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Re: more and more unlabeled links with latest version of NVDA and Firefox
On Thu, Dec 27, 2018 at 11:56 AM, Gene wrote:
U is intended for sites you have visited before and you only want to see links you haven't gone to before.U is intended to visit only links that one has previously not visited - unvisited links, regardless of whether you've visited a site before or not. It's perfectly appropriate to use when one knows one is visiting a site for the first time and, in that case, is directly analogous with K. It is only if one is visiting a site one has been to before, and in addition followed links there, where there is any distinction between visited and unvisited links. -- Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763 A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep. ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back
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Re: more and more unlabeled links with latest version of NVDA and Firefox
Gene
If you move by k or tab through the links, the
second link is read. If you down arrow through the links or use the links
list, you just hear link spoken. This is using the default settings for
object presentation and document presentation. I don't know if there is a
setting you can change that makes this consistent.
Whatever the case, this is probably what users
generally will encounter. I've seen this on some other links where I get
more information by tabbing or using k.
Gene
----- Original Message
-----
From: Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 10:01 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest
version of NVDA and Firefox We don't know if the problem occurs in other places than the elements list. However, It is unlikely that this problem is confined to the elements list. it probably affects the links wherever you see them.You are probably correct. One site, simplecast.com, has been identified and it does occur there. It's the second link, and only one that comes up "unlabeled" in the links list, on the page, so it's easy to get to. In the case of this page if one is traversing via the U keyboard shortcut what gets announced when you land on the link is the title from the HTML, "Simplecast on Twitter." The larger the sample size of pages where this is occurring the better, but that's what I was able to get from about 5 minutes total time testing on that page with the latest version of NVDA with a number of add-ons installed. If someone gets something different with a pristine portable version of NVDA, an older version of NVDA, or an installed current NVDA with no add-ons that would certainly give more data points useful to the developers, but those tests aren't something I'll be doing. -- Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763 A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep. ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back
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Re: more and more unlabeled links with latest version of NVDA and Firefox
Gene
Why use the u navigationk key? That is to
move by unvisited links. it has a very specific use and shouldn't be used
for general link navigation. K or tab should be used.
U is intended for sites you have visited before and
you only want to see links you haven't gone to before.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 10:01 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest
version of NVDA and Firefox We don't know if the problem occurs in other places than the elements list. However, It is unlikely that this problem is confined to the elements list. it probably affects the links wherever you see them.You are probably correct. One site, simplecast.com, has been identified and it does occur there. It's the second link, and only one that comes up "unlabeled" in the links list, on the page, so it's easy to get to. In the case of this page if one is traversing via the U keyboard shortcut what gets announced when you land on the link is the title from the HTML, "Simplecast on Twitter." The larger the sample size of pages where this is occurring the better, but that's what I was able to get from about 5 minutes total time testing on that page with the latest version of NVDA with a number of add-ons installed. If someone gets something different with a pristine portable version of NVDA, an older version of NVDA, or an installed current NVDA with no add-ons that would certainly give more data points useful to the developers, but those tests aren't something I'll be doing. -- Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763 A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep. ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back
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Re: more and more unlabeled links with latest version of NVDA and Firefox
Gene
That may be, but we can't see if your problem is a
general one or just yours without more information.
We need addresses to web pages where this happens
and we need to know certain things.
What browser are you using? Have you seen the
problem in different browsers? You may have stated the version of Windows
you are using but if you did I don't remember. Have you seen the problem
on more than one computer? Those are the questions that come to mind
now.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Mallard
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 9:48 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest
version of NVDA and Firefox In my case, the issue has been present for quite some time. At least a couple of years on the first sites where I noticed it, so I don't suppose it's a question of newer versions of NVDA. In 2016 they were like this, and so they are today, only there are more instances of that. Ciao, Ollie Il 27/12/2018 15:27, Gene ha scritto: > But no one has said that they tested any of these sites using older > versions of NVDA where the links were read. I have older versions > here. If someone will send specific pages where such problems occur, > they can be checked by me and/or others. > At this point, we don't know if the problem is the sites, which may or > may not have changed, or NVDA, which may or may not have changed. > Gene > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Mallard <mailto:mallard@...> > *Sent:* Thursday, December 27, 2018 8:07 AM > *To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> > *Subject:* Re: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest > version of NVDA and Firefox > > Hey all, > > > I do find such links more and more often too, but my understanding was > that this issue was due to the type of template the site designers or > webmasters used to build the sites. > > > There are lots of sites (a growing number, I'd say), where you hear > "Link", "Link", "Link", but you have to click on them to discover where > they take you. > > > It definitely isn't a Firefox issue, as I find the very same situation > in Chrome. > > > Ciao, > > Ollie > > > > > Il 27/12/2018 10:40, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io ha scritto: > > Whenever funny things occur its often a good thing to have a pristine > > portable copy of nvda with no add ons in it to check against before > > bringing up an issue that might be a clash of add ons or settings > > choices too. > > Brian > > > > bglists@... <mailto:bglists@...> > > Sent via blueyonder. > > Please address personal E-mail to:- > > briang1@... <mailto:briang1@...>, putting > 'Brian Gaff' > > in the display name field. > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris via Groups.Io" > > <chrismedley@... > <mailto:chrismedley@...>> > > To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>> > > Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 9:04 AM > > Subject: Re: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest version > > of NVDA and Firefox > > > > > > Maybe you should clarify by what you mean by unlabelled links??? > > > > > > What links are unlabelled ? > > All those sites you mentioned appear to be fine here with latest nvda > > 18.4 > > > > What is nvda not doing for you what its doing for others? > > > > Or what do you want nvda to do ? > > > > > > > > From: Governor staten > > Sent: 27 December 2018 03:48 > > To: nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> > > Subject: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest version of > > NVDA and Firefox > > > > Hello list. My subject line aptly describes the issue. Recently, I’ve > > seen more sites with unlabeled links than I’ve seen in recent memory, > > or ever before. I’ve seen them on paypal.com, yetcast.simplecast.fm > > Simplecast.com, and other places. Why is this? I’m using latest > > version of NVDA with latest version of Firefox, version 64. Will have > > to do more testing to see if this occurs in Edge and Chrome. Any ideas > > as to how to troubleshoot would be appreciated. > > > > An extra point of information, I am running the latest alpha. My > > roommate is running the latest stable version, 2018.4, along with same > > version of Firefox. He is seeing some of the same things I am, > > particularly on Simplecast.com and yetcast.simplecast.fm. Thanks to > > all in advance for any assistance that can be given. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
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Re: more and more unlabeled links with latest version of NVDA and Firefox
On Thu, Dec 27, 2018 at 09:29 AM, Gene wrote:
We don't know if the problem occurs in other places than the elements list. However, It is unlikely that this problem is confined to the elements list. it probably affects the links wherever you see them.You are probably correct. One site, simplecast.com, has been identified and it does occur there. It's the second link, and only one that comes up "unlabeled" in the links list, on the page, so it's easy to get to. In the case of this page if one is traversing via the U keyboard shortcut what gets announced when you land on the link is the title from the HTML, "Simplecast on Twitter." The larger the sample size of pages where this is occurring the better, but that's what I was able to get from about 5 minutes total time testing on that page with the latest version of NVDA with a number of add-ons installed. If someone gets something different with a pristine portable version of NVDA, an older version of NVDA, or an installed current NVDA with no add-ons that would certainly give more data points useful to the developers, but those tests aren't something I'll be doing. -- Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763 A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep. ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back
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Re: more and more unlabeled links with latest version of NVDA and Firefox
Mallard
Hello Gene,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
In my case, the issue has been present for quite some time. At least a couple of years on the first sites where I noticed it, so I don't suppose it's a question of newer versions of NVDA. In 2016 they were like this, and so they are today, only there are more instances of that. Ciao, Ollie
Il 27/12/2018 15:27, Gene ha scritto:
But no one has said that they tested any of these sites using older versions of NVDA where the links were read. I have older versions here. If someone will send specific pages where such problems occur, they can be checked by me and/or others.
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Re: Microsoft messes up again with an update.
John,
It may not be Microsoft. What make/model is your laptop and, more specifically, what Bluetooth or WiFi/Bluetooth combo card does it have? Intel has just been releasing "modern drivers" for that hardware and your machine may need to be updated to it. There are just way too many variables and unknowns to have a definitive answer, or even a decent guess. -- Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763 A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep. ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back
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Re: phonetic spelling
Hi, Hmmm, I see what’s happening. If I’m reading your post correctly, it looks like there is a bigger issue than letting NVDA pronounce characters phonetically. But to cut to the chase (as they say), the actual command to get NVDA to say the character phonetically is Numpad 2 (laptop: NVDA+period) twice. I think the reason why Giles might be mentioning object navigation and its “relationship” to character spelling and phonetic pronunciation might be confusing object navigation for review cursor thanks to our recent discussion. Am I correct? If yes, it looks like I’ll write up another tutorial (or two) on what exactly review cursor is, review modes, and possible confusion (taking Gene’s advice into account). Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Giles Turnbull
Hi all,
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Re: phonetic spelling
Tyler Spivey
You clearly didn't try pressing read word three times. Try that and see
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
what happens. You might also want to try read character twice. Both of these should do what you want. Read line three times also does it.
On 12/27/2018 7:04 AM, Giles Turnbull wrote:
Hi all,
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phonetic spelling
Hi all,
I thought there was a way to use object navigation to read letters using the NATO phonetic alphabet (alpha, bravo, juliet etc) but I can't figure out if I'm making that up! The only thing in the NVDA guide about phonetic spellings is in regard to Chinese characters. I know that using Num Pad 5 twice will spell out the word w-o-r-d and three times coppies the word to the clipboard, but is there any way to get the phonetic identification? The two SAPI5 voices I like are Zira and Hazel ... Zira is my default but I was struggling to tell whether a letter in somebody's name was a v or a b ... I hoped to figure out how to get NVDA to say Victor or Bravo, but without success. I solved the problem by switching to the Hazel voice which has a clearer pronunciation difference between v and b, but am just curious if there is a way to get the phonetic spelling if needed. Thanks, Giles
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Microsoft messes up again with an update.
John J. Boyer
My laptop will no longer send Braille to my Focus 40 via Bluetooth. Things were working fine when the machine started
to misbehave. After a cold boot it wouldn't give me anything. I think the update destroyed the pairing between the computer and the Focus 40. Microsoft did the same thing a few weeks ago. John -- John J. Boyer Email: john.boyer@abilitiessoft.org website: http://www.abilitiessoft.org Status: Company dissolved but website and email addresses live. Location: Madison, Wisconsin, USA Mission: developing assistive technology software and providing STEM services that are available at no cost
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Re: Graphics that contain links
Gene
I should say its on the web page of the petition
you want to sign.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Beasley
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 8:38 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Graphics that contain links I can’t find any button. I am using Windows mail
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
From: Chris via
Groups.Io
Look for the sign button rather than a graphic, it works fine
From: Peter
Beasley
There is a petition site here in the UK called 38 degrees. Until a couple of months ago, there was no problem clicking on links to sign petitions. They have changed the link to a graphic. What it says is graphic wrecked angle contains link. I am unable to find a way to activate these links using NVDA which is my only screen reader..
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
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Re: Any available tutorial on Golden Cursor
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Lino Morales
Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2018 9:32 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] Any available tutorial on Golden Cursor
Don’t quote me on this, but I believe Joseph did make an audio tutorial or a written one on his site which he’d have to provide the URL.
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> on behalf of Sim Kah Yong <simkahyong@...>
Hi all,
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Re: Graphics that contain links
Gene
The button is on the web page of the petition you
want to send.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Beasley
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 8:38 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Graphics that contain links I can’t find any button. I am using Windows mail
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
From: Chris via
Groups.Io
Look for the sign button rather than a graphic, it works fine
From: Peter
Beasley
There is a petition site here in the UK called 38 degrees. Until a couple of months ago, there was no problem clicking on links to sign petitions. They have changed the link to a graphic. What it says is graphic wrecked angle contains link. I am unable to find a way to activate these links using NVDA which is my only screen reader..
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
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Re: Graphics that contain links
Chris
Ahh, I thought you meant the site itself Try going to the website rather than using email links
From: Peter Beasley
Sent: 27 December 2018 14:38 To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] Graphics that contain links
I can’t find any button. I am using Windows mail
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
From: Chris via Groups.Io
Look for the sign button rather than a graphic, it works fine
From: Peter Beasley
There is a petition site here in the UK called 38 degrees. Until a couple of months ago, there was no problem clicking on links to sign petitions. They have changed the link to a graphic. What it says is graphic wrecked angle contains link. I am unable to find a way to activate these links using NVDA which is my only screen reader..
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
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Re: Graphics that contain links
Peter Beasley
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
From: Chris via Groups.Io
Sent: 27 December 2018 14:18 To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] Graphics that contain links
Look for the sign button rather than a graphic, it works fine
From: Peter Beasley
There is a petition site here in the UK called 38 degrees. Until a couple of months ago, there was no problem clicking on links to sign petitions. They have changed the link to a graphic. What it says is graphic wrecked angle contains link. I am unable to find a way to activate these links using NVDA which is my only screen reader..
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
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Re: more and more unlabeled links with latest version of NVDA and Firefox
Gene
We don't know if the problem occurs in other places
than the elements list. However, It is unlikely that this problem is
confined to the elements list. it probably affects the links wherever you
see them.
Gene
----- original Message -----
From: Chris via Groups.Io
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 8:21 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest
version of NVDA and Firefox Don’t use the elements list then its that simple
From: Brian
Vogel
On Thu, Dec 27, 2018 at 04:04 AM, Chris wrote:
Uh, they show up in the elements list of links as
"unlabeled." It's that simple. Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763 A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep. ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back
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Re: more and more unlabeled links with latest version of NVDA and Firefox
Gene
But no one has said that they tested any of these
sites using older versions of NVDA where the links were read. I have older
versions here. If someone will send specific pages where such problems
occur, they can be checked by me and/or others.
At this point, we don't know if the problem is the
sites, which may or may not have changed, or NVDA, which may or may not have
changed.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Mallard
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 8:07 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest
version of NVDA and Firefox I do find such links more and more often too, but my understanding was that this issue was due to the type of template the site designers or webmasters used to build the sites. There are lots of sites (a growing number, I'd say), where you hear "Link", "Link", "Link", but you have to click on them to discover where they take you. It definitely isn't a Firefox issue, as I find the very same situation in Chrome. Ciao, Ollie Il 27/12/2018 10:40, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io ha scritto: > Whenever funny things occur its often a good thing to have a pristine > portable copy of nvda with no add ons in it to check against before > bringing up an issue that might be a clash of add ons or settings > choices too. > Brian > > bglists@... > Sent via blueyonder. > Please address personal E-mail to:- > briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff' > in the display name field. > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris via Groups.Io" > <chrismedley@...> > To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io> > Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 9:04 AM > Subject: Re: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest version > of NVDA and Firefox > > > Maybe you should clarify by what you mean by unlabelled links??? > > > What links are unlabelled ? > All those sites you mentioned appear to be fine here with latest nvda > 18.4 > > What is nvda not doing for you what its doing for others? > > Or what do you want nvda to do ? > > > > From: Governor staten > Sent: 27 December 2018 03:48 > To: nvda@nvda.groups.io > Subject: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest version of > NVDA and Firefox > > Hello list. My subject line aptly describes the issue. Recently, I’ve > seen more sites with unlabeled links than I’ve seen in recent memory, > or ever before. I’ve seen them on paypal.com, yetcast.simplecast.fm > Simplecast.com, and other places. Why is this? I’m using latest > version of NVDA with latest version of Firefox, version 64. Will have > to do more testing to see if this occurs in Edge and Chrome. Any ideas > as to how to troubleshoot would be appreciated. > > An extra point of information, I am running the latest alpha. My > roommate is running the latest stable version, 2018.4, along with same > version of Firefox. He is seeing some of the same things I am, > particularly on Simplecast.com and yetcast.simplecast.fm. Thanks to > all in advance for any assistance that can be given. > > > > > > > > > >
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Re: more and more unlabeled links with latest version of NVDA and Firefox
Chris
Don’t use the elements list then its that simple
From: Brian Vogel
Sent: 27 December 2018 14:00 To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] more and more unlabeled links with latest version of NVDA and Firefox
On Thu, Dec 27, 2018 at 04:04 AM, Chris wrote:
Uh, they show up in the elements list of links as "unlabeled." It's that simple. Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763 A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep. ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back
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Re: Graphics that contain links
Chris
Look for the sign button rather than a graphic, it works fine
From: Peter Beasley
Sent: 27 December 2018 12:39 To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: [nvda] Graphics that contain links
There is a petition site here in the UK called 38 degrees. Until a couple of months ago, there was no problem clicking on links to sign petitions. They have changed the link to a graphic. What it says is graphic wrecked angle contains link. I am unable to find a way to activate these links using NVDA which is my only screen reader..
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
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