP is now unsupported
by Microsoft, and for day-to-day use I'd say Windows 7 or later is the
optimum choice. If you really want or have to use XP, you can either
install it in a virtual machine or use Windows XP mode, which I don't know
if it's still available to download.

I've been a long time XP users, but finally decided, around 6 years ago,
that I have to move on and upgrade to Windows 7 for better stability, and
today I found myself relying on many features in Windows 7 that weren't
available in XP.
--
I love deadlines. I love the whooshing noise they make as they go by.

- Douglas Noel Adams

Please reply to the list;
please *don't* CC me.


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

one great advantage of free softwares is the freedom and choices of
there users for there operating system.
commercial programs stop the previous windows, but free programs
support them for many years later and even maybe forever!
i know some softwares that work on windows 95 until windows 10

On 12/6/16, Supanut Leepaisomboon <@supanut2000> wrote:
Freedom Scientific stopped supporting XP since version 16 of Jaws, so I
think it wouldn't be strange if some day in the future NV Access stops
supporting XP. As has been mentioned in this thread, XP is now unsupported
by Microsoft, and for day-to-day use I'd say Windows 7 or later is the
optimum choice. If you really want or have to use XP, you can either install
it in a virtual machine or use Windows XP mode, which I don't know if it's
still available to download.

I've been a long time XP users, but finally decided, around 6 years ago,
that I have to move on and upgrade to Windows 7 for better stability, and
today I found myself relying on many features in Windows 7 that weren't
available in XP.
--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


NVDA and Open Office

Don H
 

How well does NVDA work with Open Office? If it does work with Open Office are there any info as to how to set up Open Office to work well?
Thanks


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

Freedom Scientific stopped supporting XP since version 16 of Jaws, so I think it wouldn't be strange if some day in the future NV Access stops supporting XP. As has been mentioned in this thread, XP is now unsupported by Microsoft, and for day-to-day use I'd say Windows 7 or later is the optimum choice. If you really want or have to use XP, you can either install it in a virtual machine or use Windows XP mode, which I don't know if it's still available to download.

I've been a long time XP users, but finally decided, around 6 years ago, that I have to move on and upgrade to Windows 7 for better stability, and today I found myself relying on many features in Windows 7 that weren't available in XP.


Re: Windows XP support was: RE: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

joseph, did you mean supporting of xp is depending on the programming
language that you use?
which version of python do you use now?

and did python 3 stop support of xp?
how about visual studio?
does visual studio 2015 that now you use, support xp and since which
version of studio supporting of xp is stopped?

On 12/6/16, Joseph Lee <@joslee> wrote:
Hi,
The following may come across as a bit hard to swallow, but please bear with
me:
A building that began to crumble from its foundation will soon collapse
completely, but one can save many lives by evacuating its occupants in an
orderly fashion.
Personally, I believe that we should prepare to say goodbye to XP soon, but
do understand reasons why we should continue to accept patrons who comes
from XP. In the old days, technology was a slow-moving car, but today, it is
like a dew - fresh in the beginning, but dries up shortly after. This will
accelerate more in coming months and years (for Windows 10 users, have you
asked why there are two major upgrades in a span of one year?).
In case of XP support, one of the crucial components NVDA uses is written
for latest Visual Studio in mind, and if this component moves to drop
support for XP, NV Access will need to choose between moving on or keeping
old version alive. Another thing to consider is the fact that newer Python
versions dropped support for XP, and this is an even bigger issue, given
that some developers want to move to Python 3. Ultimately, the mindset of
screen reader users will determine to what extent NVDA and other screen
readers will support XP and for how long.
Cheers,
Joseph


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of nasrin
khaksar
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2016 4:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: Windows XP support was: RE: [nvda] Is any release prior to the
latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported?
#NVDARelease

i realy wish and request that dont stop supporting of xp.

On 12/6/16, Joseph Lee <@joslee> wrote:
Hi,
Er, ordered a hamburger but got a chicken sandwich instead...
Support for Windows XP depends on a number of things, the most
important being compiler support (NVDA isn't powered entirely by
Python; there are a couple components that are compiled by Visual
Studio compiler, and thankfully, the one NV Access uses supports compiling
NVDA to run on XP).
There will indeed come a time when NVDA will drop support for XP, and
this list will be one of the firsts to know when this happens well in
advance of end of support date. Same fate is awaiting Windows Vista in
2017 - Windows Vista will be supported for a while though.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
nasrin khaksar
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2016 4:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

please dont stop supporting of windows xp.
nvda is extremely great, even with continuation of supporting of all
operating systems that i love and also my softwares.
quentin, i decided to migrate to linux, but i only love nvda, my
current programs and cant learn new operating system and command lines
when installing softwares.
and one people replied that even i cant use nvda via vine on linux and
via vine, i cant use my windows programs because they are not
accessible even with using orca.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi joseph.
yes, i use windows xp and i heard that .UIA is not supported on xp.
i did not change an important option for accessibility.


hi david.
my windows has problem and i dont know the reason.
but i should say that my windows has not narrator at all!
i tested this and and i am sure that i dont have narrator to test!
moreover, microsoft sam is not understandable for me and i cant
recognize what he says and what message does he read!
and also for me, i could not install another screen reader beside
nvda, because my system faces hangs, crashes and for me in my system,
screen readers are not compatible with each other.
you mentioned that having more than one screen reader does not cause
trouble, but for me it causes!


hi gene.
i tested many versions of potplayer and the result of testing all
versions, was crash of nvda since version 2015.4 so, its a regression
in nvda 2015.4, because in 2015.3 i did not face such problem.
yes. the current stable version of potplayer as you and quentin
mentioned, is 1.6.63856 but as i said i tried different versions and
could not solve the issue myself.
also, i did not change any settings in potplayer including: skins,
visual appearance, and its other settings.
vlc is not accessible for me, not has great quality and needs
powerful system.
i tried it and the result was only system resources consumption and
crashes of the program for me!
and the only satisfactory program for me is potplayer.
i found this in many month research, many program tested and going to
the many websites.
also, thanks so much for your link.
i joined this and repeated my problem.
the problem for me is only crashing of nvda, not potplayer!


hi quentin.
thanks extremely for your kindness.
i dont think that my problem is related to specific version of
windows and also specific version of potplayer.
i am sure there is one problem with nvda and potplayer which is
regression from nvda 2015.4 and later versions.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi jacob.
thanks so much for helping me.

can you please test many files with potplayer?
eventually for me nvda is not responding and i dont know how to
solve this problem.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi david and quentin.
i use xp and also i do all of my works with it.
i use internet, libreoffice, notepad, potplayer and one conversion
software.
i dont have the security programs because realy i dont trust them!

On 12/6/16, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
You're more of an expert on what works under XP than me Brian,
that's great info!

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Brian's Mail list account <
bglists@...> wrote:

Well, as far as I am aware, the basic plan is to not break XP if
it is at all possible, but just occasionally this might not be
possible as the windows code changes.
Indeed at the moment xp portable versions of even the next
snapshots are very good. Try running portable copies of nvda on,
say windows 10 and you will find lots of things that no longer
work due to the security of that operating system not allowing
access to parts of windows from a portable app.
the big problem at present for those using XP is the web browser.
Depending on your processor, 50 is the last version I can get to
work on xp with intel processors, and 48 is the last one on xp
with amd processors.
This is due to the lack of sse2 instruction set support on the
amd chips.
Dropbox, no matter what Dropbox say, is working fine again on xp
intel processors at version 15, though they do warn that this
could change as its officially not supported. AMD chips last
working version of Dropbox is 13, and one has to disable updates
by nefarious means to keep it working on such hardware.

The hack to continue to get xp updates is still working for MSSE,
but his month no xp security updates came down. whether this
means they have blocked the loophole or just they have given up I
cannot say.
I notice that Flash for IE8 is seemingly not being updated by
Adobe, but seems to be working in Firefox 50 at the moment.
Adobe reader DC is not usable on XP and 11 is the last version.

I'm sure there are many other issues but that really depends on
what you are doing.
Its gratifying to note that the hacked copy of Outlook express
that works in 10 is still supported by nvda, and its only issue
is that its preview pane has to be turned off or it will fall
over sometimes.


Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:- briang1@...,
putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David"
<trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:31 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release, and thenext RC release, officially supported?
#NVDARelease


Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?


Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year
ago - where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP
for businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for
the validity of the article, and do not know if I even
bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to
update your security software, you might still be able to use it
offline for a long time yet. And if you only update the database
of your security software, that software will keep rolling under
XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those
of us who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer
flavor of Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging
around.
Personally,
I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have
software that is needed for certain tasks, which would not
impose a security risk, but which cannot be run under newer
Windows.
That is, my XP machine is not going online, but I still need a
screen reader for it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an
OS, whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA
apparently continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave
many of us the chance to continue using our older equipment, for
tasks that totally well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where
they still commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the
upgrade of the OS, and basically there might not be too much
more holes in XP, than in any newer flavors of Windows.
According to what I read, both Win8 and 10, seem to have open
holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever reason are not
being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes are not in
your OS itself, but more in the communication between you and
the Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which
OS you are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:

Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be
honest microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now
and any computer with it will have malware and be crappy to
because microsoft says so and I really don't aggree with
microsoft but its the way it is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history,
soon 7 will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:

please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release, and thenext RC release, officially supported?
#NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as
well, although when I looked back at Nasrin's original
question re Potplayer, it was using Windows 7 - although there
are multiple versions of Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the
cause of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest
stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported?
#NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the
same one Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab
around the main screen to read the information which is
displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and
there are keystrokes for most things, once you know what they
are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I
could play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close
when I finished listening to a couple of songs, and
everything seems fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had
2016.3 on the Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried
with 2016.4rc1 and again, I couldn't reproduce the crash,
even after listening to a few songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore
<jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,

Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to
access controls that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I
highly recommend that one learn how to use Narrator, because
it is getting more and more powful in win10, and can do a
few things that high-end screen readers cannot do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA,
and JAWS or Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail
<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>
for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest
stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported?
#NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I
do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely
true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP
and up
-
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though
far from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help
you out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least
could give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is
accessible at all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the
software at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the
screen reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis
encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want,
give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the
high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the
usage of a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you
might be able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do
what you expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen
readers, do have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download
and install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they
all provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from
30 to
60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your
third-party software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader,
sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is
NOT the case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other
words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one
backup screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help
the tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can
describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you
never tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with
potplayer menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can
access to all
menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except
unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I
hadn't ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's
anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when
anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the
problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the
problem, but
others

running the same operating system and similar overall
configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this
suggests an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours
on a given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between
two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and old
DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been
fixed, etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for
anything, but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be
occasions when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you."
Having
a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life
is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall









--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books
now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess




.







--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306
Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess

--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org

--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org







--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages al-islam.org






--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Thank you all

Sakina
 

Dear All,

First of all I would like to thank my friend Brian who introduced me to this group.

I can not thank him enough.

Secondly to Gene and all the people whose names I can not mention but I thank you all very much.

By being in your group I am learning new things each day.

It will take me a long time to learn many things, but I will persevere.

Thank you all again

With best wishes and regards always

Sakina


Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

i dont know.

On 12/6/16, Andre Fisher <andrefisher729@...> wrote:
Where did you get this copy of Windows XP? Is it legal?

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
david,
i tested the demo version of jaws 11, 14 and 15 with nvda and the
result was crash and sometimes not responding nvda.
i took your advice and and recieve a message that i dont have narrator.
in the first time of installation of my windows, i tried openning
narrater via its shortcut and i did not have any voice.
i am sure that the narrator is not installed in my system.

On 12/6/16, David <trailerdavid@...> wrote:
What other screen reader have you tried to install and run, that caused
you trouble? Which version of that screen reader? When did you try it?


Give us some more facts, and maybe we can help you further, please.


David

On 12/6/2016 1:20 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
hi joseph.
yes, i use windows xp and i heard that .UIA is not supported on xp.
i did not change an important option for accessibility.


hi david.
my windows has problem and i dont know the reason.
but i should say that my windows has not narrator at all!
i tested this and and i am sure that i dont have narrator to test!
moreover, microsoft sam is not understandable for me and i cant
recognize what he says and what message does he read!
and also for me, i could not install another screen reader beside
nvda, because my system faces hangs, crashes and for me in my system,
screen readers are not compatible with each other.
you mentioned that having more than one screen reader does not cause
trouble, but for me it causes!


hi gene.
i tested many versions of potplayer and the result of testing all
versions, was crash of nvda since version 2015.4
so, its a regression in nvda 2015.4, because in 2015.3 i did not face
such problem.
yes. the current stable version of potplayer as you and quentin
mentioned, is 1.6.63856
but as i said i tried different versions and could not solve the issue
myself.
also, i did not change any settings in potplayer including: skins,
visual appearance, and its other settings.
vlc is not accessible for me, not has great quality and needs powerful
system.
i tried it and the result was only system resources consumption and
crashes of the program for me!
and the only satisfactory program for me is potplayer.
i found this in many month research, many program tested and going to
the many websites.
also, thanks so much for your link.
i joined this and repeated my problem.
the problem for me is only crashing of nvda, not potplayer!


hi quentin.
thanks extremely for your kindness.
i dont think that my problem is related to specific version of windows
and also specific version of potplayer.
i am sure there is one problem with nvda and potplayer which is
regression from nvda 2015.4 and later versions.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi jacob.
thanks so much for helping me.

can you please test many files with potplayer?
eventually for me nvda is not responding and i dont know how to solve
this problem.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi david and quentin.
i use xp and also i do all of my works with it.
i use internet, libreoffice, notepad, potplayer and one conversion
software.
i dont have the security programs because realy i dont trust them!

On 12/6/16, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
You're more of an expert on what works under XP than me Brian,
that's
great
info!

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Brian's Mail list account <
bglists@...> wrote:

Well, as far as I am aware, the basic plan is to not break XP if it
is
at
all possible, but just occasionally this might not be possible as
the
windows code changes.
Indeed at the moment xp portable versions of even the next
snapshots
are
very good. Try running portable copies of nvda on, say windows 10
and
you
will find lots of things that no longer work due to the security
of
that
operating system not allowing access to parts of windows from a
portable
app.
the big problem at present for those using XP is the web browser.
Depending on your processor, 50 is the last version I can get to
work
on
xp
with intel processors, and 48 is the last one on xp with amd
processors.
This is due to the lack of sse2 instruction set support on the amd
chips.
Dropbox, no matter what Dropbox say, is working fine again on xp
intel
processors at version 15, though they do warn that this could
change
as
its officially not supported. AMD chips last working version of
Dropbox
is
13, and one has to disable updates by nefarious means to keep it
working
on
such hardware.

The hack to continue to get xp updates is still working for MSSE,
but
his
month no xp security updates came down. whether this means they
have
blocked the loophole or just they have given up I cannot say.
I notice that Flash for IE8 is seemingly not being updated by
Adobe,
but
seems to be working in Firefox 50 at the moment.
Adobe reader DC is not usable on XP and 11 is the last version.

I'm sure there are many other issues but that really depends on
what
you
are doing.
Its gratifying to note that the hacked copy of Outlook express that
works
in 10 is still supported by nvda, and its only issue is that its
preview
pane has to be turned off or it will fall over sometimes.


Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David"
<trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:31 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and
thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?

Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year ago
-
where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP for
businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for the
validity
of the article, and do not know if I even bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to
update
your
security software, you might still be able to use it offline for a
long
time yet. And if you only update the database of your security
software,
that software will keep rolling under XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those
of
us
who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer flavor of
Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging around.
Personally,
I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have
software
that is needed for certain tasks, which would not impose a
security
risk, but which cannot be run under newer Windows. That is, my XP
machine is not going online, but I still need a screen reader for
it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an
OS,
whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA apparently
continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave many of us
the
chance to continue using our older equipment, for tasks that
totally
well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where they
still
commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the upgrade of the OS,
and
basically there might not be too much more holes in XP, than in
any
newer flavors of Windows. According to what I read, both Win8 and
10,
seem to have open holes. Some even are well known, but for
whatever
reason are not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes
are
not in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you
and
the
Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which OS
you
are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:

Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be
honest
microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now and any
computer with it will have malware and be crappy to because
microsoft
says so and I really don't aggree with microsoft but its the way
it
is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history, soon
7
will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:

please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as
well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of
Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64
bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the
cause
of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the
same
one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab
around
the
main screen to read the information which is displayed
visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there
are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I
could
play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close
when
I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems
fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had
2016.3
on
the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1
and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few
songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore
<jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,
Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to
access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend
that
one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers
cannot
do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and
JAWS
or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail
<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>
for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest
stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely
true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and
up
-
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far
from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you
out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least
could
give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible
at
all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the
software
at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen
reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis
encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want,
give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the
high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage
of
a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you
might
be
able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do
what
you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen
readers,
do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all
provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from
30
to
60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your
third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader,
sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is
NOT
the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other
words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one
backup
screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help
the
tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can
describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never
tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer
menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can access
to
all
menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except
unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I
hadn't
ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's
anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the
problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem,
but
others

running the same operating system and similar overall
configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this
suggests
an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on
a
given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and old
DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed,
etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for
anything,
but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be
occasions
when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you."
Having
a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall








--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess



.




--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306
Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess
--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org



--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org





--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Andre Fisher
 

Where did you get this copy of Windows XP? Is it legal?

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
david,
i tested the demo version of jaws 11, 14 and 15 with nvda and the
result was crash and sometimes not responding nvda.
i took your advice and and recieve a message that i dont have narrator.
in the first time of installation of my windows, i tried openning
narrater via its shortcut and i did not have any voice.
i am sure that the narrator is not installed in my system.

On 12/6/16, David <trailerdavid@...> wrote:
What other screen reader have you tried to install and run, that caused
you trouble? Which version of that screen reader? When did you try it?


Give us some more facts, and maybe we can help you further, please.


David

On 12/6/2016 1:20 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
hi joseph.
yes, i use windows xp and i heard that .UIA is not supported on xp.
i did not change an important option for accessibility.


hi david.
my windows has problem and i dont know the reason.
but i should say that my windows has not narrator at all!
i tested this and and i am sure that i dont have narrator to test!
moreover, microsoft sam is not understandable for me and i cant
recognize what he says and what message does he read!
and also for me, i could not install another screen reader beside
nvda, because my system faces hangs, crashes and for me in my system,
screen readers are not compatible with each other.
you mentioned that having more than one screen reader does not cause
trouble, but for me it causes!


hi gene.
i tested many versions of potplayer and the result of testing all
versions, was crash of nvda since version 2015.4
so, its a regression in nvda 2015.4, because in 2015.3 i did not face
such problem.
yes. the current stable version of potplayer as you and quentin
mentioned, is 1.6.63856
but as i said i tried different versions and could not solve the issue
myself.
also, i did not change any settings in potplayer including: skins,
visual appearance, and its other settings.
vlc is not accessible for me, not has great quality and needs powerful
system.
i tried it and the result was only system resources consumption and
crashes of the program for me!
and the only satisfactory program for me is potplayer.
i found this in many month research, many program tested and going to
the many websites.
also, thanks so much for your link.
i joined this and repeated my problem.
the problem for me is only crashing of nvda, not potplayer!


hi quentin.
thanks extremely for your kindness.
i dont think that my problem is related to specific version of windows
and also specific version of potplayer.
i am sure there is one problem with nvda and potplayer which is
regression from nvda 2015.4 and later versions.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi jacob.
thanks so much for helping me.

can you please test many files with potplayer?
eventually for me nvda is not responding and i dont know how to solve
this problem.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi david and quentin.
i use xp and also i do all of my works with it.
i use internet, libreoffice, notepad, potplayer and one conversion
software.
i dont have the security programs because realy i dont trust them!

On 12/6/16, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
You're more of an expert on what works under XP than me Brian, that's
great
info!

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Brian's Mail list account <
bglists@...> wrote:

Well, as far as I am aware, the basic plan is to not break XP if it
is
at
all possible, but just occasionally this might not be possible as
the
windows code changes.
Indeed at the moment xp portable versions of even the next snapshots
are
very good. Try running portable copies of nvda on, say windows 10
and
you
will find lots of things that no longer work due to the security of
that
operating system not allowing access to parts of windows from a
portable
app.
the big problem at present for those using XP is the web browser.
Depending on your processor, 50 is the last version I can get to
work
on
xp
with intel processors, and 48 is the last one on xp with amd
processors.
This is due to the lack of sse2 instruction set support on the amd
chips.
Dropbox, no matter what Dropbox say, is working fine again on xp
intel
processors at version 15, though they do warn that this could
change
as
its officially not supported. AMD chips last working version of
Dropbox
is
13, and one has to disable updates by nefarious means to keep it
working
on
such hardware.

The hack to continue to get xp updates is still working for MSSE,
but
his
month no xp security updates came down. whether this means they have
blocked the loophole or just they have given up I cannot say.
I notice that Flash for IE8 is seemingly not being updated by Adobe,
but
seems to be working in Firefox 50 at the moment.
Adobe reader DC is not usable on XP and 11 is the last version.

I'm sure there are many other issues but that really depends on what
you
are doing.
Its gratifying to note that the hacked copy of Outlook express that
works
in 10 is still supported by nvda, and its only issue is that its
preview
pane has to be turned off or it will fall over sometimes.


Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David"
<trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:31 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and
thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?

Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year ago
-
where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP for
businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for the
validity
of the article, and do not know if I even bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to update
your
security software, you might still be able to use it offline for a
long
time yet. And if you only update the database of your security
software,
that software will keep rolling under XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those of
us
who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer flavor of
Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging around.
Personally,
I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have
software
that is needed for certain tasks, which would not impose a security
risk, but which cannot be run under newer Windows. That is, my XP
machine is not going online, but I still need a screen reader for
it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an
OS,
whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA apparently
continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave many of us
the
chance to continue using our older equipment, for tasks that
totally
well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where they
still
commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the upgrade of the OS,
and
basically there might not be too much more holes in XP, than in any
newer flavors of Windows. According to what I read, both Win8 and
10,
seem to have open holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever
reason are not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes
are
not in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you
and
the
Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which OS
you
are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:

Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be
honest
microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now and any
computer with it will have malware and be crappy to because
microsoft
says so and I really don't aggree with microsoft but its the way
it
is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history, soon
7
will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:

please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as
well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of
Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the
cause
of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the
same
one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab
around
the
main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there
are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I
could
play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close
when
I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems
fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had
2016.3
on
the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few
songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore
<jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,
Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend
that
one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers
cannot
do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and
JAWS
or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>
for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely
true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and
up
-
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far
from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you
out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least
could
give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible
at
all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the
software
at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen
reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis
encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want,
give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the
high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage
of
a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might
be
able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do
what
you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen
readers,
do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all
provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30
to
60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader,
sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT
the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other
words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup
screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help
the
tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can
describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never
tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer
menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can access
to
all
menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except
unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't
ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's
anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem,
but
others

running the same operating system and similar overall
configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this
suggests
an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a
given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed,
etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for
anything,
but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be
occasions
when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you."
Having
a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall








--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess



.




--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306
Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess
--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org



--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

 

david,
i tested the demo version of jaws 11, 14 and 15 with nvda and the
result was crash and sometimes not responding nvda.
i took your advice and and recieve a message that i dont have narrator.
in the first time of installation of my windows, i tried openning
narrater via its shortcut and i did not have any voice.
i am sure that the narrator is not installed in my system.

On 12/6/16, David <trailerdavid@...> wrote:
What other screen reader have you tried to install and run, that caused
you trouble? Which version of that screen reader? When did you try it?


Give us some more facts, and maybe we can help you further, please.


David

On 12/6/2016 1:20 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
hi joseph.
yes, i use windows xp and i heard that .UIA is not supported on xp.
i did not change an important option for accessibility.


hi david.
my windows has problem and i dont know the reason.
but i should say that my windows has not narrator at all!
i tested this and and i am sure that i dont have narrator to test!
moreover, microsoft sam is not understandable for me and i cant
recognize what he says and what message does he read!
and also for me, i could not install another screen reader beside
nvda, because my system faces hangs, crashes and for me in my system,
screen readers are not compatible with each other.
you mentioned that having more than one screen reader does not cause
trouble, but for me it causes!


hi gene.
i tested many versions of potplayer and the result of testing all
versions, was crash of nvda since version 2015.4
so, its a regression in nvda 2015.4, because in 2015.3 i did not face
such problem.
yes. the current stable version of potplayer as you and quentin
mentioned, is 1.6.63856
but as i said i tried different versions and could not solve the issue
myself.
also, i did not change any settings in potplayer including: skins,
visual appearance, and its other settings.
vlc is not accessible for me, not has great quality and needs powerful
system.
i tried it and the result was only system resources consumption and
crashes of the program for me!
and the only satisfactory program for me is potplayer.
i found this in many month research, many program tested and going to
the many websites.
also, thanks so much for your link.
i joined this and repeated my problem.
the problem for me is only crashing of nvda, not potplayer!


hi quentin.
thanks extremely for your kindness.
i dont think that my problem is related to specific version of windows
and also specific version of potplayer.
i am sure there is one problem with nvda and potplayer which is
regression from nvda 2015.4 and later versions.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi jacob.
thanks so much for helping me.

can you please test many files with potplayer?
eventually for me nvda is not responding and i dont know how to solve
this problem.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi david and quentin.
i use xp and also i do all of my works with it.
i use internet, libreoffice, notepad, potplayer and one conversion
software.
i dont have the security programs because realy i dont trust them!

On 12/6/16, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
You're more of an expert on what works under XP than me Brian, that's
great
info!

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Brian's Mail list account <
bglists@...> wrote:

Well, as far as I am aware, the basic plan is to not break XP if it
is
at
all possible, but just occasionally this might not be possible as the
windows code changes.
Indeed at the moment xp portable versions of even the next snapshots
are
very good. Try running portable copies of nvda on, say windows 10 and
you
will find lots of things that no longer work due to the security of
that
operating system not allowing access to parts of windows from a
portable
app.
the big problem at present for those using XP is the web browser.
Depending on your processor, 50 is the last version I can get to work
on
xp
with intel processors, and 48 is the last one on xp with amd
processors.
This is due to the lack of sse2 instruction set support on the amd
chips.
Dropbox, no matter what Dropbox say, is working fine again on xp
intel
processors at version 15, though they do warn that this could change
as
its officially not supported. AMD chips last working version of
Dropbox
is
13, and one has to disable updates by nefarious means to keep it
working
on
such hardware.

The hack to continue to get xp updates is still working for MSSE, but
his
month no xp security updates came down. whether this means they have
blocked the loophole or just they have given up I cannot say.
I notice that Flash for IE8 is seemingly not being updated by Adobe,
but
seems to be working in Firefox 50 at the moment.
Adobe reader DC is not usable on XP and 11 is the last version.

I'm sure there are many other issues but that really depends on what
you
are doing.
Its gratifying to note that the hacked copy of Outlook express that
works
in 10 is still supported by nvda, and its only issue is that its
preview
pane has to be turned off or it will fall over sometimes.


Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David" <trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:31 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and
thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?

Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year ago -
where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP for
businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for the
validity
of the article, and do not know if I even bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to update
your
security software, you might still be able to use it offline for a
long
time yet. And if you only update the database of your security
software,
that software will keep rolling under XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those of
us
who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer flavor of
Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging around.
Personally,
I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have
software
that is needed for certain tasks, which would not impose a security
risk, but which cannot be run under newer Windows. That is, my XP
machine is not going online, but I still need a screen reader for
it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an OS,
whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA apparently
continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave many of us the
chance to continue using our older equipment, for tasks that totally
well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where they
still
commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the upgrade of the OS,
and
basically there might not be too much more holes in XP, than in any
newer flavors of Windows. According to what I read, both Win8 and
10,
seem to have open holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever
reason are not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes
are
not in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you and
the
Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which OS
you
are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:

Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be
honest
microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now and any
computer with it will have malware and be crappy to because
microsoft
says so and I really don't aggree with microsoft but its the way it
is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history, soon 7
will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:

please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as
well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of
Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the cause
of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the
same
one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab
around
the
main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there
are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I
could
play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close when
I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems
fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had 2016.3
on
the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few
songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore
<jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,
Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend
that
one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers
cannot
do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and
JAWS
or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>
for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely
true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and up
-
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far
from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you
out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least could
give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible
at
all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the
software
at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen
reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis
encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want,
give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the
high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage
of
a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might
be
able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do what
you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen readers,
do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all
provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30
to
60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader,
sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT
the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other
words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup
screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help the
tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can
describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never
tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer
menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can access
to
all
menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except
unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't
ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's
anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem,
but
others

running the same operating system and similar overall
configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this suggests
an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a
given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed,
etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for
anything,
but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be occasions
when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you."
Having
a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall








--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess



.




--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306
Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess
--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org



--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org



--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: Is any release prior to the latest stable release, and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

David <trailerdavid@...>
 

What other screen reader have you tried to install and run, that caused
you trouble? Which version of that screen reader? When did you try it?


Give us some more facts, and maybe we can help you further, please.


David

On 12/6/2016 1:20 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
hi joseph.
yes, i use windows xp and i heard that .UIA is not supported on xp.
i did not change an important option for accessibility.


hi david.
my windows has problem and i dont know the reason.
but i should say that my windows has not narrator at all!
i tested this and and i am sure that i dont have narrator to test!
moreover, microsoft sam is not understandable for me and i cant
recognize what he says and what message does he read!
and also for me, i could not install another screen reader beside
nvda, because my system faces hangs, crashes and for me in my system,
screen readers are not compatible with each other.
you mentioned that having more than one screen reader does not cause
trouble, but for me it causes!


hi gene.
i tested many versions of potplayer and the result of testing all
versions, was crash of nvda since version 2015.4
so, its a regression in nvda 2015.4, because in 2015.3 i did not face
such problem.
yes. the current stable version of potplayer as you and quentin
mentioned, is 1.6.63856
but as i said i tried different versions and could not solve the issue myself.
also, i did not change any settings in potplayer including: skins,
visual appearance, and its other settings.
vlc is not accessible for me, not has great quality and needs powerful system.
i tried it and the result was only system resources consumption and
crashes of the program for me!
and the only satisfactory program for me is potplayer.
i found this in many month research, many program tested and going to
the many websites.
also, thanks so much for your link.
i joined this and repeated my problem.
the problem for me is only crashing of nvda, not potplayer!


hi quentin.
thanks extremely for your kindness.
i dont think that my problem is related to specific version of windows
and also specific version of potplayer.
i am sure there is one problem with nvda and potplayer which is
regression from nvda 2015.4 and later versions.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi jacob.
thanks so much for helping me.

can you please test many files with potplayer?
eventually for me nvda is not responding and i dont know how to solve
this problem.

On 12/6/16, nasrin khaksar <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
hi david and quentin.
i use xp and also i do all of my works with it.
i use internet, libreoffice, notepad, potplayer and one conversion
software.
i dont have the security programs because realy i dont trust them!

On 12/6/16, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
You're more of an expert on what works under XP than me Brian, that's
great
info!

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Brian's Mail list account <
bglists@...> wrote:

Well, as far as I am aware, the basic plan is to not break XP if it is
at
all possible, but just occasionally this might not be possible as the
windows code changes.
Indeed at the moment xp portable versions of even the next snapshots
are
very good. Try running portable copies of nvda on, say windows 10 and
you
will find lots of things that no longer work due to the security of
that
operating system not allowing access to parts of windows from a
portable
app.
the big problem at present for those using XP is the web browser.
Depending on your processor, 50 is the last version I can get to work
on
xp
with intel processors, and 48 is the last one on xp with amd
processors.
This is due to the lack of sse2 instruction set support on the amd
chips.
Dropbox, no matter what Dropbox say, is working fine again on xp intel
processors at version 15, though they do warn that this could change
as
its officially not supported. AMD chips last working version of Dropbox
is
13, and one has to disable updates by nefarious means to keep it
working
on
such hardware.

The hack to continue to get xp updates is still working for MSSE, but
his
month no xp security updates came down. whether this means they have
blocked the loophole or just they have given up I cannot say.
I notice that Flash for IE8 is seemingly not being updated by Adobe,
but
seems to be working in Firefox 50 at the moment.
Adobe reader DC is not usable on XP and 11 is the last version.

I'm sure there are many other issues but that really depends on what
you
are doing.
Its gratifying to note that the hacked copy of Outlook express that
works
in 10 is still supported by nvda, and its only issue is that its
preview
pane has to be turned off or it will fall over sometimes.


Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David" <trailerdavid@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2016 8:31 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable release,
and
thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


Is XP REALLY not being supported any longer?

Could be. But I did read an article - think it is about a year ago -
where it was stated that Microsoft continue to support XP for
businesses, of course not free of charge. Cannot speak for the
validity
of the article, and do not know if I even bookmarked it either.


A whole other thing to keep in mind, is this:

Do you have an XP machine, and only connect it to the net to update
your
security software, you might still be able to use it offline for a
long
time yet. And if you only update the database of your security
software,
that software will keep rolling under XP for who knows how long.


From what I can see, several users still use XP. Even for those of us
who happen to have made the step forward, to some newer flavor of
Windows, many of us still keep XP machines hanging around. Personally,
I
do join the ones who have an XP machine, simply because I have
software
that is needed for certain tasks, which would not impose a security
risk, but which cannot be run under newer Windows. That is, my XP
machine is not going online, but I still need a screen reader for it.
And, as the commercial screen readers tend to stop supporting an OS,
whenever Microsoft does, I am happy to learn that NVDA apparently
continues to run under XP. Hopefully, that will leave many of us the
chance to continue using our older equipment, for tasks that totally
well could be run on an offline, XP system.


Seemingly too, there will be many places in the world, where they
still
commonly use XP. Not everyone could afford the upgrade of the OS, and
basically there might not be too much more holes in XP, than in any
newer flavors of Windows. According to what I read, both Win8 and 10,
seem to have open holes. Some even are well known, but for whatever
reason are not being cared for. And many times, the biggest holes are
not in your OS itself, but more in the communication between you and
the
Internet. Such net related holes, might be independent on which OS you
are running.


Just some thoughts to keep in mind, when advicing.

David

On 12/6/2016 6:49 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:

Xp is dead, it will probably stay in core for a while but to be
honest
microsoft has deemed it unsupported so its crap os now and any
computer with it will have malware and be crappy to because microsoft
says so and I really don't aggree with microsoft but its the way it
is.
Xp like win98 and other good versions of windows is history, soon 7
will be then we will have to struggle with 10.



On 6/12/2016 3:10 p.m., Michael Capelle wrote:

please, do not get rid of xp support.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Quentin Christensen"
<quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2016 6:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease


That's true Gene. I had a thought in mind about Windows XP as well,
although when I looked back at Nasrin's original question re
Potplayer, it
was using Windows 7 - although there are multiple versions of
Windows
7 as
well (for the record, I have Windows 7 home premium, SP1 64 bit).

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

And, of course, you aren't testing with XP. That may be the cause
of
these problems.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
*Sent:* Monday, December 05, 2016 6:08 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease

Hi everyone,

I downloaded the version that Nasrin linked to, which was the same
one
Gene tried - version 1.6.6385619.7.

It doesn't have a traditional alt menu and you also can't tab
around
the
main screen to read the information which is displayed visually.
However,
you can get to the commands via the applications key, and there are
keystrokes for most things, once you know what they are.

I tried it on both Windows 10 and Windows 7, and found that I could
play
MP3 files with it, pause and play again, and alt+f4 to close when I
finished listening to a couple of songs, and everything seems fine?
I'm
using NVDA 2016.4rc1 Actually I just realised I still had 2016.3
on
the
Windows 7 machine so I've gone back and tried with 2016.4rc1 and
again, I
couldn't reproduce the crash, even after listening to a few songs.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:11 AM, David Moore
<jesusloves1966@...>
wrote:

Hi, That is true,
Narrator, in win10 anniversary update, has enabled me to access
controls
that I could not access with JAWS or NVDA. I highly recommend that
one
learn how to use Narrator, because it is getting more and more
powful in
win10, and can do a few things that high-end screen readers cannot
do.
Think that you have three screen readerrs, Narrator, NVDA, and
JAWS
or
Window eyes that you can use in demo mode.

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>
for
Windows 10



*From: *David <trailerdavid@...>
*Sent: *Monday, December 5, 2016 3:12 PM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Is any release prior to the latest stable
release,
and thenext RC release, officially supported? #NVDARelease



Just for your correction.





You said you do NOT have any other screen reader to test? I do

understand what you mean, but it is not fully and completely true.





ALL, and I mean ALL flavors of Windows - from at least XP and up -
holds

Microsoft's embedded screen reader, named NARRATOR. Though far
from

being a full-fledged screen reader, it many times can help you
out.
For

instance, due to its very basic functionality, it at least could
give

you some idea to what extend a piece of software is accessible at
all.

If NARRATOR cannot help you out, then chances are that the
software
at

the minimum requires some more advanced features of the screen
reader.





I do, and have don so in other settings, on a general basis
encourage

all: If your high-end screen reader cannot do what you want, give

Narrator a go. Then com back and report your findings.





Might sound a bit awkward at first glance. But sometimes the
high-end

screen readers might have settings, that complicates the usage of
a

software. Running Narrator, finding that things work, you might be
able

to start tracing why the high-end screen reader does not do what
you
expect.





Furthermore, most - if not all - of the high-end screen readers,
do
have

downloadable demo-versions. Might be an idea, to download and
install at

least one such demo, and use it for cases when you want to
determine if

NVDA is the bottleneck of your issue. Far as I know, they all
provide

you fully working products, with an up-time of anything from 30 to
60

minutes; Enough time to get an idea of whether your third-party
software

is workable or not.





In the older days, installing more than one screen reader,
sometimes

caused system trouble. To the best of my knowledge, such is NOT
the
case

any longer, and have not been for a decade or so. In other words,

encouraged are everyone, to go get yourself at least one backup
screen

reader, if nothing else go for a demo. It further might help the
tech

team of NVDA getting to the core of your problem, if you can
describe

what is taken place when running an alternative screen reader.





How do you know, if you prefer McDonald burgers, if you never
tasted

anything but Burger-King?





David







On 12/5/2016 5:22 PM, nasrin khaksar wrote:

gene.
thanks so much for helping me to test the program.
i dont have any screen reader except nvda to test.
me too, use windows xp service pack 3
you dont need to use nvda cursors to intract with potplayer
menus.
you should only press the application keys and you can access to
all
menus and options by normal arrow keys.
only nvda freezes and says nothing in the windows except
unknown.
i should restart nvda to work as normal.
On 12/5/16, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Well, this thread has taken an interesting turn that I hadn't
ever
anticipated (and, to quote Seinfeld, "not that there's anything
wrong
with

that.")
So I'll use this to get back on my soapbox about when anyone
encounters an

issue with any software or combination of software:
* if you cannot give steps necessary to replicate the problem
there's

virtually no hope that the problem can or will be solved
* if you can give steps necessary to replicate the problem, but
others

running the same operating system and similar overall
configuration
that you

are don't have it when they perform those steps, this suggests
an
idiosyncratic problem with your own system
I cannot count the number of times when I've spent hours on a
given
problem

only to find out that it was a weird interaction between two
programs
that

are installed, that a system has not been updated and old DLL
files >> are

being called that have errors that have long ago been fixed,
etc.
I'm not saying that anyone is directly "at fault" for anything,
but
these

are factors that you must consider and there will be occasions
when
"it's

just you" as well as many more when it's "not just you."
Having
a
detective's mindset is essential in instances such as this.
--
*Brian*
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is
complete.
If

you’re alive, it isn’t.*
~ Lauren Bacall








--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <%2B61%207%203149%203306>
Direct: +61 413 904 383 <+61%20413%20904%20383>
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess



.




--
Quentin Christensen
Training Material Developer
Basic Training for NVDA & Microsoft Word with NVDA E-Books now
available:
http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Ph +61 7 3149 3306
Direct: +61 413 904 383
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess
--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org



--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org