Date   

Re: I am interested in programming for NVDA

Stephanie Watts
 

 Hi Sally,
I apologize for the late response. Yes, I would be happy to participate in a subgroup for newbies like us who wish to code. Looking forward to hearing from others.
Stephanie 


Re: Excel Question

Gene
 

You didn't mention alt down arrow, the standard command to open closed combo boxes.  Did you try it?
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, August 18, 2017 3:03 PM
Subject: [nvda] Excel Question

Working on latest Windows 10 and NVDA versions. I’m trying to sort a worksheet by one column and then by a second column. The Alt/H/S/U command gets me to the dialog box to do this. I click on the “Add Level” and tab to the first sort field. This is a drop down box where I select the column that I want to sort by. I can’t figure out how to open that drop down list. Tried arrow keys, Spacebar, Enter, NVDA/numpad 2, NVDA/numpad Enter. None of these are working. Is there some other command that I need to use to open these drop down lists?

Thanks.

 


slightly ot, braille contraction confusion

Anne Günther
 

Hi,
I'm from Germany. So that,s my first language' Which means I'm only semi fluent in reading english contractions. So I looked for a cheat sheet. During my search I learned that ueb is now generally adopted "everywhere". I also found a list of symbols and to my... not exactly great yoy I found out, that a fair amount is different than I learned it. But when I switched to the unified braille table in nvda it looked a lot more like what I'm used to. So what's with all that?
best wishes, Guenni


Re: using nvda with winrar

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

Yep, the html version has both a link to the winrar program, and my name at the end of the article. It also has tables listing the keys to make navigation a bit easier. Linking to it is just fine, and saving a copy is fine too. No complaints with either.

On 8/18/2017 4:58 PM, Gene New Zealand wrote:
Hi travis


I just read the tutorial on Winrar that you wrote in the email. I will
add a link to your html page from off my website to that tutorial but
will also save the contents into a doc file from the email. Yes any
thing written by any one else i always ask them to put there names to
the tutorial they wrote. Is your name on the html version down the
bottom? I would have to check otherwise i can add it onto the page which
it links from.


I would have to check again but was there a link in the tutorial to
where you could get Winrar from? if not I can add one in on the linking
page.


it will be linked off the nvda tutorial for other programs page.


Thanks Gene NZ



On 18/08/2017 15:16, Travis Siegel wrote:
I've mentioned winrar on this list before, but I've also seen posts in
the past where folks claimed winrar wasn't accessible, so here's an
article I wrote to explain how to use winrar with NVDA. There is an
html version located at http://www.softcon.com/files/winrar.html

and the text version is pasted in below.

Hope folks find it useful.


Using NVDA with winrar

Winrar is a completely accessible file archiver similar to winzip or
7zip, created by rarlabs
(http://www.rarlab.com). The difference is that it not only handles
rar archives, but it can be used as a
general file explorer program, too, and that is what this article will
focus on.
When you launch winrar, you are presented with a general file view
similar to windows explorer. By
default though, winrar offers more information than windows explorer
does, and this is primarily the
reason I like it. I know explorer can be adjusted to show more
information, and winrar can also be
adjusted to show less information as well by unchecking details in the
settings menu on the file list tab,
though I like it the way it is by default.
Winrar will also start up using the same directory you were last
viewing when it starts, though this is
configurable via the settings menu. I personally like this option,
since it allows me to leave winrar in
a directory I use often, and know it will start there next time I run it.
You can also add favorites to winrar, and even scan programs for
viruses using any installed virus
scanners already on your system. It's quite the versatile program,
and the fact that it's 100 percent
accessible is simply a huge plus.

Just like explorer, you'll have all the items on your computer, cd
drives, hard disks, and any usb drives
you've plugged in, as well as any network shares you've mounted.
Navigating winrar is as simple as using the arrow keys as well as page
up and page down to move up and
down the list of files. First letter navigation is also possible,
just press any letter of your choice,
and winrar will jump to the first file/directory with that letter.
Pressing it again will move to the
next one in line and so on.
When you get to a directory or archive file you want to navigate into,
simply press the enter key, and the
view changes to the new directory.
To get back out of the directory you're currently browsing, you can
either scroll to the top of the list,
then press enter on the two dots there (this means parent directory),
or you can simply use the control-
pageup key to get back much more quickly).
By default, directories are listed first, then files (sorted by
extension) with archive files being listed
first. This means that if you have multiple files with the same name,
but different extensions, they will
show up in different parts of the list. I like this arrangement, but
if you don't, it's possible to
change this behavior by changing the sort order via the menus.

Winrar will launch programs (just like windows explorer), load text or
doc files into word or notepad, or
open pdf files using adobe, just like windows explorer does, but the
real power of winrar becomes apparent
when you get to an archive you want to manipulate.

When you find an archive file you'd like to view, simply press enter
on it, and winrar will treat the file
just like it's a directory on the disk, allowing you to use the
archive file (zip, rar, arj, 7z, and so
on) exactly as if it were just another directory on the drive, even to
the point of viewing documentation,
and executing programs. The problem though is that if you use this
method to run an executable, it may or
may not work, depending on the program, and how it handles it's data
files (if any), because of being
executed from within the archive. Winrar will execute programs not
inside archives just fine.
Winrar will allow you to extract a text or doc file, edit that file,
then resave it back into the archive
when you're done, which makes for some handy disk usage savings.

In most cases though, when you're working with archive files, you will
want to extract those archives so
that you can work with them or install the programs, or whatever it is
you want to do, and lucky for us,
winrar has lots of ways to do this.
One of the reasons winrar is so accessible, is because it has
keystrokes for nearly every function you'd
ever want to perform. For example, extracting an archive is alt-E or
alt-W (depending on whether you wish
to specify where it is extracted to or not), and creating an archive
from the currently highlighted
directory or file is alt-A.
alt-T will test an archive, alt-R will perform recovery on an archive,
and many many more. In fact, you
can accomplish nearly everything you need to do using just key
combinations, it's almost never necessary
to use mouse or screen reader functions to accomplish what you need.

So, just for tutorial purposes, let's create an archive, and lock the
archive against tampering. (note,
locking archives is only available in the registered version).
First, we'll select a directory. Any directory will do, I'm going to
use my documents directory for this
example, but this will work for any directory you like.
First, navigate to your documents directory, then press enter to enter
the directory. Verify that this is
the directory we want. Once you've convinced yourself that you're in
the right place, winrar has a nice
keystroke that will take you back to the directory so you don't have
to page/arrow up to the top, then
press enter to get out of the directory, and that is control-pageUp.
Once you're back on the documents directory, just press alt-A (or use
the applications key, and select add
to archive).
Winrar will prompt you for the archive name, which will default to
documents.rar.
Now, at this point, press tab and you can work your way through all
the various options for creating your
archive. You can select the archive type (rar, rar version 5, and zip
are the defaults). Yes, rar can
create zip files too.
Rar5 is the new archive type for rar, which is not compatible with
earlier versions of rar, so if you or
whoever receives the file doesn't have winrar version 5 or later, they
won't be able to uncompress the
file. This may or may not be what you want, depending on how security
conscious you are, so feel free to
choose whatever option you like, as long as you know the possible down
sides to selecting them.

The next option is the type of archive. I won't go into detail here,
but real quick, the options are:
store, fastest, fast, normal, good and best.
In general, these options range from no compression at all, to give me
the most compression you can, so
that my archive is as small as possible. Each option takes more
memory, and longer to execute.
The next option is dictionary size, and without getting into a lot of
technical details which most people
don't care about, the dictionary size determines how effective rar
will be when compressing data, if it
finds duplicate data in the each block, it can compress it better, so
in general, the larger the block,
the better the compression, with the trade off that the larger the
dictionary, the longer it will take to
actually do the compressing, because it has more data to search
through each time it wants to compress a
new piece of data.
It's generally best to leave the defaults here (on my machine using
best compression, it's 4 megabyte
blocks), but that will vary depending on compression type, and other
factors.
the next two tabs are an option to split your archive into specific
sizes. For example, if you're
compressing a large video file that is several hundred gigabytes, and
you only have 4 gigabyte dvd disks
to save it on, rar can split the file into multiple chunks, so that
you can copy each individual chunk to
a different disk and store it that way, or if you are trying to upload
a file to dropbox or some other
online file storage system, and they have a file size restriction,
winrar can solve that problem for you
by making the archive the exact size you need, and splitting it into
multiple files.
The first one asks you the size, and the second one asks whether you
specified the size in bytes,
kilobytes, megabytes, or gigabytes. So, if you are using the split
option, this gives you a way to
designate the archive size precisely so you won't have any confusion
over the actual archive sizes.

The next set of options are various options that will affect either
the archive, or the files you're
archiving. You have options such as:
delete files after archiving, (good for saving space on your hard
drive on low resource pcs),
Create a self extracting archive, (this means that your rar file will
be turned into an executable so that
people who don't have rar can still extract your archive).
Create solid archive, (Usually this option compresses better at the
expense of time)
Add recovery record (this makes your archives a bit larger, but allows
them to still extract properly,
even if the archive gets damaged)
test archive files (ensures the files were compressed properly,
generally not needed unless you're
archiving from unstable media)
Lock archive (Allows the archive to be locked against changes of any
kind after it's created)
and finally
set password (allows you to password protect the archive)

After you've configured your new archive the way you want it, tab to
the ok button, and away it goes.

While the archiving is taking place, winrar will present you with
three buttons, Background (which will
move winrar to the system tray, and remove it from the alt-tab
sequence; and the other buttons are Pause
archiving, and cancel.

When the archiving is complete, you will now have a new file in the
current directory with the name you
selected in the previous step, and if you selected background, winrar
will then reappear in the alt-tab
sequence, and also show you any errors it encountered during the
archiving process.
(note, this is the only inaccessible part of winrar, for some reason,
the view used to show errors isn't
accessible to NVDA, but you can use the log function to see any errors.)

That's all there is to it. Winrar is easy to use, and has some very
nice features that make it a great
general file viewer, as well as an excellent archive maintainer.
If you'd like to get a complete list of winrar functions and settings,
F-10 will do it, it presents you
with a nice organized multitab settings view that allows you to view
or change virtually everything about
winrar and how it works.

Below are a list of the more common functions and their key
combinations. These key combinations are
usually available from anywhere, though occasionally, they will work
when winrar is in particular modes
(for example, the extract archive obviously won't work if you're not
looking at an archive file).
Most of these functions are also available using the applications (or
context if you prefer) key which is
the one on the right side of the space bar between the alt and control
keys on most windows keyboards.

Delete file : delete
rename file : F2
menu : F10
Print file : control-i
Settings : control-s
Change drive : control-d
set password : control-p

Add files to archive : alt-a
Extract to specified directory : alt-e
extract without confirmation : alt-w
Lock archive : alt-l
add comment to archive : alt-m
Repair archive : alt-r
protect archive : alt-p
Test archive : alt-t
show information : alt-i
View file : alt-v

If you forget any of these keys, you can use the menus to find the
options you want. (of which F10 is
only the master menu key)

alt-f : file menu
alt-c : commands menu
alt-s : tools menu
alt-o : favorites
alt-n : options
alt-h : help

Some functions are only available in the registered version, but since
I've been a registered rar user for
many years now, I have no idea which functions aren't present in the
non registered version.
I realize this was a rather quick and dirty examination of winrar
functions, but I hope it was enough to
convince you that winrar is well worth taking a look see to verify for
yourself whether it can handle your
file browsing and archiving needs.
If there are questions, or comments, feel free to send them to me, and
I'd be glad to update this article
with modifications and additional information that folks would like to
see.
Feel free to repost this article where you like, as long as you give
credit to me (Travis Siegel) as the
originator.





Re: insert key problem

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

Ahh, never tried the other insert key, sorry for the confusion then.  And, another correction to my message, the insert on the sixpack of keys is the one on the top left, not the top center.  I (wrongly) assumed that the numpad insert was the only one used, so the passthrough method must be used then.  Again, sorry for any confusion, and thanks to Gene for the correction.


On 8/18/2017 5:02 PM, Gene wrote:
On keyboards with two insert keys, one is the numpad insert and the other is the insert on the main keyboard.  Either one can be used with NVDA.  Try it.  Try numpad insert with down arrow to start read to end in a document.  Then try the insert on the main keyboard with down arrow.  I'm giving the desktop layout command for read to end.  Exactly the same thing will happen.  The key describer describes both keys the same way. If you use either insert with another key on the numpad, the same thing will happen.  There may be times when it is more convenient to use one insert than the other.  And if you are using a laptop, the insert key is the only insert key.  If you are using the laptop layout, I don't know if insert is used as an NVDA key.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, August 18, 2017 3:28 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] insert key problem

Most keyboards have two insert keys.  The one on the numpad can be used for NVDA, while the one in the middle on the top row of the sixpack of keys between the keyboard and numpad can be used for other uses.  Alternatively, you can use the passthrough key by pressing insert-2 which will allow you to press any key combo on the keyboard, and NVDA will ignore it and your other apps would pick up the key combination and act on it accordingly.


On 8/18/2017 3:31 PM, anthony borg wrote:

Hi list

I wonder if someone can help me.

As I have to use the sticky key I can’t use the capslock as NVDA key as well, because when I come to use it to write a capital letter it doesn’t work.

So I had to use the numpad insert key as NVDA, then after that I discovered that now I can’t use an insert key with other commands as well.

Can someone tell me if there is any other solution please?

Thanks in advance

Anthony



Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: insert key problem

Gene
 

On keyboards with two insert keys, one is the numpad insert and the other is the insert on the main keyboard.  Either one can be used with NVDA.  Try it.  Try numpad insert with down arrow to start read to end in a document.  Then try the insert on the main keyboard with down arrow.  I'm giving the desktop layout command for read to end.  Exactly the same thing will happen.  The key describer describes both keys the same way. If you use either insert with another key on the numpad, the same thing will happen.  There may be times when it is more convenient to use one insert than the other.  And if you are using a laptop, the insert key is the only insert key.  If you are using the laptop layout, I don't know if insert is used as an NVDA key.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, August 18, 2017 3:28 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] insert key problem

Most keyboards have two insert keys.  The one on the numpad can be used for NVDA, while the one in the middle on the top row of the sixpack of keys between the keyboard and numpad can be used for other uses.  Alternatively, you can use the passthrough key by pressing insert-2 which will allow you to press any key combo on the keyboard, and NVDA will ignore it and your other apps would pick up the key combination and act on it accordingly.


On 8/18/2017 3:31 PM, anthony borg wrote:

Hi list

I wonder if someone can help me.

As I have to use the sticky key I can’t use the capslock as NVDA key as well, because when I come to use it to write a capital letter it doesn’t work.

So I had to use the numpad insert key as NVDA, then after that I discovered that now I can’t use an insert key with other commands as well.

Can someone tell me if there is any other solution please?

Thanks in advance

Anthony



Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: using nvda with winrar

Gene New Zealand <hurrikennyandopo@...>
 

Hi


I forgot to mention yes Winrar is very accessible the last time i used
it not long ago before the pc died. it works very well with NVDA.


Gene NZ

On 18/08/2017 15:16, Travis Siegel wrote:
I've mentioned winrar on this list before, but I've also seen posts in
the past where folks claimed winrar wasn't accessible, so here's an
article I wrote to explain how to use winrar with NVDA. There is an
html version located at http://www.softcon.com/files/winrar.html

and the text version is pasted in below.

Hope folks find it useful.


Using NVDA with winrar

Winrar is a completely accessible file archiver similar to winzip or
7zip, created by rarlabs
(http://www.rarlab.com). The difference is that it not only handles
rar archives, but it can be used as a
general file explorer program, too, and that is what this article will
focus on.
When you launch winrar, you are presented with a general file view
similar to windows explorer. By
default though, winrar offers more information than windows explorer
does, and this is primarily the
reason I like it. I know explorer can be adjusted to show more
information, and winrar can also be
adjusted to show less information as well by unchecking details in the
settings menu on the file list tab,
though I like it the way it is by default.
Winrar will also start up using the same directory you were last
viewing when it starts, though this is
configurable via the settings menu. I personally like this option,
since it allows me to leave winrar in
a directory I use often, and know it will start there next time I run it.
You can also add favorites to winrar, and even scan programs for
viruses using any installed virus
scanners already on your system. It's quite the versatile program,
and the fact that it's 100 percent
accessible is simply a huge plus.

Just like explorer, you'll have all the items on your computer, cd
drives, hard disks, and any usb drives
you've plugged in, as well as any network shares you've mounted.
Navigating winrar is as simple as using the arrow keys as well as page
up and page down to move up and
down the list of files. First letter navigation is also possible,
just press any letter of your choice,
and winrar will jump to the first file/directory with that letter.
Pressing it again will move to the
next one in line and so on.
When you get to a directory or archive file you want to navigate into,
simply press the enter key, and the
view changes to the new directory.
To get back out of the directory you're currently browsing, you can
either scroll to the top of the list,
then press enter on the two dots there (this means parent directory),
or you can simply use the control-
pageup key to get back much more quickly).
By default, directories are listed first, then files (sorted by
extension) with archive files being listed
first. This means that if you have multiple files with the same name,
but different extensions, they will
show up in different parts of the list. I like this arrangement, but
if you don't, it's possible to
change this behavior by changing the sort order via the menus.

Winrar will launch programs (just like windows explorer), load text or
doc files into word or notepad, or
open pdf files using adobe, just like windows explorer does, but the
real power of winrar becomes apparent
when you get to an archive you want to manipulate.

When you find an archive file you'd like to view, simply press enter
on it, and winrar will treat the file
just like it's a directory on the disk, allowing you to use the
archive file (zip, rar, arj, 7z, and so
on) exactly as if it were just another directory on the drive, even to
the point of viewing documentation,
and executing programs. The problem though is that if you use this
method to run an executable, it may or
may not work, depending on the program, and how it handles it's data
files (if any), because of being
executed from within the archive. Winrar will execute programs not
inside archives just fine.
Winrar will allow you to extract a text or doc file, edit that file,
then resave it back into the archive
when you're done, which makes for some handy disk usage savings.

In most cases though, when you're working with archive files, you will
want to extract those archives so
that you can work with them or install the programs, or whatever it is
you want to do, and lucky for us,
winrar has lots of ways to do this.
One of the reasons winrar is so accessible, is because it has
keystrokes for nearly every function you'd
ever want to perform. For example, extracting an archive is alt-E or
alt-W (depending on whether you wish
to specify where it is extracted to or not), and creating an archive
from the currently highlighted
directory or file is alt-A.
alt-T will test an archive, alt-R will perform recovery on an archive,
and many many more. In fact, you
can accomplish nearly everything you need to do using just key
combinations, it's almost never necessary
to use mouse or screen reader functions to accomplish what you need.

So, just for tutorial purposes, let's create an archive, and lock the
archive against tampering. (note,
locking archives is only available in the registered version).
First, we'll select a directory. Any directory will do, I'm going to
use my documents directory for this
example, but this will work for any directory you like.
First, navigate to your documents directory, then press enter to enter
the directory. Verify that this is
the directory we want. Once you've convinced yourself that you're in
the right place, winrar has a nice
keystroke that will take you back to the directory so you don't have
to page/arrow up to the top, then
press enter to get out of the directory, and that is control-pageUp.
Once you're back on the documents directory, just press alt-A (or use
the applications key, and select add
to archive).
Winrar will prompt you for the archive name, which will default to
documents.rar.
Now, at this point, press tab and you can work your way through all
the various options for creating your
archive. You can select the archive type (rar, rar version 5, and zip
are the defaults). Yes, rar can
create zip files too.
Rar5 is the new archive type for rar, which is not compatible with
earlier versions of rar, so if you or
whoever receives the file doesn't have winrar version 5 or later, they
won't be able to uncompress the
file. This may or may not be what you want, depending on how security
conscious you are, so feel free to
choose whatever option you like, as long as you know the possible down
sides to selecting them.

The next option is the type of archive. I won't go into detail here,
but real quick, the options are:
store, fastest, fast, normal, good and best.
In general, these options range from no compression at all, to give me
the most compression you can, so
that my archive is as small as possible. Each option takes more
memory, and longer to execute.
The next option is dictionary size, and without getting into a lot of
technical details which most people
don't care about, the dictionary size determines how effective rar
will be when compressing data, if it
finds duplicate data in the each block, it can compress it better, so
in general, the larger the block,
the better the compression, with the trade off that the larger the
dictionary, the longer it will take to
actually do the compressing, because it has more data to search
through each time it wants to compress a
new piece of data.
It's generally best to leave the defaults here (on my machine using
best compression, it's 4 megabyte
blocks), but that will vary depending on compression type, and other
factors.
the next two tabs are an option to split your archive into specific
sizes. For example, if you're
compressing a large video file that is several hundred gigabytes, and
you only have 4 gigabyte dvd disks
to save it on, rar can split the file into multiple chunks, so that
you can copy each individual chunk to
a different disk and store it that way, or if you are trying to upload
a file to dropbox or some other
online file storage system, and they have a file size restriction,
winrar can solve that problem for you
by making the archive the exact size you need, and splitting it into
multiple files.
The first one asks you the size, and the second one asks whether you
specified the size in bytes,
kilobytes, megabytes, or gigabytes. So, if you are using the split
option, this gives you a way to
designate the archive size precisely so you won't have any confusion
over the actual archive sizes.

The next set of options are various options that will affect either
the archive, or the files you're
archiving. You have options such as:
delete files after archiving, (good for saving space on your hard
drive on low resource pcs),
Create a self extracting archive, (this means that your rar file will
be turned into an executable so that
people who don't have rar can still extract your archive).
Create solid archive, (Usually this option compresses better at the
expense of time)
Add recovery record (this makes your archives a bit larger, but allows
them to still extract properly,
even if the archive gets damaged)
test archive files (ensures the files were compressed properly,
generally not needed unless you're
archiving from unstable media)
Lock archive (Allows the archive to be locked against changes of any
kind after it's created)
and finally
set password (allows you to password protect the archive)

After you've configured your new archive the way you want it, tab to
the ok button, and away it goes.

While the archiving is taking place, winrar will present you with
three buttons, Background (which will
move winrar to the system tray, and remove it from the alt-tab
sequence; and the other buttons are Pause
archiving, and cancel.

When the archiving is complete, you will now have a new file in the
current directory with the name you
selected in the previous step, and if you selected background, winrar
will then reappear in the alt-tab
sequence, and also show you any errors it encountered during the
archiving process.
(note, this is the only inaccessible part of winrar, for some reason,
the view used to show errors isn't
accessible to NVDA, but you can use the log function to see any errors.)

That's all there is to it. Winrar is easy to use, and has some very
nice features that make it a great
general file viewer, as well as an excellent archive maintainer.
If you'd like to get a complete list of winrar functions and settings,
F-10 will do it, it presents you
with a nice organized multitab settings view that allows you to view
or change virtually everything about
winrar and how it works.

Below are a list of the more common functions and their key
combinations. These key combinations are
usually available from anywhere, though occasionally, they will work
when winrar is in particular modes
(for example, the extract archive obviously won't work if you're not
looking at an archive file).
Most of these functions are also available using the applications (or
context if you prefer) key which is
the one on the right side of the space bar between the alt and control
keys on most windows keyboards.

Delete file : delete
rename file : F2
menu : F10
Print file : control-i
Settings : control-s
Change drive : control-d
set password : control-p

Add files to archive : alt-a
Extract to specified directory : alt-e
extract without confirmation : alt-w
Lock archive : alt-l
add comment to archive : alt-m
Repair archive : alt-r
protect archive : alt-p
Test archive : alt-t
show information : alt-i
View file : alt-v

If you forget any of these keys, you can use the menus to find the
options you want. (of which F10 is
only the master menu key)

alt-f : file menu
alt-c : commands menu
alt-s : tools menu
alt-o : favorites
alt-n : options
alt-h : help

Some functions are only available in the registered version, but since
I've been a registered rar user for
many years now, I have no idea which functions aren't present in the
non registered version.
I realize this was a rather quick and dirty examination of winrar
functions, but I hope it was enough to
convince you that winrar is well worth taking a look see to verify for
yourself whether it can handle your
file browsing and archiving needs.
If there are questions, or comments, feel free to send them to me, and
I'd be glad to update this article
with modifications and additional information that folks would like to
see.
Feel free to repost this article where you like, as long as you give
credit to me (Travis Siegel) as the
originator.





Re: I couldn't subscribe to devlearning. [Mailer-Daemon@mailbox.supranet.net: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender]

 

Travis,

          I'm not going to say anything after this.  But if you think the random user of this group is going to use the web interface in the first place there is ample evidence that this is contrary to fact.   If they do, if you think they'll "drill down" after a search that's even less likely.

          I wouldn't drill down after a group name search because subgroups should be plainly identified.  They are not.

          Interfaces need to be designed around what "most people" would do.  You, clearly, are not most people, you work far harder than most are willing to, which is a great thing.  But if interfaces were designed for folks like you well over half the world would be unable to locate a darned thing, and that's based on observations from having been in this business since the 1980s.  People are generally lazy, on the whole, and a good user interface takes that into account.
--
Brian  Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1703, Build 15063  (dot level on request - it changes too often to keep in signature)

     The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement.  But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth.

            Niels Bohr

 

 


Re: using nvda with winrar

Gene New Zealand <hurrikennyandopo@...>
 

Hi travis


I just read the tutorial on Winrar that you wrote in the email. I will
add a link to your html page from off my website to that tutorial but
will also save the contents into a doc file from the email. Yes any
thing written by any one else i always ask them to put there names to
the tutorial they wrote. Is your name on the html version down the
bottom? I would have to check otherwise i can add it onto the page which
it links from.


I would have to check again but was there a link in the tutorial to
where you could get Winrar from? if not I can add one in on the linking
page.


it will be linked off the nvda tutorial for other programs page.


Thanks Gene NZ

On 18/08/2017 15:16, Travis Siegel wrote:
I've mentioned winrar on this list before, but I've also seen posts in
the past where folks claimed winrar wasn't accessible, so here's an
article I wrote to explain how to use winrar with NVDA. There is an
html version located at http://www.softcon.com/files/winrar.html

and the text version is pasted in below.

Hope folks find it useful.


Using NVDA with winrar

Winrar is a completely accessible file archiver similar to winzip or
7zip, created by rarlabs
(http://www.rarlab.com). The difference is that it not only handles
rar archives, but it can be used as a
general file explorer program, too, and that is what this article will
focus on.
When you launch winrar, you are presented with a general file view
similar to windows explorer. By
default though, winrar offers more information than windows explorer
does, and this is primarily the
reason I like it. I know explorer can be adjusted to show more
information, and winrar can also be
adjusted to show less information as well by unchecking details in the
settings menu on the file list tab,
though I like it the way it is by default.
Winrar will also start up using the same directory you were last
viewing when it starts, though this is
configurable via the settings menu. I personally like this option,
since it allows me to leave winrar in
a directory I use often, and know it will start there next time I run it.
You can also add favorites to winrar, and even scan programs for
viruses using any installed virus
scanners already on your system. It's quite the versatile program,
and the fact that it's 100 percent
accessible is simply a huge plus.

Just like explorer, you'll have all the items on your computer, cd
drives, hard disks, and any usb drives
you've plugged in, as well as any network shares you've mounted.
Navigating winrar is as simple as using the arrow keys as well as page
up and page down to move up and
down the list of files. First letter navigation is also possible,
just press any letter of your choice,
and winrar will jump to the first file/directory with that letter.
Pressing it again will move to the
next one in line and so on.
When you get to a directory or archive file you want to navigate into,
simply press the enter key, and the
view changes to the new directory.
To get back out of the directory you're currently browsing, you can
either scroll to the top of the list,
then press enter on the two dots there (this means parent directory),
or you can simply use the control-
pageup key to get back much more quickly).
By default, directories are listed first, then files (sorted by
extension) with archive files being listed
first. This means that if you have multiple files with the same name,
but different extensions, they will
show up in different parts of the list. I like this arrangement, but
if you don't, it's possible to
change this behavior by changing the sort order via the menus.

Winrar will launch programs (just like windows explorer), load text or
doc files into word or notepad, or
open pdf files using adobe, just like windows explorer does, but the
real power of winrar becomes apparent
when you get to an archive you want to manipulate.

When you find an archive file you'd like to view, simply press enter
on it, and winrar will treat the file
just like it's a directory on the disk, allowing you to use the
archive file (zip, rar, arj, 7z, and so
on) exactly as if it were just another directory on the drive, even to
the point of viewing documentation,
and executing programs. The problem though is that if you use this
method to run an executable, it may or
may not work, depending on the program, and how it handles it's data
files (if any), because of being
executed from within the archive. Winrar will execute programs not
inside archives just fine.
Winrar will allow you to extract a text or doc file, edit that file,
then resave it back into the archive
when you're done, which makes for some handy disk usage savings.

In most cases though, when you're working with archive files, you will
want to extract those archives so
that you can work with them or install the programs, or whatever it is
you want to do, and lucky for us,
winrar has lots of ways to do this.
One of the reasons winrar is so accessible, is because it has
keystrokes for nearly every function you'd
ever want to perform. For example, extracting an archive is alt-E or
alt-W (depending on whether you wish
to specify where it is extracted to or not), and creating an archive
from the currently highlighted
directory or file is alt-A.
alt-T will test an archive, alt-R will perform recovery on an archive,
and many many more. In fact, you
can accomplish nearly everything you need to do using just key
combinations, it's almost never necessary
to use mouse or screen reader functions to accomplish what you need.

So, just for tutorial purposes, let's create an archive, and lock the
archive against tampering. (note,
locking archives is only available in the registered version).
First, we'll select a directory. Any directory will do, I'm going to
use my documents directory for this
example, but this will work for any directory you like.
First, navigate to your documents directory, then press enter to enter
the directory. Verify that this is
the directory we want. Once you've convinced yourself that you're in
the right place, winrar has a nice
keystroke that will take you back to the directory so you don't have
to page/arrow up to the top, then
press enter to get out of the directory, and that is control-pageUp.
Once you're back on the documents directory, just press alt-A (or use
the applications key, and select add
to archive).
Winrar will prompt you for the archive name, which will default to
documents.rar.
Now, at this point, press tab and you can work your way through all
the various options for creating your
archive. You can select the archive type (rar, rar version 5, and zip
are the defaults). Yes, rar can
create zip files too.
Rar5 is the new archive type for rar, which is not compatible with
earlier versions of rar, so if you or
whoever receives the file doesn't have winrar version 5 or later, they
won't be able to uncompress the
file. This may or may not be what you want, depending on how security
conscious you are, so feel free to
choose whatever option you like, as long as you know the possible down
sides to selecting them.

The next option is the type of archive. I won't go into detail here,
but real quick, the options are:
store, fastest, fast, normal, good and best.
In general, these options range from no compression at all, to give me
the most compression you can, so
that my archive is as small as possible. Each option takes more
memory, and longer to execute.
The next option is dictionary size, and without getting into a lot of
technical details which most people
don't care about, the dictionary size determines how effective rar
will be when compressing data, if it
finds duplicate data in the each block, it can compress it better, so
in general, the larger the block,
the better the compression, with the trade off that the larger the
dictionary, the longer it will take to
actually do the compressing, because it has more data to search
through each time it wants to compress a
new piece of data.
It's generally best to leave the defaults here (on my machine using
best compression, it's 4 megabyte
blocks), but that will vary depending on compression type, and other
factors.
the next two tabs are an option to split your archive into specific
sizes. For example, if you're
compressing a large video file that is several hundred gigabytes, and
you only have 4 gigabyte dvd disks
to save it on, rar can split the file into multiple chunks, so that
you can copy each individual chunk to
a different disk and store it that way, or if you are trying to upload
a file to dropbox or some other
online file storage system, and they have a file size restriction,
winrar can solve that problem for you
by making the archive the exact size you need, and splitting it into
multiple files.
The first one asks you the size, and the second one asks whether you
specified the size in bytes,
kilobytes, megabytes, or gigabytes. So, if you are using the split
option, this gives you a way to
designate the archive size precisely so you won't have any confusion
over the actual archive sizes.

The next set of options are various options that will affect either
the archive, or the files you're
archiving. You have options such as:
delete files after archiving, (good for saving space on your hard
drive on low resource pcs),
Create a self extracting archive, (this means that your rar file will
be turned into an executable so that
people who don't have rar can still extract your archive).
Create solid archive, (Usually this option compresses better at the
expense of time)
Add recovery record (this makes your archives a bit larger, but allows
them to still extract properly,
even if the archive gets damaged)
test archive files (ensures the files were compressed properly,
generally not needed unless you're
archiving from unstable media)
Lock archive (Allows the archive to be locked against changes of any
kind after it's created)
and finally
set password (allows you to password protect the archive)

After you've configured your new archive the way you want it, tab to
the ok button, and away it goes.

While the archiving is taking place, winrar will present you with
three buttons, Background (which will
move winrar to the system tray, and remove it from the alt-tab
sequence; and the other buttons are Pause
archiving, and cancel.

When the archiving is complete, you will now have a new file in the
current directory with the name you
selected in the previous step, and if you selected background, winrar
will then reappear in the alt-tab
sequence, and also show you any errors it encountered during the
archiving process.
(note, this is the only inaccessible part of winrar, for some reason,
the view used to show errors isn't
accessible to NVDA, but you can use the log function to see any errors.)

That's all there is to it. Winrar is easy to use, and has some very
nice features that make it a great
general file viewer, as well as an excellent archive maintainer.
If you'd like to get a complete list of winrar functions and settings,
F-10 will do it, it presents you
with a nice organized multitab settings view that allows you to view
or change virtually everything about
winrar and how it works.

Below are a list of the more common functions and their key
combinations. These key combinations are
usually available from anywhere, though occasionally, they will work
when winrar is in particular modes
(for example, the extract archive obviously won't work if you're not
looking at an archive file).
Most of these functions are also available using the applications (or
context if you prefer) key which is
the one on the right side of the space bar between the alt and control
keys on most windows keyboards.

Delete file : delete
rename file : F2
menu : F10
Print file : control-i
Settings : control-s
Change drive : control-d
set password : control-p

Add files to archive : alt-a
Extract to specified directory : alt-e
extract without confirmation : alt-w
Lock archive : alt-l
add comment to archive : alt-m
Repair archive : alt-r
protect archive : alt-p
Test archive : alt-t
show information : alt-i
View file : alt-v

If you forget any of these keys, you can use the menus to find the
options you want. (of which F10 is
only the master menu key)

alt-f : file menu
alt-c : commands menu
alt-s : tools menu
alt-o : favorites
alt-n : options
alt-h : help

Some functions are only available in the registered version, but since
I've been a registered rar user for
many years now, I have no idea which functions aren't present in the
non registered version.
I realize this was a rather quick and dirty examination of winrar
functions, but I hope it was enough to
convince you that winrar is well worth taking a look see to verify for
yourself whether it can handle your
file browsing and archiving needs.
If there are questions, or comments, feel free to send them to me, and
I'd be glad to update this article
with modifications and additional information that folks would like to
see.
Feel free to repost this article where you like, as long as you give
credit to me (Travis Siegel) as the
originator.





Re: I couldn't subscribe to devlearning. [Mailer-Daemon@mailbox.supranet.net: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender]

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

After you find the nvda list on groups.io, you simply click on it, and there is a link on that page for subgroups.  Click on that, and you're presented with a list of the subgroups.  All nice and tidy.


On 8/18/2017 3:43 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Travis,
  
           What you say is all well and good for the main NVDA group and a number of other NVDA related groups, but you're not going to find the devlearning subgroup that way, and that's a problem.  It is not returned in any search.

--
Brian  Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1703, Build 15063  (dot level on request - it changes too often to keep in signature)

     The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement.  But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth.

            Niels Bohr

 

 



Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: insert key problem

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

Most keyboards have two insert keys.  The one on the numpad can be used for NVDA, while the one in the middle on the top row of the sixpack of keys between the keyboard and numpad can be used for other uses.  Alternatively, you can use the passthrough key by pressing insert-2 which will allow you to press any key combo on the keyboard, and NVDA will ignore it and your other apps would pick up the key combination and act on it accordingly.


On 8/18/2017 3:31 PM, anthony borg wrote:

Hi list

I wonder if someone can help me.

As I have to use the sticky key I can’t use the capslock as NVDA key as well, because when I come to use it to write a capital letter it doesn’t work.

So I had to use the numpad insert key as NVDA, then after that I discovered that now I can’t use an insert key with other commands as well.

Can someone tell me if there is any other solution please?

Thanks in advance

Anthony



Virus-free. www.avast.com


Excel Question

Greg Rhodes <gkrhodes@...>
 

Working on latest Windows 10 and NVDA versions. I’m trying to sort a worksheet by one column and then by a second column. The Alt/H/S/U command gets me to the dialog box to do this. I click on the “Add Level” and tab to the first sort field. This is a drop down box where I select the column that I want to sort by. I can’t figure out how to open that drop down list. Tried arrow keys, Spacebar, Enter, NVDA/numpad 2, NVDA/numpad Enter. None of these are working. Is there some other command that I need to use to open these drop down lists?

Thanks.

 


Re: I couldn't subscribe to devlearning. [Mailer-Daemon@mailbox.supranet.net: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender]

 

Travis,
  
           What you say is all well and good for the main NVDA group and a number of other NVDA related groups, but you're not going to find the devlearning subgroup that way, and that's a problem.  It is not returned in any search.

--
Brian  Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1703, Build 15063  (dot level on request - it changes too often to keep in signature)

     The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement.  But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth.

            Niels Bohr

 

 


Re: insert key problem

Andre Fisher
 

If you press CAPS Lock twice, it should turn on. Otherwise, what exactly are you trying to use the Insert key to do?

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: anthony borg
Sent: Friday, August 18, 2017 2:30 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] insert key problem

 

Hi list

I wonder if someone can help me.

As I have to use the sticky key I can’t use the capslock as NVDA key as well, because when I come to use it to write a capital letter it doesn’t work.

So I had to use the numpad insert key as NVDA, then after that I discovered that now I can’t use an insert key with other commands as well.

Can someone tell me if there is any other solution please?

Thanks in advance

Anthony

 


insert key problem

anthony borg
 

Hi list

I wonder if someone can help me.

As I have to use the sticky key I can’t use the capslock as NVDA key as well, because when I come to use it to write a capital letter it doesn’t work.

So I had to use the numpad insert key as NVDA, then after that I discovered that now I can’t use an insert key with other commands as well.

Can someone tell me if there is any other solution please?

Thanks in advance

Anthony


Doing Google Searches

Andre Fisher
 

Hi.

A quick query. Lately, I have realized that most persons subscribed to this list, rather than going to Google or a search engine of their choice, seek to ask questions here prior to doing this type of research. I’d seriously like to know why, as I find this practice to be counterproductive. Why do I say this? Because sometimes, the responses that are given are incorrect. Why don’t persons read the NVDA User Guide, for example. It is well detailed. Could persons explain this to me?


Re: I couldn't subscribe to devlearning. [Mailer-Daemon@mailbox.supranet.net: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender]

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

The direct links to both the nvda and the devlearning list were posted here yesterday (by me), but finding the proper list on groups.io isn't hard, just search for nvda, and it comes up as one of the very first choices.  Worst case, tell it to show all lists, then keep paging until you find the list names that begin with n, then go down the list until you find the NVDA list.  I've used both methods, and had no trouble either time.



On 8/18/2017 12:31 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Well, if this group exists on Groups.io I'll be darned if I can find where.  A group search on "devlearning" returns absolutely nothing, and here are the search results from searching groups for NVDA:  https://groups.io/search?q=NVDA 
--
Brian  Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1703, Build 15063  (dot level on request - it changes too often to keep in signature)

     The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement.  But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth.

            Niels Bohr

 

 



Virus-free. www.avast.com


Those wanting to subscribe to devlearning subgroup: a welcome message

 

Hi all,

 

The below message was sent to the “devlearning” subgroup. If you still would like to subscribe, please send an email to nvda+devlearning+subscribe@groups.io and confirm if requested. But before doing so, please read the following welcome message:

 

Hi everyone,

 

Welcome to NVDA Development Learning, a subgroup of international NVDA users mailing list. I’ll serve as a moderator, and if she is willing, Sally as well.

 

In order to gauge what kind of material we need to cover, I’d like to get a feel of your knowledge of Python, as well as how you were inspired by NVDA and reasons for learning how to contribute code. This member intro also serves as a way for moderators to approve your posts, as by default, initial messages from members must be approved before you can post freely in order to reduce spam. Once some intros were received, I’ll publish expectations from this course, as well as provide an overview of things to be covered.

 

Be warned: the material we’ll cover will ask you to think and write a lot. Contributing code to NVDA screen reader project requires not just programming, but good thinking and writing skills (writing as in communicating with other developers). Also, there will be times when you do need to work as a group, while at other times, you need to showcase independent research skills. In other words, the course won’t really teach you how to contribute code to NVDA – rather, it will teach you to become good problem solvers and thinking things through.

 

I’m stating the above warning as a reality check for some of you, as I do know that, for some, trying to learn coding may steer you in other directions, such as writing documentation for NVDA, reviewing add-ons, contributing to translations and what not. I’ll talk about some misconceptions about NVDA code contributions (and programming in general) in due course.

 

Hope this helps. And with that, I’d like to ask you to post member intros on the devlearning subgroup if you are already a member of that group.

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: looking for a free YouTube video downloader that supports playlists

 

is there a way I could get your batch files?


On 8/18/2017 12:01 PM, Damien Sykes-Lindley wrote:
Hi,
Yes, yes and yes.
It can be downloaded at www.ytdl.org.
It can download playlists. It can even download from video and audio services other than Youtube.
It’s command line based, so as long as you read the documentation, it’s easy. I have batch scripts to download all my content – Especially easy since it can download in bulk and read URL’s from a file.
Cheers.
Damien.
 
From: The Wolf
Sent: Friday, August 18, 2017 7:27 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] looking for a free YouTube video downloader that supports playlists
 

can you download playlist with it? also is it easy to use? 


On 8/18/2017 9:32 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
You can use youtube-dl. It is a command line program that is fully accessible. You can even write a script that takes out the youtube ID as well. I love that piece of software.
 
Take care
On Aug 17, 2017, at 9:36 PM, Kwork <istherelife@...> wrote:
 
Hello,
I'm looking for a YouTube video downloader that supports playlists, and that is NVDA accessible. I'm not looking for anything that converts, so don't want a program that automatically downloads and converts without saving the original video. I've been using Pontes, but that hasn't been as reliable lately. Thanks for any help.
Travis
 



Re: looking for a free YouTube video downloader that supports playlists

Damien Sykes-Lindley <damien@...>
 

Hi,
Yes, yes and yes.
It can be downloaded at www.ytdl.org.
It can download playlists. It can even download from video and audio services other than Youtube.
It’s command line based, so as long as you read the documentation, it’s easy. I have batch scripts to download all my content – Especially easy since it can download in bulk and read URL’s from a file.
Cheers.
Damien.
 

From: The Wolf
Sent: Friday, August 18, 2017 7:27 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] looking for a free YouTube video downloader that supports playlists
 

can you download playlist with it? also is it easy to use? 


On 8/18/2017 9:32 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
You can use youtube-dl. It is a command line program that is fully accessible. You can even write a script that takes out the youtube ID as well. I love that piece of software.
 
Take care
On Aug 17, 2017, at 9:36 PM, Kwork <istherelife@...> wrote:
 
Hello,
I'm looking for a YouTube video downloader that supports playlists, and that is NVDA accessible. I'm not looking for anything that converts, so don't want a program that automatically downloads and converts without saving the original video. I've been using Pontes, but that hasn't been as reliable lately. Thanks for any help.
Travis