Date   

Re: Ribbon disabler and more.

George McCoy <slr1bpz@...>
 

I got and mastered Gene's tutorial when I first upgraded to windows 7 back in 2011.  The material still  applies in windows 10.


George

On 9/3/2018 3:47 PM, Gene wrote:
Thank you.  I hope many people find it useful.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 3:21 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Ribbon disabler and more.

Thanks, Gene. This ribbon tutorial was excellent.
 
Jean with a J
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, September 3, 2018 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Ribbon disabler and more.
 
For those who haven't gotten good instruction or instructional material about ribbons, here is a tutorial, not very long, to read and practice with if you wish.  Don't believe all the negative comments about ribbons until you try working with them yourself.  A lot of the negative comments, perhaps most, are the result of people not getting good instruction or good instructional material.
 
Under my signature is the tutorial.  I don't have Windows 10 so I don't discuss the ribbons there but ribbons are ribbons just as menus are menus.  Once you learn to use ribbons, you can use them anywhere. 
 
Gene
 
I'll provide a brief tutorial based on what I wrote years ago of how to work with ribbons. 
 
I've added a little to it here.
 
I don't know how the organization of Windows has changed in Windows 10 but this description should allow you to look through the Windows ribbons, or any other ribbons, and see how things are organized. 
 
First, I'll discuss a structure found in later versions of Windows that you need to know about-- the split button. 
One thing you will see as you look around ribbons and in other places in Windows are split buttons. A split button often allows you to see more options than just the default action.  Let's take an example. 
Let's say you come across a split button that says shut down Windows.  If you press enter on that button, Windows will shut down.  That is the default action.  Split buttons often show more options if you either right arrow while on the button or down arrow.  As an example, if you are on the shut down split button, you can right arrow and a list of options will open.  the items in the list include sleep, hibernate, restart, and others.  You up or down arrow through the list or use the short cut commands you hear announced as you move through the list.  the letter shortcuts often take actions without pressing enter so be careful when using them, just as you are in menus. 
 
So, let's review.  You find a split button that says shut down.  If you press enter, the computer will shut down. If you right arrow, other options may be displayed.  Or if you down arrow, other options may be displayed.  A split button won't work with both methods.  One method, either right arrowing or down arrowing will do so if it can be done with the button.  Try both methods if you don't know which one might work.  If you are on a tool bar which extends across the screen from left to right, down arrowing will open additional options.  If you think about this, it makes sense.  If you are in a menu, down arrowing will move you to the next item in the menu.  So you right arrow on the split button to cause it to display more options.  In a tool bar that extends across the screen from left to right, right arrowing will move you to the next item in the tool bar.  So you down arrow when on the split button to cause it to display more options.  But some tool bars run up and down the screen, as menus do.  And at times, you may not be sure which way a structure extends on screen.  So, as I said, if you are not sure or don't know, try both methods of causing the split button to display more options.  Often, one of them will work. If you open the options a split button offers and don't want to work with them, arrow in the opposite direction to move out of them.  For example, if you right arrowed to open more options, left arrow. 
Some split buttons don't do anything when you right arrow or down arrow.  In that case, open them with alt down arrow.  Then tab through the additional options.  I've almost never worked in this way with split buttons but if you want to close a split button, try alt up arrow if you've used alt down arrow to open it.
 
Now, to ribbons themselves.
 
Regarding ribbons, much of the complaining about them is not warranted if you understand how they work and how to use short cut commands effectively and efficiently.  and I would strongly recommend against using the JAWS virtual menus, no matter what the JAWS training material says about ribbons being difficult to use.  the training material is just plain wrong and using virtual menus, you will be unnecessarily dependent on one screen-reader.  There are other disadvantages to using them which I won't go into here.
 
Try looking at ribbons and doing what is described below in wordpad.  Everyone with Windows 7 has Wordpad on their machine.  Wordpad provides a good environment to look at and practice working with ribbons.  
 
The essence of working with ribbons is this:
Press alt to move to the upper ribbon.
You will probably be on an item that says home tab. Items on the upper ribbon are announced as tabs such as home tab, view tab, etc. 
To see what ribbons are available, right or left arrow repeatedly to move through the ribbons.  Move in one
direction to move through all of them, just as you would to move through all the menus.
 
For this demonstration, just so we are all doing the same thing, move with the right arrow. When you get back to where you started, you can keep right arrowing to move through the items again, if you wish.  You can move through all the items as many times as you want. Or you can move with the left arrow whenever you want to move in the opposite direction.  
 
Stop on view.  Then start tabbing.  You will move through all items in what is called the lower ribbon that are in the view ribbon. 
 
In other words you tab to see the items in a ribbon once you move to it.  Tab moves you forward through the items, shift tab moves you backword.
So tab and shift tab are used instead of up and down arrow. 
 
Many items in the lower ribbon are buttons.  Use either the space bar or enter to activate the button. You may find a button that opens a menu and if you press enter or the space bar, you will then be in a menu.
 
Each time you move to an item, you will hear the short cut command to work with that item. 
But JAWS has a bug and you often won't.  To hear the short cut, use the command JAWS key tab.  If you are using the default JAWS key, it is either insert.
 
Try tabbing to an item in a Wordpad ribbon and using the command insert tab.  You will hear some extraneous information.  The last thing you will hear is the short cut sequence.  You can repeat the information by repeating the command as often as you want.
 
Let's look at an item which is usually called the application menu.  Return to the main program window in wordpad by closing the ribbons.  You can either press escape repeatedly, if necessary, or you can press alt once.  Now, open the ribbons again with alt. 
Start right arrowing until you get to the application menu.
You will hear application menu and then something like button drop down grid.  Never mind drop down grid.  It's a description you don't have to worry about.  The important things are that you are on a button and at the application menu.  Press enter or the space bar to activate the button.  Activating the button opens the menu.  Start down arrowing. you will hear all the short cut commands necessary to open an item or take an action.  When you got to the menu item, you heard alt f.  When you open the menu and move through it, you will hear all the letters announced.  for example, if you down arrow to save as, you will hear alt f a.  that means that, when you are in the main program window, you open the menu as you always did, alt f, then type a.  Alt f opens the menau and a then opens save as.  Ribbon programs have one menu and you should look through it.  Many important and common commands and interfaces such as options may be there.  By options, I mean the kind of options interface you used to find in the tools menu.
 
Now the we have seen the menu, let's look at the ribbons structure some more.
To review, and add more information, as you have seen, you can move to the ribbon interface with alt.  Then right and left arrow, just as you would move from menu to menu. 
You can also move to a ribbon using alt and a letter.  So, alt h takes you to the home ribbon.  Alt v takes you to the view ribbon, etc.  Once you are on the ribbon you want to work with, tab to move forward through the items in a ribbon.  Shift tab to move back through the items.  So tab and shift tab are used instead of up and down arrow.
Ribbons are divided into categories which you will hear announced as you tab.  for example, in an e-mail program, a ribbon may have a category named respond.  You may hear this announced as respond tool bar.  As you tab, you will hear commands such as reply and forward in the respond category.  When you hear a category announced, don't tab until you hear everything spoken.  You will miss the first command in the category if you do.  I'm talking about working with an unfamiliar ribbon. 
there are often many more commands and items in a ribbon than in a menu.  So memorize command sequences for items you know you will use regularly. 
As I said, there are different categories in ribbons to help organize items.  You can quickly jump from category to category in a ribbon to help you see if there is a category you want to look through. 
Move to a ribbon in Wordpad.  For example, alt h for hhome or alt v for view.
Then repeatedly issue the command control right arrow to move forward from category to category and control left arrow to move back.  When you get to a category you want to hear the items in, start tabbing.  Of course, you can shift tab to move back. 
 
Open a ribbon in Wordpad and tab through it to see how it is organized by moving through it. 
Then use control right arrow to move by category and tab to see what is in a category. 
 
Commands such as control o, control n, control s, control r, etc. are mostly retained in programs
that use ribbons, though you won't hear them announced. If you don't already know them, you'll have to find them in ways such as by looking at a list of keyboard commands for the program.  Such lists are often available in the help for the program. If you already know the commands from having used an older version of the program, most or perhaps even all of the commands you know will work.  


Re: NVDA 2018.3 beta 3 hangs after closing System Information application

Quentin Christensen
 

Using either 2018.3beta3, or the latest alpha, I get unknown reported as soon as I close system information, and yes, as soon as I press the windows key, or windows+m etc, I get to the start menu or desktop as expected.  I'm not getting any crash or even an error or warning like the original poster however.

I wonder if the crash is caused by the same action with a differently configured PC, or whether it is something else which is happening around the same time (an example might be changing configuration profiles if there was a triggered one for system information, or an addon which was triggered or looking for something else).



On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 11:42 AM, Don H <lmddh50@...> wrote:

Just tried to duplicate this.  Indeed after closing the system information with alt f4 it seems that NVDA goes silent.  after the alt f4 is pressed Nvda says unknown.  Sighted help says I am back to the desktop and nothing is shown besides my normal desktop.     However if you hit windows key m speech returns.  Seems that something is open that is minimized by windows key m. 

On 9/3/2018 7:56 PM, Quentin Christensen wrote:
Takuya,

Do you have any (other) addons installed, and if so, have you tried restarting with add-ons disabled?  If so, have you checked that you are using the most up to date version of any addons?

And finally, just to check, does this happen immediately after updating either NVDA or Windows, and if so, does it persist after rebooting the computer?

If you also could send me a copy of your full log, ideally at Debug level, I can have a look as well.

I forgot to mention previously, but more information on the log is available at: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/wiki/LogFilesAndCrashDumps


Kind regards

Quentin.





On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 10:01 AM, Takuya Nishimoto <nishimotz@...> wrote:
I have reported regarding similar issue.

https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/8434

It was difficult to reproduce on other machines than the specific environment.

--
Takuya Nishimoto
nishimotz@...

2018年9月4日(火) 4:08 Jason White via Groups.Io <jason=jasonjgw.net@groups.io>:
>
> After using System Information on Windows 10 1803 (all up to date), and closing the application with Alt+F4, I experienced a hang in NVDA 2018.3 beta 3.
>
>
>
> The log file in my local temporary directory contains the following. Please let me know whether further details are desired, or whether it has been or should be taken up in GitHub.
>
>
>
> WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:47:55.289):
>
> Core frozen in stack:
>
>   File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 495, in main
>
>   File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop
>
>   File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 466, in run
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus
>
>   File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache
>
>   File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container
>
>   File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 954, in findGroupboxObject
>
>   File "winUser.pyo", line 430, in getClassName
>
>
>
> WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:48:10.339):
>
> Core frozen in stack:
>
>   File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 495, in main
>
>   File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop
>
>   File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 466, in run
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus
>
>   File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache
>
>   File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container
>
>   File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 945, in findGroupboxObject
>
>   File "winUser.pyo", line 429, in getClassName
>
>
>
>






--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 




--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: Can one selectively cut and past text from a wordd graphic identifier without the graphic?

Jonathan COHN
 

Use speech history tool?

On 9/1/18, 6:19 AM, "nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

So I have a .docx file, when loaded into word, I can hear a description of
the graphic. What I would like to do is cut the description but not the
actual graphic and put it and the text of the document into a text editor.
It seems not to be possible. Selecting the graphic tries to paste it all,
which of course fails. using object nav and the click three times to go to
clipboard does not work either. Am I being thick here?
Short of copying it by typing it, and its quite long there seems to be no
way to get at this description but somebody put it in, one assumes so I'd
have thought emulating what they did, should reveal it.
How?
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.


Re: NVDA, latest alpha works much better in Win10 mail app!

hurrikennyandopo ...
 

Hi David

 

It might be a good idea to do a reset on nvda back to factory defaults. Then make sure you close it then open it again so you get the messages when you install it for the first time.

 

I am still getting no repeats of the letters or lines etc in mail app and I can read back letter by letter word by word etc when replying to a email. I also wonder if when I think it is leno said he can not do letter by letter it is his version of windows? I know in earlier versions of windows when you replied that problem was there but not now. I am on window 10 ver 1803.

 

Gene nz

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> on behalf of Lino Morales <linomorales001@...>
Sent: Tuesday, September 4, 2018 12:35:36 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA, latest alpha works much better in Win10 mail app!
 

David. You posted about this when was it last week? I don’t understand what your problem was. The only problem I’v had with Mail is when I reply to a message NVDA doesn’t read out what I’m typing. When I read messages I just simply use say all with NVDA plus down arrow.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> on behalf of David Moore <jesusloves1966@...>
Sent: Monday, September 3, 2018 8:32:19 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA, latest alpha works much better in Win10 mail app!
 

Hi all!

I can’t believe what the newest Window Apps Essential’s did for the Win10 Mail app.

I have been hearing the same line repeat as I arrow down through my messages that I am about to send. I am using latest alpha version. I still have a little trouble navigating letter by letter; it says the same letter a few times, but it is so much better!

I could not make corrections at all, because I could not navigate character by character or word by word.

It is all fixed now, and I am so glad!

Do any of you notice a change in how the Win10 Mail app works?

Take care, guys!

David Moore

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


Re: NVDA 2018.3 beta 3 hangs after closing System Information application

Don H
 

Just tried to duplicate this.  Indeed after closing the system information with alt f4 it seems that NVDA goes silent.  after the alt f4 is pressed Nvda says unknown.  Sighted help says I am back to the desktop and nothing is shown besides my normal desktop.     However if you hit windows key m speech returns.  Seems that something is open that is minimized by windows key m. 

On 9/3/2018 7:56 PM, Quentin Christensen wrote:
Takuya,

Do you have any (other) addons installed, and if so, have you tried restarting with add-ons disabled?  If so, have you checked that you are using the most up to date version of any addons?

And finally, just to check, does this happen immediately after updating either NVDA or Windows, and if so, does it persist after rebooting the computer?

If you also could send me a copy of your full log, ideally at Debug level, I can have a look as well.

I forgot to mention previously, but more information on the log is available at: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/wiki/LogFilesAndCrashDumps


Kind regards

Quentin.





On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 10:01 AM, Takuya Nishimoto <nishimotz@...> wrote:
I have reported regarding similar issue.

https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/8434

It was difficult to reproduce on other machines than the specific environment.

--
Takuya Nishimoto
nishimotz@...

2018年9月4日(火) 4:08 Jason White via Groups.Io <jason=jasonjgw.net@groups.io>:
>
> After using System Information on Windows 10 1803 (all up to date), and closing the application with Alt+F4, I experienced a hang in NVDA 2018.3 beta 3.
>
>
>
> The log file in my local temporary directory contains the following. Please let me know whether further details are desired, or whether it has been or should be taken up in GitHub.
>
>
>
> WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:47:55.289):
>
> Core frozen in stack:
>
>   File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 495, in main
>
>   File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop
>
>   File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 466, in run
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus
>
>   File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache
>
>   File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container
>
>   File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 954, in findGroupboxObject
>
>   File "winUser.pyo", line 430, in getClassName
>
>
>
> WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:48:10.339):
>
> Core frozen in stack:
>
>   File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 495, in main
>
>   File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop
>
>   File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 466, in run
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus
>
>   File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache
>
>   File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container
>
>   File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 945, in findGroupboxObject
>
>   File "winUser.pyo", line 429, in getClassName
>
>
>
>






--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: NVDA 2018.3 beta 3 hangs after closing System Information application

Jason White
 

Thanks – I’ll try to reproduce and to capture debug-level logs.

 

At this point, unfortunately, it will probably have to be tomorrow.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Monday, September 3, 2018 8:01 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2018.3 beta 3 hangs after closing System Information application

 

Hi Jason,

 

It isn't reproducing for me, although I'm using a fast insider build of Windows here.

 

Two things to try:


- If you restart NVDA with add-ons disabled (press NVDA+Q then down arrow to "restart with addons disabled" and press ENTER), does it still happen?

 

- Particularly if the crash doesn't happen with add-ons disabled, make sure you are using the most up to date version of all your addons.  There is also an addon to check that: https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/addonUpdater.en.html

 

In any case, if you could send me a copy of your full NVDA log, ideally at log level debug, I can have a closer look at what is happening.


Kind regards

 

Quentin.

 

On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 5:08 AM, Jason White via Groups.Io <jason@...> wrote:

After using System Information on Windows 10 1803 (all up to date), and closing the application with Alt+F4, I experienced a hang in NVDA 2018.3 beta 3.

 

The log file in my local temporary directory contains the following. Please let me know whether further details are desired, or whether it has been or should be taken up in GitHub.

 

WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:47:55.289):

Core frozen in stack:

  File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>

  File "core.pyo", line 495, in main

  File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop

  File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify

  File "core.pyo", line 466, in run

  File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll

  File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus

  File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject

  File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__

  File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache

  File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container

  File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 954, in findGroupboxObject

  File "winUser.pyo", line 430, in getClassName

 

WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:48:10.339):

Core frozen in stack:

  File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>

  File "core.pyo", line 495, in main

  File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop

  File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify

  File "core.pyo", line 466, in run

  File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll

  File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus

  File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject

  File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__

  File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache

  File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container

  File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 945, in findGroupboxObject

  File "winUser.pyo", line 429, in getClassName

 



 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

 

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: useing the o c r adon on windows7, is it possable?

Adel Spence
 


thankyou.

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 8:42 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] useing the o c r adon on windows7, is it possable?

Hi Adel,

Yes you should be able to use the OCR addon in Windows 7.  You can either get it by going to the NVDA menu, then tools then Manage add-ons then the "Get add-ons" button, or from: https://addons.nvda-project.org/index.en.html

The OCR add-on is available from this page: https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/ocr.en.html

Essentially, once setup, move to the image or PDF file (open the PDF file in Adobe reader), etc, then press NVDA+r.  From there use the review cursor to read or copy the text which was found and press escape when done.

All the review cursor keyboard shortcuts are available from the User Guide: https://www.nvaccess.org/files/nvda/documentation/userGuide.html#ReviewingText

Alternatively they are in the Basic Training for NVDA module, which also has in-depth step by step activities to help you get familiar with them (not directly with OCR though).  The good news is that the section on the review cursor is in the free sample available from: 

(Electronic text, the sample is a web page link): https://www.nvaccess.org/product/basic-training-for-nvda-ebook/
(Audio, the sample is a single MP3 which will play in your browser or you can download it.  The full course is completely marked up with DAISY): https://www.nvaccess.org/product/basic-training-for-nvda-downloadable-audio/

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 7:19 AM, Adel Spence <adelspence12@...> wrote:
hi. if I can useing the nvda o c r adin for windows7 please tell me and thanks




--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: NVDA 2018.3 beta 3 hangs after closing System Information application

Quentin Christensen
 

Takuya,

Do you have any (other) addons installed, and if so, have you tried restarting with add-ons disabled?  If so, have you checked that you are using the most up to date version of any addons?

And finally, just to check, does this happen immediately after updating either NVDA or Windows, and if so, does it persist after rebooting the computer?

If you also could send me a copy of your full log, ideally at Debug level, I can have a look as well.

I forgot to mention previously, but more information on the log is available at: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/wiki/LogFilesAndCrashDumps


Kind regards

Quentin.





On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 10:01 AM, Takuya Nishimoto <nishimotz@...> wrote:
I have reported regarding similar issue.

https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/8434

It was difficult to reproduce on other machines than the specific environment.

--
Takuya Nishimoto
nishimotz@...

2018年9月4日(火) 4:08 Jason White via Groups.Io <jason=jasonjgw.net@groups.io>:
>
> After using System Information on Windows 10 1803 (all up to date), and closing the application with Alt+F4, I experienced a hang in NVDA 2018.3 beta 3.
>
>
>
> The log file in my local temporary directory contains the following. Please let me know whether further details are desired, or whether it has been or should be taken up in GitHub.
>
>
>
> WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:47:55.289):
>
> Core frozen in stack:
>
>   File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 495, in main
>
>   File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop
>
>   File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 466, in run
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus
>
>   File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache
>
>   File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container
>
>   File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 954, in findGroupboxObject
>
>   File "winUser.pyo", line 430, in getClassName
>
>
>
> WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:48:10.339):
>
> Core frozen in stack:
>
>   File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 495, in main
>
>   File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop
>
>   File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify
>
>   File "core.pyo", line 466, in run
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll
>
>   File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent
>
>   File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus
>
>   File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__
>
>   File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache
>
>   File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container
>
>   File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 945, in findGroupboxObject
>
>   File "winUser.pyo", line 429, in getClassName
>
>
>
>






--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: useing the o c r adon on windows7, is it possable?

Quentin Christensen
 

Hi Adel,

Yes you should be able to use the OCR addon in Windows 7.  You can either get it by going to the NVDA menu, then tools then Manage add-ons then the "Get add-ons" button, or from: https://addons.nvda-project.org/index.en.html

The OCR add-on is available from this page: https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/ocr.en.html

Essentially, once setup, move to the image or PDF file (open the PDF file in Adobe reader), etc, then press NVDA+r.  From there use the review cursor to read or copy the text which was found and press escape when done.

All the review cursor keyboard shortcuts are available from the User Guide: https://www.nvaccess.org/files/nvda/documentation/userGuide.html#ReviewingText

Alternatively they are in the Basic Training for NVDA module, which also has in-depth step by step activities to help you get familiar with them (not directly with OCR though).  The good news is that the section on the review cursor is in the free sample available from: 

(Electronic text, the sample is a web page link): https://www.nvaccess.org/product/basic-training-for-nvda-ebook/
(Audio, the sample is a single MP3 which will play in your browser or you can download it.  The full course is completely marked up with DAISY): https://www.nvaccess.org/product/basic-training-for-nvda-downloadable-audio/

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 7:19 AM, Adel Spence <adelspence12@...> wrote:
hi. if I can useing the nvda o c r adin for windows7 please tell me and thanks




--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: Multi language support

Quentin Christensen
 

Hi Cristóbal,

In NVDA's voice / speech settings (press NVDA+control+v to open directly or from the NVDA menu, then preferences, then settings, then speech) are options for language.

After selecting the synthesizer to use, you can choose the voice and possibly variant.  Different synths work differently - some use voice and variant, some only have voice, some have different languages (or really it's how different sounds are pronounced so that it sounds correct in the particular language).

There are also options for automatic language and dialect switching when supported.

If a web page or document etc is setup correctly, it will identify what language it is written in, and in that case, NVDA is able to switch to the correct language automatically.

Otherwise, you can use configuration profiles to switch languages, and you can either have it setup so that it switches based on the program in use, or manually.

There is some information on configuration profiles in the User Guide: https://www.nvaccess.org/files/nvda/documentation/userGuide.html#ConfigurationProfiles 

Alternatively, it is covered in detail in the Basic Training for NVDA module, available from: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Kind regards

Quentin



On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 7:10 AM, Cristóbal <cristobalmuli@...> wrote:

Hello list,

I’m mainly a Jaws user, but fall back on NVDA for this or that reason from time to time. I’m therefore not as well versed in some aspects of the screen reader. I am thus unfamiliar with NVDA multilanguage support.

In my case, it would be American English and Mexican/Latin American Spanish from German from time to time.

Where or how does one go about enabling language switching in NVDA? Be it on the fly or to create different voice profiles and whatnot?

 

Thanks,

Cristóbal




--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: NVDA, latest alpha works much better in Win10 mail app!

Lino Morales
 

David. You posted about this when was it last week? I don’t understand what your problem was. The only problem I’v had with Mail is when I reply to a message NVDA doesn’t read out what I’m typing. When I read messages I just simply use say all with NVDA plus down arrow.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> on behalf of David Moore <jesusloves1966@...>
Sent: Monday, September 3, 2018 8:32:19 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA, latest alpha works much better in Win10 mail app!
 

Hi all!

I can’t believe what the newest Window Apps Essential’s did for the Win10 Mail app.

I have been hearing the same line repeat as I arrow down through my messages that I am about to send. I am using latest alpha version. I still have a little trouble navigating letter by letter; it says the same letter a few times, but it is so much better!

I could not make corrections at all, because I could not navigate character by character or word by word.

It is all fixed now, and I am so glad!

Do any of you notice a change in how the Win10 Mail app works?

Take care, guys!

David Moore

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


NVDA, latest alpha works much better in Win10 mail app!

David Moore
 

Hi all!

I can’t believe what the newest Window Apps Essential’s did for the Win10 Mail app.

I have been hearing the same line repeat as I arrow down through my messages that I am about to send. I am using latest alpha version. I still have a little trouble navigating letter by letter; it says the same letter a few times, but it is so much better!

I could not make corrections at all, because I could not navigate character by character or word by word.

It is all fixed now, and I am so glad!

Do any of you notice a change in how the Win10 Mail app works?

Take care, guys!

David Moore

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


Re: NVDA 2018.3 beta 3 hangs after closing System Information application

Takuya Nishimoto
 

I have reported regarding similar issue.

https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/8434

It was difficult to reproduce on other machines than the specific environment.

--
Takuya Nishimoto
nishimotz@gmail.com

2018年9月4日(火) 4:08 Jason White via Groups.Io <jason=jasonjgw.net@groups.io>:


After using System Information on Windows 10 1803 (all up to date), and closing the application with Alt+F4, I experienced a hang in NVDA 2018.3 beta 3.



The log file in my local temporary directory contains the following. Please let me know whether further details are desired, or whether it has been or should be taken up in GitHub.



WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:47:55.289):

Core frozen in stack:

File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>

File "core.pyo", line 495, in main

File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop

File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify

File "core.pyo", line 466, in run

File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll

File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue

File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback

File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent

File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus

File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject

File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__

File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache

File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 954, in findGroupboxObject

File "winUser.pyo", line 430, in getClassName



WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:48:10.339):

Core frozen in stack:

File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>

File "core.pyo", line 495, in main

File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop

File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify

File "core.pyo", line 466, in run

File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll

File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue

File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback

File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent

File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus

File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject

File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__

File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache

File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 945, in findGroupboxObject

File "winUser.pyo", line 429, in getClassName




Re: NVDA 2018.3 beta 3 hangs after closing System Information application

Quentin Christensen
 

Hi Jason,

It isn't reproducing for me, although I'm using a fast insider build of Windows here.

Two things to try:

- If you restart NVDA with add-ons disabled (press NVDA+Q then down arrow to "restart with addons disabled" and press ENTER), does it still happen?

- Particularly if the crash doesn't happen with add-ons disabled, make sure you are using the most up to date version of all your addons.  There is also an addon to check that: https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/addonUpdater.en.html

In any case, if you could send me a copy of your full NVDA log, ideally at log level debug, I can have a closer look at what is happening.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 5:08 AM, Jason White via Groups.Io <jason@...> wrote:

After using System Information on Windows 10 1803 (all up to date), and closing the application with Alt+F4, I experienced a hang in NVDA 2018.3 beta 3.

 

The log file in my local temporary directory contains the following. Please let me know whether further details are desired, or whether it has been or should be taken up in GitHub.

 

WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:47:55.289):

Core frozen in stack:

  File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>

  File "core.pyo", line 495, in main

  File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop

  File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify

  File "core.pyo", line 466, in run

  File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll

  File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus

  File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject

  File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__

  File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache

  File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container

  File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 954, in findGroupboxObject

  File "winUser.pyo", line 430, in getClassName

 

WARNING - watchdog._watcher (14:48:10.339):

Core frozen in stack:

  File "nvda.pyw", line 214, in <module>

  File "core.pyo", line 495, in main

  File "wx\core.pyo", line 2134, in MainLoop

  File "gui\__init__.pyo", line 963, in Notify

  File "core.pyo", line 466, in run

  File "queueHandler.pyo", line 83, in pumpAll

  File "queueHandler.pyo", line 50, in flushQueue

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 62, in _queueEventCallback

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 147, in executeEvent

  File "eventHandler.pyo", line 160, in doPreGainFocus

  File "api.pyo", line 107, in setFocusObject

  File "baseObject.pyo", line 34, in __get__

  File "baseObject.pyo", line 115, in _getPropertyViaCache

  File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyo", line 1579, in _get_container

  File "IAccessibleHandler.pyo", line 945, in findGroupboxObject

  File "winUser.pyo", line 429, in getClassName

 




--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: NVDA and Skype Accessability

Inam Uddin
 

Respected friend, I’m very sorry to let you know that there was no any kind of JAWS update came out on September second 2018.

The last JAWS update came out on August 21 2018.

Do you mean that one?

With regards from Inamuddin with the Skype ID:

Charlsdarwin1

 

 

You can contact me via gmail:
inamuddin09@...

Inamuddin.ronaque@...

outlook:
inam092@...

yahoo:
inamuddin2010@...

Add my Skype ID:
charlsdarwin1
Meet me on facebook:
www.facebook.com/inamuddin786

Follow me on my twitter ID:
www.twitter.com/charlsdarwin1

Call me on my cell numbers:
+92-300-2227598 

+92-334-3348409

 

 

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Monday, September 3, 2018 3:58 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA and Skype Accessability

 

I am aware that just yesterday a Jaws update came down with an update for

the new Skype for that screenreader, but Not sure what windows 7 does about

Skype as I've not been a fan of it for some time as every time microsoft

change it they break its accessibility. I'd expect more from them

considering the work they are putting into narrator on 10.

Brian

 

bglists@...

Sent via blueyonder.

Please address personal E-mail to:-

briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----

From: "Karmelo" <karm212@...>

To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

Sent: Sunday, September 02, 2018 9:51 PM

Subject: [nvda] NVDA and Skype Accessability

 

 

Hi all,

 

I am a new member of this list from Malta Europe.  I have Windows 7 and had

to upgrade to the latest version of Skype 8.22.  I would like to ask whether

there is an addon from NVDA which makes the ap accessible.

 

Thank you very much,

Charles

 

 

Charles Borg

Sliema, Malta

E:

karm212@...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


Re: NVDA and Skype Accessability

Inam Uddin
 

Yes dear, there is an addon of NVDA for Skype 8 is available.

Please visit:

http://www.dlee.org/skype/

With regards from Inamuddin with the Skype ID:

Charlsdarwin1

 

 

You can contact me via gmail:
inamuddin09@...

Inamuddin.ronaque@...

outlook:
inam092@...

yahoo:
inamuddin2010@...

Add my Skype ID:
charlsdarwin1
Meet me on facebook:
www.facebook.com/inamuddin786

Follow me on my twitter ID:
www.twitter.com/charlsdarwin1

Call me on my cell numbers:
+92-300-2227598 

+92-334-3348409

 

 

From: Karmelo
Sent: Monday, September 3, 2018 4:05 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA and Skype Accessability

 

Hi all,

 

I am a new member of this list from Malta Europe.  I have Windows 7 and had to upgrade to the latest version of Skype 8.22.  I would like to ask whether there is an addon from NVDA which makes the ap accessible.

 

Thank you very much,

Charles

 

 

Charles Borg

Sliema, Malta

E:

karm212@...

 

 

 

 

 


Re: accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

Craig
 

Hi.

In the past I have used smsit which I found very accessible and had no problems with it but haven't used it for about a year now.

Cheers
C

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Aman Singer
Sent: Tuesday, 4 September 2018 8:27 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

Hi,

First, thank you for an excellent message and explanation below. I will keep the link to it as a description of the best methods of sending SMS from Windows. Your effort is appreciated.
Permit me to add a few things to what you say below,

You write:

If you own an Android phone, you can connect it with your Windows computer so that you will be able to read and write texts on WIndows.

Besides the program you mention, there is PulseSMS http://www.pulsesms.com which I use, and https://messages.android.com/
I have heard good things about Android messages but cannot verify, from personal experience, that it is accessible. Pulse SMS is accessible through its web site though not through its windows program. The Android app is accessible with Talkback.

You write:

There are solutions to make your computer to act as a bluetooth speaker and keyboard. That way, you will be able to control your phone with your computer and make it sent texts or do anything else you'd like with it.

There are also keyboards, most popularly from Logitech, which connect to multiple devices. That is, you can have your keyboard connect to your PC and, with a key press, have that same keyboard connect to your phone. These include the k380, k480, k810 and k811 from Logitech, among others. If you have speech or braille access to your phone, you can use these boards to send SMS messages without needing to take your hands off the board or connect your computer or phone in any way. I quite realize that this isn't using Windows to send the SMS, but it may resolve the problem people are trying to solve by allowing them to use the same control device they use for their Windows machine.
Aman



,From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of mikolaj holysz
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 3:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

There are a couple ways:
1. VOIP. Someone mentioned callcentric, but I think you should look for something that works with your country so texting numbers in your country is cheap. This is very country-specific, so you won't be able to get much help here, googling and trying to figure it out on your own is your best bed.
Those solutions are usually paid (cheap, but a credit card / paypal / whatever is usually a requirement).
2. E-mail gateways: This has been suggested before but yes, gateways for services outside the US exist. This is, as well, very country specific, but Googling should help in this case too. Try Googling country find carrier of a phone number (or something similar in your language). That will let you determine where the phone number you're trying to text is.
Those services aren't 100% reliable, if it's possible to move numbers between carriers and you're trying to text a number that has been moved, it may guess the old carrier. It usually uses numbering classes to guess. Numbering classes are ranges of phone numbers assigned to your carrier for use by your country's phone authority.
After figuring out the carrier, try Googling carrier name email to sms gateway. You should find a domain that you send emails to, the address should usually look like number@domain. Those exist for most (though not all carriers). If the carrier is aMVNO (a small carrier), try Googling the carrier along with a keyword like infrastructure to figure out whose infrastructure it uses. Building mobile infrastructure is very costly, so small carriers usually use the infrastructure of bigger carriers, so it's usually possible to use their gateways. For example, the scenario may look like this:
1. you have a number 123 456 7890 and you know it's an Australian number.
2. You try Googling "find carrier of phone number Australia" and find a website.
3. You enter that number and figure out it's owned by SomeLittleCarrier.
4. You try SomeLittleCarrier sms gateway but you figure out that that carrier doesn't have a gateway.
5. You find out what infrastructure the carrier is using, it turns out they're using the infrastructure of aVeryBigCarrier.
6. You look for aVeryBigCarrier's gateway on Google and find out that their domain is gateway.averybigcarrier.au 7. You send an meail to 1234567890@gateway.averybigcarrier.au and the person gets your text.
Beware that the texts you send that way include your email address and don't come from your phone number.
It's usually hard/impossible to reply to them. Some carriers provide sms to email gateways too, again, Google is your friend.

3. Windows and Android.
If you own an Android phone, you can connect it with your Windows computer so that you will be able to read and write texts on WIndows.
Those texts will then go through your phone and will be automatically send to wherever you wanted them to go. The recipient will not know that you've sent them from your computer, as they will come from your phone number. Normal fees for texting will apply, as it will be your phone sending the texts, your computer will only tell it what to send. Of course for that to work, your phone needs to be connected to the Internet.
The apps to do this are usually not very accessible but there's a really good solution called GTalk SMS. It's a bit hard to set up but if you / someone else needs assistance, reach me by email privately and I can provide help.

4. Connecting your phone to your computer. There are solutions to make your computer to act as a bluetooth speaker and keyboard. That way, you will be able to control your phone with your computer and make it sent texts or do anything else you'd like with it. I haven't tried the Bluetooth Keyboard part yet but I may if there's interest. That's the only solution that might work with the iPhone.

If you have an iPhone and want to send texts via an app, not by emulating a bt keyboard on your computer, and also want the texts to come from your number, you will need to get a mac.

I hope that answered all questions you might've had.



W dniu 2018-08-30 o 15:33, Dan Beaver pisze:
Hi,


I have been looking into doing this. However, there are so many
choices I am uncertain which to choose.


Has anyone else figured out any of the apps and services that are
accessible using NVDA to do SMS texting from a Windows system? If so
which are accessible and easy to use?


Thanks.


Dan Beaver


Re: accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

Aman Singer
 

Hi,

The problem came in version 2.x of the Pulse program for Windows. I reported it to the author
https://github.com/klinker-apps/messenger-issues/issues/644
and was told that nothing would be done though he seemingly understood the issue.
Aman

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tyler Wood
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 7:23 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

Hi Aman,

It has been a while since I used pulse, so things very well may have changed.

I recall only doing it once, so yes, now that you have to do it repeatedly, I would say stick with the chrome extension or app, whatever they are calling it these days.


I'd be curious how android messages works, too.



On 03-Sep-2018 7:20 PM, Aman Singer wrote:
Hi Tyler,


If I may ask, do you recall what you did the first time to make the newest version of pulse accessible? I was able to get into the web container with the simulated mouse click, but whenever I had to close the window, I would have to take the same steps again once I reopened it. That is, whenever I got or wanted to send a text message, I would have to object nav, activate an object inside the window, possibly click inside the window, and finally read and write the messages. I don't think this accessible, it takes too long to take these steps every time, though it is not a problem to do it once. How did you manage to make it keep working after the first time?
BTW, just to correct something, the site I gave out for Pulsesms was
wrong. I gave pulsesms.com. The actual site is http://pulsesms.app
Aman

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Tyler Wood
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 7:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

Hi,

The windows program of Pulse SMS is accessible over here with NVDA. It opens in a web looking container which can be opened from the desktop.
It also provides notifications in the notification center for texts received.

I believe it required a bit of fiddling with object nav the first go round as well as a simulated mouse click with capslock enter.

Hope that helps!


On 03-Sep-2018 6:57 PM, Aman Singer wrote:
Hi,

First, thank you for an excellent message and explanation below. I will keep the link to it as a description of the best methods of sending SMS from Windows. Your effort is appreciated.
Permit me to add a few things to what you say below,

You write:

If you own an Android phone, you can connect it with your Windows computer so that you will be able to read and write texts on WIndows.

Besides the program you mention, there is PulseSMS
http://www.pulsesms.com which I use, and https://messages.android.com/
I have heard good things about Android messages but cannot verify, from personal experience, that it is accessible. Pulse SMS is accessible through its web site though not through its windows program. The Android app is accessible with Talkback.

You write:

There are solutions to make your computer to act as a bluetooth speaker and keyboard. That way, you will be able to control your phone with your computer and make it sent texts or do anything else you'd like with it.

There are also keyboards, most popularly from Logitech, which connect to multiple devices. That is, you can have your keyboard connect to your PC and, with a key press, have that same keyboard connect to your phone. These include the k380, k480, k810 and k811 from Logitech, among others. If you have speech or braille access to your phone, you can use these boards to send SMS messages without needing to take your hands off the board or connect your computer or phone in any way. I quite realize that this isn't using Windows to send the SMS, but it may resolve the problem people are trying to solve by allowing them to use the same control device they use for their Windows machine.
Aman



,From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
mikolaj holysz
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 3:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

There are a couple ways:
1. VOIP. Someone mentioned callcentric, but I think you should look for something that works with your country so texting numbers in your country is cheap. This is very country-specific, so you won't be able to get much help here, googling and trying to figure it out on your own is your best bed.
Those solutions are usually paid (cheap, but a credit card / paypal / whatever is usually a requirement).
2. E-mail gateways: This has been suggested before but yes, gateways for services outside the US exist. This is, as well, very country specific, but Googling should help in this case too. Try Googling country find carrier of a phone number (or something similar in your language). That will let you determine where the phone number you're trying to text is.
Those services aren't 100% reliable, if it's possible to move numbers between carriers and you're trying to text a number that has been moved, it may guess the old carrier. It usually uses numbering classes to guess. Numbering classes are ranges of phone numbers assigned to your carrier for use by your country's phone authority.
After figuring out the carrier, try Googling carrier name email to sms gateway. You should find a domain that you send emails to, the address should usually look like number@domain. Those exist for most (though not all carriers). If the carrier is aMVNO (a small carrier), try Googling the carrier along with a keyword like infrastructure to figure out whose infrastructure it uses. Building mobile infrastructure is very costly, so small carriers usually use the infrastructure of bigger carriers, so it's usually possible to use their gateways. For example, the scenario may look like this:
1. you have a number 123 456 7890 and you know it's an Australian number.
2. You try Googling "find carrier of phone number Australia" and find a website.
3. You enter that number and figure out it's owned by SomeLittleCarrier.
4. You try SomeLittleCarrier sms gateway but you figure out that that carrier doesn't have a gateway.
5. You find out what infrastructure the carrier is using, it turns out they're using the infrastructure of aVeryBigCarrier.
6. You look for aVeryBigCarrier's gateway on Google and find out that their domain is gateway.averybigcarrier.au 7. You send an meail to 1234567890@gateway.averybigcarrier.au and the person gets your text.
Beware that the texts you send that way include your email address and don't come from your phone number.
It's usually hard/impossible to reply to them. Some carriers provide sms to email gateways too, again, Google is your friend.

3. Windows and Android.
If you own an Android phone, you can connect it with your Windows computer so that you will be able to read and write texts on WIndows.
Those texts will then go through your phone and will be automatically send to wherever you wanted them to go. The recipient will not know that you've sent them from your computer, as they will come from your phone number. Normal fees for texting will apply, as it will be your phone sending the texts, your computer will only tell it what to send. Of course for that to work, your phone needs to be connected to the Internet.
The apps to do this are usually not very accessible but there's a really good solution called GTalk SMS. It's a bit hard to set up but if you / someone else needs assistance, reach me by email privately and I can provide help.

4. Connecting your phone to your computer. There are solutions to make your computer to act as a bluetooth speaker and keyboard. That way, you will be able to control your phone with your computer and make it sent texts or do anything else you'd like with it. I haven't tried the Bluetooth Keyboard part yet but I may if there's interest. That's the only solution that might work with the iPhone.

If you have an iPhone and want to send texts via an app, not by emulating a bt keyboard on your computer, and also want the texts to come from your number, you will need to get a mac.

I hope that answered all questions you might've had.



W dniu 2018-08-30 o 15:33, Dan Beaver pisze:
Hi,


I have been looking into doing this. However, there are so many
choices I am uncertain which to choose.


Has anyone else figured out any of the apps and services that are
accessible using NVDA to do SMS texting from a Windows system? If
so which are accessible and easy to use?


Thanks.


Dan Beaver











Re: accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

Tyler Wood
 

Hi Aman,

It has been a while since I used pulse, so things very well may have changed.

I recall only doing it once, so yes, now that you have to do it repeatedly, I would say stick with the chrome extension or app, whatever they are calling it these days.


I'd be curious how android messages works, too.

On 03-Sep-2018 7:20 PM, Aman Singer wrote:
Hi Tyler,


If I may ask, do you recall what you did the first time to make the newest version of pulse accessible? I was able to get into the web container with the simulated mouse click, but whenever I had to close the window, I would have to take the same steps again once I reopened it. That is, whenever I got or wanted to send a text message, I would have to object nav, activate an object inside the window, possibly click inside the window, and finally read and write the messages. I don't think this accessible, it takes too long to take these steps every time, though it is not a problem to do it once. How did you manage to make it keep working after the first time?
BTW, just to correct something, the site I gave out for Pulsesms was wrong. I gave pulsesms.com. The actual site is
http://pulsesms.app
Aman
-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tyler Wood
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 7:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

Hi,

The windows program of Pulse SMS is accessible over here with NVDA. It opens in a web looking container which can be opened from the desktop.
It also provides notifications in the notification center for texts received.

I believe it required a bit of fiddling with object nav the first go round as well as a simulated mouse click with capslock enter.

Hope that helps!


On 03-Sep-2018 6:57 PM, Aman Singer wrote:
Hi,

First, thank you for an excellent message and explanation below. I will keep the link to it as a description of the best methods of sending SMS from Windows. Your effort is appreciated.
Permit me to add a few things to what you say below,

You write:

If you own an Android phone, you can connect it with your Windows computer so that you will be able to read and write texts on WIndows.

Besides the program you mention, there is PulseSMS
http://www.pulsesms.com which I use, and https://messages.android.com/
I have heard good things about Android messages but cannot verify, from personal experience, that it is accessible. Pulse SMS is accessible through its web site though not through its windows program. The Android app is accessible with Talkback.

You write:

There are solutions to make your computer to act as a bluetooth speaker and keyboard. That way, you will be able to control your phone with your computer and make it sent texts or do anything else you'd like with it.

There are also keyboards, most popularly from Logitech, which connect to multiple devices. That is, you can have your keyboard connect to your PC and, with a key press, have that same keyboard connect to your phone. These include the k380, k480, k810 and k811 from Logitech, among others. If you have speech or braille access to your phone, you can use these boards to send SMS messages without needing to take your hands off the board or connect your computer or phone in any way. I quite realize that this isn't using Windows to send the SMS, but it may resolve the problem people are trying to solve by allowing them to use the same control device they use for their Windows machine.
Aman


,From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
mikolaj holysz
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 3:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

There are a couple ways:
1. VOIP. Someone mentioned callcentric, but I think you should look for something that works with your country so texting numbers in your country is cheap. This is very country-specific, so you won't be able to get much help here, googling and trying to figure it out on your own is your best bed.
Those solutions are usually paid (cheap, but a credit card / paypal / whatever is usually a requirement).
2. E-mail gateways: This has been suggested before but yes, gateways for services outside the US exist. This is, as well, very country specific, but Googling should help in this case too. Try Googling country find carrier of a phone number (or something similar in your language). That will let you determine where the phone number you're trying to text is.
Those services aren't 100% reliable, if it's possible to move numbers between carriers and you're trying to text a number that has been moved, it may guess the old carrier. It usually uses numbering classes to guess. Numbering classes are ranges of phone numbers assigned to your carrier for use by your country's phone authority.
After figuring out the carrier, try Googling carrier name email to sms gateway. You should find a domain that you send emails to, the address should usually look like number@domain. Those exist for most (though not all carriers). If the carrier is aMVNO (a small carrier), try Googling the carrier along with a keyword like infrastructure to figure out whose infrastructure it uses. Building mobile infrastructure is very costly, so small carriers usually use the infrastructure of bigger carriers, so it's usually possible to use their gateways. For example, the scenario may look like this:
1. you have a number 123 456 7890 and you know it's an Australian number.
2. You try Googling "find carrier of phone number Australia" and find a website.
3. You enter that number and figure out it's owned by SomeLittleCarrier.
4. You try SomeLittleCarrier sms gateway but you figure out that that carrier doesn't have a gateway.
5. You find out what infrastructure the carrier is using, it turns out they're using the infrastructure of aVeryBigCarrier.
6. You look for aVeryBigCarrier's gateway on Google and find out that their domain is gateway.averybigcarrier.au 7. You send an meail to 1234567890@gateway.averybigcarrier.au and the person gets your text.
Beware that the texts you send that way include your email address and don't come from your phone number.
It's usually hard/impossible to reply to them. Some carriers provide sms to email gateways too, again, Google is your friend.

3. Windows and Android.
If you own an Android phone, you can connect it with your Windows computer so that you will be able to read and write texts on WIndows.
Those texts will then go through your phone and will be automatically send to wherever you wanted them to go. The recipient will not know that you've sent them from your computer, as they will come from your phone number. Normal fees for texting will apply, as it will be your phone sending the texts, your computer will only tell it what to send. Of course for that to work, your phone needs to be connected to the Internet.
The apps to do this are usually not very accessible but there's a really good solution called GTalk SMS. It's a bit hard to set up but if you / someone else needs assistance, reach me by email privately and I can provide help.

4. Connecting your phone to your computer. There are solutions to make your computer to act as a bluetooth speaker and keyboard. That way, you will be able to control your phone with your computer and make it sent texts or do anything else you'd like with it. I haven't tried the Bluetooth Keyboard part yet but I may if there's interest. That's the only solution that might work with the iPhone.

If you have an iPhone and want to send texts via an app, not by emulating a bt keyboard on your computer, and also want the texts to come from your number, you will need to get a mac.

I hope that answered all questions you might've had.



W dniu 2018-08-30 o 15:33, Dan Beaver pisze:
Hi,


I have been looking into doing this. However, there are so many
choices I am uncertain which to choose.


Has anyone else figured out any of the apps and services that are
accessible using NVDA to do SMS texting from a Windows system? If
so which are accessible and easy to use?


Thanks.


Dan Beaver










Re: accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

Aman Singer
 

Hi Tyler,


If I may ask, do you recall what you did the first time to make the newest version of pulse accessible? I was able to get into the web container with the simulated mouse click, but whenever I had to close the window, I would have to take the same steps again once I reopened it. That is, whenever I got or wanted to send a text message, I would have to object nav, activate an object inside the window, possibly click inside the window, and finally read and write the messages. I don't think this accessible, it takes too long to take these steps every time, though it is not a problem to do it once. How did you manage to make it keep working after the first time?
BTW, just to correct something, the site I gave out for Pulsesms was wrong. I gave pulsesms.com. The actual site is
http://pulsesms.app
Aman

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tyler Wood
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 7:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

Hi,

The windows program of Pulse SMS is accessible over here with NVDA. It opens in a web looking container which can be opened from the desktop.
It also provides notifications in the notification center for texts received.

I believe it required a bit of fiddling with object nav the first go round as well as a simulated mouse click with capslock enter.

Hope that helps!


On 03-Sep-2018 6:57 PM, Aman Singer wrote:
Hi,

First, thank you for an excellent message and explanation below. I will keep the link to it as a description of the best methods of sending SMS from Windows. Your effort is appreciated.
Permit me to add a few things to what you say below,

You write:

If you own an Android phone, you can connect it with your Windows computer so that you will be able to read and write texts on WIndows.

Besides the program you mention, there is PulseSMS
http://www.pulsesms.com which I use, and https://messages.android.com/
I have heard good things about Android messages but cannot verify, from personal experience, that it is accessible. Pulse SMS is accessible through its web site though not through its windows program. The Android app is accessible with Talkback.

You write:

There are solutions to make your computer to act as a bluetooth speaker and keyboard. That way, you will be able to control your phone with your computer and make it sent texts or do anything else you'd like with it.

There are also keyboards, most popularly from Logitech, which connect to multiple devices. That is, you can have your keyboard connect to your PC and, with a key press, have that same keyboard connect to your phone. These include the k380, k480, k810 and k811 from Logitech, among others. If you have speech or braille access to your phone, you can use these boards to send SMS messages without needing to take your hands off the board or connect your computer or phone in any way. I quite realize that this isn't using Windows to send the SMS, but it may resolve the problem people are trying to solve by allowing them to use the same control device they use for their Windows machine.
Aman



,From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
mikolaj holysz
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 3:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] accessible sms texting from windows with NVDA

There are a couple ways:
1. VOIP. Someone mentioned callcentric, but I think you should look for something that works with your country so texting numbers in your country is cheap. This is very country-specific, so you won't be able to get much help here, googling and trying to figure it out on your own is your best bed.
Those solutions are usually paid (cheap, but a credit card / paypal / whatever is usually a requirement).
2. E-mail gateways: This has been suggested before but yes, gateways for services outside the US exist. This is, as well, very country specific, but Googling should help in this case too. Try Googling country find carrier of a phone number (or something similar in your language). That will let you determine where the phone number you're trying to text is.
Those services aren't 100% reliable, if it's possible to move numbers between carriers and you're trying to text a number that has been moved, it may guess the old carrier. It usually uses numbering classes to guess. Numbering classes are ranges of phone numbers assigned to your carrier for use by your country's phone authority.
After figuring out the carrier, try Googling carrier name email to sms gateway. You should find a domain that you send emails to, the address should usually look like number@domain. Those exist for most (though not all carriers). If the carrier is aMVNO (a small carrier), try Googling the carrier along with a keyword like infrastructure to figure out whose infrastructure it uses. Building mobile infrastructure is very costly, so small carriers usually use the infrastructure of bigger carriers, so it's usually possible to use their gateways. For example, the scenario may look like this:
1. you have a number 123 456 7890 and you know it's an Australian number.
2. You try Googling "find carrier of phone number Australia" and find a website.
3. You enter that number and figure out it's owned by SomeLittleCarrier.
4. You try SomeLittleCarrier sms gateway but you figure out that that carrier doesn't have a gateway.
5. You find out what infrastructure the carrier is using, it turns out they're using the infrastructure of aVeryBigCarrier.
6. You look for aVeryBigCarrier's gateway on Google and find out that their domain is gateway.averybigcarrier.au 7. You send an meail to 1234567890@gateway.averybigcarrier.au and the person gets your text.
Beware that the texts you send that way include your email address and don't come from your phone number.
It's usually hard/impossible to reply to them. Some carriers provide sms to email gateways too, again, Google is your friend.

3. Windows and Android.
If you own an Android phone, you can connect it with your Windows computer so that you will be able to read and write texts on WIndows.
Those texts will then go through your phone and will be automatically send to wherever you wanted them to go. The recipient will not know that you've sent them from your computer, as they will come from your phone number. Normal fees for texting will apply, as it will be your phone sending the texts, your computer will only tell it what to send. Of course for that to work, your phone needs to be connected to the Internet.
The apps to do this are usually not very accessible but there's a really good solution called GTalk SMS. It's a bit hard to set up but if you / someone else needs assistance, reach me by email privately and I can provide help.

4. Connecting your phone to your computer. There are solutions to make your computer to act as a bluetooth speaker and keyboard. That way, you will be able to control your phone with your computer and make it sent texts or do anything else you'd like with it. I haven't tried the Bluetooth Keyboard part yet but I may if there's interest. That's the only solution that might work with the iPhone.

If you have an iPhone and want to send texts via an app, not by emulating a bt keyboard on your computer, and also want the texts to come from your number, you will need to get a mac.

I hope that answered all questions you might've had.



W dniu 2018-08-30 o 15:33, Dan Beaver pisze:
Hi,


I have been looking into doing this. However, there are so many
choices I am uncertain which to choose.


Has anyone else figured out any of the apps and services that are
accessible using NVDA to do SMS texting from a Windows system? If
so which are accessible and easy to use?


Thanks.


Dan Beaver