Re: list of all table commands

Brian's Mail list account

Maybe the place where this is needs to be flagged in other areas where one might look though. I certainly missed them as well.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Nikos Demetriou via groups.io" <nikosdemetriou@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2022 1:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] list of all table commands

Many thanks Joseph.
It was my mistake there are under 5.3. Navigating with the System Caret
Nikos

On Wed, 20 Jul 2022 at 15:47, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> wrote:

Hi,

Current (and new) table navigation commands are:

- Control+Alt+arrows: move between columns and rows
- Control+Alt+Home/End: move to the first or the last column on the
same row
- Control+Alt+Page up/page down: move to the first or the last row on
the selected column

Thought these were added to the user guide, but looks like it wasn't
(Quentin, any thoughts?).

Cheers,

Joseph

Re: nvda and visual studio code

Jacob Kruger

Not necessarily the same, but, if I need to know current line number, I just hit ctrl+G, and, the go to line dialogue tells me the current line number before I just hit escape to close it?

Jacob Kruger
Skype: BlindZA
"Resistance is futile...but, acceptance is versatile..."
On 2022-07-20 10:19 PM, David Galantin wrote:

Hi,

I read in the release notes of the last nvda version, we can see the line number’s in Visual studio.

Is it works in the Visual Studio Code ? I tried it but I didn’t have line number’s.

I activated the option in nvda and visual studio code.

David

Envoyé à partir de Courrier pour Windows

Re: Checking for updates is failing

On Wed, Jul 20, 2022 at 07:44 PM, Quentin Christensen wrote:
The automatic check for updates checks when starting, but only, at most, once every 24 hour period.
-
I can confirm this (even though there's no need to confirm what Quentin is saying) and have had internet service "burps" when an update was in the process of downloading, and it never checks in the background again on that day.  I generally just wait until I get the next, "Do you want to update?," prompt.  If I'm in a rush then I just download the installer directly from the NVAccess Download Page.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

~ Dorothy Nevill

Re: Checking for updates is failing

Bob Cavanaugh

I got it while on the phone about an hour into my conversation, not
when starting as expected. Then my internet decided to go down, so I
manually checked when it came back and am now running the latest NVDA.

On 7/20/22, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
The automatic check for updates checks when starting, but only, at most,
once every 24 hour period. Those following us on social media, or reading
the email lists often do see our announcement before you get the prompt to
update.

Quentin.

On Thu, Jul 21, 2022 at 7:41 AM Arlene <nedster66@...> wrote:

I just went to check for updates. There it was.

Windows

*From: *Bob Cavanaugh <cavbob1993@...>
*Sent: *July 20, 2022 11:06 AM
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject: *Re: [nvda] Checking for updates is failing

I typically wait until it prompts me for an update before doing so,

and I too haven't gotten a request for an NVDA update. If I haven't

gotten one by Friday, I may do a manual check.

On 7/20/22, John Sanfilippo <johnsanfilippo@...> wrote:

I'm now running NVDA 2022.2, but only because I read about the update
in
email.
I'm running a very recently updated Windows 11 home, on a Microsoft
Surface lapto three.
Althought Check for Updates is set in settings, it ain't happening.
John
--
- jso msl -

--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Web: www.nvaccess.org
Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda

Hi,

The criticism and rebuke are warranted - I apologize for making things messier, especially to Janet for not showing professionalism in my answer earlier.

Again my apologies for making things difficult.

Cheers,

Joseph

David Goldfield

Joseph, while I don’t apologize for what I was intending to express I do sincerely apologize if my initial response came off as less than charitable.

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

NVDA Certified Expert

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive news, events and information regarding the blindness assistive technology field.

www.DavidGoldfield.org

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Goldfield
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2022 8:11 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io

Joseph wrote:

>(some of you should know what I'm talking about; spoiler alert: take a look at recent alpha changelog)

Joseph, I have the highest respect for you because of your knowledge, your willingness to share it in abundance as well as for your many contributions to the community. I am grateful for all of these things. However, I don’t find this particular message helpful. Since the alpha builds and their changelogs are available publicly it’s frankly silly to say, “I know something big but I can’t talk about it but check the alpha builds.” This is not elementary school and we’re all adults. Please either say nothing or just state what it is that you’re talking about. There’s nothing wrong with stating that you can’t comment on it beyond what’s in the alpha builds.

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

NVDA Certified Expert

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive news, events and information regarding the blindness assistive technology field.

www.DavidGoldfield.org

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2022 6:15 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io

Hi,

All I can say at this time is that this game changing feature will be part of a future NVDA stable version (some of you should know what I'm talking about; spoiler alert: take a look at recent alpha changelog).

Cheers,

Joseph

David Goldfield

Joseph wrote:

>(some of you should know what I'm talking about; spoiler alert: take a look at recent alpha changelog)

Joseph, I have the highest respect for you because of your knowledge, your willingness to share it in abundance as well as for your many contributions to the community. I am grateful for all of these things. However, I don’t find this particular message helpful. Since the alpha builds and their changelogs are available publicly it’s frankly silly to say, “I know something big but I can’t talk about it but check the alpha builds.” This is not elementary school and we’re all adults. Please either say nothing or just state what it is that you’re talking about. There’s nothing wrong with stating that you can’t comment on it beyond what’s in the alpha builds.

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

NVDA Certified Expert

Subscribe to the Tech-VI announcement list to receive news, events and information regarding the blindness assistive technology field.

www.DavidGoldfield.org

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2022 6:15 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io

Hi,

All I can say at this time is that this game changing feature will be part of a future NVDA stable version (some of you should know what I'm talking about; spoiler alert: take a look at recent alpha changelog).

Cheers,

Joseph

Re: Checking for updates is failing

Quentin Christensen

The automatic check for updates checks when starting, but only, at most, once every 24 hour period.  Those following us on social media, or reading the email lists often do see our announcement before you get the prompt to update.

Quentin.

On Thu, Jul 21, 2022 at 7:41 AM Arlene <nedster66@...> wrote:

I just went to check for updates. There it was.

Sent from Mail for Windows

From: Bob Cavanaugh
Sent: July 20, 2022 11:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Checking for updates is failing

I typically wait until it prompts me for an update before doing so,

and I too haven't gotten a request for an NVDA update. If I haven't

gotten one by Friday, I may do a manual check.

On 7/20/22, John Sanfilippo <johnsanfilippo@...> wrote:

> I'm now running NVDA 2022.2, but only because I read about the update in

> email.

>

>

> I'm running a very recently updated Windows 11 home, on a Microsoft

> Surface lapto three.

>

>

> Althought Check for Updates is set in settings, it ain't happening.

>

>

> John

>

>

>

> --

> - jso msl -

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Re: typing the letter "I" makes NVDA glitch

Curtis Delzer

I'd switch keyboards and see if it is some kind of macro which is turned on with the afore mentioned <I> because nothing inside NVDA as such can learn a given sequence without some kinf of add-on.

On 7/10/2022 8:52 AM, Gene wrote:
I don't know what is causing the problem but I would suggest the following for now to deal with it.

It isn't reasonable for you to change how you write in this manner.

Use the installer to create a clean portable version of NVDA.  I doubt you will have the same problem using it.  Until the problem is solved, use the portable version for most things and the installed version for times when the portable copy won't work.  for example, I found by experience, that the portable version doesn't work in the task manager.  So if I am going to run the task manager, I always run the installed version before doing so if I have been using a portable version.

You said you uninstalled and reinstalled NVDA.  I don't think your installed copy is corrupted.  Your settings and I assume speech dictionary files and perhaps other things I don't know about are kept when you uninstall the program so you can install it again and not lose such information.  It appears that there is something in the retained information that is causing the problem.

Gene

On 7/10/2022 10:04 AM, sandra.gloz@... wrote:

This only started recently, but every time I write something that includes the letter I by itself, like saying, “I went to the store,” typing it and pressing space starts a glitch that lasts a long time. It then types the letter again multiple times by itself and starts deleting and typing it again quickly, and if you type something else after that, it screws up those words too and jumbles up all the letters until it eventually stops and leaves you with a screwed up sentence. (Right now  I will mostly write in second person and use the word you instead of talking in first person for obvious reasons.) The glitch of deleting and typing the same letter can last forever if you don’t start typing something else to interrupt it, which, again, it will still screw up. If you turn NVDA off, the keyboard returns to normal and you can write that letter without glitches.

I can barely type on  this  computer because of this. I’ve also tried restarting my computer and deleting NVDA and redownloading it. Does anyone else have this problem? Or any suggestions for how to fix it?

--
Curtis Delzer
H.S.
K6VFO
Rialto, CA
curtis@...

Hi,

This is quite an interesting suggestion, but I doubt it can be implemented quite easily. This is more so now as tools exist to update NVDA without relying on its own update mechanism - some people are using a tool called Winget (Windows Package Manager) to update NVDA, in which case you won't be prompted to save current version as a portable copy somewhere. Same goes with the Windows Store version of NVDA where Microsoft Store takes care of updates.

As for the game changer I'm talking about, well, looks like the cat is out of the bag, so:

Later this year NVDA will include its own delayed character description functionality provided that this feature (introduced to a recent alpha build) stays in NVDA 2022.3. This continues the recent trend of add-on ideas or features becoming part of NVDA screen reader.

Cheers,

Joseph

Gene

Perhaps the update function should present a screen explaining why this is important to do and giving users the opportunity to answer yes or no to having it done.  I don't think most users would think about this themselves.  My objection to updates of this kind is that they remove the previous version.  That is why, if I used JAWS to any extent, I'd probably install a completely new version and not use the update function, thus leaving the old version on the machine in case I want to use it.

Gene

On 7/20/2022 4:49 PM, Gene wrote:

Before updating NVDA, I would recommend creating a portable version of the current version you are using.  Then, if the updated installed version has problems, you can use the portable version and, in a case like this, continue to use the add-on without disruption.

Gene

On 7/20/2022 4:33 PM, Janet Brandly wrote:

Hi Joseph,

Please tell us more. I’d like to get this function back ASAP.

Janet

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: July 20, 2022 2:29 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io

Hi,

Cheers,

Joseph

On Wed, Jul 20, 2022 at 05:49 PM, Gene wrote:
Before updating NVDA, I would recommend creating a portable version of the current version you are using.
-
An excellent recommendation and general practice.  It would save quite a bit of heartache over time.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

~ Dorothy Nevill

Hi,

All I can say at this time is that this game changing feature will be part of a future NVDA stable version (some of you should know what I'm talking about; spoiler alert: take a look at recent alpha changelog).

Cheers,

Joseph

Gene

Before updating NVDA, I would recommend creating a portable version of the current version you are using.  Then, if the updated installed version has problems, you can use the portable version and, in a case like this, continue to use the add-on without disruption.

Gene

On 7/20/2022 4:33 PM, Janet Brandly wrote:

Hi Joseph,

Please tell us more. I’d like to get this function back ASAP.

Janet

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: July 20, 2022 2:29 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io

Hi,

Cheers,

Joseph

Re: Checking for updates is failing

Arlene

I just went to check for updates. There it was.

Sent from Mail for Windows

From: Bob Cavanaugh
Sent: July 20, 2022 11:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Checking for updates is failing

I typically wait until it prompts me for an update before doing so,

and I too haven't gotten a request for an NVDA update. If I haven't

gotten one by Friday, I may do a manual check.

On 7/20/22, John Sanfilippo <johnsanfilippo@...> wrote:

> I'm now running NVDA 2022.2, but only because I read about the update in

> email.

> I'm running a very recently updated Windows 11 home, on a Microsoft

> Surface lapto three.

> Althought Check for Updates is set in settings, it ain't happening.

> John

> --

> - jso msl -

>

On Wed, Jul 20, 2022 at 05:34 PM, Janet Brandly wrote:
I’d like to get this function back ASAP.
-
Janet,

Then for the love of heaven download the compatible add-on!  Why do you think I gave a direct link to the page on which it resides in the NVDA Add-Ons Directory?!
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

~ Dorothy Nevill

Janet Brandly

Hi Joseph,

Please tell us more. I’d like to get this function back ASAP.

Janet

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: July 20, 2022 2:29 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io

Hi,

Cheers,

Joseph

Re: Improving accessibility of Spotify for desktop

Marco Oros

Hello again. I am here after long time.

After update of Spotify, the mouse cursor isn't says sometimes anything, when I would like to move somewhere. It is very bad to me, because I can't move playlists, playlist folders or songs in playlists.

I think, that NVDA will soon need some add-on to improve those things.

Dňa 18. 5. 2021 o 12:47 Marco Oros via groups.io napísal(a):

Hi people, I am back in this thread.

After new update, Spotify's playlist view in Your library is accessed very well.

Also, I need some people, some blind users, who will register in Spotify community and vote for My accessible ideas for Spotify, or create another ideas to vote for. There are not many votes to get It to Spotify. I will be happy, if Spotify will be more accessible for the blind, like It is.

Dňa 7. 5. 2021 o 0:08 Marco Oros via groups.io napísal(a):

I know about It, but I have for example problem with playlist view.

Also, in My computer this interface is actually default.

Playlists are viewed in left, but not at 'Your library' section.

Dňa 6. 5. 2021 o 23:57 Sarah k Alawami napísal(a):

They already have a layout you can get ot that is fully accessible. I forgot how to do it but you need to edit a CFG file. My BF told me about it and I've seen him use it with no issues. I've been using spotify since 2017 in electron mode and it is grate.

--

Sarah Alawami, owner of TFFP. . For more info go to our website.

Our discord is where you will know when we go live on twitch. Feel free to give the channel a follow and see what is up there.

For stream archives, products you can buy and more visit my main lbry page and my tffp lbry page You will also be able to buy some of my products and eBooks there.
Finally, you can support my work on happs, the network of now.

On 6 May 2021, at 10:06, Marco Oros wrote:

Hello.

I don't know, where to post It. I'll try to post It here.

Maybe You know about Spotify. New interface is better accessible, than this previous. I think to Spotify for desktop. Sometimes NVDA don't read everything on Spotify, for example playlist view in 'Your library' ETC. Similar thing is with moving playlists to folders, althought with new interface Spotify's accessibility is better.

I don't know, how to programm, but please somebody make Spotify for desktop accessible with NVDA. It is very good software.

Thank You.

best regards

Marco Oros

Welcome to the NVDA Community Add-ons website - NVDA Dev & Test Toolbox

Group Integration <nvda@...>

NVDA Dev & Test Toolbox

• Author: Cyrille Bougot
• NVDA compatibility: 2019.2 and beyond

This add-on gathers various features for NVDA debugging and testing.

Features

• An enhanced restart dialog to specify some extra options when restarting NVDA.
• A toggle script and a backport of NVDA's "Play a sound for logged errors" feature.
• An object property explorer.
• An extended script description mode: when enabled input help mode report information on scripts that have no description.
• Commands to help log reading and analyzing.
• In the Python console workspace, a function to open the source code of an object.
• A command to log the stack trace of the speech.speak function.

Enhanced restart dialog

The NVDA+shift+Q command opens a dialog to specify some extra options before restarting NVDA. The options that can be specified correspond to the command line options that can be used with nvda.exe, e.g. -c for config path, --disable-addons to disable add-ons, etc.

Play a sound for logged errors

The "Play a sound for logged errors" setting has been introduced in NVDA 2021.3 and allows to specify if NVDA will play an error sound in case an error is logged.

This add-on provides an additional command (NVDA+control+alt+E) to toggle this setting. You can choose:

• "Only in test versions" (default) to make NVDA play error sounds only if the current NVDA version is a test version (alpha, beta or run from source).
• "Yes" to enable error sounds whatever your current NVDA version is.

For NVDA prior to 2021.3, this add-on provides the backport of this feature and the possibility to control it with the keyboard command. The checkbox in the Advanced settings panel is not backported however.

Object property explorer

This feature allows to report some properties of the current navigator object without opening the log viewer.

To list the properties of an object, move the navigator object to it and use the following commands:

• Selects the previous property and reports it for the navigator object.
• Selects the next property and reports it for the navigator object.
• Reports the currently selected property for the navigator object; two presses displays this information in a browseable message.

These three commands are unassigned by default; you will have to assign them in the Input gesture dialog to use them.

The list of the supported properties is the following: name, role, state, value, windowClassName, windowControlID, windowHandle, location, Python class, Python class mro.

This feature is an improvement of an example in NVDA developer guide.

Extended script description mode

When the Extended script description mode is active, the input help mode (NVDA+1) is modified as follows. If a script has no description, the script's name and class are reported. If a script has a description, its description is reported as usual. The gesture to activate or deactivate this feature is NVDA+control+alt+D.

Executing a gesture bound to a script without description in input help mode also create an entry for this script in the gesture management dialog. This entry is located in a dedicated category called "Scripts without description (modify at your own risk!)". This allow to easily add, delete or change the native NVDA gestures for these script. Be aware however that it is often intended that such script do not have any description to prevent the user to modify the associated gesture. Indeed, the gesture may be defined to match an application shortcut key. For example the script script_toggleItalic on NVDAObjects.window.winword.WordDocument is bound to control+I and this should not be modified since the gesture is passed to the application to actually execute the shortcut key.

Usage example

Control+shift+I also toggle italic in Word, even if it is not natively reported by NVDA. To have the control+shift+I result reported by NVDA as control+I, you should perform the following steps:

• Open a Word document.
• Enable the extended script description mode with NVDA+control+alt+D.
• Enter input help mode with NVDA+1.
• Press control+I to report the italic script and have it added in the gesture dialog.
• Exit input help mode with NVDA+1.
• Open the input gestures dialog.
• In the category "Scripts without description (modify at your own risk!)", select the command "toggleItalic on NVDAObjects.window.winword.WordDocument".
• Add the control+shift+I shortcut and validate.
• If you want, exit the extended script description mode with NVDA+control+alt+D.

Known bug: A script added for a specific class is visible even if gesture manager is opened in another context.

A log reader mode provides commands to ease log reading and analyzing. In the log viewer window the log reader is enabled by default, thus log reading commands are available immediately. In another text reading area such as an editor (e.g. Notepad++) or a webpage (e.g. GitHub issue), you need to press NVDA+control+alt+L to enable log reader mode and use its commands. When you are done with log reading and analyzing tasks, you can disable again NVDA+control+alt+L to disable the log reader mode.

The commands available in log reader mode are described hereafter.

Single letter command similar to browse mode quick navigation keys allow to move to various type of log messages: * m: any message * e: ERROR * i: IO * d: DEBUG * f: INFO * g: DEBUGWARNING * w: WARNING

Pressing the single letter moves to the next occurrence of this message. Combining the letter with the shift key moves to the previous occurrence of this message.

Opening a file in your editor

When looking at a traceback, you may want to open one of the source files to understand the cause and the context of the issue. Press C to open the source code file corresponding to the current line of the traceback.

For this feature to work, you need to have configured your favorite editor's command. If you are not running NVDA from source, the location of NVDA source code also should have been configured. For more details regarding the configuration, please see the paragraph NVDA Debug & Test Tools configuration.

Python console extension

In the console, you can call the following function to view the source code that defines the variable myVar:
openCodeFile(myVar)

For this feature to work, you need to have configured your favorite editor's command. If you are not running NVDA from source, the location of NVDA source code also should have been configured. For more details regarding the configuration, please see the paragraph NVDA Debug & Test Tools configuration.

The openCodeFile functions can be called on objects defined in NVDA's code or on objects defined by add-ons. It cannot be called on objects whose source code is not available such as python builtins.

Below are examples of call in NVDA's code:

• View the definition of the function speech.speech.speak:
openCodeFile(speech.speech.speak)
• View the definition of the class TextInfo:
openCodeFile(textInfos.TextInfo)
• View the definition of the method copyToClipboard of the class TextInfo:
openCodeFile(textInfos.TextInfo.copyToClipboard)
• View the class definition of the focused object:
openCodeFile(focus)
• Open the file api.py defining the module api:
openCodeFile(api)

Log the stack trace of the speech function

Sometimes, you may want to see which part of the code is responsible for speaking something. For this, you can enable the stack trace logging of the speech function pressing NVDA+control+alt+S. Each time NVDA speaks, a corresponding stack trace will be logged in the log.

Note: You may modify the script's file directly to patch another function. See all instructions in the file for details on usage.

NVDA Debug & Test Tools configuration

The log reader commands and the python console extension feature may require a specific configuration. To use functions that allow to view source code in your editor, you should first configure your editor's command line. If NVDA's file need to be viewed and if you are not running from source, you also need to configure NVDA's source code path.

Editor's command line configuration

To use the 'open source code' command or the openCodeFile console command, you need first to configure the command that will be called to open the file in your favorite editor. For this, open the NVDA console (NVDA+control+Z) and type the following line and then Enter: config.conf['ndtt']['sourceFileOpener'] = r'"C:\path\to\my\editor\editor.exe" "{path}":{line}' You should of course modify this line according to the real name and location of your editor and the syntax used by it to open files. {path} will be replaced by the full path of the file to open and {line} by the line number where you want the cursor to be set. For Notepad++ for example the command to type in the console would be: config.conf['ndtt']['sourceFileOpener'] = r'"C:\Program Files\Notepad++\notepad++.exe" "{path}" -n{line}'

NVDA source code path configuration

When a file belonging to NVDA's core is listed in the traceback, the line is of the following form: File "config\profileUpgrader.pyc", line 30, in upgrade

If you are not running NVDA from source, you may specify an alternate location where the source file will be found, e.g. the place where you have cloned NVDA source files. In this case, you have to configure the path where you have NVDA source files located.

For this, open the NVDA console (NVDA+control+Z) and type the following line and then Enter: config.conf['ndtt']['nvdaSourcePath'] = r'C:\pathExample\GIT\nvda\source' Of course, replace the path of NVDA source with the correct one.

Be sure however that the version of your source file (e.g. GIT commit) is the same as the one of the running instance of NVDA.

Change log

Version 2.1

• Various bugfixes and code refactoring/cleaning to address all use cases: all supported versions, installed vs. run from source, etc. (contribution from Łukasz Golonka)
• Rewriting of the compa module (contribution from Łukasz Golonka)
• The restart dialog can now be opened only once.
• The object explorer shortcuts are now unassigned by default and need to be mapped by the user.
• With the object explorer, a double-press to call the script to report the current object's property now displays the reported information in a browseable message.

Version 2.0

• New feature: Enhanced restart dialog to specify some extra options when restarting NVDA.
• New feature: extended description mode.
• Play error sound feature harmonized between pre and post 2021.3 versions of NVDA.
• New feature: Log reader commands are now available in the log viewer and also optionally in edit fields or webpages.
• New feature: In the Python console, an openCodeFile function is available to view the source code of an object.
• Some features are now disabled in secure mode for security reasons.
• The add-on's compatibility range has been extended (from 2019.2 to 2021.1).
• Releases are now performed with GitHub action instead of appVeyor.

Version 1.0

• Initial release.

Re: Article on Screen Reader History (including NVDA)

Gene

I don't know how many people you heard this from nor if their problems are the same as yours.  But people in general don't have problems.  If they did, we'd see a lot of complaints on lists like this.

You can probably sell your JAWS to someone, but I don't know the procedure to do so.

It would very much be worth your time to see how NVDA works on your machine.  You would save a lot of money if you use NVDA and the longer you use it, the more you would save.  I use NVDA almost exclusively.

Also, we don't know what is having problems on your machine, JAWS or the synthesizer you are using.  If the synthesizer is crashing and JAWS is still running, you may think JAWS isn't running when it is.  I'm sure there are logs that can tell a knowledgeable person what is crashing or having some sort of problem.  You may want to consult technical support, though I think that, as I said, if NVDA meets your needs, in the long run, you would be much better off selling JAWS and using NVDA.

I'm discussing the possibility that the synthesizer is crashing more as a general troubleshooting possibility to keep in mind when you have problems with any screen-reader that seems to stop.  You can't assume that the screen-reader is crashing and this should be tested by switching to another synthesizer.

Gene
On 7/20/2022 3:22 PM, Pamela Dominguez wrote:

No, I have never used NVDA.  Maybe I should try it, but I’m mad that I paid for this jaws with two SMAs and I wanna throw it out the window.  I’ve heard other people say they have problems with theirs.  The jaws cost more than my computer!  Pam.

Sent from Mail for Windows

From: Dave Grossoehme
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2022 2:34 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Article on Screen Reader History (including NVDA)

Pam have you tried NVDA?  If so, do you have the problems with NVDA as you do with Jaws?

Dave

On 7/19/2022 8:13 AM, Pamela Dominguez wrote:

Because it doesn’t work anywhere near as well as window eyes, and it keeps crapping out.  I’ll be in the middle of something, and it will shut up like somebody pulled the plug.  Part of it is because I’m used to window eyes, and the rest of it is just because it keeps malfunctioning.  Pam.

Sent from Mail for Windows

From: Gene
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2022 8:08 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Article on Screen Reader History (including NVDA)

Is that because you are used to doing some things another way such as use the WE cursor?  Most of what you do with any screen-reader is to issue program and Windows commands and certain screen-reader commands such as read to end, read title bar, and quick navigation keys on web pages.

In short, since most of what is done with a screen-reader doesn't involve screen-reader commands, why do you dislike it so much?

Gene

On 7/19/2022 7:02 AM, Pamela Dominguez wrote:

I used window eyes from about 2002 until a couple of months ago.  I still have the windows seven computer that has it on it.  I like that screenreader.  I have jaws on this windows ten box, and I hate jaws with a passion!  Pam.

Sent from Mail for Windows

From: Michael Munn
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2022 7:26 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Article on Screen Reader History (including NVDA)

I was a user of Window-eyes for several years before they sentenced that screen reader to death. Window-eyes is one the only screen reader is far I know of ever made a deal with Microsoft so this way it’s user can use Office for free. Heck, that was the screen reader my school taught me to use when I was in seventh grade because they have the latest version of Office. Right now I’m a heavy user of Jaws in Windows, and I just recently getting in to Voice Over on the Mac. I do use NVDA but I’m not a full time user of it.  It is good for an operating system to be open sourced so this way the end user with vision problem can have multiple choice to what screen reader they choose to install on their machine.

Best regards

Michael H> Munn

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Shawn via groups.io
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2022 9:57 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Article on Screen Reader History (including NVDA)

Yeah, I couldn't get that because you have to have a Brazilian bank account in a certain bank to get it. I thought it would be cool to try it. I did have DosVox though for a while and played around with it some years ago. There were some cool games, I especially liked the one where you have to try to land on the moon. But I had to use a different voice, the native voice was incomprehensible to me as it was just made up of a bunch of syllables in wav files. Sounded like an alien robot. For native speakers it wasn't a problem, but for me I hated it. Luckily you could use a Sapi voice with it. It was basically a screen reader for people who didn't want to have to learn windows. It had loads of parts like a word processor, dictionaries, a telnet type client, and a file manager and I forget what else. Lots of people say it makes its users lazy for that reason, and they don't bother learning how to do things with windows and other programs.

Shawn Klein

On 7/18/2022 6:35 PM, Rui Fontes wrote:

And everybody have forgoten a screen reader developed in Brasil, named Virtual Vision...

Rui Fontes

Às 00:28 de 19/07/2022, Gene escreveu:

the article is interesting and it has good information about JAWS and NVDA.  But it has problems.  It should have said something about Window-eyes because a lot of people used it and it was a good screen-reader.  It helped in development of screen-reader innovations in ways that should have been noted.

But a serious problem in the article is that it gives the reader the impression that there shouldn't need to be independently developed screen-readers if developers of software built accessibility into them.  This is erroneous for two reasons.

First, yes, accessibility should be built into programs and operating systems but we have been better served by screen-readers being developed outside of operating system programmers.  We are much better off having choices when it  comes  to Windows screen-readers.  It is a constantly stated truism that some screen-readers work better with some programs than others.  If Microsoft had developed a good screen-reader from the outset, we would probably only have one screen-reader and even if we would benefit from having more, we wouldn't.

The article doesn't discuss this at all and the author is evidently completely unaware of the arguments about which is better, one screen-reader developed by the developers of an operating system or what exists regarding Windows.

I think we are much better off as things are.

Gene

On 7/14/2022 10:06 PM, Laurie Mehta via groups.io wrote:

Hi,

I came across this today and am sharing it here because I think that many here will find it interesting. (Link below my name…)

-Laurie

The hidden history of screen readers

 3781 - 3800 of 101114