Date   

Re: 2 questions about OCR

Gene
 

You are evidently sending your message to the list and to the owner address, but perhaps not. Whatever the case, the address field says group moderators. That may confuse a lot of people and they may not read the message or they may skip it because they may think it is being addressed to the moderators.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Joseph Norton
Sent: Monday, November 02, 2020 7:28 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Group Moderators
Subject: [nvda] 2 questions about OCR



Hi listers:



I have 2 questions about the OCR feature:



First, if I am looking at a screen with information in columns, the OCR tries to show each column separately. For example, if I am looking at a DOS directory listing, it shows me first, the file name, then a list of extensions, then the size, etc. Is there any way to have the OCR results reflect the way the screen actually looks, instead of trying to show me separate columns?



Second, is there a way to do a left or right click on something shown in the OCR results?



Thanks!



Sent from Mail for Windows 10


Re: Using Acrobat Reader DC with NVDA

Pauline Smith
 

I am going to show my tech ignorance with this question.  What is Acrobat reader DC?  I have Adobe on my computer. Is this a separate program?

Pauline

On 11/1/2020 6:45 PM, Kelly Sapergia wrote:
Hi,

I'm having problems using Acrobat Reader DC (hereafter titled ARDC) with
NVDA. It works great with JAWS, but when I have NVDA loaded and open a file
in ARDC, I don't get the message asking how I want the document presented as
far as accessibility goes. All I get is a frame, but no text. Do I need an
addon to make it work better, or are there some settings I need to adjust?

Thanks.

Yours Sincerely,
Kelly John Sapergia
Show Host and Production Director
The Global Voice Internet Radio
www.theglobalvoice.info

Personal Website: www.ksapergia.net
Business Site (KJS Productions): www.kjsproductions.com
Follow me on Twitter at: kjsapergia






2 questions about OCR

Joseph Norton
 

Hi listers:

 

I have 2 questions about the OCR feature:

 

First, if I am looking at a screen with information in columns, the OCR tries to show each column separately.  For example, if I am looking at a DOS directory listing, it shows me first, the file name, then a list of extensions, then the size, etc.  Is there any way to have the OCR results reflect the way the screen actually looks, instead of trying to show me separate columns?

 

Second, is there a way to do a left or right click on something shown in the OCR results?

 

Thanks!

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


Re: appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

 

Hi,

Actually, when you do tab through clipboard history interface, an overlay cursor may appear to move. Same goes with opening the clipboard history context menu where the three options mentioned by Brian can be found.

I investigated ways to support announcing additional interface items at least twice, the most recent being a few months ago. Each time, a fix led to unacceptable experiences and regressions. Part of this has to do with the way modern keyboard interface is designed (note that I use the term “modern keyboard” to refer to emoji panel, clipboard history, dictation, modern input method editor interfaces and such). Being an overlay window, modern keyboard does not raise events which allows NVDA to automatically announce what’s focused, and once closed, Windows does not tell NVDA that the overlay window is closed properly. This results in NVDA forgetting what you were working on when modern keyboard interface is closed, forcing you to switch apps. The fix does allow you to review additional controls at the cost of hunting for what you were doing last, which to me is unacceptable. The focus issue is the main reason why I told Microsoft to look into usability issues with modern keyboard interface changes in recent Insider Preview builds, as the new interface isn’t working with NVDA (thankfully, the latest Insider Preview build does restore the stable emoji panel interface that does work with NVDA).

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Dan Beaver
Sent: Monday, November 2, 2020 4:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

 

Hi Brian,

 

the problem is that on my system tabbing doesn't get me to those options.  All I can do is cursor through the entries in the history and press spacebar to paste that entry or hit delete to delete it.

 

Thanks.

 

Dan Beaver

On 11/2/2020 6:13 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

Dan,

           The three options "per item on clipboard history" are Delete (this item), Delete All, and Pin.  It's no surprise that a straight hit of the Delete key deletes the single item.  I wonder if a CTRL+ or ALT+ might do a Delete all?  I have no idea what might do a Pin.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

-- 
Dan Beaver (KA4DAN)


Re: appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

 

On Mon, Nov 2, 2020 at 06:52 PM, Betsy Grenevitch wrote:
This is something I have always wondered about but just never asked. When we are told about such things as "clipboard history" it would be nice to also be given how to access it. I have not had any professional training--or not much anyway--so have no idea where to find such a thing. I am sure I am not the only one on this list in that position.
-
Betsy,

           You know I've been helpful to you in the past and I want you to know that the following is not aimed at you, personally, but at this sort of complaint.  New features are new features.  Blind or sighted, most of us have to do web searches to get additional data.  If someone actually uses a feature and is able to give some additional information, and does so, well, bless 'em.  But there are many, and I'm among them, who are aware of features that we have chosen not to use.  There's nothing wrong, nothing at all, with giving information about the existence of a given feature and expecting readers to then go out and do their own homework if they wish to use it.

            Offering direction does not always entail offering a tutorial.  And it is expected, for members of online groups, that they possess the basic skills necessary to web search, and if they don't, that they should be asking how to gain those skills.  Age, visual status, or time using a computer is not an excuse for not doing so and if you, any you, need help to learn how to do effective web searches and content review then ask.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 


Re: appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

Dan Beaver
 

Hi Brian,


the problem is that on my system tabbing doesn't get me to those options.  All I can do is cursor through the entries in the history and press spacebar to paste that entry or hit delete to delete it.


Thanks.


Dan Beaver

On 11/2/2020 6:13 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Dan,

           The three options "per item on clipboard history" are Delete (this item), Delete All, and Pin.  It's no surprise that a straight hit of the Delete key deletes the single item.  I wonder if a CTRL+ or ALT+ might do a Delete all?  I have no idea what might do a Pin.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

-- 
Dan Beaver (KA4DAN)


Re: appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

Betsy Grenevitch
 

This is something I have always wondered about but just never asked. When we are told about such things as "clipboard history" it would be nice to also be given how to access it. I have not had any professional training--or not much anyway--so have no idea where to find such a thing. I am sure I am not the only one on this list in that position.


thanks for considering those of us who know just enough to get by and who are not technologically inclined.


On 11/1/2020 5:59 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Cearbhall and Dan,

         And I lied, kinda.  I had forgotten that there is also an NVDA add-on that deals with "collecting to the clipboard."  See: Clip Contents Designer

         I tend to be a copy-paste-copy-paste operator, but on those rare occasions that I want to do copy-copy-copy, paste-paste-paste, I use Clipboard History these days.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

-- 
Betsy Grenevitch
678-862-3876


Re: Drag and Drop

Gene
 

In 5.7 there is a section titled something like commands related to the mouse.
There is a brief description of drag and drop there. I found the section by opening the user guide, which opens in the default browser, and searching, as I would a web page because this is a long HTML document and your browser is working with your screen-reader in browse mode, for the word drag. I then moved up until I got to the start of the section.

You don't need to go back to the beginning unless you want more information but you will have to go back a little.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Louise Pfau
Sent: Monday, November 02, 2020 3:48 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Drag and Drop

Hi. I just went into the section of the user guide that you referenced, and there was nothing to do with drag and drop as such. There were commands for using the mouse.

Thanks,

Louise


Re: Drag and Drop

hurrikennyandopo ...
 

Hi


Are you using a physical mouse? or are you doing it by mouse commands.


Left mouse button lock
shift+numpadDivide
NVDA+control+[
none
Locks the left mouse button down. Press again to release it. To drag the mouse, press this key to lock the left button down and then move the mouse either physically or use one of the other mouse routing commands


Right mouse button lock
shift+numpadMultiply
NVDA+control+]
none
Locks the right mouse button down. Press again to release it. To drag the mouse, press this key to lock the right button down and then move the mouse either physically or use one of the other mouse routing commands


The other option is maybe the golden cursor add on which can be found at https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/goldenCursor.en.html

There is a part in there where you can also use the arrow keys to move the mouse if I remember right to drag and drop along with some other stuff that might be used.


if I remember right when I used to use a mouse it was basically find what you wanted to drag then hold down I think it was the left mouse key on the item move it to the new position then let the left mouse button off


Is this more like it?


I thin at times it may depend on the program 2.


Gene nz


Is

On 3/11/2020 10:48 am, Louise Pfau wrote:
Hi.  I just went into the section of the user guide that you referenced, and there was nothing to do with drag and drop as such.  There were commands for using the mouse.

Thanks,

Louise


Re: appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

 

Dan,

           The three options "per item on clipboard history" are Delete (this item), Delete All, and Pin.  It's no surprise that a straight hit of the Delete key deletes the single item.  I wonder if a CTRL+ or ALT+ might do a Delete all?  I have no idea what might do a Pin.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 


Add-on Updater 20.11.1 #addonrelease

 

Hi all,

Add-on Updater 20.11.1 is now available. This version resolves an incomplete bug fix included in version 20.11 (specifically, resolving a follow-up problem where you’ll hear error tones when you try to use Add-on Updater from source code version of NVDA).

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: Using Acrobat Reader DC with NVDA

Kelly Sapergia
 

Hi All,

Thanks for the messages. Bringing up the Reading Options menu helped
considerably.

Yours Sincerely,
Kelly John Sapergia
Show Host and Production Director
The Global Voice Internet Radio
www.theglobalvoice.info

Personal Website: www.ksapergia.net
Business Site (KJS Productions): www.kjsproductions.com
Follow me on Twitter at: kjsapergia


Re: appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

Dan Beaver
 

Well, I finally got the clipboard history feature to work on my system.


I did discover that while cursoring through the history you can remove entries from the history by selecting one and then just pressing the delete key.  This is good because I can't get to the options in the history at all.


Thanks for this info.


Dan Beaver

On 11/1/2020 8:41 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Sun, Nov 1, 2020 at 08:24 PM, Dan Beaver wrote:
When I copy things to the clipboard and then press windows + V it says the first item in the clipboard history but I can't figure out how to access the list of the history.
-
Up/Down arrow moves you through the items on the clipboard.

Enter pastes the one you have focus on.

If you wish to remove an item from Clipboard History, when you have focus on it hit Tab, activate the menu, and choose the appropriate option.

 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

-- 
Dan Beaver (KA4DAN)


Re: Drag and Drop

Louise Pfau
 

Hi.  I just went into the section of the user guide that you referenced, and there was nothing to do with drag and drop as such.  There were commands for using the mouse.

Thanks,

Louise


Re: Drag and Drop

hurrikennyandopo ...
 

Hi


See the section below in the user guide it will list all commands to do with the mouse including drag and drop.


5.7. Navigating with the Mouse



I did not copy in all the commands more to do with bandwidth with some people.


Gene nz


On 3/11/2020 9:09 am, Louise Pfau wrote:
Hi.  Is there a drag and drop feature for NVDA?  I couldn't find anything in the user guide.  JAWS uses CONTROL+JAWS+NUMPAD / to perform the function when you're focused on the item to be dragged, and then again when you're focused on the drop location.

Thanks,

Louise


Drag and Drop

Louise Pfau
 

Hi.  Is there a drag and drop feature for NVDA?  I couldn't find anything in the user guide.  JAWS uses CONTROL+JAWS+NUMPAD / to perform the function when you're focused on the item to be dragged, and then again when you're focused on the drop location.

Thanks,

Louise


Re: appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

hurrikennyandopo ...
 

Hi


After the clipboard feature was turned on and you had copied stuff to the clipboard then arrowed to the one to paste as you found also the space bar done the trick nicely .


using the enter key would at times just post v.


gene nz


On 3/11/2020 8:43 am, Chris Mullins wrote:

                Hi

                                I have been testing the Clipboard History feature of Windows 10 using NVDA and have achieved mixed results.  I can traverse the list of clipboard items with up/down arrows but the enter key,  has caused me problems. 

 

When located on a particular item in the clipboard items list, pressing enter pastes in the requisite item but causes focus issues in the test Notepad document I am using and when I use NVDA+t to identify which document I am in, NVDA gives audio feedback about braille tethering, so I think  there may be some compatibility issues here.  Repeated presses of NVDA+t seems to cycle around the Braille tethering options.  I do not have a Braille device connected to my machine.  Flipping focus between open apps eventually restores normality.

 

I could not get the tab key to open any menus asociated with the Clipboard History list, the only menu I could get was a context menu using the Applications key and this had many options, mostly unavailable, delete being one of them however, Pressing the delete key whilst a particular list item is in focus, will remove it from the list.

 

I could not determine a way to move between the document and the Clipboard History window to paste in several clipboard items, other than by using Windows+v each time, neither could I select more than one clipboard item at a time for pasting.

 

I found that the most reliable way of pasting items from the Clipboard History list into your target document is to highlight an item using the arrow keys, then press the spacebar to paste it.  Focus returns to your target document after these keystrokes.

 

I think there may be compatibility issues with the ClipSpeak add-on as well.  When pasting several items from the Clipboard History list, I found that ClipSpeak was only announcing every other  item as "Pasted text" but the strange thing was that the items that were not announced were pasted successfully and those announced, failed to paste into the target document.  After disabling Clipspeak, I was able to use the spacebar to paste items consistently.           

 

Cheers

Chris

 

From: Brian Vogel
Sent: 02 November 2020 01:42
tTo: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] appending to clipboard instead of just copying toclipboard?

 

On Sun, Nov 1, 2020 at 08:24 PM, Dan Beaver wrote:

When I copy things to the clipboard and then press windows + V it says the first item in the clipboard history but I can't figure out how to access the list of the history.

-
Up/Down arrow moves you through the items on the clipboard.

Enter pastes the one you have focus on.

If you wish to remove an item from Clipboard History, when you have focus on it hit Tab, activate the menu, and choose the appropriate option.

 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

 

-->


Re: appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

 

Hi,

As for keyboard command issue, this is caused by the fact that clipboard history will internally press Control+V, thereby causing the control key to get stuck.

As for moving between the document and clipboard history, it isn’t possible because clipboard history is really an overlay window, not a truly focusable control.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris Mullins
Sent: Monday, November 2, 2020 11:44 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] appending to clipboard instead of just copying toclipboard?

 

                Hi

                                I have been testing the Clipboard History feature of Windows 10 using NVDA and have achieved mixed results.  I can traverse the list of clipboard items with up/down arrows but the enter key,  has caused me problems. 

 

When located on a particular item in the clipboard items list, pressing enter pastes in the requisite item but causes focus issues in the test Notepad document I am using and when I use NVDA+t to identify which document I am in, NVDA gives audio feedback about braille tethering, so I think  there may be some compatibility issues here.  Repeated presses of NVDA+t seems to cycle around the Braille tethering options.  I do not have a Braille device connected to my machine.  Flipping focus between open apps eventually restores normality.

 

I could not get the tab key to open any menus asociated with the Clipboard History list, the only menu I could get was a context menu using the Applications key and this had many options, mostly unavailable, delete being one of them however, Pressing the delete key whilst a particular list item is in focus, will remove it from the list.

 

I could not determine a way to move between the document and the Clipboard History window to paste in several clipboard items, other than by using Windows+v each time, neither could I select more than one clipboard item at a time for pasting.

 

I found that the most reliable way of pasting items from the Clipboard History list into your target document is to highlight an item using the arrow keys, then press the spacebar to paste it.  Focus returns to your target document after these keystrokes.

 

I think there may be compatibility issues with the ClipSpeak add-on as well.  When pasting several items from the Clipboard History list, I found that ClipSpeak was only announcing every other  item as "Pasted text" but the strange thing was that the items that were not announced were pasted successfully and those announced, failed to paste into the target document.  After disabling Clipspeak, I was able to use the spacebar to paste items consistently.           

 

Cheers

Chris

 

From: Brian Vogel
Sent: 02 November 2020 01:42
tTo: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] appending to clipboard instead of just copying toclipboard?

 

On Sun, Nov 1, 2020 at 08:24 PM, Dan Beaver wrote:

When I copy things to the clipboard and then press windows + V it says the first item in the clipboard history but I can't figure out how to access the list of the history.

-
Up/Down arrow moves you through the items on the clipboard.

Enter pastes the one you have focus on.

If you wish to remove an item from Clipboard History, when you have focus on it hit Tab, activate the menu, and choose the appropriate option.

 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

 


Re: appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

Chris Mullins
 

                Hi

                                I have been testing the Clipboard History feature of Windows 10 using NVDA and have achieved mixed results.  I can traverse the list of clipboard items with up/down arrows but the enter key,  has caused me problems. 

 

When located on a particular item in the clipboard items list, pressing enter pastes in the requisite item but causes focus issues in the test Notepad document I am using and when I use NVDA+t to identify which document I am in, NVDA gives audio feedback about braille tethering, so I think  there may be some compatibility issues here.  Repeated presses of NVDA+t seems to cycle around the Braille tethering options.  I do not have a Braille device connected to my machine.  Flipping focus between open apps eventually restores normality.

 

I could not get the tab key to open any menus asociated with the Clipboard History list, the only menu I could get was a context menu using the Applications key and this had many options, mostly unavailable, delete being one of them however, Pressing the delete key whilst a particular list item is in focus, will remove it from the list.

 

I could not determine a way to move between the document and the Clipboard History window to paste in several clipboard items, other than by using Windows+v each time, neither could I select more than one clipboard item at a time for pasting.

 

I found that the most reliable way of pasting items from the Clipboard History list into your target document is to highlight an item using the arrow keys, then press the spacebar to paste it.  Focus returns to your target document after these keystrokes.

 

I think there may be compatibility issues with the ClipSpeak add-on as well.  When pasting several items from the Clipboard History list, I found that ClipSpeak was only announcing every other  item as "Pasted text" but the strange thing was that the items that were not announced were pasted successfully and those announced, failed to paste into the target document.  After disabling Clipspeak, I was able to use the spacebar to paste items consistently.           

 

Cheers

Chris

 

From: Brian Vogel
Sent: 02 November 2020 01:42
tTo: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] appending to clipboard instead of just copying toclipboard?

 

On Sun, Nov 1, 2020 at 08:24 PM, Dan Beaver wrote:

When I copy things to the clipboard and then press windows + V it says the first item in the clipboard history but I can't figure out how to access the list of the history.

-
Up/Down arrow moves you through the items on the clipboard.

Enter pastes the one you have focus on.

If you wish to remove an item from Clipboard History, when you have focus on it hit Tab, activate the menu, and choose the appropriate option.

 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

 


Re: appending to clipboard instead of just copying to clipboard?

 

On Mon, Nov 2, 2020 at 01:20 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:
Therefore a suggestion that can sound like, “please add clipboard append functionality to Windows 10 App Essentials add-on” is hereby denied (I’m speaking as the author of Windows 10 App Essentials add-on).
-
And since such exists both under Windows 10 and an NVDA Add-On, there would be no earthly reason to do so, period.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

9061 - 9080 of 87710