Date   

Re: academics and employment

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

One thing that worries me about the way Microsoft are trying to develop narrator. The development is good, but they really do need to make it easier for third party readers to use what it uses. So often I hear, well Narrator can do it, but nothing else does. I suggest this is because Narrator has a lot more access to the innards of windows than a third party screenreader does, probably due to there being fewer security issues as its built in and can use hooking into things that would be a security risk if allowed outside.
I have tried recent Narrator, and although it is than it used to be, it seems often a bit clumsy and slow compared to nvda.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Walker, Michael E. (UMSL-Student)" <mewx8b@mail.umsl.edu>
To: <nvda@groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 1:30 AM
Subject: [nvda] academics and employment


Hello,

It is Mike who was talking to you all earlier about copy and paste. I am now on my personal e-mail.

I want to clarify what was said about the copy and paste system on the web needing to be perfected, for NVDA to be adequate for college and employment. Let us take a moment to think about what NVDA does for us, because of the hundreds if not thousands of man hours of development put into this. I pulled down the source from GitHub, after talking with Joseph Lee, to gain an appreciation of what goes into building this thing. It is incredible. I work for the Boeing Company. That is right. It is the same company that builds all the airplanes and Defense, Space, and security systems. I use NVDA as my primary screen reader in Git BASH, and Visual Studio Code. NVDA is what helped me build the Angular template for Boeing's frontend architecture reference implementation. I only ever turn on JAWS, if I am using something highly proprietary like Citrix.

Do I think NVDA could use some improvements that proprietary screen readers have? Absolutely, but we must also remember the imperfections of proprietary readers. NVDA is the best reader I have found that supports Notepad++ and SQL Server Management Studio where JAWS repeats the lines, when I down arrow. JAWS is also way more heavyweight, and crashes over the simplest things. I cannot remember the last time NVDA froze.

Overall, what we need is an attitude of gratitude. NVDA is plenty suited for education and employment, despite its imperfection and need for a bit of improvement. Let me close out by saying use Microsoft Narrator full-time for education and employment, or even Orca for Linux. They do not have half the shit NVDA does.

Thank you so much for taking the time to volunteer and develop NVDA. Keep up the great work! I will use NVDA until the day I die over JAWS.

Mighty Mike


Re: groups.io will be down for maintenance this evening, starting at 9PM Pacific Time (4AM Saturday 8/18 UTC), for about two hours.

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Oh I see, well they certainly seem to have the ability to tell folk stuff as every account I've ever used on their lists recently got the mail about the update to the privacy policies. Lets hope this is not them making changes that might affect accessibility.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 10:10 PM
Subject: [nvda] groups.io will be down for maintenance this evening, starting at 9PM Pacific Time (4AM Saturday 8/18 UTC), for about two hours.


The subject says it all, but I'll repeat it here in case it gets cut off by certain e-mail clients:

groups.io will be down for maintenance this evening, starting at 9PM Pacific Time (4AM Saturday 8/18 UTC), for about two hours.

There has been a banner message to this effect up all day on the web interface, but nothing has come across on traffic on the groups themselves, which leaves e-mail users in the dark.

You can still reply to messages, but all of it will be held in a queue during the maintenance period.
--

Brian *-* Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134

A little kindness from person to person is better than a vast love for all humankind.

~ Richard Dehmel


Re: Strange occasional issue in Windows 10 with programmes taking a long time to load -- maybe media players in particular?

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Do you think an anti virus is checking something and will not let things work until its happy? If you play a particular file does it always happen.
Another thought. Do you have Jaws on this system?
I notice that recent versions once again insert some kind of driver in the display chain, like in the old XP days. Ever since this happened my whole windows 7 machine boots up slower and can, on occasion seem to exhibit the symptoms you say. I did a reinstall of Jaws from an update yesterday and touch wood the issue has gone. It seems this driver is there whether you are running Jaws or not. I'm not a Jaws user myself but as has been said here, it often is a good idea to have several screenreaders.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "JM Casey" <crystallogic@ca.inter.net>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 9:17 PM
Subject: [nvda] Strange occasional issue in Windows 10 with programmes taking a long time to load -- maybe media players in particular?


Hey folks. I'm sorry, this isn't directly an NVDA issue, but the list
moderators are often quite relaxed about letting things drift off on
occasion, and I'm not currently signed up to any forums where I can ask
directly, so I wondered if there might be someone here who has had
experience with a similar issue.



I'm running Windows 10, 1803. I have the last version of winamp, 5.666, with
the patch designed for Windows 10.



Although I'm not certain these things are related, I feel like this actually
started with VLC. Some months back I downloaded the 64-bit version of VLC
3.0. I was immediately impressed with how fast it loaded. Only a few seconds
between hitting enter in file explorer and playing a video, and I thought
this was nice. However, seemingly a few weeks later, VlC was taking thirty
seconds or more to open. Recently they put out an update, which I installed,
and VlC was back to loading fast again.



Now though, and I'm not absolutely certain when this started, but it was
recent, Winamp, which I still use for audio playback, is taking a really
long time to load! Much longer than VLC did, even when it was having its
weird issue. I estimate that whether I hit enter on a file in explorer, or
use the context menu to play a folder, or use the run box to open the
programme directly, it takes about two minutes for the window to appear
and/or audio to start playing. Weirdly, once or twice it seems like the
audio starts playing, but ther'es no window for several minutes, and during
that time of coruse none of the Winamp controls work.

Any thoughts or suggestions as to what might be causing it? I have a feeling
reinstalling might fix the issue, but I'd still like to know what might have
caused this to happen.







Actually, I'm not even certain how related these things are, but




Re: NVDA Just Stopped reading my google sheet

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

When you say nothing has changed are you sure of this, ie no updates to anything in the background like an anti virus program?
I do not use Google tools so cannot say what might have happened, but I've had some very unlikely interactions in the past, so I just wondered if there was any way to tell. I think I'd have taken the machine back a day or so first to see if that fixed it.
Having said all of that I still have not found out why, one day some months ago, nvda stopped reading dropbox preferences, internal log in browser and share panel.
Sometimes windows does things that defy logic.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Martin O'Sullivan" <osumartin@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 7:12 PM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA Just Stopped reading my google sheet


Nothing has changed on my end one second NVDA was reading the sheet fine,
then it just stopped. Now it will not read the sells.

It still reads the menu, but not the contents of the sells.

Here is what NVDA Says when I open the sheet.

Start of NVDA Output

Copy of Gmail Scheduler by ctrlq.org - Google Sheets - Google Chrome icon
2 of 6
Copy of Gmail Scheduler by ctrlq.org - Google Sheets - Google Chrome icon
2 of 6
Copy of Gmail Scheduler by ctrlq.org - Google Sheets - Google Chrome row
1 column 1
Copy of Gmail Scheduler by ctrlq.org - Google Sheets
application
E3 combo box multi line editable
n

Copy of Gmail Scheduler by ctrlq.org - Google Sheets
application
application
Working...

You are online
You are online
To enable screen reader support, press Ctrl+Alt+Z To learn about keyboard
shortcuts, press Ctrl+slash
Screen reader support enabled.
Working...

Copy of Gmail Scheduler by ctrlq.org - Google Sheets - Google Chrome icon
2 of 6
Copy of Gmail Scheduler by ctrlq.org - Google Sheets - Google Chrome icon
2 of 6

End of NVDA Output

I have done the following to try and resolve the problem.

1 restarted NVDA, no effect.
2 Restarted Chrome No Effect
3 using Firefox no effect
4 Restarted the computer No effect
5 Removed and Reinstalled NVDA No effect
6 Run NVDA from a USB Stick No effect

I need this to work what can I do.

--
Martin O'Sullivan
‎"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the
poor have no food, they call me a communist." Hélder Câmara

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Re: academics and employment

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

I'll just say one more thing. Yes, I believe employers should give NVDA a
chance. I remember telling a rehabilitation counselor one time that if he
and other counselors would encourage their clients to use NVDA, they would
save lots of money. Then the money they save could be used for things like
microsoft word or things needed to do a job more efficiently.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris
Shook
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 7:59 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] academics and employment

I'll just say this.
I do not understand why an employer would care what screen reader you use.
So long as it doesn't interfere with their system, it should be the blind
person's choice which screen reader to use.
I have JAWS installed, but rarely use it because NVDA serves my purposes
just fine.
Not to mention, I love how NVDA let's you know when you have a spelling
error while typing. JAWS will not do that. It will only tell you which word
is misspelled if you read word by word.
What I'm trying to say is I wish employers would give it a chance before
making a judgment.
Chris


Re: volume problem

Jackie
 

Darren, try going to 'start > run' & type sndvol, then press enter.
You can check/adjust the volume levels for your running apps.

On 8/17/18, Darren Tomblin <dtomblin@hotmail.com> wrote:
hi, i'm having a problem with the volume with winamp and firefox. i'm
not getting any sound out of thesms but nvda is working properly. I
checked and they don't seem

--
73,
Daro be muted. ren Tomblin(KC9JJJ)




--
Remember! Friends Help Friends Be Cybersafe
Jackie McBride
Helping Cybercrime Victims 1 Person at a Time
https://brighter-vision.com


Re: academics and employment

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Hi, Chris,

Yes, it appears from what I read that Gene prefers Jaws over NVDA. We all
have the right to our own opinions. We should be able to agree to disagree.
After all, that's what life is all about--differing viewpoints. I used Jaws
for years and both Jaws and NVDA are great programs. NVDA serves my needs
very well.

Rosemarie

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris
Shook
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 8:12 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] academics and employment

THis really has nothing to do with the current conversation, but I have to
ask.
Since when did human society degrade to such a point that people cannot have
different viewpoints on issues.
I happen to agree with Michael that I do like NVDA better than JAWS.
THat is not to say JAWS is a bad product. I just prefer NVDA over JAWS.
Jean, it appears that you prefer JAWS over NVDA. That's cool to. Can't we
just agree to disagree?"


volume problem

Darren Tomblin
 

hi, i'm having a problem with the volume with winamp and firefox. i'm
not getting any sound out of thesms but nvda is working properly. I
checked and they don't seem

--
73,
Daro be muted. ren Tomblin(KC9JJJ)


Re: academics and employment

Chris Shook <chris0309@...>
 

THis really has nothing to do with the current conversation, but I have to ask.
Since when did human society degrade to such a point that people cannot have different viewpoints on issues.
I happen to agree with Michael that I do like NVDA better than JAWS. THat is not to say JAWS is a bad product. I just prefer NVDA over JAWS.
Jean, it appears that you prefer JAWS over NVDA. That's cool to. Can't we just agree to disagree?"


Re: academics and employment

Mike
 

Gene, firstly, I did not mean anything malicious toward the group or you. Secondly, my entire sentence about crashing was taken out of context. I did not mean to imply that JAWS crashed the first time I used it. I do not generalize on every system…

 

You are right! I am not saying you are wrong about JAWS, OK? JAWS lets you create custom labels and other things NVDA does not. I also agree with you on using JAWS on a VPN. I am not against you or the group on anything! Calm down! Yes, JAWS will let you create frames. Yes, JAWS will let you create graphics labels and other stuff.

 

This was nothing intended for the group to get upset about. I definitely didn’t mean anything in a bad way.

 

Best,

Mike

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 9:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] academics and employment

 

I am not convinced that this discription of JAWS crashing all the time is accurate as a generalization.  It is one person's experience on how many computers, one, more than one?  You can't ever generalize performance from the report of one person.  If the report is based on JAWS being used on perhaps three or four different computers then, while still not generalizable, it has a bit of a very small sample.  But I don't believe in trying to build up NVDA's reputation  by circulating messages that criticize JAWS in this way.  I have no objection to the message being sent to the list as part of a discussion.  I object to advocating that it be widely circulated.

 

And those who do believe in this strategy might consider that those who want to build up JAWS or another product can find things in NVDA to criticize. 

 

Let's consider a few important shortcomings that are especially important in employment situations.

 

You can't change how structures are interpreted in NVDA, such as telling it to read something as a list when it isn't to see if it can work with that imposed structure better.  You can't create frames.  I once set up JAWS for someone using a VPN to read the exact lines on the screen necessary to log in.  I may have done other things as well to have JAWS read specific parts of the screen automatically or by issuing a command so the person could use the program she needed with proper control and without very excessive verbiage.  You can't do that with NVDA. Someone has to write a script.  Research It was discussed, when it came out, as being able to be tailored to do something like read a proprietary data base used at a job. 

 

Loyalty to NVDA is not productive if it stifles proper critiques of what needs improvement.  No one is served.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 8:27 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] academics and employment

 

Great endorsement!  I love this one!  Everyone please pass this message along!

 

 

Roger

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 8/17/2018 7:30 PM, Walker, Michael E. (UMSL-Student) wrote:

Hello,

 

It is Mike who was talking to you all earlier about copy and paste. I am now on my personal e-mail.

 

I want to clarify what was said about the copy and paste system on the web needing to be perfected, for NVDA to be adequate for college and employment. Let us take a moment to think about what NVDA does for us, because of the hundreds if not thousands of man hours of development put into this. I pulled down the source from GitHub, after talking with Joseph Lee, to gain an appreciation of what goes into building this thing. It is incredible. I work for the Boeing Company. That is right. It is the same company that builds all the airplanes and Defense, Space, and security systems. I use NVDA as my primary screen reader in Git BASH, and Visual Studio Code. NVDA is what helped me build the Angular template for Boeing’s frontend architecture reference implementation. I only ever turn on JAWS, if I am using something highly proprietary like Citrix.

 

Do I think NVDA could use some improvements that proprietary screen readers have? Absolutely, but we must also remember the imperfections of proprietary readers. NVDA is the best reader I have found that supports Notepad++ and SQL Server Management Studio where JAWS repeats the lines, when I down arrow. JAWS is also way more heavyweight, and crashes over the simplest things. I cannot remember the last time NVDA froze.

 

Overall, what we need is an attitude of gratitude. NVDA is plenty suited for education and employment, despite its imperfection and need for a bit of improvement. Let me close out by saying use Microsoft Narrator full-time for education and employment, or even Orca for Linux. They do not have half the shit NVDA does.

 

Thank you so much for taking the time to volunteer and develop NVDA. Keep up the great work! I will use NVDA until the day I die over JAWS.

 

Mighty Mike

 


Re: academics and employment

Chris Shook <chris0309@...>
 

I'll just say this.
I do not understand why an employer would care what screen reader you use. So long as it doesn't interfere with their system, it should be the blind person's choice which screen reader to use.
I have JAWS installed, but rarely use it because NVDA serves my purposes just fine.
Not to mention, I love how NVDA let's you know when you have a spelling error while typing. JAWS will not do that. It will only tell you which word is misspelled if you read word by word.
What I'm trying to say is I wish employers would give it a chance before making a judgment.
Chris


Re: academics and employment

Gene
 

I am not convinced that this discription of JAWS crashing all the time is accurate as a generalization.  It is one person's experience on how many computers, one, more than one?  You can't ever generalize performance from the report of one person.  If the report is based on JAWS being used on perhaps three or four different computers then, while still not generalizable, it has a bit of a very small sample.  But I don't believe in trying to build up NVDA's reputation  by circulating messages that criticize JAWS in this way.  I have no objection to the message being sent to the list as part of a discussion.  I object to advocating that it be widely circulated.
 
And those who do believe in this strategy might consider that those who want to build up JAWS or another product can find things in NVDA to criticize. 
 
Let's consider a few important shortcomings that are especially important in employment situations.
 
You can't change how structures are interpreted in NVDA, such as telling it to read something as a list when it isn't to see if it can work with that imposed structure better.  You can't create frames.  I once set up JAWS for someone using a VPN to read the exact lines on the screen necessary to log in.  I may have done other things as well to have JAWS read specific parts of the screen automatically or by issuing a command so the person could use the program she needed with proper control and without very excessive verbiage.  You can't do that with NVDA. Someone has to write a script.  Research It was discussed, when it came out, as being able to be tailored to do something like read a proprietary data base used at a job. 
 
Loyalty to NVDA is not productive if it stifles proper critiques of what needs improvement.  No one is served.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 8:27 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] academics and employment

Great endorsement!  I love this one!  Everyone please pass this message along!


Roger








On 8/17/2018 7:30 PM, Walker, Michael E. (UMSL-Student) wrote:

Hello,

 

It is Mike who was talking to you all earlier about copy and paste. I am now on my personal e-mail.

 

I want to clarify what was said about the copy and paste system on the web needing to be perfected, for NVDA to be adequate for college and employment. Let us take a moment to think about what NVDA does for us, because of the hundreds if not thousands of man hours of development put into this. I pulled down the source from GitHub, after talking with Joseph Lee, to gain an appreciation of what goes into building this thing. It is incredible. I work for the Boeing Company. That is right. It is the same company that builds all the airplanes and Defense, Space, and security systems. I use NVDA as my primary screen reader in Git BASH, and Visual Studio Code. NVDA is what helped me build the Angular template for Boeing’s frontend architecture reference implementation. I only ever turn on JAWS, if I am using something highly proprietary like Citrix.

 

Do I think NVDA could use some improvements that proprietary screen readers have? Absolutely, but we must also remember the imperfections of proprietary readers. NVDA is the best reader I have found that supports Notepad++ and SQL Server Management Studio where JAWS repeats the lines, when I down arrow. JAWS is also way more heavyweight, and crashes over the simplest things. I cannot remember the last time NVDA froze.

 

Overall, what we need is an attitude of gratitude. NVDA is plenty suited for education and employment, despite its imperfection and need for a bit of improvement. Let me close out by saying use Microsoft Narrator full-time for education and employment, or even Orca for Linux. They do not have half the shit NVDA does.

 

Thank you so much for taking the time to volunteer and develop NVDA. Keep up the great work! I will use NVDA until the day I die over JAWS.

 

Mighty Mike



Re: academics and employment

Mike
 

Ok. I didn’t mean gratitude in the sense that we must never speak our minds. I meant appreciate what has been done, while continuing to speak up about improvement. There is a balance between both, as we cannot change everything overnight. I definitely didn’t mean this in a bad way though, and understand where you’re coming from.

 

Where has JAWS succeeded in employment that NVDA didn’t?

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 9:34 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] academics and employment

 

But if people are so concerned with gratitude that they don't speak their mind about what needs improvement, no one is being served.  JAWS is still better in a lot of employment situations and a few years ago, even one or two of the main developers said this.  Since then, NVDA has become more capable in employment situations but it still has serious drawbacks in a lot of cases. 

 

I can appreciate NVDA and the work that went into it but that has nothing to do with whether I or others should speak freely about what needs improvement. 

 

Historically, blind people have been expected to be grateful.  I appreciate things but I don't like the word grateful  It smaks of the days of rampant paternalism when blind people were expected to be little better than charity cases.  As I said, I can appreciate something like NVDA but grateful is a different word with different and very unfavorable connotations for what it means to be a blind person in modern times. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 7:30 PM

Subject: [nvda] academics and employment

 

Hello,

 

It is Mike who was talking to you all earlier about copy and paste. I am now on my personal e-mail.

 

I want to clarify what was said about the copy and paste system on the web needing to be perfected, for NVDA to be adequate for college and employment. Let us take a moment to think about what NVDA does for us, because of the hundreds if not thousands of man hours of development put into this. I pulled down the source from GitHub, after talking with Joseph Lee, to gain an appreciation of what goes into building this thing. It is incredible. I work for the Boeing Company. That is right. It is the same company that builds all the airplanes and Defense, Space, and security systems. I use NVDA as my primary screen reader in Git BASH, and Visual Studio Code. NVDA is what helped me build the Angular template for Boeing’s frontend architecture reference implementation. I only ever turn on JAWS, if I am using something highly proprietary like Citrix.

 

Do I think NVDA could use some improvements that proprietary screen readers have? Absolutely, but we must also remember the imperfections of proprietary readers. NVDA is the best reader I have found that supports Notepad++ and SQL Server Management Studio where JAWS repeats the lines, when I down arrow. JAWS is also way more heavyweight, and crashes over the simplest things. I cannot remember the last time NVDA froze.

 

Overall, what we need is an attitude of gratitude. NVDA is plenty suited for education and employment, despite its imperfection and need for a bit of improvement. Let me close out by saying use Microsoft Narrator full-time for education and employment, or even Orca for Linux. They do not have half the shit NVDA does.

 

Thank you so much for taking the time to volunteer and develop NVDA. Keep up the great work! I will use NVDA until the day I die over JAWS.

 

Mighty Mike


Re: academics and employment

Gene
 

But if people are so concerned with gratitude that they don't speak their mind about what needs improvement, no one is being served.  JAWS is still better in a lot of employment situations and a few years ago, even one or two of the main developers said this.  Since then, NVDA has become more capable in employment situations but it still has serious drawbacks in a lot of cases. 
 
I can appreciate NVDA and the work that went into it but that has nothing to do with whether I or others should speak freely about what needs improvement. 
 
Historically, blind people have been expected to be grateful.  I appreciate things but I don't like the word grateful  It smaks of the days of rampant paternalism when blind people were expected to be little better than charity cases.  As I said, I can appreciate something like NVDA but grateful is a different word with different and very unfavorable connotations for what it means to be a blind person in modern times. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 7:30 PM
Subject: [nvda] academics and employment

Hello,

 

It is Mike who was talking to you all earlier about copy and paste. I am now on my personal e-mail.

 

I want to clarify what was said about the copy and paste system on the web needing to be perfected, for NVDA to be adequate for college and employment. Let us take a moment to think about what NVDA does for us, because of the hundreds if not thousands of man hours of development put into this. I pulled down the source from GitHub, after talking with Joseph Lee, to gain an appreciation of what goes into building this thing. It is incredible. I work for the Boeing Company. That is right. It is the same company that builds all the airplanes and Defense, Space, and security systems. I use NVDA as my primary screen reader in Git BASH, and Visual Studio Code. NVDA is what helped me build the Angular template for Boeing’s frontend architecture reference implementation. I only ever turn on JAWS, if I am using something highly proprietary like Citrix.

 

Do I think NVDA could use some improvements that proprietary screen readers have? Absolutely, but we must also remember the imperfections of proprietary readers. NVDA is the best reader I have found that supports Notepad++ and SQL Server Management Studio where JAWS repeats the lines, when I down arrow. JAWS is also way more heavyweight, and crashes over the simplest things. I cannot remember the last time NVDA froze.

 

Overall, what we need is an attitude of gratitude. NVDA is plenty suited for education and employment, despite its imperfection and need for a bit of improvement. Let me close out by saying use Microsoft Narrator full-time for education and employment, or even Orca for Linux. They do not have half the shit NVDA does.

 

Thank you so much for taking the time to volunteer and develop NVDA. Keep up the great work! I will use NVDA until the day I die over JAWS.

 

Mighty Mike


Re: academics and employment

Roger Stewart
 

Great endorsement!  I love this one!  Everyone please pass this message along!


Roger








On 8/17/2018 7:30 PM, Walker, Michael E. (UMSL-Student) wrote:

Hello,

 

It is Mike who was talking to you all earlier about copy and paste. I am now on my personal e-mail.

 

I want to clarify what was said about the copy and paste system on the web needing to be perfected, for NVDA to be adequate for college and employment. Let us take a moment to think about what NVDA does for us, because of the hundreds if not thousands of man hours of development put into this. I pulled down the source from GitHub, after talking with Joseph Lee, to gain an appreciation of what goes into building this thing. It is incredible. I work for the Boeing Company. That is right. It is the same company that builds all the airplanes and Defense, Space, and security systems. I use NVDA as my primary screen reader in Git BASH, and Visual Studio Code. NVDA is what helped me build the Angular template for Boeing’s frontend architecture reference implementation. I only ever turn on JAWS, if I am using something highly proprietary like Citrix.

 

Do I think NVDA could use some improvements that proprietary screen readers have? Absolutely, but we must also remember the imperfections of proprietary readers. NVDA is the best reader I have found that supports Notepad++ and SQL Server Management Studio where JAWS repeats the lines, when I down arrow. JAWS is also way more heavyweight, and crashes over the simplest things. I cannot remember the last time NVDA froze.

 

Overall, what we need is an attitude of gratitude. NVDA is plenty suited for education and employment, despite its imperfection and need for a bit of improvement. Let me close out by saying use Microsoft Narrator full-time for education and employment, or even Orca for Linux. They do not have half the shit NVDA does.

 

Thank you so much for taking the time to volunteer and develop NVDA. Keep up the great work! I will use NVDA until the day I die over JAWS.

 

Mighty Mike



Re: Review position not following system cursor in terminal applications

Mike
 

Jason, Tyler Spivey would definitely know. I have known him for years. He is one of the smartest developers I know. I remember him from when I was in high school and he went by TSP on networks. I went by foxwarrior09, as my school was called Fox, and the sports team was the Warriors.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jason White via Groups.Io
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 7:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Review position not following system cursor in terminal applications

Thanks - I wasn't aware of that option. Restarting NVDA seemed to fix it in Windows Subsystem for Linux, but not in the msysv2 console.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tyler Spivey
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 7:30 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Review position not following system cursor in terminal applications

Is Caret moves review cursor (NVDA+6) on?
On 8/17/2018 4:23 PM, Jason White via Groups.Io wrote:
The problem isn't confined to Windows Subsystem for Linux; I noticed
it under msysv2 as well.

 

*From:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> *On Behalf Of
*Walker, Michael E
*Sent:* Friday, August 17, 2018 4:20 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Review position not following system cursor in
terminal applications

 

Jason,

 

Do you absolutely need the Windows subsystem for Linux to accomplish
your goals? Can you accomplish what you need through PowerShell, the
Cygwin terminal, MSYS, or Git BASH?

 

Best regards,

Mike

 

*From:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
[mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of *Jason White via Groups.Io
*Sent:* Friday, August 17, 2018 3:16 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* [nvda] Review position not following system cursor in
terminal applications

 

I've been trying to use NVDA 2018.2.1 in terminal applications such as
the Windows Subsystem for Linux. The BrailleExtender add-on is loaded,
and highly desirable. It's configured by default to ensure that the
braille display tracks the review position in terminal applications.

 

Unfortunately, the review position isn't following the system cursor.
Thus, for example, if I issue a command that generates several lines
on the terminal, and the cursor moves to the  new prompt that
immediately follows this output, the review position isn't moved
forward
with it.

 

All of the NVDA preferences related to navigation seem to be set
correctly as far as I can tell (I haven't changed them from the
defaults, as it's a new installation on an up to date Windows 10
version
1803 system).

 

Have I neglected to change a setting, or is there a deeper problem here?
Suggestions about likely causes and solutions would be most welcome.

 


academics and employment

Mike
 

Hello,

 

It is Mike who was talking to you all earlier about copy and paste. I am now on my personal e-mail.

 

I want to clarify what was said about the copy and paste system on the web needing to be perfected, for NVDA to be adequate for college and employment. Let us take a moment to think about what NVDA does for us, because of the hundreds if not thousands of man hours of development put into this. I pulled down the source from GitHub, after talking with Joseph Lee, to gain an appreciation of what goes into building this thing. It is incredible. I work for the Boeing Company. That is right. It is the same company that builds all the airplanes and Defense, Space, and security systems. I use NVDA as my primary screen reader in Git BASH, and Visual Studio Code. NVDA is what helped me build the Angular template for Boeing’s frontend architecture reference implementation. I only ever turn on JAWS, if I am using something highly proprietary like Citrix.

 

Do I think NVDA could use some improvements that proprietary screen readers have? Absolutely, but we must also remember the imperfections of proprietary readers. NVDA is the best reader I have found that supports Notepad++ and SQL Server Management Studio where JAWS repeats the lines, when I down arrow. JAWS is also way more heavyweight, and crashes over the simplest things. I cannot remember the last time NVDA froze.

 

Overall, what we need is an attitude of gratitude. NVDA is plenty suited for education and employment, despite its imperfection and need for a bit of improvement. Let me close out by saying use Microsoft Narrator full-time for education and employment, or even Orca for Linux. They do not have half the shit NVDA does.

 

Thank you so much for taking the time to volunteer and develop NVDA. Keep up the great work! I will use NVDA until the day I die over JAWS.

 

Mighty Mike


Re: Review position not following system cursor in terminal applications

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

The only time my NVDA cursor doesn't follow the system cursor when using either the command line in windows, or the cygwin environment is when I'm in screen review mode. As long as I'm in object navigation mode, it always follows the system cursor.

On Fri, 17 Aug 2018, Jason White via Groups.Io wrote:

The problem isn’t confined to Windows Subsystem for Linux; I noticed it
under msysv2 as well.
 


Re: Review position not following system cursor in terminal applications

Jason White
 

Thanks - I wasn't aware of that option. Restarting NVDA seemed to fix it in
Windows Subsystem for Linux, but not in the msysv2 console.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tyler Spivey
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 7:30 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Review position not following system cursor in terminal
applications

Is Caret moves review cursor (NVDA+6) on?
On 8/17/2018 4:23 PM, Jason White via Groups.Io wrote:
The problem isn’t confined to Windows Subsystem for Linux; I noticed
it under msysv2 as well.

 

*From:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> *On Behalf Of
*Walker, Michael E
*Sent:* Friday, August 17, 2018 4:20 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Review position not following system cursor in
terminal applications

 

Jason,

 

Do you absolutely need the Windows subsystem for Linux to accomplish
your goals? Can you accomplish what you need through PowerShell, the
Cygwin terminal, MSYS, or Git BASH?

 

Best regards,

Mike

 

*From:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
[mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of *Jason White via Groups.Io
*Sent:* Friday, August 17, 2018 3:16 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* [nvda] Review position not following system cursor in
terminal applications

 

I’ve been trying to use NVDA 2018.2.1 in terminal applications such as
the Windows Subsystem for Linux. The BrailleExtender add-on is loaded,
and highly desirable. It’s configured by default to ensure that the
braille display tracks the review position in terminal applications.

 

Unfortunately, the review position isn’t following the system cursor.
Thus, for example, if I issue a command that generates several lines
on the terminal, and the cursor moves to the  new prompt that
immediately follows this output, the review position isn’t moved forward
with it.

 

All of the NVDA preferences related to navigation seem to be set
correctly as far as I can tell (I haven’t changed them from the
defaults, as it’s a new installation on an up to date Windows 10
version
1803 system).

 

Have I neglected to change a setting, or is there a deeper problem here?
Suggestions about likely causes and solutions would be most welcome.

 


Re: Review position not following system cursor in terminal applications

Tyler Spivey
 

Is Caret moves review cursor (NVDA+6) on?

On 8/17/2018 4:23 PM, Jason White via Groups.Io wrote:
The problem isn’t confined to Windows Subsystem for Linux; I noticed it
under msysv2 as well.

 

*From:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> *On Behalf Of *Walker,
Michael E
*Sent:* Friday, August 17, 2018 4:20 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Review position not following system cursor in
terminal applications

 

Jason,

 

Do you absolutely need the Windows subsystem for Linux to accomplish
your goals? Can you accomplish what you need through PowerShell, the
Cygwin terminal, MSYS, or Git BASH?

 

Best regards,

Mike

 

*From:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
[mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of *Jason White via Groups.Io
*Sent:* Friday, August 17, 2018 3:16 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* [nvda] Review position not following system cursor in
terminal applications

 

I’ve been trying to use NVDA 2018.2.1 in terminal applications such as
the Windows Subsystem for Linux. The BrailleExtender add-on is loaded,
and highly desirable. It’s configured by default to ensure that the
braille display tracks the review position in terminal applications.

 

Unfortunately, the review position isn’t following the system cursor.
Thus, for example, if I issue a command that generates several lines on
the terminal, and the cursor moves to the  new prompt that immediately
follows this output, the review position isn’t moved forward with it.

 

All of the NVDA preferences related to navigation seem to be set
correctly as far as I can tell (I haven’t changed them from the
defaults, as it’s a new installation on an up to date Windows 10 version
1803 system).

 

Have I neglected to change a setting, or is there a deeper problem here?
Suggestions about likely causes and solutions would be most welcome.