Date   

Re: Caption location

Gene
 

Is it more likely that you could use a portable version of NVDA than the installed version?  You can run it portable not even on the machine, but on a thumb drive.  Doing that may be against policy, but I want to bring up all possibilities.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 3:13 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Caption location

Jaws runs in 40 minute (trial) mode, though when it runs out, you’ll need to restart to use it again. They do need to update your list as Window Eyes and Jaws merged like a year ago…

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of tonea.ctr.morrow@...
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:00 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Caption location

 

I went through the approved list of software and found JAWS and Window Eyes and Zoom Text. I know I won’t get JAWS because it is too expensive. You really, really have to justify that much money.

 

I did put in a request for NVDA on the chance that my copy of approved software is outdated. If it isn’t approved, it doesn’t matter if it is free.

 

We’ll see what comes of things.

 

Tonea

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 12:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Caption location

 

If the texts are to be packaged as PDF it becomes even more important to have a screenreader as tagging the reading order through a document is very very important.

Brian

 


Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: Caption location

Rayn Darren
 

MAGic is actually better than Zoom Text, has more speech as far as I can remember, but it has the same issue as Jaws, 40 minute mode.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Moore
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:05 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Caption location

 

well, window-eyes is no longer available and Zoomtext is more of a magnification program although it does have some screen reading capability although it is somewhat limited.

 

However, these changes are recent and big orgs move slowly so this might still be the approved list!

 

Hope not.

 

Contact me on skype: brian.moore
follow me on twitter:
http://www.twitter.com/bmoore123

On 12/13/2017 1:59 PM, tonea.ctr.morrow@... wrote:

I went through the approved list of software and found JAWS and Window Eyes and Zoom Text. I know I won’t get JAWS because it is too expensive. You really, really have to justify that much money.

 

I did put in a request for NVDA on the chance that my copy of approved software is outdated. If it isn’t approved, it doesn’t matter if it is free.

 

We’ll see what comes of things.

 

Tonea

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 12:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Caption location

 

If the texts are to be packaged as PDF it becomes even more important to have a screenreader as tagging the reading order through a document is very very important.

Brian

 

 


Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: Caption location

Rayn Darren
 

Jaws runs in 40 minute (trial) mode, though when it runs out, you’ll need to restart to use it again. They do need to update your list as Window Eyes and Jaws merged like a year ago…

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of tonea.ctr.morrow@...
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:00 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Caption location

 

I went through the approved list of software and found JAWS and Window Eyes and Zoom Text. I know I won’t get JAWS because it is too expensive. You really, really have to justify that much money.

 

I did put in a request for NVDA on the chance that my copy of approved software is outdated. If it isn’t approved, it doesn’t matter if it is free.

 

We’ll see what comes of things.

 

Tonea

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 12:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Caption location

 

If the texts are to be packaged as PDF it becomes even more important to have a screenreader as tagging the reading order through a document is very very important.

Brian

 


Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: Website Where NVDA does not read main article

Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Group,


I guess I'm getting old.  The article body is way below the headers.  I saw the reference to the 'next article' about IBM devices and then the large advertisement and I got lazy and didn't read any further.  Sorry for the misinformation.




On 12/13/2017 2:26 PM, Gene wrote:
My suggestion evidently won't work in this case because this is the actual page of the article.  Did you read below the links?  there is a brief advertisement and I see the article below that.  I don't know what the links are supposed to do but let us know if you can see the article if you let the page read.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 1:06 PM
Subject: [nvda] Website Where NVDA does not read main article

Hi Group,


I am using both Firefox and Edge browser.  When I visit the following
website for a fix for the WIFI vulnerability, all I see under the
article title located half way down the page are 9 links that when
activated, go no where.  I wonder just what is going on and how it can
be remedied.


https://techcrunch.com/2017/10/16/heres-what-you-can-do-to-protect-yourself-from-the-krack-wifi-vulnerability/


--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"




-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: nvda unresponsiveness

Sarah k Alawami
 

I have. that's why I'm recomding  them. The process is fully accessible and they get the building done in under 2 weeks. Or maybe a bit over two weeks. You select the programs and you can even have a logo on the case if you want. You can even if you want to have them shipp it in a wooden crate, I did not do this by the way. But the crate is thick and protects from bumps. I didn't want that, but the machine still is awesome, I even have a kenzington  lock for my machine as well. I emailed them after I placed the order  and asked them to turn the volume all the way up so I can complete the set up myself. That was awesome, they did it all for me and helped me with anything else I needed.. They would have probably installed nvda if I wanted them to as well, but I didn't as I had a ninite installer on a flash drive I use for such things.

Take care and be blessed.

On Dec 13, 2017, at 10:46 AM, Casey <cwollner@...> wrote:

hi have you order A machine from them before?

If so how and you tell them what all you want in the machine and how do you select your drives and programs and all of that?




On 12/13/2017 12:17 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
If you want a pc with no bloat ware go to this link. They are wonderful and they even sell gear. Oh and all of the pcs are built in my birth  place in the USA.


On Dec 12, 2017, at 10:39 PM, Shaun Everiss <sm.everiss@...> wrote:

Yeah, ms office, a few wild tangent games and mcafee, why they insist on that is really beyond me.

When I get my gaming laptop, I am seriously going to outright ask for a driver disk, and a stright out win10 disk and see what they do, or an image without the demos and crap on it, I'll even pay a little extra for it not being included.

Heck, I don't need their recovery image, win10 talks now so as long as I can get their site working and all the serials and things I can make it all work enough!

Then again, a lot of the software that toshiba and hp have are usually usefull.

Sadly their support app is inacurate its good to copy product info off but thats it sadly.

I do think though that there needs to be some program or batch written to fix these dll issues though.




On 11/12/2017 11:17 p.m., Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
Yes indeed HP laptops if purchased from one of the big stores nearly always come with clutter. They have lots of junk, erm useful demos of expensive software on them and the first job really is to look at what is on there and remove all the unwanted stuff. However do be careful with demos of Microsoft Offiice as  uninstalling these has a history of screwing up the registry for screenreader users.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene" <gsasner@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, December 11, 2017 6:26 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda unresponsiveness


At this point, we don't know enough to form proper opinions or conclusions. One thing that should be checked is whether something is using more processor power than it should.  I don't recall what version of Windows you are running but once you tell us, people can tell you how to see how much processor power is being used by everything on your system in total.  If the number is excessively high, we can start looking at the amount of power individual programs use.  This problem may be the result of something using a lot of computer resources and whatever it is may be able to be removed or stopped if it isn't needed.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Marisane Moruthanyana
Sent: Monday, December 11, 2017 12:13 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda unresponsiveness


Hi Kevin

I often use internet explorer as my browser.

Yes, I sometimes use firefox, but the problem is the same.

Although I am not 100% sure, I would like to conclude that the problem
is caused by the type of processor and the speed on my machine.

Why, because on my other laptop which use intel (R(core(tm)I4 with 4GB
memory, nvda respons very well without this problem.

My new HP laptop which gives me this problem use intel (r) seleron
processor at the speed of 1.6 GHZ.

Hope you understand.

Marisane

On 12/10/17, Kevin Cussick via Groups.Io
<the.big.white.shepherd@...> wrote:
I only see this using firefox sometimes when arrowing down a page it
stops talking and you just have to wait I have the latest Sr of ff sorry
not sure what the latest Sr is but I got an update yesterday for the Esr
sorry I have said Sr it should have been Esr sorry.

On 10/12/2017 12:17, Gerardo Corripio wrote:
Might you have too many AddOns installed? Try running NVDA without the
AddOns: For this, NVDA+qq, and a dialogue should come up asking you what
you want to do; among these options is Start NVDA without AddOns. See if
this helps, to see if maybe it's an AddOn taht's causing this slowness?


El 10/12/2017 a las 03:11 a.m., Marisane Moruthanyana escribió:
Morning nvda users

I am Marisane from SA.

I have, for sometime now, been looking for your assistance regarding
nvda unresponsiveness but to no avail.

I have recently upgraded to nvda 2017.4, but the unresponsiveness
still persists.

May I know whether this may be due to my laptop's using intel seleron
processor at a speed of less than 2ghz?

Does the processor type and its speed have any impact on nvda's
functionality / dysfunctionality?

What processor and speed should one take into account when buying a
laptop so that nvda may respond positively?

I am frustrated, because this happens only with nvda and not with jaws.

I use jaws demo as I have no licence for it to do some work on my PC,
but it responds very well that I do not have the same problems as
those with nvda.

If the processor type and its speed are the cause of nvda'
unresponsiveness, why only it and not other screen reader like jaws?

Your urgent assistance in this regard is appreciated in advance.

Please, please, please help, I am getting frustrated everyday.

I solely rely on nvda as my jaws is only 40 minutes.

Hope you understand.

Regards
Marisane














.







-- 

Casey


Re: Recently updated on accessibilitycentral.net

abdul muhamin
 

Wow, good work. Keepit up

 

regards, Abdulmuhamin Yousaf!
head of content department at
www.blindHelp.net

 

From: Gene New Zealand
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 1:01 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Recently updated on accessibilitycentral.net

 

Hi guys

Pages recently updated
Recently updated: Added links to NVDA Guides on all NVDA related pages

New: Added a tutorial How to access safe mode in Windows and exit it with the NVDA screen reader by Hareth  and co to the NVDA audio tutorials page under the troubleshooting section http://accessibilitycentral.net/nvda%20audio%20tutorials.html Added a tutorial (by Gene Asner) called Navigating ribbons in WordPad (to the NVDA tutorials learning the basics page) http://accessibilitycentral.net/nvda%20tutorials%20learning%20the%20basics.html Added a tutorial called Using the Ribbon interface in Windows via the keyboard (by Brian Vogel) to the NVDA tutorials for Windows 10 page. http://accessibilitycentral.net/nvda%20tutorials%20for%20windows%2010.html

Gene NZ

--

Check out my website for NVDA tutorials and other blindness related material at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net Regardless of where you are in New Zealand if you are near one of the APNK sites you can use a copy of the NVDA screen reader on one of their computers. To find out which locations (or location) is near to you please visit http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries (Aotearoa People's Network Kaharoa). To find an NVDA certified expert near you, please visit the following link https://certification.nvaccess.org/. The certification page contains the official list of NVDA certified individuals from around the world, who have sat and successfully passed the NVDA expert exam.

 


Re: Request for comments: Should I record 2018 edition ofWelcome to NVDA tutorials set?

abdul muhamin
 

Hi Josaph, your tutorials are best, I’m waiting for your tutorial, please record it soon!

 

regards, Abdulmuhamin Yousaf!
head of content department at
www.blindHelp.net

 

From: zahra
Sent: Saturday, December 9, 2017 10:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Request for comments: Should I record 2018 edition ofWelcome to NVDA tutorials set?

 

hello joseph.

your tutorial and posts to the list are very great.

i remember my first experience using nvda with farsi translated of

your tutorial for nvda 2013

it was very great and helped me in many ways.

i realy wish that have your english tutorial and appreciate your help.

i sincerely pray for you every day and request divine infinite mercy

and special blessings for you!

 

On 12/9/17, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> wrote:

> Dear global NVDA community,

> After reading recent threads on various NVDA lists and looking at some

> tweets, I find myself asking if I should do it again: record the 2018

> edition of the popular "Welcome to NVDA" tutorials set. The thing is, there

> are more superb tutorials out now, including NV Access's own Basic Training

> module. I do understand that many folks have come to know NVDA through my

> tutorials and some tutorials used mine as a reference or a guide.

> For reference, the 2015 edition of this tutorials set can be found at:

> http://www.josephsl.net/tutorials

> If the community says I should record the 2018 edition, it'll be done with

> some conditions:

> *        The tutorial will be based on a combination of 2017.4 and latest

> snapshot features.

> *        I'll be using Windows 10 Version 1709 (Fall Creators Update).

> *        I will not ask for payment for this set; if you insist on paying me,

> I'd rather ask you to donate to NV Access.

> *        If possible, I'll come up with a text transcript and a way for folks

> to provide edits via pull requests on GitHub.

> *        I'll be moving away from Internet Explorer for browse mode

> demonstrations, opting for Firefox and Microsoft Edge.

> Below is a list of changes between 2015 and 2018 editions provided you say

> I

> should do it:

> *        I'll be using Windows OneCore voices for most speech demos.

> *        Chapter 1 (Intro) will be expanded and re-recorded to improve

> recording quality, as well as adding additional information such as command

> line switches to start a portable copy after creating one and a note on

> Controlled Folder Access.

> *        Chapter 2 (Basics) will go over more touchscreen possibilities, some

> command changes (including copying the contents of status bars) and others.

> *        Chapter 3 (Objects and object navigation) will feature new examples,

> especially more universal app examples.

> *        Chapter 4 (Browsing the web) will feature reading PDF documents with

> Microsoft Edge, turning off single letter navigation commands on the fly

> and

> elements list improvements.

> *        Chapter 5 (Apps) will feature new and updated examples.

> *        Chapters 6 and 7 (Configuration) will feature new settings,

> including Windows 10 OCR and many others.

> *        Chapter 8 (tools) will feature content recognition.

> *        Chapter 9 (Add-ons) will feature new and updated examples, including

> Remote Support add-on.

> *        Addenda may include a word on ARM64 support, development snapshots

> and what not.

> Comments are appreciated.

> Cheers,

> Joseph

 

 

--

we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.

holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.

in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:

indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.

best website for studying islamic book in different languages

www.al-islam.org

 

 

 


Re: Parenthesis

Gene
 

That's beyond my knowledge but someone will probably answer the question.  It's no reflection on you that you didn't think of it.  Why should you?  the only reason I know about it is that I've gone to web pages that say things such as screen-reader users, follow this link to do this or that and I've seen discussions of how this is done to make them invisible for sighted users. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 1:38 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Parenthesis

Bouncing my forehead against my palm, “Duh!”

 

I do that kind of thing all the time, why didn’t I think of doing it for the screen reader?

 

For example, I needed to make a table of contents for graphics within a PDF. I put the graphic on the line, the customary leader of five alternating periods and spaces and then where the page number would go was left blank. I then put an anchor on the graphic where it was used in the document. I went back to the leader periods and made them a hyperlink to the anchor. When I made the file a PDF, I turned off coloring and underlining the links. Thus, to a sighted person, the leader dots between the graphic and the page number don’t look like a hyperlink. And, the PDF inserted the page numbers for me. To the PDF, it thought it was inserting page numbers for the link. To the sighted person, they are page numbers to the graphic!

 

Sadly, for you , it would have read something like “Start hyperlink Start . . . . . page 3”. Which begs the question, does NVDA read pdf page references?  --Sorry for the digression.

 

Anyway, I’ll look into your suggestion.

 

Tonea

 

----- Original Message -----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 1:13 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Parenthesis

 

One thing you could do is add an extra line at the end of the text, using black on black contrast.  Screen-readers will read it but people won't see it.  The line might list the wildcard characters and make whatever brief comments you have in mind.  You might want to write out the signs such as with the word asterisk.  But if it is preferable for sighted users to leave the line they would see as it is, this would avoid any degreedation of the site from a sighted user's point of view.

 

Gene

 

 


Re: Parenthesis

Gene
 

I have no objection to altering web pages in ways that screen-readers can read them and that don't degrade the page for sighted users.  But making changes that degrade the page for sighted users isn't in the interest of blind people, I would argue.  It doesn't help the image of blind people if sighted people learn that a web page has been altered to make it less attractive or usable to them.  Blind people can and should get tutorials or some sort of instruction on using computers including the Internet.  If they don't know about such instruction, then more efforts to inform the general public should be made.
 
Where do you draw the line?   A small modification here and there that may make a site less intuitave for a sighted user and from there, how do you deal with this argument or problem? 
 
Screen-readers render web sites in the following manner:
The links a sighted person sees running down the left side of the page, the blind person seess as a block at the top.  Below that, is the main text a sighted person sees running ddown the right side of the screen, the blind person sees as a block at the bottom of the screen.  Unfortunately, for various reasons, large numbers of blind people don't learn how to navigate pages well on the Internet.  Leaving aside the reasons for this in this message, if someone argued that the links that run down the left side of web pages should be removed, would you favor that?  As I said, where do you draw the line?  Removing those links would mean that a blind person could go to a page with an article and just start reading the article without knowing how to move to it.  At present, there are many ways a blind person can efficiently find an article in the majority of cases.  the person can try moving by heading because the article often begins with a heading.  Screen-readers, in addition to move by heading commands, also have a command that skips blocks of links and that command, if executed once or twice, often puts the person at or close to the start of the article.  If a blind person doesn't know these sorts of things, the Internet will be very cumbersome to use.  But you can't change the Internet in ways like removing the links that run down the left sides of web pages.  Blind people need to learn how to do these things. 
 
I'm not advocating technical bias.  I'm advocating education.  If you make small changes such as writing the word asterisk instead of star, that may be innocuous.  But I suspect that the reason you originally used * is because sighted people immediately see the symbol and, whether they are sure what an asterisk is or not, they know what a * is or if they have any doubts, they can find it on their keyboards.  If you try to do too much accomodation that degrades web pages for them, it may cause resentment among sighted people and that isn't good for blind people in the long run.  I firmly don't believe in degrading things for sighted users.  If accomodations can be made that don't cause degredation, that's fine, as in my previous message, where I discussed using black on black contrast.  There are all sorts of accomodations that can be made that don't degrade the page for sighted users.
 
Also, if it is not a degredation to write something like asterisk  that's fine, too.  But I'm saying that in accomodating blind users, it is important not to degrade the page for sighted users.  You may not have any such accomodations in mind, but I'm presenting my position in case it helps you decide which accomodations are reasonable and which not and when to ask about accomodations that wouldn't degrade a page but would still benefit blind people.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Parenthesis

I disagree. My grandmother went deaf when she got into her seventies. I saw how it isolated her. She couldn’t get phone calls from her sons who lived out of state. People would get frustrated with her. Or, she would see how frustrated they were getting and then get frustrated herself because she was doing the best she could.

 

Proper communication is a fundamental human right essential to everyone’s well-being, in my opinion. But, I’m a loud mouth.

 

Changing sidewalks for wheel chair access made it easier for the blind, or so I am told. I know it made it easier for the elderly who had to use walkers. Someone who needs a walker because of a balance issue, not a strength issue, is more likely to fall at a curb. So the strength can fade away from unwillingness to walk and fear of being tripped up on curbs. Thus ramps have helped more than the wheel-chair bound.

 

As for my grandmother, I set her up with a phone that did email. The sons could send her email and she could hear from them, even if she never did figure out how to respond (this was the middle of the 1990s). That meant a lot to her.

 

These new access standards also address limited cognitive abilities, cultural differences, and alternate languages. As a former teacher, I am aware of cultural bias in testing. Cultural bias exists in web pages too, like when they assume that you know what wild cards are in a search engine and which one does which function. That’s technical bias.

 

People omit things to make them brief (unlike my letter here) or to make themselves elite (because you have to be in the know to understand). Requiring brevity by omitting things is not the same as including it and allowing people to skip what they want. A sighted person just skips over double wording as standard operating procedure. We see it so often. If you have to go back and decode something, that takes longer.

 

Tonea

 

----- Original Message -----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 12:39 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Parenthesis

 

But I don't believe in altering standard text for screen-readers on a site for the general public.  Maybe, on a site intended only or almost     exclusively for blind people.  I haven't given that any thought.  But when we read books, if a chapter title is in all capitals, we either learn how to deal with it if it causes problems, or we don't.  This sort of thing goes far beyond the requirements of accessibility.  Screen-reader users have a responsibility to know something about the program they are using.  If all caps did cause me a problem, I would look at the line and spell what isn't being pronounced correctly.  You don't build a street so that people who don't know how to drive can drive on it.  You build a street for licensed drivers.  You shouldn't alter text under normal conditions because some blind people may not know how to use their screen-readers. 

 

Gene

 


Re: Parenthesis

tonea.ctr.morrow@...
 

Bouncing my forehead against my palm, “Duh!”

 

I do that kind of thing all the time, why didn’t I think of doing it for the screen reader?

 

For example, I needed to make a table of contents for graphics within a PDF. I put the graphic on the line, the customary leader of five alternating periods and spaces and then where the page number would go was left blank. I then put an anchor on the graphic where it was used in the document. I went back to the leader periods and made them a hyperlink to the anchor. When I made the file a PDF, I turned off coloring and underlining the links. Thus, to a sighted person, the leader dots between the graphic and the page number don’t look like a hyperlink. And, the PDF inserted the page numbers for me. To the PDF, it thought it was inserting page numbers for the link. To the sighted person, they are page numbers to the graphic!

 

Sadly, for you , it would have read something like “Start hyperlink Start . . . . . page 3”. Which begs the question, does NVDA read pdf page references?  --Sorry for the digression.

 

Anyway, I’ll look into your suggestion.

 

Tonea

 

----- Original Message -----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 1:13 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Parenthesis

 

One thing you could do is add an extra line at the end of the text, using black on black contrast.  Screen-readers will read it but people won't see it.  The line might list the wildcard characters and make whatever brief comments you have in mind.  You might want to write out the signs such as with the word asterisk.  But if it is preferable for sighted users to leave the line they would see as it is, this would avoid any degreedation of the site from a sighted user's point of view.

 

Gene

 

 


Re: Avast and accessibility

Angela Delicata
 

NO, actually, I was able to remove Avast with no removing tool: I used screen reader with the help of Braille display and cursors.

All the Best
Angela from Italy

Il 13/12/2017 19:36, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io ha scritto:
Did you not have to download a removal tool?
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela Delicata" <angeladelicata@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 1:53 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Avast and accessibility


Yes, for me it is better because at least I was able to remove it myself with no sighted help, but it is not so accessible anyway: I would not suggest it to anyone.


Il 13/12/2017 14:42, Dan Beaver ha scritto:
Hi,


I know I have seen this discussed before but didn't need to follow the thread at
that time.


How accessible is Avast?  Is it better than AVG or not?


Thanks.


Dan beaver


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Re: Website Where NVDA does not read main article

Gene
 

My suggestion evidently won't work in this case because this is the actual page of the article.  Did you read below the links?  there is a brief advertisement and I see the article below that.  I don't know what the links are supposed to do but let us know if you can see the article if you let the page read.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 1:06 PM
Subject: [nvda] Website Where NVDA does not read main article

Hi Group,


I am using both Firefox and Edge browser.  When I visit the following
website for a fix for the WIFI vulnerability, all I see under the
article title located half way down the page are 9 links that when
activated, go no where.  I wonder just what is going on and how it can
be remedied.


https://techcrunch.com/2017/10/16/heres-what-you-can-do-to-protect-yourself-from-the-krack-wifi-vulnerability/


--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"




Re: Parenthesis

tonea.ctr.morrow@...
 

I disagree. My grandmother went deaf when she got into her seventies. I saw how it isolated her. She couldn’t get phone calls from her sons who lived out of state. People would get frustrated with her. Or, she would see how frustrated they were getting and then get frustrated herself because she was doing the best she could.

 

Proper communication is a fundamental human right essential to everyone’s well-being, in my opinion. But, I’m a loud mouth.

 

Changing sidewalks for wheel chair access made it easier for the blind, or so I am told. I know it made it easier for the elderly who had to use walkers. Someone who needs a walker because of a balance issue, not a strength issue, is more likely to fall at a curb. So the strength can fade away from unwillingness to walk and fear of being tripped up on curbs. Thus ramps have helped more than the wheel-chair bound.

 

As for my grandmother, I set her up with a phone that did email. The sons could send her email and she could hear from them, even if she never did figure out how to respond (this was the middle of the 1990s). That meant a lot to her.

 

These new access standards also address limited cognitive abilities, cultural differences, and alternate languages. As a former teacher, I am aware of cultural bias in testing. Cultural bias exists in web pages too, like when they assume that you know what wild cards are in a search engine and which one does which function. That’s technical bias.

 

People omit things to make them brief (unlike my letter here) or to make themselves elite (because you have to be in the know to understand). Requiring brevity by omitting things is not the same as including it and allowing people to skip what they want. A sighted person just skips over double wording as standard operating procedure. We see it so often. If you have to go back and decode something, that takes longer.

 

Tonea

 

----- Original Message -----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 12:39 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Parenthesis

 

But I don't believe in altering standard text for screen-readers on a site for the general public.  Maybe, on a site intended only or almost     exclusively for blind people.  I haven't given that any thought.  But when we read books, if a chapter title is in all capitals, we either learn how to deal with it if it causes problems, or we don't.  This sort of thing goes far beyond the requirements of accessibility.  Screen-reader users have a responsibility to know something about the program they are using.  If all caps did cause me a problem, I would look at the line and spell what isn't being pronounced correctly.  You don't build a street so that people who don't know how to drive can drive on it.  You build a street for licensed drivers.  You shouldn't alter text under normal conditions because some blind people may not know how to use their screen-readers. 

 

Gene

 


Re: Website Where NVDA does not read main article

Gene
 

You might try entering something into a search engine that will make the actual page of the article come up.  Then if you follow the link, you may be placed on the page with the article available there.  I tried that when someone was having a problem two or three months ago getting to a page from the page the person was on.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 1:06 PM
Subject: [nvda] Website Where NVDA does not read main article

Hi Group,


I am using both Firefox and Edge browser.  When I visit the following
website for a fix for the WIFI vulnerability, all I see under the
article title located half way down the page are 9 links that when
activated, go no where.  I wonder just what is going on and how it can
be remedied.


https://techcrunch.com/2017/10/16/heres-what-you-can-do-to-protect-yourself-from-the-krack-wifi-vulnerability/


--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"




Re: Website Where NVDA does not read main article

Dan Kerstetter
 

I just had a look with both NVDA and JAWS 2018. The text of the article is below the "share" links and an advertisement frame.

HTH

Dan

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 2:06 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Website Where NVDA does not read main article

Hi Group,


I am using both Firefox and Edge browser. When I visit the following website for a fix for the WIFI vulnerability, all I see under the article title located half way down the page are 9 links that when activated, go no where. I wonder just what is going on and how it can be remedied.


https://techcrunch.com/2017/10/16/heres-what-you-can-do-to-protect-yourself-from-the-krack-wifi-vulnerability/


--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: Parenthesis

Gene
 

One thing you could do is add an extra line at the end of the text, using black on black contrast.  Screen-readers will read it but people won't see it.  The line might list the wildcard characters and make whatever brief comments you have in mind.  You might want to write out the signs such as with the word asterisk.  But if it is preferable for sighted users to leave the line they would see as it is, this would avoid any degreedation of the site from a sighted user's point of view.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 12:39 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Parenthesis

But I don't believe in altering standard text for screen-readers on a site for the general public.  Maybe, on a site intended only or almost     exclusively for blind people.  I haven't given that any thought.  But when we read books, if a chapter title is in all capitals, we either learn how to deal with it if it causes problems, or we don't.  This sort of thing goes far beyond the requirements of accessibility.  Screen-reader users have a responsibility to know something about the program they are using.  If all caps did cause me a problem, I would look at the line and spell what isn't being pronounced correctly.  You don't build a street so that people who don't know how to drive can drive on it.  You build a street for licensed drivers.  You shouldn't alter text under normal conditions because some blind people may not know how to use their screen-readers. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Parenthesis

I disagree see my other post. A lot depends on the synth though.
 Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Devin Prater" <r.d.t.prater@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:45 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Parenthesis


All caps are not read any differently than any other text.

Devin Prater
Assistive Technology instructor in training, JAWS Sertified.

> On Dec 12, 2017, at 12:29 PM, Kwork <istherelife@...> wrote:
>
> With my punctuation set to some, it pauses on either side of the
> parenthesis. A comma does the same thing, so I would have to guess which
> is a paren and which a comma. Not that big a deal for me. If I really want
> to know, I'll investigate on my own. I don't know about other punctuation
> levels as about all I use is some, so others would be able to answer that
> better.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: tonea.ctr.morrow@...
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 9:12 AM
> Subject: [nvda] Parenthesis
>
> How does the software treat parenthesis (such as this) when it does
> speech? How does it convey to the listener that the comment (possibly
> unimportant) is an aside comment? I need to know so I can understand how
> my audience will hear it, both literally and figuratively.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Tonea
>
>




Re: How does it treat symbols in quotes?

Brian Moore
 

Hi.  I don't think you need to re-write anything. IF the user has their punctuation turned off, then they should understand the consequences of that action and it is not your responsibility as a content author to accommodate every possible configuration a user may change.


just imho


Contact me on skype: brian.moore
follow me on twitter:
http://www.twitter.com/bmoore123
On 12/13/2017 1:49 PM, tonea.ctr.morrow@... wrote:

Okay, based on feedback I am designing my help files for HTML format. This does support a frame setup: the top or header frame has navigation buttons and the logo that links back to the main page. Left frame has the table of contents, index, and search. Right frame is the display window.

 

Here is my question--on the search frame, I have the following sentence:

 

Enter one or more keywords to search (the wildcards supported are '*' for one or more unknown characters and '?' for a single unknown character):

 

If you have punctuation turned off, do I need to rewrite that sentence to something like this:

 

Enter one or more keywords to search (the wildcards supported are '*' asterisk for one or more unknown characters and '?' question mark for a single unknown character):

 

Also, any comments you want to make about frames is fine too!

 

Thanks!

 

Tonea Morrow

Technical Writer

MCSG/SAIC | Desk: 405-954-7152

MMAC: Base Maintenance Building 15

Enterprise Services Center (ESC)

6500 S. MacArthur Blvd, OKC, OK  73169

tonea.ctr.morrow@... | www.esc.gov

Availability (appointments outside these)

Mo

7a – 5 p

If I take a lunch, I’ll be here later. If I take a kid to a doctor, I’ll be here later on Friday.

Tu

7:30 a – 3:30p

We

7:30 a – 3p

Th

7:30 a – 3:30p

Fr

7:30 a – 2p

 

 



Website Where NVDA does not read main article

Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Group,


I am using both Firefox and Edge browser.  When I visit the following website for a fix for the WIFI vulnerability, all I see under the article title located half way down the page are 9 links that when activated, go no where.  I wonder just what is going on and how it can be remedied.


https://techcrunch.com/2017/10/16/heres-what-you-can-do-to-protect-yourself-from-the-krack-wifi-vulnerability/


--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: Caption location

Brian Moore
 

well, window-eyes is no longer available and Zoomtext is more of a magnification program although it does have some screen reading capability although it is somewhat limited.


However, these changes are recent and big orgs move slowly so this might still be the approved list!


Hope not.


Contact me on skype: brian.moore
follow me on twitter:
http://www.twitter.com/bmoore123
On 12/13/2017 1:59 PM, tonea.ctr.morrow@... wrote:

I went through the approved list of software and found JAWS and Window Eyes and Zoom Text. I know I won’t get JAWS because it is too expensive. You really, really have to justify that much money.

 

I did put in a request for NVDA on the chance that my copy of approved software is outdated. If it isn’t approved, it doesn’t matter if it is free.

 

We’ll see what comes of things.

 

Tonea

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 12:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Caption location

 

If the texts are to be packaged as PDF it becomes even more important to have a screenreader as tagging the reading order through a document is very very important.

Brian

 



Re: Caption location

tonea.ctr.morrow@...
 

I went through the approved list of software and found JAWS and Window Eyes and Zoom Text. I know I won’t get JAWS because it is too expensive. You really, really have to justify that much money.

 

I did put in a request for NVDA on the chance that my copy of approved software is outdated. If it isn’t approved, it doesn’t matter if it is free.

 

We’ll see what comes of things.

 

Tonea

 

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 12:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Caption location

 

If the texts are to be packaged as PDF it becomes even more important to have a screenreader as tagging the reading order through a document is very very important.

Brian