Date   

Re: NVDA Settings Documentation

 

Hi,

Agreed (that’s one of the reasons why I comment a lot in my add-on source code).

One holiday wish I have (possibly a long-term wish) is to help folks get started on revamping the NVDA community documentation. At least this can include add-on user guides, but I foresee a day where the screen reader user guide would not escape this rewrite in hopes of making it more relevant for users. I would go so far as ask NVDA code contributors to add extensive documentation in source code itself – it is now possible to do it easily with help from a module called Sphinx, a source code based documentation generator. There are major issues to consider, however:

  1. Who is the target audience: thinking about this changes the game, as it will dictate tone, style, word usage, and organization of the document and supplemental materials.
  2. Mindset of code contributors: are we just software developers or technical authors? Some people would argue that developers should focus on programming and testing, leaving the task of documenting what developers wrote to technical authors, and this separation of concerns may foster better communication amongst team members. On the other hand, by forcing developers to become technical authors, they can make crucial decisions about the user-visible aspects of a given product a bit early.
  3. How can we show we accept diversity in terms of culture, language, skill level, and other factors: although the community documentation was written by NV Access people at first, it is increasingly written by people from diverse backgrounds in terms of culture, language, skill level, and other factors (although I did receive training on technical communication and software development, I’m not a native English speaker). This is more so for parts that are written by people who may have different interpretation about a UI message or concepts, more so if the author’s native language is not English (the reverse is true for translators as they need to grasp concepts written in English in their native languages).

 

My responses to the above questions are:

  1. Who is the target audience: it varies. For NVDA user guide, it is users with differing skill levels. For add-on guides, they target end users. For this reason, whenever I edit the NVDA user guide or add-on guides, I think about what users expect and NVDA’s response. This changes if we’re dealing with a document meant for developers (such as add-on internals and such).
  2. Mindset of code contributors: I believe that, as much as programming skills is important, willingness to communicate with audiences (users, other contributors, industry experts, etc.) is also important. One way to practice both is thinking and writing to and about users, therefore I tend to fall into a bit of the latter category from above: programming is, in one way or another, writing. Python is just one of the more specialized languages used to communicate with another entity (the machine), and if one can teach a computer to do something (along with fixing mistakes), it would be possible to train developers to respect users more by writing good documentation (of course someone may need to look at the documentation for style and such). My philosophy partly stems from my experiences as a former computer science major at a college I attended (different from the one I’m about to graduate from): my first computer science professor stressed the importance of source code comments and documentation, and I still practice this lesson today, which fuels my overall frustration with the current state of NVDA user guide and source code documentation in general. I think one exercise code contributors can do before submitting anything to GitHub (specifically, pull; requests) is writing an early user facing documentation, because doing so helps you improve your writing skills and think carefully about the impact of your changes when users meet them (I sometimes find myself struggling for minutes to hours over UI messages and documentation for this reason; I know what my code will do, but I hit a roadblock when explaining what I’ve done to would-be users before actually writing code).
  3. How can we show we are a group of people coming from diverse backgrounds: I think this goal was somewhat achieved when we look at recent NVDA work – many new features and bug fixes included in NVDA 2020.3 were written by someone other than an NV Access staff member, from people living in different countries and speaking many languages. But I know that we can improve on that somehow.

 

Another wish I have, mostly for Quentin: can we develop some sort of a training program for would-be contributors wishing to improve the overall NVDA community documentation, including the user guide? It may include basics on technical writing, tone and style, audience analysis, exercises where coding and documentation should be done together, and documentation production in a variety of formats (including online media). I think this may help us dive deeper into user guide issues being brought up, including the guide being “too thick” for newbies (in terms of understanding, lack of solid examples, and friendliness), especially for preferences chapter.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Sunday, October 18, 2020 11:56 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA Settings Documentation

 

Joseph,

           While I applaud your efforts, and tutorials are invaluable, I wasn't even going that far.  I'm talking basic documentation, where each item in a panel/pane/settings group in a given pane are briefly documented.  There are myriad NVDA settings that, if their actual function is not directly obvious, which is the case, for example, with most checkboxes, then they're a black hole.

            Even I will admit that for all software it is a limited number of end users who refer to this sort of thing.  That being said, some do, and it serves as a very important basis for new developers to develop depth of knowledge of "what's in there and what it's for."

             I was just commenting to someone for whom I've done custom VBA scripting for Outlook that I am eternally grateful to myself for having developed the habit of rigorously commenting my code, at a bare minimum, as even I would have no idea what some of what I've written actually does when looking at it much later.  Complex stuff doesn't remain in "off the top of my head" mode (for most "mes") as time moves on.  That's one of the reasons that basic documentation is so important.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 


Re: NVDA and current selection in file explorer

Louise Pfau
 

Hi.  I can't find the add-on you mentioned in the community add-ons list, which is where I go to get my add-ons.  Where did you originally find it?

Thanks,

Louise


Re: BARD express

Joshua Hendrickson
 

I know, it is so awesome. Bard express works so well now with the new
version of NVDA.

On 10/18/20, Robert Doc Wright godfearer <godfearer@comcast.net> wrote:
I am pleased with how nvda is much better. I am able to gett all of the
annotation now while using the advance mode.
******
Jesus says, follow me and I'll help you through the rough spots.
the world says, hey come with me. My way is broad and easy. So what if you
get crap on your shoes. You can always wash it off, can't you!


Family times where there is fun for every ear!
http://stream.wrighthere.net:8000/stream.mp3

Or ask your A device to play Family times on tuneIn
You can also find us on your mobile device install OoTunes and search for
Family times





--
Joshua Hendrickson

Joshua Hendrickson


BARD express

Robert Doc Wright godfearer
 

I am pleased with how nvda is much better. I am able to gett all of the annotation now while using the advance mode. 
******
Jesus says, follow me and I'll help you through the rough spots.
the world says, hey come with me. My way is broad and easy. So what if you get crap on your shoes. You can always wash it off, can't you!
 

Family times where there is fun for every ear!
http://stream.wrighthere.net:8000/stream.mp3
 
Or ask your A device to play Family times on tuneIn
You can also find us on your mobile device install OoTunes and search for Family times


Re: NVDA Settings Documentation

 

Joseph,

           While I applaud your efforts, and tutorials are invaluable, I wasn't even going that far.  I'm talking basic documentation, where each item in a panel/pane/settings group in a given pane are briefly documented.  There are myriad NVDA settings that, if their actual function is not directly obvious, which is the case, for example, with most checkboxes, then they're a black hole.

            Even I will admit that for all software it is a limited number of end users who refer to this sort of thing.  That being said, some do, and it serves as a very important basis for new developers to develop depth of knowledge of "what's in there and what it's for."

             I was just commenting to someone for whom I've done custom VBA scripting for Outlook that I am eternally grateful to myself for having developed the habit of rigorously commenting my code, at a bare minimum, as even I would have no idea what some of what I've written actually does when looking at it much later.  Complex stuff doesn't remain in "off the top of my head" mode (for most "mes") as time moves on.  That's one of the reasons that basic documentation is so important.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 


Re: Maximum number of characters on one line

Gene
 

The browser is what breaks up material into lines on web pages exdcept, of course, where a new paragraph begins. When browse mode or the virtual pc cursor format a page, they ddetermine how many carachters will be on a line. When you set the number of carachters, you are determining how long you want a line to be.

-----Original Message-----
From: Luke Robinett
Sent: Sunday, October 18, 2020 11:13 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Maximum number of characters on one line


To be honest, I’ve never even understood what that setting means or what it even correlates to. Maximum characters for what? Isn’t NVDA just reading whatever you are telling it to? Something I could obviously use more education on.

On Oct 17, 2020, at 8:57 PM, Eilana Benish <benish.ilana@gmail.com> wrote:












Hello

why in NVDA, user can't change the Maximum number of characters on one line from mor then 250 Characters?

Allowing this feature will help in very long and complex documents When the user wants to read the entire line with NVDA and up arrow?





--






ובכבוד רב | Sincerely,

אילנה בניש מורשה נגישות שירות 2200 | Eilana Benish, service Accessibility authorized (2200)

ניהול פרויקטים – נגישות ושמישות אינטרנט וטכנולוגיות מידע | Projects manager – Accessibility & usability on internet and ICT

📱 +972-50-7100367 | 📧 benish.ilana@gmail.com


Re: NVDA Settings Documentation

 

Hi,

Generally, the newer the setting, it is better documented in the user guide. For example, consider the just mentioned setting in browse mode panel versus touch interaction panel – the former is an old setting, while the latter is a recent section (bonus: I wrote the touch interaction section apart from a bit on toggling touch interaction with a keyboard command). The user guide as currently stands has limitations, including covering only the basic scenarios.

Part of the reason why I produced Welcome to NVDA tutorial series (2013, 2015, 2018) was due to personal frustrations with the NVDA user guide. The biggest frustration is the issue Brian mentioned: lack of real-life scenarios. This is why when you listen to (or watch video) tutorials, you’ll notice more real-life examples being presented, and I believe that’s one of the strengths of NV Access’s own basic training material as well.

One idea I briefly considered was producing the fourth edition of Welcome to NVDA series this year but shelved it, knowing that there are folks who can produce better tutorial sets, along with the fact that NV Access has a basic training material now. But if there is a really strong demand for it, I’ll revisit this idea next year, with a possibility that the fourth edition will be the last Welcome to NVDA set I produce.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Sunday, October 18, 2020 9:35 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA Settings Documentation

 

Does such exist?

When reviewing the User Guide (at least what I've been able to find) there is very little to nothing regarding a number of NVDA settings, what they do, and how they change interaction with "the real world" things NVDA's working with.

One example is the Maximum Characters per line setting in Browse settings.  I can find absolutely nothing that clearly documents what that setting does or what changing it will do to NVDA's behavior.

I have to presume that there is a document that would go, panel by panel, and setting-by-setting, through these and what they do.  But if such exists, I really don't know where it is.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 


NVDA Settings Documentation

 

Does such exist?

When reviewing the User Guide (at least what I've been able to find) there is very little to nothing regarding a number of NVDA settings, what they do, and how they change interaction with "the real world" things NVDA's working with.

One example is the Maximum Characters per line setting in Browse settings.  I can find absolutely nothing that clearly documents what that setting does or what changing it will do to NVDA's behavior.

I have to presume that there is a document that would go, panel by panel, and setting-by-setting, through these and what they do.  But if such exists, I really don't know where it is.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 


Re: NVDA 2020.3: enable selective registration for UA automation events not having any impact in visual studio 2019

Luke Robinett <blindgroupsluke@...>
 

Yeah. Honestly there are a lot of problems with NVDA and visual studio. I am amazed I am as productive as I am in that software given I don’t have access to even a fraction of what cited users do because of the lack of support.

On Oct 17, 2020, at 12:44 AM, rowen brian <manchen0528@...> wrote:

Hello 
The parameter prompt of the method cannot be read out, press Ctrl +k, Ctrl+P


Re: Maximum number of characters on one line

Luke Robinett <blindgroupsluke@...>
 

To be honest, I’ve never even understood what that setting means or what it even correlates to. Maximum characters for what? Isn’t NVDA just reading whatever you are telling it to? Something I could obviously use more education on.

On Oct 17, 2020, at 8:57 PM, Eilana Benish <benish.ilana@...> wrote:




Hello

why in NVDA, user can't change the Maximum number of characters on one line from mor then 250 Characters?

Allowing this feature will help in very long and complex documents When the user wants to read the entire line with NVDA and up arrow?

 

--

 

 

ובכבוד רב | Sincerely,

אילנה בניש מורשה נגישות שירות 2200 | Eilana Benish, service Accessibility authorized (2200)

ניהול פרויקטים – נגישות ושמישות אינטרנט וטכנולוגיות מידע  | Projects manager – Accessibility & usability on internet and ICT

📱 +972-50-7100367 | 📧 benish.ilana@...  


Re: Windows 10 App Essentials 20.10.2 released, a few notices about add-on development for the next few weeks #addonrelease

Hettie <woehler.hettie@...>
 

Hi Luke

Thanks, will install it.


Hettie

On 2020/10/17 5:21 pm, Luke Davis wrote:
On Sat, 17 Oct 2020, Hettie wrote:

Is Windows 10 App Essentials  a windows or nvda app?
Neither. It is an NVDA add-on. Press Insert+n, t, and go down to "manage add-ons" and press enter. That will allow you to install add-ons into NVDA. You can press Alt+G to open a web page where you can find add-ons. Move to Windows 10 App Essentials, press enter, move to the "stable version" link, and select that.

 > Is it essential to use it with windows 10??

Windows 10 will be more accessible and much more pleasant to use if you do use the add-on.  You can use NVDA in Windows 10 without it, but I can't think of a good reason not to use Win 10 App Essentials, and many good reasons why you should use it.

Does it automatically come with either windows 10 or nvda?
No. See above.

Luke



--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com


Re: NVDA and current selection in file explorer

hurrikennyandopo ...
 

Hi


Sorry I thought I had put it into the email as well as the other steps to high light the files you wanted.


the link to the drop box where it is is athttps://www.dropbox.com/s/a935bus11i8y8k0/ZExplorer_1.0_Gen.nvda-addon?dl=1 <https://www.dropbox.com/s/a935bus11i8y8k0/ZExplorer_1.0_Gen.nvda-addon?dl=1>




Gene nz

On 18/10/2020 3:30 pm, William Wong wrote:
Hi, what is the addon you mentioned in the email?


hurrikennyandopo ... 於 18/10/2020 9:36 寫道:
Hi


The following will help so you know when it is selected or not and the add on will tell you how many were high lighted  etc.


Do not worry about the spelling mistakes they will be fixed up before they go to my website.



  *Selecting and unselecting files in file explorer
when you go into a folder in file explorer you might only want to copy certain files out of that folder. They might not be together or in a group. to copy only certain files out of the folder if there are heaps of them you will need to do the following.
it would be easier to go to the top of the folder so you can see all the files below. Now hold down the CTRL key then use the space bar to select or unselect hightlight files. Each time you press the space bar on a unselected file it will then become selected. Work your way down the files you want and select them with the spacebar while still holding the CTRL key.
You should hear  wheather it is select or unselected. as you arrow down the list of files.r To confirm which ones you selected while still holding down the CTRL key go to the top of the folder then arrow down the list. If it only says the name of the song it is selected but if it says the name of the song and unselected then you know it is not. Usually the status bar can be read with the NVDA key + END key but not at present.

Gene nz



On 18/10/2020 12:27 pm, William Wong wrote:
Hi all,

In file explorer, after doing file or folder selection with shift up or down arrow, if I press num 5 key, it will only report the last item being selected.

After reading the user menu, it seemed that there is no way to report what are the items being selected?

Thanks,

William











Maximum number of characters on one line

Eilana Benish
 


Hello

why in NVDA, user can't change the Maximum number of characters on one line from mor then 250 Characters?

Allowing this feature will help in very long and complex documents When the user wants to read the entire line with NVDA and up arrow?

 

--

 

 

ובכבוד רב | Sincerely,

אילנה בניש מורשה נגישות שירות 2200 | Eilana Benish, service Accessibility authorized (2200)

ניהול פרויקטים – נגישות ושמישות אינטרנט וטכנולוגיות מידע  | Projects manager – Accessibility & usability on internet and ICT

📱 +972-50-7100367 | 📧 benish.ilana@...  


Re: NVDA and current selection in file explorer

William
 

Oh sorry, I found out the link in another email.


William Wong 於 18/10/2020 10:30 寫道:

Hi, what is the addon you mentioned in the email?


hurrikennyandopo ... 於 18/10/2020 9:36 寫道:
Hi


The following will help so you know when it is selected or not and the add on will tell you how many were high lighted  etc.


Do not worry about the spelling mistakes they will be fixed up before they go to my website.



  *Selecting and unselecting files in file explorer
when you go into a folder in file explorer you might only want to copy certain files out of that folder. They might not be together or in a group. to copy only certain files out of the folder if there are heaps of them you will need to do the following.
it would be easier to go to the top of the folder so you can see all the files below. Now hold down the CTRL key then use the space bar to select or unselect hightlight files. Each time you press the space bar on a unselected file it will then become selected. Work your way down the files you want and select them with the spacebar while still holding the CTRL key.
You should hear  wheather it is select or unselected. as you arrow down the list of files.r To confirm which ones you selected while still holding down the CTRL key go to the top of the folder then arrow down the list. If it only says the name of the song it is selected but if it says the name of the song and unselected then you know it is not. Usually the status bar can be read with the NVDA key + END key but not at present.

Gene nz



On 18/10/2020 12:27 pm, William Wong wrote:
Hi all,

In file explorer, after doing file or folder selection with shift up or down arrow, if I press num 5 key, it will only report the last item being selected.

After reading the user menu, it seemed that there is no way to report what are the items being selected?

Thanks,

William








Re: NVDA and current selection in file explorer

William
 

Hi, what is the addon you mentioned in the email?


hurrikennyandopo ... 於 18/10/2020 9:36 寫道:

Hi


The following will help so you know when it is selected or not and the add on will tell you how many were high lighted  etc.


Do not worry about the spelling mistakes they will be fixed up before they go to my website.



  *Selecting and unselecting files in file explorer
when you go into a folder in file explorer you might only want to copy certain files out of that folder. They might not be together or in a group. to copy only certain files out of the folder if there are heaps of them you will need to do the following.
it would be easier to go to the top of the folder so you can see all the files below. Now hold down the CTRL key then use the space bar to select or unselect hightlight files. Each time you press the space bar on a unselected file it will then become selected. Work your way down the files you want and select them with the spacebar while still holding the CTRL key.
You should hear  wheather it is select or unselected. as you arrow down the list of files.r To confirm which ones you selected while still holding down the CTRL key go to the top of the folder then arrow down the list. If it only says the name of the song it is selected but if it says the name of the song and unselected then you know it is not. Usually the status bar can be read with the NVDA key + END key but not at present.

Gene nz



On 18/10/2020 12:27 pm, William Wong wrote:
Hi all,

In file explorer, after doing file or folder selection with shift up or down arrow, if I press num 5 key, it will only report the last item being selected.

After reading the user menu, it seemed that there is no way to report what are the items being selected?

Thanks,

William








Re: NVDA and current selection in file explorer

Gene
 

If you open a folder and don't move you will be at the top and nothing is selected. If you hold the control key and move nothing will be selected until you select it.
If you issue a command to move to the top even if you are already there and nothing was selected before, the first file will be selected. If you want nothing selected open file explorer, open the folder you want to work in and don't move until you are holding control. Or, if you want to make sure nothing is selected, perhaps you have been working in the folder already, press home to be sure you are at the top. The first file is selected.
Hold control and press the space bar. You will hear the the file is now unselected.
Then continue to down arrow still holding control until you get to a file you want to select. Follow the rest of the instructions.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: hurrikennyandopo ...
Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2020 8:36 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA and current selection in file explorer

Hi


The following will help so you know when it is selected or not and the
add on will tell you how many were high lighted etc.


Do not worry about the spelling mistakes they will be fixed up before
they go to my website.



*Selecting and unselecting files in file explorer
when you go into a folder in file explorer you might only want to copy
certain files out of that folder. They might not be together or in a
group. to copy only certain files out of the folder if there are heaps
of them you will need to do the following.
it would be easier to go to the top of the folder so you can see all the
files below. Now hold down the CTRL key then use the space bar to select
or unselect hightlight files. Each time you press the space bar on a
unselected file it will then become selected. Work your way down the
files you want and select them with the spacebar while still holding the
CTRL key.
You should hear wheather it is select or unselected. as you arrow down
the list of files.r To confirm which ones you selected while still
holding down the CTRL key go to the top of the folder then arrow down
the list. If it only says the name of the song it is selected but if it
says the name of the song and unselected then you know it is not.
Usually the status bar can be read with the NVDA key + END key but not
at present.

Gene nz



On 18/10/2020 12:27 pm, William Wong wrote:
Hi all,

In file explorer, after doing file or folder selection with shift up or down arrow, if I press num 5 key, it will only report the last item being selected.

After reading the user menu, it seemed that there is no way to report what are the items being selected?

Thanks,

William






Re: NVDA and current selection in file explorer

hurrikennyandopo ...
 

Hi


The following will help so you know when it is selected or not and the add on will tell you how many were high lighted  etc.


Do not worry about the spelling mistakes they will be fixed up before they go to my website.



  *Selecting and unselecting files in file explorer
when you go into a folder in file explorer you might only want to copy certain files out of that folder. They might not be together or in a group. to copy only certain files out of the folder if there are heaps of them you will need to do the following.
it would be easier to go to the top of the folder so you can see all the files below. Now hold down the CTRL key then use the space bar to select or unselect hightlight files. Each time you press the space bar on a unselected file it will then become selected. Work your way down the files you want and select them with the spacebar while still holding the CTRL key.
You should hear  wheather it is select or unselected. as you arrow down the list of files.r To confirm which ones you selected while still holding down the CTRL key go to the top of the folder then arrow down the list. If it only says the name of the song it is selected but if it says the name of the song and unselected then you know it is not. Usually the status bar can be read with the NVDA key + END key but not at present.

Gene nz

On 18/10/2020 12:27 pm, William Wong wrote:
Hi all,

In file explorer, after doing file or folder selection with shift up or down arrow, if I press num 5 key, it will only report the last item being selected.

After reading the user menu, it seemed that there is no way to report what are the items being selected?

Thanks,

William





Re: NVDA and current selection in file explorer

hurrikennyandopo ...
 

Hi


the following add on might help it will also give you the status bar in file explorer and how many things you have hightlighted to copy.


The link to the drop box is https://www.dropbox.com/s/a935bus11i8y8k0/ZExplorer_1.0_Gen.nvda-addon?dl=0 <https://www.dropbox.com/s/a935bus11i8y8k0/ZExplorer_1.0_Gen.nvda-addon?dl=0> is where it is .


I had to look up in my installed add ons to see what it was called I think it might need a easier to remember name.


Gene nz

On 18/10/2020 12:27 pm, William Wong wrote:
Hi all,

In file explorer, after doing file or folder selection with shift up or down arrow, if I press num 5 key, it will only report the last item being selected.

After reading the user menu, it seemed that there is no way to report what are the items being selected?

Thanks,

William





NVDA and current selection in file explorer

William
 

Hi all,

In file explorer, after doing file or folder selection with shift up or down arrow, if I press num 5 key, it will only report the last item being selected.

After reading the user menu, it seemed that there is no way to report what are the items being selected?

Thanks,

William


Re: NVDA + 1 under new tab page of Chrome

William
 

Oh thanks.

I really do not know it should only work if the focus is on the document. I originally thought that it works if the current active window is a web browser.


Gene 於 17/10/2020 22:12 寫道:

If you are in the right place, browse mode should be on.  Make sure you are actually in the blank page.  Use f6 as probably the fastest way to get there.  I have my browsers open to a blank page and if I am in the right place, browse mode is active and the descriptions work as you describe.

If you open a blank new tab with control n, you are placed on the address bar, not in the actual page.
-----Original Message----- From: William Wong
Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2020 5:37 AM
To: NVDA Mailing List
Subject: [nvda] NVDA + 1 under new tab page of Chrome

Hello,

Normally, when particular page is opened in Chrome, pressing nvda 1,
then press those navigational keys (e.g. k) will speak its respective
function in web navigation (e.g. link for k)

But I just found out that, if the current page is a blank new tab page
(e.g. a blank page after opening Chrome) pressing nvda 1, and press
those navigational keys will not speak its function, but just speak the
English letter.

I would like to know, is this a normal behavior?


Thanks,

William









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