Date   

Re: A few thoughts: Web Aim survey, quantity versus quality, feeling burnt out and tutorials

 

hi joseph and all.
i pray and wish for unity of our comunity.
i admire opensource and helpful programs like nvda, always remember
your kindness and never forget praying for all of you sincerely!

On 1/24/18, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
<bglists@...> wrote:
Yeah well I'm surveyed and consultation out. it seems these days there are

such consultations done all over the place about everything from babies
nappies to screenreaders and I've yet to see any of them bear any fruit in
the way things are done because I feel that everything these days is driven

by vested interests and cost.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mário Navarro" <mario.gnv@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 3:50 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A few thoughts: Web Aim survey, quantity versus quality,

feeling burnt out and tutorials



absolutely right.

thank you good friend.


long life to Joseph Lee.

cheers.



Às 17:25 de 23/12/2017, Joseph Lee escreveu:

Dear NVDA community,

As I read messages on recent discussions, I realized just how much
enthusiasm and concern people have over NVDA and its future. At the
same time, it became clear to me that I and other developers and
community elders need a day off and just listen to you all, as
listening allows us to think about what others are saying and plan
things accordingly.

But first, a humble opinion about surveys and other points:

First, when calls for the seventh Web AIM survey went out, I told
people to not just do it to “increase” market share. I specifically
told screen reader companies to not coerce users to do it, but let
people take it out of their own willingness. This advice was to avoid
a fiasco that happened with Web AIM 6 where AI Squared (now part of
VFO) staff told Window-Eyes users to fill out the survey in mass
numbers, which became a small controversy within the screen reading
world, and to me, making Web AIM results no longer credible.

As some folks pointed out, Web AIM numbers depend on how many people
fill it out and where they come from (and this is true of any surveys
where word of mouth drives participation). The results also depend on
demographics and other factors such as choices given, how the
questions are worded, and overall objective. If one or more data
points seems to be dominant, they can be either skewed or outliers,
with the more extreme cases being termed “outliers” and they affect
how the results are explicated (interpreted). Even skewed data, such
as what I can perceive from some surveys including recent Web AIM
iterations can affect statistical calculations to a point where it
raises genuine questions about bias, credibility, and others (after
all, success of statistics, particularly inferential statistics,
depends on a representative sample or a close equivalent that allows
researchers to approximate the real world, which is prone to errors if
not done correctly such as misinterpretation, bad outliers, only some
groups participating, not looking at things more deeply and what not).

One important thing to note is that Web AIM is a representative
survey, thus the result in front of me could reflect reality. However,
due to recent controversy, possible type I and II errors
(false-positive and false-negative, respectively) and because of
outliers and skewed data and participation, it does not truly reflect
actual data, which is a point some folks here are trying to say and I
concur with. My explication of Web AIM 7 is that, in some parts of the
world, JAWS for Windows is more popular. However, given the fact that
not all geographical regions are represented, I’d counter by saying
that this is not a true representative sample that includes every
continent, and if it did, the story would be different and will
reflect reality a bit better (not a lot because there are other ways
of skewing data such as filling it out on behalf of an organization,
robotic fillers and so on). Coupled with the fact that Web AIM went
through a major controversy recently that damaged its credibility
somewhat, I would dare not trust Web AIM results again.

This leads to my second point: quantity versus quality. If NV Access
went straight for quantity alone, they could have implemented all
possible feature requests in hopes of boosting market share. The
reality in front of us says otherwise: not all feature requests are
here. Numerous factors contribute to this problem:

* Lack of leading developers: in 2017, a long-time NVDA developer
started working for another organization, and NV Access has been
looking for his replacement ever since. Even if the replacement is
found, it’ll take several months for him or her to become used to
this community, learn about accessibility and how to interact with
members, and earn our trust (it took Reef Turner a year to fully
earn our trust). Folks can counter this by saying that there are
countless contributors out there, but ultimately what gets into
NVDA depends on pull requests and review time from NV Access.
* Attitudes about open-source software from organizations: as some
folks pointed out, there are prevailing attitudes about
open-source in organizations that makes it a bit harder for NVDA
to land on their computers, which allows developers to assess true
needs of organizations through user feedback. Without valuable
feedback from organizations (a quality one at that), we won’t see
huger progress in NVDA development.
* Outside attitudes about the NVDA community: from the inside, NVDA
community is seen as a tight nit of enthusiasts who strives to
make NVDA better every day. On the outside, however, we have a
mixed bag of reputations, from admiration to honorable mentions to
disdain. Every organization have these mixed reputations,
especially more so for a community powered by technology such as
Linux kernel developers, web browser vendors and web standards
organizations, and even screen reader community. Not only we need
to show that we are united inside, we need to showcase unity
outside of this community.
* Inside matters just as outside: public relations outside of NVDA
community is important, but unity within an organization is just
as important as public organizational face (I’ll address
developer’s point of view below). What makes NVDA stand out is our
unity despite coming from different circumstances and backgrounds.

Most of these point to quality, not quantity alone. In summary,
quantity is important, but quality is just as important as how many
people download NVDA 2017.4 between Christmas and New Year.

Lastly, in regards to organization internals, I’d like to address
something I really wanted to say for the past few weeks: sometimes, I
felt burnt out. My initial response to your enthusiasm over my audio
tutorials was that I’ll ask for justifications for producing an
updated version, seeing that there are countless free videos and
tutorials out there. This was partly because I truly felt burnt out
with academics, speech and debate competitions and what not
(especially after a debate regarding a potential feature held not long
ago), at one point telling myself that I’ll retire from the NVDA
community sooner than later and feeling as though I carried important
burdens on my shoulders. But you didn’t see that justification post;
instead, I posted links to where you can download the 2018 version of
my audio tutorial series. In effect, I’ve given up my Christmas
holidays for this community, knowing that I needed a time to listen to
you all and do something about it. All this was possible because of a
simple act of listening and thinking about what the community means to
me and what my work means to everyone. I’m committed to finishing
Welcome to NVDA 2018 series before NVDA 2018.1 ships, with several
addenda coming after that, all because of support from this community
and outsiders. And I promise again: The Welcome to NVDA 2018 series
was, and will remain, free for all. All I ask of you in return is
donate to a cause that makes equal access to technology possible,
especially during this holiday season and beyond.

I’m sure for many of you, my musings above are a bit hard to digest.
Now you know why I don’t trust Web AIM survey results, quality is just
as important as quantity, and read a confession from a community
leader on his inner feelings. But there are two more things you need
to know, something all of us needs to think about:

Community leaders won’t stay with you forever. In early 2017, I sensed
that a long-time NVDA developer would leave this community for
something better. Only I and others didn’t know until summer that it
would be Jamie moving onto Mozilla Foundation.

I also felt, back in early 2017, that my active time with the NVDA
community is slowly drawing to a close. I don’t know when it’ll
happen, but I’ve been laying foundations for the next generation of
developers and enthusiasts to take the lead. This is one of the
reasons for setting up the devlearning subgroup, because I felt it is
time for me and other leaders to teach NVDA internals and other
concepts to the next group of community leaders and developers so they
can bring NVDA to the next level and do more amazing things than I and
others did (in my case, for the past five years).

Lastly, I sense a time when this community will face a sharp divide to
a point where people will start questioning the merits of this
community. I only told a select few earlier because it wasn’t right
for me to disclose it early and for them to prepare a plan. The screen
shade debate is, in fact, a sort of a preview of what is to come. One
of the fundamental questions you will face at that time will be
whether you still have your first love for NVDA, and whether you still
have your original reasons for joining this community. The survival of
this community at that time will depend on your ability to unite to
face a difficult situation, even if that means facing possible splits.
One thing you should NOT do at that time: ignoring new users and
outside critics, because they are influential opinion leaders and are
key stakeholders in NVDA’s future. One thing you SHOULD do though:
listen to others and think critically.

Hope this makes sense.

Merry (early) Christmas,

Joseph

--
A acção pode nem sempre ser felicidade, mas não há felicidade sem
acção...





--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:
indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
www.al-islam.org


Re: can't import my favorites to firefox 58

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

I got it solved. Thanks.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Robert Mendoza
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 10:14 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't import my favorites to firefox 58

 

Hi Rosemary,

I did to import my favorites to Firefox 58 to my testing machine, noticed after it open first time just tab around until you heard of the Import now and you are about to choose items of check boxes like cookies, and favorites. Since I don't want to import the cookies I just left uncheck it then, arrow down to Favorites to check the box. Hope this helps you.

 

Robert Mendoza

On 1/25/2018 1:42 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

I just tried that and it didn't work this time. I'm using firefox 58.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 9:36 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't import my favorites to firefox 58

 

I think you asked about this recently.  Please keep such messages for things you don't do enough to remember.  You have to press alt and right arrow to the import and backup menu.  Then down arrow to the item you want and press enter.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 11:10 PM

Subject: [nvda] can't import my favorites to firefox 58

 

Hi, everyone,

 

I just installed firefox 58 and so-far it's working great. I can't import my favorites to firefox. I go to the library with shift control B and all it shows is a treeview but I can't find import. What am I missing?

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 


Re: A Test Email

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Got it.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of inamuddinInam Uddin via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 5:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] A Test Email

 

Dear friends, this is a test email. Please reply me if my mails are getting through?

 

 

Arguing with a woman is reading software license agreement.
At the end, you have to ignore everything and clic I agree.
You can contact me via gmail:
inamuddin09@...
Inamuddin.ronaque@...
outlook:
inam092@...
yahoo:
inamuddin2010@...
Add my Skype ID:
charlsdarwin1
Meet me on facebook:
www.facebook.com/inamuddin786
Follow me on my twitter ID:
www.twitter.com/charlsdarwin1
Call me on my cell numbers:
+92-300-2227598
+92-334-3348409

 


Re: can't import my favorites to firefox 58

Robert Mendoza
 

Hi Rosemary,

I did to import my favorites to Firefox 58 to my testing machine, noticed after it open first time just tab around until you heard of the Import now and you are about to choose items of check boxes like cookies, and favorites. Since I don't want to import the cookies I just left uncheck it then, arrow down to Favorites to check the box. Hope this helps you.


Robert Mendoza
On 1/25/2018 1:42 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

I just tried that and it didn't work this time. I'm using firefox 58.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 9:36 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't import my favorites to firefox 58

 

I think you asked about this recently.  Please keep such messages for things you don't do enough to remember.  You have to press alt and right arrow to the import and backup menu.  Then down arrow to the item you want and press enter.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 11:10 PM

Subject: [nvda] can't import my favorites to firefox 58

 

Hi, everyone,

 

I just installed firefox 58 and so-far it's working great. I can't import my favorites to firefox. I go to the library with shift control B and all it shows is a treeview but I can't find import. What am I missing?

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 


got my favorites imported successfully

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Hi, everyone,

 

There was a step I forgot. You hit alt and right arrow after going to the library with shift control B. I'll keep that in mind.

 

Rosemarie

 

 


Re: can't import my favorites to firefox 58

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

I just tried that and it didn't work this time. I'm using firefox 58.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 9:36 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't import my favorites to firefox 58

 

I think you asked about this recently.  Please keep such messages for things you don't do enough to remember.  You have to press alt and right arrow to the import and backup menu.  Then down arrow to the item you want and press enter.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 11:10 PM

Subject: [nvda] can't import my favorites to firefox 58

 

Hi, everyone,

 

I just installed firefox 58 and so-far it's working great. I can't import my favorites to firefox. I go to the library with shift control B and all it shows is a treeview but I can't find import. What am I missing?

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 


Re: can't import my favorites to firefox 58

Gene
 

I think you asked about this recently.  Please keep such messages for things you don't do enough to remember.  You have to press alt and right arrow to the import and backup menu.  Then down arrow to the item you want and press enter.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 11:10 PM
Subject: [nvda] can't import my favorites to firefox 58

Hi, everyone,

 

I just installed firefox 58 and so-far it's working great. I can't import my favorites to firefox. I go to the library with shift control B and all it shows is a treeview but I can't find import. What am I missing?

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 


can't import my favorites to firefox 58

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Hi, everyone,

 

I just installed firefox 58 and so-far it's working great. I can't import my favorites to firefox. I go to the library with shift control B and all it shows is a treeview but I can't find import. What am I missing?

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 


Re: space

 

Well space is a bit bad to, space is fine if there is a space.

Supernova says blank line or blank line.

I guess we could make it blank line or empty line if you want but still.

On 25/01/2018 3:30 p.m., Kevin wrote:
Is it possible to change when NVDA says blank to space like jaws, blank doesn’t sound good.

Email is golden !!!
Kevin Lee


Re: space

Sarah k Alawami
 

If you have a blank line "blank" would be better than space. So Id say keep it the way it is. A space is just that, it is *not* a blank line.

On Jan 24, 2018, at 6:30 PM, Kevin <kleeva5@...> wrote:

Is it possible to change when NVDA says blank to space like jaws, blank doesn’t sound good.
 
Email is golden !!!
Kevin Lee
 


space

Kevin <kleeva5@...>
 

Is it possible to change when NVDA says blank to space like jaws, blank doesn’t sound good.

 

Email is golden !!!
Kevin Lee

 


Re: FireFox 58 And Screen Readers

David Moore
 

Same with me!

I am using NVDA latest master development snapshot,

And it works really well with Firefox 58. I am accessing so many programs, apps, and browsers with NVDA verses JAWS. JAWS is getting way behind. NVDA works much better in Edge, for example. I really want to show my gratitude for all you do.

I just tried the News app with JAWS 2018 and NVDA, and NVDA works much better. I am using NVDA more and more to do just what I want to do.

Also, NVDA lets me know, in the mail app, as I type, when I made a spelling mistake. I can just press Shift+F10 to correct it.

That is beautiful.

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: inamuddinInam Uddin via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 8:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] FireFox 58 And Screen Readers

 

Respected friends, as you are well aware that Mozilla has updated its browser FF58 on January 23rd 2018 as it promised!

I’m very much delighted to let you know that NVDA is well a head of all screen reader regarding the use of FF58.

The matter of fact is that I have JAWS 18.4530, JAWS 2018.1712.54, narrator and NVDA 2017.4.

I have tested FF58 with all of them and I found out that Fire Fox 58 is working the best with NVDA 2017.4.

I really couldn’t understand that even then Freedomscientific/VFO is charging hundreds and thousands of US Dollars from visually challenged people  and from different agencies which are helping visually challenged people, why they haven’t come up with JAWS update before releasing of Fire Fox 58!

This fundamental question is enough to convince those people and agencies which are giving hundreds and thousands of Dollars to Freedomscientific/VFo, should donate a hand some amount of money to NVAccess as well so it can work for the betterment of visually challenged people better than before!

In short all I can say is “East and west, NVDA is the best”

With regards from Inamuddin with the Skype ID:

Charlsdarwin1

 

 

Arguing with a woman is reading software license agreement.
At the end, you have to ignore everything and clic I agree.
You can contact me via gmail:
inamuddin09@...
Inamuddin.ronaque@...
outlook:
inam092@...
yahoo:
inamuddin2010@...
Add my Skype ID:
charlsdarwin1
Meet me on facebook:
www.facebook.com/inamuddin786
Follow me on my twitter ID:
www.twitter.com/charlsdarwin1
Call me on my cell numbers:
+92-300-2227598
+92-334-3348409

 

 


Re: FireFox 58 And Screen Readers

 

That may be hard to do.

My aunt worked for a clothing place that had its own software, they decided to get sap, because all major companies had it.

It was harder to use, and had a lot of issues due to the complexity of the program and so they went back but at cost.

They had spent lots on the program and well while they went back it was only because it didn't suit it still took a couple years before that happened.

Now jaws, its been round for a while and just like windows just about everyone is using it or has used it or will use it.

Even if jaws was the most crappy insecure virus prone and privacy killing software no one would bother giving it up.

They have spent to much cash.

Its why while I'd like to doodle with linux I would never give up windows.

Sure I have issues and think that parts of it could be better, but even if it were crap I would still use it, buy it, etc because everyone basically uses it.

Games and a lot of things I use are run on it, its like giving up my (incert accessibility aid) its not happening.

Jaws is lagging, but giving up, it will never happen all the agencies love jaws.

Jaws is the best everything else is total crap no one cares.

But what if they do, have you or I in fact do we as users realise how much inercia has built up with this thing.

Even if nvda could do everything jaws can and more even if we all switched, it wouldn't happen over night.

Now I have seen a few smaller outfits change but no big company or government is going to switch from vfo and their crazy schemes and they know this, people have spent to much to switch, they can't switch easily and so they won't unless for some reason jaws does something so bad it will have to be dumped.

There are still users trying to get windoweyes support.

THe funding in jobs here will include jaws and when I work I will be using ujaws for it probably.

Its the way it is.

On 25/01/2018 2:35 p.m., inamuddinInam Uddin via Groups.Io wrote:
Respected friends, as you are well aware that Mozilla has updated its browser FF58 on January 23rd 2018 as it promised!
I’m very much delighted to let you know that NVDA is well a head of all screen reader regarding the use of FF58.
The matter of fact is that I have JAWS 18.4530, JAWS 2018.1712.54, narrator and NVDA 2017.4.
I have tested FF58 with all of them and I found out that Fire Fox 58 is working the best with NVDA 2017.4.
I really couldn’t understand that even then Freedomscientific/VFO is charging hundreds and thousands of US Dollars from visually challenged people and from different agencies which are helping visually challenged people, why they haven’t come up with JAWS update before releasing of Fire Fox 58!
This fundamental question is enough to convince those people and agencies which are giving hundreds and thousands of Dollars to Freedomscientific/VFo, should donate a hand some amount of money to NVAccess as well so it can work for the betterment of visually challenged people better than before!
In short all I can say is “East and west, NVDA is the best”
With regards from Inamuddin with the Skype ID:
Charlsdarwin1


Arguing with a woman is reading software license agreement.
At the end, you have to ignore everything and clic I agree.
You can contact me via gmail:
inamuddin09@...
Inamuddin.ronaque@...
outlook:
inam092@...
yahoo:
inamuddin2010@...
Add my Skype ID:
charlsdarwin1
Meet me on facebook:
www.facebook.com/inamuddin786
Follow me on my twitter ID:
www.twitter.com/charlsdarwin1
Call me on my cell numbers:
+92-300-2227598
+92-334-3348409


FireFox 58 And Screen Readers

inamuddinInam Uddin
 

Respected friends, as you are well aware that Mozilla has updated its browser FF58 on January 23rd 2018 as it promised!

I’m very much delighted to let you know that NVDA is well a head of all screen reader regarding the use of FF58.

The matter of fact is that I have JAWS 18.4530, JAWS 2018.1712.54, narrator and NVDA 2017.4.

I have tested FF58 with all of them and I found out that Fire Fox 58 is working the best with NVDA 2017.4.

I really couldn’t understand that even then Freedomscientific/VFO is charging hundreds and thousands of US Dollars from visually challenged people  and from different agencies which are helping visually challenged people, why they haven’t come up with JAWS update before releasing of Fire Fox 58!

This fundamental question is enough to convince those people and agencies which are giving hundreds and thousands of Dollars to Freedomscientific/VFo, should donate a hand some amount of money to NVAccess as well so it can work for the betterment of visually challenged people better than before!

In short all I can say is “East and west, NVDA is the best”

With regards from Inamuddin with the Skype ID:

Charlsdarwin1

 

 

Arguing with a woman is reading software license agreement.
At the end, you have to ignore everything and clic I agree.
You can contact me via gmail:
inamuddin09@...
Inamuddin.ronaque@...
outlook:
inam092@...
yahoo:
inamuddin2010@...
Add my Skype ID:
charlsdarwin1
Meet me on facebook:
www.facebook.com/inamuddin786
Follow me on my twitter ID:
www.twitter.com/charlsdarwin1
Call me on my cell numbers:
+92-300-2227598
+92-334-3348409

 


A Test Email

inamuddinInam Uddin
 

Dear friends, this is a test email. Please reply me if my mails are getting through?

 

 

Arguing with a woman is reading software license agreement.
At the end, you have to ignore everything and clic I agree.
You can contact me via gmail:
inamuddin09@...
Inamuddin.ronaque@...
outlook:
inam092@...
yahoo:
inamuddin2010@...
Add my Skype ID:
charlsdarwin1
Meet me on facebook:
www.facebook.com/inamuddin786
Follow me on my twitter ID:
www.twitter.com/charlsdarwin1
Call me on my cell numbers:
+92-300-2227598
+92-334-3348409

 


Re: Checkboxes

Sarah k Alawami
 

Yeah thought so. I wonder what we can tell web developers though as I can't code check boxes to save my life. I have a CMS do all the work for me. I know the simple stuff but yeah not the more complex forms etc.

Any fix we can give the devs or are we just stuck doing the work around for now

On Jan 24, 2018, at 12:43 PM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

There is no NVDA setting.  
 
Also, since it happens on some check boxes and not on others, that's your answer.  If it were a setting, it would affect all check boxes.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 2:37 PM
Subject: [nvda] Checkboxes

Hi all,

something I've noticed fairly recently is that on some websites when I activate a checkbox it has stopped saying “checkbox checked” as I pres space bar to check it. I have to arrow back to make sure that it did indeed check (or uncheck).

I notice this mostly in WordPress where I use the checkboxes to select posts or media files I want to edit. It's not a WordPress only effect, but I don't think all websites have started doing this.

I'm just wondering whether it's a change in certain websites including WordPress or whether there's an NVDA setting that I've accidentally turned off that let me hear "checkbox checked" at the time I press the space bar on a checkbox.

Thanks for any suggestions :)

Giles


Re: Firefox 58

Gene
 

If people don't know this, in a Google search or, I would think when doing a search with other search engines, the results have a link to the result, then if you down arrow, you will see the address the link leads to.  If it is a long address, part of the middle may not be shown but enough will be shown that you will know if it is the correct address.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 6:41 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Firefox 58

I should have said, do a Google search to make sure that you are going to the correct site.  Check the address displayed for the site in the result you are going to go to to make sure the address is correct.  In other words, just because a Google result shows a site that looks like the one you want, without checking the address displayed below the link to go to the page, you can't be sure if it is correct or a site put up by a phisher or a malware distributor.  In otherwords, if you search for Mozilla or download firefox, or whatever and you are looking at a result you want to follow the link for, check the link.  If the link is different in some way, mozilla but spelled with one l, or something else not correct or expected that isn't the real site.  for a well known site like Mozilla, this is unlikely to happen.  Google shows results based on popularity and the real site is very likely to come up.  But you should check addresses to be sure.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 6:27 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Firefox 58

Your message cannot be answered as written.  My guess about what you are doing can be discussed.  for one thing, what do you mean you are using Google.  Google is a search engine.  Google Chrome is a browser.  If you typed something like Mozilla into Google, you wouldn't get Mozilla.com.  The first result would be for the Mozilla web site which has an org extension.  My guess is that you are using Google Chrome and that you typed http://www.mozilla.com into the address field and went there.  That is not Mozilla.  If you type an address and are taken somewhere that doesn't look right or is unexpected, then do a Google search to see what the actual address is.  And if you aren't absolutely sure of an address, don't go to it.  Search for the site you want using google.  There are malware distributors and phishers who purchase site names that are similar to the actual names of well known sites.  That's so that if people mistype because of a typographical error, they might be taken to a malicious site that may try to download malware onto the machine or try to get personal information from the person by looking like the real site and asking questions.  I'm not saying that mozilla.com is or isn't a malicious site, I don't know.  I'm saying that it is dangerous to go to addresses you aren't sure of. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Don H
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 5:59 PM
Subject: [nvda] Firefox 58

If I use google and go to www.mozilla.com  a web page comes up that
seems to have no way to access it.  If you try to tab or use any of the
hot keys to move around the screen the only thing NVDA says is download
firefox.  Is anyone else experiencing this issue?
Thanks




Re: Firefox 58

Gene
 

I should have said, do a Google search to make sure that you are going to the correct site.  Check the address displayed for the site in the result you are going to go to to make sure the address is correct.  In other words, just because a Google result shows a site that looks like the one you want, without checking the address displayed below the link to go to the page, you can't be sure if it is correct or a site put up by a phisher or a malware distributor.  In otherwords, if you search for Mozilla or download firefox, or whatever and you are looking at a result you want to follow the link for, check the link.  If the link is different in some way, mozilla but spelled with one l, or something else not correct or expected that isn't the real site.  for a well known site like Mozilla, this is unlikely to happen.  Google shows results based on popularity and the real site is very likely to come up.  But you should check addresses to be sure.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 6:27 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Firefox 58

Your message cannot be answered as written.  My guess about what you are doing can be discussed.  for one thing, what do you mean you are using Google.  Google is a search engine.  Google Chrome is a browser.  If you typed something like Mozilla into Google, you wouldn't get Mozilla.com.  The first result would be for the Mozilla web site which has an org extension.  My guess is that you are using Google Chrome and that you typed http://www.mozilla.com into the address field and went there.  That is not Mozilla.  If you type an address and are taken somewhere that doesn't look right or is unexpected, then do a Google search to see what the actual address is.  And if you aren't absolutely sure of an address, don't go to it.  Search for the site you want using google.  There are malware distributors and phishers who purchase site names that are similar to the actual names of well known sites.  That's so that if people mistype because of a typographical error, they might be taken to a malicious site that may try to download malware onto the machine or try to get personal information from the person by looking like the real site and asking questions.  I'm not saying that mozilla.com is or isn't a malicious site, I don't know.  I'm saying that it is dangerous to go to addresses you aren't sure of. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Don H
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 5:59 PM
Subject: [nvda] Firefox 58

If I use google and go to www.mozilla.com  a web page comes up that
seems to have no way to access it.  If you try to tab or use any of the
hot keys to move around the screen the only thing NVDA says is download
firefox.  Is anyone else experiencing this issue?
Thanks




Re: Firefox 58

Gene
 

Your message cannot be answered as written.  My guess about what you are doing can be discussed.  for one thing, what do you mean you are using Google.  Google is a search engine.  Google Chrome is a browser.  If you typed something like Mozilla into Google, you wouldn't get Mozilla.com.  The first result would be for the Mozilla web site which has an org extension.  My guess is that you are using Google Chrome and that you typed http://www.mozilla.com into the address field and went there.  That is not Mozilla.  If you type an address and are taken somewhere that doesn't look right or is unexpected, then do a Google search to see what the actual address is.  And if you aren't absolutely sure of an address, don't go to it.  Search for the site you want using google.  There are malware distributors and phishers who purchase site names that are similar to the actual names of well known sites.  That's so that if people mistype because of a typographical error, they might be taken to a malicious site that may try to download malware onto the machine or try to get personal information from the person by looking like the real site and asking questions.  I'm not saying that mozilla.com is or isn't a malicious site, I don't know.  I'm saying that it is dangerous to go to addresses you aren't sure of. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Don H
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 5:59 PM
Subject: [nvda] Firefox 58

If I use google and go to www.mozilla.com  a web page comes up that
seems to have no way to access it.  If you try to tab or use any of the
hot keys to move around the screen the only thing NVDA says is download
firefox.  Is anyone else experiencing this issue?
Thanks




Firefox 58

Don H
 

If I use google and go to www.mozilla.com a web page comes up that seems to have no way to access it. If you try to tab or use any of the hot keys to move around the screen the only thing NVDA says is download firefox. Is anyone else experiencing this issue?
Thanks