Date   

Re: Question about Web Browsing

Gene
 

I just looked at the mobile site.  I only looked at the page that comes up when you use the link I provided.  I didn't look at a product or item for sale.  The page that comes up is so truncated that I wonder how useful the entire mobile alternative is.  If you do a search for something, and then go to a result to purchase it or learn more, I wonder if it is extremely sparse in the information you get.  The access site may be much more useful.  Those who are more interested may wish to compare and report.  But the mobile page that comes up is extremely short, with almost nothing on it. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 4:21 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

If you do a google search for Amazon mobile site, you will see this as a very early result.
 
You can tell it's the correct link without even going to the site by looking at the excerpt of the page related to the link, that is below the link and the address in the results.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

That is just the regular URL.
Seems like there is some code one can put in their browser settings to always open the mobile version.
Basically, I think that this setting sends the message to the site that this is a mobile device.
Not sure how to do that though.
Otherwise, I don't know what other things to try, since that replacing WWW with an M does not work.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


I just went to Amazon.com on my phone, and this is the address it gave:
https://www.amazon.com

Chris


> On May 16, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@...> wrote:
>
> I just tried:
> https://m.amazon.com/
> and that does not work.
> I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile site.
> Glenn
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>
>
> This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.
>
> http://www.amazon.com/access
>
> Hope this helps,
>
> Chris
>
>
>> On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@...> wrote:
>>
>> Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.
>>
>> The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>> It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
>> I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
>> Also, sometimes I like the section called:
>> You might also like:
>> And
>> Other similar items
>> Neither of which are on the accessible page.
>> But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
>> It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
>> I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
>> Glenn
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>> I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?
>>
>> I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>> The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
>> I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
>> Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
>> And I like all the information from the regular page.
>> You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
>> But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
>> Glenn
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>> Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>> Is that m.amazon.com?  They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>> On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:
>>>
>>> You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Christopher Gray
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>> On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
>>>> behaviour, though their use of frams and  carousel based suggestions
>>>> can be a little irritating at times!
>>>> Brian
>>>>
>>>> bglists@...
>>>> Sent via blueyonder.
>>>> Please address personal E-mail to:-
>>>> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
>>>> in the display name field.
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
>>>> <chris@...>
>>>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Good deal, many thanks.
>>>>>
>>>>> Chris
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
>>>>>> control +  f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
>>>>>> chosen as your  NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@...> wrote:
>>>>>>> Hi:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question.  I come to NVDA
>>>>>>> with  just  over a  week of experience, and things have gone
>>>>>>> pretty well.  Before now, I  have  been a  Cobra users for many
>>>>>>> years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a  Window-Eyes user.
>>>>>>> Those are my points of reference.  I have reveiwed and then  read
>>>>>>> the  NVDA  User manual on the online Help system and found it
>>>>>>> pretty useful.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
>>>>>>> on  Amazon.com  thus far.  I am used to having a command in Cobra,
>>>>>>> ctrl+f, which was  an  internal  Find command, not an Internet
>>>>>>> Explorer command.  Is there an  equivalent in  NVDA  or some
>>>>>>> alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
>>>>>>> disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
>>>>>>> software  program itself??  Also, after I choose an item to
>>>>>>> examine or purchase  on  Amazon,  that part of the screen seems to
>>>>>>> go blank.  I don't know how to get  things  to  reset.
>>>>>>> Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
>>>>>>> solution  is to
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> start using Chrome, I could do that.  Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
>>>>>>> information  to  help me get started?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
>>>>>>> appreciated.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chris
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ****************************************
>>>>>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
>>>>>>> Council of  the Blind in  your Will or Estate Plan?
>>>>>>> Contact me as shown below and I can help  you with  this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>>>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director  Missouri Council of the
>>>>>>> Blind
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>>>>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>>>>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>>>>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>>>>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>>>>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
>>>>>>> Voice,  Chris and Don.
>>>>>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
>>>>>>> Pacific
>>>>>>> Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>>>>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
>>>>>>> "Listen  to  Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
>>>>>>> live broadcast.
>>>>>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>>>>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe  Jackie McBride
>>>>>> Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
>>>>>> https://brighter-vision.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ****************************************
>>>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
>>>>> Council  of the Blind in  your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as
>>>>> shown below and I can help you  with this.
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director  Missouri Council of the Blind
>>>>>
>>>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>>>
>>>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
>>>>> Voice,  Chris and Don.
>>>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
>>>>> Pacific
>>>>> Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
>>>>> to  Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>>>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> ****************************************
>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------
>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director
>>> Missouri Council of the Blind
>>>
>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>
>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ****************************************
>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.
>>
>> ----------------------------------------
>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director
>> Missouri Council of the Blind
>>
>> 5453 Chippewa
>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>
>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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Re: Question about Web Browsing

Ervin, Glenn
 

Gene,

That is one I really haven’t made use of.

I’ll have to see how it works for providing the kind of information I’m usually looking for.

Thanks.

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 4:26 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

 

You can move by separator, the letter s, as well.  On some sites, that is an important way to move. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Ervin, Glenn

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 4:07 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

 

Actually, I think most sighted folk would like a bit less stuff on some of these sites.
I always jump by headings, or by buttons, or I look for edit fields.
Sometimes I search for a specific word, like when I open a product link in eBay, I usually press the find command and type in:
Desc
And that takes me to the description.
I haven't tried it in a long time, but it seems like the M. works for eBay.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:40 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

A part of me does think: Why would we promote using a separate site that offers the same service, just because we have a disability? It has been a while since I have used Amazon on a computer, since I always use the app on my iPhone, but I will check into what it would look like, to perhaps even tab past that carousel. As others have said, try other things like headings, elements list with insert+f7, etc. If you know the key phrase or part of it, use CTRL+NVDA+F, to bring up NVDA's find command. Type the part of the phrase you know.

Having to go through developer tools and change how the browser sends the version just for Amazon sounds really cumbersome. If I had to do that, I would contact Amazon's customer service for guidance. I would either send a complaint, or see what information they could offer. See what NVDA features are available from NVDA's user guide that you may not have thought of, for browsing the web.

Overall, there is no one size fits all solution. It really boils down to why you are on Amazon, what you are shopping for, the information you need, and if you need to see the related items that someone earlier mentioned that says, "Items like this one," or whatever it said.

Good luck!

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:09 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

This may take some digging around, but see if your browser allows the user agent to be changed. You may have to enable developer mode.

> On May 16, 2018, at 3:07 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@...> wrote:
>
> That is just the regular URL.
> Seems like there is some code one can put in their browser settings to always open the mobile version.
> Basically, I think that this setting sends the message to the site that this is a mobile device.
> Not sure how to do that though.
> Otherwise, I don't know what other things to try, since that replacing WWW with an M does not work.
> Glenn
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
> Chris Chaffin
> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:05 PM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>
>
> I just went to Amazon.com on my phone, and this is the address it gave:
> https://www.amazon.com
>
> Chris
>
>
>> On May 16, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@...> wrote:
>>
>> I just tried:
>> https://m.amazon.com/
>> and that does not work.
>> I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile site.
>> Glenn
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>> Chris Chaffin
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>>
>> This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.
>>
>> http://www.amazon.com/access
>>
>> Hope this helps,
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>>> On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@...> wrote:
>>>
>>> Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.
>>>
>>> The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Ervin, Glenn
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
>>> I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
>>> Also, sometimes I like the section called:
>>> You might also like:
>>> And
>>> Other similar items
>>> Neither of which are on the accessible page.
>>> But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
>>> It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
>>> I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
>>> Glenn
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Walker, Michael E
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?
>>>
>>> I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Ervin, Glenn
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
>>> I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
>>> Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
>>> And I like all the information from the regular page.
>>> You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
>>> But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
>>> Glenn
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Walker, Michael E
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Christopher Gray
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> Is that m.amazon.com?  They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>> On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:
>>>>
>>>> You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>>> Christopher Gray
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
>>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>>
>>>> With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.
>>>>
>>>> Chris
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed
>>>>> this behaviour, though their use of frams and  carousel based
>>>>> suggestions can be a little irritating at times!
>>>>> Brian
>>>>>
>>>>> bglists@...
>>>>> Sent via blueyonder.
>>>>> Please address personal E-mail to:- briang1@...,
>>>>> putting 'Brian Gaff'
>>>>> in the display name field.
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
>>>>> <chris@...>
>>>>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Good deal, many thanks.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Chris
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
>>>>>>> control +  f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
>>>>>>> chosen as your  NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@...> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hi:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question.  I come to NVDA
>>>>>>>> with  just  over a  week of experience, and things have gone
>>>>>>>> pretty well.  Before now, I  have  been a  Cobra users for many
>>>>>>>> years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a  Window-Eyes user.
>>>>>>>> Those are my points of reference.  I have reveiwed and then
>>>>>>>> read the  NVDA  User manual on the online Help system and found
>>>>>>>> it pretty useful.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing,
>>>>>>>> mostly on  Amazon.com  thus far.  I am used to having a command
>>>>>>>> in Cobra,
>>>>>>>> ctrl+f, which was  an  internal  Find command, not an Internet
>>>>>>>> Explorer command.  Is there an  equivalent in  NVDA  or some
>>>>>>>> alternative technique available to find things on a screen
>>>>>>>> without disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of
>>>>>>>> mode in the software  program itself??  Also, after I choose an
>>>>>>>> item to examine or purchase  on  Amazon,  that part of the
>>>>>>>> screen seems to go blank.  I don't know how to get  things  to  reset.
>>>>>>>> Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
>>>>>>>> solution  is to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> start using Chrome, I could do that.  Is there
>>>>>>>> NVDA/Chrome-based information  to  help me get started?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very
>>>>>>>> much appreciated.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Chris
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ****************************************
>>>>>>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to
>>>>>>>> Missouri Council of  the Blind in  your Will or Estate Plan?
>>>>>>>> Contact me as shown below and I can help  you with  this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>>>>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director  Missouri Council of the
>>>>>>>> Blind
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>>>>>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>>>>>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>>>>>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>>>>>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>>>>>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the
>>>>>>>> Global Voice,  Chris and Don.
>>>>>>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
>>>>>>>> Pacific
>>>>>>>> Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>>>>>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
>>>>>>>> "Listen  to  Past Shows" link any time during the week after
>>>>>>>> each live broadcast.
>>>>>>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>>>>>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe  Jackie McBride
>>>>>>> Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
>>>>>>> https://brighter-vision.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ****************************************
>>>>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
>>>>>> Council  of the Blind in  your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me
>>>>>> as shown below and I can help you  with this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director  Missouri Council of the
>>>>>> Blind
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>>>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>>>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>>>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>>>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>>>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
>>>>>> Voice,  Chris and Don.
>>>>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
>>>>>> Pacific
>>>>>> Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>>>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
>>>>>> "Listen to  Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>>>>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>>>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ****************************************
>>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.
>>>>
>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind
>>>>
>>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>>
>>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
>>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> ****************************************
>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------
>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind
>>>
>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>
>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>












Re: Question about Web Browsing

Gene
 

You can move by separator, the letter s, as well.  On some sites, that is an important way to move. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 4:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Actually, I think most sighted folk would like a bit less stuff on some of these sites.
I always jump by headings, or by buttons, or I look for edit fields.
Sometimes I search for a specific word, like when I open a product link in eBay, I usually press the find command and type in:
Desc
And that takes me to the description.
I haven't tried it in a long time, but it seems like the M. works for eBay.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:40 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

A part of me does think: Why would we promote using a separate site that offers the same service, just because we have a disability? It has been a while since I have used Amazon on a computer, since I always use the app on my iPhone, but I will check into what it would look like, to perhaps even tab past that carousel. As others have said, try other things like headings, elements list with insert+f7, etc. If you know the key phrase or part of it, use CTRL+NVDA+F, to bring up NVDA's find command. Type the part of the phrase you know.

Having to go through developer tools and change how the browser sends the version just for Amazon sounds really cumbersome. If I had to do that, I would contact Amazon's customer service for guidance. I would either send a complaint, or see what information they could offer. See what NVDA features are available from NVDA's user guide that you may not have thought of, for browsing the web.

Overall, there is no one size fits all solution. It really boils down to why you are on Amazon, what you are shopping for, the information you need, and if you need to see the related items that someone earlier mentioned that says, "Items like this one," or whatever it said.

Good luck!

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:09 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

This may take some digging around, but see if your browser allows the user agent to be changed. You may have to enable developer mode.

> On May 16, 2018, at 3:07 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@...> wrote:
>
> That is just the regular URL.
> Seems like there is some code one can put in their browser settings to always open the mobile version.
> Basically, I think that this setting sends the message to the site that this is a mobile device.
> Not sure how to do that though.
> Otherwise, I don't know what other things to try, since that replacing WWW with an M does not work.
> Glenn
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
> Chris Chaffin
> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:05 PM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>
>
> I just went to Amazon.com on my phone, and this is the address it gave:
> https://www.amazon.com
>
> Chris
>
>
>> On May 16, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@...> wrote:
>>
>> I just tried:
>> https://m.amazon.com/
>> and that does not work.
>> I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile site.
>> Glenn
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>> Chris Chaffin
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>>
>> This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.
>>
>> http://www.amazon.com/access
>>
>> Hope this helps,
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>>> On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@...> wrote:
>>>
>>> Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.
>>>
>>> The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Ervin, Glenn
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
>>> I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
>>> Also, sometimes I like the section called:
>>> You might also like:
>>> And
>>> Other similar items
>>> Neither of which are on the accessible page.
>>> But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
>>> It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
>>> I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
>>> Glenn
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Walker, Michael E
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?
>>>
>>> I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Ervin, Glenn
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
>>> I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
>>> Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
>>> And I like all the information from the regular page.
>>> You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
>>> But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
>>> Glenn
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Walker, Michael E
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Christopher Gray
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> Is that m.amazon.com?  They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>> On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:
>>>>
>>>> You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>>> Christopher Gray
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
>>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>>
>>>> With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.
>>>>
>>>> Chris
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed
>>>>> this behaviour, though their use of frams and  carousel based
>>>>> suggestions can be a little irritating at times!
>>>>> Brian
>>>>>
>>>>> bglists@...
>>>>> Sent via blueyonder.
>>>>> Please address personal E-mail to:- briang1@...,
>>>>> putting 'Brian Gaff'
>>>>> in the display name field.
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
>>>>> <chris@...>
>>>>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Good deal, many thanks.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Chris
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
>>>>>>> control +  f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
>>>>>>> chosen as your  NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@...> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hi:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question.  I come to NVDA
>>>>>>>> with  just  over a  week of experience, and things have gone
>>>>>>>> pretty well.  Before now, I  have  been a  Cobra users for many
>>>>>>>> years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a  Window-Eyes user.
>>>>>>>> Those are my points of reference.  I have reveiwed and then
>>>>>>>> read the  NVDA  User manual on the online Help system and found
>>>>>>>> it pretty useful.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing,
>>>>>>>> mostly on  Amazon.com  thus far.  I am used to having a command
>>>>>>>> in Cobra,
>>>>>>>> ctrl+f, which was  an  internal  Find command, not an Internet
>>>>>>>> Explorer command.  Is there an  equivalent in  NVDA  or some
>>>>>>>> alternative technique available to find things on a screen
>>>>>>>> without disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of
>>>>>>>> mode in the software  program itself??  Also, after I choose an
>>>>>>>> item to examine or purchase  on  Amazon,  that part of the
>>>>>>>> screen seems to go blank.  I don't know how to get  things  to  reset.
>>>>>>>> Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
>>>>>>>> solution  is to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> start using Chrome, I could do that.  Is there
>>>>>>>> NVDA/Chrome-based information  to  help me get started?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very
>>>>>>>> much appreciated.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Chris
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ****************************************
>>>>>>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to
>>>>>>>> Missouri Council of  the Blind in  your Will or Estate Plan?
>>>>>>>> Contact me as shown below and I can help  you with  this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>>>>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director  Missouri Council of the
>>>>>>>> Blind
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>>>>>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>>>>>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>>>>>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>>>>>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>>>>>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the
>>>>>>>> Global Voice,  Chris and Don.
>>>>>>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
>>>>>>>> Pacific
>>>>>>>> Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>>>>>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
>>>>>>>> "Listen  to  Past Shows" link any time during the week after
>>>>>>>> each live broadcast.
>>>>>>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>>>>>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe  Jackie McBride
>>>>>>> Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
>>>>>>> https://brighter-vision.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ****************************************
>>>>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
>>>>>> Council  of the Blind in  your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me
>>>>>> as shown below and I can help you  with this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director  Missouri Council of the
>>>>>> Blind
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>>>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>>>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>>>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>>>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>>>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
>>>>>> Voice,  Chris and Don.
>>>>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
>>>>>> Pacific
>>>>>> Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>>>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
>>>>>> "Listen to  Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>>>>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>>>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ****************************************
>>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.
>>>>
>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind
>>>>
>>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>>
>>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
>>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> ****************************************
>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------
>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind
>>>
>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>
>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>













Re: Question about Web Browsing

Gene
 

If you do a google search for Amazon mobile site, you will see this as a very early result.
 
You can tell it's the correct link without even going to the site by looking at the excerpt of the page related to the link, that is below the link and the address in the results.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

That is just the regular URL.
Seems like there is some code one can put in their browser settings to always open the mobile version.
Basically, I think that this setting sends the message to the site that this is a mobile device.
Not sure how to do that though.
Otherwise, I don't know what other things to try, since that replacing WWW with an M does not work.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


I just went to Amazon.com on my phone, and this is the address it gave:
https://www.amazon.com

Chris


> On May 16, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@...> wrote:
>
> I just tried:
> https://m.amazon.com/
> and that does not work.
> I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile site.
> Glenn
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>
>
> This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.
>
> http://www.amazon.com/access
>
> Hope this helps,
>
> Chris
>
>
>> On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@...> wrote:
>>
>> Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.
>>
>> The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>> It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
>> I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
>> Also, sometimes I like the section called:
>> You might also like:
>> And
>> Other similar items
>> Neither of which are on the accessible page.
>> But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
>> It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
>> I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
>> Glenn
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>> I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?
>>
>> I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>> The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
>> I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
>> Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
>> And I like all the information from the regular page.
>> You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
>> But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
>> Glenn
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>> Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>
>> Is that m.amazon.com?  They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>> On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:
>>>
>>> You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
>>> Christopher Gray
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
>>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>
>>> With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>> On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
>>>> behaviour, though their use of frams and  carousel based suggestions
>>>> can be a little irritating at times!
>>>> Brian
>>>>
>>>> bglists@...
>>>> Sent via blueyonder.
>>>> Please address personal E-mail to:-
>>>> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
>>>> in the display name field.
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
>>>> <chris@...>
>>>> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Good deal, many thanks.
>>>>>
>>>>> Chris
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
>>>>>> control +  f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
>>>>>> chosen as your  NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@...> wrote:
>>>>>>> Hi:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question.  I come to NVDA
>>>>>>> with  just  over a  week of experience, and things have gone
>>>>>>> pretty well.  Before now, I  have  been a  Cobra users for many
>>>>>>> years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a  Window-Eyes user.
>>>>>>> Those are my points of reference.  I have reveiwed and then  read
>>>>>>> the  NVDA  User manual on the online Help system and found it
>>>>>>> pretty useful.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
>>>>>>> on  Amazon.com  thus far.  I am used to having a command in Cobra,
>>>>>>> ctrl+f, which was  an  internal  Find command, not an Internet
>>>>>>> Explorer command.  Is there an  equivalent in  NVDA  or some
>>>>>>> alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
>>>>>>> disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
>>>>>>> software  program itself??  Also, after I choose an item to
>>>>>>> examine or purchase  on  Amazon,  that part of the screen seems to
>>>>>>> go blank.  I don't know how to get  things  to  reset.
>>>>>>> Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
>>>>>>> solution  is to
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> start using Chrome, I could do that.  Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
>>>>>>> information  to  help me get started?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
>>>>>>> appreciated.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chris
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ****************************************
>>>>>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
>>>>>>> Council of  the Blind in  your Will or Estate Plan?
>>>>>>> Contact me as shown below and I can help  you with  this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>>>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director  Missouri Council of the
>>>>>>> Blind
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>>>>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>>>>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>>>>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>>>>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>>>>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
>>>>>>> Voice,  Chris and Don.
>>>>>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
>>>>>>> Pacific
>>>>>>> Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>>>>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
>>>>>>> "Listen  to  Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
>>>>>>> live broadcast.
>>>>>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>>>>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe  Jackie McBride
>>>>>> Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
>>>>>> https://brighter-vision.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ****************************************
>>>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
>>>>> Council  of the Blind in  your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as
>>>>> shown below and I can help you  with this.
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director  Missouri Council of the Blind
>>>>>
>>>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>>>
>>>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
>>>>> Voice,  Chris and Don.
>>>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
>>>>> Pacific
>>>>> Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
>>>>> to  Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>>>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> ****************************************
>>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------
>>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director
>>> Missouri Council of the Blind
>>>
>>> 5453 Chippewa
>>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>>
>>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
>>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ****************************************
>> Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.
>>
>> ----------------------------------------
>> Christopher Gray, Executive Director
>> Missouri Council of the Blind
>>
>> 5453 Chippewa
>> St. Louis, MO 63109
>> Phone:     (314) 832-7172
>> Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
>> Fax:       (314) 832-7796
>>
>> Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
>> Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
>> Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
>> Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
>> You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
>> Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>







Re: Question about Web Browsing

Jackie
 

Chris G, you don't say what browser you're using, unless I missed
something somewhere. Nor do you tell us which OS you're using, which
could also factor into this discussion.

On 5/16/18, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov> wrote:
Actually, I think most sighted folk would like a bit less stuff on some of
these sites.
I always jump by headings, or by buttons, or I look for edit fields.
Sometimes I search for a specific word, like when I open a product link in
eBay, I usually press the find command and type in:
Desc
And that takes me to the description.
I haven't tried it in a long time, but it seems like the M. works for eBay.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker,
Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:40 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

A part of me does think: Why would we promote using a separate site that
offers the same service, just because we have a disability? It has been a
while since I have used Amazon on a computer, since I always use the app on
my iPhone, but I will check into what it would look like, to perhaps even
tab past that carousel. As others have said, try other things like headings,
elements list with insert+f7, etc. If you know the key phrase or part of it,
use CTRL+NVDA+F, to bring up NVDA's find command. Type the part of the
phrase you know.

Having to go through developer tools and change how the browser sends the
version just for Amazon sounds really cumbersome. If I had to do that, I
would contact Amazon's customer service for guidance. I would either send a
complaint, or see what information they could offer. See what NVDA features
are available from NVDA's user guide that you may not have thought of, for
browsing the web.

Overall, there is no one size fits all solution. It really boils down to why
you are on Amazon, what you are shopping for, the information you need, and
if you need to see the related items that someone earlier mentioned that
says, "Items like this one," or whatever it said.

Good luck!

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Devin
Prater
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:09 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

This may take some digging around, but see if your browser allows the user
agent to be changed. You may have to enable developer mode.

On May 16, 2018, at 3:07 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov>
wrote:

That is just the regular URL.
Seems like there is some code one can put in their browser settings to
always open the mobile version.
Basically, I think that this setting sends the message to the site that
this is a mobile device.
Not sure how to do that though.
Otherwise, I don't know what other things to try, since that replacing WWW
with an M does not work.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


I just went to Amazon.com on my phone, and this is the address it gave:
https://www.amazon.com

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov>
wrote:

I just tried:
https://m.amazon.com/
and that does not work.
I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or
tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile
site.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going
back to the main site if that is what I want.

http://www.amazon.com/access

Hope this helps,

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E
<michael.e.walker3@boeing.com> wrote:

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being
able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am
someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain
information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page.
For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it
takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with
screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not
have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that
people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works
best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should
use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full
version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use
Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use
m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site,
and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews
and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a
new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I
opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it
from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack
your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the
mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did
encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon
did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation
shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that
does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie
will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible
page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not
be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the
top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of
my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site,
but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it
meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then
come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed
this behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based
suggestions can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:- briang1@blueyonder.co.uk,
putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then
read the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found
it pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing,
mostly on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command
in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen
without disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of
mode in the software program itself?? Also, after I choose an
item to examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the
screen seems to go blank. I don't know how to get things to
reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there
NVDA/Chrome-based information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very
much appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to
Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the
Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00
P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after
each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the
podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me
as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00
P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live
broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the
podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown
below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice,
Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown
below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice,
Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.











































--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe
Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


Re: Question about Web Browsing

Ervin, Glenn
 

Actually, I think most sighted folk would like a bit less stuff on some of these sites.
I always jump by headings, or by buttons, or I look for edit fields.
Sometimes I search for a specific word, like when I open a product link in eBay, I usually press the find command and type in:
Desc
And that takes me to the description.
I haven't tried it in a long time, but it seems like the M. works for eBay.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:40 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

A part of me does think: Why would we promote using a separate site that offers the same service, just because we have a disability? It has been a while since I have used Amazon on a computer, since I always use the app on my iPhone, but I will check into what it would look like, to perhaps even tab past that carousel. As others have said, try other things like headings, elements list with insert+f7, etc. If you know the key phrase or part of it, use CTRL+NVDA+F, to bring up NVDA's find command. Type the part of the phrase you know.

Having to go through developer tools and change how the browser sends the version just for Amazon sounds really cumbersome. If I had to do that, I would contact Amazon's customer service for guidance. I would either send a complaint, or see what information they could offer. See what NVDA features are available from NVDA's user guide that you may not have thought of, for browsing the web.

Overall, there is no one size fits all solution. It really boils down to why you are on Amazon, what you are shopping for, the information you need, and if you need to see the related items that someone earlier mentioned that says, "Items like this one," or whatever it said.

Good luck!

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:09 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

This may take some digging around, but see if your browser allows the user agent to be changed. You may have to enable developer mode.

On May 16, 2018, at 3:07 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov> wrote:

That is just the regular URL.
Seems like there is some code one can put in their browser settings to always open the mobile version.
Basically, I think that this setting sends the message to the site that this is a mobile device.
Not sure how to do that though.
Otherwise, I don't know what other things to try, since that replacing WWW with an M does not work.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


I just went to Amazon.com on my phone, and this is the address it gave:
https://www.amazon.com

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov> wrote:

I just tried:
https://m.amazon.com/
and that does not work.
I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile site.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.

http://www.amazon.com/access

Hope this helps,

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@boeing.com> wrote:

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed
this behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based
suggestions can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:- briang1@blueyonder.co.uk,
putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then
read the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found
it pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing,
mostly on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command
in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen
without disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of
mode in the software program itself?? Also, after I choose an
item to examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the
screen seems to go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there
NVDA/Chrome-based information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very
much appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to
Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the
Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after
each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me
as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.

































Re: Question about Web Browsing

Walker, Michael E
 

A part of me does think: Why would we promote using a separate site that offers the same service, just because we have a disability? It has been a while since I have used Amazon on a computer, since I always use the app on my iPhone, but I will check into what it would look like, to perhaps even tab past that carousel. As others have said, try other things like headings, elements list with insert+f7, etc. If you know the key phrase or part of it, use CTRL+NVDA+F, to bring up NVDA's find command. Type the part of the phrase you know.

Having to go through developer tools and change how the browser sends the version just for Amazon sounds really cumbersome. If I had to do that, I would contact Amazon's customer service for guidance. I would either send a complaint, or see what information they could offer. See what NVDA features are available from NVDA's user guide that you may not have thought of, for browsing the web.

Overall, there is no one size fits all solution. It really boils down to why you are on Amazon, what you are shopping for, the information you need, and if you need to see the related items that someone earlier mentioned that says, "Items like this one," or whatever it said.

Good luck!

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:09 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

This may take some digging around, but see if your browser allows the user agent to be changed. You may have to enable developer mode.

On May 16, 2018, at 3:07 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov> wrote:

That is just the regular URL.
Seems like there is some code one can put in their browser settings to always open the mobile version.
Basically, I think that this setting sends the message to the site that this is a mobile device.
Not sure how to do that though.
Otherwise, I don't know what other things to try, since that replacing WWW with an M does not work.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


I just went to Amazon.com on my phone, and this is the address it gave:
https://www.amazon.com

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov> wrote:

I just tried:
https://m.amazon.com/
and that does not work.
I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile site.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.

http://www.amazon.com/access

Hope this helps,

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@boeing.com> wrote:

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed
this behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based
suggestions can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:- briang1@blueyonder.co.uk,
putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then
read the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found
it pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing,
mostly on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command
in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen
without disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of
mode in the software program itself?? Also, after I choose an
item to examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the
screen seems to go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there
NVDA/Chrome-based information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very
much appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to
Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the
Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after
each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me
as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.

































Re: Question about Web Browsing

Devin Prater
 

This may take some digging around, but see if your browser allows the user agent to be changed. You may have to enable developer mode.

On May 16, 2018, at 3:07 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov> wrote:

That is just the regular URL.
Seems like there is some code one can put in their browser settings to always open the mobile version.
Basically, I think that this setting sends the message to the site that this is a mobile device.
Not sure how to do that though.
Otherwise, I don't know what other things to try, since that replacing WWW with an M does not work.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


I just went to Amazon.com on my phone, and this is the address it gave:
https://www.amazon.com

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov> wrote:

I just tried:
https://m.amazon.com/
and that does not work.
I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile site.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.

http://www.amazon.com/access

Hope this helps,

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@boeing.com> wrote:

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.

































Re: Question about Web Browsing

Ervin, Glenn
 

That is just the regular URL.
Seems like there is some code one can put in their browser settings to always open the mobile version.
Basically, I think that this setting sends the message to the site that this is a mobile device.
Not sure how to do that though.
Otherwise, I don't know what other things to try, since that replacing WWW with an M does not work.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


I just went to Amazon.com on my phone, and this is the address it gave:
https://www.amazon.com

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov> wrote:

I just tried:
https://m.amazon.com/
and that does not work.
I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile site.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.

http://www.amazon.com/access

Hope this helps,

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@boeing.com> wrote:

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





























Re: Question about Web Browsing

Chris Chaffin
 

I just went to Amazon.com on my phone, and this is the address it gave:
https://www.amazon.com

Chris

On May 16, 2018, at 3:44 PM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@nebraska.gov> wrote:

I just tried:
https://m.amazon.com/
and that does not work.
I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile site.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.

http://www.amazon.com/access

Hope this helps,

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@boeing.com> wrote:

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





























Re: Question about Web Browsing

Ervin, Glenn
 

I just tried:
https://m.amazon.com/
and that does not work.
I know there are other URLs for mobile sites, maybe someone on a phone or tablet can go to Amazon's site and send us the exact URL for the mobile site.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.

http://www.amazon.com/access

Hope this helps,

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@boeing.com> wrote:

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.

























Re: Question about Web Browsing

Christopher Gray
 

Very helpful, thank you.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Chris Chaffin wrote:


This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.

http://www.amazon.com/access

Hope this helps,

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@boeing.com> wrote:

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.

























****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in
your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.


Re: Question about Web Browsing

Ervin, Glenn
 

I hope nobody else has that sticky cookie problem that I had after visiting that access page.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.

http://www.amazon.com/access

Hope this helps,

Chris


On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@boeing.com> wrote:

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.

























Re: Question about Web Browsing

Ervin, Glenn
 

I do that too with FaceBook, that is, the m.FaceBook page.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 2:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.


Re: Question about Web Browsing

Chris Chaffin
 

This is the version of the Amazon site I use, and I have no problem going back to the main site if that is what I want.

http://www.amazon.com/access

Hope this helps,

Chris

On May 16, 2018, at 3:26 PM, Walker, Michael E <michael.e.walker3@boeing.com> wrote:

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.

























Re: Question about Web Browsing

Walker, Michael E
 

Glenn, thank you for submitting the complaint to Amazon about not being able to revert back to the main site, without deleting cookies. I am someone who does find it easier to let a new page load for certain information at certain times. At others, I like everything on one page. For me, it boils down to how busy the specific page is, and how long it takes me to find the information I need, even when I am browsing with screen reader heading commands, tables, by paragraph, etc. So, I do not have a single workflow. It is situational. My point, then, is that people should have the right to choose the browsing method that works best for them. If they prefer the stripped down interface, they should use that. However, when they are ready to revert back to the full version, they should have that right, too.

The workflow I described above is not unique to Amazon. When I use Facebook, it is another one where I usually just like to use m.facebook.com, unless there is something I cannot get from that site, and need the main site.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.


Re: Sound Forge 12.5

Christopher Gray
 

Jaws, as with Cobra, scripts come as part of the Jaws install. That is what several Jaws users have told me. Brian Hartgen's scripts are in addition.

Be all this as it may, Soundforge 12.5 is not working with NVDA and that, for me, is a huge issue. What is the process in NVDA to start discovering a solution for this?

Chris


On Wed, 16 May 2018, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:

Uh, I'm not meaning hear to be rude, but as a professional sound engineer, I
can say with absolute certainty, that unless there is functionality I'm not
seeing, which is unlikely, I use Soundforge almost daily with no scripts,
unless they come preinstalled with JAWS, and I'm able to do quite a lot. I
can edit, mix, master, etc. I've been able to ever since version 4.5 way
back in the days, which is when I first started using it.

Anyway, I mean this with all due respect, but, alas, I digress.

Chris.


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Christopher
Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

Yes, I am told that Jaws works well with the Version 12 series. Brian
Hartgen,
I believe, has a comprehensive set of Jaws scripts and tutorials. Cobra had
its
own scripts for Soundforge 9 and 10, but 12 is new and Baum had developed no

replacement before its current dormancy.

Soundforge has always required scripting and I sincerely doubt one can get
anywhere by contacting them about accessibility issues.

Chris


On Wed, 16 May
2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:

Does anyone know if jaws is OK with the new version. I was not aware that
nvda had been tested with any version since it went mega commercial.
I'm using Goldwave here, but obviously the program you are using has a
chequered career and has been written by lots of different folk over the
years, I'd not be surprised if accessibility is quite low on their radar.
We
would normally say, if you are a paying customer and it used to work
before,
that you should be able to have a word with them about changes like
this.
I think the general advice is to contact them, and then if they seem not
to
want to fix it, take either further action or see if anyone can write a
patch for nvda, but if the program costs money it can be difficult to find
somebody to do it.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray" <chris@moblind.org>
To: "NVDA Mailing List" <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 5:49 PM
Subject: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5


Hello:

As some will know, Magix now owns and updates Sound Forge. The most
recent release is 12.5.

This version is not working very well at all with NVDA. Even the
simplest of activities, highlighting a segment of audio and getting it
to
play back is not working for me. Also, my position in a sound file
tends
to jump around in ways I don't understand. Suddenly, I might find
myself
2-3 minutes into a file for no reason at all.

Anybody know of a fix for this?

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council
of the Blind in
your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you
with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice,
Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.







****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of
the Blind in
your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with
this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice,
Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.







****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in
your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.


Re: Question about Web Browsing

Ervin, Glenn
 

It is pretty slimmed down, with separate links for details and reviews and questions and answers.
I make use of all that information, and I don't like having to open a new page or window for that info.
Also, sometimes I like the section called:
You might also like:
And
Other similar items
Neither of which are on the accessible page.
But I had a hell of a time getting my browser to not open it after I opened it once until I went in and removed its cookie and removed it from history.
It just kept coming up, no matter what I typed in for the URL.
I complained to Amazon's use of this, and maybe it does not highjack your browser any more.
Glenn

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.


Re: Question about Web Browsing

Walker, Michael E
 

I thought I remembered the accessibility link being the same as the mobile site years ago. It must have changed. I know a lot of sites did encourage use of the mobile version for accessibility. It seemed Amazon did at one point. Does anyone know when that changed?

I certainly agree with using headings and other screen reader navigation shortcuts. Try the main site with screen reader proficiency. If that does not work, click on the accessibility link.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

The accessibility link is not the same as the mobile page.
I stopped using the accessible page, and if you go there once, a cookie will need to be manually removed if you ever want the regular page.
Basically, it is more work to get the wanted info from the accessible page, because they are separate links on the page.
And I like all the information from the regular page.
You just need to make use of jumping by headings and the like.
But if there is an actual mobile page, I might like that.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Just go to amazon.com and look for their accessibility link. It may not be labeled "accessibility", but with pressing CTRL+HOME to get to the top of the page and maybe some tabbing, you should find it. I do most of my shopping on my iPhone with Amazon's app.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

Is that m.amazon.com? They used to have a screenreader-optomized site, but I'm not seeing that link any longer.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Walker, Michael E wrote:

You could just use Amazon's mobile site, instead of the main one, if it meets your needs. That will get you around the fancy carousel stuff.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing

With the NVDA internal Find command, let me experiment further and then come back to the list.

Chris

On Wed, 16 May 2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
wrote:

Could you expand on the amazon issue. i cannot say I've noticed this
behaviour, though their use of frams and carousel based suggestions
can be a little irritating at times!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Question about Web Browsing


Good deal, many thanks.

Chris

On Tue, 15 May 2018, Jackie wrote:

Hello, Christopher. The command you're looking for is NVDA +
control + f. When I say "NVDA", I mean the modifier key you've
chosen as your NVDA key, ie, caps lock, numpad insert, etc. HTH.

On 5/15/18, Christopher Gray <chris@moblind.org> wrote:
Hi:

Please forgive a somewhat open-ended question. I come to NVDA
with just over a week of experience, and things have gone
pretty well. Before now, I have been a Cobra users for many
years, back to about 1994, and when necessary a Window-Eyes user.
Those are my points of reference. I have reveiwed and then read
the NVDA User manual on the online Help system and found it
pretty useful.

The area where I'm having some trouble is in web browsing, mostly
on Amazon.com thus far. I am used to having a command in Cobra,
ctrl+f, which was an internal Find command, not an Internet
Explorer command. Is there an equivalent in NVDA or some
alternative technique available to find things on a screen without
disturbing the screen itself or opening some sort of mode in the
software program itself?? Also, after I choose an item to
examine or purchase on Amazon, that part of the screen seems to
go blank. I don't know how to get things to reset.
Any NVDA advice on this would be most welcome.

I've seen some conversation here about Chrome and if my best
solution is to

start using Chrome, I could do that. Is there NVDA/Chrome-based
information to help me get started?

Any pointers to commands or an overall approach will be very much
appreciated.

Thank you.

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan?
Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the
Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the
"Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each
live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as
shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.






****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.


Re: Sound Forge 12.5

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

Uh, I'm not meaning hear to be rude, but as a professional sound engineer, I
can say with absolute certainty, that unless there is functionality I'm not
seeing, which is unlikely, I use Soundforge almost daily with no scripts,
unless they come preinstalled with JAWS, and I'm able to do quite a lot. I
can edit, mix, master, etc. I've been able to ever since version 4.5 way
back in the days, which is when I first started using it.

Anyway, I mean this with all due respect, but, alas, I digress.

Chris.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Christopher
Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

Yes, I am told that Jaws works well with the Version 12 series. Brian
Hartgen,
I believe, has a comprehensive set of Jaws scripts and tutorials. Cobra had
its
own scripts for Soundforge 9 and 10, but 12 is new and Baum had developed no

replacement before its current dormancy.

Soundforge has always required scripting and I sincerely doubt one can get
anywhere by contacting them about accessibility issues.

Chris


On Wed, 16 May
2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:

Does anyone know if jaws is OK with the new version. I was not aware that
nvda had been tested with any version since it went mega commercial.
I'm using Goldwave here, but obviously the program you are using has a
chequered career and has been written by lots of different folk over the
years, I'd not be surprised if accessibility is quite low on their radar.
We
would normally say, if you are a paying customer and it used to work
before,
that you should be able to have a word with them about changes like
this.
I think the general advice is to contact them, and then if they seem not
to
want to fix it, take either further action or see if anyone can write a
patch for nvda, but if the program costs money it can be difficult to find
somebody to do it.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray" <chris@moblind.org>
To: "NVDA Mailing List" <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 5:49 PM
Subject: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5


Hello:

As some will know, Magix now owns and updates Sound Forge. The most
recent release is 12.5.

This version is not working very well at all with NVDA. Even the
simplest of activities, highlighting a segment of audio and getting it
to
play back is not working for me. Also, my position in a sound file
tends
to jump around in ways I don't understand. Suddenly, I might find
myself
2-3 minutes into a file for no reason at all.

Anybody know of a fix for this?

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council
of the Blind in
your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you
with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice,
Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.







****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of
the Blind in
your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help you with
this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice,
Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.