Date   

Re: Failing to read document with Adobe Acrobat DC and NVDA

enes sarıbaş
 

Hi,

I am using the English version.

On 11/9/2021 6:03 PM, Quentin Christensen wrote:
There is one comment on that issue Enes shared indicating that it works in English, but does not work in other languages, or at least Turkish.  For those experiencing Adobe Reader NOT working, what language are you using?  (I am using English, which might fit with that hypothesis as althoguh it throws a bunch of errors in the log, it does open and read the file).

Quentin.

On Wed, Nov 10, 2021 at 7:34 AM cisco <audiogamer2004@...> wrote:

Hello Quentin and all,

 

I wanted to firstly thank you for the link, it was the one I downloaded the continuous version from.

 

How ever, when I tried to open a PDF file in that specific version as well, the same that happened previously happened, I wasn’t able to read anything.

 

I’m just letting you all guys know so you can see if you have that problem or not.

 

If you find some kind of workaround do write it on the list for those of us who have the problem.

Thanks again for everything.

Best regards.

Francisco.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Tuesday, November 9, 2021 4:02 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Failing to read document with Adobe Acrobat DC and NVDA

 

I don't have the exact URL I downloaded from, I likely updated from a previous version.  But just looking on Adobe's site I found: https://get.adobe.com/uk/reader/otherversions/

 

Which lets you select the OS, language and version (64-bit or 32-bit).  I found our issue on it: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/12920 but I don't have a concrete solution, except that it seems to work for some users and not for others.

 

On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 10:39 PM cisco <audiogamer2004@...> wrote:

Hello there Quentin and all,

 

May I ask a link to download the version of Acrobat you’re using right now? I not only want to download it, I also want to confront the link with the one I used.

Thanks in advance and best regards.

Francisco.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Monday, November 8, 2021 12:15 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Failing to read document with Adobe Acrobat DC and NVDA

 

I'm not sure what the specific issue here is, but in response to the comment about Adobe Reader DC 64 not being accessible, I am using:

 

Adobe Acrobat Reader DC Continuous Release Version 2021.007.20099 64-bit

 

And I can read accessible PDF files with NVDA 2021.3 beta 2  (I didn't try 2021.2 just now, but I was using it until we released the first beta and I didn't notice an issue).

 

Kind regards

 

Quentin.


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


locked Japanese TTS engine

juergenkohler23@...
 

Hello,
 
is there a free Japanese TTS engine for NVDA (e.g. a SAPI4 or SAPI5 voice)? I would be very happy to receive answers!
 
Many thanks and best regards


Re: Unable to focus on zoom

Ali Colak
 

Thanks

On 11/10/21, Yeti <jbslists@...> wrote:
Hello Ali and All,

Im running the 2021.3B2 currently under W10-64 and have not installed any
addon regarding Zoom, as far I know.
Addendum:
I used the Zoom Version 5.8.0 (1324) before.
Now I updated to the current 5.8.3 (1581), but still working.

Ad Astra

Yeti







Re: Unable to focus on zoom

Yeti
 

Hello Ali and All,

Im running the 2021.3B2 currently under W10-64 and have not installed any addon regarding Zoom, as far I know.
Addendum:
I used the Zoom Version 5.8.0 (1324) before.
Now I updated to the current 5.8.3 (1581), but still working.

Ad Astra

Yeti


Re: Unable to focus on zoom

Yeti
 

Hello Ali and All,

Since last Friday, I have been having problems with zoom,
I worked with zoom yesterday and just tried it again yet.
I can not find anything strange "


Im running the 2021.3B2 currently under W10-64 and have not installed any addon regarding Zoom, as far I know.

Sorry for can't helping

Ad astra

Yeti


Unable to focus on zoom

Ali Colak
 

Hello,
Since last Friday, I have been having problems with zoom, where NVDA
is unable to focus on the zoom window. whether I open the aplication
itself or open a zoom meeting from a link. I thought it might be a
problem with the Beta version of NVDA, so I downgraded, but no luck.
The next option I can think of is reinstalling zoom, but before I do
that, anyone have any ideas?

Thanks


Re: NVDA Cursor Help Please

Sarah k Alawami
 

Actually I have very long ish fingers so I don’t’ have to shift my hands all that much.k I’ve used the desktop layouts before and I can’t really grasp said layouts, I never was able to, not in my almost 30 years of computer usage.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Tuesday, November 9, 2021 8:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA Cursor Help Please

 

I think you are saying what you are because you are used to the laptop layout.  Muscle memory allows those used to the desktop layout to move to the numpad and press the key they wish quickly.  Perhaps that is a fractional loss of speed but I wouldn't assume that.  After all. using the laptop layout you have to move to the shift key or use control shift, moving one of your hands away from the home key for a lot of commands. And the desktop layout appears, from the little I've compared, to be more logically laid out and thus easier to learn. 

 

It is important to guard against conflating what you are used to to having advantages it may not.

 

Gene

On 11/9/2021 8:36 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

Actually I use laptop mode n the desktop layouts, always. I don’t like the  desktop layouts, they can for me go die. I can reach keys a lot easier than on desktop mode. And I don’t have to move my hands a lot.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Luke Robinett
Sent: Tuesday, November 9, 2021 3:55 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA Cursor Help Please

 

Here’s what Brian‘s response would have looked like without the user shaming he likes to add. I think this line alone would have sufficiently answered OP‘s question:

 

If you have a keyboard with a full number pad, whether it's native to a laptop or attached to a laptop or a desktop, you can use desktop layout if you wish, because the keyboard itself is a classic desktop keyboard layout.  The laptop keyboard layout and commands exists for those laptops that do not have a built-in number pad on their native keyboard and that's the actual keyboard being used.

 

 

On Nov 9, 2021, at 7:51 AM, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 10:32 AM, David Russell wrote:

According to the Disability Answer Desk, Microsoft, All-in-one computers are considered laptops.
Thus is the keyboard setup like a laptop then?

-
David, what follows is not aimed at you and you alone, but needs to be said:   KEYBOARD LAYOUT IS ABOUT THE KEYBOARD LAYOUT, PERIOD.  What it is attached to is irrelevant.  You can, and in your case you have, attach a desktop layout keyboard to a desktop, all-in-one, or laptop.  What it's attached to is not what matters, what type of keyboard it is is what does.

If you have a keyboard with a full number pad, whether it's native to a laptop or attached to a laptop or a desktop, you can use desktop layout if you wish, because the keyboard itself is a classic desktop keyboard layout.  The laptop keyboard layout and commands exists for those laptops that do not have a built-in number pad on their native keyboard and that's the actual keyboard being used.  These days there are relatively few laptops that come with a "classic laptop" keyboard layout.  I haven't touched a 15 inch or larger laptop without a number pad on it for years now.

You really should be using desktop keyboard layout because you have an actual desktop keyboard layout.

The NVDA Commands Quick Reference can be brought up by any NVDA user via NVDA + N, H, Q.  It will open in your default web browser, and I cannot tell you the number of times I've opened this document when I have forgotten (or never yet learned) the keystokes for a given command.

NVDA calls the mode for listening to what various key press combinations do Input Help Mode.  It can be toggled on/off, regardless of keyboard layout, with NVDA + 1.

If your keyboard has a delete key, and it almost certainly does, using it for its native function makes sense, just as using the applications/menu key does if your keyboard has one rather than SHIFT + F10.

But, were I you, I'd set NVDA to be using desktop keyboard layout as you obviously have purchased a desktop style keyboard.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: NVDA Cursor Help Please

Gene
 

I think you are saying what you are because you are used to the laptop layout.  Muscle memory allows those used to the desktop layout to move to the numpad and press the key they wish quickly.  Perhaps that is a fractional loss of speed but I wouldn't assume that.  After all. using the laptop layout you have to move to the shift key or use control shift, moving one of your hands away from the home key for a lot of commands. And the desktop layout appears, from the little I've compared, to be more logically laid out and thus easier to learn. 


It is important to guard against conflating what you are used to to having advantages it may not.


Gene

On 11/9/2021 8:36 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

Actually I use laptop mode n the desktop layouts, always. I don’t like the  desktop layouts, they can for me go die. I can reach keys a lot easier than on desktop mode. And I don’t have to move my hands a lot.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Luke Robinett
Sent: Tuesday, November 9, 2021 3:55 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA Cursor Help Please

 

Here’s what Brian‘s response would have looked like without the user shaming he likes to add. I think this line alone would have sufficiently answered OP‘s question:

 

If you have a keyboard with a full number pad, whether it's native to a laptop or attached to a laptop or a desktop, you can use desktop layout if you wish, because the keyboard itself is a classic desktop keyboard layout.  The laptop keyboard layout and commands exists for those laptops that do not have a built-in number pad on their native keyboard and that's the actual keyboard being used.

 

 

On Nov 9, 2021, at 7:51 AM, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 10:32 AM, David Russell wrote:

According to the Disability Answer Desk, Microsoft, All-in-one computers are considered laptops.
Thus is the keyboard setup like a laptop then?

-
David, what follows is not aimed at you and you alone, but needs to be said:   KEYBOARD LAYOUT IS ABOUT THE KEYBOARD LAYOUT, PERIOD.  What it is attached to is irrelevant.  You can, and in your case you have, attach a desktop layout keyboard to a desktop, all-in-one, or laptop.  What it's attached to is not what matters, what type of keyboard it is is what does.

If you have a keyboard with a full number pad, whether it's native to a laptop or attached to a laptop or a desktop, you can use desktop layout if you wish, because the keyboard itself is a classic desktop keyboard layout.  The laptop keyboard layout and commands exists for those laptops that do not have a built-in number pad on their native keyboard and that's the actual keyboard being used.  These days there are relatively few laptops that come with a "classic laptop" keyboard layout.  I haven't touched a 15 inch or larger laptop without a number pad on it for years now.

You really should be using desktop keyboard layout because you have an actual desktop keyboard layout.

The NVDA Commands Quick Reference can be brought up by any NVDA user via NVDA + N, H, Q.  It will open in your default web browser, and I cannot tell you the number of times I've opened this document when I have forgotten (or never yet learned) the keystokes for a given command.

NVDA calls the mode for listening to what various key press combinations do Input Help Mode.  It can be toggled on/off, regardless of keyboard layout, with NVDA + 1.

If your keyboard has a delete key, and it almost certainly does, using it for its native function makes sense, just as using the applications/menu key does if your keyboard has one rather than SHIFT + F10.

But, were I you, I'd set NVDA to be using desktop keyboard layout as you obviously have purchased a desktop style keyboard.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: NVDA Cursor Help Please

Sarah k Alawami
 

Actually I use laptop mode n the desktop layouts, always. I don’t like the  desktop layouts, they can for me go die. I can reach keys a lot easier than on desktop mode. And I don’t have to move my hands a lot.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Luke Robinett
Sent: Tuesday, November 9, 2021 3:55 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA Cursor Help Please

 

Here’s what Brian‘s response would have looked like without the user shaming he likes to add. I think this line alone would have sufficiently answered OP‘s question:

 

If you have a keyboard with a full number pad, whether it's native to a laptop or attached to a laptop or a desktop, you can use desktop layout if you wish, because the keyboard itself is a classic desktop keyboard layout.  The laptop keyboard layout and commands exists for those laptops that do not have a built-in number pad on their native keyboard and that's the actual keyboard being used.

 

 

On Nov 9, 2021, at 7:51 AM, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 10:32 AM, David Russell wrote:

According to the Disability Answer Desk, Microsoft, All-in-one computers are considered laptops.
Thus is the keyboard setup like a laptop then?

-
David, what follows is not aimed at you and you alone, but needs to be said:   KEYBOARD LAYOUT IS ABOUT THE KEYBOARD LAYOUT, PERIOD.  What it is attached to is irrelevant.  You can, and in your case you have, attach a desktop layout keyboard to a desktop, all-in-one, or laptop.  What it's attached to is not what matters, what type of keyboard it is is what does.

If you have a keyboard with a full number pad, whether it's native to a laptop or attached to a laptop or a desktop, you can use desktop layout if you wish, because the keyboard itself is a classic desktop keyboard layout.  The laptop keyboard layout and commands exists for those laptops that do not have a built-in number pad on their native keyboard and that's the actual keyboard being used.  These days there are relatively few laptops that come with a "classic laptop" keyboard layout.  I haven't touched a 15 inch or larger laptop without a number pad on it for years now.

You really should be using desktop keyboard layout because you have an actual desktop keyboard layout.

The NVDA Commands Quick Reference can be brought up by any NVDA user via NVDA + N, H, Q.  It will open in your default web browser, and I cannot tell you the number of times I've opened this document when I have forgotten (or never yet learned) the keystokes for a given command.

NVDA calls the mode for listening to what various key press combinations do Input Help Mode.  It can be toggled on/off, regardless of keyboard layout, with NVDA + 1.

If your keyboard has a delete key, and it almost certainly does, using it for its native function makes sense, just as using the applications/menu key does if your keyboard has one rather than SHIFT + F10.

But, were I you, I'd set NVDA to be using desktop keyboard layout as you obviously have purchased a desktop style keyboard.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: NVDA Cursor Help Please

 

On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 06:54 PM, Luke Robinett wrote:
Here’s what Brian‘s response would have looked like without the user shaming he likes to add.
-
In your opinion.

There has been an ongoing, and consistent, confusion about what keyboard layout really refers to, that has not seemed to go away over time.

I'm not sorry if you find necessary emphasis to be "user shaming."  It's not, and never has been.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: NVDA not reading number of unread messages

Quentin Christensen
 

I haven't used Yahoo for a few years, but I just tried in both Chrome and Firefox and when I sent myself a test message, and looked at my inbox, in both browsers, it read "Inbox, 1 email, 1 unread".

Maybe you need to clear your browser cache?  I more often use Gmail and I know when it starts playing up, often clearing the browser cache fixes it.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Wed, Nov 10, 2021 at 10:06 AM mcLeod stinnett <macks75205@...> wrote:
version 21.2 i read my yahoo mail on the web, in the basic view. when i go to the inbox for the first time in a day,  NVDA might say 5 unread. for the last few days it says nothing about that, no big deal. question is, to get it to report that do i need to check a certain setting?
--
from mack 







--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: Failing to read document with Adobe Acrobat DC and NVDA

Quentin Christensen
 

There is one comment on that issue Enes shared indicating that it works in English, but does not work in other languages, or at least Turkish.  For those experiencing Adobe Reader NOT working, what language are you using?  (I am using English, which might fit with that hypothesis as althoguh it throws a bunch of errors in the log, it does open and read the file).

Quentin.

On Wed, Nov 10, 2021 at 7:34 AM cisco <audiogamer2004@...> wrote:

Hello Quentin and all,

 

I wanted to firstly thank you for the link, it was the one I downloaded the continuous version from.

 

How ever, when I tried to open a PDF file in that specific version as well, the same that happened previously happened, I wasn’t able to read anything.

 

I’m just letting you all guys know so you can see if you have that problem or not.

 

If you find some kind of workaround do write it on the list for those of us who have the problem.

Thanks again for everything.

Best regards.

Francisco.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Tuesday, November 9, 2021 4:02 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Failing to read document with Adobe Acrobat DC and NVDA

 

I don't have the exact URL I downloaded from, I likely updated from a previous version.  But just looking on Adobe's site I found: https://get.adobe.com/uk/reader/otherversions/

 

Which lets you select the OS, language and version (64-bit or 32-bit).  I found our issue on it: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/12920 but I don't have a concrete solution, except that it seems to work for some users and not for others.

 

On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 10:39 PM cisco <audiogamer2004@...> wrote:

Hello there Quentin and all,

 

May I ask a link to download the version of Acrobat you’re using right now? I not only want to download it, I also want to confront the link with the one I used.

Thanks in advance and best regards.

Francisco.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Monday, November 8, 2021 12:15 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Failing to read document with Adobe Acrobat DC and NVDA

 

I'm not sure what the specific issue here is, but in response to the comment about Adobe Reader DC 64 not being accessible, I am using:

 

Adobe Acrobat Reader DC Continuous Release Version 2021.007.20099 64-bit

 

And I can read accessible PDF files with NVDA 2021.3 beta 2  (I didn't try 2021.2 just now, but I was using it until we released the first beta and I didn't notice an issue).

 

Kind regards

 

Quentin.


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: NVDA Cursor Help Please

Luke Robinett
 

Here’s what Brian‘s response would have looked like without the user shaming he likes to add. I think this line alone would have sufficiently answered OP‘s question:

If you have a keyboard with a full number pad, whether it's native to a laptop or attached to a laptop or a desktop, you can use desktop layout if you wish, because the keyboard itself is a classic desktop keyboard layout.  The laptop keyboard layout and commands exists for those laptops that do not have a built-in number pad on their native keyboard and that's the actual keyboard being used.


On Nov 9, 2021, at 7:51 AM, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 10:32 AM, David Russell wrote:
According to the Disability Answer Desk, Microsoft, All-in-one computers are considered laptops.
Thus is the keyboard setup like a laptop then?
-
David, what follows is not aimed at you and you alone, but needs to be said:   KEYBOARD LAYOUT IS ABOUT THE KEYBOARD LAYOUT, PERIOD.  What it is attached to is irrelevant.  You can, and in your case you have, attach a desktop layout keyboard to a desktop, all-in-one, or laptop.  What it's attached to is not what matters, what type of keyboard it is is what does.

If you have a keyboard with a full number pad, whether it's native to a laptop or attached to a laptop or a desktop, you can use desktop layout if you wish, because the keyboard itself is a classic desktop keyboard layout.  The laptop keyboard layout and commands exists for those laptops that do not have a built-in number pad on their native keyboard and that's the actual keyboard being used.  These days there are relatively few laptops that come with a "classic laptop" keyboard layout.  I haven't touched a 15 inch or larger laptop without a number pad on it for years now.

You really should be using desktop keyboard layout because you have an actual desktop keyboard layout.

The NVDA Commands Quick Reference can be brought up by any NVDA user via NVDA + N, H, Q.  It will open in your default web browser, and I cannot tell you the number of times I've opened this document when I have forgotten (or never yet learned) the keystokes for a given command.

NVDA calls the mode for listening to what various key press combinations do Input Help Mode.  It can be toggled on/off, regardless of keyboard layout, with NVDA + 1.

If your keyboard has a delete key, and it almost certainly does, using it for its native function makes sense, just as using the applications/menu key does if your keyboard has one rather than SHIFT + F10.

But, were I you, I'd set NVDA to be using desktop keyboard layout as you obviously have purchased a desktop style keyboard.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


NVDA not reading number of unread messages

mcLeod stinnett
 

version 21.2 i read my yahoo mail on the web, in the basic view. when i go to the inbox for the first time in a day, NVDA might say 5 unread. for the last few days it says nothing about that, no big deal. question is, to get it to report that do i need to check a certain setting?
--
from mack


Re: Failing to read document with Adobe Acrobat DC and NVDA

cisco
 

Hello Quentin and all,

 

I wanted to firstly thank you for the link, it was the one I downloaded the continuous version from.

 

How ever, when I tried to open a PDF file in that specific version as well, the same that happened previously happened, I wasn’t able to read anything.

 

I’m just letting you all guys know so you can see if you have that problem or not.

 

If you find some kind of workaround do write it on the list for those of us who have the problem.

Thanks again for everything.

Best regards.

Francisco.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Tuesday, November 9, 2021 4:02 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Failing to read document with Adobe Acrobat DC and NVDA

 

I don't have the exact URL I downloaded from, I likely updated from a previous version.  But just looking on Adobe's site I found: https://get.adobe.com/uk/reader/otherversions/

 

Which lets you select the OS, language and version (64-bit or 32-bit).  I found our issue on it: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/12920 but I don't have a concrete solution, except that it seems to work for some users and not for others.

 

On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 10:39 PM cisco <audiogamer2004@...> wrote:

Hello there Quentin and all,

 

May I ask a link to download the version of Acrobat you’re using right now? I not only want to download it, I also want to confront the link with the one I used.

Thanks in advance and best regards.

Francisco.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Monday, November 8, 2021 12:15 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Failing to read document with Adobe Acrobat DC and NVDA

 

I'm not sure what the specific issue here is, but in response to the comment about Adobe Reader DC 64 not being accessible, I am using:

 

Adobe Acrobat Reader DC Continuous Release Version 2021.007.20099 64-bit

 

And I can read accessible PDF files with NVDA 2021.3 beta 2  (I didn't try 2021.2 just now, but I was using it until we released the first beta and I didn't notice an issue).

 

Kind regards

 

Quentin.


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 


Re: NVDA Cursor Help Please

Jujube
 

To enter input help mode, press NVDA+1


On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 7:32 AM David Russell <david.sonofhashem@...> wrote:
Hi NVDA,

A few months ago, I replaced my Acer all-in-one computer keyboard with
another purchased at an office supply store. The Acer keyboard was too
sensitive for my use.
According to the Disability Answer Desk, Microsoft, All-in-one
computers are considered laptops.
Thus is the keyboard setup like a laptop then?
How can I put the computer in what JAWS used to call "review mode" and
experiment to find out what keys are for insert, delete, page-up,
page-down etc?
The command control+backspace, for example does not work as a delete key for me.
To change punctuation settings, I use the capslock key with the letter p.

Thanks for the help in advance.

I never knew keyboard variation existed until replacing such.  Thanks!

--
David C. Russell, Author
david.sonofhashem@...






Re: nvda and e-mails

Steve Nutt
 

Hi Brian,

 

If you turn on Make Outlook More Efficient in Narrator, it emulates the way JAWS 2022 works, in that it doesn’t read any of that garbage like To, From, Subject etc, when you open the message. It is much more efficient, because you don’t have to press any keys, it just launches into the body of the message.

 

All the best


Steve

 

--

To subscribe to our News and Special Offers list, go to https://www.comproom.co.uk/subscribe

 

Computer Room Services

77 Exeter Close

Stevenage

Hertfordshire

SG1 4PW

T: +44(0)1438-742286

M: +44(0)7956-334938

F: +44(0)1438-759589

E: steve@...

W: https://www.comproom.co.uk

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: 09 November 2021 16:26
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda and e-mails

 

On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 10:53 AM, Gene wrote:

This is an example of where a very small adjustment on the part of the user can eliminate a lot of problems. 

-
Amen!    And that's not meant specifically as a defense of NVDA and the default behaviors it has.  But very often, no matter what the chosen tool, the user has to, at least to some extent, configure their actions to "the way the tool works" rather than the other way around to develop a smooth and efficient way of working with it.

No matter what ends up getting set up as a default behavior, some will love it, some will hate it, and some will be entirely indifferent.  But in the case of the "hate it" crowd for a given thing, you can often figure out a way around that default behavior that's lightning fast by playing around with things for a while, be they settings, commands to be issued, or a combination thereof.

I just played with both NVDA and Narrator in Outlook, and while I can say that I prefer Narrator the difference was not drastic for the HTML formatted message from Healthcare.gov that I was using for my example.  One thing that Narrator does that I have not seen either JAWS or NVDA do, and I don't recall Narrator having done in the early days, that really helps sighted assistants is that it literally highlights each and every word and/or object like a link/button/etc. it's reading as it reads it.  It's like having a blue square being your follow-along finger.  I realize that this would not be of significance if you cannot see it, but it makes a huge difference when someone who's blind and someone who can see are collaborating and sitting and looking at the same screen at the same time.  I haven't looked at JAWS in a while, but I used to get so lost when it was blithely reading all from the virtual cursor and nothing whatsoever moved on the screen.  It could be several pages down in a document and still showing the first page on the screen.  Trying to figure out how to guide my student about "what to do next" when I was lacking the context of where we were, exactly, was a real challenge.  NVDA gets around this with the Focus Highlight feature, and JAWS has something similar, but neither does a follow the word I'm reading sort of highlighting, but you are definitely kept in the same region of text, with scrolling, as the end of what had been visible is reached.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: nvda and e-mails

 

On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 10:53 AM, Gene wrote:
This is an example of where a very small adjustment on the part of the user can eliminate a lot of problems. 
-
Amen!    And that's not meant specifically as a defense of NVDA and the default behaviors it has.  But very often, no matter what the chosen tool, the user has to, at least to some extent, configure their actions to "the way the tool works" rather than the other way around to develop a smooth and efficient way of working with it.

No matter what ends up getting set up as a default behavior, some will love it, some will hate it, and some will be entirely indifferent.  But in the case of the "hate it" crowd for a given thing, you can often figure out a way around that default behavior that's lightning fast by playing around with things for a while, be they settings, commands to be issued, or a combination thereof.

I just played with both NVDA and Narrator in Outlook, and while I can say that I prefer Narrator the difference was not drastic for the HTML formatted message from Healthcare.gov that I was using for my example.  One thing that Narrator does that I have not seen either JAWS or NVDA do, and I don't recall Narrator having done in the early days, that really helps sighted assistants is that it literally highlights each and every word and/or object like a link/button/etc. it's reading as it reads it.  It's like having a blue square being your follow-along finger.  I realize that this would not be of significance if you cannot see it, but it makes a huge difference when someone who's blind and someone who can see are collaborating and sitting and looking at the same screen at the same time.  I haven't looked at JAWS in a while, but I used to get so lost when it was blithely reading all from the virtual cursor and nothing whatsoever moved on the screen.  It could be several pages down in a document and still showing the first page on the screen.  Trying to figure out how to guide my student about "what to do next" when I was lacking the context of where we were, exactly, was a real challenge.  NVDA gets around this with the Focus Highlight feature, and JAWS has something similar, but neither does a follow the word I'm reading sort of highlighting, but you are definitely kept in the same region of text, with scrolling, as the end of what had been visible is reached.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: nvda and e-mails

Sarah k Alawami
 

I actually never read to end. But go line by line myself at times. I find it easier

To track stuff and the curser seems to track better when I go line by line.

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Tuesday, November 9, 2021 7:53 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda and e-mails

 

This is an example of where a very small adjustment on the part of the user can eliminate a lot of problems.  Whyile I don’t use Outlook, I expect that opening a message, then issuing the read to end command will eliminate the problems discussed.  That is what I do with both Windows Live Mail and Thunderbird and the entire problems are eliminated in that way.  Issuing the command becomes second nature and automatic after a short time.  Screen-readers exist in complex environments and users will save themselves time and inconvenience by helping them do their jobs if this can be done in simple and easy ways when doing so helps.

 

another example is using the screen-reader find command on a web page.  As soon as my screen-reader starts to speak what it has found, I immediately issue the read current line command.  That reads what has been found and eliminates a lot of irrelevant verbiage.

 

This isn’t necessary when using repeat search but it is with the first search with NVDA to eliminate such verbiage..  It also used to be necessary in JAWS but I haven’t used JAWS in years and I don’t know if the problem was ever resolved in newer versions than I used.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Steve Nutt

Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2021 9:43 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda and e-mails

 

Hi,

 

Unfortunately, NVDA doesn’t have the ability to automatically read all Emails when you open them in outlook.

 

If you open an HTML Email, then Say All kicks in, but it still reads the header and all that garbage. If you open a text based Email, then it only reads the first line.

 

That’s why I say compared to JAWS and Narrator, it is horrible to use with Email.

 

All the best


Steve

 

--

To subscribe to our News and Special Offers list, go to https://www.comproom.co.uk/subscribe

 

Computer Room Services

77 Exeter Close

Stevenage

Hertfordshire

SG1 4PW

T: +44(0)1438-742286

M: +44(0)7956-334938

F: +44(0)1438-759589

E: steve@...

W: https://www.comproom.co.uk

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of dennis huckle
Sent: 09 November 2021 13:34
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda and e-mails

 

Hello Jean,

Just always read line by line,

Remember I used to use jaws so not as difficult.

However as Mentioned to steve I found its only with certain commercial e-mails I have this problem.

Kind regards,

Dennis huckle.

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 09 November 2021 12:39
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda and e-mails

 

If you use read to end instead of manually moving by line, you won't hear blank spoken.  NVDA doesn't announce blank lines in read to end. 

 

Is there a reason you read messages by line, as you appear to read at least some?

 

Gene

On 11/8/2021 8:41 AM, dennis huckle wrote:

I have Microsoft office.

When using nvda to read e-mails unless I use the browser to read them in nvda, not jaws, lots of blank lines appear in the e-mail received.

Is there a way of reducing the number of blank lines whilst reading an e-mail.

Also some e-mails close when using nvda.

This, as mentioned doesn’t happen in jaws.

Any suggestions welcome.

Kind regards,

Dennis huckle.

 


Re: nvda and e-mails

Gene
 

This is an example of where a very small adjustment on the part of the user can eliminate a lot of problems.  Whyile I don’t use Outlook, I expect that opening a message, then issuing the read to end command will eliminate the problems discussed.  That is what I do with both Windows Live Mail and Thunderbird and the entire problems are eliminated in that way.  Issuing the command becomes second nature and automatic after a short time.  Screen-readers exist in complex environments and users will save themselves time and inconvenience by helping them do their jobs if this can be done in simple and easy ways when doing so helps.
 
another example is using the screen-reader find command on a web page.  As soon as my screen-reader starts to speak what it has found, I immediately issue the read current line command.  That reads what has been found and eliminates a lot of irrelevant verbiage.
 
This isn’t necessary when using repeat search but it is with the first search with NVDA to eliminate such verbiage..  It also used to be necessary in JAWS but I haven’t used JAWS in years and I don’t know if the problem was ever resolved in newer versions than I used.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Nutt
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2021 9:43 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda and e-mails
 

Hi,

 

Unfortunately, NVDA doesn’t have the ability to automatically read all Emails when you open them in outlook.

 

If you open an HTML Email, then Say All kicks in, but it still reads the header and all that garbage. If you open a text based Email, then it only reads the first line.

 

That’s why I say compared to JAWS and Narrator, it is horrible to use with Email.

 

All the best


Steve

 

--

To subscribe to our News and Special Offers list, go to https://www.comproom.co.uk/subscribe

 

Computer Room Services

77 Exeter Close

Stevenage

Hertfordshire

SG1 4PW

T: +44(0)1438-742286

M: +44(0)7956-334938

F: +44(0)1438-759589

E: steve@...

W: https://www.comproom.co.uk

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of dennis huckle
Sent: 09 November 2021 13:34
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda and e-mails

 

Hello Jean,

Just always read line by line,

Remember I used to use jaws so not as difficult.

However as Mentioned to steve I found its only with certain commercial e-mails I have this problem.

Kind regards,

Dennis huckle.

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 09 November 2021 12:39
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda and e-mails

 

If you use read to end instead of manually moving by line, you won't hear blank spoken.  NVDA doesn't announce blank lines in read to end. 

 

Is there a reason you read messages by line, as you appear to read at least some?

 

Gene

On 11/8/2021 8:41 AM, dennis huckle wrote:

I have Microsoft office.

When using nvda to read e-mails unless I use the browser to read them in nvda, not jaws, lots of blank lines appear in the e-mail received.

Is there a way of reducing the number of blank lines whilst reading an e-mail.

Also some e-mails close when using nvda.

This, as mentioned doesn’t happen in jaws.

Any suggestions welcome.

Kind regards,

Dennis huckle.

 

7501 - 7520 of 96798