Date   

Re: adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA

enes sarıbaş
 

Hi Brian,

I very much went against this advice, and installed 64 bit versions of file compression, format conversion, and office software etc.Even browsers, I was one of the early upgraders to Firefox 64 bit. Until Reader 64 bit, I had no issues whatsoever with 64 bit software.  Nor did I see any advice with Mozilla, Microsoft etc against choosing a 64 bit version.


On 10/7/2021 7:29 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Thu, Oct 7, 2021 at 11:02 AM, Gene wrote:
This page appears to indicate that Windows 10 can run the 32 bit version but not Windows 11. 
-
Gene,

You've somehow overlooked or misread the table on that page.  32-bit software remains supported under all 64-bit versions of Windows, including Windows 11.  And the table for the 32-bit version of Acrobat Reader states it runs under:

Windows 11 (64 bit), Windows 10 (32 bit and 64 bit) version 1809 or later, Windows 8, 8.1 (32 bit and 64 bit), Windows 7 SP1 (32 bit and 64 bit), or Windows Server - 2008 R2 (64 bit), 2012 (64 bit), 2012 R2 (64 bit), 2016 (64 bit), or 2019 (64 bit)

Windows 10 is the final version of Windows that has an actual 32-bit version of the Windows operating system, but that's a separate issue.  Most of us are running Windows 10 64-bit unless we have very old hardware, and most will still have been using the 32-bit versions of Acrobat Reader, Microsoft Office, and a number of other pieces of software that still "prefer" (for lack of a better way of putting it) to install their 32-bit versions by default and only use 64-bit when explicitly chosen.

It's still pretty much "the general advice" among techs that if a piece of software "has some age on it" and there exist both 32 and 64-bit versions, to install the 32-bit versions for a more trouble-free experience.  I fully expect that this is going to change in the years after Windows 11 becomes common as there will be no reason to focus on maintaining 32-bit and 64-bit versions, and 64-bit will definitely win out as time marches on.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA

 

On Thu, Oct 7, 2021 at 11:02 AM, Gene wrote:
This page appears to indicate that Windows 10 can run the 32 bit version but not Windows 11. 
-
Gene,

You've somehow overlooked or misread the table on that page.  32-bit software remains supported under all 64-bit versions of Windows, including Windows 11.  And the table for the 32-bit version of Acrobat Reader states it runs under:

Windows 11 (64 bit), Windows 10 (32 bit and 64 bit) version 1809 or later, Windows 8, 8.1 (32 bit and 64 bit), Windows 7 SP1 (32 bit and 64 bit), or Windows Server - 2008 R2 (64 bit), 2012 (64 bit), 2012 R2 (64 bit), 2016 (64 bit), or 2019 (64 bit)

Windows 10 is the final version of Windows that has an actual 32-bit version of the Windows operating system, but that's a separate issue.  Most of us are running Windows 10 64-bit unless we have very old hardware, and most will still have been using the 32-bit versions of Acrobat Reader, Microsoft Office, and a number of other pieces of software that still "prefer" (for lack of a better way of putting it) to install their 32-bit versions by default and only use 64-bit when explicitly chosen.

It's still pretty much "the general advice" among techs that if a piece of software "has some age on it" and there exist both 32 and 64-bit versions, to install the 32-bit versions for a more trouble-free experience.  I fully expect that this is going to change in the years after Windows 11 becomes common as there will be no reason to focus on maintaining 32-bit and 64-bit versions, and 64-bit will definitely win out as time marches on.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


locked Re: As Concerns Windows 11 Installation

 

This is a question that is off-topic for the NVDA group.  It has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with NVDA.  This topic is locked as of the posting of this message.

It either belongs on the Chat Subgroup or, better if you're seeking answers regarding Windows-related topics as a screen reader user, the Windows Access with Screen Readers Group (Formerly: Windows 10 for Screen Reader Users Group)

Group Archive: https://winaccess.groups.io/g/winaccess/topics

Subscribe: winaccess+subscribe@winaccess.groups.io

Post: winaccess@winaccess.groups.io  

Unsubscribe: winaccess+unsubscribe@winaccess.groups.io  

Group Owner: winaccess+owner@winaccess.groups.io  

Help: winaccess+help@winaccess.groups.io  

 
What I wrote above is not aimed at Ron, specifically, but the membership in general.  The main NVDA group is not going to become a Windows 11, Windows Feature Update, or anything else directly related to Windows but utterly disconnected from NVDA group.  Please lets nip this trend in the bud, now.

--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA

Rui Fontes
 

Downgrading, I don't believe...

But, you can remove the 64-bit version and install the 32-bit version.


It gaves always an error when starting, but it works...


Rui Fontes


Às 15:56 de 07/10/2021, enes sarıbaş escreveu:

I don't know if downgrading to 32 bit is even possible.   I am hoping someone from NVAccess would respond to this.

On 10/7/2021 5:51 PM, Christopher Duffley wrote:
OK...that's strange! Are you able to use another version of Adobe Reader for the time being? I'm not sure if NVAccess or someone in the add-ons community can do something about it, or better yet, Adobe themselves.

Thanks,

Christopher Duffley
Host of Mission Possible Podcast: http://www.missionpossiblepodcast.com
Cell: +1 (603) 851-6971

12 Pro Max

On Oct 7, 2021, at 10:42, enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:



Hi,

It does persist after running the tool.

On 10/7/2021 4:41 PM, Christopher Duffley wrote:
Could you try running the COM Registry Fixing Tool in the Tools menu, then restart the machine, and see if this persists?

Thanks,

Christopher Duffley
Host of Mission Possible Podcast: http://www.missionpossiblepodcast.com
Cell: +1 (603) 851-6971

12 Pro Max

On Oct 7, 2021, at 08:07, enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:

this sequence repeats in the log.

ERROR - RPC process 10084 (Acrobat.exe) (14:56:39.824) - Dummy-1229 (4232):
Thread 8124, build\x86_64\remote\COMProxyRegistration.cpp, registerCOMProxy, 182:
Unable to register interface IAccessibleHyperlink with proxy stub IAccessible2Proxy.dll, code -2147023156


On 10/7/2021 3:05 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
Hi all,

I am running latest windows 10 21h1, with NVDA latest alpha build   as of this writing.   Adobe reader 64 bit doesn't work at all.  When clicking on a document, it becomes unresponsive, and exits adobe reader within 30 seconds with no error message.  Is anyone else experiencing this?







Re: adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA

Gene
 

This page appears to indicate that Windows 10 can run the 32 bit version but not Windows 11. 
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2021 9:56 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA
 

I don't know if downgrading to 32 bit is even possible.   I am hoping someone from NVAccess would respond to this.

On 10/7/2021 5:51 PM, Christopher Duffley wrote:
OK...that's strange! Are you able to use another version of Adobe Reader for the time being? I'm not sure if NVAccess or someone in the add-ons community can do something about it, or better yet, Adobe themselves.
 
Thanks,
 
Christopher Duffley
Host of Mission Possible Podcast: http://www.missionpossiblepodcast.com
Cell: +1 (603) 851-6971
 
12 Pro Max

On Oct 7, 2021, at 10:42, enes sarıbaş mailto:enes.saribas@... wrote:



Hi,

It does persist after running the tool.

On 10/7/2021 4:41 PM, Christopher Duffley wrote:
Could you try running the COM Registry Fixing Tool in the Tools menu, then restart the machine, and see if this persists?
 
Thanks,
 
Christopher Duffley
Host of Mission Possible Podcast: http://www.missionpossiblepodcast.com
Cell: +1 (603) 851-6971
 
12 Pro Max

On Oct 7, 2021, at 08:07, enes sarıbaş mailto:enes.saribas@... wrote:

this sequence repeats in the log.

ERROR - RPC process 10084 (Acrobat.exe) (14:56:39.824) - Dummy-1229 (4232):
Thread 8124, build\x86_64\remote\COMProxyRegistration.cpp, registerCOMProxy, 182:
Unable to register interface IAccessibleHyperlink with proxy stub IAccessible2Proxy.dll, code -2147023156


On 10/7/2021 3:05 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
Hi all,

I am running latest windows 10 21h1, with NVDA latest alpha build   as of this writing.   Adobe reader 64 bit doesn't work at all.  When clicking on a document, it becomes unresponsive, and exits adobe reader within 30 seconds with no error message.  Is anyone else experiencing this?







Re: adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA

enes sarıbaş
 

I don't know if downgrading to 32 bit is even possible.   I am hoping someone from NVAccess would respond to this.

On 10/7/2021 5:51 PM, Christopher Duffley wrote:

OK...that's strange! Are you able to use another version of Adobe Reader for the time being? I'm not sure if NVAccess or someone in the add-ons community can do something about it, or better yet, Adobe themselves.

Thanks,

Christopher Duffley
Host of Mission Possible Podcast: http://www.missionpossiblepodcast.com
Cell: +1 (603) 851-6971

12 Pro Max

On Oct 7, 2021, at 10:42, enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:



Hi,

It does persist after running the tool.

On 10/7/2021 4:41 PM, Christopher Duffley wrote:
Could you try running the COM Registry Fixing Tool in the Tools menu, then restart the machine, and see if this persists?

Thanks,

Christopher Duffley
Host of Mission Possible Podcast: http://www.missionpossiblepodcast.com
Cell: +1 (603) 851-6971

12 Pro Max

On Oct 7, 2021, at 08:07, enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:

this sequence repeats in the log.

ERROR - RPC process 10084 (Acrobat.exe) (14:56:39.824) - Dummy-1229 (4232):
Thread 8124, build\x86_64\remote\COMProxyRegistration.cpp, registerCOMProxy, 182:
Unable to register interface IAccessibleHyperlink with proxy stub IAccessible2Proxy.dll, code -2147023156


On 10/7/2021 3:05 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
Hi all,

I am running latest windows 10 21h1, with NVDA latest alpha build   as of this writing.   Adobe reader 64 bit doesn't work at all.  When clicking on a document, it becomes unresponsive, and exits adobe reader within 30 seconds with no error message.  Is anyone else experiencing this?







Re: adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA

Christopher Duffley
 

OK...that's strange! Are you able to use another version of Adobe Reader for the time being? I'm not sure if NVAccess or someone in the add-ons community can do something about it, or better yet, Adobe themselves.

Thanks,

Christopher Duffley
Host of Mission Possible Podcast: http://www.missionpossiblepodcast.com
Cell: +1 (603) 851-6971

12 Pro Max

On Oct 7, 2021, at 10:42, enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:



Hi,

It does persist after running the tool.

On 10/7/2021 4:41 PM, Christopher Duffley wrote:
Could you try running the COM Registry Fixing Tool in the Tools menu, then restart the machine, and see if this persists?

Thanks,

Christopher Duffley
Host of Mission Possible Podcast: http://www.missionpossiblepodcast.com
Cell: +1 (603) 851-6971

12 Pro Max

On Oct 7, 2021, at 08:07, enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:

this sequence repeats in the log.

ERROR - RPC process 10084 (Acrobat.exe) (14:56:39.824) - Dummy-1229 (4232):
Thread 8124, build\x86_64\remote\COMProxyRegistration.cpp, registerCOMProxy, 182:
Unable to register interface IAccessibleHyperlink with proxy stub IAccessible2Proxy.dll, code -2147023156


On 10/7/2021 3:05 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
Hi all,

I am running latest windows 10 21h1, with NVDA latest alpha build   as of this writing.   Adobe reader 64 bit doesn't work at all.  When clicking on a document, it becomes unresponsive, and exits adobe reader within 30 seconds with no error message.  Is anyone else experiencing this?







Re: adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA

enes sarıbaş
 

Hi,

It does persist after running the tool.

On 10/7/2021 4:41 PM, Christopher Duffley wrote:

Could you try running the COM Registry Fixing Tool in the Tools menu, then restart the machine, and see if this persists?

Thanks,

Christopher Duffley
Host of Mission Possible Podcast: http://www.missionpossiblepodcast.com
Cell: +1 (603) 851-6971

12 Pro Max

On Oct 7, 2021, at 08:07, enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:

this sequence repeats in the log.

ERROR - RPC process 10084 (Acrobat.exe) (14:56:39.824) - Dummy-1229 (4232):
Thread 8124, build\x86_64\remote\COMProxyRegistration.cpp, registerCOMProxy, 182:
Unable to register interface IAccessibleHyperlink with proxy stub IAccessible2Proxy.dll, code -2147023156


On 10/7/2021 3:05 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
Hi all,

I am running latest windows 10 21h1, with NVDA latest alpha build   as of this writing.   Adobe reader 64 bit doesn't work at all.  When clicking on a document, it becomes unresponsive, and exits adobe reader within 30 seconds with no error message.  Is anyone else experiencing this?







Re: adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA

Christopher Duffley
 

Could you try running the COM Registry Fixing Tool in the Tools menu, then restart the machine, and see if this persists?

Thanks,

Christopher Duffley
Host of Mission Possible Podcast: http://www.missionpossiblepodcast.com
Cell: +1 (603) 851-6971

12 Pro Max

On Oct 7, 2021, at 08:07, enes sarıbaş <enes.saribas@...> wrote:

this sequence repeats in the log.

ERROR - RPC process 10084 (Acrobat.exe) (14:56:39.824) - Dummy-1229 (4232):
Thread 8124, build\x86_64\remote\COMProxyRegistration.cpp, registerCOMProxy, 182:
Unable to register interface IAccessibleHyperlink with proxy stub IAccessible2Proxy.dll, code -2147023156


On 10/7/2021 3:05 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
Hi all,

I am running latest windows 10 21h1, with NVDA latest alpha build   as of this writing.   Adobe reader 64 bit doesn't work at all.  When clicking on a document, it becomes unresponsive, and exits adobe reader within 30 seconds with no error message.  Is anyone else experiencing this?







Re: Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

Gene
 

Not when first turned on.  Nothing has changed on screen and a new screen hasn’t been ;presented.  If you justturn it on, it does nothing. 
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2021 6:28 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo
 

You’re right David, I just tried it. It doesn’t echo anything when first turned on.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Goldfield
Sent: 07 October 2021 10:43
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

My only disagreement with Steve’s description is that when you set the JAWS screen echo to “all” it does not automatically speak the contents of the screen.

This is not particularly detailed but here is the relevant description taken from the JAWS help system:

Screen Echo

This option allows you to select what information is echoed when text on the screen changes.

  • Off: Changes to displayed text are not echoed.
  • Highlighted: Changes to highlighted text are echoed. This is the default setting.
  • All: Changes to any displayed text are echoed.

 

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

JAWS Certified, 2019

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive emails regarding news and events in the blindness assistive technology field.

Email: tech-vi+subscribe@groups.io

 

www.DavidGoldfield.org

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, October 7, 2021 3:59 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Hi Quentin,

 

Essentially, it does exactly as described earlier down the thread.

 

When you enable it, it echoes the whole screen once. Then it monitors for changes and echoes them.

 

This is very useful for accessibility testing. It’s probably not a mainstream feature that everyone could use, but it would be helpful to have it.

 

All the best


Steve

 

--

To subscribe to our News and Special Offers list, go to https://www.comproom.co.uk/subscribe

 

Computer Room Services

77 Exeter Close

Stevenage

Hertfordshire

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T: +44(0)1438-742286

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E: steve@...

W: https://www.comproom.co.uk

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: 06 October 2021 22:41
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Perhaps what would be helpful here would be for someone familiar with the Jaws feature, to please describe how it works for the user?  Ok, so I'm a user, I have a program which doesn't seem to be accessible, I launch this feature.... what does it do?

 

With a number of features, it may be that there is a solution to a problem, and it may or may not be identical to the way Jaws does it, and I think sometimes we get stuck on "this is what Jaws does, I want it to work the same", rather than "this is the problem I'm trying to solve, is there a solution"?

 

On Thu, Oct 7, 2021 at 2:42 AM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Wed, Oct 6, 2021 at 10:07 AM, Gene wrote:

Not having both of these options imposes limitations that should be discussed unless there is a technical reason that they can’t be implemented.

-
Gene,

There are multitudes of things that could, potentially, be implemented but that are not because the need for same is so infrequent and/or other things have higher priority.  I say that not as a criticism of you, but in reaction to an observation that's often repeated that has the underlying belief that because someone, somewhere, once in a blue moon might be able to use a feature that it should be implemented.  That's not always the case.

And in an instance such as this one, it makes way more sense to pursue accessibility improvements through the developers of the apps, rather than having the screen reader(s) workaround what is clearly bad to non-existent accessibility in the software design itself.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 


Re: Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

Gene
 

This comment is based on my recollection and my experimentation now with a very old version of JAWS.  I haven’t used JAWS for a long time and I haven’t updated  it.  This needs to be checked or confirmed as the current behavior. 
 
The description isn’t completely accurate.  I can cause either all or most of the screen to be automatically echoed at times and at other times, only new or changed text is echoed.  I don’t know just when either happens. 
 
Gene

------Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2021 4:42 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo
 

My only disagreement with Steve’s description is that when you set the JAWS screen echo to “all” it does not automatically speak the contents of the screen.

This is not particularly detailed but here is the relevant description taken from the JAWS help system:

Screen Echo

This option allows you to select what information is echoed when text on the screen changes.

  • Off: Changes to displayed text are not echoed.
  • Highlighted: Changes to highlighted text are echoed. This is the default setting.
  • All: Changes to any displayed text are echoed.

 

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

JAWS Certified, 2019

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive emails regarding news and events in the blindness assistive technology field.

Email: tech-vi+subscribe@groups.io

 

www.DavidGoldfield.org

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, October 7, 2021 3:59 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Hi Quentin,

 

Essentially, it does exactly as described earlier down the thread.

 

When you enable it, it echoes the whole screen once. Then it monitors for changes and echoes them.

 

This is very useful for accessibility testing. It’s probably not a mainstream feature that everyone could use, but it would be helpful to have it.

 

All the best


Steve

 

--

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Computer Room Services

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Stevenage

Hertfordshire

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T: +44(0)1438-742286

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E: steve@...

W: https://www.comproom.co.uk

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: 06 October 2021 22:41
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Perhaps what would be helpful here would be for someone familiar with the Jaws feature, to please describe how it works for the user?  Ok, so I'm a user, I have a program which doesn't seem to be accessible, I launch this feature.... what does it do?

 

With a number of features, it may be that there is a solution to a problem, and it may or may not be identical to the way Jaws does it, and I think sometimes we get stuck on "this is what Jaws does, I want it to work the same", rather than "this is the problem I'm trying to solve, is there a solution"?

 

On Thu, Oct 7, 2021 at 2:42 AM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Wed, Oct 6, 2021 at 10:07 AM, Gene wrote:

Not having both of these options imposes limitations that should be discussed unless there is a technical reason that they can’t be implemented.

-
Gene,

There are multitudes of things that could, potentially, be implemented but that are not because the need for same is so infrequent and/or other things have higher priority.  I say that not as a criticism of you, but in reaction to an observation that's often repeated that has the underlying belief that because someone, somewhere, once in a blue moon might be able to use a feature that it should be implemented.  That's not always the case.

And in an instance such as this one, it makes way more sense to pursue accessibility improvements through the developers of the apps, rather than having the screen reader(s) workaround what is clearly bad to non-existent accessibility in the software design itself.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 


Re: adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA

enes sarıbaş
 

this sequence repeats in the log.

ERROR - RPC process 10084 (Acrobat.exe) (14:56:39.824) - Dummy-1229 (4232):
Thread 8124, build\x86_64\remote\COMProxyRegistration.cpp, registerCOMProxy, 182:
Unable to register interface IAccessibleHyperlink with proxy stub IAccessible2Proxy.dll, code -2147023156

On 10/7/2021 3:05 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
Hi all,

I am running latest windows 10 21h1, with NVDA latest alpha build   as of this writing.   Adobe reader 64 bit doesn't work at all.  When clicking on a document, it becomes unresponsive, and exits adobe reader within 30 seconds with no error message.  Is anyone else experiencing this?


adobe reader 64 bit does not work with NVDA

enes sarıbaş
 

Hi all,

I am running latest windows 10 21h1, with NVDA latest alpha build   as of this writing.   Adobe reader 64 bit doesn't work at all.  When clicking on a document, it becomes unresponsive, and exits adobe reader within 30 seconds with no error message.  Is anyone else experiencing this?


Re: Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

David Goldfield
 

Thanks for confirming this, Steve.

It’s one of those nice to have features but, for me, it is not essential. I occasionally use it for apps which frequently update the screen, such as when I copy a large number of files from one folder to another or when installing a piece of software where I want to automatically hear all of the changes which are taking place. Having all screen changes announced during such events is convenient but, again, not essential, at least for me. With NVDA I can always just use its review cursor to manually review screen updates. For most situations most of the time I never need to rely on it but someone else’s use case might dictate otherwise.

For those individuals I would say that filing this as a feature request in NVDA’s Github would be appropriate.

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

JAWS Certified, 2019

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive emails regarding news and events in the blindness assistive technology field.

Email: tech-vi+subscribe@groups.io

 

www.DavidGoldfield.org

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, October 7, 2021 7:29 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

You’re right David, I just tried it. It doesn’t echo anything when first turned on.

 

All the best


Steve

 

--

To subscribe to our News and Special Offers list, go to https://www.comproom.co.uk/subscribe

 

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77 Exeter Close

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T: +44(0)1438-742286

M: +44(0)7956-334938

F: +44(0)1438-759589

E: steve@...

W: https://www.comproom.co.uk

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Goldfield
Sent: 07 October 2021 10:43
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

My only disagreement with Steve’s description is that when you set the JAWS screen echo to “all” it does not automatically speak the contents of the screen.

This is not particularly detailed but here is the relevant description taken from the JAWS help system:

Screen Echo

This option allows you to select what information is echoed when text on the screen changes.

  • Off: Changes to displayed text are not echoed.
  • Highlighted: Changes to highlighted text are echoed. This is the default setting.
  • All: Changes to any displayed text are echoed.

 

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

JAWS Certified, 2019

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive emails regarding news and events in the blindness assistive technology field.

Email: tech-vi+subscribe@groups.io

 

www.DavidGoldfield.org

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, October 7, 2021 3:59 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Hi Quentin,

 

Essentially, it does exactly as described earlier down the thread.

 

When you enable it, it echoes the whole screen once. Then it monitors for changes and echoes them.

 

This is very useful for accessibility testing. It’s probably not a mainstream feature that everyone could use, but it would be helpful to have it.

 

All the best


Steve

 

--

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: 06 October 2021 22:41
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Perhaps what would be helpful here would be for someone familiar with the Jaws feature, to please describe how it works for the user?  Ok, so I'm a user, I have a program which doesn't seem to be accessible, I launch this feature.... what does it do?

 

With a number of features, it may be that there is a solution to a problem, and it may or may not be identical to the way Jaws does it, and I think sometimes we get stuck on "this is what Jaws does, I want it to work the same", rather than "this is the problem I'm trying to solve, is there a solution"?

 

On Thu, Oct 7, 2021 at 2:42 AM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Wed, Oct 6, 2021 at 10:07 AM, Gene wrote:

Not having both of these options imposes limitations that should be discussed unless there is a technical reason that they can’t be implemented.

-
Gene,

There are multitudes of things that could, potentially, be implemented but that are not because the need for same is so infrequent and/or other things have higher priority.  I say that not as a criticism of you, but in reaction to an observation that's often repeated that has the underlying belief that because someone, somewhere, once in a blue moon might be able to use a feature that it should be implemented.  That's not always the case.

And in an instance such as this one, it makes way more sense to pursue accessibility improvements through the developers of the apps, rather than having the screen reader(s) workaround what is clearly bad to non-existent accessibility in the software design itself.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 


Re: Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

Steve Nutt
 

You’re right David, I just tried it. It doesn’t echo anything when first turned on.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Goldfield
Sent: 07 October 2021 10:43
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

My only disagreement with Steve’s description is that when you set the JAWS screen echo to “all” it does not automatically speak the contents of the screen.

This is not particularly detailed but here is the relevant description taken from the JAWS help system:

Screen Echo

This option allows you to select what information is echoed when text on the screen changes.

  • Off: Changes to displayed text are not echoed.
  • Highlighted: Changes to highlighted text are echoed. This is the default setting.
  • All: Changes to any displayed text are echoed.

 

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

JAWS Certified, 2019

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive emails regarding news and events in the blindness assistive technology field.

Email: tech-vi+subscribe@groups.io

 

www.DavidGoldfield.org

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, October 7, 2021 3:59 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Hi Quentin,

 

Essentially, it does exactly as described earlier down the thread.

 

When you enable it, it echoes the whole screen once. Then it monitors for changes and echoes them.

 

This is very useful for accessibility testing. It’s probably not a mainstream feature that everyone could use, but it would be helpful to have it.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: 06 October 2021 22:41
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Perhaps what would be helpful here would be for someone familiar with the Jaws feature, to please describe how it works for the user?  Ok, so I'm a user, I have a program which doesn't seem to be accessible, I launch this feature.... what does it do?

 

With a number of features, it may be that there is a solution to a problem, and it may or may not be identical to the way Jaws does it, and I think sometimes we get stuck on "this is what Jaws does, I want it to work the same", rather than "this is the problem I'm trying to solve, is there a solution"?

 

On Thu, Oct 7, 2021 at 2:42 AM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Wed, Oct 6, 2021 at 10:07 AM, Gene wrote:

Not having both of these options imposes limitations that should be discussed unless there is a technical reason that they can’t be implemented.

-
Gene,

There are multitudes of things that could, potentially, be implemented but that are not because the need for same is so infrequent and/or other things have higher priority.  I say that not as a criticism of you, but in reaction to an observation that's often repeated that has the underlying belief that because someone, somewhere, once in a blue moon might be able to use a feature that it should be implemented.  That's not always the case.

And in an instance such as this one, it makes way more sense to pursue accessibility improvements through the developers of the apps, rather than having the screen reader(s) workaround what is clearly bad to non-existent accessibility in the software design itself.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 


Re: Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

David Goldfield
 

My only disagreement with Steve’s description is that when you set the JAWS screen echo to “all” it does not automatically speak the contents of the screen.

This is not particularly detailed but here is the relevant description taken from the JAWS help system:

Screen Echo

This option allows you to select what information is echoed when text on the screen changes.

  • Off: Changes to displayed text are not echoed.
  • Highlighted: Changes to highlighted text are echoed. This is the default setting.
  • All: Changes to any displayed text are echoed.

 

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

JAWS Certified, 2019

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive emails regarding news and events in the blindness assistive technology field.

Email: tech-vi+subscribe@groups.io

 

www.DavidGoldfield.org

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, October 7, 2021 3:59 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Hi Quentin,

 

Essentially, it does exactly as described earlier down the thread.

 

When you enable it, it echoes the whole screen once. Then it monitors for changes and echoes them.

 

This is very useful for accessibility testing. It’s probably not a mainstream feature that everyone could use, but it would be helpful to have it.

 

All the best


Steve

 

--

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: 06 October 2021 22:41
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Perhaps what would be helpful here would be for someone familiar with the Jaws feature, to please describe how it works for the user?  Ok, so I'm a user, I have a program which doesn't seem to be accessible, I launch this feature.... what does it do?

 

With a number of features, it may be that there is a solution to a problem, and it may or may not be identical to the way Jaws does it, and I think sometimes we get stuck on "this is what Jaws does, I want it to work the same", rather than "this is the problem I'm trying to solve, is there a solution"?

 

On Thu, Oct 7, 2021 at 2:42 AM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Wed, Oct 6, 2021 at 10:07 AM, Gene wrote:

Not having both of these options imposes limitations that should be discussed unless there is a technical reason that they can’t be implemented.

-
Gene,

There are multitudes of things that could, potentially, be implemented but that are not because the need for same is so infrequent and/or other things have higher priority.  I say that not as a criticism of you, but in reaction to an observation that's often repeated that has the underlying belief that because someone, somewhere, once in a blue moon might be able to use a feature that it should be implemented.  That's not always the case.

And in an instance such as this one, it makes way more sense to pursue accessibility improvements through the developers of the apps, rather than having the screen reader(s) workaround what is clearly bad to non-existent accessibility in the software design itself.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 


Re: Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

Steve Nutt
 

Jean, you are exactly right.

 

All the best


Steve

 

--

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 06 October 2021 22:59
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

I’m certainly not stuck on it and those who use JAWS can test and see if the feature works as I recall.  I haven’t used it for so long my memory may not be correct.  My recollection, from when I used it with a shell account in the late nineties with the Pine e-mail program is that it read everything on a screen the first time the screen was presented in full.  Then, my recollection is that if you let the computer sit on that screen, only new or changed material was read.  I seem to recall that if I was in the Pine inbox, swhen the status line almost at the bottom of the screen changed to announce the arrival of x number of new messages, that that line would be read automatically and nothing else. 

Others can confirm my recollection or state if it is wrong. 

 

If something that acts as I recall JAWS doing isn’t practical, then why have frames not been oincorporated into NVDA?  Why haven’t they been incorporated even if speak all were incorporated? In a frame, you define a certain part of the screen, and instruct the frame what to do.  For example, a frame could be instructed to read the text in the frame when it changes or to look for specific text and do something specific such as speak it or take an action.  Is there a technical reason this has never been done or has it just never been done?  Frames, Window-eyes called the same feature hyperactive windows, as I recall, allows a user who doesn’t know how to script to do a good deal of customization.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2021 4:40 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Perhaps what would be helpful here would be for someone familiar with the Jaws feature, to please describe how it works for the user?  Ok, so I'm a user, I have a program which doesn't seem to be accessible, I launch this feature.... what does it do?

 

With a number of features, it may be that there is a solution to a problem, and it may or may not be identical to the way Jaws does it, and I think sometimes we get stuck on "this is what Jaws does, I want it to work the same", rather than "this is the problem I'm trying to solve, is there a solution"?

 

On Thu, Oct 7, 2021 at 2:42 AM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Wed, Oct 6, 2021 at 10:07 AM, Gene wrote:

Not having both of these options imposes limitations that should be discussed unless there is a technical reason that they can’t be implemented.

-
Gene,

There are multitudes of things that could, potentially, be implemented but that are not because the need for same is so infrequent and/or other things have higher priority.  I say that not as a criticism of you, but in reaction to an observation that's often repeated that has the underlying belief that because someone, somewhere, once in a blue moon might be able to use a feature that it should be implemented.  That's not always the case.

And in an instance such as this one, it makes way more sense to pursue accessibility improvements through the developers of the apps, rather than having the screen reader(s) workaround what is clearly bad to non-existent accessibility in the software design itself.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 

 

 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 


Re: Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

Steve Nutt
 

Hi Quentin,

 

Essentially, it does exactly as described earlier down the thread.

 

When you enable it, it echoes the whole screen once. Then it monitors for changes and echoes them.

 

This is very useful for accessibility testing. It’s probably not a mainstream feature that everyone could use, but it would be helpful to have it.

 

All the best


Steve

 

--

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: 06 October 2021 22:41
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Equivalent to Jaw's Screen Echo

 

Perhaps what would be helpful here would be for someone familiar with the Jaws feature, to please describe how it works for the user?  Ok, so I'm a user, I have a program which doesn't seem to be accessible, I launch this feature.... what does it do?

 

With a number of features, it may be that there is a solution to a problem, and it may or may not be identical to the way Jaws does it, and I think sometimes we get stuck on "this is what Jaws does, I want it to work the same", rather than "this is the problem I'm trying to solve, is there a solution"?

 

On Thu, Oct 7, 2021 at 2:42 AM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Wed, Oct 6, 2021 at 10:07 AM, Gene wrote:

Not having both of these options imposes limitations that should be discussed unless there is a technical reason that they can’t be implemented.

-
Gene,

There are multitudes of things that could, potentially, be implemented but that are not because the need for same is so infrequent and/or other things have higher priority.  I say that not as a criticism of you, but in reaction to an observation that's often repeated that has the underlying belief that because someone, somewhere, once in a blue moon might be able to use a feature that it should be implemented.  That's not always the case.

And in an instance such as this one, it makes way more sense to pursue accessibility improvements through the developers of the apps, rather than having the screen reader(s) workaround what is clearly bad to non-existent accessibility in the software design itself.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 


locked As Concerns Windows 11 Installation

Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Group,

So with all the discussion of Windows 11 installation and functionality, i decided to check for updates and install Windows 11. The first thing I did was to download a file that is supposed to determine whether or not my system will support Windows 11. The file is called: WindowsPCHealthCheckSetup.exe.

I did this, ran it and it approved of my current system. Then I went to the Windows update on my system and saw that Windows 11 was indeed available for my system. I click on the download and install button and after several minutes, I was prompted to restart my computer. After another few minutes, my system booted successfully and I received the message: "Updates are being installed; please don't turn off your computer.'  After several more minutes, this message went away and everything ran fine.

...Except when I opened the start menu and typed in Winver and pressed enter, Windows informed me that I was still running Windows 10.

When I checked Windows update, it now says that I am up to date.
What happened?

--
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grevous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!


Re: windows 11 installation

betina vega
 

Hi, Brian:

Thank you for your response.
I will consider this, and probably wait.

Sincerely,
Betina Vega

On 10/6/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
From Joseph Lee, on Windows Access for Screen Reader Users Group message #
54796 ( https://winaccess.groups.io/g/winaccess/message/54796 ) :

*NVDA 2021.2 is required when using Windows 11 (older releases will work but
support isn’t really guaranteed). I would say that it would be best to think
about Windows 11 upgrades after NVDA 2021.3 comes out.*

I would presume that 2021.2 would be just fine.  But I'll add to what Joseph
said by saying that I wouldn't be in any rush to upgrade to Windows 11 until
at least 4 to six months have passed since its introduction (which is
effectively now).  So, I'd not be doing a Windows 11 upgrade until February,
at earliest, and would probably wait until early May 2022.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043

*The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.*

~ John F. Kennedy





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