Date   

Re: Keyboard Shortcuts List

Gene
 

But an important question that hasn't been discussed yet is, is there a pattern or principle of deciding what structure of short cuts should and shouldn't be used.  Quick navigation commands such as move by heading, skip blocks of links, etc., commands screen-readers use online have become standardized and it should be generally safe to say that using commands like alt shift and a letter wouldn't interfere with any screen-reader.  Control shift plus letter could conflict with Window-eyes commands and there are still many people using Window-eyes.  But I would think that a simple principle such as, use shift alt plus letter or number commands for web site short cuts would eliminate the need for studying or checking commands with JAWS and NVDA and, perhaps, Window-eyes and HAL.  Eliminating conflicts could be really tedious and cumbersome if not approached correctly so I think this needs discussion.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----


Re: How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app

Gene
 

I would think that reading mail as plain text would eliminate the problem for most messages.  For those requiring HTML, then perhaps you may have to use something else. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 10:38 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app

Myself I cannot get on with thunderbird myself as it persists in using that
tree structure. I prefer my emails to be completely separate which is why I
have Outlook Express, but unfortunately, I strongly suspect IE code will be
dropped at some point from windows in favour of the Edge system, which will
make simple mods to Outlook Express to let it still work to not be possible.
I'd use web based email if all the interfaces were the same, but sadly they
are not.
 In the end I may need to find myself a disposable email address and point
all the others at it and try to devise some kind of filter for a working
email client, or go over to   phone based email which I really do not want
to do.
 Since I have not even got a phone yet.
 Seems to me that as many phones use apps for mail, we really do need
somebody to make a simple account based system that does email and usenet in
the one package just like outlook express did.
 Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 8:13 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app


> Well if eudora hadn't well gone south I'd be still using it with
> supernova.
>
> Thunderbird is fine though it appears mozilla keep it maintained mainly.
>
>
>
>
> On 17/01/2018 8:52 p.m., Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
>> I could not function without filters, another reason for me still using
>> what has been described as prehistoric software for email and usenet.
>> Brian
>>
>> bglists@...
>> Sent via blueyonder.
>> Please address personal email to:-
>> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
>> in the display name field.
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Mendoza"
>> <lowvisiontek@...>
>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 6:10 AM
>> Subject: [nvda] How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app
>>
>>
>>> Just curious how flexible is the Mail app in handling filtered messages
>>> into specific folders? I wanted to know what is the basic command to do
>>> it. I appreciate your advice. Thanks in advance.
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Robert Mendoza
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>




Centovacast

Mark <mark@...>
 

Hi does anyone use centovacast website

If so is there any way around  the drag and drop for inserting tracks in to a playlist

I know you can make your own playlist and  import  it

In to centova cast but has anyone used the drag and drop

Mark.

 

 

Tune in to the number one station on the web TAFN radio
http://listen.tafn.org.uk:8027/stream
Or for our catch up service on demand http://www.tafn.org.uk/on-demand or to find out more ways of listening go to http://www.tafn.org.uk/radio

part of the accessible friends network
www.tafn.org.uk
Registered UK Charity: #1108043.

 

From: Joseph Weakland
Sent: 17 January 2018 18:29
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] zello addon query

 

by chance is there any plans for a nvda zello addon that would you to 1.

access anhy pending auth requests you may have? 2. see if there is a new

version of zello availlable?

 

If there is no such addon in development how would one who uses nvda

check zello for windows to see if there is a new version or pending auth

requests?

 

 

--

email

josephweakland@...

sent from thunderbird

 

 

 

 


Re: zello addon query

Lino Morales
 

You need to get onto the NVDA Gethub page and see if you can get someone to write up an add-on. Or better yet just use the IOS app which talking about is off topic here.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Joseph Weakland
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 1:29 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] zello addon query

 

by chance is there any plans for a nvda zello addon that would you to 1.

access anhy pending auth requests you may have? 2. see if there is a new

version of zello availlable?

 

If there is no such addon in development how would one who uses nvda

check zello for windows to see if there is a new version or pending auth

requests?

 

 

--

email

josephweakland@...

sent from thunderbird

 

 

 

 


Re: How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app

 

From my ex. They just automatically transferred over once you load the email address and to mail.

Melissa
Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 17, 2018, at 2:20 AM, David Moore <jesusloves1966@...> wrote:

The mail app is not good with making filters, I just have my lists split up into four email accounts. I check them regularly. Unfortunately, if you are use to having rules or filters, that does not exist in the mail app.

I know you can create filters on the web sites themselves, like, Gmail.com, but I am not sure how to transfer those filters to the Mail app!

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Shaun Everiss
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 3:13 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app

 

Well if eudora hadn't well gone south I'd be still using it with supernova.

 

Thunderbird is fine though it appears mozilla keep it maintained mainly.

 

 

 

 

On 17/01/2018 8:52 p.m., Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:

> I could not function without filters, another reason for me still

> using what has been described as prehistoric software for email and

> usenet.

> Brian

> bglists@...

> Sent via blueyonder.

> Please address personal email to:-

> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

> in the display name field.

> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Mendoza"

> <lowvisiontek@...>

> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

> Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 6:10 AM

> Subject: [nvda] How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app

>> Just curious how flexible is the Mail app in handling filtered

>> messages into specific folders? I wanted to know what is the basic

>> command to do it. I appreciate your advice. Thanks in advance.

>> 

>> --

>> 

>> Robert Mendoza

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>

 

 

 

 


zello addon query

Joseph Weakland
 

by chance is there any plans for a nvda zello addon that would you to 1. access anhy pending auth requests you may have? 2. see if there is a new version of zello availlable?

If there is no such addon in development how would one who uses nvda check zello for windows to see if there is a new version or pending auth requests?


--
email
josephweakland@att.net
sent from thunderbird


Re: Keyboard Shortcuts List

tonea.ctr.morrow@...
 

I will look into it. As for Gene’s list, it is from dot one, but I am still grateful for it.

 

Thanks,

 

Tonea

 

---Original Message---

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 11:29 AM

Hi,

Gene might be running an old version of NVDA. I’ll upload the actual commands quick reference for 2017.4 (latest release).

For web browsing, the section you might be interested in is browse mode section.

But here’s something more important than key commands: there is a big problem (actually, two). Screen readers use a key on the keyboard as their modifier. Typically it is insert key, but NVDA and others can use caps lock key. Thus, the command sets you were used to when browsing the web (such as alt+shift+letter or similar ones) isn’t applicable to screen reader users in a sense that there will be no major conflicts. But the other problem is that screen readers assign letters and symbols for element navigation on websites and web applications, so that will conflict. But there is a way out: screen reader users must be told to disable element navigation commands (in NVDA, that’ll be single letter navigation on/off (NVDA+Shioft+Space)).

How NVDA can navigate through various elements via letters and symbols is a bit hard to explain, but suffice to say that it has to do with how NVDA represents webpages, or more recently, what web browsers tell screen readers to do when navigating websites. If you want, I’d be happy to either write or record a lecture on a concept called “virtual buffers”, which is essentially what browse mode really is (or used to be until recently); if you want an accessible introduction to browse mode, web apps and screen readers and related concepts, I suggest taking a look at various tutorials out there, including mine.

Lastly, while writing the above reply, I realized that we might be running into a bigger problem: lack of real user data and expert testimony. I realize that without expert guidance, you can get stuck, and without real-life user data, you may find yourself asking a way out (trust me, I’ve been through this before when writing features for some NVDA add-ons). I’d like to kindly suggest that you let NV Access help you as a consultant, provided that your organizational protocol allows this (getting help from a foreign charity). If consulting a foreign charity won’t work, then please let someone from your department give you permission to contact me and other NVDA experts in United States (a list of certified NVDA Experts can be found at certification.nvaccess.org). I suggest this next step, as it might be preferable to let an actual user or an expert guide you and your organization through live training and/or consulting work; using documentation is helpful at time,s but I think, at other times (such as this), gathering user data in a more live setting would benefit all parties.

Hope this helps. In the meantime, I’ll upload the commands quick reference for 2017.4 later today.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

 


Re: Keyboard Shortcuts List

tonea.ctr.morrow@...
 

Okay, I’ve had time to look at what Gene sent me. I think it is from the software itself.

 

Joseph, if you are going to make a web page reference for software developers to ensure they don’t conflict with NVDA keyboard controls, then the target audience is sighted people who don’t have this software and may have no experience with the blind or screen readers. With that in mind, I’d like to point out some things.

 

There are a lot of keyboard commands that say NVDA+letter. You’ll need a clarifier as to what you mean by NVDA. Does it mean that NVDA has to be the focus before selecting the letter?

 

What is a System Caret? How does that play into the usage of the software by your consumers?

 

The presentation of Desktop key, Laptop Key, and Touch is fantastic. I strongly suggest you keep that. People read from left to right, so I would recommend moving the Name column to be after the keys and before the description. This aids the sighted viewer in scanning for a particular key combination. If this page you are making is not to be devoted to developers, but to be for general usage, then the advantage of changing column order is not a big gain when the audience is broadened. Don’t feel obligated to change it.

 

In fact, if you wanted to just modify this list, you could add a column to each table. In the column put one of three characters: E, S, or D. E for essential (the same as sacrosanct). S for Supportive. And D for Developmental. Color coding the rows would still be great, but adding a developer’s column makes a broad document more usable by developers.

 

The section, “Single letter Navigation” doesn’t make sense to me. I’m sure it will once I get my NVDA, but until then it looks like you’d never be able to write an email because all those single letters are reserved.

 

For software developers, I wouldn’t put in the braille guides. I would put a reference to them and have them listed on a separate page.

 

Sorry if I’m being a pest,

 

Tonea

 

----- Original Message -----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Morrow, Tonea CTR (FAA)
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 11:06 AM

Shhhh. Don’t make me laugh so much. I’ll disturb the quiet of the cubicles.

 

I got Gene’s list, though I haven’t had time to look at it yet. If you are offering to maintain a webpage, then I think the categories you would want to put in it are:

·         Sacrosanct – Do not re-asign these keys because they serve critical functions.

·         Supportive – Do not re-asign these keys if you want to be supportive of our users.

·         Experimental – These keys are in use in experimental versions of our software.

And, in each case, list the key combination paired with the function that it does (a brief description or/and name) so the sighted user can understand why that combination is important.

 

Visual users like tables, so you could put the key combination in the first cell of each row and the usage in the second cell of each row. Visual users also like color. Using black text and complying with 508 and WCAG AAA and contrast, you could have these:

·         Sacrosanct could have a pink/red color background of (255, 170, 200) in RGB or use hexidecimal FFAAC8 to convey critical.

·         Supportive could have a pale yellow background of (250, 250, 150) in RGB or use hexidecimal FFFF96 to convey pay-attention.

·         Experimental could have a pale blue background of (135, 225, 255) in RGB or use hexidecimal 87E1FF to convey neutral.

Cell borders aren’t necessary, but if you want them then basic black of 1-3 pixels is nice. For a more powerful effect visually, borders could be done to coordinate with the categories:

·         Sacrosanct: 4 pixels, 3-D effect, RGB (95, 65, 0) Hex 710000, a darker red

·         Supportive: 2 pixels, RGB (113, 0, 0) Hex 5F4100, a darker brown

·         Experimental: 2 pixels, RGB (0, 0, 115) Hex 000073, a darker blue

·         Overall page background of white makes the whole color pallete WCAG AAA/contrast compliant

 

If you don’t want to do tables, a glossary format would work just as well. Just apply a type style to the key combination so that it stands out from the definition. This allows sighted users to make a visual search if they are checking for a specific key combo. Obviously, they wouldn’t want to use Control-Alt-Delete, but if they did then you would want to make it easy for them to visually scan the page to see if that combination is already in use.  Let me know if you need any help or feedback. And, of course, feel free to ignore any or all of my suggestions.

 

Thank you for helping me get the support NVDA should receive,

 

Tonea

 

----- Original Message -----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 7:13 PM

Hi,

I’ll take care of that. Which edition do you need: latest release, latest public beta, latest alpha, or latest really unstable build? I can do one of these because I have all of them on my computer. It’s a matter of choosing which one you need and uploading to my website.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

 


Re: Blog post on Firefox 58.

Lino Morales
 

That’s the whole point I’m trying to make here Rosemarie. Its not nessessary.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

Hi, Lino,

 

I don't need special sounds to tell me when a web site has finished loading. Brian, listen for the word "busy" when a page has finished loading. Why do we have to have special sounds for that?

 

Rosemarie

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Lino Morales
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

Brian you just can’t let go ae? I don’t need extra sounds for this that and the other. Be a good bloak and contact Marko Z or James The if you really want this. Advocating on here won’t do you any good unless you do it yourself. This is the message I preach to other blind folks here in the US. No matter where you live its best you do it yourself.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.

Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when

downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the

page is fully loaded again.

 

I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was

released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not

go to sounds.

There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously

feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in

using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate

and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.

Thank you and have a safe trip home...

last one out turns off the lights

Brian

 

bglists@...

Sent via blueyonder.

Please address personal email to:-

briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----

From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@...>

To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM

Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

 

> The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

> https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/

>

>

 

 

 

 

 


Re: Blog post on Firefox 58.

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Hi, Lino,

 

I don't need special sounds to tell me when a web site has finished loading. Brian, listen for the word "busy" when a page has finished loading. Why do we have to have special sounds for that?

 

Rosemarie

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Lino Morales
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

Brian you just can’t let go ae? I don’t need extra sounds for this that and the other. Be a good bloak and contact Marko Z or James The if you really want this. Advocating on here won’t do you any good unless you do it yourself. This is the message I preach to other blind folks here in the US. No matter where you live its best you do it yourself.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.

Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when

downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the

page is fully loaded again.

 

I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was

released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not

go to sounds.

There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously

feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in

using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate

and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.

Thank you and have a safe trip home...

last one out turns off the lights

Brian

 

bglists@...

Sent via blueyonder.

Please address personal email to:-

briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----

From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@...>

To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM

Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

 

> The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

> https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/

>

>

 

 

 

 


Re: Keyboard Shortcuts List

 

Hi,

Correction: single letter navigation on/off toggle: NVDA+Shift+Space.

Cheers,

oseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:29 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keyboard Shortcuts List

 

Hi,

Gene might be running an old version of NVDA. I’ll upload the actual commands quick reference for 2017.4 (latest release).

For web browsing, the section you might be interested in is browse mode section.

But here’s something more important than key commands: there is a big problem (actually, two). Screen readers use a key on the keyboard as their modifier. Typically it is insert key, but NVDA and others can use caps lock key. Thus, the command sets you were used to when browsing the web (such as alt+shift+letter or similar ones) isn’t applicable to screen reader users in a sense that there will be no major conflicts. But the other problem is that screen readers assign letters and symbols for element navigation on websites and web applications, so that will conflict. But there is a way out: screen reader users must be told to disable element navigation commands (in NVDA, that’ll be single letter navigation on/off (NVDA+Shioft+Space)).

How NVDA can navigate through various elements via letters and symbols is a bit hard to explain, but suffice to say that it has to do with how NVDA represents webpages, or more recently, what web browsers tell screen readers to do when navigating websites. If you want, I’d be happy to either write or record a lecture on a concept called “virtual buffers”, which is essentially what browse mode really is (or used to be until recently); if you want an accessible introduction to browse mode, web apps and screen readers and related concepts, I suggest taking a look at various tutorials out there, including mine.

Lastly, while writing the above reply, I realized that we might be running into a bigger problem: lack of real user data and expert testimony. I realize that without expert guidance, you can get stuck, and without real-life user data, you may find yourself asking a way out (trust me, I’ve been through this before when writing features for some NVDA add-ons). I’d like to kindly suggest that you let NV Access help you as a consultant, provided that your organizational protocol allows this (getting help from a foreign charity). If consulting a foreign charity won’t work, then please let someone from your department give you permission to contact me and other NVDA experts in United States (a list of certified NVDA Experts can be found at certification.nvaccess.org). I suggest this next step, as it might be preferable to let an actual user or an expert guide you and your organization through live training and/or consulting work; using documentation is helpful at time,s but I think, at other times (such as this), gathering user data in a more live setting would benefit all parties.

Hope this helps. In the meantime, I’ll upload the commands quick reference for 2017.4 later today.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of tonea.ctr.morrow@...
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keyboard Shortcuts List

 

Shhhh. Don’t make me laugh so much. I’ll disturb the quiet of the cubicles.

 

I got Gene’s list, though I haven’t had time to look at it yet. If you are offering to maintain a webpage, then I think the categories you would want to put in it are:

  • Sacrosanct – Do not re-asign these keys because they serve critical functions.
  • Supportive – Do not re-asign these keys if you want to be supportive of our users.
  • Experimental – These keys are in use in experimental versions of our software.

And, in each case, list the key combination paired with the function that it does (a brief description or/and name) so the sighted user can understand why that combination is important.

 

Visual users like tables, so you could put the key combination in the first cell of each row and the usage in the second cell of each row. Visual users also like color. Using black text and complying with 508 and WCAG AAA and contrast, you could have these:

  • Sacrosanct could have a pink/red color background of (255, 170, 200) in RGB or use hexidecimal FFAAC8 to convey critical.
  • Supportive could have a pale yellow background of (250, 250, 150) in RGB or use hexidecimal FFFF96 to convey pay-attention.
  • Experimental could have a pale blue background of (135, 225, 255) in RGB or use hexidecimal 87E1FF to convey neutral.

Cell borders aren’t necessary, but if you want them then basic black of 1-3 pixels is nice. For a more powerful effect visually, borders could be done to coordinate with the categories:

  • Sacrosanct: 4 pixels, 3-D effect, RGB (95, 65, 0) Hex 710000, a darker red
  • Supportive: 2 pixels, RGB (113, 0, 0) Hex 5F4100, a darker brown
  • Experimental: 2 pixels, RGB (0, 0, 115) Hex 000073, a darker blue
  • Overall page background of white makes the whole color pallete WCAG AAA/contrast compliant

 

If you don’t want to do tables, a glossary format would work just as well. Just apply a type style to the key combination so that it stands out from the definition. This allows sighted users to make a visual search if they are checking for a specific key combo. Obviously, they wouldn’t want to use Control-Alt-Delete, but if they did then you would want to make it easy for them to visually scan the page to see if that combination is already in use.  Let me know if you need any help or feedback. And, of course, feel free to ignore any or all of my suggestions.

 

Thank you for helping me get the support NVDA should receive,

 

Tonea

 

----- Original Message -----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 7:13 PM

Hi,

I’ll take care of that. Which edition do you need: latest release, latest public beta, latest alpha, or latest really unstable build? I can do one of these because I have all of them on my computer. It’s a matter of choosing which one you need and uploading to my website.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 2:55 PM

 

I realized that I can't send you the most current list.  I don't have a computer set up to be able to run the latest NVDA.  I have a Windows 7 machine that I almost never use online and I've never updated it to Service Pack 1.  My other machines are XP.  So I can send you one that isn't too old but I hope someone will send a newer page.  But this should have most of the keys used in the current edition. 

 

I'll be sending the page in the next ten or fifteen minutes, unless there is some unexpected problem.

 

Gene

 

 


Re: Blog post on Firefox 58.

Lino Morales
 

Brian you just can’t let go ae? I don’t need extra sounds for this that and the other. Be a good bloak and contact Marko Z or James The if you really want this. Advocating on here won’t do you any good unless you do it yourself. This is the message I preach to other blind folks here in the US. No matter where you live its best you do it yourself.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.

Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when

downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the

page is fully loaded again.

 

I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was

released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not

go to sounds.

There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously

feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in

using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate

and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.

Thank you and have a safe trip home...

last one out turns off the lights

Brian

 

bglists@...

Sent via blueyonder.

Please address personal email to:-

briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----

From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@...>

To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM

Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

 

> The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

> https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/

>

>

 

 

 

 


Re: Keyboard Shortcuts List

 

Hi,

Gene might be running an old version of NVDA. I’ll upload the actual commands quick reference for 2017.4 (latest release).

For web browsing, the section you might be interested in is browse mode section.

But here’s something more important than key commands: there is a big problem (actually, two). Screen readers use a key on the keyboard as their modifier. Typically it is insert key, but NVDA and others can use caps lock key. Thus, the command sets you were used to when browsing the web (such as alt+shift+letter or similar ones) isn’t applicable to screen reader users in a sense that there will be no major conflicts. But the other problem is that screen readers assign letters and symbols for element navigation on websites and web applications, so that will conflict. But there is a way out: screen reader users must be told to disable element navigation commands (in NVDA, that’ll be single letter navigation on/off (NVDA+Shioft+Space)).

How NVDA can navigate through various elements via letters and symbols is a bit hard to explain, but suffice to say that it has to do with how NVDA represents webpages, or more recently, what web browsers tell screen readers to do when navigating websites. If you want, I’d be happy to either write or record a lecture on a concept called “virtual buffers”, which is essentially what browse mode really is (or used to be until recently); if you want an accessible introduction to browse mode, web apps and screen readers and related concepts, I suggest taking a look at various tutorials out there, including mine.

Lastly, while writing the above reply, I realized that we might be running into a bigger problem: lack of real user data and expert testimony. I realize that without expert guidance, you can get stuck, and without real-life user data, you may find yourself asking a way out (trust me, I’ve been through this before when writing features for some NVDA add-ons). I’d like to kindly suggest that you let NV Access help you as a consultant, provided that your organizational protocol allows this (getting help from a foreign charity). If consulting a foreign charity won’t work, then please let someone from your department give you permission to contact me and other NVDA experts in United States (a list of certified NVDA Experts can be found at certification.nvaccess.org). I suggest this next step, as it might be preferable to let an actual user or an expert guide you and your organization through live training and/or consulting work; using documentation is helpful at time,s but I think, at other times (such as this), gathering user data in a more live setting would benefit all parties.

Hope this helps. In the meantime, I’ll upload the commands quick reference for 2017.4 later today.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of tonea.ctr.morrow@...
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keyboard Shortcuts List

 

Shhhh. Don’t make me laugh so much. I’ll disturb the quiet of the cubicles.

 

I got Gene’s list, though I haven’t had time to look at it yet. If you are offering to maintain a webpage, then I think the categories you would want to put in it are:

  • Sacrosanct – Do not re-asign these keys because they serve critical functions.
  • Supportive – Do not re-asign these keys if you want to be supportive of our users.
  • Experimental – These keys are in use in experimental versions of our software.

And, in each case, list the key combination paired with the function that it does (a brief description or/and name) so the sighted user can understand why that combination is important.

 

Visual users like tables, so you could put the key combination in the first cell of each row and the usage in the second cell of each row. Visual users also like color. Using black text and complying with 508 and WCAG AAA and contrast, you could have these:

  • Sacrosanct could have a pink/red color background of (255, 170, 200) in RGB or use hexidecimal FFAAC8 to convey critical.
  • Supportive could have a pale yellow background of (250, 250, 150) in RGB or use hexidecimal FFFF96 to convey pay-attention.
  • Experimental could have a pale blue background of (135, 225, 255) in RGB or use hexidecimal 87E1FF to convey neutral.

Cell borders aren’t necessary, but if you want them then basic black of 1-3 pixels is nice. For a more powerful effect visually, borders could be done to coordinate with the categories:

  • Sacrosanct: 4 pixels, 3-D effect, RGB (95, 65, 0) Hex 710000, a darker red
  • Supportive: 2 pixels, RGB (113, 0, 0) Hex 5F4100, a darker brown
  • Experimental: 2 pixels, RGB (0, 0, 115) Hex 000073, a darker blue
  • Overall page background of white makes the whole color pallete WCAG AAA/contrast compliant

 

If you don’t want to do tables, a glossary format would work just as well. Just apply a type style to the key combination so that it stands out from the definition. This allows sighted users to make a visual search if they are checking for a specific key combo. Obviously, they wouldn’t want to use Control-Alt-Delete, but if they did then you would want to make it easy for them to visually scan the page to see if that combination is already in use.  Let me know if you need any help or feedback. And, of course, feel free to ignore any or all of my suggestions.

 

Thank you for helping me get the support NVDA should receive,

 

Tonea

 

----- Original Message -----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 7:13 PM

Hi,

I’ll take care of that. Which edition do you need: latest release, latest public beta, latest alpha, or latest really unstable build? I can do one of these because I have all of them on my computer. It’s a matter of choosing which one you need and uploading to my website.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 2:55 PM

 

I realized that I can't send you the most current list.  I don't have a computer set up to be able to run the latest NVDA.  I have a Windows 7 machine that I almost never use online and I've never updated it to Service Pack 1.  My other machines are XP.  So I can send you one that isn't too old but I hope someone will send a newer page.  But this should have most of the keys used in the current edition. 

 

I'll be sending the page in the next ten or fifteen minutes, unless there is some unexpected problem.

 

Gene

 

 


Re: Editing vocalizer source files

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

And the lack of sound scheme as well has always been a bone of irritation for many users.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Engin Albayrak" <mealbayrak@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 3:50 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Editing vocalizer source files


Hello. This is also a necessity For Turkish language. As Turkish users, We want to close abriviations. Because They are usually rong.

-----Özgün İleti-----
Kimden: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] Yerine Narayan
Tarih: 17 Ocak 2018 Çarşamba 17:21
Kime: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Konu: [nvda] Editing vocalizer source files

hi friends, can we edit NVDA ADD-ON vocalizer source file according our regional language pronunciation. because, i want to make some changes in pronunciation rules in Hindi language. i don't know whether it can possible or not. please help me suggesting regarding this one. waiting for your reply. thank you.

--
Shree


Re: Blog post on Firefox 58.

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Yea, maybe it needs a sound instead ) well I could not resist it.
I agree I'd like to see a simple wish list form for firefox.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@ripco.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:38 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


Is there a way to contact the Firefox accessibility team? Unless the notify me when a page tries to redirect or refresh feature was reintroduced in version 58, that is a serious question that should be addressed and that those concerned should write to the accessibility team about. This wasn't mentioned in the blog entry about improvements in Firefox 58.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Kingett
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 8:08 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/


Re: Blog post on Firefox 58.

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.
Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the page is fully loaded again.

I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not go to sounds.
There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.
Thank you and have a safe trip home...
last one out turns off the lights
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM
Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/




Re: Keyboard Shortcuts List

tonea.ctr.morrow@...
 

Shhhh. Don’t make me laugh so much. I’ll disturb the quiet of the cubicles.

 

I got Gene’s list, though I haven’t had time to look at it yet. If you are offering to maintain a webpage, then I think the categories you would want to put in it are:

·         Sacrosanct – Do not re-asign these keys because they serve critical functions.

·         Supportive – Do not re-asign these keys if you want to be supportive of our users.

·         Experimental – These keys are in use in experimental versions of our software.

And, in each case, list the key combination paired with the function that it does (a brief description or/and name) so the sighted user can understand why that combination is important.

 

Visual users like tables, so you could put the key combination in the first cell of each row and the usage in the second cell of each row. Visual users also like color. Using black text and complying with 508 and WCAG AAA and contrast, you could have these:

·         Sacrosanct could have a pink/red color background of (255, 170, 200) in RGB or use hexidecimal FFAAC8 to convey critical.

·         Supportive could have a pale yellow background of (250, 250, 150) in RGB or use hexidecimal FFFF96 to convey pay-attention.

·         Experimental could have a pale blue background of (135, 225, 255) in RGB or use hexidecimal 87E1FF to convey neutral.

Cell borders aren’t necessary, but if you want them then basic black of 1-3 pixels is nice. For a more powerful effect visually, borders could be done to coordinate with the categories:

·         Sacrosanct: 4 pixels, 3-D effect, RGB (95, 65, 0) Hex 710000, a darker red

·         Supportive: 2 pixels, RGB (113, 0, 0) Hex 5F4100, a darker brown

·         Experimental: 2 pixels, RGB (0, 0, 115) Hex 000073, a darker blue

·         Overall page background of white makes the whole color pallete WCAG AAA/contrast compliant

 

If you don’t want to do tables, a glossary format would work just as well. Just apply a type style to the key combination so that it stands out from the definition. This allows sighted users to make a visual search if they are checking for a specific key combo. Obviously, they wouldn’t want to use Control-Alt-Delete, but if they did then you would want to make it easy for them to visually scan the page to see if that combination is already in use.  Let me know if you need any help or feedback. And, of course, feel free to ignore any or all of my suggestions.

 

Thank you for helping me get the support NVDA should receive,

 

Tonea

 

----- Original Message -----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 7:13 PM

Hi,

I’ll take care of that. Which edition do you need: latest release, latest public beta, latest alpha, or latest really unstable build? I can do one of these because I have all of them on my computer. It’s a matter of choosing which one you need and uploading to my website.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 2:55 PM

 

I realized that I can't send you the most current list.  I don't have a computer set up to be able to run the latest NVDA.  I have a Windows 7 machine that I almost never use online and I've never updated it to Service Pack 1.  My other machines are XP.  So I can send you one that isn't too old but I hope someone will send a newer page.  But this should have most of the keys used in the current edition. 

 

I'll be sending the page in the next ten or fifteen minutes, unless there is some unexpected problem.

 

Gene

 

 


Re: Issue installing latest Windows 10 update

George McCoy <slr1bpz@...>
 

Rick,
 
I had a similar issue with another program.  I resolved it as follows:
I downloaded and installed the latest version of ccleaner.
I ran the registry cleaner portion of ccleaner several times until it said no registry items were found.  I ran it a total of four times before I got the desired result.
After that, the update proceeded without errors.
 
Good luck,
George
 

From: ely.r@...
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 3:47 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Issue installing latest Windows 10 update
 

Repeatedly, I have tried doing the most recent Windows 10 update. Get to the step where the installer asks me to uninstall this program as it cannot. The program at fault is, Window eyes 9.1. It is not listed as an installed program in Programs and Features, “add or remove”. I have searched the entire computer for Window Eyes and GW Micro remains and find nothing.

Is it possible that the installer is finding a remaining entry in the registry?

Any suggestions would be much appreciated,

Thanks,

Rick

Dr. Rick Ely

TVI, Vision Consultant

451 Rocky Hill Road

Florence, MA 01062

&413()  727-3038


Re: NVDA issue in win10 after security patch update.

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

That was a time ago. Why has it only just been installed?
Seems a bit odd.

Can you take the machine back to before the update for now?
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Amala" <anbujustin@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 1:03 PM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA issue in win10 after security patch update.


Hi All,

After the below patch in windows 10, NVDA is not working properly. It is
reading the text as unknown in chrome and Mozilla Firefox. It is working
partially working in edge.

Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool for Windows 8, 8.1, 10 and Windows
Server 2012, 2012 R2, 2016 x64 Edition - November 2017 (KB890830)

Please help me.

Thanks and regards
Amala J


Re: How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

It is really, since the one thing you do not consider is that the gmail sides interface is under the control of google who may at any time completely redesign it. Also of course when you are like me using email from several different sources, their web mail platforms are all different and not compatible.

To be honest as long as you set up the email on pop3 etc as secure servers which is very easy to do in both live mail and outlook express I never get any bad emails with payloads as they get ditched.

I do agree however that somebody needs to spend the same time of pc apps as they seem to do on mobile phone ones.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Norman" <lists@thekingstech.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:40 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app


Hi.

You don't need to transfer them to the mail app if it's set using imap.
In this case gmail does all the work behind the scenes and your mail
program knows nothing about this.

I'm with brian, i couldn't function on mailing lists without filters,
however, this is not a good reason to use out of date mail software,
current mail software is actually more efficient in my oppinion at
handling this.

I personally run zimbra 8.8 released late last year and still in active
development as my mail server. The client is thunderbird.


Works like a charm and also filters mail for every device connected to
the account, my phone, and computer currently.



HTH.




On 1/17/2018 3:20 AM, David Moore wrote:

The mail app is not good with making filters, I just have my lists
split up into four email accounts. I check them regularly.
Unfortunately, if you are use to having rules or filters, that does
not exist in the mail app.

I know you can create filters on the web sites themselves, like,
Gmail.com, but I am not sure how to transfer those filters to the Mail
app!

David Moore

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
Windows 10

*From: *Shaun Everiss <mailto:sm.everiss@gmail.com>
*Sent: *Wednesday, January 17, 2018 3:13 AM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app

Well if eudora hadn't well gone south I'd be still using it with
supernova.

Thunderbird is fine though it appears mozilla keep it maintained mainly.

On 17/01/2018 8:52 p.m., Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:

I could not function without filters, another reason for me still
using what has been described as prehistoric software for email and
usenet.
Brian
bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Mendoza"
<lowvisiontek@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 6:10 AM
Subject: [nvda] How to create filtered rule in Windows 10 Mail app
Just curious how flexible is the Mail app in handling filtered
messages into specific folders? I wanted to know what is the basic
command to do it. I appreciate your advice. Thanks in advance.
--
Robert Mendoza