Date   

How to use Endnote App with NVDA

Aschalew Byness
 

Hi listers
I found Endnote application inaccessible with NVDA. Is there any addon developed for that? PS. Endnote is an app that help us insert citation into our writing with the  citation style we want.
Thanks


Re: experience sharing: Using NVDA's Gestures to Switch the Touchpad

Quentin Christensen
 

I know input help will generally tell you what you've pressed, but I'm not sure exactly what input gestures store - and I can't think of a command which ONLY accepts left or right control / alt / shift etc to test with . If you have an example, please do test it and report back!

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Thu, Mar 17, 2022 at 12:44 PM Rowen Cary <manchen_0528@...> wrote:

Hi Quentin,

I'm actually more curious if NVDA can distinguish between left and right when mapping keys, For example, I only want to use Ctrl+a letter on the right to achieve a certain function.

Thanks On Thu, Mar 17, 2022 at 08:21 AM, Quentin Christensen wrote:

As others have hinted at, NVDA allows you to map ANY keystroke. We covered the steps to do this using the input gestures dialog in In-Process a few weeks back: https://www.nvaccess.org/post/in-process-22nd-february-2022/#emulating That would be the preferred method for most users, rather than editing files directly.

As to its relevance - one main use for the feature is to allow Braille device users to map system commands to various keys on the device. But, if you need to toggle your trackpad on and off regularly, and your device doesn't provide a handy keystroke for that already - then this is also an option.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 2:55 PM Sharad Koirala shakoirala@... wrote:

thanks Rowen.

On 3/15/22, Rowen Cary wrote: > hello gene, > > I hope this method will allow me to quickly switch the touchpad on and off > without resorting to additional software or complicated steps, and maybe > other people just happen to want to do the same. > Why is it relevant to NVDA? > Because NVDA allows users to map keys, for me it solves a lot of problems, > like mapping an Application key that might not exist on my laptop keyboard. > Of course, using this rare method to be able to switch the touchpad on and > off, I think it's useful to NVDA users, so it's relevant. > > Thanks > > On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 12:17 AM, Gene wrote: > >> >> I don't understand the context of what is being discussed. Why would >> NVDA be able to turn on and off the touch pad? I see no connection >> between that setting and the functions of a screen-reader. >> >> >> Gene >> >> On 3/14/2022 11:08 AM, Luke Davis wrote: >> >> > Rowen Cary wrote: >> > >> >> If nothing else you will open NVDA's gesture profile, The first >> >> line of the file is: [globalCommands.GlobalCommands] >> > >> > No it isn't, not always. >> > >> > Please make sure, if you're trying this, that you do find that line, >> > and enter your edit below it. >> > >> >> Please try pressing ctrl+F4 to toggle the on/off state of the >> >> touchpad. >> > >> > I have tried this on my MSI laptop, which already has a shortcut for >> > this (FN+F3), and the effect is identical. The touchpad is turned off, >> > and neither the left or right hard clicks at its bottom corners have >> > any effect (to answer Brian's question). >> > Win 10, 21H2. >> > >> > Next, I tried it where it really matters: on my HP Pavilion, which has >> > a jumbo touchpad which has always been a pain while typing, and has no >> > convenient way to disable it on the fly, that I have ever found. >> > Sadly, on that machine, it has no effect. >> > Win 10, 1909 (2018 laptop, can't be upgraded past 1909). >> > >> >> Off topic, I want NVDA's input gestures to distinguish between left >> >> and right function keys. >> > >> > Which key do you mean exactly? The FN key? I was not aware that any >> > laptop had two of those. >> > Or the control key? Or something else? >> > >> > Luke >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > >

-- Dr. Sharad Koirala Lecturer Department of Community Medicine Gandaki Medical College, Pokhara, Nepal

-- Quentin Christensen Training and Support Manager

Web: www.nvaccess.org Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/ Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/ User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess Twitter: @NVAccess https://twitter.com/NVAccess



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: NVDA and word perfect

Quentin Christensen
 

Ah thanks Brian!  I must admit I only had a quick look :)


On Thu, Mar 17, 2022 at 11:37 AM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
Quentin,

FYI, the actual page for Biblos on that developer's site, http://www.digrande.it/en/Biblos.aspx, for some reason pops up in English when I land on it, but the main page does not.  There is a language selection dropdown at the bottom of the page that allows the selection of English, Spanish, Italian, and Portugese.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Constantly insisting on “my rights” with no consideration of “my responsibilities” isn’t “freedom” — it’s adolescence.
     ~ Commenter, Evangelos, in comments for
         America 2022: Where Everyone Has Rights and No One Has Responsibilities,
        New York Times, February 8, 2022

 



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: experience sharing: Using NVDA's Gestures to Switch the Touchpad

Rowen Cary
 

Hi Quentin,

I'm actually more curious if NVDA can distinguish between left and right when mapping keys, For example, I only want to use Ctrl+a letter on the right to achieve a certain function.

Thanks On Thu, Mar 17, 2022 at 08:21 AM, Quentin Christensen wrote:

As others have hinted at, NVDA allows you to map ANY keystroke. We covered the steps to do this using the input gestures dialog in In-Process a few weeks back: https://www.nvaccess.org/post/in-process-22nd-february-2022/#emulating That would be the preferred method for most users, rather than editing files directly.

As to its relevance - one main use for the feature is to allow Braille device users to map system commands to various keys on the device. But, if you need to toggle your trackpad on and off regularly, and your device doesn't provide a handy keystroke for that already - then this is also an option.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 2:55 PM Sharad Koirala shakoirala@... wrote:

thanks Rowen.

On 3/15/22, Rowen Cary wrote: > hello gene, > > I hope this method will allow me to quickly switch the touchpad on and off > without resorting to additional software or complicated steps, and maybe > other people just happen to want to do the same. > Why is it relevant to NVDA? > Because NVDA allows users to map keys, for me it solves a lot of problems, > like mapping an Application key that might not exist on my laptop keyboard. > Of course, using this rare method to be able to switch the touchpad on and > off, I think it's useful to NVDA users, so it's relevant. > > Thanks > > On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 12:17 AM, Gene wrote: > >> >> I don't understand the context of what is being discussed. Why would >> NVDA be able to turn on and off the touch pad? I see no connection >> between that setting and the functions of a screen-reader. >> >> >> Gene >> >> On 3/14/2022 11:08 AM, Luke Davis wrote: >> >> > Rowen Cary wrote: >> > >> >> If nothing else you will open NVDA's gesture profile, The first >> >> line of the file is: [globalCommands.GlobalCommands] >> > >> > No it isn't, not always. >> > >> > Please make sure, if you're trying this, that you do find that line, >> > and enter your edit below it. >> > >> >> Please try pressing ctrl+F4 to toggle the on/off state of the >> >> touchpad. >> > >> > I have tried this on my MSI laptop, which already has a shortcut for >> > this (FN+F3), and the effect is identical. The touchpad is turned off, >> > and neither the left or right hard clicks at its bottom corners have >> > any effect (to answer Brian's question). >> > Win 10, 21H2. >> > >> > Next, I tried it where it really matters: on my HP Pavilion, which has >> > a jumbo touchpad which has always been a pain while typing, and has no >> > convenient way to disable it on the fly, that I have ever found. >> > Sadly, on that machine, it has no effect. >> > Win 10, 1909 (2018 laptop, can't be upgraded past 1909). >> > >> >> Off topic, I want NVDA's input gestures to distinguish between left >> >> and right function keys. >> > >> > Which key do you mean exactly? The FN key? I was not aware that any >> > laptop had two of those. >> > Or the control key? Or something else? >> > >> > Luke >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > >

-- Dr. Sharad Koirala Lecturer Department of Community Medicine Gandaki Medical College, Pokhara, Nepal

-- Quentin Christensen Training and Support Manager

Web: www.nvaccess.org Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/ Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/ User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess Twitter: @NVAccess https://twitter.com/NVAccess


News – NV Access - NVDA 2021.3.4 Released #nvaccessnewsfeed

nvda@nvda.groups.io Integration <nvda@...>
 

NVDA 2021.3.4 Released

By Sean Budd

NV Access is pleased to announce that version 2021.3.4 of NVDA, the free screen reader for Microsoft Windows, is now available for download. This is a security update which fixes 3 security issues present in older versions of NVDA. We encourage all users to upgrade to this version.

Security fixes

Please responsibly disclose potential security issues to info@.... NVDA 2021.3.4 includes 3 security fixes. All issues require physical access to the computer.

  • When performing an administrative action that requires a secure screen, a user could open a python console with system privileges. To prevent this, the wx GUI inspection tool is now disabled in secure screens.
  • A user with administrative access could capture debug logging from secure screens. To prevent this, it is no longer possible to restart NVDA in secure mode with –debug-logging.
  • The public system profile of NVDA could be polluted with unexpected gestures or dictionary replacements. To prevent this, the Input Gesture dialog, Default Dictionary, Voice Dictionary, and Temporary Dictionary are now disabled on secure screens.

For further information, please contact NV Access via info@....

Important Note:

Please note, after updating any software, it is a good idea to restart the computer. Restart by going to the Shutdown dialog, selecting “restart” and pressing ENTER. Updating software can change files which are in use. This can lead to instability and strange behaviour which is resolved by rebooting. This is the first thing to try if you do notice anything odd after updating.

Links

Close-up photograph of NVDA logo in notification area.

Close-up photograph of NVDA logo in notification area.


NVDA 2021.3.4 released

Quentin Christensen
 

NVDA 2021.3.4 Released

NV Access is pleased to announce that version 2021.3.4 of NVDA, the free screen reader for Microsoft Windows, is now available for download. This is a security update which fixes 3 security issues present in older versions of NVDA.  All issues require physical access to the computer.  We encourage all users to upgrade to this version.

Please responsibly disclose potential security issues to info@....

More info and download links at: https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2021-3-4/

--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: NVDA and word perfect

 

Quentin,

FYI, the actual page for Biblos on that developer's site, http://www.digrande.it/en/Biblos.aspx, for some reason pops up in English when I land on it, but the main page does not.  There is a language selection dropdown at the bottom of the page that allows the selection of English, Spanish, Italian, and Portugese.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Constantly insisting on “my rights” with no consideration of “my responsibilities” isn’t “freedom” — it’s adolescence.
     ~ Commenter, Evangelos, in comments for
         America 2022: Where Everyone Has Rights and No One Has Responsibilities,
        New York Times, February 8, 2022

 


Re: NVDA and word perfect

Quentin Christensen
 

Rather than a drop box link, I went looking for the original page.  Is this it? (Italian) http://www.digrande.it/

Here's a page from Index Braille (in English) with links to the site, the download and some support resources:


On Wed, Mar 16, 2022 at 4:36 AM Richard Kuzma via groups.io <rmkuzma=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Good afternoon,
If you are looking for a word processor you might want to check out biplos.
It is a free open source program that read and writes Microsoft doc documents.
It also has some nice braille and audio creation tools too.
It has standard old school menus also.
If interested I can send you a drop box link to it.
Best of all, it is completely free.
Take care,
Rich


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Don H
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2022 1:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA and word perfect

Just got a Email offer for WordPerfect Office Standard 2021All-in-one office suite.
How well does wordperfect work with latest released version of Win 10 and NVDA?
Last time I used Word Perfect was back in the DOS days.
Thanks  Looks like it is on sale for $109. of













--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: Tracking changes with Screen Reader

Quentin Christensen
 

As well as everything Brian said, yes, track changes works with NVDA.

The Microsoft Word with NVDA module covers Track Changes in detail as well: https://www.nvaccess.org/product/microsoft-word-training-for-nvda-ebook/

Kind regards

Quentin.


On Wed, Mar 16, 2022 at 1:35 AM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
Jason,

I suggest using my tutorial, Searching a Groups.io Topics Page/Archive, and the search should be on [Word "track changes"] with the square brackets removed and the phrase "track changes" left enclosed in quotes.  This has been discussed, at length, on multiple occasions.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Constantly insisting on “my rights” with no consideration of “my responsibilities” isn’t “freedom” — it’s adolescence.
     ~ Commenter, Evangelos, in comments for
         America 2022: Where Everyone Has Rights and No One Has Responsibilities,
        New York Times, February 8, 2022

 



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: experience sharing: Using NVDA's Gestures to Switch the Touchpad

Quentin Christensen
 

As others have hinted at, NVDA allows you to map ANY keystroke.  We covered the steps to do this using the input gestures dialog in In-Process a few weeks back: https://www.nvaccess.org/post/in-process-22nd-february-2022/#emulating  That would be the preferred method for most users, rather than editing files directly.

As to its relevance - one main use for the feature is to allow Braille device users to map system commands to various keys on the device.  But, if you need to toggle your trackpad on and off regularly, and your device doesn't provide a handy keystroke for that already - then this is also an option.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 2:55 PM Sharad Koirala <shakoirala@...> wrote:
thanks Rowen.

On 3/15/22, Rowen Cary <manchen_0528@...> wrote:
> hello gene,
>
> I hope this method will allow me to quickly switch the touchpad on and off
> without resorting to additional software or complicated steps, and maybe
> other people just happen to want to do the same.
> Why is it relevant to NVDA?
> Because NVDA allows users to map keys, for me it solves a lot of problems,
> like mapping an Application key that might not exist on my laptop keyboard.
> Of course, using this rare method to be able to switch the touchpad on and
> off, I think it's useful to NVDA users, so it's relevant.
>
> Thanks
>
> On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 12:17 AM, Gene wrote:
>
>>
>> I don't understand the context of what is being discussed.  Why would
>> NVDA be able to turn on and off the touch pad?  I see no connection
>> between that setting and the functions of a screen-reader.
>>
>>
>> Gene
>>
>> On 3/14/2022 11:08 AM, Luke Davis wrote:
>>
>> > Rowen Cary wrote:
>> >
>> >>     If nothing else you will open NVDA's gesture profile, The first
>> >> line of the file is: [globalCommands.GlobalCommands]
>> >
>> > No it isn't, not always.
>> >
>> > Please make sure, if you're trying this, that you do find that line,
>> > and enter your edit below it.
>> >
>> >>     Please try pressing ctrl+F4 to toggle the on/off state of the
>> >> touchpad.
>> >
>> > I have tried this on my MSI laptop, which already has a shortcut for
>> > this (FN+F3), and the effect is identical. The touchpad is turned off,
>> > and neither the left or right hard clicks at its bottom corners have
>> > any effect (to answer Brian's question).
>> > Win 10, 21H2.
>> >
>> > Next, I tried it where it really matters: on my HP Pavilion, which has
>> > a jumbo touchpad which has always been a pain while typing, and has no
>> > convenient way to disable it on the fly, that I have ever found.
>> > Sadly, on that machine, it has no effect.
>> > Win 10, 1909 (2018 laptop, can't be upgraded past 1909).
>> >
>> >> Off topic, I want NVDA's input gestures to distinguish between left
>> >> and right function keys.
>> >
>> > Which key do you mean exactly? The FN key? I was not aware that any
>> > laptop had two of those.
>> > Or the control key? Or something else?
>> >
>> > Luke
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
Dr. Sharad Koirala
Lecturer
Department of Community Medicine
Gandaki Medical College, Pokhara, Nepal







--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: Clipspeak add-on for NVDA

Gene
 

While it isn't continually asked for but there are often long times between, that doesn't mean it isn't wanted and that it wouldn't be asked for a lot if more people asked for things.  I may be wrong, there may be other things that would be asked for more, and this may not be wanted as much as I think, but considering that most members never participate in lists like this but follow the list and never write anything, I think my statement is a good guess.  I suspect that for every one person who asks for it, there may be twenty, thirty, fifty, perhaps far more people who just never bother asking for it or discussing it on the list.  And people on the list are far more likely to know about the add-on and thus be less likely to ask. 
 
I don't see much requested in terms of new features in general but I see this one asked for more than anything else.  I'd be fascinated to see those switching from JAWS or who use both screen-readers asked how much they want this feature.  If a lot of  people switch from JAWS, I think a lot of them would want this feature.

Also, as Rui said, he stopped asking for it.  Others may have stopped as well. 


Gene

On 3/16/2022 5:16 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Wed, Mar 16, 2022 at 03:36 PM, Gene wrote:
Since it appears that the ability to hear copy, cut, and paste is the most requested feature in NVDA
-
Gene,

What makes you say this?  I'm not saying it's wrong, but this particular desire tends to come up occasionally and disappear for long periods of time.  I have not noticed it being requested with particular frequency or forcefulness by the community as a whole.

That being said, you are correct that if a feature request exists, or is created, for this then it is up to members of the NVDA user community to comment on it if they want it to get any traction.  I have said, over and over and over again, that the end users of NVDA have no idea how lucky they are to have a direct communication channel with the developer community for NVDA in the form of GitHub.  That is exceedingly rare, and gives the NVDA user community a voice that most user communities would give their eye teeth to have.

One cannot, and should not, use GitHub to create new bug reports or feature requests without due consideration.  But it is underused by the user community.  Even if the only thing you (the generic you) do is occasionally check if an issue exists for something of interest to you, and giving a "me too" comment that includes something of substance beyond just "me too," to them it ensures they don't slowly sink to the bottom of the priority ocean.  A "me too" alone doesn't say much, but a description of your own situation and why you want something, too, gives it weight.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Constantly insisting on “my rights” with no consideration of “my responsibilities” isn’t “freedom” — it’s adolescence.
     ~ Commenter, Evangelos, in comments for
         America 2022: Where Everyone Has Rights and No One Has Responsibilities,
        New York Times, February 8, 2022

 


Re: Clipspeak add-on for NVDA

 
Edited

On Wed, Mar 16, 2022 at 06:59 PM, Rui Fontes wrote:
Many people, as myself, have quit asking this feature because NV Access is tottally against it...
-
I am not naïve, and I understand where you're coming from, but you and others like you do need to consider that "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" may apply in situations like this.

I can't say that you have done this, but many "quit squeaking" far, far, far too early on.

For virtually any software, a large and long enough outcry from the user community has a tendency to effect change.

All of the above having been said, I also understand that, after a certain point, the desire to keep on fighting just dies out.

It's funny, but as someone who is sighted, and who has worked with screen reader users for some time, I never even think about having cut/copy/paste speak what's being cut, copied, or pasted, as that should have been a part of the selection process.  Mind you, confirmation that a cut/copy/paste command has been issued is handy, and at the moment I can't remember which screen reader(s) do this confirmation announcement by default.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Constantly insisting on “my rights” with no consideration of “my responsibilities” isn’t “freedom” — it’s adolescence.
     ~ Commenter, Evangelos, in comments for
         America 2022: Where Everyone Has Rights and No One Has Responsibilities,
        New York Times, February 8, 2022

 


Re: Clipspeak add-on for NVDA

Rui Fontes
 

Many people, as myself, have quit asking this feature because NV Access is tottally against it...


And this feature is not the only one that NV Access is totally against it... One good example is the announcement of certain key  commands...


Rui Fontes


Às 22:16 de 16/03/2022, Brian Vogel escreveu:

On Wed, Mar 16, 2022 at 03:36 PM, Gene wrote:
Since it appears that the ability to hear copy, cut, and paste is the most requested feature in NVDA
-
Gene,

What makes you say this?  I'm not saying it's wrong, but this particular desire tends to come up occasionally and disappear for long periods of time.  I have not noticed it being requested with particular frequency or forcefulness by the community as a whole.

That being said, you are correct that if a feature request exists, or is created, for this then it is up to members of the NVDA user community to comment on it if they want it to get any traction.  I have said, over and over and over again, that the end users of NVDA have no idea how lucky they are to have a direct communication channel with the developer community for NVDA in the form of GitHub.  That is exceedingly rare, and gives the NVDA user community a voice that most user communities would give their eye teeth to have.

One cannot, and should not, use GitHub to create new bug reports or feature requests without due consideration.  But it is underused by the user community.  Even if the only thing you (the generic you) do is occasionally check if an issue exists for something of interest to you, and giving a "me too" comment that includes something of substance beyond just "me too," to them it ensures they don't slowly sink to the bottom of the priority ocean.  A "me too" alone doesn't say much, but a description of your own situation and why you want something, too, gives it weight.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Constantly insisting on “my rights” with no consideration of “my responsibilities” isn’t “freedom” — it’s adolescence.
     ~ Commenter, Evangelos, in comments for
         America 2022: Where Everyone Has Rights and No One Has Responsibilities,
        New York Times, February 8, 2022

 


Re: Clipspeak add-on for NVDA

 

On Wed, Mar 16, 2022 at 03:36 PM, Gene wrote:
Since it appears that the ability to hear copy, cut, and paste is the most requested feature in NVDA
-
Gene,

What makes you say this?  I'm not saying it's wrong, but this particular desire tends to come up occasionally and disappear for long periods of time.  I have not noticed it being requested with particular frequency or forcefulness by the community as a whole.

That being said, you are correct that if a feature request exists, or is created, for this then it is up to members of the NVDA user community to comment on it if they want it to get any traction.  I have said, over and over and over again, that the end users of NVDA have no idea how lucky they are to have a direct communication channel with the developer community for NVDA in the form of GitHub.  That is exceedingly rare, and gives the NVDA user community a voice that most user communities would give their eye teeth to have.

One cannot, and should not, use GitHub to create new bug reports or feature requests without due consideration.  But it is underused by the user community.  Even if the only thing you (the generic you) do is occasionally check if an issue exists for something of interest to you, and giving a "me too" comment that includes something of substance beyond just "me too," to them it ensures they don't slowly sink to the bottom of the priority ocean.  A "me too" alone doesn't say much, but a description of your own situation and why you want something, too, gives it weight.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Constantly insisting on “my rights” with no consideration of “my responsibilities” isn’t “freedom” — it’s adolescence.
     ~ Commenter, Evangelos, in comments for
         America 2022: Where Everyone Has Rights and No One Has Responsibilities,
        New York Times, February 8, 2022

 


Re: Clipspeak Interfering with Clipboard and Other Functions

 

On Wed, Mar 16, 2022 at 03:31 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:
I need to move on
-
Joseph,

I say the following with sincerity and deep appreciation for what you have done for the NVDA community:  Indeed you do!

You have a life outside of the NVDA Community to live, you have given more to the community, unpaid, than anyone else I know.  You've done your time, and you have done everything in your power to make your exit and orderly one, starting months ago.

So, go forth and prosper!  Let go.  It's OK, and that's whether anyone else, including myself, thinks so. You don't need to sacrifice your own life as well as future happiness and success on the altar of NVDA.  You've done plenty!
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Constantly insisting on “my rights” with no consideration of “my responsibilities” isn’t “freedom” — it’s adolescence.
     ~ Commenter, Evangelos, in comments for
         America 2022: Where Everyone Has Rights and No One Has Responsibilities,
        New York Times, February 8, 2022

 


Re: Clipspeak add-on for NVDA

Gene
 

Since it appears that the ability to hear copy, cut, and paste is the most requested feature in NVDA, this is even more reason why the ability should be integrated into the program itself. 


I hope developers no longer believe what they maintained for years, that the feature can't be made to work reliably and thus should not be in the program.  It can and it has been implemented accurately in JAWS for decades and in System Access for however long it has been around.  And the add-on, even without revision is, in my experience, about 97 or 98 percent accurate.


But it is unlikely that anything will be done about this if almost no one expresses interest in the proper channel. 


Here is a closed very old issue which dates back to 2008. 

https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/75

I don't know if commenting on a very old closed issue attracts much attention.  Others may know.  I've seen it stated that commenting on a closed issue may result in it being opened again. 


What is the best way to proceed? 


Perhaps a certain ticket will be presented to the list as a good one for future comment.  But if people don't do it, then I may pretty much give up.


Gene

On 3/16/2022 2:11 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi everyone,

I will provide a detailed summary in a more appropriate thread, but I've got bad news: ClipSpeak is NOT compatible with upcoming NVDA 2022.1 changes, so manifest edits will not work in the future (sorry).

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: Clipspeak Interfering with Clipboard and Other Functions

 
Edited

Hello all,

I have revisited the ClipSpeak add-on source code and found that:

Short answer regarding compatibility with upcoming NVDA 2022.1 changes: incompatible.

Explanation: this is one of those instances where simply editing the add-on manifest won't work when NVDA 2022.1 is released, something I've been warning the community about for weeks (as late as a few days ago). The add-on uses code that's removed in upcoming NVDA release, along with employing practices that can raise eyebrows (it did raise mine). In order for any future version of ClipSpeak to work with upcoming vast changes, it must be edited at the source code level. And I can tell you that I'm not really in a position to do so unless as a last resort (I can imagine a scenario where since I "rescued" some add-ons before such as Golden Cursor, folks may ask me to intervene, but I'm at a crossroad in graduate school education where I need to spend more time fulfilling my duty to the school).

I understand that what I said can be a shock to you; I imagine that people who are new to NVDA community may believe that the latest add-ons are ready for future NVDA releases, only to discover that a seasoned screen reader contributor is saying otherwise. I also understand that talking about a crossroad in life, especially coming from someone who was seen as ready to assist the community day and night, might be a bit odd. But I do know that sometimes a shocking revelation is what eventually wakes up a community (it doesn't always work though); after all, I am a human, and as most humans do, I need to move on (I realized this and made up my mind last weekend after spending days auditing and resolving security issues with my add-ons; the realization that I spent too much time in the add-ons community to the detriment of my immediate duty of a scholar in training, hence my statement that I can't intervene unless as a last resort).

If there is one take away from my analysis, it is that sometimes you must open the box to fix things; there is a difference between appearance of compatibility and actuality of compatibility (please remember this, my friends).

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: Clipspeak add-on for NVDA

 

Hi everyone,

I will provide a detailed summary in a more appropriate thread, but I've got bad news: ClipSpeak is NOT compatible with upcoming NVDA 2022.1 changes, so manifest edits will not work in the future (sorry).

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: Clipspeak Interfering with Clipboard and Other Functions

Gene
 

I don't know how it was updated.  It may have just been that the manifest was changed.  It may be the same as the version on the NVDA official Add-ons page except for that change.  I don't know if there is any language specification in the program.  It may speak in English regardless of what language your screen-reader is set to but the language being used may have nothing to do with how the add-on works. 

If you want to read a description of the add-on before it was updated, you can do so here:

https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/clipspeak.en.html


The add-on information discusses the language being used by the computer but only in terms of compatibility of short cut keys.  As you will see, how the add-on determines if something is done has nothing to do with language.


Gene

On 3/16/2022 12:57 PM, Dave Grossoehme wrote:

Hi Jean:  How resent has this other application been updated?  Again, is this an add on to NVDA?  If so, what version of the language is it written in?  That  might help know whether it is going to be compatible with the current version, and upcoming versions of NVDA.

Dave


On 3/16/2022 1:44 PM, Gene wrote:

If that happens, as I believe I discussed here recently, there is another add-on that has a lot more features that performs this function.  However, before people install it, they should carefully read the discussion of the features on the add-on the add-on's web site.  Some changes, perhaps many, are performed automatically when the add-on becomes active and I don't know if they are reverted if the add-on is disabled or uninstalled.


Others may know.  If they are reverted, the care I am recommending may not matter nearly so much since the changes would be very easily undone, but since I don't know, I think people should be aware of what may be changed.


Gene

On 3/16/2022 12:32 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Wed, Mar 16, 2022 at 01:10 PM, Gene wrote:
Since I've only seen two complaints, I don't have any reason to believe there is a compatibility problem.  Nothing works correctly on all systems. Perhaps it is prone to not work properly on a small number more systems than the previous version, but until I see more complaints, I will remain skeptical that there is a general compatibility problem.
-
And I have to say that I agree with you here, and not just in the context of this add-on.

People really need to understand, and accept, that because they're having an issue when many others aren't it's far more likely to be a problem that lies with their own computing ecosystem, and is idiosyncratic to it, rather than being a global issue.

This particular tweaked version has been "making the rounds" for quite a while now, and there has been no substantial number of reports, as a proportion of those who've used it, that there is a functional compatibility issue.  There have been a few, but a few among many doesn't mean "incompatible" in any meaningful sense of that word.

However, Luke is right that probably sooner, rather than later, there is going to be a "permanent breakage" in compatibility without someone taking this add-on over since the original developer formally stated that they are through with it many months ago.  If no one does step up to that proverbial plate, then the add-on should effectively be considered dead when the "permanent breakage" occurs.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Constantly insisting on “my rights” with no consideration of “my responsibilities” isn’t “freedom” — it’s adolescence.
     ~ Commenter, Evangelos, in comments for
         America 2022: Where Everyone Has Rights and No One Has Responsibilities,
        New York Times, February 8, 2022

 


Re: Clipspeak Interfering with Clipboard and Other Functions

 

On Wed, Mar 16, 2022 at 02:01 PM, Dave Grossoehme wrote:
I apologize for writing the prior message before going back through the complete thread.
-
I appreciate it, but what I appreciate more is your providing an example of why reading through the entirety of a topic before responding is a very good idea.

We all have the occasional slip-up.  The fact that you recognize it as such is fantastic!
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Constantly insisting on “my rights” with no consideration of “my responsibilities” isn’t “freedom” — it’s adolescence.
     ~ Commenter, Evangelos, in comments for
         America 2022: Where Everyone Has Rights and No One Has Responsibilities,
        New York Times, February 8, 2022

 

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