Date   

word perfect

Don H
 

How well does the latest version of Word Perfect work with screen readers? See Word Perfect on sale for $59.


2020-12-19: Add-ons Site Up and Running Again

Quentin Christensen
 

Hi everyone,

We're aware of the issue with the add-ons site being down, and we're looking into it. Thanks for your patience.

Quentin


Re: copy to clip board

Arlene
 

I like that. I like how NVDA says Copy to clipboard. 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Don H
Sent: December 18, 2020 2:11 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] copy to clip board

 

The fnew feature within the NVDA beta where it says copy to clip board

and then says what has been copied is really a nice new feature.

 

 

 

 

 

 


Re: copy to clip board

Vickie Andrada
 

I personally like it. For me it's not a big deal to hit the control key if I don't want to hear exactly what it's copied. But each to their own. So maybe it'd be good to be able to turn this off if you didn't want it.

Vicki

On 12/18/2020 7:09 PM, Gene wrote:
Comments on what's new in the beta:

I don't think automatic reading of what is copied to the clipboard is a good feature.  First, it only says copied to clipboard where it always has, that is, in Browse Mode.  It doesn't do what the add-on does, that is, say copied or copied to clipboard in general.  The only change is that it now repeats the text you have copied to the clipboard, which  is already available using the command NVDA c.  I generally know what I have selected before I copy it and I'd rather issue the command to hear it if I want it announced.  This way, I have to stop speech every time I don't want the readout.


I think the automatic reading should be removed and that the announcement of copied or copied to clipboard should be made universal, as the add-on does.


I wouldn't object if an announcement were made when copying text that says something like, to hear what has been selected before copying, use NVDA c or NVDA key c.  You would then be instructed that to stop this announcement, do something like issue the command NVDA c quickly twice.  But this is an example of too much automation and it tells you what is copied after you did so where the NVDA c command tells you what you will copy.  I don't want to make this more important than it is.  Pressing control to stop speech takes almost no time and can be gotten used to quickly, its the principle.  I think its too much verbosity and often duplicates what I hear when I want to when selecting text or using NVDA key 3.


I very seldom work with sites that have Aria live regions, so I can't test this, but the feature that turns off speech from those regions when dynamic content is turned off is an important addition.


When using the f1 help in NVDA dialogs, in the one dialog I tested it in, document formatting, you lose your place in the dialog when help is opened with f1.  Closing help returns you to the beginning of the dialog.  Also, after frames, there is an unlabeled checkbox and it is not listed in the help documentation.  why is it there and what does it do?


Figure and out of figure are also still not controllable in the object presentation dialog.

Gene

12/18/2020 4:10 PM, Don H wrote:

The fnew feature within the NVDA beta where it says copy to clip board and then says what has been copied is really a nice new feature.








Re: copy to clip board

Gene
 

Comments on what's new in the beta:

I don't think automatic reading of what is copied to the clipboard is a good feature.  First, it only says copied to clipboard where it always has, that is, in Browse Mode.  It doesn't do what the add-on does, that is, say copied or copied to clipboard in general.  The only change is that it now repeats the text you have copied to the clipboard, which  is already available using the command NVDA c.  I generally know what I have selected before I copy it and I'd rather issue the command to hear it if I want it announced.  This way, I have to stop speech every time I don't want the readout.


I think the automatic reading should be removed and that the announcement of copied or copied to clipboard should be made universal, as the add-on does.


I wouldn't object if an announcement were made when copying text that says something like, to hear what has been selected before copying, use NVDA c or NVDA key c.  You would then be instructed that to stop this announcement, do something like issue the command NVDA c quickly twice.  But this is an example of too much automation and it tells you what is copied after you did so where the NVDA c command tells you what you will copy.  I don't want to make this more important than it is.  Pressing control to stop speech takes almost no time and can be gotten used to quickly, its the principle.  I think its too much verbosity and often duplicates what I hear when I want to when selecting text or using NVDA key 3.


I very seldom work with sites that have Aria live regions, so I can't test this, but the feature that turns off speech from those regions when dynamic content is turned off is an important addition.


When using the f1 help in NVDA dialogs, in the one dialog I tested it in, document formatting, you lose your place in the dialog when help is opened with f1.  Closing help returns you to the beginning of the dialog.  Also, after frames, there is an unlabeled checkbox and it is not listed in the help documentation.  why is it there and what does it do?


Figure and out of figure are also still not controllable in the object presentation dialog.

Gene

12/18/2020 4:10 PM, Don H wrote:

The fnew feature within the NVDA beta where it says copy to clip board and then says what has been copied is really a nice new feature.





copy to clip board

Don H
 

The fnew feature within the NVDA beta where it says copy to clip board and then says what has been copied is really a nice new feature.


locked Re: [chat] is it possible to access the BIOS with a screen reader

 

I do not know who elected to move this topic, appropriately originated on the Chat Subgroup, here, and I am presuming it is accidental.

That being said, this topic is now locked.  We absolutely know that BIOS/UEFI is not accessible using NVDA, JAWS, Narrator, or any of the other now out-of-support Windows platform screen readers.  It's not going to become so using any of those screen readers, because it can't, since UEFI/BIOS access must occur before Windows is running, and Windows must be running before the screen readers listed can run.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

[Regarding the Supreme Court refusing to hear the case brought by Texas to overturn the votes certified by 4 states:Pleased with the SCOTUS ruling, but also immediately slightly terrified of where this crazy train goes next.  We should know by now there’s a bottomless supply of crazy.

        ~ Brendan Buck, former adviser to Speakers of the House Paul Ryan and John Boehner 

 


locked Re: [chat] is it possible to access the BIOS with a screen reader

Howard Traxler
 

In what memory location (address) are the BIOS values stored?  It seems that one could simply write a program to read that section of memory and display the content.  The next step would be to modify those values and write it all back to memory.

On 12/18/2020 1:39 PM, Clive May wrote:
Hi
In the days of DOS, there was a suite of utilities which would read the BIOS settings into a HEX file and write them back to the BIOS.  There was no utility, as far as I know,  to allow you to amend the file and, if there had been a way, I am uncertain if the settings could be put back successfully if the file was changed.


On 18/12/2020 18:16, Howard Traxler wrote:
In the distant passed, I was successful dumping the screen to a Braille embosser through the parallel port each time I made a change.


On 12/18/2020 9:40 AM, molly the blind tech lover wrote:

Hey guys, Molly here.

In order to run my virtual machine it requires a change to the BIOS settings on my PC.

Can one access the BIOS without sighted assistance?

I am thinking not, because the BIOS comes up before Windows boots.

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

My professor is looking into getting sighted assistance to help, but as my entire family has COVID we’re stuck at the moment.

Regards

Molly


locked Re: [chat] is it possible to access the BIOS with a screen reader

Clive May <clive.may@...>
 

Hi


I believe it's a security matter. 


On 18/12/2020 18:22, Shaun Everiss wrote:

No, you will need to have someone with sight do that.

You'd think that there would be a reader now for bios, since the efi os is quite detailed.

On a probook I worked on it appeared like a menu driven program like you would see in a text editor like notepad, why it was never ported to windows is anyone's guess.

Toshiba did that in the day, first a menu then a control panel type program then an app.

One assumes it could be a universal but you need someone to ddo that for you.



On 19/12/2020 4:40 am, molly the blind tech lover wrote:

Hey guys, Molly here.

In order to run my virtual machine it requires a change to the BIOS settings on my PC.

Can one access the BIOS without sighted assistance?

I am thinking not, because the BIOS comes up before Windows boots.

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

My professor is looking into getting sighted assistance to help, but as my entire family has COVID we’re stuck at the moment.

Regards

Molly


locked Re: [chat] is it possible to access the BIOS with a screen reader

Clive May <clive.may@...>
 

Hi
In the days of DOS, there was a suite of utilities which would read the BIOS settings into a HEX file and write them back to the BIOS.  There was no utility, as far as I know,  to allow you to amend the file and, if there had been a way, I am uncertain if the settings could be put back successfully if the file was changed. 

 

On 18/12/2020 18:16, Howard Traxler wrote:
In the distant passed, I was successful dumping the screen to a Braille embosser through the parallel port each time I made a change.


On 12/18/2020 9:40 AM, molly the blind tech lover wrote:

Hey guys, Molly here.

In order to run my virtual machine it requires a change to the BIOS settings on my PC.

Can one access the BIOS without sighted assistance?

I am thinking not, because the BIOS comes up before Windows boots.

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

My professor is looking into getting sighted assistance to help, but as my entire family has COVID we’re stuck at the moment.

Regards

Molly



Re: Using the NVDA Dictionaries to Alter Pronunciations

Dan Miner
 

I have been getting  similar issues with versions of source code packages.  I’m using MS Core for my voice but it is clearly interpreting things like.  20.01.05 as a date... my favorite is partial intepretation..  2.03.26 comes out as 1 March 2016.  *sigh*

    Dan

On Dec 18, 2020, at 9:54 AM, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Fri, Dec 18, 2020 at 04:07 AM, Robert Doc Wright godfearer wrote:
Ok then I need to address this to Code factory because I am using Eloquence.
-
No snark toward you intended (it's aimed at Code Factory/Eloquence):  Good luck with that.

This sort of behavior is not limited to Eloquence, and I've experienced it with a number of other synths, and when using them with other screen readers.  The issue with making changes is the same for a synth-maker as it is for any software maker that has had a given behavior or feature out there for a very long time:  Many users rely on that behavior, even if it drives other users insane.  You cannot please everyone with whatever defaults or "efficiency shortcuts" you take that work for many, but really don't work for some (who may still be many in number).

The whole purpose of the speech dictionary functions in screen readers is to get around quirks like this one.  And if you want a quick result, you use that tool yourself, as it could be months to years to never as far as getting any change from the synth itself.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

[Regarding the Supreme Court refusing to hear the case brought by Texas to overturn the votes certified by 4 states:Pleased with the SCOTUS ruling, but also immediately slightly terrified of where this crazy train goes next.  We should know by now there’s a bottomless supply of crazy.

        ~ Brendan Buck, former adviser to Speakers of the House Paul Ryan and John Boehner 

 


Re: Dell issues - information request

g melconian <gmelconian619@...>
 

Same here even though mine is a 6 year old one.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Austin Pinto
Sent: Friday, December 18, 2020 5:57 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Dell issues - information request

yes. i also use a dell. and what ishue are you looking for?

On 12/18/20, mike mcglashon <michael.mcglashon@comcast.net> wrote:
Hi quentin:



I use dell,

I think 5570 inspiron;

I do notice that with n v d a 2020.3 at least,

When I arrow to a file in my folder list,

Then hit shift-f10,

Then hit rename file,

And whenst I arrow through the file name to edit the name,

N v d a hangs,

The whole computer hangs at that point.



Am not sure if this is the kind of data you are looking for,

But,

When I saw your message,

I decided it was the time to report it.





Please advise as you like.



Mike M.



Mike mcglashon

Email: <mailto:Michael.mcglashon@comcast.net>
Michael.mcglashon@comcast.net

Ph: 618 783 9331



From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin
Christensen
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2020 11:02 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Dell issues - information request



Hi everyone,



I'd like to collate a bit more information just from those having
issues with Dell PCs and NVDA at the moment please. If that's you,
could you please reply and let me know:



1) What model laptop you have?

1a) If you know what Driver / driver version you have that would be
great too please.

2) Which version of Windows are you using?

3) Which version of NVDA you are using?



If anyone is using alpha versions, if you use the stable 2020.3 does
it make a difference?



My feeling is this is a Dell / Realtek driver issue, but I'd like to
double check and also collate that information for chasing it up with
Dell and Realtek.



Kind regards



Quentin.





--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager



Web: <http://www.nvaccess.org/> www.nvaccess.org

Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/

User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess <https://twitter.com/NVAccess>









--
search for me on facebook, google+, orkut..
austinpinto.xaviers@gmail.com
follow me on twitter.
austinmpinto
contact me on skype.
austin.pinto3


Re: NVDA not reading anything but plain text

Dan Miner
 

I recently had a different outcome but I suspect similar root issue. For whatever reason, an NVDA setting will change surprisingly and usually for the worse. There is an AppData/Roaming directory under your user profile (use echo %USERPROFILE% in a console if you don’t know yours). You’ll find an NVDA folder there with local settings. I had to delete that directory to restore defaults to even use NVDA in any form (even installer wouldn’t work properly).

Dan

On Dec 18, 2020, at 11:25 AM, Gene <gsasner@gmail.com> wrote:

Do you mean it doesn't read what is displayed by a browser? Does that also include what is displayed by word processors? Plain text means nothing but text and would limit you to something like Notepad.

Have you tried other screen-readers and had a sighted person look at the screen to see if what is displayed looks as it should? Without more knowledge, we have no basis to assume the problem is an NVDA problem.

Gene
-----Original Message----- From: Joy Francis
Sent: Friday, December 18, 2020 12:06 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA not reading anything but plain text



I have been using NVDA for years. All of a sudden NVDA stopped reading everything, but plain text.

I have gone through all the typical electron fixes. 1. make sure it is on. 2. turn it off and restart; close browser and restart; 3. check for updates; 4. turn computer off and restart and do 1 - 3 again; 4. uninstall NVDA and reinstall.

So far nothing has helped. The question has been sent to NVDA but the tech person assigned to my question is out until January 2021. He recommended coming here and asking for help.

Any and all help is greatly appreciated.

Joy Francis







Re: NVDA not reading anything but plain text

Gene
 

Do you mean it doesn't read what is displayed by a browser? Does that also include what is displayed by word processors? Plain text means nothing but text and would limit you to something like Notepad.

Have you tried other screen-readers and had a sighted person look at the screen to see if what is displayed looks as it should? Without more knowledge, we have no basis to assume the problem is an NVDA problem.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Joy Francis
Sent: Friday, December 18, 2020 12:06 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA not reading anything but plain text



I have been using NVDA for years. All of a sudden NVDA stopped reading everything, but plain text.

I have gone through all the typical electron fixes. 1. make sure it is on. 2. turn it off and restart; close browser and restart; 3. check for updates; 4. turn computer off and restart and do 1 - 3 again; 4. uninstall NVDA and reinstall.

So far nothing has helped. The question has been sent to NVDA but the tech person assigned to my question is out until January 2021. He recommended coming here and asking for help.

Any and all help is greatly appreciated.

Joy Francis


Re: NVDA not reading anything but plain text

Tyler Spivey
 

What do you expect it to read?

On 12/18/2020 10:06 AM, Joy Francis wrote:
I have been using NVDA for years. All of a sudden NVDA stopped reading everything, but plain text.
I have gone through all the typical electron fixes. 1. make sure it is on. 2. turn it off and restart; close browser and restart; 3. check for updates; 4. turn computer off and restart and do 1 - 3 again; 4. uninstall NVDA and reinstall.
So far nothing has helped. The question has been sent to NVDA but the tech person assigned to my question is out until January 2021. He recommended coming here and asking for help.
Any and all help is greatly appreciated.
Joy Francis


NVDA not reading anything but plain text

Joy Francis
 

I have been using NVDA for years. All of a sudden NVDA stopped reading everything, but plain text.

I have gone through all the typical electron fixes. 1. make sure it is on. 2. turn it off and restart; close browser and restart; 3. check for updates; 4. turn computer off and restart and do 1 - 3 again; 4. uninstall NVDA and reinstall. 

So far nothing has helped. The question has been sent to NVDA but the tech person assigned to my question is out until January 2021. He recommended coming here and asking for help.

Any and all help is greatly appreciated.

Joy Francis


Re: Dell issues - information request

Hareth <hareth4m@...>
 

Hi Mike,
Just Press F2 on the file, That should give you the rename edit box.
TC

On 12/18/20, mike mcglashon <michael.mcglashon@comcast.net> wrote:
Hi quentin:



I use dell,

I think 5570 inspiron;

I do notice that with n v d a 2020.3 at least,

When I arrow to a file in my folder list,

Then hit shift-f10,

Then hit rename file,

And whenst I arrow through the file name to edit the name,

N v d a hangs,

The whole computer hangs at that point.



Am not sure if this is the kind of data you are looking for,

But,

When I saw your message,

I decided it was the time to report it.





Please advise as you like.



Mike M.



Mike mcglashon

Email: <mailto:Michael.mcglashon@comcast.net>
Michael.mcglashon@comcast.net

Ph: 618 783 9331



From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin
Christensen
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2020 11:02 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Dell issues - information request



Hi everyone,



I'd like to collate a bit more information just from those having issues
with Dell PCs and NVDA at the moment please. If that's you, could you
please reply and let me know:



1) What model laptop you have?

1a) If you know what Driver / driver version you have that would be great
too please.

2) Which version of Windows are you using?

3) Which version of NVDA you are using?



If anyone is using alpha versions, if you use the stable 2020.3 does it make
a difference?



My feeling is this is a Dell / Realtek driver issue, but I'd like to double
check and also collate that information for chasing it up with Dell and
Realtek.



Kind regards



Quentin.





--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager



Web: <http://www.nvaccess.org/> www.nvaccess.org

Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/

User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess <https://twitter.com/NVAccess>









Re: Using the NVDA Dictionaries to Alter Pronunciations

 

On Fri, Dec 18, 2020 at 04:07 AM, Robert Doc Wright godfearer wrote:
Ok then I need to address this to Code factory because I am using Eloquence.
-
No snark toward you intended (it's aimed at Code Factory/Eloquence):  Good luck with that.

This sort of behavior is not limited to Eloquence, and I've experienced it with a number of other synths, and when using them with other screen readers.  The issue with making changes is the same for a synth-maker as it is for any software maker that has had a given behavior or feature out there for a very long time:  Many users rely on that behavior, even if it drives other users insane.  You cannot please everyone with whatever defaults or "efficiency shortcuts" you take that work for many, but really don't work for some (who may still be many in number).

The whole purpose of the speech dictionary functions in screen readers is to get around quirks like this one.  And if you want a quick result, you use that tool yourself, as it could be months to years to never as far as getting any change from the synth itself.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

[Regarding the Supreme Court refusing to hear the case brought by Texas to overturn the votes certified by 4 states:Pleased with the SCOTUS ruling, but also immediately slightly terrified of where this crazy train goes next.  We should know by now there’s a bottomless supply of crazy.

        ~ Brendan Buck, former adviser to Speakers of the House Paul Ryan and John Boehner 

 


Re: Do you use plain text email or HTML-formatted? #poll-notice

 

Thank you to all who have replied.  Someone pointed out to me something I had overlooked completely, since I have been so focused on the absent "Reply to Sender" link in one of the two formats:  BOTH have an email link for the message's sender at the very end of the cluster of links, right after the Unsubscribe entry, and in both cases that mailto email link is enclosed with square brackets.

So until and unless Groups.io figures out why this is happening, the ability to privately respond to the sender of any given message still exists.

There is a difference between the Reply to Sender link and the mailto link at the end of the cluster, and that is that the Reply to Sender prepopulates the Subject of the email created with the prefix, "Private:," followed by the name of the topic.  This can, of course, be changed.  The mailto link just causes an email composition window to open with the To: field prepopulated for the sender, but nothing in the Subject, so you have to put whatever subject line it is you'd like.

Again, my appreciation for all the assistance that's been given.  Although the resolution is not (yet, anyway) the consistency I'd hoped for with a Reply to Sender option there is a viable workaround that's easy enough to use until the issue is resolved.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

[Regarding the Supreme Court refusing to hear the case brought by Texas to overturn the votes certified by 4 states:Pleased with the SCOTUS ruling, but also immediately slightly terrified of where this crazy train goes next.  We should know by now there’s a bottomless supply of crazy.

        ~ Brendan Buck, former adviser to Speakers of the House Paul Ryan and John Boehner 

 


Re: Dell issues - information request

Giles Turnbull
 

Hi Quentin,

I didn't experience this issue with a Dell Latitude 5590 that I owned from August 2018 until I dropped and broke it in September 2019! The insurance policy I had allowed me to replace it with a Latitude 5500 but I've been using an old Asus laptop of mine rather than the Dell. I'll be back with my parents for a few days next week and will be able to try out the Dell Latitude 5500 and will be happy to post my comments on whether I experience any issues then :)

My asus G751JL gaming laptop uses RealTek audio drivers and usually requires me to forceably re-start NVDA with Alt+CTRL+n two or three times per day when NVDA grinds to a halt doing things ... I don't know whether this is related to the Dell issue and I don't know how to test it out. I've owned and heavily used the Asus laptop for a good 4 years.

Giles

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