Date   

Re: Favourite add-ons

 

Hi,
Correction: Joseph Lee, not Doug Lee.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Rui Fontes
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 5:09 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

Hello!

1 - I agree that a screen reader should not modify the user interface given by the system where it is running;

2 - That should not interfere with the possibility of screen readers make available a alternative user interface, when it is usefull.

3 - Systray list addon was created by me, with the help of Rui Batista, and later modified by Doug Lee.

4 - Why I decided to create it?
4.1 - Most new NVDA users, at least in 2013 in Portugal and Brazil, were old Jaws users and so they were used to it;
4.2 - Sometimes, when you arrow through Systray, after making Windows+B, and you get to the Network icon, the system shows a popup, Network flyout or something like that, and make unusable the systray that way...;

5 - So, for me, the ideological reason is not valid, since the screen reader is not changing the user interface, but only giving anorther way to do the same...

6 - Regarding the announcement of copy, cut and paste, here I can understand the ideological reason, since the operating system do not announce it in some cases...

6.1 - The system never announces the fact of something being copied to the clipboard;
6.2 - When something is cutted, a visual information is given, since the text or file is gone, and NVDA not always give that information to us;
6.3 - When something is pasted, again, some visual information is given, but not always NVDA announce it...

7 - So, for me, the ideological reason only will be valid when NVDA give us the same information given visually.

8 - Untill that, I will defend the announcement of copy, cut and paste, making all efforts to gave a correct information, but when it will not be possible to be sure the operation was performed, giving us the information not confirmed...

Regards,

Rui Fontes
NVDA portuguese team



Às 11:14 de 22/08/2018, Gene escreveu:
Here is a correction to my last message.
I said that one reason that copy, cut and paste aren't announced is
the ideological one I discussed. That may be incorrect. I read two
discussions of this when users requested the feature that are
available on Ghithub. I didn't see the ideological reason given.
Instead, the mistaken belief was expressed that it can't be known
reliably except in certain cases, when copying, pasting, and cutting
occur. this is factually incorrect yet it was believed by the
developers for most of the years NVDA has been under development. I
don't know what the developers believe now.
The argument was that NVDA would have to be programmed to announce
copy, paste, and cut when the commands were given without any
knowledge of whether the actions were actually taken. So the
screen-reader would give false information if something prevented the
operations from occurring.
As the developer of the add on has demonstrated and as I did in my
tests, this belief is incorrect and I strongly believe that since the
belief has been disproven, that the feature should either be placed in
code or that the add on be distributed and active as part of the
installation. I don't care which solution would be adopted.
Gene
----- original Message -----
*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@ripco.com>
*Sent:* Wednesday, August 22, 2018 4:49 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

This message is rather long. I hope you find it interesting and
provocative of thought.
Rarely, one of the icons doesn't work as expect in the system tray. I
don't remember what now, but I couldn't do something in the system
tray I should have been able to do but I could in the system tray dialog.
Aside from that, while it wouldn't be a major problem or inconvenience
to accustom myself to the system tray interface for regular use, why
should I have to? The dialog has been standard in screen-readers
since Windows 98. Why wasn't it included in NVDA? As far as I know,
this was for ideological reasons, and ideology defeated common sense
and a reasonable accomodation to something that had been available for
so long that it is now the standard.
the reason there was a separate system tray dialog in the first place
is that the system tray wasn't accessible in Windows 98. And when the
system tray dialog was instituted, a lot of people were still using
Windows 95, where the system tray was also inaccessible. So the
dialog started as a way to use an inaccessible feature, not as a redundancy.
The ideological principle is that screen-readers should never unless
really necessary, present anything that isn't presented to the sighted
user in a different format or manner or present any additional information.
While I generally agree with this approach, ideology, strictly adhered
to to the point of absurdity, always fails to deal with reality or
common sense.
New users to NVDA should not have to wait until they, maybe, learn
about add ons to have a feature that has been standard in
screen-readers for twenty years.
And it was partly the same ideological rigidity that caused the copy
and paste announcements not to be heard in NVDA and I object for the
same reasons. At least make the add ons part of the installation if
they aren't added to the code. Window-eyes for years, had add ons as
part of the installation of the program. This is nothing radical.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Clare Page <mailto:clare.page@wanadoo.fr>
*Sent:* Wednesday, August 22, 2018 4:17 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

Hi!

I find the Clipspeak add-on very useful, because without it there is
no announcement of when copying and cutting and pasting has been done;

As for the system tray add-on, I hope you don’t mind me asking, but
why do you need this add-on, and consider it as essential, when the
system tray is perfectly usable without it? I’m not criticizing, just
curious as to why you consider it a necessary add-on and think it
should be part of NVDA, when NVDA can easily read the system tray on its own?

Bye for now!

From Clare

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of
*Gene
*Sent:* mardi 21 août 2018 16:04
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

I don't use many add ons because the way I use my computer, I don't
benefit from most of them. But the two I use regularly and I consider
important enough that they shouldn't be add ons is Clip Speak, which
announces copy and past when you copy to and past from the clipboard,
and the system tray dialog add on. The system tray dialog has been a
standard part of screen-readers since Windows 2008. It should be
included in NVDA itself but it isn't.

As for Clipp Speak, I don't know if there is a new version that solves
these problems. the original version caused some problems in Word and
it caused a problem in the Youtube downloader I use even though I
wasn't directly using the add on. So, if you see strange problems you
didn't have before, even if they seem unrelated to anything you would
expect the add on to cause, try disabling them and see if the problem disappears.

Gene

----- Original Message -----

*From:*Sociohack AC <mailto:acsociopath@gmail.com>

*Sent:*Tuesday, August 21, 2018 8:37 AM

*To:*nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>

*Subject:*[nvda] Favourite add-ons

What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack


Re: Favourite add-ons

Ralf Kefferpuetz
 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Noah Carver via Groups.Io
Sent: Mittwoch, 22. August 2018 14:35
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

 

Can I have the link for Total Commander enhanced?

 

On 8/21/2018 10:37, Ralf Kefferpuetz wrote:

Hello,

 

My top 12 addOns are:

Application Dictionary

Golden cursor

IdentNav

Input lock

Instant translate

Notepad++

Outlook enhanced

Remote support

SentenceNav

Sonos for Sonos desktop

Speech history

Total Commander enhanced

 

Best regards,

  Ralf

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sociohack AC
Sent: Dienstag, 21. August 2018 15:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

 

What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack

 


Re: Favourite add-ons

Gene
 

Not only JAWS has a system tray dialog.  Window-eyes had one and System Access had one.  I don't know about Dolphin (spelling but I wouldn't be surprised. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Rui Fontes
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 7:09 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

Hello!

1 - I agree that a screen reader should not modify the user interface
given by the system where it is running;

2 - That should not interfere with the possibility of screen readers
make available a alternative user interface, when it is usefull.

3 - Systray list addon was created by me, with the help of Rui Batista,
and later modified by Doug Lee.

4 - Why I decided to create it?
4.1 - Most new NVDA users, at least in 2013 in Portugal and Brazil, were
old Jaws users and so they were used to it;
4.2 - Sometimes, when you arrow through Systray, after making Windows+B,
and you get to the Network icon, the system shows a popup, Network
flyout or something like that, and make unusable the systray that way...;

5 - So, for me, the ideological reason is not valid, since the screen
reader is not changing the user interface, but only giving anorther way
to do the same...

6 - Regarding the announcement of copy, cut and paste, here I can
understand the ideological reason, since the operating system do not
announce it in some cases...

6.1 - The system never announces the fact of something being copied to
the clipboard;
6.2 - When something is cutted, a visual information is given, since the
text or file is gone, and NVDA not always give that information to us;
6.3 - When something is pasted, again, some visual information is given,
but not always NVDA announce it...

7 - So, for me, the ideological reason only will  be valid when NVDA
give us the same information given visually.

8 - Untill that, I will defend the announcement of copy, cut and paste,
making all efforts to gave a correct information, but when it will not
be possible to be sure the operation was performed, giving us the
information not confirmed...

Regards,

Rui Fontes
NVDA portuguese team



Às 11:14 de 22/08/2018, Gene escreveu:
> Here is a correction to my last message.
> I said that one reason that copy, cut and paste aren't announced is the
> ideological one I discussed.  That may be incorrect.  I read two
> discussions of this when users requested the feature that are available
> on Ghithub.  I didn't see the ideological reason given.  Instead, the
> mistaken belief was expressed that it can't be known reliably except in
> certain cases, when copying, pasting, and cutting occur. this is
> factually incorrect yet it was believed by the developers for most of
> the years NVDA has been under development.  I don't know what the
> developers believe now.
> The argument was that NVDA would have to be programmed to announce copy,
> paste, and cut when the commands were given without any knowledge of
> whether the actions were actually taken.  So the screen-reader would
> give false information if something prevented the operations from
> occurring.
> As the developer of the add on has demonstrated and as I did in my
> tests, this belief is incorrect and I strongly believe that since the
> belief has been disproven, that the feature should either be placed in
> code or that the add on be distributed and active as part of the
> installation. I don't care which solution would be adopted.
> Gene
> ----- original Message -----
> *From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 22, 2018 4:49 AM
> *To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> *Subject:* Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons
>
> This message is rather long.  I hope you find it interesting and
> provocative of thought.
> Rarely, one of the icons doesn't work as expect in the system tray. I
> don't remember what now, but I couldn't do something in the system tray
> I should have been able to do but I could in the system tray dialog.
> Aside from that, while it wouldn't be a major problem or inconvenience
> to accustom myself to the system tray interface for regular use, why
> should I have to?  The dialog has been standard in screen-readers since
> Windows 98.  Why wasn't it included in NVDA?  As far as I know, this was
> for ideological reasons, and ideology defeated common sense and a
> reasonable accomodation to something that had been available for so long
> that it is now the standard.
> the reason there was a separate system tray dialog in the first place is
> that the system tray wasn't accessible in Windows 98.  And when the
> system tray dialog was instituted, a lot of people were still using
> Windows 95, where the system tray was also inaccessible.  So the dialog
> started as a way to use an inaccessible feature, not as a redundancy.
> The ideological principle is that screen-readers should never unless
> really necessary, present anything that isn't presented to the sighted
> user in a different format or manner or present any additional information.
> While I generally agree with this approach, ideology, strictly adhered
> to to the point of absurdity, always fails to deal with reality or
> common sense.
> New users to NVDA should not have to wait until they, maybe, learn about
> add ons to have a feature that has been standard in screen-readers for
> twenty years.
> And it was partly the same ideological rigidity that caused the copy and
> paste announcements not to be heard in NVDA and I object for the same
> reasons.  At least make the add ons part of the installation if they
> aren't added to the code.  Window-eyes for years, had add ons as part of
> the installation of the program.  This is nothing radical.
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Clare Page <mailto:clare.page@...>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 22, 2018 4:17 AM
> *To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> *Subject:* Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons
>
> Hi!
>
> I find the Clipspeak add-on very useful, because without it there is no
> announcement of when copying and cutting and pasting has been done;
>
> As for the system tray add-on, I hope you don’t mind me asking, but why
> do you need this add-on, and consider it as essential, when the system
> tray is perfectly usable without it? I’m not criticizing, just curious
> as to why you consider it a necessary add-on and think it should be part
> of NVDA, when NVDA can easily read the system tray on its own?
>
> Bye for now!
>
>  From Clare
>
> *From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of *Gene
> *Sent:* mardi 21 août 2018 16:04
> *To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
> *Subject:* Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons
>
> I don't use many add ons because the way I use my computer, I don't
> benefit from most of them. But the two I use regularly and I consider
> important enough that they shouldn't be add ons is Clip Speak, which
> announces copy and past when you copy to and past from the clipboard,
> and the system tray dialog add on.  The system tray dialog has been a
> standard part of screen-readers since Windows 2008. It should be
> included in NVDA itself but it isn't.
>
> As for Clipp Speak, I don't know if there is a new version that solves
> these problems.  the original version caused some problems in Word and
> it caused a problem in the Youtube downloader I use even though I wasn't
> directly using the add on. So, if you see strange problems you didn't
> have before, even if they seem unrelated to anything you would expect
> the add on to cause, try disabling them and see if the problem disappears.
>
> Gene
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> *From:*Sociohack AC <mailto:acsociopath@...>
>
> *Sent:*Tuesday, August 21, 2018 8:37 AM
>
> *To:*nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>
> *Subject:*[nvda] Favourite add-ons
>
> What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
> --
> Regards,
> Sociohack
>
>



Re: Favourite add-ons

 

Can I have the link for Total Commander enhanced?


On 8/21/2018 10:37, Ralf Kefferpuetz wrote:

Hello,

 

My top 12 addOns are:

Application Dictionary

Golden cursor

IdentNav

Input lock

Instant translate

Notepad++

Outlook enhanced

Remote support

SentenceNav

Sonos for Sonos desktop

Speech history

Total Commander enhanced

 

Best regards,

  Ralf

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sociohack AC
Sent: Dienstag, 21. August 2018 15:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

 

What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack



NVDA keeping another process open

Felix G.
 

Hi!
Has anyone else noticed that when NVDA is running, it seems to keep
some other processes permanently open? For example, there is a
development environment, let's call it x, which I use for creating a
software component. Strangely, when I open x and then close it again,
it stays running as a process in task manager, but as soon as I close
NVDA it also closes. I've tried with two other screen readers and they
don't affect it in this way, that is, with those running, the process
stops immediately when I close its window. So NVDA seems to do
something to certain other processes which keeps them from
terminating.
I noticed the same with Outlook 2007, by the way, which I am still
using on one machine. That also won't close as long as NVDA is
running, but as soon as I exit NVDA, Outlook closes along with it.
Other screen readers don't affect Outlook in this way.
Best,
Felix


Re: Favourite add-ons

Rui Fontes
 

Hello!

1 - I agree that a screen reader should not modify the user interface given by the system where it is running;

2 - That should not interfere with the possibility of screen readers make available a alternative user interface, when it is usefull.

3 - Systray list addon was created by me, with the help of Rui Batista, and later modified by Doug Lee.

4 - Why I decided to create it?
4.1 - Most new NVDA users, at least in 2013 in Portugal and Brazil, were old Jaws users and so they were used to it;
4.2 - Sometimes, when you arrow through Systray, after making Windows+B, and you get to the Network icon, the system shows a popup, Network flyout or something like that, and make unusable the systray that way...;

5 - So, for me, the ideological reason is not valid, since the screen reader is not changing the user interface, but only giving anorther way to do the same...

6 - Regarding the announcement of copy, cut and paste, here I can understand the ideological reason, since the operating system do not announce it in some cases...

6.1 - The system never announces the fact of something being copied to the clipboard;
6.2 - When something is cutted, a visual information is given, since the text or file is gone, and NVDA not always give that information to us;
6.3 - When something is pasted, again, some visual information is given, but not always NVDA announce it...

7 - So, for me, the ideological reason only will be valid when NVDA give us the same information given visually.

8 - Untill that, I will defend the announcement of copy, cut and paste, making all efforts to gave a correct information, but when it will not be possible to be sure the operation was performed, giving us the information not confirmed...

Regards,

Rui Fontes
NVDA portuguese team



Às 11:14 de 22/08/2018, Gene escreveu:

Here is a correction to my last message.
I said that one reason that copy, cut and paste aren't announced is the ideological one I discussed.  That may be incorrect.  I read two discussions of this when users requested the feature that are available on Ghithub.  I didn't see the ideological reason given.  Instead, the mistaken belief was expressed that it can't be known reliably except in certain cases, when copying, pasting, and cutting occur. this is factually incorrect yet it was believed by the developers for most of the years NVDA has been under development.  I don't know what the developers believe now.
The argument was that NVDA would have to be programmed to announce copy, paste, and cut when the commands were given without any knowledge of whether the actions were actually taken.  So the screen-reader would give false information if something prevented the operations from occurring.
As the developer of the add on has demonstrated and as I did in my tests, this belief is incorrect and I strongly believe that since the belief has been disproven, that the feature should either be placed in code or that the add on be distributed and active as part of the installation. I don't care which solution would be adopted.
Gene
----- original Message -----
*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@ripco.com>
*Sent:* Wednesday, August 22, 2018 4:49 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons
This message is rather long.  I hope you find it interesting and provocative of thought.
Rarely, one of the icons doesn't work as expect in the system tray. I don't remember what now, but I couldn't do something in the system tray I should have been able to do but I could in the system tray dialog.
Aside from that, while it wouldn't be a major problem or inconvenience to accustom myself to the system tray interface for regular use, why should I have to?  The dialog has been standard in screen-readers since Windows 98.  Why wasn't it included in NVDA?  As far as I know, this was for ideological reasons, and ideology defeated common sense and a reasonable accomodation to something that had been available for so long that it is now the standard.
the reason there was a separate system tray dialog in the first place is that the system tray wasn't accessible in Windows 98.  And when the system tray dialog was instituted, a lot of people were still using Windows 95, where the system tray was also inaccessible.  So the dialog started as a way to use an inaccessible feature, not as a redundancy.
The ideological principle is that screen-readers should never unless really necessary, present anything that isn't presented to the sighted user in a different format or manner or present any additional information.
While I generally agree with this approach, ideology, strictly adhered to to the point of absurdity, always fails to deal with reality or common sense.
New users to NVDA should not have to wait until they, maybe, learn about add ons to have a feature that has been standard in screen-readers for twenty years.
And it was partly the same ideological rigidity that caused the copy and paste announcements not to be heard in NVDA and I object for the same reasons.  At least make the add ons part of the installation if they aren't added to the code.  Window-eyes for years, had add ons as part of the installation of the program.  This is nothing radical.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Clare Page <mailto:clare.page@wanadoo.fr>
*Sent:* Wednesday, August 22, 2018 4:17 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons
Hi!
I find the Clipspeak add-on very useful, because without it there is no announcement of when copying and cutting and pasting has been done;
As for the system tray add-on, I hope you don’t mind me asking, but why do you need this add-on, and consider it as essential, when the system tray is perfectly usable without it? I’m not criticizing, just curious as to why you consider it a necessary add-on and think it should be part of NVDA, when NVDA can easily read the system tray on its own?
Bye for now!
From Clare
*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of *Gene
*Sent:* mardi 21 août 2018 16:04
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons
I don't use many add ons because the way I use my computer, I don't benefit from most of them. But the two I use regularly and I consider important enough that they shouldn't be add ons is Clip Speak, which announces copy and past when you copy to and past from the clipboard, and the system tray dialog add on.  The system tray dialog has been a standard part of screen-readers since Windows 2008. It should be included in NVDA itself but it isn't.
As for Clipp Speak, I don't know if there is a new version that solves these problems.  the original version caused some problems in Word and it caused a problem in the Youtube downloader I use even though I wasn't directly using the add on. So, if you see strange problems you didn't have before, even if they seem unrelated to anything you would expect the add on to cause, try disabling them and see if the problem disappears.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:*Sociohack AC <mailto:acsociopath@gmail.com>
*Sent:*Tuesday, August 21, 2018 8:37 AM
*To:*nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:*[nvda] Favourite add-ons
What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack


Re: Favourite add-ons

Ralf Kefferpuetz
 

Hello,

It makes lots of notepad++ functions accessible.
Please see here:
https://github.com/derekriemer/nvda-notepadPlusPlus/releases

regards,
Ralf

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Christian Schoepplein
Sent: Mittwoch, 22. August 2018 11:38
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

Hej,

what does the Notepad++ plugin do in detail and where can I get it? IIRC I did not see it on the regular addon page...

Cheers and TIA,

Schoepp

On Tue, August 21, 2018 4:37 pm, Ralf Kefferpuetz wrote:
Hello,




My top 12 addOns are:


Application Dictionary


Golden cursor


IdentNav


Input lock


Instant translate


Notepad++


Outlook enhanced


Remote support


SentenceNav


Sonos for Sonos desktop


Speech history


Total Commander enhanced




Best regards,


Ralf




From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sociohack
AC
Sent: Dienstag, 21. August 2018 15:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Favourite add-ons




What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack









Re: Favourite add-ons

Gene
 

Here is a correction to my last message. 
 
I said that one reason that copy, cut and paste aren't announced is the ideological one I discussed.  That may be incorrect.  I read two discussions of this when users requested the feature that are available on Ghithub.  I didn't see the ideological reason given.  Instead, the mistaken belief was expressed that it can't be known reliably except in certain cases, when copying, pasting, and cutting occur. this is factually incorrect yet it was believed by the developers for most of the years NVDA has been under development.  I don't know what the developers believe now. 
 
The argument was that NVDA would have to be programmed to announce copy, paste, and cut when the commands were given without any knowledge of whether the actions were actually taken.  So the screen-reader would give false information if something prevented the operations from occurring. 
 
As the developer of the add on has demonstrated and as I did in my tests, this belief is incorrect and I strongly believe that since the belief has been disproven, that the feature should either be placed in code or that the add on be distributed and active as part of the installation.  I don't care which solution would be adopted.
 
Gene
----- original Message -----

From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 4:49 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

This message is rather long.  I hope you find it interesting and provocative of thought.
 
Rarely, one of the icons doesn't work as expect in the system tray. I don't remember what now, but I couldn't do something in the system tray I should have been able to do but I could in the system tray dialog. 
 
Aside from that, while it wouldn't be a major problem or inconvenience to accustom myself to the system tray interface for regular use, why should I have to?  The dialog has been standard in screen-readers since Windows 98.  Why wasn't it included in NVDA?  As far as I know, this was for ideological reasons, and ideology defeated common sense and a reasonable accomodation to something that had been available for so long that it is now the standard. 
 
the reason there was a separate system tray dialog in the first place is that the system tray wasn't accessible in Windows 98.  And when the system tray dialog was instituted, a lot of people were still using Windows 95, where the system tray was also inaccessible.  So the dialog started as a way to use an inaccessible feature, not as a redundancy. 
 
The ideological principle is that screen-readers should never unless really necessary, present anything that isn't presented to the sighted user in a different format or manner or present any additional information. 
 
While I generally agree with this approach, ideology, strictly adhered to to the point of absurdity, always fails to deal with reality or common sense. 
 
New users to NVDA should not have to wait until they, maybe, learn about add ons to have a feature that has been standard in screen-readers for twenty years. 
 
And it was partly the same ideological rigidity that caused the copy and paste announcements not to be heard in NVDA and I object for the same reasons.  At least make the add ons part of the installation if they aren't added to the code.  Window-eyes for years, had add ons as part of the installation of the program.  This is nothing radical. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Clare Page
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 4:17 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

Hi!

I find the Clipspeak add-on very useful, because without it there is no announcement of when copying and cutting and pasting has been done;

As for the system tray add-on, I hope you don’t mind me asking, but why do you need this add-on, and consider it as essential, when the system tray is perfectly usable without it? I’m not criticizing, just curious as to why you consider it a necessary add-on and think it should be part of NVDA, when NVDA can easily read the system tray on its own?

Bye for now!

From Clare

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: mardi 21 août 2018 16:04
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

 

I don't use many add ons because the way I use my computer, I don't benefit from most of them.  But the two I use regularly and I consider important enough that they shouldn't be add ons is Clip Speak, which announces copy and past when you copy to and past from the clipboard, and the system tray dialog add on.  The system tray dialog has been a standard part of screen-readers since Windows 2008.  It should be included in NVDA itself but it isn't.

 

As for Clipp Speak, I don't know if there is a new version that solves these problems.  the original version caused some problems in Word and it caused a problem in the Youtube downloader I use even though I wasn't directly using the add on.  So, if you see strange problems you didn't have before, even if they seem unrelated to anything you would expect the add on to cause, try disabling them and see if the problem disappears.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Sociohack AC

Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 8:37 AM

Subject: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

 

What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack


Re: Favourite add-ons

Gene
 

This message is rather long.  I hope you find it interesting and provocative of thought.
 
Rarely, one of the icons doesn't work as expect in the system tray. I don't remember what now, but I couldn't do something in the system tray I should have been able to do but I could in the system tray dialog. 
 
Aside from that, while it wouldn't be a major problem or inconvenience to accustom myself to the system tray interface for regular use, why should I have to?  The dialog has been standard in screen-readers since Windows 98.  Why wasn't it included in NVDA?  As far as I know, this was for ideological reasons, and ideology defeated common sense and a reasonable accomodation to something that had been available for so long that it is now the standard. 
 
the reason there was a separate system tray dialog in the first place is that the system tray wasn't accessible in Windows 98.  And when the system tray dialog was instituted, a lot of people were still using Windows 95, where the system tray was also inaccessible.  So the dialog started as a way to use an inaccessible feature, not as a redundancy. 
 
The ideological principle is that screen-readers should never unless really necessary, present anything that isn't presented to the sighted user in a different format or manner or present any additional information. 
 
While I generally agree with this approach, ideology, strictly adhered to to the point of absurdity, always fails to deal with reality or common sense. 
 
New users to NVDA should not have to wait until they, maybe, learn about add ons to have a feature that has been standard in screen-readers for twenty years. 
 
And it was partly the same ideological rigidity that caused the copy and paste announcements not to be heard in NVDA and I object for the same reasons.  At least make the add ons part of the installation if they aren't added to the code.  Window-eyes for years, had add ons as part of the installation of the program.  This is nothing radical. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Clare Page
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 4:17 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

Hi!

I find the Clipspeak add-on very useful, because without it there is no announcement of when copying and cutting and pasting has been done;

As for the system tray add-on, I hope you don’t mind me asking, but why do you need this add-on, and consider it as essential, when the system tray is perfectly usable without it? I’m not criticizing, just curious as to why you consider it a necessary add-on and think it should be part of NVDA, when NVDA can easily read the system tray on its own?

Bye for now!

From Clare

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: mardi 21 août 2018 16:04
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

 

I don't use many add ons because the way I use my computer, I don't benefit from most of them.  But the two I use regularly and I consider important enough that they shouldn't be add ons is Clip Speak, which announces copy and past when you copy to and past from the clipboard, and the system tray dialog add on.  The system tray dialog has been a standard part of screen-readers since Windows 2008.  It should be included in NVDA itself but it isn't.

 

As for Clipp Speak, I don't know if there is a new version that solves these problems.  the original version caused some problems in Word and it caused a problem in the Youtube downloader I use even though I wasn't directly using the add on.  So, if you see strange problems you didn't have before, even if they seem unrelated to anything you would expect the add on to cause, try disabling them and see if the problem disappears.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Sociohack AC

Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 8:37 AM

Subject: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

 

What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack


Re: Favourite add-ons

Christian Schoepplein
 

Hej,

what does the Notepad++ plugin do in detail and where can I get it? IIRC I
did not see it on the regular addon page...

Cheers and TIA,

Schoepp

On Tue, August 21, 2018 4:37 pm, Ralf Kefferpuetz wrote:
Hello,




My top 12 addOns are:


Application Dictionary


Golden cursor


IdentNav


Input lock


Instant translate


Notepad++


Outlook enhanced


Remote support


SentenceNav


Sonos for Sonos desktop


Speech history


Total Commander enhanced




Best regards,


Ralf




From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sociohack AC
Sent: Dienstag, 21. August 2018 15:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Favourite add-ons




What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack









Re: Favourite add-ons

Clare Page <clare.page@...>
 

Hi!

I find the Clipspeak add-on very useful, because without it there is no announcement of when copying and cutting and pasting has been done;

As for the system tray add-on, I hope you don’t mind me asking, but why do you need this add-on, and consider it as essential, when the system tray is perfectly usable without it? I’m not criticizing, just curious as to why you consider it a necessary add-on and think it should be part of NVDA, when NVDA can easily read the system tray on its own?

Bye for now!

From Clare

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: mardi 21 août 2018 16:04
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

 

I don't use many add ons because the way I use my computer, I don't benefit from most of them.  But the two I use regularly and I consider important enough that they shouldn't be add ons is Clip Speak, which announces copy and past when you copy to and past from the clipboard, and the system tray dialog add on.  The system tray dialog has been a standard part of screen-readers since Windows 2008.  It should be included in NVDA itself but it isn't.

 

As for Clipp Speak, I don't know if there is a new version that solves these problems.  the original version caused some problems in Word and it caused a problem in the Youtube downloader I use even though I wasn't directly using the add on.  So, if you see strange problems you didn't have before, even if they seem unrelated to anything you would expect the add on to cause, try disabling them and see if the problem disappears.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 8:37 AM

Subject: [nvda] Favourite add-ons

 

What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack


Re: Facebook account

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Do you mean you have also lost the computer access as well?
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "farhan israk" <fahim.net.2014@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 8:30 PM
Subject: [nvda] Facebook account


I'm Fahim from Dhaka Bangladesh. I use Google authenticator. I have changed
phone. I have done factory reset my previous phone. I forgot to take
backup. So, I'm not able to access my facebook account. How to recover it?



Re: Favourite add-ons

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Yes a sore point since I have had no luck restoring dropbox dialogue access on either of my windows 7 machines since I removed Avast. It is as if the api for their preferences, share and log in screens has been deleted.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 7:50 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Favourite add-ons


Hmmm sociohack, interesting handle.

For me windows 10 apps, the addon updater once stable, iffinterpreters, vlc, and a few others are good.

Ofcause it depends on what you have loaded.

For example emoticons is fine, but to be honest, I have a lot of program spaciffic ones, vlc, dropbox, winamp, teamtalk, things like that.



On 8/22/2018 1:37 AM, Sociohack AC wrote:
What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack



NVDA and TortoiseSVN

Mohammadreza Rashad
 

Hello my friends, I'm using Windows 10 x64 build 1803 and TortoiseSVN
1.10.1 x64 (latest version).
First: When I want to commit something and go to the log editor to
write what I want to do, while navigating to the first character in
edit field, either by home key when I’m on first line or by leftArrow
key, NVDA freezes for 10 seconds. When freeze ends, It says “blank”
instead of first letter. When I want to delete that first letter with
the Backspace key, NVDA freezes forever. Then I have to press
ctrl+alt+n to run it again.
I saw the abovementioned problem with 3 versions of NVDA: 2018.2.1,
2018.3beta3, and latest alpha (15920). I’ll paste the NVDA log file
for technicians to investigate.
Second: I still have problem when I want to check my commit or update
result lists with review cursor. This cursor does not scroll the list
to show the rest. In a list with e.g. 35 items, I can only see the
last 10 items using review cursor.
Thanks in advance
--- NVDA log set to debug warnings ---
INFO - __main__ (11:52:27.204):
Starting NVDA
INFO - core.main (11:52:27.405):
Config dir: C:\Users\Mohammadreza\AppData\Roaming\nvda
INFO - config.ConfigManager._loadConfig (11:52:27.407):
Loading config: C:\Users\Mohammadreza\AppData\Roaming\nvda\nvda.ini
INFO - core.main (11:52:27.515):
NVDA version 2018.2.1
INFO - core.main (11:52:27.516):
Using Windows version 10.0.17134 workstation
INFO - core.main (11:52:27.516):
Using Python version 2.7.15 (v2.7.15:ca079a3ea3, Apr 30 2018,
16:22:17) [MSC v.1500 32 bit (Intel)]
INFO - core.main (11:52:27.516):
Using comtypes version 1.1.3
DEBUGWARNING - touchHandler.touchSupported (11:52:27.609):
No touch devices found
INFO - synthDrivers.espeak.SynthDriver.__init__ (11:52:27.825):
Using eSpeak NG version 1.49.1 dev
INFO - synthDriverHandler.setSynth (11:52:27.884):
Loaded synthDriver espeak
INFO - core.main (11:52:27.884):
Using wx version 3.0.2.0 msw (classic)
INFO - brailleInput.initialize (11:52:27.885):
Braille input initialized
INFO - braille.initialize (11:52:27.888):
Using liblouis version 3.5.0
INFO - braille.BrailleHandler.setDisplayByName (11:52:27.888):
Loaded braille display driver noBraille, current display has 0 cells.
INFO - _UIAHandler.UIAHandler.MTAThreadFunc (11:52:28.016):
UIAutomation: IUIAutomation5
DEBUGWARNING - touchHandler.touchSupported (11:52:28.572):
No touch devices found
DEBUGWARNING - braille.getDisplayList (11:52:30.342):
Braille display driver brailliantB reports as unavailable, excluding
DEBUGWARNING - braille.getDisplayList (11:52:30.348):
Braille display driver freedomScientific reports as unavailable, excluding
DEBUGWARNING - braille.getDisplayList (11:52:30.361):
Braille display driver brailliantB reports as unavailable, excluding
DEBUGWARNING - braille.getDisplayList (11:52:30.361):
Braille display driver freedomScientific reports as unavailable, excluding
INFO - external:globalPlugins.brailleExtender.GlobalPlugin.__init__
(11:52:30.375):
BrailleExtender dev-18.08.14-113938 loaded
DEBUGWARNING - touchHandler.touchSupported (11:52:30.387):
No touch devices found
WARNING - globalPlugins.MathMlReader (11:52:30.417):
MathPlayer 4 not available
INFO - core.main (11:52:30.431):
NVDA initialized
INFO - external:globalPlugins.sharedComputer.GlobalPlugin.changeVolumeLevel
(11:52:30.532):
Level speakers at Startup: 24 Percent
INFO - external:globalPlugins.sharedComputer.GlobalPlugin.changeVolumeLevel
(11:52:30.532):
speakers at Startup: Unmuted
INFO - external:globalPlugins.sharedComputer.GlobalPlugin.changeVolumeLevel
(11:52:30.532):
speakers after correction: 24 Percent, Unmuted
INFO - external:globalPlugins.sharedComputer.GlobalPlugin.changeVolumeLevel
(11:52:30.532):
Level speakers at Startup: 24 Percent
INFO - external:globalPlugins.sharedComputer.GlobalPlugin.changeVolumeLevel
(11:52:30.532):
speakers at Startup: Unmuted
INFO - external:globalPlugins.sharedComputer.GlobalPlugin.changeVolumeLevel
(11:52:30.532):
speakers after correction: 24 Percent, Unmuted
* DEBUGWARNING - watchdog._watcher (11:52:52.470):
Trying to recover from freeze, core stack:
File "nvda.pyw", line 212, in <module>
File "core.pyo", line 473, in main
File "wx\_core.pyo", line 8657, in MainLoop
File "wx\_core.pyo", line 7952, in MainLoop
File "core.pyo", line 444, in Notify
File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll
File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue
File "scriptHandler.pyo", line 145, in _queueScriptCallback
File "scriptHandler.pyo", line 187, in executeScript
File "editableText.pyo", line 189, in script_caret_moveByCharacter
File "editableText.pyo", line 144, in _caretMovementScriptHelper
File "editableText.pyo", line 129, in _caretScriptPostMovedHelper
File "textInfos\offsets.pyo", line 348, in expand
File "textInfos\offsets.pyo", line 330, in _getUnitOffsets
File "NVDAObjects\window\scintilla.pyo", line 227, in _getCharacterOffsets
--- log ended. ---


--
Best wishes,
Mohammadreza Rashad


Re: VLC meedia player with nvda

 

To be honest, if you have dvd audio extracter you can crack the dvds.

I personally think its a crime for us to have to even do this especially if the damn things are ours and sightlings can handle the menus for nothing.

Windows media player may work better.

In most dvds which are not paramount, its possible to extract the dvd but with some startrek dvds all the files are done in such a way that while you can pull them they are in bits and bobs and unable to be reordered.

In others they are almost impossible to get.

Saying that with streaming being a thing, dvds and video shops are a thing of the past.

Then again, while I have a lot, I have not brought or listened to a dvd in ages.

Its not much good if I can't access it, or if while I can crack the thing I have issues cracking them.

I actually object to cracking the dvds in the first place as it takes time to do so about 30 minutes especially if I will only watch them once.

I even have to crack rental dvds so I can watch them and while I will crack all day long I really think the laws that make dvds accessible should also imply that there is a way to either rent audio described dvds or audio tracks or buy them out right.

That would make me not hack the dvds in the first place.

But those laws don't exist and now its just to hard to do that now so I just don't watch many dvds now.

On 8/22/2018 7:13 AM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
Is this the old chestnut of the copyright warning which you cannot read or skip past till its been on screen for a while threatening  boiling in oil if you even think about ripping out the film on it? grin.
I don't know the answer myself. DVDs seem to be actually getting worse for accessibility of late.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Caleb Neyenhuis" <calebneyenhuis@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 10:40 AM
Subject: [nvda] VLC meedia player with nvda


Hi all
I am trying to play a dvd with vlc meedia player
But it gets stuck at the intro whitch then means i have to press play like a normal dvd player
But it is all ready playing
Does any one know how to get to the next lpart where it plays
Thanks





Re: NVDA and Microsoft OneCore Voices

 

well the one core voices were called mobile.

Some voices need a language pack download.

On 8/22/2018 3:32 AM, Ervin, Glenn wrote:
I was setting up a friend's Windows 10 computer, and I could not find any one-core voices.
Only the two, a male and a female, and then another female voice at the bottom, but none indicated one-core as the name, they had people names.
Glenn


From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris Mullins
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 8:16 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA and Microsoft OneCore Voices

Hi Kelly
Assuming you are talking about the voice rate in NVDA Settings being 100%,press Windows+i to open the Settings dialog for Windows, tab into the list of categories and press enter on "Ease of Access". Tab to the list of topics and arrow down to Speech and press enter. Tab to "Additional Speech Settings and press enter. You should find a speech rate for the OneCore voice, check it's value between the 2 machines and adjust accordingly.

Cheers
Chris .

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kelly
Sent: 17 August 2018 13:42
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: [nvda] NVDA and Microsoft OneCore Voices

Hi,

Are there any known issues with NVDA and the MS OneCore voices and speech rate. I have the same version of NVDA installed on two different computers but the top rates I'm getting with the OneCore voices are drastically different. On one machine, the rates are similar to what you'd get if you used MS Sapi 5, very slow even at 100%. The voices themselves are the OneCore versions though.

The two machines are running the latest Windows Insider build.






Re: Favourite add-ons

 

Hmmm sociohack, interesting handle.

For me windows 10 apps, the addon updater once stable, iffinterpreters, vlc, and a few others are good.

Ofcause it depends on what you have loaded.

For example emoticons is fine, but to be honest, I have a lot of program spaciffic ones, vlc, dropbox, winamp, teamtalk, things like that.

On 8/22/2018 1:37 AM, Sociohack AC wrote:
What are the most useful add-ons for you people?
--
Regards,
Sociohack



Re: review of free office

 

Hmph, all the systems have java by default.

For compatability sake, all machines as well as every visual c run time from 2005-2017 have codec mega, and java 8 latest and 10 latest.

All the access is there, I have vb 6, and the visual studio extended runtimes, as well as directx 9c redist the last one ever out, the managed directx libraries, slim dx and a few others.

I have just about every runtime loaded on the system in case windows has an issue running something.

On 8/21/2018 11:37 PM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
Was it perhaps needing Java?
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, August 20, 2018 11:37 PM
Subject: [nvda] review of free office


Hi.

Well I have to agree with rosemery here.

Free office text input ariea for the text maker was itself accessible, but the menus I couldn't access them, the interface for the office menus with alt did not come up.

I also tried flexy pdf, I couldn't choose my interface, and while flexy pdf was installed as part of my review tests with the way freeoffice was I quickly went off the idea.

Ofcause I made an system restore for the thing just before I killed things, but yeah, still not happy with it all.

I will have to move back to libre office I think.







Re: Spell Checking With NVDA

Gene
 

That is for an entire line.  If there is only one word on what NVDA considers a line, whether it is or not, you will only hear that one word spelled.  But that isn't the read current word command. 
 
I would suggest you consider learning the proper review commands, for read current word and read current character.  You should also learn the command in that cluster for read current line.  They are important not only because you may need them for there usual purpose, but they are essential to know if you want to select text you can't select with the application cursor.  If you are in a dialog, for example, and you want to send someone the text that describes an error to someone doing technical support.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 10:34 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Spell Checking With NVDA

I have always just used NVDA + the up arrow twice to spell out a word.
I use NVDA + up arrow to re-read a line ... if I hit up twice it
spells out the sentence for me. The only difference between that and
using numpad 5 is that it doesn't do it phonetically.

On 8/21/18, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
> Hi Abbie,
>
> To have NVDA spell the suggested word (or the misspelling, or any other
> word you are reading at any point), press numpad 5 twice quickly (or if
> using Laptop keyboard layout, press NVDA+control+. twice quickly).
>
> Regards
>
> Quentin.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 9:10 AM, Abbie Taylor <abbietaylor945@...>
> wrote:
>
>> I'm also a writer. I'm not familiar with object navigation, but I can tab
>> through the spell checker dialog in Word 2013 and read everything except
>> the misspelled word. In the list of suggestions, NVDA doesn't spell the
>> suggested words.
>>
>>
>> For this reason, I have NVDA set to notify me of spelling mistakes. When
>> proofreading a document, I pay attention to these and correct them on the
>> spot. Then, I run the spell checker in case I missed anything. When I do,
>> since I have some vision, I enlarge the text so I can more easily see my
>> mistakes.
>>
>>
>> I've tried Jarte, a free word processing program. In that spell checker,
>> NVDA works a lot better, since it's laid out in a menu, and even spells
>> the
>> misspelled word and suggestions. Unfortunately, Jarte dosn't have all the
>> functions of Microsoft Word. I hope this is helpful.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Abbie Johnson Taylor, Author http://abbiescorner.wordpress.com
>> http://www.abbiejohnsontaylor.com abbietaylor945@... Order my new
>> memoir at http://www.abbiejohnsontaylor.com/memoir.htm
>>
>>
>> --
>> Abbie Johnson Taylor, Author
>> http://www.abbiejohnsontaylor.com
>> http://abbiescorner.wordpress.com
>> abbietaylor945@...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Quentin Christensen
> Training and Support Manager
>
> Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available:
> http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
>
> www.nvaccess.org
> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
> Twitter: @NVAccess
>
>
>
>



Re: introduction

Quentin Christensen
 

Hi Nene,

Welcome to the group, and to NVDA.  Feel free to ask any questions you may have.  There are also some structured learning resources you might be interested in.  The official training material is the "Basic Training for NVDA" which is not free, but priced quite reasonably, and in a range of formats from the NV Access shop: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

If you are coming from another screen reader, there are several excellent (and free) guides created by members of the community:


Kind regards

Quentin.

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 11:06 AM, Nene <este05@...> wrote:
Hello, my name is Nene from England UK, and just subscribed in this list group.
I am thinking to use NVDA, that I am here to learn more about it.
Please excuse my primitive queries that I may ask to you knowledgeable users, your help given to this new NVDA learner is very much appreciated.
Thank you, for creating this excellent group!
Nene




--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess