Date   

Re: Here we go again!

Jujube
 

I 100% agree. There is no reason to get paranoid this quickly, 2022.1 is still months away and I'm sure addons will be compatible by the time 2022.1 is released. I also commend the developers for doing the absolute best they can. 


On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 2:40 PM Governor staten <govsta@...> wrote:

Such is life with software, especially that of the alpha kind. In order to move forward, things are changed. This, unfortunately, breaks backwards compatibility.


I will commend the devs herein. They quickly resolve these issues. You know that this is alpha software. They let you know that things can, and do, break.








On 10/20/2021 5:23 PM, Carlos wrote:
Today I downloaded the alpha version of nvda 2022.1. And, once again add-ons will need to be updated to work with nvda 2022.1.

Someone really needs to come up with some kind of add-ons patch that will make "All!" add-ons work with current/future versions of nvda! Otherwise, the use of add-ons will become very impractical!

I wonder if at some point breaking add-ons compatibility will have an effect on the usability of nvda as a usable screen reader?

NVDA is taking a very big risk in annoying users by constantly breaking add-ons compatibility! At some point nvda users will grow tired of all this nonsense. And, will just walk away from nvda. And, those who depend on nvda for their daily use will be without a free open source screen reader!

Maybe its time for nvda to be taken over by developers that will know how to better handle upgrading nvda while keeping add-ons compatible for all users!

And, maybe its time to move away from python as it is the cause of all these add-ons breaking their compatibility?








Re: Here we go again!

 

Such is life with software, especially that of the alpha kind. In order to move forward, things are changed. This, unfortunately, breaks backwards compatibility.


I will commend the devs herein. They quickly resolve these issues. You know that this is alpha software. They let you know that things can, and do, break.








On 10/20/2021 5:23 PM, Carlos wrote:
Today I downloaded the alpha version of nvda 2022.1. And, once again add-ons will need to be updated to work with nvda 2022.1.

Someone really needs to come up with some kind of add-ons patch that will make "All!" add-ons work with current/future versions of nvda! Otherwise, the use of add-ons will become very impractical!

I wonder if at some point breaking add-ons compatibility will have an effect on the usability of nvda as a usable screen reader?

NVDA is taking a very big risk in annoying users by constantly breaking add-ons compatibility! At some point nvda users will grow tired of all this nonsense. And, will just walk away from nvda. And, those who depend on nvda for their daily use will be without a free open source screen reader!

Maybe its time for nvda to be taken over by developers that will know how to better handle upgrading nvda while keeping add-ons compatible for all users!

And, maybe its time to move away from python as it is the cause of all these add-ons breaking their compatibility?








Re: Here we go again!

Jujube
 

Hi Carlos, as far as I know they are striving to only break addons once a year at the .1 release. I suggest reading this thread as Joseph Lee's explanations in particular will hopefully give you a better handle on the developer's perspective.

NVDA addons are similar to browser extensions. You may not know this, but many browser extensions have died out due to lack of updates and NVDA addons are no different.

Although changing NVDA to another progrramming language is theoretically possible, I strongly susptect that such a move would require a massive rewrite of NVDA's code.

I hope something decent is worked out soon, but in the meantime, I just wanted to explain why this is happening.

On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 2:23 PM Carlos <gmjc341961@...> wrote:
Today I downloaded the alpha version of nvda 2022.1. And, once again
add-ons will need to be updated to work with nvda 2022.1.

Someone really needs to come up with some kind of add-ons patch that
will make "All!" add-ons work with current/future versions of nvda!
Otherwise, the use of add-ons will become very impractical!

I wonder if at some point breaking add-ons compatibility will have an
effect on the usability of nvda as a usable screen reader?

NVDA is taking a very big risk in annoying users by constantly breaking
add-ons compatibility! At some point nvda users will grow tired of all
this nonsense. And, will just walk away from nvda. And, those who depend
on nvda for their daily use will be without a free open source screen
reader!

Maybe its time for nvda to be taken over by developers that will know
how to better handle upgrading nvda while keeping add-ons compatible for
all users!

And, maybe its time to move away from python as it is the cause of all
these add-ons breaking their compatibility?








Here we go again!

Carlos
 

Today I downloaded the alpha version of nvda 2022.1. And, once again add-ons will need to be updated to work with nvda 2022.1.

Someone really needs to come up with some kind of add-ons patch that will make "All!" add-ons work with current/future versions of nvda! Otherwise, the use of add-ons will become very impractical!

I wonder if at some point breaking add-ons compatibility will have an effect on the usability of nvda as a usable screen reader?

NVDA is taking a very big risk in annoying users by constantly breaking add-ons compatibility! At some point nvda users will grow tired of all this nonsense. And, will just walk away from nvda. And, those who depend on nvda for their daily use will be without a free open source screen reader!

Maybe its time for nvda to be taken over by developers that will know how to better handle upgrading nvda while keeping add-ons compatible for all users!

And, maybe its time to move away from python as it is the cause of all these add-ons breaking their compatibility?


Re: Different focus from say all and arrowing through

mike mcglashon
 

Block quote:
What are you pressing to start say all?
There are two of them. One starts from the system cursor, the other one starts from the review cursor. The one that starts from the review cursor doesn't move the system cursor.
End quote:

So, which keystroke invokes which "say all mode"?


Please advise as you like.

Mike M.

Mike mcglashon
Email: Michael.mcglashon@comcast.net
Ph: 618 783 9331

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tyler Spivey via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 4:54 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Different focus from say all and arrowing through

What are you pressing to start say all?
There are two of them. One starts from the system cursor, the other one starts from the review cursor. The one that starts from the review cursor doesn't move the system cursor.

On 10/20/2021 1:49 PM, Christopher Bartlett wrote:
While proofreading a long document using say-all, I'd find a place for
editing, and hit control to stop speech, but then when I'd arrow
through the document, I'd be in a different place. I have focus
follows caret set in review, so I figured the focus would, well,
follow the system caret. I thought the system caret would travel with the say'all cursor.
I'm a little rusty on NVDA concepts, since for a long time, I did most
of my work on a Chromebook, but now I'm using my win 10 machine a lot
more again, and MS Office.

Christopher Bartlett


--
Christopher Bartlett


Re: what next

dennis huckle <denniswhuckle@...>
 

Sorry folks,

Didn’t sign my name on last post.

Kind regards,

Dennis huckle.

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris via groups.io
Sent: 20 October 2021 21:23
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

Tech support are correct, and narrator wont work within the bios/uefi

So you will need sighted help to change the setting unfortunately

 

 

 

From: ken lawrence via groups.io
Sent: 20 October 2021 18:40
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] what next

 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

 


Re: what next

dennis huckle <denniswhuckle@...>
 

Hello all,

I can definitely confirm that to do anything in the bios you, like me will need sighted assistance.

Of course its really important that you know exactly what you want to achieve so as to assist yoin making the correct dicisions within bios.

ur sighted assistant

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris via groups.io
Sent: 20 October 2021 21:23
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

Tech support are correct, and narrator wont work within the bios/uefi

So you will need sighted help to change the setting unfortunately

 

 

 

From: ken lawrence via groups.io
Sent: 20 October 2021 18:40
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] what next

 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

 


Re: Different focus from say all and arrowing through

Tyler Spivey
 

What are you pressing to start say all?
There are two of them. One starts from the system cursor, the other one starts from the review cursor. The one that starts from the review cursor doesn't move the system cursor.

On 10/20/2021 1:49 PM, Christopher Bartlett wrote:
While proofreading a long document using say-all, I'd find a place for editing, and hit control to stop speech, but then when I'd arrow through the document, I'd be in a different place.  I have focus follows caret set in review, so I figured the focus would, well, follow the system caret.  I thought the system caret would travel with the say'all cursor.
I'm a little rusty on NVDA concepts, since for a long time, I did most of my work on a Chromebook, but now I'm using my win 10 machine a lot more again, and MS Office.
Christopher Bartlett
--
Christopher Bartlett


Different focus from say all and arrowing through

Christopher Bartlett
 

While proofreading a long document using say-all, I'd find a place for editing, and hit control to stop speech, but then when I'd arrow through the document, I'd be in a different place.  I have focus follows caret set in review, so I figured the focus would, well, follow the system caret.  I thought the system caret would travel with the say'all cursor.
I'm a little rusty on NVDA concepts, since for a long time, I did most of my work on a Chromebook, but now I'm using my win 10 machine a lot more again, and MS Office.

Christopher Bartlett


--
Christopher Bartlett


Re: what next

Chris
 

Tech support are correct, and narrator wont work within the bios/uefi

So you will need sighted help to change the setting unfortunately

 

 

 

From: ken lawrence via groups.io
Sent: 20 October 2021 18:40
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] what next

 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

 


Re: what next

Chris Mullins
 

Hi Ken

You can also download a mcafee removal tool from the mcafee web site.  I do not know how accessible it is but it should get rid of the remaining components.

 

Cheers

Chris

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Mohamed
Sent: 20 October 2021 19:45
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

HP actually has a BIOS configuration utility that can be used to edit BIOS settings from within Windows. https://ftp.ext.hp.com/pub/caps-softpaq/cmit/HP_BCU.html. this is a command line app that allows you to configure BIOS settings by editing a text file. You'll need to generate a text file of your current BIOS settings, and disable the setting called Action Key Mode by removing the asterisk from enabled and moving it to disable.

On 10/20/2021 1:40 PM, ken lawrence via groups.io wrote:

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

 


Re: Introductory questions about navigating in a browser.

Gene
 

When reading begins, press control to stop reading.  Then move line by line and you will hear each line and no more until you move to the next line.
 
There is a way to have the web page read but that won’t solve what you evidently want to do.  Evidently, you want to start reading at the beginning of content you want to read such as an article.  To do that, try moving using the letter n to skip blocks of links, or h, move by heading.  On some pages, one works better than the other. 
 
If you do want a page to read from the top, there is a setting you can change, discussed by another member.  There may be some pages where you want this at least at times. 
 
I don’t know how slow it is for you to type and I don’t know which you might prefer in situations like this:
Say you open a web page that is the home page of a newspaper.  You want to get to the link that says editorial.  If the page starts to read automatically, press control.
You can then open NVDA search, which is used on web pages and some other places, type edit and search.  This will save you from moving through a lot of links to find it.
Or you can open the links list and type the letter e until you find it.  I believe you press enter then to follow the link when in the links list. 
 
Or if, on this page, you haven’t gone to a lot of links to different sections of the paper, when the page opens and you have stopped automatic reading, if it occurs, type the letter v.  That moves you through links you have used before.  Then, when you get to the one you want, follow it as usual.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Alan Joyce
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 10:36 AM
Subject: [nvda] Introductory questions about navigating in a browser.
 

Hi,

 

I’m new to using NVDA having little exposure to other text to speech programs before jumping in. I’ve use a program called the Grid which acts as a keyboard emulator to help me with my typing as I’m unable to physically access a standard keyboard. With my setup on NVDA, I have found a few elements which I’m struggling with and would appreciate a guide through. These are;  

1.   When reading out a lengthy email from Gmail opened in the EDGE browser, is it possible to control the read back rate – say line by line – so I can pick up on what is being typed. What are the key combination for this and the settings which would allow this?

2.   When I open a webpage in the Edge, is it possible for NVDA to start to read the page content automatically? At the moment, it announces the page opening and I have to start finding my way through Tabbing or down arrow key which seems to work some times and then not others.

3.   For above, is there one reading mode which is preferred over the other?

 

I’m sure I’ve more to come on top of these but I’d welcome a start!

 

Kindest regards,

Alan

 

Windows 10, Ver 1909

 

 

Enable Ireland Disability Services Ltd. Registered Office Unit 32F, Rosemount Park Drive, Rosemount Business Park, Ballycoolin Road, Dublin 11 Registered in Dublin No.13909 Charity No.20006617 Patron Michael D. Higgins, President of Ireland Chairman Stephen Haughey Chief Executive John O'Sullivan Secretary Noreen Dempsey.

 

The information contained in this e-mail and in any attachments is confidential and is intended solely for attention and use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, please note that any form of use, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error please notify the sender and delete all copies from your computer system(s). The sender accepts no responsibility for unauthorised copying or processing of this email by any third party and disclaims any liability for any loss arising as a result.You are welcome to view our Privacy Notice on-line at: https://www.enableireland.ie/privacy-policy.


Re: what next

Mohamed
 

HP actually has a BIOS configuration utility that can be used to edit BIOS settings from within Windows. https://ftp.ext.hp.com/pub/caps-softpaq/cmit/HP_BCU.html. this is a command line app that allows you to configure BIOS settings by editing a text file. You'll need to generate a text file of your current BIOS settings, and disable the setting called Action Key Mode by removing the asterisk from enabled and moving it to disable.

On 10/20/2021 1:40 PM, ken lawrence via groups.io wrote:

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 


Re: what next

Gene
 

This has nothing to do with the screen-reader.  Narrator, being another screen-reader, will not work around the problem.  If someone didn’t use a screen-reader, the fn keys would function the same way.  Either your computer manufacturer provides a way to control this behavior using  commands provided not in BIOS or you will have to have someone change the BIOS setting.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 12:40 PM
Subject: [nvda] what next
 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 


Re: what next

Jackie
 

The short answer is no. The long answer is h*** (rhymes w/tech) no. I
suggest getting extremely good sighted assistance, because you mess
w/the wrong thing in BIOS, and things can go pear-shaped very quickly.
& this is 1 reason why I tend to steer clear of HP.

The battles grind on w/no end in sight, 2021 and beyond.

On 10/20/21, ken lawrence via groups.io
<kenlawrence124=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says
that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work. Will
narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and
regain use of function keys that way? I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on
this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus.
Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021?

Sent from Mail for Windows







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what next

ken lawrence
 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 


Re: NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Monte Single
 

My bad, it should read "document format" not page format.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Monte Single
Sent: October 20, 2021 10:41 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

You have to go settings, page format, and uncheck columns and rows.
This page format section of settings has a huge selection of items to choose from; it is worth reviewing more than once to get things tuned the way you like.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Saylor Cooper
Sent: October 20, 2021 10:36 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Hello, I’m trying to figure out how to get NVDA to stop reading columns and rows especially on webpages whenever I don’t need that information. Thanks.

Saylor Cooper


Re: NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Saylor Cooper
 

Yes I got it thanks everyone.

Saylor Cooper

On Oct 20, 2021, at 11:48 AM, Jujube <ellaxyu@...> wrote:


Hi Saylor, I think you're referring to the reading of tables. You need to go to document formatting settings (NVDA control D), tab a bunch of times, and uncheck "row and column headers" or any of the other table reading settings. Hope this helps.

On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 9:35 AM Saylor Cooper <saylorcooper1@...> wrote:
Hello, I’m trying to figure out how to get NVDA to stop reading columns and rows especially on webpages whenever I don’t need that information. Thanks.

Saylor Cooper





Re: Introductory questions about navigating in a browser.

Jujube
 

Hi, I'll try to answer your questions though I for some reason don't fully know what you mean.

1. To read by line usually pressing up or down arrows can work. If you want to read by paragraph press control + up or down arrow.

2. If you want everything read to you when the page loads, change the following setting:
a. press NVDA control B to access browse mode settings.
b. tab a few times until you get to the setting "automatic say all on page load". Press space to check it and then press enter to close the dialog. Hope this helps.

On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 9:39 AM Alan Joyce <amjoyce@...> wrote:

Hi,

 

I’m new to using NVDA having little exposure to other text to speech programs before jumping in. I’ve use a program called the Grid which acts as a keyboard emulator to help me with my typing as I’m unable to physically access a standard keyboard. With my setup on NVDA, I have found a few elements which I’m struggling with and would appreciate a guide through. These are;  

1.   When reading out a lengthy email from Gmail opened in the EDGE browser, is it possible to control the read back rate – say line by line – so I can pick up on what is being typed. What are the key combination for this and the settings which would allow this?

2.   When I open a webpage in the Edge, is it possible for NVDA to start to read the page content automatically? At the moment, it announces the page opening and I have to start finding my way through Tabbing or down arrow key which seems to work some times and then not others.

3.   For above, is there one reading mode which is preferred over the other?

 

I’m sure I’ve more to come on top of these but I’d welcome a start!

 

Kindest regards,

Alan

 

Windows 10, Ver 1909

 

 

Enable Ireland Disability Services Ltd. Registered Office Unit 32F, Rosemount Park Drive, Rosemount Business Park, Ballycoolin Road, Dublin 11 Registered in Dublin No.13909 Charity No.20006617 Patron Michael D. Higgins, President of Ireland Chairman Stephen Haughey Chief Executive John O'Sullivan Secretary Noreen Dempsey.


The information contained in this e-mail and in any attachments is confidential and is intended solely for attention and use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, please note that any form of use, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error please notify the sender and delete all copies from your computer system(s). The sender accepts no responsibility for unauthorised copying or processing of this email by any third party and disclaims any liability for any loss arising as a result.You are welcome to view our Privacy Notice on-line at: https://www.enableireland.ie/privacy-policy.


Re: NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Jujube
 

Hi Saylor, I think you're referring to the reading of tables. You need to go to document formatting settings (NVDA control D), tab a bunch of times, and uncheck "row and column headers" or any of the other table reading settings. Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 9:35 AM Saylor Cooper <saylorcooper1@...> wrote:
Hello, I’m trying to figure out how to get NVDA to stop reading columns and rows especially on webpages whenever I don’t need that information. Thanks.

Saylor Cooper




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