Date   

Re: Weather plus is unable to download and install

Adriano Barbieri
 

Hi,

Probablyby mistake you have canceled the download, The link works properly, the add-on downloads the update quietly, try again, or try to download from the link I just posted for manual update.

Regards
Adriano


Il 21/10/2021 12:34, Jarek.Krcmar ha scritto:

Hello all in group,

when I started my computer, Nvda said: There is a new version of the Weather plus to download. But if I confirm the downloading, Nvda said the downloading was canselled.

I would like to know, how could I get this addon.

Do you have any idea, please?



Re: Does the latest release play nicely with Firefox? And the addon stuff isn't yet relevant if I update now, correct?

Steve Wettlaufer
 

I'm curious what is supposed to be wrong with NVDA and Firefox in the latest versions?  I'm fairly new to the group here, but I've used NVDA and Firefox happily together for years, always updating to the latest versions of each.

On 2021-10-21 6:09 a.m., Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:
I am still on Version 2020.3, and didn't update earlier this year because I saw some messages about NVDA and Firefox not playing nicely, and Firefox being my main browser, I was hesitant to update. Now that I'm hearing about possible addon incompatibility, I'm realising I'd better update before I have to go with a new release that breaks anything, even if I don't have the addons that are being singled out. I just wanna be sure things aren't liable to flip out if I update now.





Weather_Plus8.6 update available

Adriano Barbieri
 

Hello everyone,
Changes in this version:
• updated astronomical information, regarding sunrise / sunset of the sun and moon, when not indicated.
• updated Ukrainian documentation translation (thanks to Alex Yeshanu.
Thanks to Rui Fontes and Rémy Ruiz for the maintenance and support of Weather_Plus.
Repository:
https://github.com/ruifontes/Weather_Plus/
Download:
https://www.nvda.it/files/plugin/weather_plus8.6.nvda-addon


Regards
Adriano


Weather plus is unable to download and install

Jarek.Krcmar
 

Hello all in group,

when I started my computer, Nvda said: There is a new version of the Weather plus to download. But if I confirm the downloading, Nvda said the downloading was canselled.

I would like to know, how could I get this addon.

Do you have any idea, please?


--
Jarek


locked Optacon

Pele West
 

Hi Everyone

I still use my optacon nearly every day. I think it is the most wonderful device I own.

Pele West


Re: Does the latest release play nicely with Firefox? And the addon stuff isn't yet relevant if I update now, correct?

Quentin Christensen
 

Sharni-Lee,

As far as we are aware, NVDA and Firefox are playing nice together, but of course, if you encounter any issues, please do let us know!

Re the add-ons, as far as I know, most should have been updated to work with NVDA 2021.1 and later quite some time ago, but there is a page keeping track of where they are at here: https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/nvdacompat.en.html  So it's worth checking against any add-ons you use to make sure.

if you're worried, you can always download the latest version of NVDA from https://www.nvaccess.org/download/ and when you run it, select "Continue" or create a portable copy, and test that with anything crucial to ensure it works.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 9:09 PM Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@...> wrote:
I am still on Version 2020.3, and didn't update earlier this year
because I saw some messages about NVDA and Firefox not playing nicely,
and Firefox being my main browser, I was hesitant to update. Now that
I'm hearing about possible addon incompatibility, I'm realising I'd
better update before I have to go with a new release that breaks
anything, even if I don't have the addons that are being singled out. I
just wanna be sure things aren't liable to flip out if I update now.








--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Does the latest release play nicely with Firefox? And the addon stuff isn't yet relevant if I update now, correct?

Sharni-Lee Ward
 

I am still on Version 2020.3, and didn't update earlier this year because I saw some messages about NVDA and Firefox not playing nicely, and Firefox being my main browser, I was hesitant to update. Now that I'm hearing about possible addon incompatibility, I'm realising I'd better update before I have to go with a new release that breaks anything, even if I don't have the addons that are being singled out. I just wanna be sure things aren't liable to flip out if I update now.


Re: what next

dennis huckle <denniswhuckle@...>
 

What a wonderful device it was.
Gave me pins and needles in my right index finger and buzzed like an angry wasp but brilliant device.
Kind regards,
Dennis huckle.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jackie
Sent: 21 October 2021 01:05
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

The optacon is dead. Long live the Optacon.

Back in the day there was a way to route some bioses of some boxes over a serial port--I believe the name of the product was Weasel or similar--but there is no device I know of that works better for this than an Optacon in the hands of a proficient user. Unfortunately, the first sentence of this message is sadly applicable.

On 10/20/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 07:32 PM, Arlene wrote:


I hope in the future blind users can go in there with Nairator.
-
Not likely.

What folks who use screen readers, as they currently exist, need to
understand is that they are application software.  Mind you, a very
specialized application, but still an application.  The operating
system (whether Windows or any other one) must be up and running at
least to a certain point before any screen reader can come online.

UEFI/BIOS occur in the boot sequence well prior to Windows (or other
OSes such as Linux) ever being kicked off for loading.  While it would
be conceivably possible to have a dedicated screen reader for that
environment, and if memory serves a prototype was once made, long ago,
it certainly would not be Narrator, NVDA, JAWS or any other screen
reader as end users know them.  And it would also very likely have
commands strictly limited to the environment at hand, which means it
would be very different in that way, too.

And, as you mention, even if you were to have a screen reader of some
sort available to navigate UEFI/BIOS, you still have to be very, very
certain that what you're doing is precisely what you intend to do and
that what you intend is actually what needs to be done to achieve the result hoped for.
 If you can have this certainty, then go for it, otherwise, get assistance.
And this is completely separate from your visual status.  Most of my
sighted clients have no idea that UEFI/BIOS even exists nor how to
interact with it.  It's just not something most end users ever need to touch.

As far as turning off "media keys" or whatever a maker might call the
actions associated with the function keys, lobbying them to create
utilities such as the one Lenovo already has that allow these to be
turned on or off from within Windows, or asking for some keyboard
shortcut, likely a 4-key press to avoid accidents, to do this are both
better ideas than a screen reader for UEFI/BIOS likely would be.  They're safer, too.

--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043

*The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of
all.*

~ John F. Kennedy






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Re: what next

Sarah k Alawami
 

Maybe, just maybe, narrator will be able to do that as well, one day. Burt for now you need a sighted pair of eyes  or aira to help you.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Arlene
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 7:19 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

Yes, that’s what I heard. With a Mac you can do that.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Sarah k Alawami
Sent: October 20, 2021 7:12 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

Actually under mac os I can access what they call the recovery assistant and even choose what disk I want to boot from, all of it talks btw. I love it. Iv’e made changes under the command line etc.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Arlene
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 5:16 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

I guess no matter what, we’ll always need sighted assistance in something to do with the computer’s BIOS.  I won’t even touch it. I’ll get a sighted person who knows what to do in the bios. 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Jackie
Sent: October 20, 2021 5:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

The optacon is dead. Long live the Optacon.

 

Back in the day there was a way to route some bioses of some boxes

over a serial port--I believe the name of the product was Weasel or

similar--but there is no device I know of that works better for this

than an Optacon in the hands of a proficient user. Unfortunately, the

first sentence of this message is sadly applicable.

 

On 10/20/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

> On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 07:32 PM, Arlene wrote:

>> 

>> I hope in the future blind users can go in there with Nairator.

> -

> Not likely.

> What folks who use screen readers, as they currently exist, need to

> understand is that they are application software.  Mind you, a very

> specialized application, but still an application.  The operating system

> (whether Windows or any other one) must be up and running at least to a

> certain point before any screen reader can come online.

> UEFI/BIOS occur in the boot sequence well prior to Windows (or other OSes

> such as Linux) ever being kicked off for loading.  While it would be

> conceivably possible to have a dedicated screen reader for that environment,

> and if memory serves a prototype was once made, long ago, it certainly would

> not be Narrator, NVDA, JAWS or any other screen reader as end users know

> them.  And it would also very likely have commands strictly limited to the

> environment at hand, which means it would be very different in that way,

> too.

> And, as you mention, even if you were to have a screen reader of some sort

> available to navigate UEFI/BIOS, you still have to be very, very certain

> that what you're doing is precisely what you intend to do and that what you

> intend is actually what needs to be done to achieve the result hoped for.

>  If you can have this certainty, then go for it, otherwise, get assistance.

> And this is completely separate from your visual status.  Most of my sighted

> clients have no idea that UEFI/BIOS even exists nor how to interact with

> it.  It's just not something most end users ever need to touch.

> As far as turning off "media keys" or whatever a maker might call the

> actions associated with the function keys, lobbying them to create utilities

> such as the one Lenovo already has that allow these to be turned on or off

> from within Windows, or asking for some keyboard shortcut, likely a 4-key

> press to avoid accidents, to do this are both better ideas than a screen

> reader for UEFI/BIOS likely would be.  They're safer, too.

> --

> Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043

> *The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.*

> ~ John F. Kennedy

>

 

 

--

Subscribe to a WordPress for Newbies Mailing List by sending a message to:

wp4newbs-request@... with 'subscribe' in the Subject field OR by

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& check out my sites at www.brightstarsweb.com & www.mysitesbeenhacked.com

 

 

 

 

 

 


Re: what next

Arlene
 

Yes, that’s what I heard. With a Mac you can do that.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Sarah k Alawami
Sent: October 20, 2021 7:12 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

Actually under mac os I can access what they call the recovery assistant and even choose what disk I want to boot from, all of it talks btw. I love it. Iv’e made changes under the command line etc.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Arlene
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 5:16 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

I guess no matter what, we’ll always need sighted assistance in something to do with the computer’s BIOS.  I won’t even touch it. I’ll get a sighted person who knows what to do in the bios. 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Jackie
Sent: October 20, 2021 5:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

The optacon is dead. Long live the Optacon.

 

Back in the day there was a way to route some bioses of some boxes

over a serial port--I believe the name of the product was Weasel or

similar--but there is no device I know of that works better for this

than an Optacon in the hands of a proficient user. Unfortunately, the

first sentence of this message is sadly applicable.

 

On 10/20/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

> On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 07:32 PM, Arlene wrote:

>> 

>> I hope in the future blind users can go in there with Nairator.

> -

> Not likely.

> What folks who use screen readers, as they currently exist, need to

> understand is that they are application software.  Mind you, a very

> specialized application, but still an application.  The operating system

> (whether Windows or any other one) must be up and running at least to a

> certain point before any screen reader can come online.

> UEFI/BIOS occur in the boot sequence well prior to Windows (or other OSes

> such as Linux) ever being kicked off for loading.  While it would be

> conceivably possible to have a dedicated screen reader for that environment,

> and if memory serves a prototype was once made, long ago, it certainly would

> not be Narrator, NVDA, JAWS or any other screen reader as end users know

> them.  And it would also very likely have commands strictly limited to the

> environment at hand, which means it would be very different in that way,

> too.

> And, as you mention, even if you were to have a screen reader of some sort

> available to navigate UEFI/BIOS, you still have to be very, very certain

> that what you're doing is precisely what you intend to do and that what you

> intend is actually what needs to be done to achieve the result hoped for.

>  If you can have this certainty, then go for it, otherwise, get assistance.

> And this is completely separate from your visual status.  Most of my sighted

> clients have no idea that UEFI/BIOS even exists nor how to interact with

> it.  It's just not something most end users ever need to touch.

> As far as turning off "media keys" or whatever a maker might call the

> actions associated with the function keys, lobbying them to create utilities

> such as the one Lenovo already has that allow these to be turned on or off

> from within Windows, or asking for some keyboard shortcut, likely a 4-key

> press to avoid accidents, to do this are both better ideas than a screen

> reader for UEFI/BIOS likely would be.  They're safer, too.

> --

> Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043

> *The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.*

> ~ John F. Kennedy

>

 

 

--

Subscribe to a WordPress for Newbies Mailing List by sending a message to:

wp4newbs-request@... with 'subscribe' in the Subject field OR by

visiting the list page at http://www.freelists.org/list/wp4newbs

& check out my sites at www.brightstarsweb.com & www.mysitesbeenhacked.com

 

 

 

 

 

 


Re: what next

Sarah k Alawami
 

Actually under mac os I can access what they call the recovery assistant and even choose what disk I want to boot from, all of it talks btw. I love it. Iv’e made changes under the command line etc.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Arlene
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 5:16 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

I guess no matter what, we’ll always need sighted assistance in something to do with the computer’s BIOS.  I won’t even touch it. I’ll get a sighted person who knows what to do in the bios. 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Jackie
Sent: October 20, 2021 5:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

The optacon is dead. Long live the Optacon.

 

Back in the day there was a way to route some bioses of some boxes

over a serial port--I believe the name of the product was Weasel or

similar--but there is no device I know of that works better for this

than an Optacon in the hands of a proficient user. Unfortunately, the

first sentence of this message is sadly applicable.

 

On 10/20/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

> On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 07:32 PM, Arlene wrote:

>> 

>> I hope in the future blind users can go in there with Nairator.

> -

> Not likely.

> What folks who use screen readers, as they currently exist, need to

> understand is that they are application software.  Mind you, a very

> specialized application, but still an application.  The operating system

> (whether Windows or any other one) must be up and running at least to a

> certain point before any screen reader can come online.

> UEFI/BIOS occur in the boot sequence well prior to Windows (or other OSes

> such as Linux) ever being kicked off for loading.  While it would be

> conceivably possible to have a dedicated screen reader for that environment,

> and if memory serves a prototype was once made, long ago, it certainly would

> not be Narrator, NVDA, JAWS or any other screen reader as end users know

> them.  And it would also very likely have commands strictly limited to the

> environment at hand, which means it would be very different in that way,

> too.

> And, as you mention, even if you were to have a screen reader of some sort

> available to navigate UEFI/BIOS, you still have to be very, very certain

> that what you're doing is precisely what you intend to do and that what you

> intend is actually what needs to be done to achieve the result hoped for.

>  If you can have this certainty, then go for it, otherwise, get assistance.

> And this is completely separate from your visual status.  Most of my sighted

> clients have no idea that UEFI/BIOS even exists nor how to interact with

> it.  It's just not something most end users ever need to touch.

> As far as turning off "media keys" or whatever a maker might call the

> actions associated with the function keys, lobbying them to create utilities

> such as the one Lenovo already has that allow these to be turned on or off

> from within Windows, or asking for some keyboard shortcut, likely a 4-key

> press to avoid accidents, to do this are both better ideas than a screen

> reader for UEFI/BIOS likely would be.  They're safer, too.

> --

> Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043

> *The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.*

> ~ John F. Kennedy

>

 

 

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Subscribe to a WordPress for Newbies Mailing List by sending a message to:

wp4newbs-request@... with 'subscribe' in the Subject field OR by

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& check out my sites at www.brightstarsweb.com & www.mysitesbeenhacked.com

 

 

 

 

 


Re: NVDA to not read columns and rows in webpages

Rui Fontes
 

First create a profile and then make the changes...

That way the changes will affect only what you want...


Rui Fontes


Às 17:56 de 20/10/2021, Saylor Cooper escreveu:

Yes I got it thanks everyone.

Saylor Cooper

On Oct 20, 2021, at 11:48 AM, Jujube <ellaxyu@...> wrote:


Hi Saylor, I think you're referring to the reading of tables. You need to go to document formatting settings (NVDA control D), tab a bunch of times, and uncheck "row and column headers" or any of the other table reading settings. Hope this helps.

On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 9:35 AM Saylor Cooper <saylorcooper1@...> wrote:
Hello, I’m trying to figure out how to get NVDA to stop reading columns and rows especially on webpages whenever I don’t need that information. Thanks.

Saylor Cooper





Re: what next

Rui Fontes
 

I normally manage to uninstall McAfee with the help of NVDA OCR...


Rui Fontes


Às 20:19 de 20/10/2021, Chris Mullins escreveu:

Hi Ken

You can also download a mcafee removal tool from the mcafee web site.  I do not know how accessible it is but it should get rid of the remaining components.

 

Cheers

Chris

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Mohamed
Sent: 20 October 2021 19:45
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

HP actually has a BIOS configuration utility that can be used to edit BIOS settings from within Windows. https://ftp.ext.hp.com/pub/caps-softpaq/cmit/HP_BCU.html. this is a command line app that allows you to configure BIOS settings by editing a text file. You'll need to generate a text file of your current BIOS settings, and disable the setting called Action Key Mode by removing the asterisk from enabled and moving it to disable.

On 10/20/2021 1:40 PM, ken lawrence via groups.io wrote:

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

 


Re: MS Word focus issues when revising documents and their comments

Pranav Lal
 

Hi Sally,

 

I have not exactly experienced these issues but can relate to the frustration of dealing with comments. I have begun to use the ribbon to navigate between comments. When I reach a comment of interest, I right click it by pressing the windows key and reply to it. Its been a while that I worked with track changes.

 

I am using Microsoft word 365 so will test your observations and report.

 

Pranav

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sally Kiebdaj
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 7:57 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] MS Word focus issues when revising documents and their comments

 

Hello list,

 

Apologies if this has been reported somewhere already but it doesn't look like this specific issue is up on GitHub yet and I'm curious if anyone else has seen it before I try to add it.

 

I amn running 

-Microsoft® Word 2019 MSO (16.0.10378.20029) 64-bit

-Windows 10 Pro: Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.1288)

-NVDA 2021.2

 

I am unable to consistently switch focus between the document and comments either to read or edit. Additionally, I cannot seem to focus replies to my comments except through the elements list.

 

Two different things can go wrong and seem to be impacted by two different settings in MS Word and NVDA. 

 

Scenario 1: 

I open a document containing both tracked changes and comments. I prefer to make edits with my markup set to "no markup" so that I do not have to hear every deletion or insertion as I read and type. 

 

This works just fine for making changes to the text. However, if I want to comment on the text that is in "no markup" I often but not always end up stuck in some kind of pane. 

 

Steps to reproduce: 

1. Open a document containing both tracked changes and comments. Ensure that track changes is on and that show markup is set to "no markup." 

2. Select some text and insert a comment. It doesn't make a difference if you use CTRL + Alt + M or ALT +r+c. 

3. Write a comment and then press ESC to return to the document. 

4. Instead of the document, you hear something that sounds like portions of HTML or XML tags, letters or portions of the author name, or less than signs. Sometimes a comments pane is visible and sometimes it isn't. Getting a sighted user to click the comments pane closed has no effect. Pressing ESC makes NVDA read a "Refresh" button and then returns you to the strange pane with tags in it. ALT + R no longer works (it plays the error ding) but pressing ALT alone does allow you to get into the revision part of the ribbon which still tells you it can be reached by pressing r. Sometimes the ribbon seems to be collapsed in a way that requires me to hit "enter" on the "Tracking" section before I can arrow and tab through the various tracking options. These options appear to be in slightly different positions as well based on what gets read when using arrow keys to navigate. 

 

The only solution seems to be to click the mouse in the document pane multiple times and then the cursor is always brought to the top of the document regardless of where you had highlighted text for your comment. At this point the ribbon goes back to normal behavior too. 

 

This pane and focus issue happens less often if you set show markup to "all markup." However, it happens even with all markup shown, just less frequently.

 

I can read existing comments in the elements list or using NVDA + ALT + C but only if my focus is in the documents pane. When I get stuck in this other pane, the elements list is also focused on that pane and at best shows me any typos in my comments text. At worst, it shows me nothing.

 

Also, the elements list and NVDA + Alt + C do not give me a way to edit existing comments, as far as I can tell. 

 

Scenario 2: 

Open the same kind of document with the same tracking and markup settings as above. 

1. Using ALT + R + V or ALT +  R+  P, try to move between comments (so that you can edit them). 

2. Instead of bringing you to the text of the comment, you hear NVDA reading the title bar , saying Tollbar, then saying Pane. It alternates among these three quickly enough that it often interrupts full reading of the title bar. It will keep alternating among these three focus points indefinitely and none of the hotkeys to speak current focus work. They simply have no impact on NVDA reading the three different points of focus. 

3. Press ESC to successfully return to the document at the text that is highlighted for the comment you were trying to read. However you were never able to edit that comment. 

 

Has anyone else experienced this or things like this? 

 

Is it just impossible to use comments in conjunction with show markup set to "no markup?" 

 

Aside from the elements list, is there any other way to access replies to comments or to create a reply to a comment? That seems to have vanished from MS Word and the context menu somewhere between office 2010 and 2019.

 

If I'm going to pull logs and create a bug, I'd like to hear everything the list has to say first so that I can include it. 

 

Thank you!

Sally 


Re: what next

Arlene
 

I guess no matter what, we’ll always need sighted assistance in something to do with the computer’s BIOS.  I won’t even touch it. I’ll get a sighted person who knows what to do in the bios. 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Jackie
Sent: October 20, 2021 5:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

The optacon is dead. Long live the Optacon.

 

Back in the day there was a way to route some bioses of some boxes

over a serial port--I believe the name of the product was Weasel or

similar--but there is no device I know of that works better for this

than an Optacon in the hands of a proficient user. Unfortunately, the

first sentence of this message is sadly applicable.

 

On 10/20/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

> On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 07:32 PM, Arlene wrote:

>> 

>> I hope in the future blind users can go in there with Nairator.

> -

> Not likely.

> What folks who use screen readers, as they currently exist, need to

> understand is that they are application software.  Mind you, a very

> specialized application, but still an application.  The operating system

> (whether Windows or any other one) must be up and running at least to a

> certain point before any screen reader can come online.

> UEFI/BIOS occur in the boot sequence well prior to Windows (or other OSes

> such as Linux) ever being kicked off for loading.  While it would be

> conceivably possible to have a dedicated screen reader for that environment,

> and if memory serves a prototype was once made, long ago, it certainly would

> not be Narrator, NVDA, JAWS or any other screen reader as end users know

> them.  And it would also very likely have commands strictly limited to the

> environment at hand, which means it would be very different in that way,

> too.

> And, as you mention, even if you were to have a screen reader of some sort

> available to navigate UEFI/BIOS, you still have to be very, very certain

> that what you're doing is precisely what you intend to do and that what you

> intend is actually what needs to be done to achieve the result hoped for.

>  If you can have this certainty, then go for it, otherwise, get assistance.

> And this is completely separate from your visual status.  Most of my sighted

> clients have no idea that UEFI/BIOS even exists nor how to interact with

> it.  It's just not something most end users ever need to touch.

> As far as turning off "media keys" or whatever a maker might call the

> actions associated with the function keys, lobbying them to create utilities

> such as the one Lenovo already has that allow these to be turned on or off

> from within Windows, or asking for some keyboard shortcut, likely a 4-key

> press to avoid accidents, to do this are both better ideas than a screen

> reader for UEFI/BIOS likely would be.  They're safer, too.

> --

> Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043

> *The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.*

> ~ John F. Kennedy

>

 

 

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Re: MS Word focus issues when revising documents and their comments

Quentin Christensen
 

Sally,

I haven't tried "No markup" much, but just looking now, with that set, when you create a comment, it takes you to a pane on the left (at least in Office 365).  I found pressing shift+f6 moved back to the document reliably just now.  

I couldn't replicate scenario 2 myself.

Are you using UI Automation in Word?  Press NVDA+control+g to open NVDA's general settings, then control+shift+tab to move to the last section, "advanced".  Press spacebar to acknowledge the warning, then tab to "Use UI Automation to access Microsoft Word document controls" and spacebar to check that.  Apply and see if that makes a difference.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 1:27 AM Sally Kiebdaj <fiddle.pup@...> wrote:
Hello list,

Apologies if this has been reported somewhere already but it doesn't look like this specific issue is up on GitHub yet and I'm curious if anyone else has seen it before I try to add it.

I amn running 
-Microsoft® Word 2019 MSO (16.0.10378.20029) 64-bit
-Windows 10 Pro: Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.1288)
-NVDA 2021.2

I am unable to consistently switch focus between the document and comments either to read or edit. Additionally, I cannot seem to focus replies to my comments except through the elements list.

Two different things can go wrong and seem to be impacted by two different settings in MS Word and NVDA. 

Scenario 1: 
I open a document containing both tracked changes and comments. I prefer to make edits with my markup set to "no markup" so that I do not have to hear every deletion or insertion as I read and type. 

This works just fine for making changes to the text. However, if I want to comment on the text that is in "no markup" I often but not always end up stuck in some kind of pane. 

Steps to reproduce: 
1. Open a document containing both tracked changes and comments. Ensure that track changes is on and that show markup is set to "no markup." 
2. Select some text and insert a comment. It doesn't make a difference if you use CTRL + Alt + M or ALT +r+c. 
3. Write a comment and then press ESC to return to the document. 
4. Instead of the document, you hear something that sounds like portions of HTML or XML tags, letters or portions of the author name, or less than signs. Sometimes a comments pane is visible and sometimes it isn't. Getting a sighted user to click the comments pane closed has no effect. Pressing ESC makes NVDA read a "Refresh" button and then returns you to the strange pane with tags in it. ALT + R no longer works (it plays the error ding) but pressing ALT alone does allow you to get into the revision part of the ribbon which still tells you it can be reached by pressing r. Sometimes the ribbon seems to be collapsed in a way that requires me to hit "enter" on the "Tracking" section before I can arrow and tab through the various tracking options. These options appear to be in slightly different positions as well based on what gets read when using arrow keys to navigate. 

The only solution seems to be to click the mouse in the document pane multiple times and then the cursor is always brought to the top of the document regardless of where you had highlighted text for your comment. At this point the ribbon goes back to normal behavior too. 

This pane and focus issue happens less often if you set show markup to "all markup." However, it happens even with all markup shown, just less frequently.

I can read existing comments in the elements list or using NVDA + ALT + C but only if my focus is in the documents pane. When I get stuck in this other pane, the elements list is also focused on that pane and at best shows me any typos in my comments text. At worst, it shows me nothing.

Also, the elements list and NVDA + Alt + C do not give me a way to edit existing comments, as far as I can tell. 

Scenario 2: 
Open the same kind of document with the same tracking and markup settings as above. 
1. Using ALT + R + V or ALT +  R+  P, try to move between comments (so that you can edit them). 
2. Instead of bringing you to the text of the comment, you hear NVDA reading the title bar , saying Tollbar, then saying Pane. It alternates among these three quickly enough that it often interrupts full reading of the title bar. It will keep alternating among these three focus points indefinitely and none of the hotkeys to speak current focus work. They simply have no impact on NVDA reading the three different points of focus. 
3. Press ESC to successfully return to the document at the text that is highlighted for the comment you were trying to read. However you were never able to edit that comment. 

Has anyone else experienced this or things like this? 

Is it just impossible to use comments in conjunction with show markup set to "no markup?" 

Aside from the elements list, is there any other way to access replies to comments or to create a reply to a comment? That seems to have vanished from MS Word and the context menu somewhere between office 2010 and 2019.

If I'm going to pull logs and create a bug, I'd like to hear everything the list has to say first so that I can include it. 

Thank you!
Sally 



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: what next

Jackie
 

The optacon is dead. Long live the Optacon.

Back in the day there was a way to route some bioses of some boxes
over a serial port--I believe the name of the product was Weasel or
similar--but there is no device I know of that works better for this
than an Optacon in the hands of a proficient user. Unfortunately, the
first sentence of this message is sadly applicable.

On 10/20/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 07:32 PM, Arlene wrote:


I hope in the future blind users can go in there with Nairator.
-
Not likely.

What folks who use screen readers, as they currently exist, need to
understand is that they are application software.  Mind you, a very
specialized application, but still an application.  The operating system
(whether Windows or any other one) must be up and running at least to a
certain point before any screen reader can come online.

UEFI/BIOS occur in the boot sequence well prior to Windows (or other OSes
such as Linux) ever being kicked off for loading.  While it would be
conceivably possible to have a dedicated screen reader for that environment,
and if memory serves a prototype was once made, long ago, it certainly would
not be Narrator, NVDA, JAWS or any other screen reader as end users know
them.  And it would also very likely have commands strictly limited to the
environment at hand, which means it would be very different in that way,
too.

And, as you mention, even if you were to have a screen reader of some sort
available to navigate UEFI/BIOS, you still have to be very, very certain
that what you're doing is precisely what you intend to do and that what you
intend is actually what needs to be done to achieve the result hoped for.
 If you can have this certainty, then go for it, otherwise, get assistance.
And this is completely separate from your visual status.  Most of my sighted
clients have no idea that UEFI/BIOS even exists nor how to interact with
it.  It's just not something most end users ever need to touch.

As far as turning off "media keys" or whatever a maker might call the
actions associated with the function keys, lobbying them to create utilities
such as the one Lenovo already has that allow these to be turned on or off
from within Windows, or asking for some keyboard shortcut, likely a 4-key
press to avoid accidents, to do this are both better ideas than a screen
reader for UEFI/BIOS likely would be.  They're safer, too.

--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043

*The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.*

~ John F. Kennedy





--
Subscribe to a WordPress for Newbies Mailing List by sending a message to:
wp4newbs-request@... with 'subscribe' in the Subject field OR by
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& check out my sites at www.brightstarsweb.com & www.mysitesbeenhacked.com


Re: what next

David Goldfield
 

If memory serves the American Printing House for the Blind once produced a device which allowed users to access BIOS settings during the boot sequence. I believe it was a hardware device and it was made for DOS-based PCs. It was pronounced Speakualizer although I don’t know the spelling. Needless to say the device is no longer available and it wouldn’t work even if you could find one on Ebay. Still it would be very nifty if we could have something like it for today’s computers assuming the technology on today’s machines would even allow for interfacing with such a device.

 

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

JAWS Certified, 2019

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive emails regarding news and events in the blindness assistive technology field.

Email: tech-vi+subscribe@groups.io

 

www.DavidGoldfield.org

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 7:47 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] what next

 

On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 07:32 PM, Arlene wrote:

I hope in the future blind users can go in there with Nairator.

-
Not likely.

What folks who use screen readers, as they currently exist, need to understand is that they are application software.  Mind you, a very specialized application, but still an application.  The operating system (whether Windows or any other one) must be up and running at least to a certain point before any screen reader can come online.

UEFI/BIOS occur in the boot sequence well prior to Windows (or other OSes such as Linux) ever being kicked off for loading.  While it would be conceivably possible to have a dedicated screen reader for that environment, and if memory serves a prototype was once made, long ago, it certainly would not be Narrator, NVDA, JAWS or any other screen reader as end users know them.  And it would also very likely have commands strictly limited to the environment at hand, which means it would be very different in that way, too.

And, as you mention, even if you were to have a screen reader of some sort available to navigate UEFI/BIOS, you still have to be very, very certain that what you're doing is precisely what you intend to do and that what you intend is actually what needs to be done to achieve the result hoped for.   If you can have this certainty, then go for it, otherwise, get assistance.  And this is completely separate from your visual status.  Most of my sighted clients have no idea that UEFI/BIOS even exists nor how to interact with it.  It's just not something most end users ever need to touch.

As far as turning off "media keys" or whatever a maker might call the actions associated with the function keys, lobbying them to create utilities such as the one Lenovo already has that allow these to be turned on or off from within Windows, or asking for some keyboard shortcut, likely a 4-key press to avoid accidents, to do this are both better ideas than a screen reader for UEFI/BIOS likely would be.  They're safer, too.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: what next

 

On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 07:32 PM, Arlene wrote:
I hope in the future blind users can go in there with Nairator.
-
Not likely.

What folks who use screen readers, as they currently exist, need to understand is that they are application software.  Mind you, a very specialized application, but still an application.  The operating system (whether Windows or any other one) must be up and running at least to a certain point before any screen reader can come online.

UEFI/BIOS occur in the boot sequence well prior to Windows (or other OSes such as Linux) ever being kicked off for loading.  While it would be conceivably possible to have a dedicated screen reader for that environment, and if memory serves a prototype was once made, long ago, it certainly would not be Narrator, NVDA, JAWS or any other screen reader as end users know them.  And it would also very likely have commands strictly limited to the environment at hand, which means it would be very different in that way, too.

And, as you mention, even if you were to have a screen reader of some sort available to navigate UEFI/BIOS, you still have to be very, very certain that what you're doing is precisely what you intend to do and that what you intend is actually what needs to be done to achieve the result hoped for.   If you can have this certainty, then go for it, otherwise, get assistance.  And this is completely separate from your visual status.  Most of my sighted clients have no idea that UEFI/BIOS even exists nor how to interact with it.  It's just not something most end users ever need to touch.

As far as turning off "media keys" or whatever a maker might call the actions associated with the function keys, lobbying them to create utilities such as the one Lenovo already has that allow these to be turned on or off from within Windows, or asking for some keyboard shortcut, likely a 4-key press to avoid accidents, to do this are both better ideas than a screen reader for UEFI/BIOS likely would be.  They're safer, too.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: what next

Arlene
 

I agree with Jackie. I’d stay clear of the BIOS I’ll get sighted assistance.  I hope in the future blind users can go in there with Nairator. You pretty much would have to know what’s in there.  You’d have to know what to fix and what not to fix. I’d stay clear of it. 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: ken lawrence via groups.io
Sent: October 20, 2021 10:40 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] what next

 

Hi NVDA apparently BIOS is set this way in default the HP tech support says that BIOS is outside windows and therefore screen reader won’t work.  Will narrator work this way and if not can a blind user change this setting and regain use of function keys that way?  I’ve deleted more of the HP stuff on this machine and can’tcompletely get rid of inaccessible mcafee antivirus. Boy why do blind people have to fight these battles in 2021? 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

 

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