Date   

Re: virtual review addon

Bill Dengler
 

Perhaps something (roughly) similar could be achieved by redesigning the OCR add-on to use a ui.BrowsableMessage? Sorry, unfamiliar with both adding…

Bill

On Jun 19, 2017, at 9:02 PM, Josh Kennedy <joshknnd1982@gmail.com> wrote:

hi could you take virtual review one step farther? could you combine it with the OCR addon to put OCR stuff in the virtual buffer, especially if you OCR a pdf? and if possible announce that objects are clickable by hitting enter?

thanks


Josh


--
sent with mozilla thunderbird




virtual review addon

Josh Kennedy
 

hi could you take virtual review one step farther? could you combine it with the OCR addon to put OCR stuff in the virtual buffer, especially if you OCR a pdf? and if possible announce that objects are clickable by hitting enter?

thanks


Josh


--
sent with mozilla thunderbird


Clarification: last night's remarks, teaching style

 

Dear NVDA community:

 

I have received several remarks offlist regarding my comment to Rosemarie last night in regards to asking her what she has learned through the Mail app problem. I’ll take full responsibility of my remarks and tone, as a practical step, I’ll refrain from posting to this list for the rest of the week (and if I have offended folks, my sincere apologies).

 

As for teaching style I tend to employ: perhaps my remark from last night came as a result of my approach to teaching, which calls for students to have willingness to think, or at least, learn to think critically by asking tough questions, have willingness to fail in hopes of learning important lessons, and learn from mistakes. Perhaps this came as a result of my communication studies and argumentation training, being a member of the competitive speech and debate squad, things I’ve observed on various forums where people just believe whatever leaders say, or something else. My overall intention for asking Rosemarie to tell me what she has learned was to get her to think critically about what she has gone through, not just get a problem fixed. If I say I’m satisfied with the resolution of a problem, then this means no future preparations and applications through careful thinking. I personally believe in a community where not only people offer solutions, but also a venue where members can think critically, and I do know from a decade’s worth of experience on various forums that I’m thinking of an ideal community. One thing I personally would like to see is folks teaching novices not only the beauty of NVDA through solutions, but also fostering a sense of taking ownership of a product and thinking about it; in other words, I think it would be best to prepare willing novices for a time in the future where novices themselves would become power users and teach folks not only NVDA, but also to think carefully. Also, personally, I do not want our NVDA community to just be called “a community of users and developers of NVDA” – one thing that sets our community apart from others is unity, and I think it would be beneficial in the long run to add another title: thinking individuals.

 

Thanks.

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: Issue with NVDA 2017.1, and Outlook 2016

Ralf Kefferpuetz
 

Hi Julia,

 

I’m now on NVDA 2017/2 but I didn’t have such problems tith Outlook 2016 and the 2017/1 version.

Whatever view I apply grouped by or not, NVDA just reads fine.

Is that for all folders or only for some? If only for some, try to reset the folder view and see if that helps.

 

Best regards,

  Ralf

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Julia Aguilar
Sent: Montag, 19. Juni 2017 21:48
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Issue with NVDA 2017.1, and Outlook 2016

 

Hi All,

I am working through an issue with NVDA 2017.1, and Outlook 2016.

When arrowing through a list of messages, NVDA does not read as I arrow past. Silence ensues, however, visually, I am able to use the up/down arrows as expected.

The pains, except folder pain, are turned off.

The fix is to set group by to received, and then I am able to read the message list as expected. NVDA, of course, is more verbose with this setting, as it reads the group by, date, from, subject, and date again.

 

Any other tips or suggestions much appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

 

 

 

Kind regards,

Julia Aguilar

Adaptive Technology Trainer

 

Blind Foundation

Te Tūāpapa o Te Hunga Kāpō

121 Adelaide Road, Newtown, Wellington 6021

 

PO Box 27177, Marion Square 6141

Wellington

P: 04 380 2131 Ext:2131

M: +64278082801

 

Email: jaguilar@...

Blindfoundation.org.nz

For adaptive technology assistance, contact the adaptive technology help desk on 0800 243333

 

Sign up for the Blind Foundation eNewsletter
Follow us on Facebook and Twitter

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Weather Plus add-on

Dan Beaver
 

HI,


I am wondering if the weather plus add-on could be modified to allow for getting update notices or not getting them.  I tend to leave software as is unless I start having issues with it.  NVDA itself is one piece of software I do keep up to date but would really appreciate not having to kill/respond to update notices for weather plus since it is working just fine at the version I have installed.


thanks.


Dan Beaver


Re: Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 


Well said.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 2:27 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

Hi,
Messages like the one below always cause me great concern when I encounter
them on lists such as this.
For the record I'd like to say the following in the interest of balance. I
like many others had my baptism by fire as it were emersion into Windows
necessitated by the death of my Windows 7 machine. And I would like to
proclaim that my experience while involving a slight learning curve as
moving to a new operating system version often does was relatively painless
and seamless. I took it upon myself to learn as much as I could about any
significant changes and I also composed a list of keystrokes that might have
changed and anything I might want to change for optimal screen reader usage
in the new environment to make my transition as easy as possible. the latter
was minimal in the case of Windows 10.
It is one thing to state something as an opinion such as I feel that or it's
been my experience that Windows 10 is unreliable; but to make a blanket
statement that it is so as though it is fact for all is at the very least
misleading and at its worst is blatantly erroneous.
I've been using Windows 10 for 18 or so months now and over all I've found
it to be quite stable in terms of performance.

I mean no disrespect and hope I've offended no one especially the moderators
by that which I've said. I just hate to think of someone holding back from
updating a current machine, purchasing a new machine or feeling like they
must completely abandon an operating system solely on the basis of opinions
as opposed to facts. If someone chooses to make a purchase based on that
which works best for them that's one thing I'd just hate for such to be
fueled by that which promotes fear as opposed to fostering enlightenment or
learning something new.
Respectfully,
Robin


-----Original Message-----
From: Pascal Lambert
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 9:55 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a
reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

I echo the same sentiment as Brian.  The Win10 anniversary already caused me
to buy another laptop I did not need as I was leaving on an overseas trip
and my laptop was totally messed up after the update.  I am honestly about
to switch to a Mac as the Win environment is not reliable.
Blessings
Pascal

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Austin
Pinto
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 4:02 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a
reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

oh! when you said explode i thought it would sound much worced but.
its a nice directive

On 6/19/17, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...> wrote:
> Joseph, though I do understand where you are coming from and the
> frustration
>
> you feel, I do honestly have sympathy with the end user who just wants
> a reliable system.
> Microsoft have to shoulder a good deal of the blame for what their
> changes cause. I'm not suggesting in any way that they are
> deliberately  screwing things up here, just that they  really do not
> test stuff enough. For people
>
> who do not use special builds of windows, ie insiders, or nvda. I do
> not think it unreasonable to expect continuity and after a while
> people do get fed up with having the rug pulled from under them on a
> regular basis by software makers, be that Microsoft or anyone else.
>  So yes, in a development environment you would be justified in being
> annoyed, but when people are trying to run their lives day to day and
> keep encountering stones in the road and potholes not of their own
> making  it is,
>
> I think understandable if people get fed up and take the easy option.
>  I have I know said much of this before, but like most of us, I have
> had to
>
> try to help people in real life away from this place and been almost
> embarrassed when you eventually track down the issue to the actual
> changes in the software and nothing to do with the end user, except
> that he or she happens to be blind.
>
> I'll shut up now and  be quiet, bite my lip etc for a while. I nearly
> bought
>
> a new laptop last week but after reading about all the win 10 issues
> decided
>
> not to bother.
>  Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22590@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 4:22 AM
> Subject: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a
> reason
>
> why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...
>
>
>> Dear NVDA community,
>>
>>
>>
>> Disclaimer: for new community members, I'm normally not like this,
>> but I do sometimes right posts I believe folks should hear, as it
>> impacts community experience and what not. So my sincere apologies
>> for letting you witness my explosive side. Please bear with me for a
>> second, as it is important that
>>
>> I
>> talk about the following regarding respecting engineers and announce
>> a directive for Windows 10 users:
>>
>>
>>
>> In the blindness community (at least for members of various mailing
>> lists that I'm a part of or lead), I became synonymous with someone
>> who is willing to show patience until the end, especially when
>> resolving tech support problems. But there is a hidden side to that:
>> for certain things, I become
>>
>> a
>> volcano, and those who've witnessed my lava flow knows what I mean.
>> Unfortunately, I believe it is time that I explode yet again (my
>> apologies to our dear leaders for doing something like this):
>>
>>
>>
>> Answering questions: for many situations, when resolving issues, when
>> I and other engineers ask you questions in hopes of getting to the
>> meat of the burger. Sometimes we may ask you to tell us steps to
>> reproduce the given problem, what a screen reader says, and what not.
>> When developers ask you questions, please do your best to answer them
>> if possible.
>>
>>
>>
>> For Windows 10 users: there is an important reason why I wrote
>> Windows 10 App Essentials: to prevent issues like the one Rosemarie
>> and others have experienced with Mail app. Hence the following directive:
>>
>>
>>
>> Until now, it was optional for you to use Windows 10 app Essentials
>> add-on if you are using Windows 10. I'll make this an important
>> requirement starting from fall 2017. That is, starting from September
>> 2017, when you report issues like the one Rosemarie has experienced,
>> I'll no longer ask you to install latest WinTenApps add-on: I'll
>> assume that you have. For Windows Insiders, this is a critical (and
>> mandatory) requirement.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm not announcing this directive just because I feel like doing it,
>> nor to increase popularity of my brainchild: Windows 10 App
>> Essentials add-on exists for important reasons:
>>
>>
>>
>> * Workarounds for issues encountered by NVDA users when using Windows
>> 10, including various UI Automation issues.
>> * Respond to changes in accessibility of various apps such as
>> removing workarounds put in place in past versions.
>> * Respond to app executable name changes (Microsoft has changed names
>> of at least three universal app executables).
>> * Provide essential features for Windows 10 users, including
>> suggestions announcement, emoji panel support (Fall Creators Update),
>> Edge notification announcements and others.
>> * To prove to Microsoft and third-party universal app developers that
>> accessibility should be a core design criteria for apps, including
>> letting screen reader users use apps to their full potential.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>


--
search for me on facebook, google+, orkut..
austinpinto.xaviers@...
follow me on twitter.
austinmpinto
contact me on skype.
austin.pinto3










Re: Introducing Virtual Review 2.1 #addonrelease

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

Aaho! Yeah! Nice! Work!
 
This is gonna be great!
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
 

----- Original Message -----
From: Joseph Lee
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 1:37 PM
Subject: [nvda] Introducing Virtual Review 2.1 #AddonRelease

Dear NVDA community:

 

Virtual Review 2.1 is ready for download. This add-on lets you review screen content on a browse mode window when you press Control+NVDA+W.

 

Virtual Review 2.1 is specifically designed for Windows 8.x and 10 users, mostly benefits Windows 10 users. In particular, you can now (are you ready for this?) review screen contents of universal apps via virtual review window. This version also lets you see the title of the window you are virtually reviewing.

 

The add-on page is at:

https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/virtualRevision.en.html

 

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 


As both a Windows, and a mac user, I have to totally disagree. The mac looks absolutely nothing like Windows, but that's just one user's opinion, and isn't an official fact, so keep that in mind.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
 

----- Original Message -----
From: Arlene
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 1:09 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

Hi, I can't say I don’t blame you for switching to Mac! I hear win ten is looking like Mac. Some say it looks like 7.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pascal Lambert
Sent: June-19-17 6:55 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

I echo the same sentiment as Brian.  The Win10 anniversary already caused me to buy another laptop I did not need as I was leaving on an overseas trip and my laptop was totally messed up after the update.  I am honestly about to switch to a Mac as the Win environment is not reliable.
Blessings
Pascal
  
-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Austin Pinto
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 4:02 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

oh! when you said explode i thought it would sound much worced but.
its a nice directive

On 6/19/17, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...> wrote:
> Joseph, though I do understand where you are coming from and the
> frustration
>
> you feel, I do honestly have sympathy with the end user who just wants
> a reliable system.
> Microsoft have to shoulder a good deal of the blame for what their
> changes cause. I'm not suggesting in any way that they are
> deliberately  screwing things up here, just that they  really do not
> test stuff enough. For people
>
> who do not use special builds of windows, ie insiders, or nvda. I do
> not think it unreasonable to expect continuity and after a while
> people do get fed up with having the rug pulled from under them on a
> regular basis by software makers, be that Microsoft or anyone else.
>  So yes, in a development environment you would be justified in being
> annoyed, but when people are trying to run their lives day to day and
> keep encountering stones in the road and potholes not of their own
> making  it is,
>
> I think understandable if people get fed up and take the easy option.
>  I have I know said much of this before, but like most of us, I have
> had to
>
> try to help people in real life away from this place and been almost
> embarrassed when you eventually track down the issue to the actual
> changes in the software and nothing to do with the end user, except
> that he or she happens to be blind.
>
> I'll shut up now and  be quiet, bite my lip etc for a while. I nearly
> bought
>
> a new laptop last week but after reading about all the win 10 issues
> decided
>
> not to bother.
>  Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22590@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 4:22 AM
> Subject: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a
> reason
>
> why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...
>
>
>> Dear NVDA community,
>>
>>
>>
>> Disclaimer: for new community members, I'm normally not like this,
>> but I do sometimes right posts I believe folks should hear, as it
>> impacts community experience and what not. So my sincere apologies
>> for letting you witness my explosive side. Please bear with me for a
>> second, as it is important that
>>
>> I
>> talk about the following regarding respecting engineers and announce
>> a directive for Windows 10 users:
>>
>>
>>
>> In the blindness community (at least for members of various mailing
>> lists that I'm a part of or lead), I became synonymous with someone
>> who is willing to show patience until the end, especially when
>> resolving tech support problems. But there is a hidden side to that:
>> for certain things, I become
>>
>> a
>> volcano, and those who've witnessed my lava flow knows what I mean.
>> Unfortunately, I believe it is time that I explode yet again (my
>> apologies to our dear leaders for doing something like this):
>>
>>
>>
>> Answering questions: for many situations, when resolving issues, when
>> I and other engineers ask you questions in hopes of getting to the
>> meat of the burger. Sometimes we may ask you to tell us steps to
>> reproduce the given problem, what a screen reader says, and what not.
>> When developers ask you questions, please do your best to answer them
>> if possible.
>>
>>
>>
>> For Windows 10 users: there is an important reason why I wrote
>> Windows 10 App Essentials: to prevent issues like the one Rosemarie
>> and others have experienced with Mail app. Hence the following directive:
>>
>>
>>
>> Until now, it was optional for you to use Windows 10 app Essentials
>> add-on if you are using Windows 10. I'll make this an important
>> requirement starting from fall 2017. That is, starting from September
>> 2017, when you report issues like the one Rosemarie has experienced,
>> I'll no longer ask you to install latest WinTenApps add-on: I'll
>> assume that you have. For Windows Insiders, this is a critical (and
>> mandatory) requirement.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm not announcing this directive just because I feel like doing it,
>> nor to increase popularity of my brainchild: Windows 10 App
>> Essentials add-on exists for important reasons:
>>
>>
>>
>> * Workarounds for issues encountered by NVDA users when using Windows
>> 10, including various UI Automation issues.
>> * Respond to changes in accessibility of various apps such as
>> removing workarounds put in place in past versions.
>> * Respond to app executable name changes (Microsoft has changed names
>> of at least three universal app executables).
>> * Provide essential features for Windows 10 users, including
>> suggestions announcement, emoji panel support (Fall Creators Update),
>> Edge notification announcements and others.
>> * To prove to Microsoft and third-party universal app developers that
>> accessibility should be a core design criteria for apps, including
>> letting screen reader users use apps to their full potential.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>


--
search for me on facebook, google+, orkut..
austinpinto.xaviers@...
follow me on twitter.
austinmpinto
contact me on skype.
austin.pinto3










Re: Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

I'm guessing it's technical reasons, but I'll let the author put in their two cents.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 7:46 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

I don't want to make anyone mad, but here goes.


If this Windows ten ap is so important to have, why isn't it somehow included with the core of NVDA rather than as a separate item that must be downloaded by the user?



On 6/18/2017 11:22 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Dear NVDA community,

 

Disclaimer: for new community members, I’m normally not like this, but I do sometimes right posts I believe folks should hear, as it impacts community experience and what not. So my sincere apologies for letting you witness my explosive side. Please bear with me for a second, as it is important that I talk about the following regarding respecting engineers and announce a directive for Windows 10 users:

 

In the blindness community (at least for members of various mailing lists that I’m a part of or lead), I became synonymous with someone who is willing to show patience until the end, especially when resolving tech support problems. But there is a hidden side to that: for certain things, I become a volcano, and those who’ve witnessed my lava flow knows what I mean. Unfortunately, I believe it is time that I explode yet again (my apologies to our dear leaders for doing something like this):

 

Answering questions: for many situations, when resolving issues, when I and other engineers ask you questions in hopes of getting to the meat of the burger. Sometimes we may ask you to tell us steps to reproduce the given problem, what a screen reader says, and what not. When developers ask you questions, please do your best to answer them if possible.

 

For Windows 10 users: there is an important reason why I wrote Windows 10 App Essentials: to prevent issues like the one Rosemarie and others have experienced with Mail app. Hence the following directive:

 

Until now, it was optional for you to use Windows 10 app Essentials add-on if you are using Windows 10. I’ll make this an important requirement starting from fall 2017. That is, starting from September 2017, when you report issues like the one Rosemarie has experienced, I’ll no longer ask you to install latest WinTenApps add-on: I’ll assume that you have. For Windows Insiders, this is a critical (and mandatory) requirement.

 

I’m not announcing this directive just because I feel like doing it, nor to increase popularity of my brainchild: Windows 10 App Essentials add-on exists for important reasons:

 

  • Workarounds for issues encountered by NVDA users when using Windows 10, including various UI Automation issues.
  • Respond to changes in accessibility of various apps such as removing workarounds put in place in past versions.
  • Respond to app executable name changes (Microsoft has changed names of at least three universal app executables).
  • Provide essential features for Windows 10 users, including suggestions announcement, emoji panel support (Fall Creators Update), Edge notification announcements and others.
  • To prove to Microsoft and third-party universal app developers that accessibility should be a core design criteria for apps, including letting screen reader users use apps to their full potential.

 

Thank you.

Cheers,

Joseph


--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

Likewise.
 
Please, guys, can we be respectful here?
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 3:40 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

Joseph, though I do understand where you are coming from and the frustration
you feel, I do honestly have sympathy with the end user who just wants a
reliable system.
Microsoft have to shoulder a good deal of the blame for what their changes
cause. I'm not suggesting in any way that they are deliberately  screwing
things up here, just that they  really do not test stuff enough. For people
who do not use special builds of windows, ie insiders, or nvda. I do not
think it unreasonable to expect continuity and after a while people do get
fed up with having the rug pulled from under them on a regular basis by
software makers, be that Microsoft or anyone else.
 So yes, in a development environment you would be justified in being
annoyed, but when people are trying to run their lives day to day and keep
encountering stones in the road and potholes not of their own making  it is,
I think understandable if people get fed up and take the easy option.
 I have I know said much of this before, but like most of us, I have had to
try to help people in real life away from this place and been almost
embarrassed when you eventually track down the issue to the actual changes
in the software and nothing to do with the end user, except that he or she
happens to be blind.

I'll shut up now and  be quiet, bite my lip etc for a while. I nearly bought
a new laptop last week but after reading about all the win 10 issues decided
not to bother.
 Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22590@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 4:22 AM
Subject: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason
why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...


> Dear NVDA community,
>
>
>
> Disclaimer: for new community members, I'm normally not like this, but I
> do
> sometimes right posts I believe folks should hear, as it impacts community
> experience and what not. So my sincere apologies for letting you witness
> my
> explosive side. Please bear with me for a second, as it is important that
> I
> talk about the following regarding respecting engineers and announce a
> directive for Windows 10 users:
>
>
>
> In the blindness community (at least for members of various mailing lists
> that I'm a part of or lead), I became synonymous with someone who is
> willing
> to show patience until the end, especially when resolving tech support
> problems. But there is a hidden side to that: for certain things, I become
> a
> volcano, and those who've witnessed my lava flow knows what I mean.
> Unfortunately, I believe it is time that I explode yet again (my apologies
> to our dear leaders for doing something like this):
>
>
>
> Answering questions: for many situations, when resolving issues, when I
> and
> other engineers ask you questions in hopes of getting to the meat of the
> burger. Sometimes we may ask you to tell us steps to reproduce the given
> problem, what a screen reader says, and what not. When developers ask you
> questions, please do your best to answer them if possible.
>
>
>
> For Windows 10 users: there is an important reason why I wrote Windows 10
> App Essentials: to prevent issues like the one Rosemarie and others have
> experienced with Mail app. Hence the following directive:
>
>
>
> Until now, it was optional for you to use Windows 10 app Essentials add-on
> if you are using Windows 10. I'll make this an important requirement
> starting from fall 2017. That is, starting from September 2017, when you
> report issues like the one Rosemarie has experienced, I'll no longer ask
> you
> to install latest WinTenApps add-on: I'll assume that you have. For
> Windows
> Insiders, this is a critical (and mandatory) requirement.
>
>
>
> I'm not announcing this directive just because I feel like doing it, nor
> to
> increase popularity of my brainchild: Windows 10 App Essentials add-on
> exists for important reasons:
>
>
>
> * Workarounds for issues encountered by NVDA users when using Windows
> 10, including various UI Automation issues.
> * Respond to changes in accessibility of various apps such as removing
> workarounds put in place in past versions.
> * Respond to app executable name changes (Microsoft has changed names
> of at least three universal app executables).
> * Provide essential features for Windows 10 users, including
> suggestions announcement, emoji panel support (Fall Creators Update), Edge
> notification announcements and others.
> * To prove to Microsoft and third-party universal app developers that
> accessibility should be a core design criteria for apps, including letting
> screen reader users use apps to their full potential.
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Joseph
>
>




Re: how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

Gene
 

As long as you only have one tab opened, alt f4 will close the program.  If you have more than one tab opened, alt f4 presents a message you have to respond to.  I don't use Edge but based on other comments, it is similar to the message Firefox presents asking you if you want to close all tabs.  You couldn't close the program with alt f4 because you didn't respond to the message, a message you will see and hear now that you are using the latest Windows 10 accessibility add on.  I don't remember its exact name.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 2:58 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

Hi, Chris,

 

Apparently it is. That could be why Microsoft will do away with IE sometime soon. Believe it or not, I was able to close edge with alt F-4 after reading the weather forcast for my area.

 

Rosemarie

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 12:53 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I, personally prefer IE, but, I've converted to Chrome, as I hear that even on an up to date system with all security patches, IE's quite insecure in very many respects.

 

Is that altogether true?

---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Gene

Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 3:20 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I think that Internet Explorer will be around for a year, perhaps two.  Accessibility is improving with Edge but I don't think Microsoft will stop security updates for Internet Explorer until accessibility with Edge is good.  Also, I question whether Edge will have any meaningful advantages over Firefox or Chrome.  Unless you are just curious and want to play with Edge, it is probably a much better idea to use one or both of these other browsers. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

 

Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 8:29 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi, Gene NZ,

 

Thanks very much for your help. I figure it's time I learned how to use edge because I don't know how soon internet explorer will be no more. The written tutorial did help a lot.

 

Thanks again for your help.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene New Zealand
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 6:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi

 

the following page might help you. It is the nvda tutorials for other programs page which is found at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net/nvda%20tutorials%20for%20other%20programs.html

When you are on it jump down by headings to the section that says about Microsoft edge, a page come off that and hopefully will help you with it.

 

Gene nz

 

 

On 6/19/2017 12:30 PM, Pascal Lambert wrote:

Hi,

While we are on the subject of Edge, how do you get to the menus?  How do you get to the favorits?

Many thanks

Blessings

Pascal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 7:48 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi,

Ah, you may have multiple tabs open. Try pressing Control+W repeatedly until Edge closes.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:41 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi, Roger,

 

I still can't close the browser. I can't even go to the file menu to close it. I'm heaqring a youtube videoon edge but want to get out of it! This is frustrating! What do I do now?

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:33 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I tried alt F-4 but it didn't work. I'll give it another try. Maybe I didn't close it correctly.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Stewart
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:26 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I've just played with it a bit, but was always able to close it with alt f4 just like any other program.

Roger








On 6/18/2017 6:20 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

Hi, everyone,

 

I decided to play with edge a little bit but I had trouble closing the browser. I had to go to the desktop and then shut down. There has to be a way to close it like you do other browsers.

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

--

Check out my website for NVDA tutorials and other blindness related material at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net Regardless of where you are in New Zealand if you are near one of the APNK sites you can use a copy of the NVDA screen reader on one of their computers. To find out which locations (or location) is near to you please visit http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries (Aotearoa People's Network Kaharoa). To find an NVDA certified expert near you, please visit the following link https://certification.nvaccess.org/. The certification page contains the official list of NVDA certified individuals from around the world, who have sat and successfully passed the NVDA expert exam.

 


Re: Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

Kevin Cussick
 

the one advantage as an addon is if there is a problem it can be fixed fast like the mail app.

On 19/06/2017 12:46, Ron Canazzi wrote:
I don't want to make anyone mad, but here goes.
If this Windows ten ap is so important to have, why isn't it somehow included with the core of NVDA rather than as a separate item that must be downloaded by the user?
On 6/18/2017 11:22 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Dear NVDA community,

Disclaimer: for new community members, I’m normally not like this, but I do sometimes right posts I believe folks should hear, as it impacts community experience and what not. So my sincere apologies for letting you witness my explosive side. Please bear with me for a second, as it is important that I talk about the following regarding respecting engineers and announce a directive for Windows 10 users:

In the blindness community (at least for members of various mailing lists that I’m a part of or lead), I became synonymous with someone who is willing to show patience until the end, especially when resolving tech support problems. But there is a hidden side to that: for certain things, I become a volcano, and those who’ve witnessed my lava flow knows what I mean. Unfortunately, I believe it is time that I explode yet again (my apologies to our dear leaders for doing something like this):

Answering questions: for many situations, when resolving issues, when I and other engineers ask you questions in hopes of getting to the meat of the burger. Sometimes we may ask you to tell us steps to reproduce the given problem, what a screen reader says, and what not. When developers ask you questions, please do your best to answer them if possible.

For Windows 10 users: there is an important reason why I wrote Windows 10 App Essentials: to prevent issues like the one Rosemarie and others have experienced with Mail app. Hence the following directive:

Until now, it was optional for you to use Windows 10 app Essentials add-on if you are using Windows 10. I’ll make this an important requirement starting from fall 2017. That is, starting from September 2017, when you report issues like the one Rosemarie has experienced, I’ll no longer ask you to install latest WinTenApps add-on: I’ll assume that you have. For Windows Insiders, this is a critical (and mandatory) requirement.

I’m not announcing this directive just because I feel like doing it, nor to increase popularity of my brainchild: Windows 10 App Essentials add-on exists for important reasons:

* Workarounds for issues encountered by NVDA users when using
Windows 10, including various UI Automation issues.
* Respond to changes in accessibility of various apps such as
removing workarounds put in place in past versions.
* Respond to app executable name changes (Microsoft has changed
names of at least three universal app executables).
* Provide essential features for Windows 10 users, including
suggestions announcement, emoji panel support (Fall Creators
Update), Edge notification announcements and others.
* To prove to Microsoft and third-party universal app developers
that accessibility should be a core design criteria for apps,
including letting screen reader users use apps to their full
potential.

Thank you.

Cheers,

Joseph
--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

There have been many many exploits of windows based on insecurities in internet explorer.  This is a problem on several levels, but not the least being that every version of IE has had multiple vulnerabilities.  It's been a serious problem for years, and apparently, Microsoft has finally decided enough is enough.  Don't know how much help it will be though, since my guess is that this edge browser is based on ie code anyhow, so we have yet to see just how secure this edge browser is going to be.  I don't follow security issues as a general rule anymore, but just for reference, I've not heard anything about any edge vulnerabilities, though I suppose a check with google could clear up that one for us if anyone were interested.



On 6/19/2017 3:58 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

Hi, Chris,

 

Apparently it is. That could be why Microsoft will do away with IE sometime soon. Believe it or not, I was able to close edge with alt F-4 after reading the weather forcast for my area.

 

Rosemarie

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 12:53 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I, personally prefer IE, but, I've converted to Chrome, as I hear that even on an up to date system with all security patches, IE's quite insecure in very many respects.

 

Is that altogether true?

---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Gene

Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 3:20 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I think that Internet Explorer will be around for a year, perhaps two.  Accessibility is improving with Edge but I don't think Microsoft will stop security updates for Internet Explorer until accessibility with Edge is good.  Also, I question whether Edge will have any meaningful advantages over Firefox or Chrome.  Unless you are just curious and want to play with Edge, it is probably a much better idea to use one or both of these other browsers. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

 

Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 8:29 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi, Gene NZ,

 

Thanks very much for your help. I figure it's time I learned how to use edge because I don't know how soon internet explorer will be no more. The written tutorial did help a lot.

 

Thanks again for your help.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene New Zealand
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 6:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi

 

the following page might help you. It is the nvda tutorials for other programs page which is found at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net/nvda%20tutorials%20for%20other%20programs.html

When you are on it jump down by headings to the section that says about Microsoft edge, a page come off that and hopefully will help you with it.

 

Gene nz

 

 

On 6/19/2017 12:30 PM, Pascal Lambert wrote:

Hi,

While we are on the subject of Edge, how do you get to the menus?  How do you get to the favorits?

Many thanks

Blessings

Pascal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 7:48 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi,

Ah, you may have multiple tabs open. Try pressing Control+W repeatedly until Edge closes.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:41 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi, Roger,

 

I still can't close the browser. I can't even go to the file menu to close it. I'm heaqring a youtube videoon edge but want to get out of it! This is frustrating! What do I do now?

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:33 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I tried alt F-4 but it didn't work. I'll give it another try. Maybe I didn't close it correctly.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Stewart
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:26 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I've just played with it a bit, but was always able to close it with alt f4 just like any other program.

Roger








On 6/18/2017 6:20 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

Hi, everyone,

 

I decided to play with edge a little bit but I had trouble closing the browser. I had to go to the desktop and then shut down. There has to be a way to close it like you do other browsers.

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

--

Check out my website for NVDA tutorials and other blindness related material at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net Regardless of where you are in New Zealand if you are near one of the APNK sites you can use a copy of the NVDA screen reader on one of their computers. To find out which locations (or location) is near to you please visit http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries (Aotearoa People's Network Kaharoa). To find an NVDA certified expert near you, please visit the following link https://certification.nvaccess.org/. The certification page contains the official list of NVDA certified individuals from around the world, who have sat and successfully passed the NVDA expert exam.

 



Virus-free. www.avast.com


Issue with NVDA 2017.1, and Outlook 2016

Julia Aguilar <jaguilar@...>
 

Hi All,

I am working through an issue with NVDA 2017.1, and Outlook 2016.

When arrowing through a list of messages, NVDA does not read as I arrow past. Silence ensues, however, visually, I am able to use the up/down arrows as expected.

The pains, except folder pain, are turned off.

The fix is to set group by to received, and then I am able to read the message list as expected. NVDA, of course, is more verbose with this setting, as it reads the group by, date, from, subject, and date again.

 

Any other tips or suggestions much appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

 

 

 

Kind regards,

Julia Aguilar

Adaptive Technology Trainer

 

Blind Foundation

Te Tūāpapa o Te Hunga Kāpō

121 Adelaide Road, Newtown, Wellington 6021

 

PO Box 27177, Marion Square 6141

Wellington

P: 04 380 2131 Ext:2131

M: +64278082801

 

Email: jaguilar@...

Blindfoundation.org.nz

For adaptive technology assistance, contact the adaptive technology help desk on 0800 243333

 

Sign up for the Blind Foundation eNewsletter
Follow us on Facebook and Twitter

#############################################################################
This email, including any attachments, is intended solely for the addressee(s)
It is confidential and may be legally privileged. 
If you are not the intended recipient, you must not copy, disclose, distribute
or otherwise use it or the information in it. Please notify the sender at once
and delete it from your system immediately. 
Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not
necessarily represent those of the Blind Foundation.
The Blind Foundation does not accept responsibility for any viruses or other
malicious code that may be transmitted with this email.
#############################################################################

 


Re: Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

Gene
 

I evidently respondedd to a message that didn't include the comments I was responding to.  As far as I know, it was in this thread that someone said that their Windows 10 has worked well and that they object to the characterizations of some users that it doesn't in general.  I'm not completely paraphrasing the message correctly, I evidently no longer have it but that gives readers following the thread enough information to know what message I was commenting on.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 2:30 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

This message is long; you may want to read it now or when you have more time, if you are busy now.
 
You have stated how you found Windows on one machine.  It isn't a fact in general.  it is a fact regarding your personal experience.  It is my impression that a lot of people have found Windows 10 to be reliable.  But, in the case of blind users, many continually have problems with Microsoft making changes to universal apps that degrades accessibility in those apps.  Do you use universal apps such as the mail app or do you use Windows 10 to run traditional programs? 
 
Just yesterday, on the NVDA users list, there was discussion of how the e-mail app had serious problems after Microsoft updated it in terms of accessibility.  the problems could be corrected by using the latest version of the add on for NVDA that is released by NVDA, largely to deal with the unending problems Microsoft causes by not testing its apps properly for accessibility.  I believe it was on this list yesterday or the day before that I asked about Microsoft testing its universal apps.  An NVDA developer said that Microsoft tests them using Narrator.  That's not anything remotely resembling proper testing. 
 
My point is that your experience is very conditional.  If you had driver problems and forced driver updates kept undoing the changes you made to cause your system to work properly, you wouldn't have as good an experience as you report.  If you used universal apps, your experience would be a cat and mouse game depending on how well and how quickly your screen-reader delt with the changes Microsoft made to these apps after releasing them with completely inadequate testing.  And there is a basic principle that a machine owner has the right to control what is done to his/her machine.  Microsoft, in not allowing updates to be controled as in previous versions of Windows is, in effect, asserting the right to control your, not their, machine.  They license Windows to you, they don't license your machine to you.
 
Microsoft gave Windows 10 away for free to meet their financial goals to monitize Windows, not the users best interests.  I am very glad that I didn't fall for Microsoft's snake oil.  My Windows 7 machine works well and I can do everything I want to with it.  I control my machine, not Microsoft.  I will not upgrade my well working, reliable Windows 7 machine to Windows 10.  When I buy a new computer, it will have Windows 10 on it.  I won't upgrade to Windows 10 just because Microsoft does everything it can to entice me to do so for their advantage, not mine. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Monday, June 19, 2017 9:55 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a
reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

I echo the same sentiment as Brian.  The Win10 anniversary already caused me
to buy another laptop I did not need as I was leaving on an overseas trip
and my laptop was totally messed up after the update.  I am honestly about
to switch to a Mac as the Win environment is not reliable.
Blessings
Pascal

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Austin
Pinto
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 4:02 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a
reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

oh! when you said explode i thought it would sound much worced but.
its a nice directive

On 6/19/17, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...> wrote:
> Joseph, though I do understand where you are coming from and the
> frustration
>
> you feel, I do honestly have sympathy with the end user who just wants
> a reliable system.
> Microsoft have to shoulder a good deal of the blame for what their
> changes cause. I'm not suggesting in any way that they are
> deliberately  screwing things up here, just that they  really do not
> test stuff enough. For people
>
> who do not use special builds of windows, ie insiders, or nvda. I do
> not think it unreasonable to expect continuity and after a while
> people do get fed up with having the rug pulled from under them on a
> regular basis by software makers, be that Microsoft or anyone else.
>  So yes, in a development environment you would be justified in being
> annoyed, but when people are trying to run their lives day to day and
> keep encountering stones in the road and potholes not of their own
> making  it is,
>
> I think understandable if people get fed up and take the easy option.
>  I have I know said much of this before, but like most of us, I have
> had to
>
> try to help people in real life away from this place and been almost
> embarrassed when you eventually track down the issue to the actual
> changes in the software and nothing to do with the end user, except
> that he or she happens to be blind.
>
> I'll shut up now and  be quiet, bite my lip etc for a while. I nearly
> bought
>
> a new laptop last week but after reading about all the win 10 issues
> decided
>
> not to bother.
>  Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22590@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 4:22 AM
> Subject: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a
> reason
>
> why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...
>
>
>> Dear NVDA community,
>>
>>
>>
>> Disclaimer: for new community members, I'm normally not like this,
>> but I do sometimes right posts I believe folks should hear, as it
>> impacts community experience and what not. So my sincere apologies
>> for letting you witness my explosive side. Please bear with me for a
>> second, as it is important that
>>
>> I
>> talk about the following regarding respecting engineers and announce
>> a directive for Windows 10 users:
>>
>>
>>
>> In the blindness community (at least for members of various mailing
>> lists that I'm a part of or lead), I became synonymous with someone
>> who is willing to show patience until the end, especially when
>> resolving tech support problems. But there is a hidden side to that:
>> for certain things, I become
>>
>> a
>> volcano, and those who've witnessed my lava flow knows what I mean.
>> Unfortunately, I believe it is time that I explode yet again (my
>> apologies to our dear leaders for doing something like this):
>>
>>
>>
>> Answering questions: for many situations, when resolving issues, when
>> I and other engineers ask you questions in hopes of getting to the
>> meat of the burger. Sometimes we may ask you to tell us steps to
>> reproduce the given problem, what a screen reader says, and what not.
>> When developers ask you questions, please do your best to answer them
>> if possible.
>>
>>
>>
>> For Windows 10 users: there is an important reason why I wrote
>> Windows 10 App Essentials: to prevent issues like the one Rosemarie
>> and others have experienced with Mail app. Hence the following directive:
>>
>>
>>
>> Until now, it was optional for you to use Windows 10 app Essentials
>> add-on if you are using Windows 10. I'll make this an important
>> requirement starting from fall 2017. That is, starting from September
>> 2017, when you report issues like the one Rosemarie has experienced,
>> I'll no longer ask you to install latest WinTenApps add-on: I'll
>> assume that you have. For Windows Insiders, this is a critical (and
>> mandatory) requirement.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm not announcing this directive just because I feel like doing it,
>> nor to increase popularity of my brainchild: Windows 10 App
>> Essentials add-on exists for important reasons:
>>
>>
>>
>> * Workarounds for issues encountered by NVDA users when using Windows
>> 10, including various UI Automation issues.
>> * Respond to changes in accessibility of various apps such as
>> removing workarounds put in place in past versions.
>> * Respond to app executable name changes (Microsoft has changed names
>> of at least three universal app executables).
>> * Provide essential features for Windows 10 users, including
>> suggestions announcement, emoji panel support (Fall Creators Update),
>> Edge notification announcements and others.
>> * To prove to Microsoft and third-party universal app developers that
>> accessibility should be a core design criteria for apps, including
>> letting screen reader users use apps to their full potential.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>


--
search for me on facebook, google+, orkut..
austinpinto.xaviers@...
follow me on twitter.
austinmpinto
contact me on skype.
austin.pinto3










Re: how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Hi, Chris,

 

Apparently it is. That could be why Microsoft will do away with IE sometime soon. Believe it or not, I was able to close edge with alt F-4 after reading the weather forcast for my area.

 

Rosemarie

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 12:53 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I, personally prefer IE, but, I've converted to Chrome, as I hear that even on an up to date system with all security patches, IE's quite insecure in very many respects.

 

Is that altogether true?

---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Gene

Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 3:20 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I think that Internet Explorer will be around for a year, perhaps two.  Accessibility is improving with Edge but I don't think Microsoft will stop security updates for Internet Explorer until accessibility with Edge is good.  Also, I question whether Edge will have any meaningful advantages over Firefox or Chrome.  Unless you are just curious and want to play with Edge, it is probably a much better idea to use one or both of these other browsers. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

 

Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 8:29 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi, Gene NZ,

 

Thanks very much for your help. I figure it's time I learned how to use edge because I don't know how soon internet explorer will be no more. The written tutorial did help a lot.

 

Thanks again for your help.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene New Zealand
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 6:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi

 

the following page might help you. It is the nvda tutorials for other programs page which is found at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net/nvda%20tutorials%20for%20other%20programs.html

When you are on it jump down by headings to the section that says about Microsoft edge, a page come off that and hopefully will help you with it.

 

Gene nz

 

 

On 6/19/2017 12:30 PM, Pascal Lambert wrote:

Hi,

While we are on the subject of Edge, how do you get to the menus?  How do you get to the favorits?

Many thanks

Blessings

Pascal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 7:48 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi,

Ah, you may have multiple tabs open. Try pressing Control+W repeatedly until Edge closes.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:41 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi, Roger,

 

I still can't close the browser. I can't even go to the file menu to close it. I'm heaqring a youtube videoon edge but want to get out of it! This is frustrating! What do I do now?

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:33 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I tried alt F-4 but it didn't work. I'll give it another try. Maybe I didn't close it correctly.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Stewart
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:26 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I've just played with it a bit, but was always able to close it with alt f4 just like any other program.

Roger








On 6/18/2017 6:20 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

Hi, everyone,

 

I decided to play with edge a little bit but I had trouble closing the browser. I had to go to the desktop and then shut down. There has to be a way to close it like you do other browsers.

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

--

Check out my website for NVDA tutorials and other blindness related material at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net Regardless of where you are in New Zealand if you are near one of the APNK sites you can use a copy of the NVDA screen reader on one of their computers. To find out which locations (or location) is near to you please visit http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries (Aotearoa People's Network Kaharoa). To find an NVDA certified expert near you, please visit the following link https://certification.nvaccess.org/. The certification page contains the official list of NVDA certified individuals from around the world, who have sat and successfully passed the NVDA expert exam.

 


Re: how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

I, personally prefer IE, but, I've converted to Chrome, as I hear that even on an up to date system with all security patches, IE's quite insecure in very many respects.
 
Is that altogether true?
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
 

----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 3:20 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

I think that Internet Explorer will be around for a year, perhaps two.  Accessibility is improving with Edge but I don't think Microsoft will stop security updates for Internet Explorer until accessibility with Edge is good.  Also, I question whether Edge will have any meaningful advantages over Firefox or Chrome.  Unless you are just curious and want to play with Edge, it is probably a much better idea to use one or both of these other browsers. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----

Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 8:29 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

Hi, Gene NZ,

 

Thanks very much for your help. I figure it's time I learned how to use edge because I don't know how soon internet explorer will be no more. The written tutorial did help a lot.

 

Thanks again for your help.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene New Zealand
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 6:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi

 

the following page might help you. It is the nvda tutorials for other programs page which is found at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net/nvda%20tutorials%20for%20other%20programs.html

When you are on it jump down by headings to the section that says about Microsoft edge, a page come off that and hopefully will help you with it.

 

Gene nz

 

 

On 6/19/2017 12:30 PM, Pascal Lambert wrote:

Hi,

While we are on the subject of Edge, how do you get to the menus?  How do you get to the favorits?

Many thanks

Blessings

Pascal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 7:48 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi,

Ah, you may have multiple tabs open. Try pressing Control+W repeatedly until Edge closes.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:41 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi, Roger,

 

I still can't close the browser. I can't even go to the file menu to close it. I'm heaqring a youtube videoon edge but want to get out of it! This is frustrating! What do I do now?

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:33 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I tried alt F-4 but it didn't work. I'll give it another try. Maybe I didn't close it correctly.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Stewart
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:26 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I've just played with it a bit, but was always able to close it with alt f4 just like any other program.

Roger








On 6/18/2017 6:20 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

Hi, everyone,

 

I decided to play with edge a little bit but I had trouble closing the browser. I had to go to the desktop and then shut down. There has to be a way to close it like you do other browsers.

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

--

Check out my website for NVDA tutorials and other blindness related material at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net Regardless of where you are in New Zealand if you are near one of the APNK sites you can use a copy of the NVDA screen reader on one of their computers. To find out which locations (or location) is near to you please visit http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries (Aotearoa People's Network Kaharoa). To find an NVDA certified expert near you, please visit the following link https://certification.nvaccess.org/. The certification page contains the official list of NVDA certified individuals from around the world, who have sat and successfully passed the NVDA expert exam.


Re: how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

Yeah, I really need to get someone into my HP's bios as mine is that way, and I can't see a way to toggle it. Not even temporarily until rebooting, which really agrevates the dickens out of me!
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 3:15 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

Yes me too. Of course some people have issues due to the function keys being
remapped on laptops from new. Best course is to get a sighted person in and
sort that out as the first job.
 However even if you do have to use f/n and alt/f4, it still works on Edge
unless its crashed. I don't  particularly like Edge, yet another microsoft
bit of bloatware.
 Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roger Stewart" <paganus2@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 12:26 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?


> I've just played with it a bit, but was always able to close it with alt
> f4 just like any other program.
>
> Roger
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 6/18/2017 6:20 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:
>>
>> Hi, everyone,
>>
>> I decided to play with edge a little bit but I had trouble closing the
>> browser. I had to go to the desktop and then shut down. There has to
>> be a way to close it like you do other browsers.
>>
>> Thanks for your help in advance.
>>
>> Rosemarie
>>
>>
>
>
>




Re: how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 


Oh, and being she wasn't totally up to date last night, she didn't hear it.
 
Aa! That makes sense.
 
Thanks for the explaination.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
 

----- Original Message -----
From: Joseph Lee
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 1:31 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

Hi,

Not exactly, as the content of the dialog in question isn’t announced by NVDA by default (at least for default installations; this is fixed with the WinTenApsp add-on).

Cheers,

Joseph

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 10:15 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Wouldn't she have seen that however as a dialog, then been able to take action on it? Or, does it ask that in a toast, where she might not have known it was asking this question.

 

I'm not trying to be snarky here. I'm only trying to better understand.

---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Joseph Lee

Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 1:12 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi,

The true reason why Alt+F4 didn’t work here is because Edge has opened multiple tabs at once. If this happens, when one presses Alt+F4, one would be asked to close all tabs.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 10:11 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

OK, yeah, so that isn't the issue with the FN key.

 

Hmm. Now, you've really got me stumped! I'll think about it, and let you know if I come up with anything.

---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

 

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 12:52 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hi, Chris,

 

Yes, alt F-4 normally works for me in other programs.

 

Rosemarie

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 9:46 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Depends on the system. F4 might be getting intercepted as something like screen brightness or the like… Something dealing with hardware, not software. That’s why I said if you have an FN key, try holding that down. Does alt+F4 normally work in other applications for you? If so, then my suggestion won’t be correct.

 

Chris.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 12:13 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Hmm. Didn’t think of that. Does this work on a desktop or just a laptop? I have a desktop.

 

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 7:46 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

Try alt+FN+F4. Your F4 key might be getting intercepted as a hardware key and not a software key. I've had that happen on occasions with certain systems.

---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries

 

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 7:33 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I tried alt F-4 but it didn't work. I'll give it another try. Maybe I didn't close it correctly.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Stewart
Sent: Sunday, June 18, 2017 4:26 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] how do you close the microsoft edge browser?

 

I've just played with it a bit, but was always able to close it with alt f4 just like any other program.

Roger








On 6/18/2017 6:20 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

Hi, everyone,

 

I decided to play with edge a little bit but I had trouble closing the browser. I had to go to the desktop and then shut down. There has to be a way to close it like you do other browsers.

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 


Re: Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

Gene
 

This message is long; you may want to read it now or when you have more time, if you are busy now.
 
You have stated how you found Windows on one machine.  It isn't a fact in general.  it is a fact regarding your personal experience.  It is my impression that a lot of people have found Windows 10 to be reliable.  But, in the case of blind users, many continually have problems with Microsoft making changes to universal apps that degrades accessibility in those apps.  Do you use universal apps such as the mail app or do you use Windows 10 to run traditional programs? 
 
Just yesterday, on the NVDA users list, there was discussion of how the e-mail app had serious problems after Microsoft updated it in terms of accessibility.  the problems could be corrected by using the latest version of the add on for NVDA that is released by NVDA, largely to deal with the unending problems Microsoft causes by not testing its apps properly for accessibility.  I believe it was on this list yesterday or the day before that I asked about Microsoft testing its universal apps.  An NVDA developer said that Microsoft tests them using Narrator.  That's not anything remotely resembling proper testing. 
 
My point is that your experience is very conditional.  If you had driver problems and forced driver updates kept undoing the changes you made to cause your system to work properly, you wouldn't have as good an experience as you report.  If you used universal apps, your experience would be a cat and mouse game depending on how well and how quickly your screen-reader delt with the changes Microsoft made to these apps after releasing them with completely inadequate testing.  And there is a basic principle that a machine owner has the right to control what is done to his/her machine.  Microsoft, in not allowing updates to be controled as in previous versions of Windows is, in effect, asserting the right to control your, not their, machine.  They license Windows to you, they don't license your machine to you.
 
Microsoft gave Windows 10 away for free to meet their financial goals to monitize Windows, not the users best interests.  I am very glad that I didn't fall for Microsoft's snake oil.  My Windows 7 machine works well and I can do everything I want to with it.  I control my machine, not Microsoft.  I will not upgrade my well working, reliable Windows 7 machine to Windows 10.  When I buy a new computer, it will have Windows 10 on it.  I won't upgrade to Windows 10 just because Microsoft does everything it can to entice me to do so for their advantage, not mine. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Monday, June 19, 2017 9:55 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a
reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

I echo the same sentiment as Brian.  The Win10 anniversary already caused me
to buy another laptop I did not need as I was leaving on an overseas trip
and my laptop was totally messed up after the update.  I am honestly about
to switch to a Mac as the Win environment is not reliable.
Blessings
Pascal

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Austin
Pinto
Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 4:02 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a
reason why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...

oh! when you said explode i thought it would sound much worced but.
its a nice directive

On 6/19/17, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...> wrote:
> Joseph, though I do understand where you are coming from and the
> frustration
>
> you feel, I do honestly have sympathy with the end user who just wants
> a reliable system.
> Microsoft have to shoulder a good deal of the blame for what their
> changes cause. I'm not suggesting in any way that they are
> deliberately  screwing things up here, just that they  really do not
> test stuff enough. For people
>
> who do not use special builds of windows, ie insiders, or nvda. I do
> not think it unreasonable to expect continuity and after a while
> people do get fed up with having the rug pulled from under them on a
> regular basis by software makers, be that Microsoft or anyone else.
>  So yes, in a development environment you would be justified in being
> annoyed, but when people are trying to run their lives day to day and
> keep encountering stones in the road and potholes not of their own
> making  it is,
>
> I think understandable if people get fed up and take the easy option.
>  I have I know said much of this before, but like most of us, I have
> had to
>
> try to help people in real life away from this place and been almost
> embarrassed when you eventually track down the issue to the actual
> changes in the software and nothing to do with the end user, except
> that he or she happens to be blind.
>
> I'll shut up now and  be quiet, bite my lip etc for a while. I nearly
> bought
>
> a new laptop last week but after reading about all the win 10 issues
> decided
>
> not to bother.
>  Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22590@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Monday, June 19, 2017 4:22 AM
> Subject: [nvda] Important directive for Windows 10 users: there is a
> reason
>
> why Windows 10 App Essentials add-on is out there...
>
>
>> Dear NVDA community,
>>
>>
>>
>> Disclaimer: for new community members, I'm normally not like this,
>> but I do sometimes right posts I believe folks should hear, as it
>> impacts community experience and what not. So my sincere apologies
>> for letting you witness my explosive side. Please bear with me for a
>> second, as it is important that
>>
>> I
>> talk about the following regarding respecting engineers and announce
>> a directive for Windows 10 users:
>>
>>
>>
>> In the blindness community (at least for members of various mailing
>> lists that I'm a part of or lead), I became synonymous with someone
>> who is willing to show patience until the end, especially when
>> resolving tech support problems. But there is a hidden side to that:
>> for certain things, I become
>>
>> a
>> volcano, and those who've witnessed my lava flow knows what I mean.
>> Unfortunately, I believe it is time that I explode yet again (my
>> apologies to our dear leaders for doing something like this):
>>
>>
>>
>> Answering questions: for many situations, when resolving issues, when
>> I and other engineers ask you questions in hopes of getting to the
>> meat of the burger. Sometimes we may ask you to tell us steps to
>> reproduce the given problem, what a screen reader says, and what not.
>> When developers ask you questions, please do your best to answer them
>> if possible.
>>
>>
>>
>> For Windows 10 users: there is an important reason why I wrote
>> Windows 10 App Essentials: to prevent issues like the one Rosemarie
>> and others have experienced with Mail app. Hence the following directive:
>>
>>
>>
>> Until now, it was optional for you to use Windows 10 app Essentials
>> add-on if you are using Windows 10. I'll make this an important
>> requirement starting from fall 2017. That is, starting from September
>> 2017, when you report issues like the one Rosemarie has experienced,
>> I'll no longer ask you to install latest WinTenApps add-on: I'll
>> assume that you have. For Windows Insiders, this is a critical (and
>> mandatory) requirement.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm not announcing this directive just because I feel like doing it,
>> nor to increase popularity of my brainchild: Windows 10 App
>> Essentials add-on exists for important reasons:
>>
>>
>>
>> * Workarounds for issues encountered by NVDA users when using Windows
>> 10, including various UI Automation issues.
>> * Respond to changes in accessibility of various apps such as
>> removing workarounds put in place in past versions.
>> * Respond to app executable name changes (Microsoft has changed names
>> of at least three universal app executables).
>> * Provide essential features for Windows 10 users, including
>> suggestions announcement, emoji panel support (Fall Creators Update),
>> Edge notification announcements and others.
>> * To prove to Microsoft and third-party universal app developers that
>> accessibility should be a core design criteria for apps, including
>> letting screen reader users use apps to their full potential.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>


--
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