Date   

Re: NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

Sarah k Alawami
 

In my case I never move my left hand when using capslock. But my fingers are very very long so I can do that.

Take care

On 21 Jan 2019, at 12:45, Gene wrote:

I think its because you are used to that method.  I very much doubt that for a regular numpad user, there is any loss of efficiency.  And if you use caps lock, you are still moving your left hand away from the home keys.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Cristóbal
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2019 12:06 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

With Jaws, I always enable the laptop keyboard layout, be it for my desktops or laptops. Indeed, I do use the numpad and arrow keys for commands, but having the ability to use the same navigational commands on the main keyboard itself as well proves to be a huge efficiency booster and time saver.

I.E. commands such as capslock+N, comma or period for previous character, current character, next character. Capslock+ J, K or L for previous word, current word and next word. Capslock+ U, I or O for previous line, current line and next line. Same for paragraph and sentence, etc.

Again, it’s not that switching back and forth between the main keyboard to either the arrow keys or numpad is especially burdensome, but depending on what you may be doing multiplied by hundreds of times in a day, thee navigational commands via the laptop keyboard layout just feels like a more efficient process of getting things done.

The only command I came across for anything similar with NVDA is the capslock+L command for say current line. It doesn’t seem like there are too many NVDA keystroke commands that make use of the capslock+ the letters on the keyboard. Thus my query if I was in fact missing something and there were in fact keystroke commands beyond this one command or an add-on that expanded on this capability.

So yes, I am well aware of all the various numpad navigational commands as well as using the four arrow keys, but my question was on whether these same commands could also be replicated via the main keyboard. Just use the numpad or arrow keys really doesn’t address my question. If there is in fact not a current means of doing this either through a built in function in NVDA itself or through an add-on, then that would also be good to know.

 

Cristóbal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 10:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

Are you saying you want to use movement commands where you use keyboard commands for movement in JAWS that duplicate the numpad movement commands in desktop layout?  NVDA doesn't have such commands.  The numpad isn't used for that purpose in the desktop layout and such commands aren't duplicated on the laptop.  If that is what you are saying, I think that if you got used to it and gave it time, you would find movement with the keyboard commands such as control plus arrow keys to be as efficient.  Its muscle memory, as you said.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 9:46 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I’ve been using Jaws going on 18 years now.

I am aware of the various Jaws screen reader and windows numpad keystroke commands.

My query was on commands for navigating via the keyboard in a laptop mode. As I mentioned going back and forth between the keyboard and the numpad/arrow keys for me at least takes away from the efficiency as opposed to with Jaws where you can do navigate by character, word, line or paragraph without ever having to take your hands away from the main keyboard itself. It’s not that going back and forth between the main keyboard and numpad or arrow keys is that big a deal, but do it hundreds of times throughout the day and in the aggregate  can quickly become noticeable and tedious.

Thus my question on whether there were NVDA commands and or an add-on beyond the capslock+L for read current line that also allowed for further navigation without having to use the numpad and even the arrow keys.

 

Cristóbal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 4:45 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I should say, on seeing further discussion, that I'm not sure what you mean by jump by word.  As has been said, control down arrow moves down by paragraph and you can use all the standard movement commands.  They are not screen-reader commands.  If someone only taught you the numpad command movement commands in JAWS or the laptop alternative numpad movement commands, that's negligence.  In any screen-reader, or even if you weren't using one, you can use all these commands.  Right arrow, move one character right.  Left arrow, move one character left.  Up arrow, move up one line.  Down arrow, move down one line.  Down by paragraph, control down arrow. 

Up by paragraph, control up arrow.

 

I'm not sure if those are the kinds of commands you want to know but I suspect you were only taught the JAWS numpad or the JAWS laptop movement commands and not the Windows commands and that is incompetent teaching beyond belief, if that is what was done.

 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 5:51 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I don't use the laptop layout in NVDA.  I wouldn't even if I had a laptop without a numpad.  I much prefer the desktop layout.  I haven't looked at the laptop commands much but they don't seem consistent to me in terms of following patterns nearly as much as the desktop layout does.  If you are looking at commands using something like the commands reference and you are using the laptop commands, those are the ones to use.  If you want to get a USB numpad and use the desktop layout, I don't know if you would like the structure more but I prefer it a great deal more.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 5:19 PM

Subject: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

Hello list,

So I am mainly a Jaws user, but have been trying to make the effort to use NVDA more or at least become more proficient with it. The one issue I continue to have with NVDA and just can’t get used to is the keyboard navigation. I know it in part has to do with simple muscle memory with Jaws commands, but outside of the NVDA key (caps lock) plus L command to read the current line, I just cannot get used to not being able to jump around via paragraph or line or word, etc., like in Jaws laptop keyboard layout. Am I just missing something and am not aware of other keyboard navigational keystroke commands in NVDA or is there perhaps an add-on I can install?

Yes, I know there are all the numpad commands, but with Jaws at least, being able to keep one’s hands on the keyboard instead of having to switch back and forth adds up and makes a difference and comfort. And to be clear, I’m not looking for a Jaws clone and am aware that they’re two different products. I’m completely open to this different approach, but this navigational thing is for me anyway proving to be the one major stumbling bock to try to use it more.

I would appreciate any enlightenment.

Thanks,

Cristóbal

 


Re: reading from cursor to end of document issues

Gene
 

Are you using the desktop layout?  If you are using the laptop layout, that is not the correct command. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2019 12:33 PM
Subject: [nvda] reading from cursor to end of document issues

Hi all,

I frequently have issues with NVDA not reading from cursor to end of a document.  I press NVDA key plus down arrow and only one line is read. How can I get it to continue reading?  I believe this use to work.  But maybe I’m mistaken.

Thanks for any guidance.

 


Re: NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

Gene
 

I think its because you are used to that method.  I very much doubt that for a regular numpad user, there is any loss of efficiency.  And if you use caps lock, you are still moving your left hand away from the home keys.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Cristóbal
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2019 12:06 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

With Jaws, I always enable the laptop keyboard layout, be it for my desktops or laptops. Indeed, I do use the numpad and arrow keys for commands, but having the ability to use the same navigational commands on the main keyboard itself as well proves to be a huge efficiency booster and time saver.

I.E. commands such as capslock+N, comma or period for previous character, current character, next character. Capslock+ J, K or L for previous word, current word and next word. Capslock+ U, I or O for previous line, current line and next line. Same for paragraph and sentence, etc.

Again, it’s not that switching back and forth between the main keyboard to either the arrow keys or numpad is especially burdensome, but depending on what you may be doing multiplied by hundreds of times in a day, thee navigational commands via the laptop keyboard layout just feels like a more efficient process of getting things done.

The only command I came across for anything similar with NVDA is the capslock+L command for say current line. It doesn’t seem like there are too many NVDA keystroke commands that make use of the capslock+ the letters on the keyboard. Thus my query if I was in fact missing something and there were in fact keystroke commands beyond this one command or an add-on that expanded on this capability.

So yes, I am well aware of all the various numpad navigational commands as well as using the four arrow keys, but my question was on whether these same commands could also be replicated via the main keyboard. Just use the numpad or arrow keys really doesn’t address my question. If there is in fact not a current means of doing this either through a built in function in NVDA itself or through an add-on, then that would also be good to know.

 

Cristóbal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 10:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

Are you saying you want to use movement commands where you use keyboard commands for movement in JAWS that duplicate the numpad movement commands in desktop layout?  NVDA doesn't have such commands.  The numpad isn't used for that purpose in the desktop layout and such commands aren't duplicated on the laptop.  If that is what you are saying, I think that if you got used to it and gave it time, you would find movement with the keyboard commands such as control plus arrow keys to be as efficient.  Its muscle memory, as you said.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 9:46 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I’ve been using Jaws going on 18 years now.

I am aware of the various Jaws screen reader and windows numpad keystroke commands.

My query was on commands for navigating via the keyboard in a laptop mode. As I mentioned going back and forth between the keyboard and the numpad/arrow keys for me at least takes away from the efficiency as opposed to with Jaws where you can do navigate by character, word, line or paragraph without ever having to take your hands away from the main keyboard itself. It’s not that going back and forth between the main keyboard and numpad or arrow keys is that big a deal, but do it hundreds of times throughout the day and in the aggregate  can quickly become noticeable and tedious.

Thus my question on whether there were NVDA commands and or an add-on beyond the capslock+L for read current line that also allowed for further navigation without having to use the numpad and even the arrow keys.

 

Cristóbal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 4:45 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I should say, on seeing further discussion, that I'm not sure what you mean by jump by word.  As has been said, control down arrow moves down by paragraph and you can use all the standard movement commands.  They are not screen-reader commands.  If someone only taught you the numpad command movement commands in JAWS or the laptop alternative numpad movement commands, that's negligence.  In any screen-reader, or even if you weren't using one, you can use all these commands.  Right arrow, move one character right.  Left arrow, move one character left.  Up arrow, move up one line.  Down arrow, move down one line.  Down by paragraph, control down arrow. 

Up by paragraph, control up arrow.

 

I'm not sure if those are the kinds of commands you want to know but I suspect you were only taught the JAWS numpad or the JAWS laptop movement commands and not the Windows commands and that is incompetent teaching beyond belief, if that is what was done.

 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 5:51 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I don't use the laptop layout in NVDA.  I wouldn't even if I had a laptop without a numpad.  I much prefer the desktop layout.  I haven't looked at the laptop commands much but they don't seem consistent to me in terms of following patterns nearly as much as the desktop layout does.  If you are looking at commands using something like the commands reference and you are using the laptop commands, those are the ones to use.  If you want to get a USB numpad and use the desktop layout, I don't know if you would like the structure more but I prefer it a great deal more.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 5:19 PM

Subject: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

Hello list,

So I am mainly a Jaws user, but have been trying to make the effort to use NVDA more or at least become more proficient with it. The one issue I continue to have with NVDA and just can’t get used to is the keyboard navigation. I know it in part has to do with simple muscle memory with Jaws commands, but outside of the NVDA key (caps lock) plus L command to read the current line, I just cannot get used to not being able to jump around via paragraph or line or word, etc., like in Jaws laptop keyboard layout. Am I just missing something and am not aware of other keyboard navigational keystroke commands in NVDA or is there perhaps an add-on I can install?

Yes, I know there are all the numpad commands, but with Jaws at least, being able to keep one’s hands on the keyboard instead of having to switch back and forth adds up and makes a difference and comfort. And to be clear, I’m not looking for a Jaws clone and am aware that they’re two different products. I’m completely open to this different approach, but this navigational thing is for me anyway proving to be the one major stumbling bock to try to use it more.

I would appreciate any enlightenment.

Thanks,

Cristóbal

 


Re: RES: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

hurrikennyandopo ...
 

Hi


Below is for the word and character.


Announces the current word in the text where the review cursor is positioned. Pressing twice spells the word. Pressing three times spells the word using character descriptions.


Report current character in review
numpad2
NVDA+.
none
Announces the current character on the line of text where the review cursor is positioned. Pressing twice reports a description or example of that character. Pressing three times reports the numeric value of the character in decimal and hexadecimal.


By the way have you got nvda in object review  mode? use the nvda key + the number 1 on the numeric keypad to do this.


Then try it again. The review mode is different to the i think you call it the focus mode. It can get to read only material that you  might not be able to with the arrow keys they are the ones not on the numeric keypad.


Gene nz



On 22/01/2019 3:02 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:

Speaking of keyboard commands:

I'm having trouble getting the current character phonetically.  Using the laptop keyboard layout, NVDA plus period says the character and a second time says it phonetically.  But usually, it reads a character that is not where the insertion point is.  Also would like to be able to read, spell, and spell phonetically, the current word.  Can't seem to make it happen.


On 1/21/2019 6:14 AM, Daniel Damacena wrote:

In the past I was able to use laptop layout when it was necessary. Today, my notebook has the keys needed to use desktop layout, so I use it, but I do not think that the laptop layout is confused or something like that.

 

Anyway, I prefer to use a usb keyboard because it is a lot more comfortable.

Daniel Damacena Bezerra

 

De: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> Em nome de Gene
Enviada em: domingo, 20 de janeiro de 2019 20:51
Para: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Assunto: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I don't use the laptop layout in NVDA.  I wouldn't even if I had a laptop without a numpad.  I much prefer the desktop layout.  I haven't looked at the laptop commands much but they don't seem consistent to me in terms of following patterns nearly as much as the desktop layout does.  If you are looking at commands using something like the commands reference and you are using the laptop commands, those are the ones to use.  If you want to get a USB numpad and use the desktop layout, I don't know if you would like the structure more but I prefer it a great deal more.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 5:19 PM

Subject: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

Hello list,

So I am mainly a Jaws user, but have been trying to make the effort to use NVDA more or at least become more proficient with it. The one issue I continue to have with NVDA and just can’t get used to is the keyboard navigation. I know it in part has to do with simple muscle memory with Jaws commands, but outside of the NVDA key (caps lock) plus L command to read the current line, I just cannot get used to not being able to jump around via paragraph or line or word, etc., like in Jaws laptop keyboard layout. Am I just missing something and am not aware of other keyboard navigational keystroke commands in NVDA or is there perhaps an add-on I can install?

Yes, I know there are all the numpad commands, but with Jaws at least, being able to keep one’s hands on the keyboard instead of having to switch back and forth adds up and makes a difference and comfort. And to be clear, I’m not looking for a Jaws clone and am aware that they’re two different products. I’m completely open to this different approach, but this navigational thing is for me anyway proving to be the one major stumbling bock to try to use it more.

I would appreciate any enlightenment.

Thanks,

Cristóbal

 

--
Check out my website for NVDA tutorials and other blindness related material at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net
 
Regardless of where you are in New Zealand if you are near one of the APNK sites you can use a copy of the NVDA screen reader on one of their computers. To find out which location (or locations) are nearest to you please visit http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries (Aotearoa People's Network Kaharoa).
To find out which software is installed on the APNK network please visit the following link http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.info/faq/software To find out how to use NVDA on APNK computers please visit the following link http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.info/faq/nvda
 

To find out which software is available on the Christchurch City Library network, and how to start the NVDA screen reader, please go to the following links. Software available  https://my.christchurchcitylibraries.com/faq/computers/#faq_5884  How to start the NVDA screen reader on Christchurch City Library computers  https://my.christchurchcitylibraries.com/faqs/what-screen-reader-software-is-available/
 
To find an NVDA certified expert near you, please visit the following link https://certification.nvaccess.org/. The certification page contains the official list of NVDA certified individuals from around the world, who have sat and successfully passed the NVDA expert exam.


Re: NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

Adriani Botez
 

Hello,

 

ah now I understand what you are asking for. No, in NVDA there isn’t such a feature. But you could write to the author of the add-ons sentencenav, textnav and indentnav. His name is Tony Malykh. Maybe he can implement such a feature in one of those add-ons.

 

Basically, what you are requesting is a feature to read current, previous and next character/word/line/paragraph without moving the system carret in edit fields and editors.

 

You could also fill the feature template on Github and propose this feature. The link is here:

https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/new?template=feature_request.md

 

Best

Adriani

 

Von: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> Im Auftrag von Cristóbal
Gesendet: Montag, 21. Januar 2019 19:06
An: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

With Jaws, I always enable the laptop keyboard layout, be it for my desktops or laptops. Indeed, I do use the numpad and arrow keys for commands, but having the ability to use the same navigational commands on the main keyboard itself as well proves to be a huge efficiency booster and time saver.

I.E. commands such as capslock+N, comma or period for previous character, current character, next character. Capslock+ J, K or L for previous word, current word and next word. Capslock+ U, I or O for previous line, current line and next line. Same for paragraph and sentence, etc.

Again, it’s not that switching back and forth between the main keyboard to either the arrow keys or numpad is especially burdensome, but depending on what you may be doing multiplied by hundreds of times in a day, thee navigational commands via the laptop keyboard layout just feels like a more efficient process of getting things done.

The only command I came across for anything similar with NVDA is the capslock+L command for say current line. It doesn’t seem like there are too many NVDA keystroke commands that make use of the capslock+ the letters on the keyboard. Thus my query if I was in fact missing something and there were in fact keystroke commands beyond this one command or an add-on that expanded on this capability.

So yes, I am well aware of all the various numpad navigational commands as well as using the four arrow keys, but my question was on whether these same commands could also be replicated via the main keyboard. Just use the numpad or arrow keys really doesn’t address my question. If there is in fact not a current means of doing this either through a built in function in NVDA itself or through an add-on, then that would also be good to know.

 

Cristóbal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 10:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

Are you saying you want to use movement commands where you use keyboard commands for movement in JAWS that duplicate the numpad movement commands in desktop layout?  NVDA doesn't have such commands.  The numpad isn't used for that purpose in the desktop layout and such commands aren't duplicated on the laptop.  If that is what you are saying, I think that if you got used to it and gave it time, you would find movement with the keyboard commands such as control plus arrow keys to be as efficient.  Its muscle memory, as you said.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 9:46 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I’ve been using Jaws going on 18 years now.

I am aware of the various Jaws screen reader and windows numpad keystroke commands.

My query was on commands for navigating via the keyboard in a laptop mode. As I mentioned going back and forth between the keyboard and the numpad/arrow keys for me at least takes away from the efficiency as opposed to with Jaws where you can do navigate by character, word, line or paragraph without ever having to take your hands away from the main keyboard itself. It’s not that going back and forth between the main keyboard and numpad or arrow keys is that big a deal, but do it hundreds of times throughout the day and in the aggregate  can quickly become noticeable and tedious.

Thus my question on whether there were NVDA commands and or an add-on beyond the capslock+L for read current line that also allowed for further navigation without having to use the numpad and even the arrow keys.

 

Cristóbal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 4:45 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I should say, on seeing further discussion, that I'm not sure what you mean by jump by word.  As has been said, control down arrow moves down by paragraph and you can use all the standard movement commands.  They are not screen-reader commands.  If someone only taught you the numpad command movement commands in JAWS or the laptop alternative numpad movement commands, that's negligence.  In any screen-reader, or even if you weren't using one, you can use all these commands.  Right arrow, move one character right.  Left arrow, move one character left.  Up arrow, move up one line.  Down arrow, move down one line.  Down by paragraph, control down arrow. 

Up by paragraph, control up arrow.

 

I'm not sure if those are the kinds of commands you want to know but I suspect you were only taught the JAWS numpad or the JAWS laptop movement commands and not the Windows commands and that is incompetent teaching beyond belief, if that is what was done.

 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 5:51 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I don't use the laptop layout in NVDA.  I wouldn't even if I had a laptop without a numpad.  I much prefer the desktop layout.  I haven't looked at the laptop commands much but they don't seem consistent to me in terms of following patterns nearly as much as the desktop layout does.  If you are looking at commands using something like the commands reference and you are using the laptop commands, those are the ones to use.  If you want to get a USB numpad and use the desktop layout, I don't know if you would like the structure more but I prefer it a great deal more.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 5:19 PM

Subject: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

Hello list,

So I am mainly a Jaws user, but have been trying to make the effort to use NVDA more or at least become more proficient with it. The one issue I continue to have with NVDA and just can’t get used to is the keyboard navigation. I know it in part has to do with simple muscle memory with Jaws commands, but outside of the NVDA key (caps lock) plus L command to read the current line, I just cannot get used to not being able to jump around via paragraph or line or word, etc., like in Jaws laptop keyboard layout. Am I just missing something and am not aware of other keyboard navigational keystroke commands in NVDA or is there perhaps an add-on I can install?

Yes, I know there are all the numpad commands, but with Jaws at least, being able to keep one’s hands on the keyboard instead of having to switch back and forth adds up and makes a difference and comfort. And to be clear, I’m not looking for a Jaws clone and am aware that they’re two different products. I’m completely open to this different approach, but this navigational thing is for me anyway proving to be the one major stumbling bock to try to use it more.

I would appreciate any enlightenment.

Thanks,

Cristóbal

 


Re: Urgent Help With Accessing Google Drive and Docs

Sarah k Alawami
 

Right. I'm also a member of that group. I will do the same.

Take care

On 21 Jan 2019, at 11:00, mohammad suliman wrote:

Hi bhavya,
I my self haven't used docs extensively, so can't comment on your findings. However, my suggestion to you is to post this on accessible, the official google group from google for discussing the accessibility of the different google products I think, and see whether you will get an answer which helps, at-least hopefully your experience will reach the rite people at google. You can find more about this group in the link:
Hope you the best

On Mon, 21 Jan 2019 at 12:29 Bhavya shah <bhavya.shah125@...> wrote:
Dear all,

I will now be required, for certain essential activities, be required
to extensively use Google Docs and in extension Google Drive for the
next several months to collaborate on documents. Given this, it is
imperative that I get well acquainted to Drive and Docs. However, that
is precisely what I am struggling with.

* I began reading AFB's NVDA specific tutorials on Google Drive and
Docs, but my experience with Drive is not exactly corresponding to
what has been instructed.
* This includes things like NVDA being very latent in the tree view
item on Google Drive, at random instances simply getting stuck in a
control which has nothing in it until I Tab out of it, all of which is
preventing me from even managing to go inside a folder and view its
files, let alone open a document and edit it.
* Due to these issues, I am currently relying on direct URLs to files
and documents to access them and subsequently work on and contribute
to them. Another alternative approach I have tried to adopt is to add
this particular shared folder to my own Drive, such that I can access
it on Windows Explorer on my PC itself. In this scenario, there are a
number of important files that are missing from the folder on my
computer which I have had confirmed with my collaborators. Backup and
Sync from Google on my computer contradictorily claims that everything
has been updated.

I am unclear on how to resolve NVDA's laggy behaviour on Google Drive
on the web or instead be able to get all the files in the shared
folder as they are newly created and updated on my computer. I would
greatly appreciate any ideas or suggestions on a more elegant means of
using Google Drive and Docs. Things I intend to try for now are
confined to switching from Firefox to Chrome in hopes that an
alternate web browser may provide better support for NVDA with
Google's web apps.

Thanks.

P.S. I did press Ctrl+Alt+Z to enable screen reader support in Docs,
and switched views in Drive from grid to list.

--
Best Regards
Bhavya Shah

Blogger at Hiking Across Horizons: https://bhavyashah125.wordpress.com/

Contacting Me
E-mail Address: bhavya.shah125@...
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bhavyashah125/
Twitter: @BhavyaShah125
Skype: bhavya.09




Re: Urgent Help With Accessing Google Drive and Docs

 

Also, if you are using Backup & Sync to get your Google Drive on your computer, make sure you're logging in to sync the Google Account (and it's corresponding drive) you think you are.   There have been a couple of instances I've encountered where people have multiple Google Accounts and set up the wrong one in Backup & Sync.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Urgent Help With Accessing Google Drive and Docs

 

There are definitely some peculiarities in how NVDA is interacting with Google Drive's web interface, and I cannot be certain whether it's an NVDA issue or a page design issue.  One of the things that's peculiar is when you have the drive in list view it is presented visually as a list, NVDA announces it as a table (which it could be), but then when you land on any line item in the list/table it consistently says "one of one."

I do not have lagging in Chrome, and have not tested Firefox.   I've got zero issues using Google Backup & Sync where Google Drive shows up in my File Explorer just like any other file or folder does.


--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Special simvle

farhan israk
 

Thank you. I want to write square bracket which isn't available in keyboard.


On Mon, 21 Jan 2019, 2:28 pm Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io <bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io wrote:
Can you be a bit more specific on what you are trying to achieve in nvda?
 Are you wanting to allow nvda to read a special symbol or are you perhaps
asking on how to create a particular symbol in a document, this is a windows
query and may be more applicable on a windows list.
 Often this sort of thing depends on the language windows is set on and the
language the installed version  has loaded.
 Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "farhan israk" <fahim.net.2014@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2019 7:46 AM
Subject: [nvda] Special simvle


> How to insert special simble including [] in Windows 10 desktop computer?
>
>
>
>





Re: Urgent Help With Accessing Google Drive and Docs

mohammad suliman
 

Hi bhavya,
I my self haven't used docs extensively, so can't comment on your findings. However, my suggestion to you is to post this on accessible, the official google group from google for discussing the accessibility of the different google products I think, and see whether you will get an answer which helps, at-least hopefully your experience will reach the rite people at google. You can find more about this group in the link:
Hope you the best

On Mon, 21 Jan 2019 at 12:29 Bhavya shah <bhavya.shah125@...> wrote:
Dear all,

I will now be required, for certain essential activities, be required
to extensively use Google Docs and in extension Google Drive for the
next several months to collaborate on documents. Given this, it is
imperative that I get well acquainted to Drive and Docs. However, that
is precisely what I am struggling with.

* I began reading AFB's NVDA specific tutorials on Google Drive and
Docs, but my experience with Drive is not exactly corresponding to
what has been instructed.
* This includes things like NVDA being very latent in the tree view
item on Google Drive, at random instances simply getting stuck in a
control which has nothing in it until I Tab out of it, all of which is
preventing me from even managing to go inside a folder and view its
files, let alone open a document and edit it.
* Due to these issues, I am currently relying on direct URLs to files
and documents to access them and subsequently work on and contribute
to them. Another alternative approach I have tried to adopt is to add
this particular shared folder to my own Drive, such that I can access
it on Windows Explorer on my PC itself. In this scenario, there are a
number of important files that are missing from the folder on my
computer which I have had confirmed with my collaborators. Backup and
Sync from Google on my computer contradictorily claims that everything
has been updated.

I am unclear on how to resolve NVDA's laggy behaviour on Google Drive
on the web or instead be able to get all the files in the shared
folder as they are newly created and updated on my computer. I would
greatly appreciate any ideas or suggestions on a more elegant means of
using Google Drive and Docs. Things I intend to try for now are
confined to switching from Firefox to Chrome in hopes that an
alternate web browser may provide better support for NVDA with
Google's web apps.

Thanks.

P.S. I did press Ctrl+Alt+Z to enable screen reader support in Docs,
and switched views in Drive from grid to list.

--
Best Regards
Bhavya Shah

Blogger at Hiking Across Horizons: https://bhavyashah125.wordpress.com/

Contacting Me
E-mail Address: bhavya.shah125@...
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bhavyashah125/
Twitter: @BhavyaShah125
Skype: bhavya.09




Re: reading from cursor to end of document issues

 

Just for the record, "Say all" from the current position in the Laptop Keyboard Layout is NVDA+a
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: reading from cursor to end of document issues

 

First, what's your layout in use right now?
The command you're talking about will work ONLY if you use the desktop layout.
I don't remember the laptop layout command to perform this function, though.

Cheers,
Marcio
Follow me on Twitter

Em 21/01/2019 16:33, Dan Thompson escreveu:

Hi all,

I frequently have issues with NVDA not reading from cursor to end of a document.� I press NVDA key plus down arrow and only one line is read. How can I get it to continue reading?� I believe this use to work.� But maybe I�m mistaken.

Thanks for any guidance.

�



Re: Urgent Help With Accessing Google Drive and Docs

Sarah k Alawami
 

Yeah I also can't stand the new google docs or drive. Im on a mac and I just can't access anything. Right now google sheets is a pile of poop. I have not tried it on the pc, but I would not be surprised as I too am having the same issues on the mac side of things.

Take care

On 21 Jan 2019, at 7:12, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:

I could not get on with the new version of docs and drive either.
Indeed since I don't need it I gave up.
Somebody here may well be a whizz kiid on this, but on Windows 7 I got nowhere with the shark or nvda, other than locking up the pc at regular intervals.
This is why I have reservations about these kind of cloud based systems to edit documents. In theory its great... but Google seem unable to leave stuff alone for more than a month or so.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
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----- Original Message ----- From: "Bhavya shah" <bhavya.shah125@...>
To: "nvda" <nvda@groups.io>
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2019 10:29 AM
Subject: [nvda] Urgent Help With Accessing Google Drive and Docs

Dear all,

I will now be required, for certain essential activities, be required
to extensively use Google Docs and in extension Google Drive for the
next several months to collaborate on documents. Given this, it is
imperative that I get well acquainted to Drive and Docs. However, that
is precisely what I am struggling with.

* I began reading AFB's NVDA specific tutorials on Google Drive and
Docs, but my experience with Drive is not exactly corresponding to
what has been instructed.
* This includes things like NVDA being very latent in the tree view
item on Google Drive, at random instances simply getting stuck in a
control which has nothing in it until I Tab out of it, all of which is
preventing me from even managing to go inside a folder and view its
files, let alone open a document and edit it.
* Due to these issues, I am currently relying on direct URLs to files
and documents to access them and subsequently work on and contribute
to them. Another alternative approach I have tried to adopt is to add
this particular shared folder to my own Drive, such that I can access
it on Windows Explorer on my PC itself. In this scenario, there are a
number of important files that are missing from the folder on my
computer which I have had confirmed with my collaborators. Backup and
Sync from Google on my computer contradictorily claims that everything
has been updated.

I am unclear on how to resolve NVDA's laggy behaviour on Google Drive
on the web or instead be able to get all the files in the shared
folder as they are newly created and updated on my computer. I would
greatly appreciate any ideas or suggestions on a more elegant means of
using Google Drive and Docs. Things I intend to try for now are
confined to switching from Firefox to Chrome in hopes that an
alternate web browser may provide better support for NVDA with
Google's web apps.

Thanks.

P.S. I did press Ctrl+Alt+Z to enable screen reader support in Docs,
and switched views in Drive from grid to list.

--
Best Regards
Bhavya Shah

Blogger at Hiking Across Horizons: https://bhavyashah125.wordpress.com/

Contacting Me
E-mail Address: bhavya.shah125@...
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bhavyashah125/
Twitter: @BhavyaShah125
Skype: bhavya.09



Re: getting rid of norton security tool

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

I don't have any example links for you, but if you take a look at smashwords.com, there's all kinds of books there, and there are plenty of free ones to choose from as well, just grab one, download it, unzip it, and find the proper files on your pc, then open them in your browser.  It works perfectly.  You won't have the navigation commands like previous and next chapters, but it's easy enough to either change the url in the address bar, or just use your file browser of choice to find the next one and click on it to open it for you.  Generally though, you'll not find the files at the root of the unzipped folder, as that's where all the control files are.  You'll generally find them in a folder called oebps, though the folder name can change, depending on what software was used to create the epub book.  I've seen oebps, text, html and others.  I have also seen where everything is at the top level, (though only once), so you may need to do some detective work to find the correct files, but after you locate them, it's trivially easy to load them into your browser.

Again, I must stress the fact that this method won't work with DRM encrypted files, as those are stored in an encrypted format, and your browser won't know how to decrypt the files for display.

On 1/21/2019 1:10 PM, zahra wrote:
really?
do you mean that i can read free epub books with my firefox?
can someone send me the example link?

On 1/21/19, Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...> wrote:
If your epub books are DRM free, reading them is as easy as unzipping
them, and loading them into your favorite web browser. This is how I
read all of my epub books.  Then again, I refuse to pay for DRM
encrypted books if I can help it, so your mileage may vary.

On 1/21/2019 9:03 AM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
I think I will probably just reset the computer and wipe out
everything. But is there a good alternative to adobe digital editions
for reading epub books? or is there an adobe digital editions without
the  norton security junk?




reading from cursor to end of document issues

Dan Thompson
 

Hi all,

I frequently have issues with NVDA not reading from cursor to end of a document.  I press NVDA key plus down arrow and only one line is read. How can I get it to continue reading?  I believe this use to work.  But maybe I’m mistaken.

Thanks for any guidance.

 


Re: getting rid of norton security tool

 

really?
do you mean that i can read free epub books with my firefox?
can someone send me the example link?

On 1/21/19, Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...> wrote:
If your epub books are DRM free, reading them is as easy as unzipping
them, and loading them into your favorite web browser. This is how I
read all of my epub books.  Then again, I refuse to pay for DRM
encrypted books if I can help it, so your mileage may vary.

On 1/21/2019 9:03 AM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
I think I will probably just reset the computer and wipe out
everything. But is there a good alternative to adobe digital editions
for reading epub books? or is there an adobe digital editions without
the  norton security junk?




--
By God,
were I given all the seven heavens
with all they contain
in order that
I may disobey God
by depriving an ant
from the husk of a grain of barley,
I would not do it.
imam ali


Re: getting rid of norton security tool

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

If your epub books are DRM free, reading them is as easy as unzipping them, and loading them into your favorite web browser.  This is how I read all of my epub books.  Then again, I refuse to pay for DRM encrypted books if I can help it, so your mileage may vary.

On 1/21/2019 9:03 AM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
I think I will probably just reset the computer and wipe out everything. But is there a good alternative to adobe digital editions for reading epub books? or is there an adobe digital editions without the  norton security junk? 

Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

Cristóbal
 

With Jaws, I always enable the laptop keyboard layout, be it for my desktops or laptops. Indeed, I do use the numpad and arrow keys for commands, but having the ability to use the same navigational commands on the main keyboard itself as well proves to be a huge efficiency booster and time saver.

I.E. commands such as capslock+N, comma or period for previous character, current character, next character. Capslock+ J, K or L for previous word, current word and next word. Capslock+ U, I or O for previous line, current line and next line. Same for paragraph and sentence, etc.

Again, it’s not that switching back and forth between the main keyboard to either the arrow keys or numpad is especially burdensome, but depending on what you may be doing multiplied by hundreds of times in a day, thee navigational commands via the laptop keyboard layout just feels like a more efficient process of getting things done.

The only command I came across for anything similar with NVDA is the capslock+L command for say current line. It doesn’t seem like there are too many NVDA keystroke commands that make use of the capslock+ the letters on the keyboard. Thus my query if I was in fact missing something and there were in fact keystroke commands beyond this one command or an add-on that expanded on this capability.

So yes, I am well aware of all the various numpad navigational commands as well as using the four arrow keys, but my question was on whether these same commands could also be replicated via the main keyboard. Just use the numpad or arrow keys really doesn’t address my question. If there is in fact not a current means of doing this either through a built in function in NVDA itself or through an add-on, then that would also be good to know.

 

Cristóbal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 10:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

Are you saying you want to use movement commands where you use keyboard commands for movement in JAWS that duplicate the numpad movement commands in desktop layout?  NVDA doesn't have such commands.  The numpad isn't used for that purpose in the desktop layout and such commands aren't duplicated on the laptop.  If that is what you are saying, I think that if you got used to it and gave it time, you would find movement with the keyboard commands such as control plus arrow keys to be as efficient.  Its muscle memory, as you said.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 9:46 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I’ve been using Jaws going on 18 years now.

I am aware of the various Jaws screen reader and windows numpad keystroke commands.

My query was on commands for navigating via the keyboard in a laptop mode. As I mentioned going back and forth between the keyboard and the numpad/arrow keys for me at least takes away from the efficiency as opposed to with Jaws where you can do navigate by character, word, line or paragraph without ever having to take your hands away from the main keyboard itself. It’s not that going back and forth between the main keyboard and numpad or arrow keys is that big a deal, but do it hundreds of times throughout the day and in the aggregate  can quickly become noticeable and tedious.

Thus my question on whether there were NVDA commands and or an add-on beyond the capslock+L for read current line that also allowed for further navigation without having to use the numpad and even the arrow keys.

 

Cristóbal

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 4:45 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I should say, on seeing further discussion, that I'm not sure what you mean by jump by word.  As has been said, control down arrow moves down by paragraph and you can use all the standard movement commands.  They are not screen-reader commands.  If someone only taught you the numpad command movement commands in JAWS or the laptop alternative numpad movement commands, that's negligence.  In any screen-reader, or even if you weren't using one, you can use all these commands.  Right arrow, move one character right.  Left arrow, move one character left.  Up arrow, move up one line.  Down arrow, move down one line.  Down by paragraph, control down arrow. 

Up by paragraph, control up arrow.

 

I'm not sure if those are the kinds of commands you want to know but I suspect you were only taught the JAWS numpad or the JAWS laptop movement commands and not the Windows commands and that is incompetent teaching beyond belief, if that is what was done.

 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 5:51 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

I don't use the laptop layout in NVDA.  I wouldn't even if I had a laptop without a numpad.  I much prefer the desktop layout.  I haven't looked at the laptop commands much but they don't seem consistent to me in terms of following patterns nearly as much as the desktop layout does.  If you are looking at commands using something like the commands reference and you are using the laptop commands, those are the ones to use.  If you want to get a USB numpad and use the desktop layout, I don't know if you would like the structure more but I prefer it a great deal more.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 5:19 PM

Subject: [nvda] NVDA keyboard navigation keyboard commands

 

Hello list,

So I am mainly a Jaws user, but have been trying to make the effort to use NVDA more or at least become more proficient with it. The one issue I continue to have with NVDA and just can’t get used to is the keyboard navigation. I know it in part has to do with simple muscle memory with Jaws commands, but outside of the NVDA key (caps lock) plus L command to read the current line, I just cannot get used to not being able to jump around via paragraph or line or word, etc., like in Jaws laptop keyboard layout. Am I just missing something and am not aware of other keyboard navigational keystroke commands in NVDA or is there perhaps an add-on I can install?

Yes, I know there are all the numpad commands, but with Jaws at least, being able to keep one’s hands on the keyboard instead of having to switch back and forth adds up and makes a difference and comfort. And to be clear, I’m not looking for a Jaws clone and am aware that they’re two different products. I’m completely open to this different approach, but this navigational thing is for me anyway proving to be the one major stumbling bock to try to use it more.

I would appreciate any enlightenment.

Thanks,

Cristóbal

 


Re: Windows Defender Adequate?

Bob Jutzi
 

I've relied on it for the past few years with no problems.

On 1/21/2019 10:48 AM, P. Otter wrote:
now at this moment I've the same antivirus configuration.
when you are  carefull and for normal use its enough
but when you're visiting illegal sites it is better to use another read better antivirus scanner.
but the problem is that most scanners are not or bad accessible

cheers
paul otter

Op 21-1-2019 om 16:21 schreef Ralph Boersema:

For more than two years I have relied only on Windows Defender plus MalWare Bytes. Now I am purchasing a new Dell Inspiron. Any thoughts about whether Windows Defender provides adequate protection?

 

Ralph




Re: Windows Defender Adequate?

 

Ralph,

              The improvements to Windows Defender, now Windows Security as of Version 1809, have been huge over the last several years, and the results of third-party lab tests indicate this.

               Although I have Malwarebytes on my system (free version, manual scans) too, I cannot even recall the last time I used it.  It was always a backup tool for the "in case I somehow become infected" circumstance, and I have not had an infection on any of my systems in probably 20 years or longer now.

See the most recent plus the last several years of historical test results from:

AV Test

AV Comparatives

SE Labs  (Reports Page)

MRG Effitas  (360 Protection Testing Category)
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back