On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 10:32 AM, David Russell wrote:

According to the Disability Answer Desk, Microsoft, All-in-one computers are considered laptops.
Thus is the keyboard setup like a laptop then?

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David, what follows is not aimed at you and you alone, but needs to be said:   KEYBOARD LAYOUT IS ABOUT THE KEYBOARD LAYOUT, PERIOD.  What it is attached to is irrelevant.  You can, and in your case you have, attach a desktop layout keyboard to a desktop, all-in-one, or laptop.  What it's attached to is not what matters, what type of keyboard it is is what does.

If you have a keyboard with a full number pad, whether it's native to a laptop or attached to a laptop or a desktop, you can use desktop layout if you wish, because the keyboard itself is a classic desktop keyboard layout.  The laptop keyboard layout and commands exists for those laptops that do not have a built-in number pad on their native keyboard and that's the actual keyboard being used.  These days there are relatively few laptops that come with a "classic laptop" keyboard layout.  I haven't touched a 15 inch or larger laptop without a number pad on it for years now.

You really should be using desktop keyboard layout because you have an actual desktop keyboard layout.

The NVDA Commands Quick Reference can be brought up by any NVDA user via NVDA + N, H, Q.  It will open in your default web browser, and I cannot tell you the number of times I've opened this document when I have forgotten (or never yet learned) the keystokes for a given command.

NVDA calls the mode for listening to what various key press combinations do Input Help Mode.  It can be toggled on/off, regardless of keyboard layout, with NVDA + 1.

If your keyboard has a delete key, and it almost certainly does, using it for its native function makes sense, just as using the applications/menu key does if your keyboard has one rather than SHIFT + F10.

But, were I you, I'd set NVDA to be using desktop keyboard layout as you obviously have purchased a desktop style keyboard.
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Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 

On Nov 9, 2021, at 7:51 AM, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 10:32 AM, David Russell wrote:

According to the Disability Answer Desk, Microsoft, All-in-one computers are considered laptops.
Thus is the keyboard setup like a laptop then?

-
David, what follows is not aimed at you and you alone, but needs to be said:   KEYBOARD LAYOUT IS ABOUT THE KEYBOARD LAYOUT, PERIOD.  What it is attached to is irrelevant.  You can, and in your case you have, attach a desktop layout keyboard to a desktop, all-in-one, or laptop.  What it's attached to is not what matters, what type of keyboard it is is what does.

If you have a keyboard with a full number pad, whether it's native to a laptop or attached to a laptop or a desktop, you can use desktop layout if you wish, because the keyboard itself is a classic desktop keyboard layout.  The laptop keyboard layout and commands exists for those laptops that do not have a built-in number pad on their native keyboard and that's the actual keyboard being used.  These days there are relatively few laptops that come with a "classic laptop" keyboard layout.  I haven't touched a 15 inch or larger laptop without a number pad on it for years now.

You really should be using desktop keyboard layout because you have an actual desktop keyboard layout.

The NVDA Commands Quick Reference can be brought up by any NVDA user via NVDA + N, H, Q.  It will open in your default web browser, and I cannot tell you the number of times I've opened this document when I have forgotten (or never yet learned) the keystokes for a given command.

NVDA calls the mode for listening to what various key press combinations do Input Help Mode.  It can be toggled on/off, regardless of keyboard layout, with NVDA + 1.

If your keyboard has a delete key, and it almost certainly does, using it for its native function makes sense, just as using the applications/menu key does if your keyboard has one rather than SHIFT + F10.

But, were I you, I'd set NVDA to be using desktop keyboard layout as you obviously have purchased a desktop style keyboard.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 

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On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 10:53 AM, Gene wrote:

This is an example of where a very small adjustment on the part of the user can eliminate a lot of problems. 

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Amen!    And that's not meant specifically as a defense of NVDA and the default behaviors it has.  But very often, no matter what the chosen tool, the user has to, at least to some extent, configure their actions to "the way the tool works" rather than the other way around to develop a smooth and efficient way of working with it.

No matter what ends up getting set up as a default behavior, some will love it, some will hate it, and some will be entirely indifferent.  But in the case of the "hate it" crowd for a given thing, you can often figure out a way around that default behavior that's lightning fast by playing around with things for a while, be they settings, commands to be issued, or a combination thereof.

I just played with both NVDA and Narrator in Outlook, and while I can say that I prefer Narrator the difference was not drastic for the HTML formatted message from Healthcare.gov that I was using for my example.  One thing that Narrator does that I have not seen either JAWS or NVDA do, and I don't recall Narrator having done in the early days, that really helps sighted assistants is that it literally highlights each and every word and/or object like a link/button/etc. it's reading as it reads it.  It's like having a blue square being your follow-along finger.  I realize that this would not be of significance if you cannot see it, but it makes a huge difference when someone who's blind and someone who can see are collaborating and sitting and looking at the same screen at the same time.  I haven't looked at JAWS in a while, but I used to get so lost when it was blithely reading all from the virtual cursor and nothing whatsoever moved on the screen.  It could be several pages down in a document and still showing the first page on the screen.  Trying to figure out how to guide my student about "what to do next" when I was lacking the context of where we were, exactly, was a real challenge.  NVDA gets around this with the Focus Highlight feature, and JAWS has something similar, but neither does a follow the word I'm reading sort of highlighting, but you are definitely kept in the same region of text, with scrolling, as the end of what had been visible is reached.
 
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Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

Hi NVDA,

A few months ago, I replaced my Acer all-in-one computer keyboard with
another purchased at an office supply store. The Acer keyboard was too
sensitive for my use.
According to the Disability Answer Desk, Microsoft, All-in-one
computers are considered laptops.
Thus is the keyboard setup like a laptop then?
How can I put the computer in what JAWS used to call "review mode" and
experiment to find out what keys are for insert, delete, page-up,
page-down etc?
The command control+backspace, for example does not work as a delete key for me.
To change punctuation settings, I use the capslock key with the letter p.

Thanks for the help in advance.

I never knew keyboard variation existed until replacing such. Thanks!

Hello Jean,

Just always read line by line,

Remember I used to use jaws so not as difficult.

However as Mentioned to steve I found its only with certain commercial e-mails I have this problem.

Kind regards,

Dennis huckle.

If you use read to end instead of manually moving by line, you won't hear blank spoken.  NVDA doesn't announce blank lines in read to end. 

Is there a reason you read messages by line, as you appear to read at least some?

Gene

I have Microsoft office.

When using nvda to read e-mails unless I use the browser to read them in nvda, not jaws, lots of blank lines appear in the e-mail received.

Is there a way of reducing the number of blank lines whilst reading an e-mail.

Also some e-mails close when using nvda.

This, as mentioned doesn’t happen in jaws.

Any suggestions welcome.

Kind regards,

Dennis huckle.

 

Hi Dennis,

Create a configuration profile for outlook and disable the reporting of tables. That should resolve your situation.

Pranav