Date   

Re: NVDA beta

Don H
 

It just seems that more and more of the most recent NVDA updates break
such things as addon's

On 4/5/2022 5:14 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 05:59 PM, Don H wrote:

Is this going to be true when the next released version of NVDA is
available?

-
Who knows?  The only person or people who do are the developers of the
Code Factory add-on, and that's where you should be asking if you want a
definitive answer.

Not that I don't think that this is a legitimate question, because it
is, but it is not NVAccess or any of the membership here that can answer
it.  The structure, and it's been the structure for years, is that NVDA
Add-Ons are completely separate entities from NVDA itself and whether or
not they get updated is up to the developers of those add-ons.

Anything related to an add-on and that includes bug reports, questions
about upcoming updates (or the lack thereof), etc., must be directed to
the developers of those add-ons via the mechanisms they require for
communication (often, but not always, GitHub).
--

Brian -Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

Scratch most feminists and underneath there is a woman who longs to be a
sex object. The difference is that is not */all/* she wants to be.

~ Betty Rollin


Re: NVDA beta

 

On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 05:59 PM, Don H wrote:
Is this going to be true when the next released version of NVDA is available?
-
Who knows?  The only person or people who do are the developers of the Code Factory add-on, and that's where you should be asking if you want a definitive answer.

Not that I don't think that this is a legitimate question, because it is, but it is not NVAccess or any of the membership here that can answer it.  The structure, and it's been the structure for years, is that NVDA Add-Ons are completely separate entities from NVDA itself and whether or not they get updated is up to the developers of those add-ons.

Anything related to an add-on and that includes bug reports, questions about upcoming updates (or the lack thereof), etc., must be directed to the developers of those add-ons via the mechanisms they require for communication (often, but not always, GitHub).
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Scratch most feminists and underneath there is a woman who longs to be a sex object. The difference is that is not all she wants to be.

    ~ Betty Rollin


Re: NVDA beta

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

Please tell me you're kidding! If so, there went my days of using NVDA, as though a lot say ESpeak is very clear, I have a profound hearing loss, and I do mean, profound. Like, 75 percent loss in one ear, and 80 in the other. Even with my hearing aids, I cannot understand ESpeak. Even Vocalizer is somewhat difficult. That's the main reason I bought the CF version of Eloquence. Obviously, I want to be legit! That's about the only synth I'm able to understand. I know a lot hate it worth a purple and pink passion, but it's what since the very very very early 2000's I've grown used to, so now, unfortunately, it's about all I can understand.


Please devs, don't do this, if so! You'll definitely lose a user if you do, and I'd hate that.


Chris.

On 4/5/2022 5:59 PM, Don H wrote:
So it appears that the latest beta of NVDA will not work with the code factory vocalizer/eleoquinse addon.  Is this going to be true when the next released version of NVDA is available?




NVDA beta

Don H
 

So it appears that the latest beta of NVDA will not work with the code factory vocalizer/eleoquinse addon. Is this going to be true when the next released version of NVDA is available?


Re: NVDA Remote

 

Not unless you set up your own NVDA Remote Server (which can be done, but I can't give step-by-step details) within your own LAN space.

There is always an NVDA Remote Server acting as go-between, but where it happens to be located doesn't matter.  So if the server is on equipment in your own LAN, and you connect to that server, then, yes.  Otherwise, no.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Scratch most feminists and underneath there is a woman who longs to be a sex object. The difference is that is not all she wants to be.

    ~ Betty Rollin


Re: Vocalizer

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

Rui,


Thank you, my friend. That's very helpful!


Chris.

On 4/5/2022 1:09 PM, Rui Fontes wrote:
Hello!


From Tiflotecnia:

https://vocalizer-nvda.com


From CodeFactory:

https://codefactoryglobal.com/app-store/voices-for-nvda/


Best regards,

Rui Fontes
Tiflotecnia, Lda.



Às 18:01 de 05/04/2022, Christopher-Mark Gilland escreveu:
Where can I go to find out more about the Vocalizer voices addon? You know... things like the price, where to actually buy it, if I choose to do so, etc.


Chris.








NVDA Remote

K0LNY
 

Hi All,
I am wondering if there is a way to remote two computers both running NVDA,
together in the same local network, without going through nvdaremote?
In other words, keep the connection within my LAN?
Thanks


Re: Vocalizer

 

Yes, they have both both tiflo and code factory.

They also have the sapi for eloquence and vocaliser respectively and their support is good.

On 6/04/2022 5:07 am, Don H wrote:
atguys.com has the vocalizer addon

On 4/5/2022 12:01 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:
Where can I go to find out more about the Vocalizer voices addon? You
know... things like the price, where to actually buy it, if I choose to
do so, etc.


Chris.








Re: Vocalizer

Rui Fontes
 

Hello!


From Tiflotecnia:

https://vocalizer-nvda.com


From CodeFactory:

https://codefactoryglobal.com/app-store/voices-for-nvda/


Best regards,

Rui Fontes
Tiflotecnia, Lda.



Às 18:01 de 05/04/2022, Christopher-Mark Gilland escreveu:

Where can I go to find out more about the Vocalizer voices addon? You know... things like the price, where to actually buy it, if I choose to do so, etc.


Chris.





Re: Vocalizer

Don H
 

atguys.com has the vocalizer addon

On 4/5/2022 12:01 PM, Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:
Where can I go to find out more about the Vocalizer voices addon? You
know... things like the price, where to actually buy it, if I choose to
do so, etc.


Chris.





Vocalizer

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

Where can I go to find out more about the Vocalizer voices addon? You know... things like the price, where to actually buy it, if I choose to do so, etc.


Chris.


Re: Sharing screen with Zoom or Microsoft Teams and NVDA

Sarah k Alawami
 

Try being in focus mode when changing slides. That would be my suggestion. As focus mode, nvda does not intercept space or page down etc. Are you presenting these via PowerPoint or via a web browser. I have never, hope to never, do a slide via a web browser, that would be  a bit messey IMHO.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sylvie Duchateau
Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2022 1:51 AM
To: Nvda List <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: [nvda] Sharing screen with Zoom or Microsoft Teams and NVDA

 

Hello all,

I regularly have to share my screen in Zoom or Microsoft Teams to present slide content in HTML.

I used Firefox but I encountered problems, described below, and I then tried to use Chrome, but the problems occur as well.

For both browsers, I have the updated versions and I use NVDA 2021.3.5.

I encounter some problems with screen sharing with NVDA in Zoom, sometimes as well in Microsoft Teams.

When screen sharing is on, some browser commands do not work anymore. For example, pressing the space bar to show the next slide or typing an URL in the address bar. The browser does not respond, or I can read things with the braille display that are updated but people I am talking to see older parts of the slides.

Sometimes, only pressing Windows and M to access the desktop does not work anymore.

When screen sharing is disabled again or when NVDA is not in use (for my colleagues, for example), the problem of screen sharing and the lack of responsiveness in the browser does not occur.

Has anybody encountered issues with screen sharing with Zoom, Microsoft Teams and NVDA?

Thank you for any experience you may have.

Best

Sylvie


Sharing screen with Zoom or Microsoft Teams and NVDA

Sylvie Duchateau
 

Hello all,

I regularly have to share my screen in Zoom or Microsoft Teams to present slide content in HTML.

I used Firefox but I encountered problems, described below, and I then tried to use Chrome, but the problems occur as well.

For both browsers, I have the updated versions and I use NVDA 2021.3.5.

I encounter some problems with screen sharing with NVDA in Zoom, sometimes as well in Microsoft Teams.

When screen sharing is on, some browser commands do not work anymore. For example, pressing the space bar to show the next slide or typing an URL in the address bar. The browser does not respond, or I can read things with the braille display that are updated but people I am talking to see older parts of the slides.

Sometimes, only pressing Windows and M to access the desktop does not work anymore.

When screen sharing is disabled again or when NVDA is not in use (for my colleagues, for example), the problem of screen sharing and the lack of responsiveness in the browser does not occur.

Has anybody encountered issues with screen sharing with Zoom, Microsoft Teams and NVDA?

Thank you for any experience you may have.

Best

Sylvie


Announcement: Numpad Nav Mode add-on is compatible with NVDA 2022.1

Luke Davis
 

Hello all

Just a quick note to say that as of version 1.5, which is now available from Add-on Updater and the community site, the Numpad Nav Mode add-on is compatible with NVDA 2022.1.

I know this add-on has gained some users, from the emails I have gotten, but for those who don't know:

Numpad Nav Mode is an add-on which allows the numpad to be switched from its NVDA object navigation functions, to its normal Windows cursor movement functions. This can be done whether you use desktop or laptop keyboard mode.

In particular, I have been told that I should mention that this enables the Jaws-style Numpad Insert Numpad 2 functionality for read to end.

Further small improvements should be coming later this year, and if you desire any feature that it is reasonable to add, I will attempt to do so.

Add-on available at: https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/numpadNavMode.en.html

Luke


Re: Braille, NVDA, and Excel

 

See message , in the Microsoft Office Accessibility Discussion Group topic, 

Auto fitting text in Excel cells

This question has made the rounds many, many times, and almost certainly will again.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Scratch most feminists and underneath there is a woman who longs to be a sex object. The difference is that is not all she wants to be.

    ~ Betty Rollin


Re: Braille, NVDA, and Excel

Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...>
 

I am not going to be using Excel to the extreme that I feel I'd need the corse right now, absolutely no offense at all meant by that.


I'm not going to be working with numbers or anything or functions/formulas etc, but more-or-less will just be using it kind of as a way to make a table.


Why my boss doesn't just do a table inside of Word, I don't know, but this is how he wants it, so... yeah...


When I spoke of the bounderies, I meant the ladder. Basically, if something were cropped overflowing.


My mom who used to work with Excel all the time, as she was an accountant and later a property manager, told me there are ways to make Excel automatically stretch the cells no matter how wide they need to be so it never overflows, and crops things off. She didn't know how to tell me to do it though from a screen reader perspective.


Can you give me those steps? This way, we'd never have to really worry about it?


Chris.

On 4/4/2022 10:19 PM, Quentin Christensen wrote:

Hi Christopher,

Firstly congratulations on the new job, I wish you every success with it!

Yes, NVDA works well with Excel 365.  With your braille display, NVDA should show the cell contents, followed by the cell coordinates.  So it will read "Title A1", "Number A2" for instance.

With the cell boundaries you mentioned, did you mean the coordinates (as above) or how the cells fit together?  If you have text in a cell which is wider than the current cell, NVDA will report "cropped" if there is text in the cell to the right (and thus the text is cut off visually), or "overflowing" if there is no text in the cell to the right and so the text from this cell visually flows across into that cell.  This is both read aloud and also displayed after the contents and before the coordinates on the display, eg "Here is too much text for this cell.  Cropped C7"

If you want to brush up your skills on Excel with NVDA, there is the Microsoft Excel with NVDA training material from: https://www.nvaccess.org/product/microsoft-excel-training-for-nvda-ebook/

Otherwise, if you do get stuck with anything in particular, do shout out.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 5:32 AM Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...> wrote:
Guys,


I just got a new job which I am now doing volunteer, which is awesome,
as I've been out of work for quite some time. But anyway, I digress.


I'm curious to know how well NVDA works in combination with the version
of Excel which comes with an Office 365 anual subscription.
Particularly, I'm interested in how it works with Braille.


For instance, how does NVDA handle showing you on a display the
bounderies of each cell, and telling you the coordinates. I know it will
speak them, but I'm not sure with a display how that works.


Basically, what I'll be doing is, I'll be putting song titles in one
column, then in another column over to the right of that, I'll be
putting the page/number of the song as it locationally appears in our
church hymnal.


then, finally, I'll want to then alphabetically sort the left most
column with the titles, so that each title is in alphabetical order for
easier reference.


I assume with a braille display, this will be easy enough to do, then to
go back and tacticly review on the display?


Chris.








--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: Braille, NVDA, and Excel

Quentin Christensen
 

Hi Christopher,

Firstly congratulations on the new job, I wish you every success with it!

Yes, NVDA works well with Excel 365.  With your braille display, NVDA should show the cell contents, followed by the cell coordinates.  So it will read "Title A1", "Number A2" for instance.

With the cell boundaries you mentioned, did you mean the coordinates (as above) or how the cells fit together?  If you have text in a cell which is wider than the current cell, NVDA will report "cropped" if there is text in the cell to the right (and thus the text is cut off visually), or "overflowing" if there is no text in the cell to the right and so the text from this cell visually flows across into that cell.  This is both read aloud and also displayed after the contents and before the coordinates on the display, eg "Here is too much text for this cell.  Cropped C7"

If you want to brush up your skills on Excel with NVDA, there is the Microsoft Excel with NVDA training material from: https://www.nvaccess.org/product/microsoft-excel-training-for-nvda-ebook/

Otherwise, if you do get stuck with anything in particular, do shout out.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 5:32 AM Christopher-Mark Gilland <clgilland07@...> wrote:
Guys,


I just got a new job which I am now doing volunteer, which is awesome,
as I've been out of work for quite some time. But anyway, I digress.


I'm curious to know how well NVDA works in combination with the version
of Excel which comes with an Office 365 anual subscription.
Particularly, I'm interested in how it works with Braille.


For instance, how does NVDA handle showing you on a display the
bounderies of each cell, and telling you the coordinates. I know it will
speak them, but I'm not sure with a display how that works.


Basically, what I'll be doing is, I'll be putting song titles in one
column, then in another column over to the right of that, I'll be
putting the page/number of the song as it locationally appears in our
church hymnal.


then, finally, I'll want to then alphabetically sort the left most
column with the titles, so that each title is in alphabetical order for
easier reference.


I assume with a braille display, this will be easy enough to do, then to
go back and tacticly review on the display?


Chris.








--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: What are people doing about Notepad++ version 8.3.x crashing with NVDA

Quentin Christensen
 

It might be NPPCrypt which is conflicting perhaps?

Using NVDA 2022.1 Beta 3 and Notepad++ 8.3.3 seems to work fine for me without any add-ons in either program.  Do you mean the interface for add-ons in NVDA is difficult, or Notepad++?  I must admit I haven't really looked at the add-on interface in Notepad++, but just to make sure you know in NVDA, if you want to disable add-ons to see if that helps a problem, you can press NVDA+q, then down arrow to "Restart with add-ons disabled" and press enter, to restart NVDA without add-ons.  The following time you start NVDA, it will prompt to re-enable add-ons.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 2:18 AM George Kerscher <kerscher@...> wrote:

Hi,

 

I am running now the 2022.1 beta 2 in continuous, not installed. Notepadd++ continues to crash.

 

I do have NPPCrypt installed.

 

I find it to be a reail pain to install and remove plugins. The interface is difficult to use.

 

Best

George

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Sunday, April 3, 2022 10:45 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] What are people doing about Notepad++ version 8.3.x crashing with NVDA

 

I saw on a list, I don't remember which one, that if you run the beta, the problem is solved.  But I see no point in the 64bit version.  What benefit is their in having a 64 bit text editor?  64 bit programs can handle large amounts of data more quickly and there are certain programs that benefit but a lot don't.  I've read that one kind of program that benefits is a data-base program.

Gene

On 4/3/2022 11:31 PM, Ron Canazzi wrote:

Hi Group,

On another list, this question was asked. Apparently there is some sort of issue specifically with the 64 bit version of Notepad Plus plus and NVDA. Supposedly it is fixed for next full release.  However, I see no real advantage of the 64 bit over the 32 bit. I did n fact confirm the issue when for testing purposes, I did a complete uninstall of the 32 bit and installed the 64 bit version. To remedy this, I then uninstalled the 64 bit version and installed the older version 8.29 and then used what is apparently a combined version of the 8.33 installer, it detected the 32 bit version, installed a 32 bit version and the problem is solved for now.

if anyone can tell me the benefits of the 64 bit over the 32 bit version, I would be interested in the information.

On 4/3/2022 6:40 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

OH, it’s nvda? For me it’s the app itself, it freezes, then chokes, then crashes with some kind of exception. I’ll have to see if I can revert with choco.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Goldfield
Sent: Sunday, April 3, 2022 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] What are people doing about Notepad++ version 8.3.x crashing with NVDA

 

George, can you be a bit more specific in what happens and what you do to make it happen?

Which version of NVDA are you using?

What are the steps to reproduce the problem?

What exactly happens once the problem occurs? Saying that NVDA crashes isn’t necessarily as specific as you might think.

Are you using any NVDA addons?

Does the problem occur when all addons are disabled?

 

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

JAWS
                    Certified, 2022

NVDA Certified Expert

 

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive emails regarding news and events in the blindness assistive technology field.

Email: tech-vi+subscribe@groups.io

www.DavidGoldfield.org

 

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of George Kerscher
Sent: Sunday, April 3, 2022 3:55 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] What are people doing about Notepad++ version 8.3.x crashing with NVDA

 

Hi NVDA folks that use NotePad++

 

I discovered that Notepad++ 8.3.3 crashes  with NVDA. I use NPPcrypt, and had to have my son decrypt the files for me. What are people doing while this incompatibility gets fixed? I would discourage people going to version 8.3.x at this time. Can one just install 8.2.x over 8.3, or would this break plugins?

 

This also taught me a lesson about encrypting files and being careful not to depend on that software always working.

 

Best

George

Drawing of a
              guide dog in harness sitting looking up at a dangling rope
              in front of a mountain wall. Credits, Outdoor Life.

 

George Kerscher Ph.D.

-In our Information Age, access to information is a fundamental human right.

Chief Innovations Officer, DAISY Consortium

http://www.daisy.org

Senior Advisor, Global Literacy, Benetech

http://www.benetech.org

President, International Digital Publishing Forum (IDPF)

http://www.idpf.org

Member of the National Museum and Library Services  Board (IMLS)

http://www.imls.gov

Chair Steering Council Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI), at W3C

http://www.w3.org/WAI

Phone: +1 406/549-4687

Cell:+1 406/544-2466

Email: kerscher@...

 



-- 
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grevous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement  and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!

 



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


locked Re: Adding A City To The Weather Add-On

 

On Mon, Apr 4, 2022 at 06:32 PM, Joseph Machise wrote:
I like this one [Outlook Express]
-
Moderators Note:  This topic is now locked.  I gave clear instructions that this meta-discussion was to end, and it has been ignored.

I can and will absolutely enforce the rule that currently supported software is the only class that can be discussed on this group.

I don't give a damn what any given individual member may, or may not, choose to use.  But advocating for what is a known bad practice is not going to occur here.  Period. End of sentence.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Scratch most feminists and underneath there is a woman who longs to be a sex object. The difference is that is not all she wants to be.

    ~ Betty Rollin


locked Re: Adding A City To The Weather Add-On

Joseph Machise <jdmachise@...>
 


no sorry rosie I like this one

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2022 5:02 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Adding A City To The Weather Add-On

Joseph,

 

Outlook express is as old as the hills and twice as dusty. Why do you use something that's no longer supported? Get off of the outlook express train and use something like outlook or thunderbird.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Machise
Sent: Monday, April 4, 2022 1:25 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Adding A City To The Weather Add-On

 

gene I still use outlook express one of the things that windows 10 does and you can clarify some of the older programs that people used with XP we liked and in my opinion Microsoft has no business telling people to update, they should and could have improved XP and Internet explorer, you and I just and Bryan and some others on this list feel or should I say have different   opinions or beliefs, if it ain't broken don't fix it and also this windows 11 some of us don't have the money to by another computer.    

----- Original Message -----

From: Gene

Sent: Monday, April 04, 2022 4:13 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Adding A City To The Weather Add-On

 

Windows 10 is similar to Windows7.  There are new features and some things are in different places but Windows is Windows. 

When I started using Windows 10, I could do almost everything I did in Windows 7 with almost no learning.  I did learn about certain new features and some minor changes but I was able to use almost everything I knew from Windows 7.

Whenever you hear claims such as that This new version of Windows is much harder or much different than the proceeding one, be skeptical.  I've heard this over and over.  It is seldom true. 

there is all sorts of misinformation and equivalent of rumors circulated in the blind computer using community and lists like this and general  blindness technology lists are places where you can ask about what you hear that is discouraging and find out if there is anything to it. 

Gene

On 4/4/2022 2:56 PM, Joseph Machise wrote:



Brian some of us blind people have trouble with windows10 don't no weather you are blind or sited it is a lot easier for a sited person than some of us blind people to use a computer, some of us are not very techie and some people have a lot of trouble with windows10. 

----- Original Message -----

From: Brian Vogel

Sent: Monday, April 04, 2022 2:56 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Adding A City To The Weather Add-On

 

On Mon, Apr 4, 2022 at 02:32 PM, Gene wrote:

Can you use the version of the weather add-on you currently have?  If it does what you want and you don't want to upgrade NVDA, then use the current version of the add-on.  If you can no longer use it later, then worry about upgrading NVDA.

-
Gene,

Logic dictates that this issue has arisen with whatever versions of NVDA and Weather Plus that Mr. Machise already has, or the question would not have arisen in the first place.

But putting that aside, it is a very, very bad idea to suggest not updating software in general as updates become available.  This is particularly so with NVDA and its add-ons.

Avoiding updates, except in rare occasions, just keeps digging a deeper and deeper "compatibility/incompatibility" hole that is going to eventually have to be gotten out of.  There is a reason that the group rules state:  The discussion of software on the NVDA Group is limited to software currently in support.  Depending on the type of software, specific version numbers will change with time.  Users are expected to know what remains in support and what has been dropped, and announcements will be made to this group when new software is released. It should be assumed that, when a new version of software is released, primary discussion will take place on that version, not versions of software which are years old. 

That's not there because it's my personal preference (though I'll admit that it is) but because no software maker, and certainly not NVAccess or Microsoft, is going to try to maintain perpetual backward compatibility.  Computing is a stream, and one must really become accustomed to flowing with it as a matter of best practice whenever possible.  Eventually, choice completely leaves the picture.

Even though NVDA remains compatible with Windows 7 at the moment, the writing is clearly on the wall about that not continuing all that much longer.  Windows 8.1 is less than a year from sunset/end of life.  The expectation that the entire Windows ecosystem under which NVDA and its add-ons are being used will be one that is in support in order for it to be discussed here is not optional.  I continue to allow the discussion of NVDA under Windows 7 because so long as it does remain backward compatible with Windows 7 that version of NVDA remains on-topic.  But upon release of the first version of NVDA that is not compatible with Windows 7, then all things Windows 7 and earlier will be, as they have been, relegated to the Chat Subgroup or to other venues.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Scratch most feminists and underneath there is a woman who longs to be a sex object. The difference is that is not all she wants to be.

    ~ Betty Rollin

 

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