Date   

Re: Different focus from say all and arrowing through

mike mcglashon
 

Block quote:
What are you pressing to start say all?
There are two of them. One starts from the system cursor, the other one starts from the review cursor. The one that starts from the review cursor doesn't move the system cursor.
End quote:

So, which keystroke invokes which "say all mode"?


Please advise as you like.

Mike M.

Mike mcglashon
Email: Michael.mcglashon@comcast.net
Ph: 618 783 9331

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tyler Spivey via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 4:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Different focus from say all and arrowing through

What are you pressing to start say all?
There are two of them. One starts from the system cursor, the other one starts from the review cursor. The one that starts from the review cursor doesn't move the system cursor.

On 10/20/2021 1:49 PM, Christopher Bartlett wrote:
While proofreading a long document using say-all, I'd find a place for
editing, and hit control to stop speech, but then when I'd arrow
through the document, I'd be in a different place. I have focus
follows caret set in review, so I figured the focus would, well,
follow the system caret. I thought the system caret would travel with the say'all cursor.
I'm a little rusty on NVDA concepts, since for a long time, I did most
of my work on a Chromebook, but now I'm using my win 10 machine a lot
more again, and MS Office.

Christopher Bartlett


--
Christopher Bartlett


Re: what next

dennis huckle <denniswhuckle@...>
 

Sorry folks,

Didn’t sign my name on last post.

Kind regards,

Dennis huckle.

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris via groups.io
Sent: 20 October 2021 21:23
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

Tech support are correct, and narrator wont work within the bios/uefi

So you will need sighted help to change the setting unfortunately

 

 

 

From: ken lawrence via groups.io
Sent: 20 October 2021 18:40
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] what next

 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

 


Re: what next

dennis huckle <denniswhuckle@...>
 

Hello all,

I can definitely confirm that to do anything in the bios you, like me will need sighted assistance.

Of course its really important that you know exactly what you want to achieve so as to assist yoin making the correct dicisions within bios.

ur sighted assistant

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris via groups.io
Sent: 20 October 2021 21:23
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

Tech support are correct, and narrator wont work within the bios/uefi

So you will need sighted help to change the setting unfortunately

 

 

 

From: ken lawrence via groups.io
Sent: 20 October 2021 18:40
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] what next

 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

 


Re: Different focus from say all and arrowing through

Tyler Spivey
 

What are you pressing to start say all?
There are two of them. One starts from the system cursor, the other one starts from the review cursor. The one that starts from the review cursor doesn't move the system cursor.

On 10/20/2021 1:49 PM, Christopher Bartlett wrote:
While proofreading a long document using say-all, I'd find a place for editing, and hit control to stop speech, but then when I'd arrow through the document, I'd be in a different place.  I have focus follows caret set in review, so I figured the focus would, well, follow the system caret.  I thought the system caret would travel with the say'all cursor.
I'm a little rusty on NVDA concepts, since for a long time, I did most of my work on a Chromebook, but now I'm using my win 10 machine a lot more again, and MS Office.
Christopher Bartlett
--
Christopher Bartlett


Different focus from say all and arrowing through

Christopher Bartlett
 

While proofreading a long document using say-all, I'd find a place for editing, and hit control to stop speech, but then when I'd arrow through the document, I'd be in a different place.  I have focus follows caret set in review, so I figured the focus would, well, follow the system caret.  I thought the system caret would travel with the say'all cursor.
I'm a little rusty on NVDA concepts, since for a long time, I did most of my work on a Chromebook, but now I'm using my win 10 machine a lot more again, and MS Office.

Christopher Bartlett


--
Christopher Bartlett


Re: what next

Chris
 

Tech support are correct, and narrator wont work within the bios/uefi

So you will need sighted help to change the setting unfortunately

 

 

 

From: ken lawrence via groups.io
Sent: 20 October 2021 18:40
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] what next

 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

 


Re: what next

Chris Mullins
 

Hi Ken

You can also download a mcafee removal tool from the mcafee web site.  I do not know how accessible it is but it should get rid of the remaining components.

 

Cheers

Chris

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Mohamed
Sent: 20 October 2021 19:45
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

HP actually has a BIOS configuration utility that can be used to edit BIOS settings from within Windows. https://ftp.ext.hp.com/pub/caps-softpaq/cmit/HP_BCU.html. this is a command line app that allows you to configure BIOS settings by editing a text file. You'll need to generate a text file of your current BIOS settings, and disable the setting called Action Key Mode by removing the asterisk from enabled and moving it to disable.

On 10/20/2021 1:40 PM, ken lawrence via groups.io wrote:

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

 


Re: Introductory questions about navigating in a browser.

Gene
 

When reading begins, press control to stop reading.  Then move line by line and you will hear each line and no more until you move to the next line.
 
There is a way to have the web page read but that won’t solve what you evidently want to do.  Evidently, you want to start reading at the beginning of content you want to read such as an article.  To do that, try moving using the letter n to skip blocks of links, or h, move by heading.  On some pages, one works better than the other. 
 
If you do want a page to read from the top, there is a setting you can change, discussed by another member.  There may be some pages where you want this at least at times. 
 
I don’t know how slow it is for you to type and I don’t know which you might prefer in situations like this:
Say you open a web page that is the home page of a newspaper.  You want to get to the link that says editorial.  If the page starts to read automatically, press control.
You can then open NVDA search, which is used on web pages and some other places, type edit and search.  This will save you from moving through a lot of links to find it.
Or you can open the links list and type the letter e until you find it.  I believe you press enter then to follow the link when in the links list. 
 
Or if, on this page, you haven’t gone to a lot of links to different sections of the paper, when the page opens and you have stopped automatic reading, if it occurs, type the letter v.  That moves you through links you have used before.  Then, when you get to the one you want, follow it as usual.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Alan Joyce
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 10:36 AM
Subject: [nvda] Introductory questions about navigating in a browser.
 

Hi,

 

I’m new to using NVDA having little exposure to other text to speech programs before jumping in. I’ve use a program called the Grid which acts as a keyboard emulator to help me with my typing as I’m unable to physically access a standard keyboard. With my setup on NVDA, I have found a few elements which I’m struggling with and would appreciate a guide through. These are;  

1.   When reading out a lengthy email from Gmail opened in the EDGE browser, is it possible to control the read back rate – say line by line – so I can pick up on what is being typed. What are the key combination for this and the settings which would allow this?

2.   When I open a webpage in the Edge, is it possible for NVDA to start to read the page content automatically? At the moment, it announces the page opening and I have to start finding my way through Tabbing or down arrow key which seems to work some times and then not others.

3.   For above, is there one reading mode which is preferred over the other?

 

I’m sure I’ve more to come on top of these but I’d welcome a start!

 

Kindest regards,

Alan

 

Windows 10, Ver 1909

 

 

Enable Ireland Disability Services Ltd. Registered Office Unit 32F, Rosemount Park Drive, Rosemount Business Park, Ballycoolin Road, Dublin 11 Registered in Dublin No.13909 Charity No.20006617 Patron Michael D. Higgins, President of Ireland Chairman Stephen Haughey Chief Executive John O'Sullivan Secretary Noreen Dempsey.

 

The information contained in this e-mail and in any attachments is confidential and is intended solely for attention and use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, please note that any form of use, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error please notify the sender and delete all copies from your computer system(s). The sender accepts no responsibility for unauthorised copying or processing of this email by any third party and disclaims any liability for any loss arising as a result.You are welcome to view our Privacy Notice on-line at: https://www.enableireland.ie/privacy-policy.


Re: what next

Mohamed
 

HP actually has a BIOS configuration utility that can be used to edit BIOS settings from within Windows. https://ftp.ext.hp.com/pub/caps-softpaq/cmit/HP_BCU.html. this is a command line app that allows you to configure BIOS settings by editing a text file. You'll need to generate a text file of your current BIOS settings, and disable the setting called Action Key Mode by removing the asterisk from enabled and moving it to disable.

On 10/20/2021 1:40 PM, ken lawrence via groups.io wrote:

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 


Re: what next

Gene
 

This has nothing to do with the screen-reader.  Narrator, being another screen-reader, will not work around the problem.  If someone didn’t use a screen-reader, the fn keys would function the same way.  Either your computer manufacturer provides a way to control this behavior using  commands provided not in BIOS or you will have to have someone change the BIOS setting.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 12:40 PM
Subject: [nvda] what next
 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 


Re: what next

Jackie
 

The short answer is no. The long answer is h*** (rhymes w/tech) no. I
suggest getting extremely good sighted assistance, because you mess
w/the wrong thing in BIOS, and things can go pear-shaped very quickly.
& this is 1 reason why I tend to steer clear of HP.

The battles grind on w/no end in sight, 2021 and beyond.

On 10/20/21, ken lawrence via groups.io
<kenlawrence124=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says
that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work. Will
narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and
regain use of function keys that way? I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on
this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus.
Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021?

Sent from Mail for Windows







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what next

ken lawrence
 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 


Re: NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Monte Single
 

My bad, it should read "document format" not page format.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: October 20, 2021 10:41 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

You have to go settings, page format, and uncheck columns and rows.
This page format section of settings has a huge selection of items to choose from; it is worth reviewing more than once to get things tuned the way you like.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Saylor Cooper
Sent: October 20, 2021 10:36 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Hello, I’m trying to figure out how to get NVDA to stop reading columns and rows especially on webpages whenever I don’t need that information. Thanks.

Saylor Cooper


Re: NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Saylor Cooper
 

Yes I got it thanks everyone.

Saylor Cooper

On Oct 20, 2021, at 11:48 AM, Jujube <ellaxyu@...> wrote:


Hi Saylor, I think you're referring to the reading of tables. You need to go to document formatting settings (NVDA control D), tab a bunch of times, and uncheck "row and column headers" or any of the other table reading settings. Hope this helps.

On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 9:35 AM Saylor Cooper <saylorcooper1@...> wrote:
Hello, I’m trying to figure out how to get NVDA to stop reading columns and rows especially on webpages whenever I don’t need that information. Thanks.

Saylor Cooper





Re: Introductory questions about navigating in a browser.

Jujube
 

Hi, I'll try to answer your questions though I for some reason don't fully know what you mean.

1. To read by line usually pressing up or down arrows can work. If you want to read by paragraph press control + up or down arrow.

2. If you want everything read to you when the page loads, change the following setting:
a. press NVDA control B to access browse mode settings.
b. tab a few times until you get to the setting "automatic say all on page load". Press space to check it and then press enter to close the dialog. Hope this helps.

On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 9:39 AM Alan Joyce <amjoyce@...> wrote:

Hi,

 

I’m new to using NVDA having little exposure to other text to speech programs before jumping in. I’ve use a program called the Grid which acts as a keyboard emulator to help me with my typing as I’m unable to physically access a standard keyboard. With my setup on NVDA, I have found a few elements which I’m struggling with and would appreciate a guide through. These are;  

1.   When reading out a lengthy email from Gmail opened in the EDGE browser, is it possible to control the read back rate – say line by line – so I can pick up on what is being typed. What are the key combination for this and the settings which would allow this?

2.   When I open a webpage in the Edge, is it possible for NVDA to start to read the page content automatically? At the moment, it announces the page opening and I have to start finding my way through Tabbing or down arrow key which seems to work some times and then not others.

3.   For above, is there one reading mode which is preferred over the other?

 

I’m sure I’ve more to come on top of these but I’d welcome a start!

 

Kindest regards,

Alan

 

Windows 10, Ver 1909

 

 

Enable Ireland Disability Services Ltd. Registered Office Unit 32F, Rosemount Park Drive, Rosemount Business Park, Ballycoolin Road, Dublin 11 Registered in Dublin No.13909 Charity No.20006617 Patron Michael D. Higgins, President of Ireland Chairman Stephen Haughey Chief Executive John O'Sullivan Secretary Noreen Dempsey.


The information contained in this e-mail and in any attachments is confidential and is intended solely for attention and use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, please note that any form of use, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error please notify the sender and delete all copies from your computer system(s). The sender accepts no responsibility for unauthorised copying or processing of this email by any third party and disclaims any liability for any loss arising as a result.You are welcome to view our Privacy Notice on-line at: https://www.enableireland.ie/privacy-policy.


Re: NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Jujube
 

Hi Saylor, I think you're referring to the reading of tables. You need to go to document formatting settings (NVDA control D), tab a bunch of times, and uncheck "row and column headers" or any of the other table reading settings. Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 9:35 AM Saylor Cooper <saylorcooper1@...> wrote:
Hello, I’m trying to figure out how to get NVDA to stop reading columns and rows especially on webpages whenever I don’t need that information. Thanks.

Saylor Cooper





Re: NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Monte Single
 

You have to go settings, page format, and uncheck columns and rows.
This page format section of settings has a huge selection of items to choose from; it is worth reviewing more than once to get things tuned the way you like.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Saylor Cooper
Sent: October 20, 2021 10:36 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Hello, I’m trying to figure out how to get NVDA to stop reading columns and rows especially on webpages whenever I don’t need that information. Thanks.

Saylor Cooper


Introductory questions about navigating in a browser.

Alan Joyce
 

Hi,

 

I’m new to using NVDA having little exposure to other text to speech programs before jumping in. I’ve use a program called the Grid which acts as a keyboard emulator to help me with my typing as I’m unable to physically access a standard keyboard. With my setup on NVDA, I have found a few elements which I’m struggling with and would appreciate a guide through. These are;  

1.   When reading out a lengthy email from Gmail opened in the EDGE browser, is it possible to control the read back rate – say line by line – so I can pick up on what is being typed. What are the key combination for this and the settings which would allow this?

2.   When I open a webpage in the Edge, is it possible for NVDA to start to read the page content automatically? At the moment, it announces the page opening and I have to start finding my way through Tabbing or down arrow key which seems to work some times and then not others.

3.   For above, is there one reading mode which is preferred over the other?

 

I’m sure I’ve more to come on top of these but I’d welcome a start!

 

Kindest regards,

Alan

 

Windows 10, Ver 1909

 

 

Enable Ireland Disability Services Ltd. Registered Office Unit 32F, Rosemount Park Drive, Rosemount Business Park, Ballycoolin Road, Dublin 11 Registered in Dublin No.13909 Charity No.20006617 Patron Michael D. Higgins, President of Ireland Chairman Stephen Haughey Chief Executive John O'Sullivan Secretary Noreen Dempsey.


The information contained in this e-mail and in any attachments is confidential and is intended solely for attention and use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, please note that any form of use, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error please notify the sender and delete all copies from your computer system(s). The sender accepts no responsibility for unauthorised copying or processing of this email by any third party and disclaims any liability for any loss arising as a result.You are welcome to view our Privacy Notice on-line at: https://www.enableireland.ie/privacy-policy.


NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Saylor Cooper
 

Hello, I’m trying to figure out how to get NVDA to stop reading columns and rows especially on webpages whenever I don’t need that information. Thanks.

Saylor Cooper


MS Word focus issues when revising documents and their comments

Sally Kiebdaj
 

Hello list,

Apologies if this has been reported somewhere already but it doesn't look like this specific issue is up on GitHub yet and I'm curious if anyone else has seen it before I try to add it.

I amn running 
-Microsoft® Word 2019 MSO (16.0.10378.20029) 64-bit
-Windows 10 Pro: Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.1288)
-NVDA 2021.2

I am unable to consistently switch focus between the document and comments either to read or edit. Additionally, I cannot seem to focus replies to my comments except through the elements list.

Two different things can go wrong and seem to be impacted by two different settings in MS Word and NVDA. 

Scenario 1: 
I open a document containing both tracked changes and comments. I prefer to make edits with my markup set to "no markup" so that I do not have to hear every deletion or insertion as I read and type. 

This works just fine for making changes to the text. However, if I want to comment on the text that is in "no markup" I often but not always end up stuck in some kind of pane. 

Steps to reproduce: 
1. Open a document containing both tracked changes and comments. Ensure that track changes is on and that show markup is set to "no markup." 
2. Select some text and insert a comment. It doesn't make a difference if you use CTRL + Alt + M or ALT +r+c. 
3. Write a comment and then press ESC to return to the document. 
4. Instead of the document, you hear something that sounds like portions of HTML or XML tags, letters or portions of the author name, or less than signs. Sometimes a comments pane is visible and sometimes it isn't. Getting a sighted user to click the comments pane closed has no effect. Pressing ESC makes NVDA read a "Refresh" button and then returns you to the strange pane with tags in it. ALT + R no longer works (it plays the error ding) but pressing ALT alone does allow you to get into the revision part of the ribbon which still tells you it can be reached by pressing r. Sometimes the ribbon seems to be collapsed in a way that requires me to hit "enter" on the "Tracking" section before I can arrow and tab through the various tracking options. These options appear to be in slightly different positions as well based on what gets read when using arrow keys to navigate. 

The only solution seems to be to click the mouse in the document pane multiple times and then the cursor is always brought to the top of the document regardless of where you had highlighted text for your comment. At this point the ribbon goes back to normal behavior too. 

This pane and focus issue happens less often if you set show markup to "all markup." However, it happens even with all markup shown, just less frequently.

I can read existing comments in the elements list or using NVDA + ALT + C but only if my focus is in the documents pane. When I get stuck in this other pane, the elements list is also focused on that pane and at best shows me any typos in my comments text. At worst, it shows me nothing.

Also, the elements list and NVDA + Alt + C do not give me a way to edit existing comments, as far as I can tell. 

Scenario 2: 
Open the same kind of document with the same tracking and markup settings as above. 
1. Using ALT + R + V or ALT +  R+  P, try to move between comments (so that you can edit them). 
2. Instead of bringing you to the text of the comment, you hear NVDA reading the title bar , saying Tollbar, then saying Pane. It alternates among these three quickly enough that it often interrupts full reading of the title bar. It will keep alternating among these three focus points indefinitely and none of the hotkeys to speak current focus work. They simply have no impact on NVDA reading the three different points of focus. 
3. Press ESC to successfully return to the document at the text that is highlighted for the comment you were trying to read. However you were never able to edit that comment. 

Has anyone else experienced this or things like this? 

Is it just impossible to use comments in conjunction with show markup set to "no markup?" 

Aside from the elements list, is there any other way to access replies to comments or to create a reply to a comment? That seems to have vanished from MS Word and the context menu somewhere between office 2010 and 2019.

If I'm going to pull logs and create a bug, I'd like to hear everything the list has to say first so that I can include it. 

Thank you!
Sally 

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