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Re: Using the physical mouse with NVDA on some inaccessible Internet controls
Well its a bit hit and miss.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
The feadback with the mouse is not much. Its only usefull for programs with quirky controls. But sadly, accessibility just like windows touchscreens is totally crap and in fact with the mouse on windows its almost non existant. Its good if you have a small window to review the screen and click certain buttons but its vertually a non use item. Its not reliable enough for me to even call it stable and has never been this way ever since I can remember. I in fact turn off mouse support generally as nvda tends to say extranious junk on mouse stuff if it is on or gets moved. And in fact bar the times I need this gaming mouse I have half a mind to remove the mouse entirely, disable my laptop internal touchpad and rely on the external board. I must admit I do use a mouse on systems not my own which may not or may have programs that need the mouse to work. The only reason I have used a mouse on here is to access some functions of my semi accessible applien convertion suite but once those were set it was fine to do whatever to get things to work.
On 15/03/2017 10:30 a.m., Gene wrote:
I've seen a small number of messages on using the physical mouse with NVDA but I've never seen this sort of question discussed. I was looking at the Drop Box site a few days ago and I found that files can't be deleted working with the web site using a screen-reader and the keyboard. This doesn't matter for those using the program but I'm curious about the implications for other inaccessible controls and on whether deletion can be done on the Drop box site.
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Re: Using the physical mouse with NVDA on some inaccessible Internet controls
Gene
I would think that I should be able to move to the
end of the file name in the Drop Box example, then route the cursor to the
review position, then use the Golden Cursor program to move a little to the
right. I tried that but I was unable to see anything related to deleting
when I clicked with the NVDA mouse command. Assuming that I was in the
right place, a menu or list of items may have come up in another part of
the screen or it may have been inaccessible.
I'm particularly curious about flash players where,
when you click on the embedded object, you can't get play to occur no matter
what you do after clicking. I suspect that something must be clicked on
somewhere else on the screen and I wonder if that thing is accessible with the
mouse when moving around. I haven't seen anything when moving with a
screen-reader after clicking the object..
this will become less a problem with the ongoing
adoption of HTML5 but it would be nice to know while the problem
exists.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Brian Vogel
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 5:26 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Using the physical mouse with NVDA on some
inaccessible Internet controls Gene, I cannot speak in any specific way to Dropbox since I do not use it, but I can speak to some general bits related to mouse use and/or the Golden Cursor add-on for actions non-accessible otherwise. If a given website presents things like a list of files consistently such that you know there will be white space that a sighted person would right click on and the display is in a tabular format then you can definitely try using the mouse once the PC cursor (mouse cursor) has been routed to the virtual cursor and pulling in the direction you need to go with a steady hand in that direction. The trick here is that there is no control for NVDA to read when you get to "the right spot" since that spot is blank. This is why I think that Golden Cursor is more helpful for situations such as this one where the respective "row" positions are consistent as are the "column" positions for the white space. If you set up the collection of pixel positions for any given screen, for example the maximum number of files that Dropbox will display on a single screen's worth of information, you can route your mouse pointer to the respective "white space" locations per file and then just right click with the mouse or mouse pad once the mouse pointer is known to be positioned where it needs to be. I generally have folks try using the mouse
as a "quick an dirty" review of what might be on a page but there is a lot of
potential for mouse use with NVDA's mouse tracking feature enabled.
Invisible controls, such as those you describe, are a real challenge and
I'm actually surprised that Dropbox does not implement them in such a way that a
screen reader user would land on a control that is announced but that is
completely invisible to a sighted person since they can be given the generic
instruction to "right click on the white space to the right of the file name".
I've been on certain sites that use non-visible links and controls
specifically for screen-reader users, but I can't pull up an example at the
moment. I don't find an uninformed hatred a "principled position" that I need to respect in any way. ~ Ellen Evans, soc.motss, 11/6/2004
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Re: [Off topic] Raspberry Pi and accessibility, where to start?
Arlene
Oh right on!
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of erik burggraaf
Sent: March-14-17 2:53 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] [Off topic] Raspberry Pi and accessibility, where to start?
The pi is a computer which is basically a circket board with a ram and processor about the size of a credit card. They're very cheep, and let you do some very specific things. You know, you can make a cloud server or a home automation server, or build your own electronic device with a custom chassey like an mp3 player or a telephone or something. They are pretty neet, and the hardware is getting serious. Best, Erik Sent with AquaMail for Android On March 14, 2017 5:24:31 PM "Arlene" <nedster66@...> wrote:
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Re: Using the physical mouse with NVDA on some inaccessible Internet controls
Gene, I cannot speak in any specific way to Dropbox since I do not use it, but I can speak to some general bits related to mouse use and/or the Golden Cursor add-on for actions non-accessible otherwise. If a given website presents things like a list of files consistently such that you know there will be white space that a sighted person would right click on and the display is in a tabular format then you can definitely try using the mouse once the PC cursor (mouse cursor) has been routed to the virtual cursor and pulling in the direction you need to go with a steady hand in that direction. The trick here is that there is no control for NVDA to read when you get to "the right spot" since that spot is blank. This is why I think that Golden Cursor is more helpful for situations such as this one where the respective "row" positions are consistent as are the "column" positions for the white space. If you set up the collection of pixel positions for any given screen, for example the maximum number of files that Dropbox will display on a single screen's worth of information, you can route your mouse pointer to the respective "white space" locations per file and then just right click with the mouse or mouse pad once the mouse pointer is known to be positioned where it needs to be. I generally have folks try using the mouse as a "quick an dirty" review of what might be on a page but there is a lot of potential for mouse use with NVDA's mouse tracking feature enabled. Invisible controls, such as those you describe, are a real challenge and I'm actually surprised that Dropbox does not implement them in such a way that a screen reader user would land on a control that is announced but that is completely invisible to a sighted person since they can be given the generic instruction to "right click on the white space to the right of the file name". I've been on certain sites that use non-visible links and controls specifically for screen-reader users, but I can't pull up an example at the moment. I don't find an uninformed hatred a "principled position" that I need to respect in any way. ~ Ellen Evans, soc.motss, 11/6/2004
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Re: [Off topic] Raspberry Pi and accessibility, where to start?
erik burggraaf <erik@...>
The pi is a computer which is basically a circket board with a ram and processor about the size of a credit card. They're very cheep, and let you do some very specific things. You know, you can make a cloud server or a home automation server, or build your own electronic device with a custom chassey like an mp3 player or a telephone or something. They are pretty neet, and the hardware is getting serious. Best, Erik Sent with AquaMail for Android On March 14, 2017 5:24:31 PM "Arlene" <nedster66@...> wrote:
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Re: Accessible Application Updater
Kevin Cussick
Hi, I got it but for some reason not in the order it should have been in. got it now loud and clear sorry.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 14/03/2017 14:04, Gene wrote:
Maybe you ddidn't receive my first message.
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Using the physical mouse with NVDA on some inaccessible Internet controls
Gene
I've seen a small number of messages on using the
physical mouse with NVDA but I've never seen this sort of question
discussed. I was looking at the Drop Box site a few days ago and I found
that files can't be deleted working with the web site using a screen-reader and
the keyboard. This doesn't matter for those using the program but I'm
curious about the implications for other inaccessible controls and on whether
deletion can be done on the Drop box site.
Accordingt to Drop Box help, you have to click the
empty space to the right of the file name and a list of options will come
up. I have no idea if a blind person can know when he/she is in the right
place to click using a mouse nor do I know whether the options that come up are
accessible using a screen-reader or a mouse.
I'm curious also about some flash embedded objects
that can't be worked with from the keyboard.
Thanks for any information.
I might buy a mouse and play around if it seems
more access can be gotten in some situations.
Gene
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Re: [Off topic] Raspberry Pi and accessibility, where to start?
Arlene
What is this?
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jacob Kruger
Sent: March-14-17 11:03 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] [Off topic] Raspberry Pi and accessibility, where to start?
raspberryVI group/mailing list: http://www.raspberryvi.org/stories/index.html
Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA "Resistance is futile, but, acceptance is versatile..." On 2017-03-14 19:52, mk360 wrote:
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Re: Is NVDA right for me?
Gene
Window-eyes isn't simpler than NVDA. I don't
know just what Narrator can do. for your purposes, I don't know if it's
any better or not. Narrator may be simpler but that doesn't mean it will
meet your needs. I'm not saying that NVDA or Narrator will meet your needs
or not. I'm saying that I don't think you are looking at options in the
right order. I would think that there are e-mail lists and/or Internet
forums where people who have dyslexia and other print disabilities can discuss
programs they use to read print and they may be able to discuss how best to read
whatever you want to read.
I'm not saying that you won't decide to look into
screen-readers after you try to get information about other means. I'm
saying that I think you are looking at options in the wrong order.
Screen-readers are intended for blind users and don't necessarily do things that
you want done or in the way you want them done.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Fantasy Sports
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 1:27 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Is NVDA right for me? navigate the computer. I think the answers have pretty much covered it, right now leaning towards something that might be simpler then NVDA. Might need to learn how to really fine tune Windows Narrator or learn more about Windows Eyes. Thanks for the help! -----Original Message----- >From: Pranav Lal <pranav.lal@...> >Sent: Mar 13, 2017 7:21 PM >To: nvda@nvda.groups.io >Subject: Re: [nvda] Is NVDA right for me? > >Hi, > >I have not seen all messages on this thread therefore what I ask may have already been covered. In what situation do you need to read text? If you are fatigued when reading long documents then a solution like text aloud may work better. If however, you need to navigate the computer by using speech, then NVDA is the way to go. > >Pranav > > > >
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Re: Is NVDA right for me?
john s
If you have Microsoft Office 2010 or later, you can get Window Eyes for free.
At 02:27 PM 3/14/2017, you wrote: Cannot read much text without getting ill, but don't need toJohn
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Re: Is NVDA right for me?
Fantasy Sports <fantasylife@...>
Cannot read much text without getting ill, but don't need to
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
navigate the computer. I think the answers have pretty much covered it, right now leaning towards something that might be simpler then NVDA. Might need to learn how to really fine tune Windows Narrator or learn more about Windows Eyes. Thanks for the help!
-----Original Message-----
From: Pranav Lal <pranav.lal@gmail.com>
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Re: Reading Comics and Graphic Novels Out Loud
Fantasy Sports <fantasylife@...>
My disability is only neurological, meaning that if I concentrate or read
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
text I get very sick and weak and get a lot of physical pain. I am able to see pictures, however, so I just need a program that could extract the text from the dialogue bubble. Not sure if an OCR program would do that to a comic book, does anyone know?
-----Original Message-----
From: Pranav Lal <pranav.lal@gmail.com>
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Re: [Off topic] Raspberry Pi and accessibility, where to start?
Jacob Kruger
raspberryVI group/mailing list: http://www.raspberryvi.org/stories/index.html
Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA "Resistance is futile, but, acceptance is versatile..." On 2017-03-14 19:52, mk360 wrote:
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[Off topic] Raspberry Pi and accessibility, where to start?
mk360
Hi, First of all, sorry for the off topic.
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Re: Unable to get to Embedded object when playing something in Google Chrome only
Dejan Ristic
We both agree. I can find embedded object, but not the buttons. I
use NVDA in English. It is only that I find the buttons in IE 11.
It was possible with Firefox too, but now it is not. On 3/14/2017 3:02 PM, Gene wrote:
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Re: Accessible Application Updater
Gene
Maybe you ddidn't receive my first
message.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 5:46 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Accessible Application Updater good egsample of not reading all mail first. but as said this has been resolved. but I did not see any mail to date saying to stop speaking about this. On 14/03/2017 00:54, Gene wrote: > I have no objection tothe original discussion continuing. > > When such personal disputes come up, will list members please make a > point of reading all their male before responding? And it would be a > good idea to wait a while to see if the thread is resolved before > commenting. In this case the dispute had been resolved before another > message was sent by a list member not originally in the dispute. It is > nnot appropriate for small disputes like this to become topics for > general discussion. > > Gene > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Christopher-Mark Gilland <mailto:clgilland07@...> > *Sent:* Monday, March 13, 2017 7:34 PM > *To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> > *Subject:* Re: [nvda] Accessible Application Updater > > Is it ok if we continue the thread as long as it is related to > specifically the updater software, and not regarding the comments that > were made, or would you rather it be closed period altogether. > > Please clarify. Either way, I'm ok with your decision. > > Chris. > >
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Re: Unable to get to Embedded object when playing something in Google Chrome only
Gene
I don't know if the language being used in NVDA or
in Windows settings has anything to do with the command. I use English and
the command is the letter b for move to next button. That should move you
to player buttons if HTML 5 is being used and if the buttons are
accessible. But from your last description, that in Chrome you can find
the embedded object by arrowing to it, that means that standard buttons aren't
being used. HTML5 usually uses standard buttons but, as you know, Flash
uses its own buttons.
IGene
----- Original Message -----
From: Dejan Ristic
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 6:42 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Unable to get to Embedded object when playing
something in Google Chrome only Hi Gene, Let me try to give you a reply to your question, although I'm not going to
promise that I shall be more certain at the moment. As for the buttons from the first link, I'm unable to see them in any of the
browsers, except Internet Explorer 11, currently installed on my
machine. How do I find the buttons? When I open the link in IE, I hit O to get me to the embedded object area.
Then, I hit space, and the buttons play and pause are before me. I was able to
do the same in Firefox before. As for Firefox, Chrome, and Opera now, I am able to do the following:
When I find the embedded object area, and when I press space on it, the only
thing I can do is switch to the focus mode, and turn the volume up and down by
using the up and down arrows. The same goes for the second link. On 3/14/2017 2:10 AM, Gene wrote:
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Re: accessible antivirus
Casey <cwollner@...>
Hi where can you get this Emsisoft Antimalware from?
Also is it free or is there A charge
for this program?
And how easy is it to set up and
install?
Well it work with Jaws 18 as
well?
Hi! I use Emsisoft Antimalware.
It's fast, scans for potentially unwanted programs (such as adware) in addition
to general malware like trojans and worms, and has, to my mind, the best
behavior analysis around, spotting backdoors from how they behave even if the
file itself is unknown, to provide just one example. This goes far beyond what
is usually referred to as detection by heuristics. Accessibility-wise most
things I need are in the tab order but I find myself resorting to flat review
sometimes.Greetings, Chris <chrismedley@...> schrieb am Mo., 13. März 2017
um 21:25 Uhr:
Casey
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Re: Unable to get to Embedded object when playing something in Google Chrome only
Dejan Ristic
Hi Gene,
Let me try to give you a reply to your question, although I'm not
going to promise that I shall be more certain at the moment.
As for the buttons from the first link, I'm unable to see them in
any of the browsers, except Internet Explorer 11, currently
installed on my machine.
How do I find the buttons?
When I open the link in IE, I hit O to get me to the embedded
object area. Then, I hit space, and the buttons play and pause are
before me. I was able to do the same in Firefox before.
As for Firefox, Chrome, and Opera now, I am able to do the
following:
When I find the embedded object area, and when I press space on
it, the only thing I can do is switch to the focus mode, and turn
the volume up and down by using the up and down arrows.
The same goes for the second link. On 3/14/2017 2:10 AM, Gene wrote:
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Re: accessible antivirus
Ron Canazzi
Hi Felix,
This does notsound like anti virus, but more like anti lamware. On 3/14/2017 4:52 AM, Felix G. wrote:
-- They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes. They ask: "How Happy are You?" I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"
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