Date   

Re: Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

Steve Nutt
 

I already have.

 

The caps lock’s main purpose is for you to type in full caps. If NVDA slows this ability down, even by a keystroke, it should be considered.

 

Again, Narrator is smart enough to know the difference between a press on its own, or a multiple press.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 15 November 2021 16:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

There are objective facts and opinions.  You are stating a fact.  You do this.  You have presented no evidence to support a generalization that a lot of people do what you do nor that they find pressing caps lock twice to be something they consider a problem or an inconvenience worth asking to be changed.  Nor have you presented arguments why these things might be the case.

 

I have no evidence either, in terms of that I haven’t taken a survey of a representative sample of NVDA members.  But it is just common sense, considering the purpose of the caps lock key that most people don’t use it much. 

 

Also, in all the years I’ve been on this list, I have never heard this complained of before.  Therefore, it is a good inductive conclusion that few people are bothered by the current way this is set up.

 

Gene

-----Origina Message-----

From: Steve Nutt

Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 9:33 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

But what makes anyone say it isn’t? Everyone’s experience is different.

 

I know loads of people who use the caps lock, both blind and not.

 

All the best


steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 15 November 2021 15:17
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

You are one person.  If you took three showers a day, that doesn’t mean it is common. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Steve Nutt

Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 2:37 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

I disagree with your assertion that caps lock is not commonly used. I use it a lot.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: 12 November 2021 16:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 08:19 AM, Gene wrote:

It would be an execution nightmare.  First, how does Windows know what your intent is?

-
It wouldn't be Windows determining the intent, but NVDA.

Ignoring sticky keys, which is a separate function of its own, when the CAPS LOCK key is used as a modifier key I cannot think of a time when that would not involve what would easily be "timeable" as a long-press or require CAPS LOCK along with another key (as it is the modifier).  A very quick single press of CAPS LOCK meant to be used as CAPS LOCK is something NVDA could likely detect and pass through because it would be a very quick strike.

Personally, I don't think this is really necessary as CAPS LOCK is not, generally speaking, a commonly used key, unlike shift.  On the rare occasions where you really want CAPS LOCK and it's being used as the NVDA modifier key a quick double press does not seem too difficult to accomplish.
--

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The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

Steve Nutt
 

Exactly, why would you hold shift key down to do a fully capped word or sentence? Makes no sense to me.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sarah k Alawami
Sent: 15 November 2021 15:58
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

I also use it a lot to tag some of my videos as there are things that need all caps, and I’m  too lazy to hold down shift while typing KLAS to KMIA, or maybe I want to shout at someone on discord, Ok, maybe not. Lol!

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 12:38 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

I disagree with your assertion that caps lock is not commonly used. I use it a lot.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: 12 November 2021 16:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 08:19 AM, Gene wrote:

It would be an execution nightmare.  First, how does Windows know what your intent is?

-
It wouldn't be Windows determining the intent, but NVDA.

Ignoring sticky keys, which is a separate function of its own, when the CAPS LOCK key is used as a modifier key I cannot think of a time when that would not involve what would easily be "timeable" as a long-press or require CAPS LOCK along with another key (as it is the modifier).  A very quick single press of CAPS LOCK meant to be used as CAPS LOCK is something NVDA could likely detect and pass through because it would be a very quick strike.

Personally, I don't think this is really necessary as CAPS LOCK is not, generally speaking, a commonly used key, unlike shift.  On the rare occasions where you really want CAPS LOCK and it's being used as the NVDA modifier key a quick double press does not seem too difficult to accomplish.
--

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The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


NVDA's handling of checkboxes especially in Google Chrome

Tyler Zahnke <programmer651@...>
 

Hello NVDA community! Why does NVDA not read some checkboxes in Google
Chrome? NVDA reads a lot of them, but some sites have a "remember me"
checkbox on their login screen that just says "clickable"; when you
press Enter where it says clickable, the box checks, but NVDA doesn't
tell you this. I have seen websites that contain both accessible and
inaccessible checkboxes, why is this? And several times (I have a
memory of seeing this on the login screen of Palai), it doesn't read
some of the checkboxes, such as "remember me", at all. It actually got
to the point where I thought they had removed the checkbox from their
site because it completely didn't read it, but users of other devices
claimed they still saw the checkbox, but several of us Chrome and NVDA
users noticed the missing checkbox. And as soon as I tried the same
site with Firefox and NVDA, I saw the checkbox, but it said "remember
me clickable" and therefore, though you could check and uncheck it,
NVDA wouldn't tell you, while on Chrome, NVDA skips over the box. This
was a problem with a website that I actually had to help out as far as
accessibility; their site had some regular checkboxes on the form and
screen readers could read it just fine, but then some checkboxes said
"clickable" or didn't say anything at all, yet the Enter key worked on
them but the screen reader didn't say. I've probably seen variations
on this issue for a few years, some checkbox not displaying in Chrome.
Often I would try it again with Firefox, and at least in the
checkbox-related cases, it usually worked. And in the case of the
website I helped make accessible, I even looked at the HTML for the
checkboxes, and even the inaccessible checkboxes were still coded like
checkboxes though they may have had some extra styling on them. So
what's the deal with checkboxes?


Re: Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

Sarah k Alawami
 

I actually have been bothered, but I figured this was the default of every screen reader, until I started using differen oss. It’s not really a big deal to me, nice to have but not necessary.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 8:00 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

There are objective facts and opinions.  You are stating a fact.  You do this.  You have presented no evidence to support a generalization that a lot of people do what you do nor that they find pressing caps lock twice to be something they consider a problem or an inconvenience worth asking to be changed.  Nor have you presented arguments why these things might be the case.

 

I have no evidence either, in terms of that I haven’t taken a survey of a representative sample of NVDA members.  But it is just common sense, considering the purpose of the caps lock key that most people don’t use it much. 

 

Also, in all the years I’ve been on this list, I have never heard this complained of before.  Therefore, it is a good inductive conclusion that few people are bothered by the current way this is set up.

 

Gene

-----Origina Message-----

From: Steve Nutt

Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 9:33 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

But what makes anyone say it isn’t? Everyone’s experience is different.

 

I know loads of people who use the caps lock, both blind and not.

 

All the best


steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 15 November 2021 15:17
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

You are one person.  If you took three showers a day, that doesn’t mean it is common. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Steve Nutt

Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 2:37 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

I disagree with your assertion that caps lock is not commonly used. I use it a lot.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: 12 November 2021 16:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 08:19 AM, Gene wrote:

It would be an execution nightmare.  First, how does Windows know what your intent is?

-
It wouldn't be Windows determining the intent, but NVDA.

Ignoring sticky keys, which is a separate function of its own, when the CAPS LOCK key is used as a modifier key I cannot think of a time when that would not involve what would easily be "timeable" as a long-press or require CAPS LOCK along with another key (as it is the modifier).  A very quick single press of CAPS LOCK meant to be used as CAPS LOCK is something NVDA could likely detect and pass through because it would be a very quick strike.

Personally, I don't think this is really necessary as CAPS LOCK is not, generally speaking, a commonly used key, unlike shift.  On the rare occasions where you really want CAPS LOCK and it's being used as the NVDA modifier key a quick double press does not seem too difficult to accomplish.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: control plus windows plus either left or right arrows

Sarah k Alawami
 

Also check to see if keys are stuck. Hit ctrl left and right, shft, left and right, alt  left then right, windows, capslock, then tab, in that order to make sure nothing is software stuck.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of John Isige
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 7:49 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] control plus windows plus either left or right arrows

 

Windows 11 might use them for something, but it doesn't move by word. I get silence but I was also out of the Thunderbird message window, or at least, NVDA didn't think it was in focus. I'd guess either an addon, or not all of the keys are being held down. It's really easy to do with triple keys like that. I tend to try to use one finger between them, e.g. alt-win, and hit them both at the same time, and sometimes, you just don't have a good enough hold on them.

 

On 11/15/2021 9:43 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:

Mike,

What NVDA Add-Ons are you using?  I just did a quick review of the Input Gestures dialog, and the NVDA Quick Commands, and neither indicates that CTRL + WinKey + arrow keys is assigned to anything by NVDA (unless I missed it, and that's possible).  This leads me to believe that this is likely a conflict caused by some add-on.

There are a finite number of keyboard shortcuts available, and triple-key-press ones are seldom used, even by Windows.  I suspect an add-on has snagged this and that's why you need to use pass-through (NVDA + F2) to get it to have its other default function in the application you're using.

It would help to know what application that is, and what the intended function of the WinKey + Alt + Left or Right Arrow key is in that application, too.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

Gene
 

There are objective facts and opinions.  You are stating a fact.  You do this.  You have presented no evidence to support a generalization that a lot of people do what you do nor that they find pressing caps lock twice to be something they consider a problem or an inconvenience worth asking to be changed.  Nor have you presented arguments why these things might be the case.
 
I have no evidence either, in terms of that I haven’t taken a survey of a representative sample of NVDA members.  But it is just common sense, considering the purpose of the caps lock key that most people don’t use it much. 
 
Also, in all the years I’ve been on this list, I have never heard this complained of before.  Therefore, it is a good inductive conclusion that few people are bothered by the current way this is set up.
 
Gene
-----Origina Message-----

From: Steve Nutt
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 9:33 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key
 

But what makes anyone say it isn’t? Everyone’s experience is different.

 

I know loads of people who use the caps lock, both blind and not.

 

All the best


steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 15 November 2021 15:17
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

You are one person.  If you took three showers a day, that doesn’t mean it is common. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Steve Nutt

Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 2:37 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

I disagree with your assertion that caps lock is not commonly used. I use it a lot.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: 12 November 2021 16:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 08:19 AM, Gene wrote:

It would be an execution nightmare.  First, how does Windows know what your intent is?

-
It wouldn't be Windows determining the intent, but NVDA.

Ignoring sticky keys, which is a separate function of its own, when the CAPS LOCK key is used as a modifier key I cannot think of a time when that would not involve what would easily be "timeable" as a long-press or require CAPS LOCK along with another key (as it is the modifier).  A very quick single press of CAPS LOCK meant to be used as CAPS LOCK is something NVDA could likely detect and pass through because it would be a very quick strike.

Personally, I don't think this is really necessary as CAPS LOCK is not, generally speaking, a commonly used key, unlike shift.  On the rare occasions where you really want CAPS LOCK and it's being used as the NVDA modifier key a quick double press does not seem too difficult to accomplish.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

Sarah k Alawami
 

I also use it a lot to tag some of my videos as there are things that need all caps, and I’m  too lazy to hold down shift while typing KLAS to KMIA, or maybe I want to shout at someone on discord, Ok, maybe not. Lol!

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 12:38 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

I disagree with your assertion that caps lock is not commonly used. I use it a lot.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: 12 November 2021 16:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 08:19 AM, Gene wrote:

It would be an execution nightmare.  First, how does Windows know what your intent is?

-
It wouldn't be Windows determining the intent, but NVDA.

Ignoring sticky keys, which is a separate function of its own, when the CAPS LOCK key is used as a modifier key I cannot think of a time when that would not involve what would easily be "timeable" as a long-press or require CAPS LOCK along with another key (as it is the modifier).  A very quick single press of CAPS LOCK meant to be used as CAPS LOCK is something NVDA could likely detect and pass through because it would be a very quick strike.

Personally, I don't think this is really necessary as CAPS LOCK is not, generally speaking, a commonly used key, unlike shift.  On the rare occasions where you really want CAPS LOCK and it's being used as the NVDA modifier key a quick double press does not seem too difficult to accomplish.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: control plus windows plus either left or right arrows

Gene
 

Control windows left and right arrow does nothing in a document.  It is control left and right arrow that moves by word. 
 
It appears to me, that in general,     input help announces the function of a command when it is an NVDA specific command such as NVDA key t and doesn’t announce the purpose otherwise.  I found exceptions, being clipboard commands such as control c.  Down arrow is just announced as down arrow because it is nott an NVDA specific command. 
 
Others with more technical knowledge may wish to discuss if the behavior may be changed and how much work would be involved.  Another question is whether the work involved would justify the benefit. 
 
With the exception of clipboard commands, it appears that only NVDA specific commands can be changed in the gestures settings.  There are ways to change other commands but they are not done by NVDA.
 
The commands you are asking about are Windows commands and would need to be changed differently. 
 
When working in input gesture settings, you can filter by what something does such as current line, but you can’t search for a command such as NVDA t.
 
You don’t have to arrow through all the commands.  The gestures are organized in a tree view.  As you down arrow, you will hear dcategories.  When you get to a category you want to look at, right arrow on the name of the category to open it.  When finnished, when in the category or on the name, left arrow until it is closed or just go on looking down the rest of the categories and leave that one opened if you wish.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 9:16 AM
Subject: [nvda] control plus windows plus either left or right arrows
 

Hi guys:

 

I have a question regarding the use of control+windows+left and right arrows;

It looks like when using these keystrokes,

Nvda moves by word or something;

 

I also use these keys to switch between desktops;

When I go into nvda+1 help mode and hit those keys,

It says the keys but not their nvda function;

 

Is there a way in nvda’s gestures listing of keys for me to see what nvda is doing with those keys, and perhaps either change the keystrokes or turn them off altogether without having to arrow through all the gestures?

 

Currently, I have to hit nvda+f2 to bypass the next key each time I hit control+windows+left or right arrows?

 

Please advise as you like.

 

Mike M.

 

Mike mcglashon

Email: Michael.mcglashon@...

Ph: 618 783 9331

 


Re: control plus windows plus either left or right arrows

John Isige
 

Windows 11 might use them for something, but it doesn't move by word. I get silence but I was also out of the Thunderbird message window, or at least, NVDA didn't think it was in focus. I'd guess either an addon, or not all of the keys are being held down. It's really easy to do with triple keys like that. I tend to try to use one finger between them, e.g. alt-win, and hit them both at the same time, and sometimes, you just don't have a good enough hold on them.


On 11/15/2021 9:43 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Mike,

What NVDA Add-Ons are you using?  I just did a quick review of the Input Gestures dialog, and the NVDA Quick Commands, and neither indicates that CTRL + WinKey + arrow keys is assigned to anything by NVDA (unless I missed it, and that's possible).  This leads me to believe that this is likely a conflict caused by some add-on.

There are a finite number of keyboard shortcuts available, and triple-key-press ones are seldom used, even by Windows.  I suspect an add-on has snagged this and that's why you need to use pass-through (NVDA + F2) to get it to have its other default function in the application you're using.

It would help to know what application that is, and what the intended function of the WinKey + Alt + Left or Right Arrow key is in that application, too.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: control plus windows plus either left or right arrows

 

Mike,

Sorry that I somehow confabulated CTRL with WinKey in my prior response.  But the overarching principle still applies.

But now, in rechecking the NVDA Quick Commands Reference (NVDA + N, H, Q), the following section applies:

When within a table, the following key commands are also available:

Name Key Description
Move to previous column control+alt+leftArrow Moves the system caret to the previous column (staying in the same row)
Move to next column control+alt+rightArrow Moves the system caret to the next column (staying in the same row)
Move to previous row control+alt+upArrow Moves the system caret to the previous row (staying in the same column)
Move to next row control+alt+downArrow Moves the system caret to the next row (staying in the same column)

But these should active if and only if you are currently within a table, at least if the commands quick reference is accurate, and I'd have to believe it is.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: control plus windows plus either left or right arrows

 

Mike,

What NVDA Add-Ons are you using?  I just did a quick review of the Input Gestures dialog, and the NVDA Quick Commands, and neither indicates that CTRL + WinKey + arrow keys is assigned to anything by NVDA (unless I missed it, and that's possible).  This leads me to believe that this is likely a conflict caused by some add-on.

There are a finite number of keyboard shortcuts available, and triple-key-press ones are seldom used, even by Windows.  I suspect an add-on has snagged this and that's why you need to use pass-through (NVDA + F2) to get it to have its other default function in the application you're using.

It would help to know what application that is, and what the intended function of the WinKey + Alt + Left or Right Arrow key is in that application, too.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

Steve Nutt
 

But what makes anyone say it isn’t? Everyone’s experience is different.

 

I know loads of people who use the caps lock, both blind and not.

 

All the best


steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 15 November 2021 15:17
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

You are one person.  If you took three showers a day, that doesn’t mean it is common. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Steve Nutt

Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 2:37 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

I disagree with your assertion that caps lock is not commonly used. I use it a lot.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: 12 November 2021 16:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 08:19 AM, Gene wrote:

It would be an execution nightmare.  First, how does Windows know what your intent is?

-
It wouldn't be Windows determining the intent, but NVDA.

Ignoring sticky keys, which is a separate function of its own, when the CAPS LOCK key is used as a modifier key I cannot think of a time when that would not involve what would easily be "timeable" as a long-press or require CAPS LOCK along with another key (as it is the modifier).  A very quick single press of CAPS LOCK meant to be used as CAPS LOCK is something NVDA could likely detect and pass through because it would be a very quick strike.

Personally, I don't think this is really necessary as CAPS LOCK is not, generally speaking, a commonly used key, unlike shift.  On the rare occasions where you really want CAPS LOCK and it's being used as the NVDA modifier key a quick double press does not seem too difficult to accomplish.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: What Is The Proper Way To Display Icons On the System Tray In Windows 11 As Concerns NVDA

 

Believe it or not, what follows is not me trying to shut down this topic, but trying to be as helpful as I can and point you to what is likely to be a far more useful resource.

This topic is an example of where the screen reader is the least likely thing to be the root cause of the issue.  When Windows changes, and the UI change for Windows 11 is a significant change, access issues with Windows elements you used to have easy access to is likely to lie with Windows itself.  Sometimes the screen reader developers were made aware of potential sticking points well in advance of a given Windows release, and sometimes they weren't.  At times, this means they will be playing catch up along with the rest of us.

For any issues related to Windows functions, and heaven knows the quick launch bar, task bar, and notification area/system tray all are in that category, the group that always has the most active discussions about these has historically been the Windows Access for Screen Reader Users Group (formerly the Windows 10 for Screen Reader Users Group).   I would strongly suggest joining there, and joining in, when it comes to Windows 11 related sticking points as that's where the "critical mass" of Windows 11 users is most likely to be.  At the moment, even there, that's still a small minority of the overall membership.  Most are following the advice to avoid upgrading to Windows 11 until next spring, at earliest.  But some have purchased machines that came with Windows 11 and don't want to downgrade to Windows 10, and in that situation I can't say I blame them.

Windows Access for Screen Reader Users Group (Formerly: Windows 10 for Screen Reader Users Group)

Group Archive:  https://winaccess.groups.io/g/winaccess/topics

Subscribe: winaccess+subscribe@winaccess.groups.io

Post: winaccess@winaccess.groups.io

Unsubscribe: winaccess+unsubscribe@winaccess.groups.io

Group Owner: winaccess+owner@winaccess.groups.io

Help: winaccess+help@winaccess.groups.io

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Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

Gene
 

You are one person.  If you took three showers a day, that doesn’t mean it is common. 
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Nutt
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 2:37 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key
 

I disagree with your assertion that caps lock is not commonly used. I use it a lot.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: 12 November 2021 16:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 08:19 AM, Gene wrote:

It would be an execution nightmare.  First, how does Windows know what your intent is?

-
It wouldn't be Windows determining the intent, but NVDA.

Ignoring sticky keys, which is a separate function of its own, when the CAPS LOCK key is used as a modifier key I cannot think of a time when that would not involve what would easily be "timeable" as a long-press or require CAPS LOCK along with another key (as it is the modifier).  A very quick single press of CAPS LOCK meant to be used as CAPS LOCK is something NVDA could likely detect and pass through because it would be a very quick strike.

Personally, I don't think this is really necessary as CAPS LOCK is not, generally speaking, a commonly used key, unlike shift.  On the rare occasions where you really want CAPS LOCK and it's being used as the NVDA modifier key a quick double press does not seem too difficult to accomplish.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


control plus windows plus either left or right arrows

mike mcglashon
 

Hi guys:

 

I have a question regarding the use of control+windows+left and right arrows;

It looks like when using these keystrokes,

Nvda moves by word or something;

 

I also use these keys to switch between desktops;

When I go into nvda+1 help mode and hit those keys,

It says the keys but not their nvda function;

 

Is there a way in nvda’s gestures listing of keys for me to see what nvda is doing with those keys, and perhaps either change the keystrokes or turn them off altogether without having to arrow through all the gestures?

 

Currently, I have to hit nvda+f2 to bypass the next key each time I hit control+windows+left or right arrows?

 

Please advise as you like.

 

Mike M.

 

Mike mcglashon

Email: Michael.mcglashon@...

Ph: 618 783 9331

 


Re: Unable to focus on zoom

Sim Kah Yong
 

Hi, can you try pressing Control + Alternate + Shift and see if that help you to focus back on Zoom.

On 10/11/2021 1:34 pm, Ali Colak wrote:
Hello,
Since last Friday, I have been having problems with zoom, where NVDA
is unable to focus on the zoom window. whether I open the aplication
itself or open a zoom meeting from a link. I thought it might be a
problem with the Beta version of NVDA, so I downgraded, but no luck.
The next option I can think of is reinstalling zoom, but before I do
that, anyone have any ideas?

Thanks




Re: Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

Steve Nutt
 

I disagree with your assertion that caps lock is not commonly used. I use it a lot.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: 12 November 2021 16:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

On Fri, Nov 12, 2021 at 08:19 AM, Gene wrote:

It would be an execution nightmare.  First, how does Windows know what your intent is?

-
It wouldn't be Windows determining the intent, but NVDA.

Ignoring sticky keys, which is a separate function of its own, when the CAPS LOCK key is used as a modifier key I cannot think of a time when that would not involve what would easily be "timeable" as a long-press or require CAPS LOCK along with another key (as it is the modifier).  A very quick single press of CAPS LOCK meant to be used as CAPS LOCK is something NVDA could likely detect and pass through because it would be a very quick strike.

Personally, I don't think this is really necessary as CAPS LOCK is not, generally speaking, a commonly used key, unlike shift.  On the rare occasions where you really want CAPS LOCK and it's being used as the NVDA modifier key a quick double press does not seem too difficult to accomplish.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Re: Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

Steve Nutt
 

Yes, that is not difficult at all.  Narrator does it already.

 

If you press it on its own, it becomes caps lock. If you press it with another key, any other key, it becomes a modifier. Simples really.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 12 November 2021 13:19
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

It would be an execution nightmare.  First, how does Windows know what your intent is?  Would it be required that it be pressed simultaneouswly with another keey in order to function as an NVDA key?  I suspect a lot of people do not do so now some or much of the time.  And what about people with coordination problems who might find it difficult to do this?

 

Also, having a two key simultaneous press requirement violates the way modifier keys work.  The NVDA key is a modifier.  Control, shift, and alt do not require another key to be pressed simultaneously. You can press and hold the modifier and press another key wile doing so.  You can press them simultaneously but it is not required.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Steve Nutt

Sent: Friday, November 12, 2021 6:44 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

Hi Chris,

 

I think what Rowan is saying is that if you just press the caps lock key without any other key, NVDA should pass it through. I agree with this.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris via groups.io
Sent: 12 November 2021 09:16
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

And what about those of us who cannot use their right hand???

Or is your opinion tough shit to those of have only the use  of one hand

As long as you dont have to press  a key twice, sod everybody else

 

 

 

From: Rowen Cary
Sent: 12 November 2021 04:45
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Improvements to the caps lock key and the NVDA key

 

Hi All,

I think we need to improve the caps lock key, Since the function of the NVDA key is to cooperate with other keys to trigger a certain function, pressing the caps lock key once has no meaning for NVDA. Can we return it to the operating system for processing? This way we don’t need to quickly press Caps Lock twice every time we switch between upper and lower case. Some screen reader is already doing this, and the user experience is very good. I think NVDA can also do this, or even better.

Thanks!

 


Re: What Is The Proper Way To Display Icons On the System Tray In Windows 11 As Concerns NVDA

Gene
 

If you can’t get to the system tray icon in a convenient way, you may be able to get to the volume control by typing sndvol in the start menu search. 
 
Also, you can make a short cut to the volume control on the desktop and assign a shortcut key.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2021 12:50 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] What Is The Proper Way To Display Icons On the System Tray In Windows 11 As Concerns NVDA
 
Hi Group,

Thanks to all who gave information about the icons on the system tray.
The Molsem advice works--but is a bit clumsy. I do in fact even see the
volume icon but I must go all the way one direction (left arrow) and
follow by all the way (right arrow) to get it to display.  Once it
shows, I can use the context key to access the various functions.

The volume icon and a few others do not show up when using the NVDA add
on (NVDA key + F11) keystroke.


On 11/14/2021 10:00 AM, Ron Canazzi wrote:
> Hi Group,
>
> Shortly after I upgraded to Windows 11, I have had an issue when
> trying to review items on the system tray.  I don't see all of them
> that should appear. somehow (and I don't think it was immediately
> after installation of Windows 11--but maybe a day or so later) all I
> see if 5 icons and when I get to the network icon, what seems to be
> happening is that for some reason I lose focus on the system tray and
> wind up on the taskbar.
>
> I must have accidentally changed something in some manner to
> hide/conceal icons on the taskbar. So what are the proper settings
> that will display all the icons I want to see on the system tray? In
> particular, I cannot access the volume icon on  the system tray.  
> This issue occurs both with the Windows command Windows key + B and
> with the add on for NVDA which uses the JAWS similar keystroke NVDA +
> F11.
>

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Re: What Is The Proper Way To Display Icons On the System Tray In Windows 11 As Concerns NVDA

Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Group,

Thanks to all who gave information about the icons on the system tray. The Molsem advice works--but is a bit clumsy. I do in fact even see the volume icon but I must go all the way one direction (left arrow) and follow by all the way (right arrow) to get it to display.  Once it shows, I can use the context key to access the various functions.

The volume icon and a few others do not show up when using the NVDA add on (NVDA key + F11) keystroke.

On 11/14/2021 10:00 AM, Ron Canazzi wrote:
Hi Group,

Shortly after I upgraded to Windows 11, I have had an issue when trying to review items on the system tray.  I don't see all of them that should appear. somehow (and I don't think it was immediately after installation of Windows 11--but maybe a day or so later) all I see if 5 icons and when I get to the network icon, what seems to be happening is that for some reason I lose focus on the system tray and wind up on the taskbar.

I must have accidentally changed something in some manner to hide/conceal icons on the taskbar. So what are the proper settings that will display all the icons I want to see on the system tray? In particular, I cannot access the volume icon on  the system tray.   This issue occurs both with the Windows command Windows key + B and with the add on for NVDA which uses the JAWS similar keystroke NVDA + F11.
--
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grevous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
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