Date   

Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

 

Well avast you don't want, google toolbar you probably don't want.

But chrome, to be honest when does stuff become unwanted if you use it.

Like for example if you use avast, and or chrome, if it was bundled, its 1 less thing to load.

Avast and chrome are not the issue, its all this opencandy stuff.

Windows defender is supposed next month to be able to be more aggressive with scareware etc which sadly seems to be more false positives nad probably more targeting of the disabled, for games and other programs.

On 6/02/2018 11:57 a.m., Arlene wrote:
I should say the unwanted stuff like google chrome or other stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kevin
Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 2:46 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

sorry no.

On 05/02/2018 21:44, Arlene wrote:
Can you get it off ninite?

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of
*Gene
*Sent:* February-05-18 10:11 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I
thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or
more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause
people problems as well.

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use
either the portable version or the version that is called something
like the slim version.

Gene




.


Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Cristóbal
 

It used to be on Ninite many moons ago, but was removed at the request of the developer if memory serves. They wanted people to go to their actual site to download.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Monday, February 5, 2018 2:58 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

 

I've never heard of anyone getting it from Ninite.  That aside, you have to know how to protect yourself when downloading and installing free software.  You have to check the web page carefully for check boxes to refuse additional programs.  You have to look, using object navigation when installing a program and even that may not work.  You should be using unchecky, a utility you install and then just let it sit there, looking for bundled software.  It can't block everything but it blocks a lot and it may save you from downloading additional programs.

 

I can't say this is generally true but I wouldn't be surprised if it is.  If a site offers a portable version of a program. that program may not have any additional programs bundled with it.  By definition, a portable program makes no changes to your system.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Arlene

Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 3:44 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

 

Can you get it off ninite?

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: February-05-18 10:11 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

 

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause people problems as well.

 

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use either the portable version or the version that is called something like the slim version. 

 

Gene 


Re: my pc works properly but NVDA IS NOT WORKINF FINE IN WINDOWS10

 

Well optimising your ssd is supposed to shorten its life.

I have not noticed dammage while cleaning things to anything but google some of the chrome extentions can get dammaged.

I clear my restores every 6 months.

You shouldn't need to clean things every month.

I run ccleaner each session and at the end of the day to clear any potential nastys out of my temp locations.

I get a lot of malware in my temp locations which I don't care much if someone gets in there as I am always clearing that out of my temp locations.

As for disk cleanup every 6 munths or so.

Most of it is small fry, temp locations, and a few other things.

The biggest waste of space are old windows updates and logs.

If you ever clear windows defender its going to say your system is not secure and prompt you to scan till you do because its got nothing to show its been activated or anything so I don't clear this.

As for restore points, I clear points every so often,  I do clear all points before a major windows update and make another.

What I wish was for ms to clear all recovery partitons which were not the current windows update, yeah I know I can do this via partid but I'd like a guid thing or an automated things to clear out well partitions and resize things accordingly which are not manufacturer or the latest windows upgrade partition.

To be honest I don't know why ms doesn't do it itself when upgrading why leave a lot of non functional 500mb partitions at all.

On 6/02/2018 1:07 a.m., Moty Azrad wrote:
Dear all,


I have windows10 home edition 64 bits.

Jaws 2018 works very well.

Nvda, 2017.4 or any snapshot, don't work properly.

My question:

Every month, I am doing disk cleanup and use the file system cleaning too.

I delete it and make after that defrag or optimize my SSD C: drive.

can NVDA be damaged with this action I'm doing monthly?

Again, Jaws is not damaged and works very well but NVDA, does not work
properly with some programs as: firefox, google chrome, ms outlook 2010 Etc.

I use to delete my restore points and create manually one.


Thanks for any explanation or help for my isuue with NVDA.

Moti


Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Gene
 

If you have trouble finding something, and even if you don't, doing a Google search is often the easiest way to find something.  Search for ninite portable.  In the results, check the address under the link to the page to check if the link is legitimate.  In this case, use the link that leads to a page on the developers site.  For other programs, you may get a link to old apps or portable apps.  I think both sites are com.  You may see other links and not those.  In that case, ask on a good list if the sites are reputable or look up the sites on google.  You can search for something like is X site reliable or is x site safe or x sitename review.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 5:09 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

No, CCleaner doesn't appear to me on Ninite.  I don't know how to find a portable version. When I check for CCleaner on the site it takes me to for updating, I just get a few choices and there isn't any portable or slim version offered there. 

Roger









On 2/5/2018 3:44 PM, Arlene wrote:

Can you get it off ninite?

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: February-05-18 10:11 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

 

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause people problems as well.

 

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use either the portable version or the version that is called something like the slim version. 

 

Gene 



Re: say copy selected text

Gene
 

It has no way except in applications that use browse mode.
 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----

Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 5:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text

From what I know, nvda has a way to announce what has been copied to the clipboard.  If it is aware of this, then it could be made to say that something has been copied.  Whether or not it knows when something has been copied from the clipboard is another thing and I don't know if nvda is aware of this or not.  If it is, then making this a part of nvda core shouldn't be too hard to do.

Roger









On 2/5/2018 3:56 PM, Arlene wrote:

No kidding.  Yes there are other addins that you can take as your choice. But the say copy, cut and paste should be there just like all the other screen readers.  I like how you can get the addins as you like. But the cut, copy and paste should be there.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
Sent: February-05-18 7:50 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text

 

I agree if Jaws and other screen readers can properly do this so should NVDA

----- Original Message -----

From: Gene

Sent: Monday, February 5, 2018 7:50 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text

 

This message is long but it states and explains in detail why copy and paste is an important feature, and even more so with the poorly designed, paternalistic, read contents of clipboard feature available now. 

 

Where else do you find it very slow and buggy?  From my use, it isn't very slow and buggy much of the time.  I found one program, free video converter, where it prevents pasting of an address into the program.  It says pasted but the address is still the last one you used when not using the plugin.  You said it had problems in Word.  I don't have Word.  But in Notepad and Wordpad, using XP, there are no problems.  There are no problems copying and pasting in My Computer's folders and files list, nor in Windows Explorer.  When copying files to the clipboard, it is slow in reporting that something is copied.  But I'd rather have a delay, I'm not sure how long yours willl be.  I'm using an old slow machine and on mine, the delay may be a second or one and one half seconds.  Well worth it when compared with this possibility.  You aren't using the add on.  You copied and pasted a lot of files or even five or six from place to place.  You go to copy and paste more files to the same or a different location.  Since you aren't using the plugin, you get no indication about whether files have been copied to the clipboard or pasted.  You find, to your considerable annoyance, after pasting, that you have pasted the previous files to another location or that you now have duplicates of every file you previously pasted because copy didn't work even though you used the correct command and entered it correctly as far as keyboard technique is concerned.  You now have to delete the files from where they have just been copied, tgo back, copy the files you do want again, and then paste again.  If you are using clipspeak, this won't happen. 

 

As I said, this is an important feature.  People try to fob this off by saying, you can check what you have copied to the clipboard by using the speak contents of clipboard command, available in NVDA.  That's fine for small amounts of text.  But the clipboard feature wants to be smarter than you are.  It is designed not to speak larger amounts of ttext, only telling the number of characters.  Great design!  What if I want to copy a large amount of text and I just copied another large amount of text and pasted it previously.  How is knowing the number of characters going to help if it's one thousand three hundred characters the previous time and one thousand one hundred twenty characters the second time?  Yes, if you make a point of remembering the previous number you'll know if copying occurred.  But who should have to do this?  This is 2017.  This is the equivalent of a crank starter on a model T Ford.  And, though very unlikely, the number of characters might be the same or differ only by a few numbers such as one thousand two hundred fifty five and one thousand two hundred fifty two.  Or it may be more, two thousand three hundred twenty five.  Unless you really make an effort to remember the first number, you may not realize that the second number is different or you may not be sure.  In addition, when you copy files or folders to the clipboard, you are told something like no text on clipboard.  That's really helpful in teling you what files /and or folders you have pasted. 

 

If these levels of disfunction and poor design are acceptable in this feature, then why isn't a certain amount of inaccuracy acceptable in copying and pasting?  And I see no evidence that such is necessary based on past experience with JAWS and System Access to go. 

 

In short, the read contents of clipboard should be redesigned and should read everything that's there.  Programmers should not assume what is best for the user in a case like this.  It's paternalistic.  All the reader has to do to stop reading is press control, as in all other cases where speech is occurring.  As I recall, the excuse for not having the feature work that way is that the reader probably won't want to hear extended text.  Fine.  So let the reader press control. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 3:53 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text

 

Yes, I did wonder though many years ago  Dolphin had this in its novice mode
and it seemed to actually be reliable in what it said, but of course I never
did actually do exhaustive tests.

Besides, in those days most screenreaders used display chain drivers and it
may well be that it could be detected by some subtle change in the screen
content.
 The clipspeak is very slow and buggy, sadly though in most cases it does
work. Fails in Goldwave and creates spurious memory errors in some versions
of word.
 Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Quentin Christensen" <quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2018 8:53 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text


> The reason it isn't built in is precisely what you just said - when it was
> first being looked at, we couldn't actually know whether text had been
> cut,
> copied or pasted etc.  All we could do was detect that control+c had been
> pressed and know that is GENERALLY used for copy.  We didn't want to tell
> the user something had been copied when it hadn't, so instead there is the
> "Speak command keys" option (NVDA+4 or via the NVDA keyboard preferences
> NVDA+control+k) which will read CONTROL+C in that instance.
>
> The SpeakClip add-on does read the command - cut, copy, paste, select all
> etc.  It does make an effort to report this intelligently.  I recall a
> conversation with someone recently who said it is now more possible to
> accurately tell what has happened (text has been cut, a file has been
> copied, etc).  If that is the case, then it potentially could be
> considered
> to be built in.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Quentin.
>
> On Sun, Feb 4, 2018 at 7:59 PM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io <
> bglists@...> wrote:
>
>> Been here before. There is a fake clipboard announcement add on but its
>> not intelligent in that its really just reading the key combinations.
>> There
>> was an intelligent one being developed but it was slow and prone to
>> malfunctions and creating memory errors in Microsoft Word so I
>> uninstalled
>> it.
>> I have always said it should be designed in as a novice mode bit of help,
>> but at the time I think it was thought too hard to make it take into
>> account all the instances and get the indication correct.
>> This is one to bring up again on the add ons list I'd imagine.
>> Brian
>>
>> bglists@...
>> Sent via blueyonder.
>> Please address personal email to:-
>> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
>> in the display name field.
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin" <kleeva5@...>
>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2018 6:38 PM
>> Subject: [nvda] say copy selected text
>>
>>
>> How can I set NVDA to say copy selected text to the clip board and other
>> like commands when I copy, cut or paste!
>>
>> E-mail is golden!!!
>> Kevin Lee
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Quentin Christensen
> Training and Support Manager
>
> Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available:
> http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
>
> www.nvaccess.org
> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
> Twitter: @NVAccess
>




Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Pascal Lambert
 

If you contact the company, they will email you a link.

Blessings

Pascal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Stewart
Sent: Monday, February 5, 2018 6:09 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

 

No, CCleaner doesn't appear to me on Ninite.  I don't know how to find a portable version. When I check for CCleaner on the site it takes me to for updating, I just get a few choices and there isn't any portable or slim version offered there. 

Roger









On 2/5/2018 3:44 PM, Arlene wrote:

Can you get it off ninite?

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: February-05-18 10:11 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

 

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause people problems as well.

 

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use either the portable version or the version that is called something like the slim version. 

 

Gene 

 


Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Pascal Lambert
 

Yes it does. Not a 100% accessible but fairly manageable.
A very good utility.
Blessings
Pascal

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Arlene
Sent: Monday, February 5, 2018 6:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

Does it work for win ten?

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kevin Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 3:00 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

just search for c Cleaner slim and you will find it.

On 05/02/2018 22:57, Arlene wrote:
That is too bad. Then you would not have to get all this other junk.
The Junk that you install that you may not want!

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Kevin Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 2:46 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

sorry no.

On 05/02/2018 21:44, Arlene wrote:
Can you get it off ninite?

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of
*Gene
*Sent:* February-05-18 10:11 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I
thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or
more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause
people problems as well.

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner. Use
either the portable version or the version that is called something
like the slim version.

Gene






Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Gene
 

You don't have to get it.  Use the portable version or the slim, or whatever it is called, version.
 
Gene
----- original Message -----

From: Arlene
Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 4:57 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

That is too bad. Then you would not have to get all this other junk. The
Junk that you install that you may not want!

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kevin
Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 2:46 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

sorry no.

On 05/02/2018 21:44, Arlene wrote:
> Can you get it off ninite?
>
> *From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of
> *Gene
> *Sent:* February-05-18 10:11 AM
> *To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
> *Subject:* [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner
>
> I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I
> thought I should raise this very important point.
>
> CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or
> more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause
> people problems as well.
>
> Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use
> either the portable version or the version that is called something
> like the slim version.
>
> Gene
>
>







Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Roger Stewart
 

No, CCleaner doesn't appear to me on Ninite.  I don't know how to find a portable version. When I check for CCleaner on the site it takes me to for updating, I just get a few choices and there isn't any portable or slim version offered there. 

Roger









On 2/5/2018 3:44 PM, Arlene wrote:

Can you get it off ninite?

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: February-05-18 10:11 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

 

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause people problems as well.

 

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use either the portable version or the version that is called something like the slim version. 

 

Gene 



Re: say copy selected text

Roger Stewart
 

From what I know, nvda has a way to announce what has been copied to the clipboard.  If it is aware of this, then it could be made to say that something has been copied.  Whether or not it knows when something has been copied from the clipboard is another thing and I don't know if nvda is aware of this or not.  If it is, then making this a part of nvda core shouldn't be too hard to do.

Roger









On 2/5/2018 3:56 PM, Arlene wrote:

No kidding.  Yes there are other addins that you can take as your choice. But the say copy, cut and paste should be there just like all the other screen readers.  I like how you can get the addins as you like. But the cut, copy and paste should be there.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
Sent: February-05-18 7:50 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text

 

I agree if Jaws and other screen readers can properly do this so should NVDA

----- Original Message -----

From: Gene

Sent: Monday, February 5, 2018 7:50 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text

 

This message is long but it states and explains in detail why copy and paste is an important feature, and even more so with the poorly designed, paternalistic, read contents of clipboard feature available now. 

 

Where else do you find it very slow and buggy?  From my use, it isn't very slow and buggy much of the time.  I found one program, free video converter, where it prevents pasting of an address into the program.  It says pasted but the address is still the last one you used when not using the plugin.  You said it had problems in Word.  I don't have Word.  But in Notepad and Wordpad, using XP, there are no problems.  There are no problems copying and pasting in My Computer's folders and files list, nor in Windows Explorer.  When copying files to the clipboard, it is slow in reporting that something is copied.  But I'd rather have a delay, I'm not sure how long yours willl be.  I'm using an old slow machine and on mine, the delay may be a second or one and one half seconds.  Well worth it when compared with this possibility.  You aren't using the add on.  You copied and pasted a lot of files or even five or six from place to place.  You go to copy and paste more files to the same or a different location.  Since you aren't using the plugin, you get no indication about whether files have been copied to the clipboard or pasted.  You find, to your considerable annoyance, after pasting, that you have pasted the previous files to another location or that you now have duplicates of every file you previously pasted because copy didn't work even though you used the correct command and entered it correctly as far as keyboard technique is concerned.  You now have to delete the files from where they have just been copied, tgo back, copy the files you do want again, and then paste again.  If you are using clipspeak, this won't happen. 

 

As I said, this is an important feature.  People try to fob this off by saying, you can check what you have copied to the clipboard by using the speak contents of clipboard command, available in NVDA.  That's fine for small amounts of text.  But the clipboard feature wants to be smarter than you are.  It is designed not to speak larger amounts of ttext, only telling the number of characters.  Great design!  What if I want to copy a large amount of text and I just copied another large amount of text and pasted it previously.  How is knowing the number of characters going to help if it's one thousand three hundred characters the previous time and one thousand one hundred twenty characters the second time?  Yes, if you make a point of remembering the previous number you'll know if copying occurred.  But who should have to do this?  This is 2017.  This is the equivalent of a crank starter on a model T Ford.  And, though very unlikely, the number of characters might be the same or differ only by a few numbers such as one thousand two hundred fifty five and one thousand two hundred fifty two.  Or it may be more, two thousand three hundred twenty five.  Unless you really make an effort to remember the first number, you may not realize that the second number is different or you may not be sure.  In addition, when you copy files or folders to the clipboard, you are told something like no text on clipboard.  That's really helpful in teling you what files /and or folders you have pasted. 

 

If these levels of disfunction and poor design are acceptable in this feature, then why isn't a certain amount of inaccuracy acceptable in copying and pasting?  And I see no evidence that such is necessary based on past experience with JAWS and System Access to go. 

 

In short, the read contents of clipboard should be redesigned and should read everything that's there.  Programmers should not assume what is best for the user in a case like this.  It's paternalistic.  All the reader has to do to stop reading is press control, as in all other cases where speech is occurring.  As I recall, the excuse for not having the feature work that way is that the reader probably won't want to hear extended text.  Fine.  So let the reader press control. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 3:53 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text

 

Yes, I did wonder though many years ago  Dolphin had this in its novice mode
and it seemed to actually be reliable in what it said, but of course I never
did actually do exhaustive tests.

Besides, in those days most screenreaders used display chain drivers and it
may well be that it could be detected by some subtle change in the screen
content.
 The clipspeak is very slow and buggy, sadly though in most cases it does
work. Fails in Goldwave and creates spurious memory errors in some versions
of word.
 Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Quentin Christensen" <quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2018 8:53 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text


> The reason it isn't built in is precisely what you just said - when it was
> first being looked at, we couldn't actually know whether text had been
> cut,
> copied or pasted etc.  All we could do was detect that control+c had been
> pressed and know that is GENERALLY used for copy.  We didn't want to tell
> the user something had been copied when it hadn't, so instead there is the
> "Speak command keys" option (NVDA+4 or via the NVDA keyboard preferences
> NVDA+control+k) which will read CONTROL+C in that instance.
>
> The SpeakClip add-on does read the command - cut, copy, paste, select all
> etc.  It does make an effort to report this intelligently.  I recall a
> conversation with someone recently who said it is now more possible to
> accurately tell what has happened (text has been cut, a file has been
> copied, etc).  If that is the case, then it potentially could be
> considered
> to be built in.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Quentin.
>
> On Sun, Feb 4, 2018 at 7:59 PM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io <
> bglists@...> wrote:
>
>> Been here before. There is a fake clipboard announcement add on but its
>> not intelligent in that its really just reading the key combinations.
>> There
>> was an intelligent one being developed but it was slow and prone to
>> malfunctions and creating memory errors in Microsoft Word so I
>> uninstalled
>> it.
>> I have always said it should be designed in as a novice mode bit of help,
>> but at the time I think it was thought too hard to make it take into
>> account all the instances and get the indication correct.
>> This is one to bring up again on the add ons list I'd imagine.
>> Brian
>>
>> bglists@...
>> Sent via blueyonder.
>> Please address personal email to:-
>> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
>> in the display name field.
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin" <kleeva5@...>
>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2018 6:38 PM
>> Subject: [nvda] say copy selected text
>>
>>
>> How can I set NVDA to say copy selected text to the clip board and other
>> like commands when I copy, cut or paste!
>>
>> E-mail is golden!!!
>> Kevin Lee
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Quentin Christensen
> Training and Support Manager
>
> Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available:
> http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
>
> www.nvaccess.org
> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
> Twitter: @NVAccess
>




Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Roger Stewart
 

Yes it does!  I've been using CCleaner with Win 10 for a couple years now.  Works just fine.

Roger

On 2/5/2018 5:02 PM, Arlene wrote:
Does it work for win ten?

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kevin Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 3:00 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

just search for c Cleaner slim and you will find it.

On 05/02/2018 22:57, Arlene wrote:
That is too bad. Then you would not have to get all this other junk.
The Junk that you install that you may not want!

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Kevin Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 2:46 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

sorry no.

On 05/02/2018 21:44, Arlene wrote:
Can you get it off ninite?

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of
*Gene
*Sent:* February-05-18 10:11 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I
thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or
more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause
people problems as well.

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner. Use
either the portable version or the version that is called something
like the slim version.

Gene








Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Arlene
 

Does it work for win ten?

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kevin Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 3:00 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

just search for c Cleaner slim and you will find it.

On 05/02/2018 22:57, Arlene wrote:
That is too bad. Then you would not have to get all this other junk.
The Junk that you install that you may not want!

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Kevin Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 2:46 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

sorry no.

On 05/02/2018 21:44, Arlene wrote:
Can you get it off ninite?

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of
*Gene
*Sent:* February-05-18 10:11 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I
thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or
more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause
people problems as well.

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner. Use
either the portable version or the version that is called something
like the slim version.

Gene






Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Kevin Cussick
 

just search for c Cleaner slim and you will find it.

On 05/02/2018 22:57, Arlene wrote:
That is too bad. Then you would not have to get all this other junk. The
Junk that you install that you may not want!
-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kevin
Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 2:46 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner
sorry no.
On 05/02/2018 21:44, Arlene wrote:
Can you get it off ninite?

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of
*Gene
*Sent:* February-05-18 10:11 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I
thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or
more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause
people problems as well.

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use
either the portable version or the version that is called something
like the slim version.

Gene


Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Gene
 

I've never heard of anyone getting it from Ninite.  That aside, you have to know how to protect yourself when downloading and installing free software.  You have to check the web page carefully for check boxes to refuse additional programs.  You have to look, using object navigation when installing a program and even that may not work.  You should be using unchecky, a utility you install and then just let it sit there, looking for bundled software.  It can't block everything but it blocks a lot and it may save you from downloading additional programs.
 
I can't say this is generally true but I wouldn't be surprised if it is.  If a site offers a portable version of a program. that program may not have any additional programs bundled with it.  By definition, a portable program makes no changes to your system.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Arlene
Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

Can you get it off ninite?

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: February-05-18 10:11 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

 

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause people problems as well.

 

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use either the portable version or the version that is called something like the slim version. 

 

Gene 


Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Arlene
 

I should say the unwanted stuff like google chrome or other stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kevin
Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 2:46 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

sorry no.

On 05/02/2018 21:44, Arlene wrote:
Can you get it off ninite?

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of
*Gene
*Sent:* February-05-18 10:11 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I
thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or
more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause
people problems as well.

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use
either the portable version or the version that is called something
like the slim version.

Gene


Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Arlene
 

That is too bad. Then you would not have to get all this other junk. The
Junk that you install that you may not want!

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kevin
Cussick via Groups.Io
Sent: February-05-18 2:46 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

sorry no.

On 05/02/2018 21:44, Arlene wrote:
Can you get it off ninite?

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of
*Gene
*Sent:* February-05-18 10:11 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner

I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I
thought I should raise this very important point.

CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or
more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause
people problems as well.

Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use
either the portable version or the version that is called something
like the slim version.

Gene


Re: important to read before installing CCleaner

Kevin Cussick
 

sorry no.

On 05/02/2018 21:44, Arlene wrote:
Can you get it off ninite?
*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of *Gene
*Sent:* February-05-18 10:11 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* [nvda] important to read before installing CCleaner
I didn't keep the messages in the current CCleaner thread but I thought I should raise this very important point.
CCleaner, as do so many free programs now comes bundled with one or more programs you probably don't want. Some of these programs cause people problems as well.
Don't download and install the regular version of CCleaner.  Use either the portable version or the version that is called something like the slim version.
Gene


Re: my pc works properly but NVDA IS NOT WORKINF FINE IN WINDOWS10

Chris
 

What is not working properly???

Without further information its all going to be a guess

 

 

 

 

From: Arlene
Sent: 05 February 2018 22:01
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] my pc works properly but NVDA IS NOT WORKINF FINE IN WINDOWS10

 

Hi, this person's having this problem with win ten.

 

-----Original Message-----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of zahra

Sent: February-05-18 6:47 AM

To: nvda@nvda.groups.io

Subject: Re: [nvda] my pc works properly but NVDA IS NOT WORKINF FINE IN WINDOWS10

 

hello.

just disk clean up does not cause problem for nvda.

i use disk clean up on windows xp, c drive only and have no issue with nvda.

 

On 2/5/18, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

> You have evidently removed a program that unregistered some dll files.

> How to reregister them has been discussed on the list before.  I

> didn't keep the information and I'll leave it to others to tell you

> where to find it, as to how to reregister them.  It's a simple

> procedure and it will probably solve your problem.

> Gene

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: Moty Azrad

> Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 6:07 AM

> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io

> Subject: [nvda] my pc works properly but NVDA IS NOT WORKINF FINE IN

> WINDOWS10

> Dear all,

> I have windows10 home edition 64 bits.

> Jaws 2018 works very well.

> Nvda, 2017.4 or any snapshot, don't work properly.

> My question:

> Every month, I am doing disk cleanup and use the file system cleaning too.

> I delete it and  make after that defrag or optimize my SSD C: drive.

> can NVDA be damaged with this action I'm doing monthly?

> Again, Jaws is not damaged and works very well but NVDA, does not work

> properly with some programs as: firefox, google chrome, ms outlook

> 2010 Etc.

> I use to delete my restore points and create manually one.

> Thanks for any explanation or help for my isuue with NVDA.

> Moti

 

 

--

we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.

holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.

in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:

indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.

best website for studying islamic book in different languages www.al-islam.org

 

 

 

 

 

 


Re: my pc works properly but NVDA IS NOT WORKINF FINE IN WINDOWS10

Arlene
 

Hi, this person's having this problem with win ten.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of zahra
Sent: February-05-18 6:47 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] my pc works properly but NVDA IS NOT WORKINF FINE IN WINDOWS10

hello.
just disk clean up does not cause problem for nvda.
i use disk clean up on windows xp, c drive only and have no issue with nvda.

On 2/5/18, Gene <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:
You have evidently removed a program that unregistered some dll files.
How to reregister them has been discussed on the list before. I
didn't keep the information and I'll leave it to others to tell you
where to find it, as to how to reregister them. It's a simple
procedure and it will probably solve your problem.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Moty Azrad
Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 6:07 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] my pc works properly but NVDA IS NOT WORKINF FINE IN
WINDOWS10


Dear all,



I have windows10 home edition 64 bits.

Jaws 2018 works very well.

Nvda, 2017.4 or any snapshot, don't work properly.

My question:

Every month, I am doing disk cleanup and use the file system cleaning too.

I delete it and make after that defrag or optimize my SSD C: drive.

can NVDA be damaged with this action I'm doing monthly?

Again, Jaws is not damaged and works very well but NVDA, does not work
properly with some programs as: firefox, google chrome, ms outlook
2010 Etc.

I use to delete my restore points and create manually one.



Thanks for any explanation or help for my isuue with NVDA.

Moti


--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:
indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages www.al-islam.org


Re: say copy selected text

Arlene
 

No kidding.  Yes there are other addins that you can take as your choice. But the say copy, cut and paste should be there just like all the other screen readers.  I like how you can get the addins as you like. But the cut, copy and paste should be there.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
Sent: February-05-18 7:50 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text

 

I agree if Jaws and other screen readers can properly do this so should NVDA

----- Original Message -----

From: Gene

Sent: Monday, February 5, 2018 7:50 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text

 

This message is long but it states and explains in detail why copy and paste is an important feature, and even more so with the poorly designed, paternalistic, read contents of clipboard feature available now. 

 

Where else do you find it very slow and buggy?  From my use, it isn't very slow and buggy much of the time.  I found one program, free video converter, where it prevents pasting of an address into the program.  It says pasted but the address is still the last one you used when not using the plugin.  You said it had problems in Word.  I don't have Word.  But in Notepad and Wordpad, using XP, there are no problems.  There are no problems copying and pasting in My Computer's folders and files list, nor in Windows Explorer.  When copying files to the clipboard, it is slow in reporting that something is copied.  But I'd rather have a delay, I'm not sure how long yours willl be.  I'm using an old slow machine and on mine, the delay may be a second or one and one half seconds.  Well worth it when compared with this possibility.  You aren't using the add on.  You copied and pasted a lot of files or even five or six from place to place.  You go to copy and paste more files to the same or a different location.  Since you aren't using the plugin, you get no indication about whether files have been copied to the clipboard or pasted.  You find, to your considerable annoyance, after pasting, that you have pasted the previous files to another location or that you now have duplicates of every file you previously pasted because copy didn't work even though you used the correct command and entered it correctly as far as keyboard technique is concerned.  You now have to delete the files from where they have just been copied, tgo back, copy the files you do want again, and then paste again.  If you are using clipspeak, this won't happen. 

 

As I said, this is an important feature.  People try to fob this off by saying, you can check what you have copied to the clipboard by using the speak contents of clipboard command, available in NVDA.  That's fine for small amounts of text.  But the clipboard feature wants to be smarter than you are.  It is designed not to speak larger amounts of ttext, only telling the number of characters.  Great design!  What if I want to copy a large amount of text and I just copied another large amount of text and pasted it previously.  How is knowing the number of characters going to help if it's one thousand three hundred characters the previous time and one thousand one hundred twenty characters the second time?  Yes, if you make a point of remembering the previous number you'll know if copying occurred.  But who should have to do this?  This is 2017.  This is the equivalent of a crank starter on a model T Ford.  And, though very unlikely, the number of characters might be the same or differ only by a few numbers such as one thousand two hundred fifty five and one thousand two hundred fifty two.  Or it may be more, two thousand three hundred twenty five.  Unless you really make an effort to remember the first number, you may not realize that the second number is different or you may not be sure.  In addition, when you copy files or folders to the clipboard, you are told something like no text on clipboard.  That's really helpful in teling you what files /and or folders you have pasted. 

 

If these levels of disfunction and poor design are acceptable in this feature, then why isn't a certain amount of inaccuracy acceptable in copying and pasting?  And I see no evidence that such is necessary based on past experience with JAWS and System Access to go. 

 

In short, the read contents of clipboard should be redesigned and should read everything that's there.  Programmers should not assume what is best for the user in a case like this.  It's paternalistic.  All the reader has to do to stop reading is press control, as in all other cases where speech is occurring.  As I recall, the excuse for not having the feature work that way is that the reader probably won't want to hear extended text.  Fine.  So let the reader press control. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 3:53 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text

 

Yes, I did wonder though many years ago  Dolphin had this in its novice mode
and it seemed to actually be reliable in what it said, but of course I never
did actually do exhaustive tests.

Besides, in those days most screenreaders used display chain drivers and it
may well be that it could be detected by some subtle change in the screen
content.
 The clipspeak is very slow and buggy, sadly though in most cases it does
work. Fails in Goldwave and creates spurious memory errors in some versions
of word.
 Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Quentin Christensen" <quentin@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2018 8:53 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] say copy selected text


> The reason it isn't built in is precisely what you just said - when it was
> first being looked at, we couldn't actually know whether text had been
> cut,
> copied or pasted etc.  All we could do was detect that control+c had been
> pressed and know that is GENERALLY used for copy.  We didn't want to tell
> the user something had been copied when it hadn't, so instead there is the
> "Speak command keys" option (NVDA+4 or via the NVDA keyboard preferences
> NVDA+control+k) which will read CONTROL+C in that instance.
>
> The SpeakClip add-on does read the command - cut, copy, paste, select all
> etc.  It does make an effort to report this intelligently.  I recall a
> conversation with someone recently who said it is now more possible to
> accurately tell what has happened (text has been cut, a file has been
> copied, etc).  If that is the case, then it potentially could be
> considered
> to be built in.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Quentin.
>
> On Sun, Feb 4, 2018 at 7:59 PM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io <
> bglists@...> wrote:
>
>> Been here before. There is a fake clipboard announcement add on but its
>> not intelligent in that its really just reading the key combinations.
>> There
>> was an intelligent one being developed but it was slow and prone to
>> malfunctions and creating memory errors in Microsoft Word so I
>> uninstalled
>> it.
>> I have always said it should be designed in as a novice mode bit of help,
>> but at the time I think it was thought too hard to make it take into
>> account all the instances and get the indication correct.
>> This is one to bring up again on the add ons list I'd imagine.
>> Brian
>>
>> bglists@...
>> Sent via blueyonder.
>> Please address personal email to:-
>> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
>> in the display name field.
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin" <kleeva5@...>
>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2018 6:38 PM
>> Subject: [nvda] say copy selected text
>>
>>
>> How can I set NVDA to say copy selected text to the clip board and other
>> like commands when I copy, cut or paste!
>>
>> E-mail is golden!!!
>> Kevin Lee
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Quentin Christensen
> Training and Support Manager
>
> Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available:
> http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
>
> www.nvaccess.org
> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
> Twitter: @NVAccess
>