Date   

Re: Waves

Gene
 

I'm not being critical and it isn't an inconvenience.  I may still have them but I'll have to look.  But when I see such messages, it could be about wave files, it could be someone saying that they lost this or that exe file they downloaded from the Internet or they lost lots of files because of a disk crash, that immediately raises the question for me as to whether the person is backing things up or even keeping things in the first place such as exe files from the Internet.  When people install programs, they should always keep the exe files.  the programs may become corrupted, they may need to be reinstalled.  You may or may not be able to get them back in future.  People may phrase things so that they may sound critical.  I can't speak for others, but I make such comments because I see, unendingly, people who don't back things up or keep things and one way or another have serious problems as a result.  So it's trying to prevent such problems that motivates me and I assume others to comment.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Waves

Briand and Gene,

Please just disregard.  I will find them independently.  I'm so sorry for
the inconvenience.

Jonathan

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian's
Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 10:41 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Waves

Ah we told you to rename the old ones and then you could have simply copied
them back!

I'm not sure I still have them, anyone?
 Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Jonathan Milam" <milamj@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 2:27 PM
Subject: [nvda] Waves


> Hi All,
>
> Can someone provide me with a link to get the new NVDA Waves folder
> sounds?  They were overwritten by the latest version.
>
> Thanks,
> Jonathan
>
>
>






Re: Waves

Jonathan Milam
 

Briand and Gene,

Please just disregard. I will find them independently. I'm so sorry for
the inconvenience.

Jonathan

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian's
Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 10:41 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Waves

Ah we told you to rename the old ones and then you could have simply copied
them back!

I'm not sure I still have them, anyone?
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Jonathan Milam" <milamj@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 2:27 PM
Subject: [nvda] Waves


Hi All,

Can someone provide me with a link to get the new NVDA Waves folder
sounds? They were overwritten by the latest version.

Thanks,
Jonathan



Re: Important notice for speakers of non-English languages: NVDA's About dialog is shown in English in 2017.4 RC, developers are investigating

Felix G.
 

Hi!
It seems it does not always happen. For me it is displayed in German as it should.
Kind regards,
Felix

Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> schrieb am Fr., 17. Nov. 2017 um 16:37 Uhr:

Hi everyone,

 

A critical regression was found in NVDA 2017.4 RC where NVDA’s about dialog text is shown in English. Developers have identified a possible cause and are actively investigating this issue.

Relevant issue:

https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/7770

 

Cheers,

Joseph

 


Re: Waves

Brian's Mail list account
 

Ah we told you to rename the old ones and then you could have simply copied them back!

I'm not sure I still have them, anyone?
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Jonathan Milam" <milamj@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 2:27 PM
Subject: [nvda] Waves


Hi All,

Can someone provide me with a link to get the new NVDA Waves folder
sounds? They were overwritten by the latest version.

Thanks,
Jonathan


Re: firefox what was the fuss exactly?

Brian's Mail list account
 

Well everyone can raise a bug report on bugzilla but I found it hard to explain things in such a way that their programmers understood, and hence do not do it very often. What is needed is somebody in Mozilla here I think.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Canazzi" <aa2vm@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 12:50 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?


Hi Group,


Boy,this is stunning. I have had no problems of any significance with
Firefox 57. Yet I have no doubt that a good number of people are having
issues. I wonder if system information comparison would help at all.
That is to say: if everyone shared their system information with Mozilla
or some other tech savvy group to see just what factors might be
involved in such widely varying results.



On 11/16/2017 6:41 PM, Gene wrote:
I wonder why people get such different results? Is there anyone on
the list who tests for Mozilla who might report this? Other than
report it, I'm not sure how users might collect information to give a
possible explanation to the developers.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Christopher-Mark Gilland <mailto:clgilland07@...>
*Sent:* Thursday, November 16, 2017 5:13 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

Tried, and no luck.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
http://www.gshministry.org
(980) 500-9575

----- Original Message -----
*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Sent:* Thursday, November 16, 2017 6:01 PM
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

I don't know whether you are using the 64 or 32 bit version but if
you were to use the 32 bit version or the 32 bit version portable,
I'm not sure if there is even a 64 bit version portable, you could
probably get it to work, though we'll have to see if you try it.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Christopher-Mark Gilland <mailto:clgilland07@...>
*Sent:* Thursday, November 16, 2017 3:55 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

Even that! isn't working here. The only screen reader I've kind of
gotten to work with it was Narrator, and even then, it wasn't pretty.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
http://www.gshministry.org
(980) 500-9575

----- Original Message -----
*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Sent:* Thursday, November 16, 2017 3:30 PM
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

Regarding working with the new version of Firefox in Windows
7, I'm not interested in evaluating the new version enough to
test it on a lot of web pages and in a lot of different tasks
such as playing audio. It works here on my Windows 7
machine. the main problem I found is that, when a page loads,
I have to tab when the page should be loaded in order to have
whatever needs to happen for the browser or screen-reader or
whatever the case, to see anything on the page. If I tab and
wait a number of seconds after the page appears to have
loaded, it then works with the screen-reader. Before that, it
appears blank, except that the title bar shows the page that
is, or that is being loaded after the passage of a little time
since I issue the open command. I don't know what would
happen if I tabbed earlier or much earlier, but I've been
waiting until I hear NVDA announce the title bar announcing
the title of the new page. Others may want to experiment with
shorter intervals.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
*Sent:* Wednesday, November 15, 2017 10:08 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

I was clarifying my position because I wasn't sure it was
stated as clearly as it should have been or if it was being
understood as well as it should have been. And I think
despite you evidently disagreeing, that the underlying poingt
is worth considering. Excessive dependence on optional
features may lead to problems in certain contexts. If its your
computer, you can set it up as you wish. If it's a friends
computer or a work computer, or a library computer, you may
not be able to and excessive dependence can make it harder to
do things in various contexts than otherwise.
Gene.
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
<mailto:bglists@...>
*Sent:* Wednesday, November 15, 2017 2:05 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

Since you are determined to have an argument about this, would
you like a
five minute argument or a longer one we have arguments on
offer this week!

Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@... <mailto:gsasner@...>>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>>
Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2017 7:49 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?


There are some sounds that are important because you can't get
information
efficiently about something such as a USB connection in other
ways. I may
not have made it as clear as I should have in my first
message, but I'm
talking specifically about sounds in contexts such as browser
sounds, where
the information can be efficiently gotten in other ways. There
are
advantages and disadvantages in various browsers but making
whether sounds
are available in a browser be a very important factor in
determining whether
to use that browser is, in my opinion, emphasizing sounds that
are optional
to a far more central position than they should be.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: brian
Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2017 1:07 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?


I think that the reason that some blind people
like sounds is it
gives us a indacation of what's going on just like the sighted
can see at
glance. It's like windows sounds. We have the windows music
to let us know
that our computer is on. We have other windows sounds like
the sound we
hear when we plug a thumbdrive in or unplug it. If we did not
hear this
sound we would think that there is a problem but if there was
no sound then
how would we know that there was a problem. Sounds may not be
necessary but
they can really help us greatly to know what is happening. I
don't have my
sounds on in my webie brouser but I would not fault somone if
they did. I
do think that it's important to a sound for down loads because
if there is a
problem with your internet connection then you would know.
Again the
sighted can just look but we can't. Alot of people don't have
good internet
and it can and does loose connection quite frequently.

Brian Sackrider




On 11/14/2017 9:04 AM, Gene wrote:

I want to make my position clear and discuss another aspect
of the current
situation in this rather long message.

If people want to use sounds, there is nothing wrong with
that but you
don't need them and my position is that being so dependent on
them that you
make that a major determining factor on what browser to use is
being too
dependent. That's my position. I didn't say they are
worthless nor that
people shouldn't use them. I'm talking about being too
dependent on one
aspect of a program when that aspect isn't central to the
program and when
there may be better programs in general that don't have this
specific
characteristic.
I'm saying that if someone considers sounds in browsers to
be so important
that that is a major factor in deciding what browser to use, I
consider that
to be too dependent. There are other efficient ways to tell
things when
using a browser. If a page hasn't loaded, you can't move
around. Tabbing
or down arrowing once or twice will tell you. I'm not saying,
as you said,
that they are pointless. I'm saying that almost anything
sounds do, can be
either efficiently inferred or checked by other methods and
that changing
from one browser to another based either only or largely on
sounds, is
making this one characteristic of a browser too important.

I don't want my position to be misunderstood. If people
want to use
sounds, then that's fine; I'm saying that dependence on them
to an
excessive degree is not desirable if it leads to decisions on
what programs
to use in a certain class when trying to decide between
program a and b that
do roughly the same thing. Browsers have various advantages and
disadvantages and sound is only one aspect of a program.
Also, the changes being made in firefox, according to a
review I've read,
make it even faster than Chrome. It isn't much faster, at
least now, and I
don't think it matters but if people read the article about
these changes
posted last week from Marco's Accessibility blog, these
changes may result
in screen-readers being far more capable to work on complex
pages that have
embedded programs or where the pages are far more interactive
than
traditional web pages, and that increasing numbers of web
pages are, and
will be more complex over time. Therefore, I find the
attitude of blaming
Mozilla for what it says it intends to be only a temporary
loss of
performance for blind users, and writing as though they are
going to
permanently use a different browser without even seeing the
results of the
work being done is disturbing. At the moment, Chrome may be
better than
Firefoxs in its latest version because of the changes. But
blind people may
be better served by what Mozilla is doing after the initial
inconvenience.

How often do sighted people complain about things like road
construction
and repair, but would they never use the road again because of
the temporary
inconvenience? They may use a different road during the
repairs and the
road may even be closed at times, but they return to it when
it is in good
order again.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2017 3:11 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?


Well the beta I tried simply refused to say anything but
unknown on any
page, though most of the menus still worked.

I'm not inclined to update since I use the sound,
particularly the one
when
a page has fully loaded and the one that tells me a link has
in fact
activated and of course download complete


I have seen elsewhere where people think these sounds are
pointless. I
dispute this as everyone is different and I really only use
browsers where
I
can actually hear that things are going on. for example I've
always
noticed
that screenreaders sometimes do not figure out the page has
loaded, but
navigational sounds does and hence allows me to re focus the
screenreader.
Also I would not know if a download had completed if the
download pane
was
hidden without a sound.
Some links click but clickables do not so sometimes you can
figure out
what
is which sort of link on a page this way. In a way it would
be even better
if button link and clickable had different sounds to save
one getting
confused.

I think the list of things some of us want in a browser is
obviously going
to be different to what the sighted want, so one will really
need somebody
at Mozilla etc to write blind specific add ons for a browser.
Its far easier when trying to teach somebody how to use a
browser to be
able to say, if you do not hear x then its not worked.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@...
<mailto:sm.everiss@...>>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>>
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2017 6:42 PM
Subject: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?


> Hi.
>
> Well While brousing firefox ftp today I decided to try
firefox 57 as it
> was on releases today.
>
> What exactly was the fuss?
>
> Firefox interface loads fast, no lag, but I havn't tried
big sites maybe
a
> couple seconds for audiogames forum.
>
> Addons, noscript, aparently this will not work till actual
release of
> firefox.
>
> Navigational sounds.
>
> I am trying to find a replacement, the author of this said
that because
> the new interface doesn't allow for registry access one
can't get the
list
> of events to do things with.
>
> I tried 3 of them so far.
>
> Notification sound, noise and download sound.
>
> Download sound has no options or rather any way I can
configure it to
> suit.
>
> Noise has options but there are no default events set and
I tried to add
> what I wanted and define its sounds but I can't set values
and going to
> its website found that while there is a web version all
features are
> basically not there.
>
> Notification sound is another, but its got no options screen.
>
> Something like noise would be fine if it had an default
event list which
> just used the windows schemes directly to the files etc.
>
> I only need web navigation start and end, and download
complete as a
> start.
>
> If there was a way I could easily add events, or something
that would be
> good but I'd like a list for beginners I could import.
>
> Over those though, I did notice and turn on the extra privacy
protection,
> I have left active the unwanted software protection but I
heard from
some
> that this can cause problems.
>
> I also read the article about accessibility services and
how they can be
> misused.
>
> It does say if you have a compatible jaws or nvda active
on your system
> that you should leave this active.
>
> This is interesting, dolphin stuff is not on this list it
makes me
wander,
> while I do use dolphin stuff myself for things their web
stuff is only
for
> ie and ie 6-8 mainly.
>
> Still its an observation only.
>
> I must say off the bat what I really like about firefox
are the easy
> option layouts, I just wish there was a way to extend them
to well have
> extras for addons rather than mucking about with the manager.
>
> I do like the fact you can have arrow navigation on.
>
> I did get noscript revived but when I hit a site with
scripts on it
never
> actually notified me at all.
>
> I guess I have to fiddle with it, I do hope thatnoscript
does go out and
> get released.
>
> Today is the 14th in nz and tomorrow it will be 14th in us
and so, I am
> probably going to have to keep firefox 57 loaded though I
am tempted to
> drop back to 56.02 for now and get my sounds back.
>
>
>
>
>









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Re: 2017.4 RC1 Sluggish in mIRC

Brian's Mail list account
 

Suggestion. run the new one as main installed and the other as a portable for that program.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Hudson" <rob_hudson_3182@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 12:29 PM
Subject: [nvda] 2017.4 RC1 Sluggish in mIRC


I use the chat client mIRC on a daily basis. So this is a rather aggravating NVDA glitch. This is with mIRC 7.45 and NVDA 2017.4 RC1 running as portable copy. Windows 10 1703.
When cycling between windows in the mIRC interface, there is a noticeable lag before NVDA says
"edit multi line"
It can't really keep up with you when cycling windows rapidly, as when multiple channels are opened. Until or if this gets resolved, I will be sticking with 2017.3.


Important notice for speakers of non-English languages: NVDA's About dialog is shown in English in 2017.4 RC, developers are investigating

 

Hi everyone,

 

A critical regression was found in NVDA 2017.4 RC where NVDA’s about dialog text is shown in English. Developers have identified a possible cause and are actively investigating this issue.

Relevant issue:

https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/7770

 

Cheers,

Joseph

 


Re: 2017.4 RC1 Sluggish in mIRC

Brian's Mail list account
 

Has this been reported. I do notice some other strange things but nothing too annoying but then I am not using that software. it might well be due to some code removal so the code is more streamlined not the xp support is gone. Maybe a variable not defined correctly in an app module etc this was an issue found for a commonly used media player a few weeks back now so its worth reporting in an issue.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Hudson" <rob_hudson_3182@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 12:29 PM
Subject: [nvda] 2017.4 RC1 Sluggish in mIRC


I use the chat client mIRC on a daily basis. So this is a rather aggravating NVDA glitch. This is with mIRC 7.45 and NVDA 2017.4 RC1 running as portable copy. Windows 10 1703.
When cycling between windows in the mIRC interface, there is a noticeable lag before NVDA says
"edit multi line"
It can't really keep up with you when cycling windows rapidly, as when multiple channels are opened. Until or if this gets resolved, I will be sticking with 2017.3.


Re: firefox updating and becoming unusable

Brian's Mail list account
 

Ah does it indeed? Interesting. But I'm going to avoid it till at least 59 from what I've been reading recently.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Walmir Schultz via Groups.Io" <wsautodidata@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 10:48 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox updating and becoming unusable


One of the issues may be related with that alert asking if you want to accept web push from the site you are accessing.

If it appears and you press keys to continue reading the web page, all stops working.



Em 16/11/2017 07:29, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io escreveu:
If that is the checkbox its already unchecked by default, next person with a good idea?
Brian

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----- Original Message ----- From: "Dejan Ristic" <r.dejan83@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2017 6:18 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox updating and becoming unusable


Here is a link to solve your puzzle. Do not worry!


https://www.nvaccess.org/post/in-process-halloween-2017-edition/


On 15/11/2017 15:44, Richard Kuzma via Groups.Io wrote:

Can someone tell me what just happened.

I opened firefox and it says is updating to latest version and it updated.

Now it does not work with nvda or even jaws.

Please help.

Thanks




Re: Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

Brian's Mail list account
 

Even on 7 recent updates seem to have speeded stuff up, although its a bit of a mess when you take into account the latest firefox but you do not have to use it do you.


I think in Windows 10 there are still mysterious slow downs in Office.
If I were you and you have been running on 2017.3, I'd check what happened to your voice dictionaries if its bespeak you use. There have been some changes in folders and naming conventions that when that version of Espeak hit the master branch broke the dictionary.
Also there has been some attempt made to make sure the correct dlls run after an update something that tended to cause issues with Firefox old style.

The only weird problem I have had is failure to restart after an update. This is random and can be fixed by actually manually restarting it. I think this has something to do with a routine hanging on o the log file keeping it locked for a little too long sometimes.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "David Moore" <jesusloves1966@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 10:33 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released


Thank you so much Brian!
Just downloaded it and installed 2017.4 RC1.
NVDA just gets better and better all the time!
David Moore
Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: zahra
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 4:08 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

hello brian.
thanks for the link.
i always follow github and read the changes and reports and try my best to help.
its very sad news that i realized that nvda realy does not support my
favorite windows anymore!
God bless you and his infinite mercy i pray for you!

On 11/17/17, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
<bglists@...> wrote:
From: "Michael Curran" <mick@...>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 4:56 AM


Hi all,


NVDA 2017.4rc1 is now available for testing. This is a release
candidate, so unless any critical bugs are found, this will be identical
to the final 2017.4 release.


The official post can be found at:
https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2017-4rc1-released/


Regards

Mick


--
--
Michael Curran
Executive Director, NV Access Limited
PH: +61 7 3149 3306 ext. 101
www: http://www.nvaccess.org/
Twitter: @NVAccess
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess





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Re: Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

Brian's Mail list account
 

I don't think it was an option once the need to use routines in later windows core was needed. Microsoft changed the way many functions were designed when windows 7 came out and as things have progressed to Windows 10 it was becoming very hard to keep the two going.
Of course if enough programmers are out there who are interested, there is nothing to stop them picking up the source of 2017.3 and making it better if they have the expertise. That is the thing about Open Source.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "zahra" <nasrinkhaksar3@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 9:08 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released


hello brian.
thanks for the link.
i always follow github and read the changes and reports and try my best to help.
its very sad news that i realized that nvda realy does not support my
favorite windows anymore!
God bless you and his infinite mercy i pray for you!

On 11/17/17, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
<bglists@...> wrote:
From: "Michael Curran" <mick@...>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 4:56 AM


Hi all,


NVDA 2017.4rc1 is now available for testing. This is a release
candidate, so unless any critical bugs are found, this will be identical
to the final 2017.4 release.


The official post can be found at:
https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2017-4rc1-released/


Regards

Mick


--
--
Michael Curran
Executive Director, NV Access Limited
PH: +61 7 3149 3306 ext. 101
www: http://www.nvaccess.org/
Twitter: @NVAccess
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess





--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:
indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
www.al-islam.org


Re: Waves

Gene
 

You should keep everything you don't want to lose.  I don't know if you back things up but that applies to backing things up as well.  Never assume you won't lose something, even something like this.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 8:27 AM
Subject: [nvda] Waves

Hi All,

Can someone provide me with a link to get the new NVDA Waves folder
sounds?  They were overwritten by the latest version.

Thanks,
Jonathan



Waves

Jonathan Milam
 

Hi All,

Can someone provide me with a link to get the new NVDA Waves folder
sounds? They were overwritten by the latest version.

Thanks,
Jonathan


Re: firefox what was the fuss exactly?

Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Group,


Boy,this is stunning. I have had no problems of any significance with Firefox 57.  Yet I have no doubt that a good number of people are having issues.  I wonder if system information comparison would help at all.  That is to say: if everyone shared their system information with Mozilla or some other tech savvy group to see just what factors might be involved in such widely varying results.



On 11/16/2017 6:41 PM, Gene wrote:
I wonder why people get such different results?  Is there anyone on the list who tests for Mozilla who might report this?  Other than report it, I'm not sure how users might collect information to give a possible explanation to the developers.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, November 16, 2017 5:13 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

Tried, and no luck.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, November 16, 2017 6:01 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

I don't know whether you are using the 64 or 32 bit version but if you were to use the 32 bit version or the 32 bit version portable, I'm not sure if there is even a 64 bit version portable, you could probably get it to work, though we'll have to see if you try it. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, November 16, 2017 3:55 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

Even that! isn't working here. The only screen reader I've kind of gotten to work with it was Narrator, and even then, it wasn't pretty.
---
Christopher Gilland
Co-founder of Genuine Safe Haven Ministries
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, November 16, 2017 3:30 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

Regarding working with the new version of Firefox in Windows 7, I'm not interested in evaluating the new version enough to test it on a lot of web pages and in a lot of different tasks such as playing audio. It works here on my Windows 7 machine.  the main problem I found is that, when a page loads, I have to tab when the page should be loaded in order to have whatever needs to happen for the browser or screen-reader or whatever the case, to see anything on the page.  If I tab and wait a number of seconds after the page appears to have loaded, it then works with the screen-reader.  Before that, it appears blank, except that the title bar shows the page that is, or that is being loaded after the passage of a little time since I issue the open command.  I don't know what would happen if I tabbed earlier or much earlier, but I've been waiting until I hear NVDA announce the title bar announcing the title of the new page.  Others may want to experiment with shorter intervals.
 
Gene 
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2017 10:08 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

I was clarifying my position because I wasn't sure it was stated as clearly as it should have been or if it was being understood as well as it should have been.  And I think despite you evidently disagreeing, that the underlying poingt is worth considering.  Excessive dependence on optional features may lead to problems in certain contexts.  If its your computer, you can set it up as you wish.  If it's a friends computer or a work computer, or a library computer, you may not be able to and excessive dependence can make it harder to do things in various contexts than otherwise.
 
Gene. 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2017 2:05 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?

Since you are determined to have an argument about this, would you like a
five minute argument or a longer one we have arguments on offer this week!

Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2017 7:49 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?


There are some sounds that are important because you can't get information
efficiently about something such as a USB connection in other ways.  I may
not have made it as clear as I should have in my first message, but I'm
talking specifically about sounds in contexts such as browser sounds, where
the information can be efficiently gotten in other ways.  There are
advantages and disadvantages in various browsers but making whether sounds
are available in a browser be a very important factor in determining whether
to use that browser is, in my opinion, emphasizing sounds that are optional
to a far more central position than they should be.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: brian
Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2017 1:07 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?


            I think that the reason that some blind people like sounds is it
gives us a indacation of what's going on just like the sighted can see at
glance.  It's like windows sounds.  We have the windows music to let us know
that our computer is on.  We have other windows sounds like the sound we
hear when we plug a thumbdrive in or unplug it.  If we did not hear this
sound we would think that there is a problem but if there was no sound then
how would we know that there was a problem.  Sounds may not be necessary but
they can really help us greatly to know what is happening.  I don't have my
sounds on in my webie brouser but I would not fault somone if they did.  I
do think that it's important to a sound for down loads because if there is a
problem with your internet connection then you would know.  Again the
sighted can just look but we can't.  Alot of people don't have good internet
and it can and does loose connection quite frequently.

Brian Sackrider




On 11/14/2017 9:04 AM, Gene wrote:

  I want to make my position clear and discuss another aspect of the current
situation in this rather long message.

  If people want to use sounds, there is nothing wrong with that but you
don't need them and my position is that being so dependent on them that you
make that a major determining factor on what browser to use is being too
dependent.  That's my position.  I didn't say they are worthless nor that
people shouldn't use them.  I'm talking about being too dependent on one
aspect of a program when that aspect isn't central to the program and when
there may be better programs in general that don't have this specific
characteristic.
  I'm saying that if someone considers sounds in browsers to be so important
that that is a major factor in deciding what browser to use, I consider that
to be too dependent.  There are other efficient ways to tell things when
using a browser.  If a page hasn't loaded, you can't move around.  Tabbing
or down arrowing once or twice will tell you.  I'm not saying, as you said,
that they are pointless.  I'm saying that almost anything sounds do, can be
either efficiently inferred or checked by other methods and that changing
from one browser to another based either only or largely on sounds, is
making this one characteristic of a browser too important.

  I don't want my position to be misunderstood.  If people want to use
sounds, then that's fine;  I'm saying that dependence on them to an
excessive degree is not desirable if it leads to decisions on what programs
to use in a certain class when trying to decide between program a and b that
do roughly the same thing.  Browsers have various advantages and
disadvantages and sound is only one aspect of a program.
  Also, the changes being made in firefox, according to a review I've read,
make it even faster than Chrome.  It isn't much faster, at least now, and I
don't think it matters but if people read the article about these changes
posted last week from Marco's Accessibility blog, these changes may result
in screen-readers being far more capable to work on complex pages that have
embedded programs or where the pages are far more interactive than
traditional web pages, and that increasing numbers of web pages are, and
will be more complex over time.  Therefore, I find the attitude of blaming
Mozilla for what it says it intends to be only a temporary loss of
performance for blind users, and writing as though they are going to
permanently use a different browser without even seeing the results of the
work being done is disturbing.  At the moment, Chrome may be better than
Firefoxs in its latest version because of the changes.  But blind people may
be better served by what Mozilla is doing after the initial inconvenience.

  How often do sighted people complain about things like road construction
and repair, but would they never use the road again because of the temporary
inconvenience?  They may use a different road during the repairs and the
road may even be closed at times, but they return to it when it is in good
order again.

  Gene
  ----- Original Message -----

  From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
  Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2017 3:11 AM
  To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
  Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?


  Well the beta I tried simply refused to say anything but unknown on any
  page, though most of the menus still worked.

  I'm not inclined to update since I use the sound, particularly the one
when
  a page has fully loaded and the one that tells me a link has in fact
  activated and of course download complete


  I have seen elsewhere where people think these sounds are pointless. I
  dispute this as everyone is different and I really only use browsers where
I
  can actually hear that things are going on. for example I've always
noticed
  that screenreaders sometimes do not figure out the page has loaded, but
  navigational sounds does and hence allows me to re focus the screenreader.
   Also I would not know if a download had completed if the download pane
was
  hidden without a sound.
   Some links click but clickables do not so sometimes you can figure out
what
  is which sort of link on a page this way. In a way it would be even better
  if button link and clickable had different sounds to save one getting
  confused.

  I think the list of things some of us want in a browser is obviously going
  to be different to what the sighted want, so one will really need somebody
  at Mozilla etc to write blind specific add ons for a browser.
   Its far easier when trying to teach somebody how to use a browser to be
  able to say, if you do not hear x then its not worked.
   Brian

  bglists@...
  Sent via blueyonder.
  Please address personal email to:-
  briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
  in the display name field.
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@...>
  To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
  Sent: Monday, November 13, 2017 6:42 PM
  Subject: [nvda] firefox what was the fuss exactly?


  > Hi.
  >
  > Well While brousing firefox ftp today I decided to try firefox 57 as it
  > was on releases today.
  >
  > What exactly was the fuss?
  >
  > Firefox interface loads fast, no lag, but I havn't tried big sites maybe
a
  > couple seconds for audiogames forum.
  >
  > Addons, noscript, aparently this will not work till actual release of
  > firefox.
  >
  > Navigational sounds.
  >
  > I am trying to find a replacement, the author of this said that because
  > the new interface doesn't allow for registry access one can't get the
list
  > of events to do things with.
  >
  > I tried 3 of them so far.
  >
  > Notification sound, noise and download sound.
  >
  > Download sound has no options or rather any way I can configure it to
  > suit.
  >
  > Noise has options but there are no default events set and I tried to add
  > what I wanted and define its sounds but I can't set values and going to
  > its website found that while there is a web version all features are
  > basically not there.
  >
  > Notification sound is another, but its got no options screen.
  >
  > Something like noise would be fine if it had an default event list which
  > just used the windows schemes directly to the files etc.
  >
  > I only need web navigation start and end, and download complete as a
  > start.
  >
  > If there was a way I could easily add events, or something that would be
  > good but I'd like a list for beginners I could import.
  >
  > Over those though, I did notice and turn on the extra privacy
protection,
  > I have left active the unwanted software protection but I heard from
some
  > that this can cause problems.
  >
  > I also read the article about accessibility services and how they can be
  > misused.
  >
  > It does say if you have a compatible jaws or nvda active on your system
  > that you should leave this active.
  >
  > This is interesting, dolphin stuff is not on this list it makes me
wander,
  > while I do use dolphin stuff myself for things their web stuff is only
for
  > ie and ie 6-8 mainly.
  >
  > Still its an observation only.
  >
  > I must say off the bat what I really like about firefox are the easy
  > option layouts, I just wish there was a way to extend them to well have
  > extras for addons rather than mucking about with the manager.
  >
  > I do like the fact you can have arrow navigation on.
  >
  > I did get noscript revived but when I hit a site with scripts on it
never
  > actually notified me at all.
  >
  > I guess I have to fiddle with it, I do hope thatnoscript does go out and
  > get released.
  >
  > Today is the 14th in nz and tomorrow it will be 14th in us and so, I am
  > probably going to have to keep firefox 57 loaded though I am tempted to
  > drop back to 56.02 for now and get my sounds back.
  >
  >
  >
  >
  >










-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


2017.4 RC1 Sluggish in mIRC

Rob Hudson <rob_hudson_3182@...>
 

I use the chat client mIRC on a daily basis. So this is a rather aggravating NVDA glitch. This is with mIRC 7.45 and NVDA 2017.4 RC1 running as portable copy. Windows 10 1703.
When cycling between windows in the mIRC interface, there is a noticeable lag before NVDA says
"edit multi line"
It can't really keep up with you when cycling windows rapidly, as when multiple channels are opened. Until or if this gets resolved, I will be sticking with 2017.3.


Re: Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

Adriani Botez
 

Windows 10 will become your favorite Windows. Believe me it is so much better than the versions before...

Best
Adriani


Von meinem iPhone gesendet

Am 17.11.2017 um 10:08 schrieb zahra <nasrinkhaksar3@...>:

hello brian.
thanks for the link.
i always follow github and read the changes and reports and try my best to help.
its very sad news that i realized that nvda realy does not support my
favorite windows anymore!
God bless you and his infinite mercy i pray for you!

On 11/17/17, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
<bglists@...> wrote:
From: "Michael Curran" <mick@...>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 4:56 AM


Hi all,


NVDA 2017.4rc1 is now available for testing. This is a release
candidate, so unless any critical bugs are found, this will be identical
to the final 2017.4 release.


The official post can be found at:
https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2017-4rc1-released/


Regards

Mick


--
--
Michael Curran
Executive Director, NV Access Limited
PH: +61 7 3149 3306 ext. 101
www: http://www.nvaccess.org/
Twitter: @NVAccess
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess





--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:
indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
www.al-islam.org



Re: Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

Mário Navarro
 



Yes, wonderful!
now NVDA can already memorize the focus at the point of start in html content.
in google chrome!
wow this is fantastic!

Thank you, thank you!

long life to NVDA.

Cheers.


Às 10:33 de 17/11/2017, David Moore escreveu:

Thank you so much Brian!

Just downloaded it and installed 2017.4 RC1.

NVDA just gets better and better all the time!

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: zahra
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 4:08 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

 

hello brian.

thanks for the link.

i always follow github and read the changes and reports and try my best to help.

its very sad news that i realized that nvda realy does not support my

favorite windows anymore!

God bless you and his infinite mercy i pray for you!

 

On 11/17/17, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io

<bglists@...> wrote:

> From: "Michael Curran" <mick@...>

> Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 4:56 AM

>> Hi all,

>> 

>> 

>> NVDA 2017.4rc1 is now available for testing. This is a release

>> candidate, so unless any critical bugs are found, this will be identical

>> to the final 2017.4 release.

>> 

>> 

>> The official post can be found at:

>> https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2017-4rc1-released/

>> 

>> 

>> Regards

>> 

>> Mick

>> 

>> 

>> --

>> --

>> Michael Curran

>> Executive Director, NV Access Limited

>> PH: +61 7 3149 3306 ext. 101

>> www: http://www.nvaccess.org/

>> Twitter: @NVAccess

>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess

>> 

>> 

>

 

 

--

we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.

holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.

in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:

indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.

best website for studying islamic book in different languages

www.al-islam.org

 

 

 



Re: Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

David Moore
 

Yes, Thank you all!

I access so many programs and apps that I cannot access with any other screen reader.

Along with all of the add ons, NVDA is indeed a full reliable screen reader. I am using Edge with ease, and many of the win10 apps like NEWS, and the Mail, Calendar, and People apps. Thank you all!

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Robert Mendoza
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 5:47 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

 

Thanks for sharing this, Brian. Also, I would like to have the opportunity to say that nvda really impress me all the time. To all the contributors, partners, testers, admin, and developers thank you for the hardship and effort in making this as premier screen reader.

Robert Mendoza

On 11/17/2017 6:33 PM, David Moore wrote:

Thank you so much Brian!

Just downloaded it and installed 2017.4 RC1.

NVDA just gets better and better all the time!

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: zahra
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 4:08 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

 

hello brian.

thanks for the link.

i always follow github and read the changes and reports and try my best to help.

its very sad news that i realized that nvda realy does not support my

favorite windows anymore!

God bless you and his infinite mercy i pray for you!

 

On 11/17/17, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io

<bglists@...> wrote:

> From: "Michael Curran" <mick@...>

> Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 4:56 AM

>> Hi all,

>> 

>> 

>> NVDA 2017.4rc1 is now available for testing. This is a release

>> candidate, so unless any critical bugs are found, this will be identical

>> to the final 2017.4 release.

>> 

>> 

>> The official post can be found at:

>> https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2017-4rc1-released/

>> 

>> 

>> Regards

>> 

>> Mick

>> 

>> 

>> --

>> --

>> Michael Curran

>> Executive Director, NV Access Limited

>> PH: +61 7 3149 3306 ext. 101

>> www: http://www.nvaccess.org/

>> Twitter: @NVAccess

>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess

>> 

>> 

>

 

 

--

we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.

holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.

in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:

indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.

best website for studying islamic book in different languages

www.al-islam.org

 

 

 

 

 


Re: firefox updating and becoming unusable

Walmir Schultz <wsautodidata@...>
 

One of the issues may be related with that alert asking if you want to accept web push from the site you are accessing.

If it appears and you press keys to continue reading the web page, all stops working.



Em 16/11/2017 07:29, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io escreveu:

If that is the checkbox its already unchecked by default, next person with a good idea?
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Dejan Ristic" <r.dejan83@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2017 6:18 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] firefox updating and becoming unusable


Here is a link to solve your puzzle. Do not worry!


https://www.nvaccess.org/post/in-process-halloween-2017-edition/


On 15/11/2017 15:44, Richard Kuzma via Groups.Io wrote:

Can someone tell me what just happened.

I opened firefox and it says is updating to latest version and it updated.

Now it does not work with nvda or even jaws.

Please help.

Thanks



Re: Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

Robert Mendoza
 

Thanks for sharing this, Brian. Also, I would like to have the opportunity to say that nvda really impress me all the time. To all the contributors, partners, testers, admin, and developers thank you for the hardship and effort in making this as premier screen reader.

Robert Mendoza
On 11/17/2017 6:33 PM, David Moore wrote:

Thank you so much Brian!

Just downloaded it and installed 2017.4 RC1.

NVDA just gets better and better all the time!

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: zahra
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 4:08 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Fw: [Nvda-devel] NVDA 2017.4rc1 released

 

hello brian.

thanks for the link.

i always follow github and read the changes and reports and try my best to help.

its very sad news that i realized that nvda realy does not support my

favorite windows anymore!

God bless you and his infinite mercy i pray for you!

 

On 11/17/17, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io

<bglists@...> wrote:

> From: "Michael Curran" <mick@...>

> Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 4:56 AM

>> Hi all,

>> 

>> 

>> NVDA 2017.4rc1 is now available for testing. This is a release

>> candidate, so unless any critical bugs are found, this will be identical

>> to the final 2017.4 release.

>> 

>> 

>> The official post can be found at:

>> https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2017-4rc1-released/

>> 

>> 

>> Regards

>> 

>> Mick

>> 

>> 

>> --

>> --

>> Michael Curran

>> Executive Director, NV Access Limited

>> PH: +61 7 3149 3306 ext. 101

>> www: http://www.nvaccess.org/

>> Twitter: @NVAccess

>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess

>> 

>> 

>

 

 

--

we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.

holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.

in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:

indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.

best website for studying islamic book in different languages

www.al-islam.org