Date   

Accessible software for managing SQLite3 databases

Андрей Якубой
 

Hello everybody!


I learn data science and now I have to work a lot with SQLite3 databases. I'm looking for software that will allow me to learn, create and edit such databases using table-like format.


Of course I know Python and can manage DBs using SQLite3 module and SQL syntax, but it doesn't seem to be convinient learning big databases through reading Python tuple output.


I've found an interesting program called DB Browser and I've figured out that I even can learn existing DBs, e.g. viewing DB structure and data. But it doesn't clear, for example, how to add rows to the empty table, how to delete a whole row (not just row content), how to change field type, etc.


Does anybody have an experience of using DB Browser with NVDA? Or maybe there's another accessible database manager that works with SQLite3 DBs?


Thanks!


Andrey


Re: accessibility overlays on web sites

Gene
 

Clickable means you can press enter on something and it will do whatever it is supposed to do.

Gene

On 10/31/2022 3:48 AM, Brian's Mail list account via groups.io wrote:
Yes  a bit like gluing together some broken pottery with some of the bits missing, somebody described these solutions as!
I'm sure they have good intentions, and the makers of the overlays also see a cash cow, but there is as always, one true way to accessibility on a given web site. There is after all no real problem with making a nice looking site still comply with most of the guidelines, though slippage can occur over time as staff change of course.


I believe you should be able to hide that a screenreader is in use from a site if you want to, and I'd also say that sites in their first log on settings should ask you if you have a screenreader, if you want an overlay.
Its the lack of understanding that worries me. I even get people still asking after telling them that I cannot see large print, if they should make the font bigger in emails.
However getting back on topic, like this site, many use clickables for no apparent reason over links. I tend to just use them as links most of the time. I do find, however that Google Meets has problems with some headings also being controls and some browsers show the toggle while others do not for, for example the microphone or video on and off and the text often does not say its a control, let alone a toggle.
Brian


Re: accessibility overlays on web sites

 

Yeah overlays do help but eventually you should make it yourself.

What does warm my heart is that in the last few jobs I did, some sites were almost there.

The last one, I spent less time talking about accessibility and a lot more on language, and structure, where words should be, how to make the site look and behave like other similar sites, where some stuff should be for easier viewing.

99.9% of everything existed I just had to tweak it.

In the last 6 years I have not found a truely inaccessible site.

Most of it these days seem to be where lines of text is placed.

And of course if your whatever is accessible from the ground up well.

I often work on a site with a friend and had a lot of extra stuff loaded for security.

When I had a lot of extras loaded the site needed it.

However emails from the site a few weeks earlier had information I had put in with some of the programs a security risk but the site had improved to the extent those were not needed.

As a result I was able to remove 4 plugins and save some time.

On 31/10/2022 9:48 pm, Brian's Mail list account via groups.io wrote:
Yes  a bit like gluing together some broken pottery with some of the bits missing, somebody described these solutions as!
I'm sure they have good intentions, and the makers of the overlays also see a cash cow, but there is as always, one true way to accessibility on a given web site. There is after all no real problem with making a nice looking site still comply with most of the guidelines, though slippage can occur over time as staff change of course.


I believe you should be able to hide that a screenreader is in use from a site if you want to, and I'd also say that sites in their first log on settings should ask you if you have a screenreader, if you want an overlay.
Its the lack of understanding that worries me. I even get people still asking after telling them that I cannot see large print, if they should make the font bigger in emails.
However getting back on topic, like this site, many use clickables for no apparent reason over links. I tend to just use them as links most of the time. I do find, however that Google Meets has problems with some headings also being controls and some browsers show the toggle while others do not for, for example the microphone or video on and off and the text often does not say its a control, let alone a toggle.
Brian


Re: accessibility overlays on web sites

Brian's Mail list account
 

Yes a bit like gluing together some broken pottery with some of the bits missing, somebody described these solutions as!
I'm sure they have good intentions, and the makers of the overlays also see a cash cow, but there is as always, one true way to accessibility on a given web site. There is after all no real problem with making a nice looking site still comply with most of the guidelines, though slippage can occur over time as staff change of course.


I believe you should be able to hide that a screenreader is in use from a site if you want to, and I'd also say that sites in their first log on settings should ask you if you have a screenreader, if you want an overlay.
Its the lack of understanding that worries me. I even get people still asking after telling them that I cannot see large print, if they should make the font bigger in emails.
However getting back on topic, like this site, many use clickables for no apparent reason over links. I tend to just use them as links most of the time. I do find, however that Google Meets has problems with some headings also being controls and some browsers show the toggle while others do not for, for example the microphone or video on and off and the text often does not say its a control, let alone a toggle.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Don H" <lmddh50@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 9:24 PM
Subject: [nvda] accessibility overlays on web sites


I assume that web sites are supposed to make their web sites accessible
to those using screen readers. Nothing says they have to do a good job
of doing so. I would vote for NVDA somehow hiding itself so these
poorly implemented web sites couldn't see that a screen reader is being
used. I know the same issue applies to Jaws and Narrator but I know
that NVDA always does a better job of making the screen reader user
friendly. My most recent issue with a accessible overlay is with a bank
web site where instading of being able to read your balances and
activity the numbers that show clearly on the screen as a numeric value
are seen by NVDA as a spelled out version of the amount even if you
attempt to cut and paste it into a document on your computer.


Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

Brian's Mail list account
 

Yes but there are two comments I'd make about this.
1, assuming you can fathom out how to use Github as a user, then you can raise an issue, indeed search for an issue, but Github itself has a very poor user interface for the average user in my view. 2, it can be annoying if you think you have raised a non duplicate ticket, and next day you see a comment about it saying its either a non issue or a duplicate of another, which on the surface of looking at that ticket, does not jump out as being related. This then gets closed without so much as a thank you. Often people post here for guidance hoping an expert in Github can know what to search for before you go and waste a lot of time trying to raise a ticket.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 31, 2022 1:05 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible problem in NVDA regarding links


On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 08:18 PM, Gene wrote:


And since JAWS sees the links as links, I also thought there might be some
minor problem the developers might want to examine.
-
Gene, I'm not criticizing you for bringing this topic up, nor for seeking replication. Bur you or anyone else who says the above (and it happens with some frequency here) who does not create an issue in GitHub (or search to see if one exists, and comment on it) is deluding themselves if all they do is comment here.

The above may not apply to you, I am not certain, but for anyone reading this group, you need to realize that issues in GitHub are the one, and only, way things end up on the official radar of NVDA developers. If you're counting on one just happening to see something here, then create one, well . . .
--

Brian - Virginia, USA - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

*There are many people who can only make themselves feel better about themselves by making themselves feel better than others.*

~ Commenter Looking_in on the Washington Post , 7/10/2014


Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

Brian's Mail list account
 

They say clickable here, which I always thought meant they are a control that has an action, but its action is only defined when you click them.
And I just tried the latest alpha of nvda and that works as well, no error noises.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 5:45 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible problem in NVDA regarding links


Also, I don't want what I said to get lost, that JAWS sees the text as
links.

Gene
On 10/30/2022 12:33 PM, Gene via groups.io wrote:
You said you looked using heading elements and that evidently explains
the problem. I looked using links and they aren't shown as links,
there is no text. If I switched to heading elements, I expect I would
see them. The reason I checked with the links list set to display
links is because I wanted to see if there might be a difference
between what is read on the web page itself and what the links list shows.

I had wondered at first if you were looking at the screen but on
further thought, I don't think that would matter. I would expect the
lists to be displayed visually with the same information as the
screen-reader speaks.

Gene

On 10/30/2022 11:59 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
I'm off for the afternoon to help build sets for our next production
at ShenanArts. But I went to that webpage again using NVDA and
employing the elements list with headings elements.

Every heading element reads correctly. Moving to that heading gives
focus on the link for the video in question. Activating that link
causes the video to play.

So I say again, there's no NVDA issue here, there's an abominable
page design here. Everything works as expected, but the organization
is a labryinthine hell for a screen reader user who has no knowledge
of the page's organization. Not what you want when putting a webpage
together with screen reader users as the primary demographic.
--

Brian - Virginia, USA- Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

*/There are many people who can only make themselves feel better
about themselves by making themselves feel better than others. /*

~ Commenter /Looking_in/ on the /Washington Post/, 7/10/2014





Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

Brian's Mail list account
 

I never used the elements list and as long as you click on the clickable for the title of the video it plays, but on the browsers which are not my default, I do get warned I'm not logged into Youtube, but then you would expect that and the cookie messages. Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 4:59 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible problem in NVDA regarding links


I'm off for the afternoon to help build sets for our next production at ShenanArts. But I went to that webpage again using NVDA and employing the elements list with headings elements.

Every heading element reads correctly. Moving to that heading gives focus on the link for the video in question. Activating that link causes the video to play.

So I say again, there's no NVDA issue here, there's an abominable page design here. Everything works as expected, but the organization is a labryinthine hell for a screen reader user who has no knowledge of the page's organization. Not what you want when putting a webpage together with screen reader users as the primary demographic.
--

Brian - Virginia, USA - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

*There are many people who can only make themselves feel better about themselves by making themselves feel better than others.*

~ Commenter Looking_in on the Washington Post , 7/10/2014


Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

Brian's Mail list account
 

Blindshell Classic 2
30 videos•588 views•Last updated on Oct 19, 2022
Save playlist
Shuffle play
Share
Action menu
UCmatOSHzQsXruAi8N2M-G-w
PayOwn Media, LLC
Subscribe
1
Google Lookout on the BlindShell Classic 2 by PayOwn Media, LLC 11 days ago 10 minutes
PayOwn Media, LLC
Action menu
2
How To Reset the BlindShell Classic 2 Phone by PayOwn Media, LLC 3 weeks ago 2 minutes, 22 seconds
PayOwn Media, LLC
Action menu
3
Repete the last thing the BlindShell Classic 2 phone said by PayOwn Media, LLC 3 weeks ago 58 seconds
PayOwn Media, LLC
Action menu
4
Format SD card by PayOwn Media, LLC 1 month ago 2 minutes, 5 seconds
PayOwn Media, LLC

Taken from edge. All the clickables seem to show up, I obviously truncated this page.
Brian
--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 4:41 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible problem in NVDA regarding links


I tried that before sending my message. None of them were visible. The
links that sent you to the producer's web site were visible but the
actual names of the items that you click were not there on my machine.

When I say visible, I mean were read by the screen-reader.

Gene
On 10/30/2022 11:12 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Gene,

I don't think this is an NVDA problem, per se, but a piss-poor choice
of organization for a blind-centric page by an entity that should know
better.

If you open the elements list and use headings, all of those links
become instantly visible, and in a logical way. If you use the
elements list with links, they're all there but they are all listed as
PayOwnMedia, LLC, and are indistinguishable from each other.

The stack of videos is essentially a list of objects, and the links
are contained within those objects, and the first link contained
within each of those objects is the literal PayOwnMedia, LLC, link.
You have to use the previous object link once you're on the
PayOwnMedia, LLC, link to get to the actual link for the content.
There's also a triple dot menu button inside the object for each and
every one of these, but I didn't write down the menu options when
activated.

This is one of the most heinous page layouts I've ever seen if the
intent is to address a blind audience. It's very visually beautiful,
and obvious, if you're sighted, but it's certainly not if you're
blind, and never would be.
--

Brian - Virginia, USA- Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

*/There are many people who can only make themselves feel better about
themselves by making themselves feel better than others. /*

~ Commenter /Looking_in/ on the /Washington Post/, 7/10/2014






Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

Brian's Mail list account
 

I'm wondering if we are actually seeing the same page here. Yes the labelling is odd, but the clickable identifiers are the numbers or the name and there is also a description of the video and the length of it from what I can see in NVDA.
Could UK folk be getting a modified page?
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 4:12 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible problem in NVDA regarding links


Gene,

I don't think this is an NVDA problem, per se, but a piss-poor choice of organization for a blind-centric page by an entity that should know better.

If you open the elements list and use headings, all of those links become instantly visible, and in a logical way. If you use the elements list with links, they're all there but they are all listed as PayOwnMedia, LLC, and are indistinguishable from each other.

The stack of videos is essentially a list of objects, and the links are contained within those objects, and the first link contained within each of those objects is the literal PayOwnMedia, LLC, link. You have to use the previous object link once you're on the PayOwnMedia, LLC, link to get to the actual link for the content. There's also a triple dot menu button inside the object for each and every one of these, but I didn't write down the menu options when activated.

This is one of the most heinous page layouts I've ever seen if the intent is to address a blind audience. It's very visually beautiful, and obvious, if you're sighted, but it's certainly not if you're blind, and never would be.
--

Brian - Virginia, USA - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

*There are many people who can only make themselves feel better about themselves by making themselves feel better than others.*

~ Commenter Looking_in on the Washington Post , 7/10/2014


Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

Brian's Mail list account
 

I'm confused almost everything on that page says clickable.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 4:15 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible problem in NVDA regarding links


On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 12:09 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:


It is a bug
-
It is not a bug, it is a direct feature of the design layout used on this webpage.

My guess is that Auphonic paid PayOwnMedia to design this and that PayOwnMedia has never designed with a blind audience in mind. But what's even more shocking is that Auphonic didn't catch all this and raise holy hell about it.

That page is a complete accessibility nightmare, and it's very obvious to me that's because the designer was targeting a sighted audience, which is the wrong one to target for the BlindShell 2 phone.
--

Brian - Virginia, USA - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

*There are many people who can only make themselves feel better about themselves by making themselves feel better than others.*

~ Commenter Looking_in on the Washington Post , 7/10/2014


Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

Brian's Mail list account
 

Hi just went to that page and they seem to indicate they are clickable in Firefox, Edge, and a Waterfox. None are probably the latest versions, but are not ages old either.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 3:57 PM
Subject: [nvda] A possible problem in NVDA regarding links


I was just looking at this site:
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLNC7pndw1rKOpgBJVrx6a6mAKJE9BvxHm

The site has a playlist consisting of demonstrations about using The Blind Shell2. I noticed that the items you press enter on to make the videos play aren't identified by NVDA as either clickable or links, but pressing enter works.

I looked at the items with JAWS and it identifies them as links.
Others should verify that problem. If it is replicable, NVDA may be missing links on some pages.

To find the play list items quickly, they are heading level three titles.

Gene




ΑΠ: [nvda] Unable To Access Documents In Google Docs

Dimitrios Tsakiridis
 

Hello every one:

I use last version of NVDA, and I use Microsoft Edge.

When I open a google document, it must to enable the accessible support, using Control+alt+Z.

The problem is about shortcut, because there are sometimes for this shortcut, it’s does not work.

 

Best regards, Dimitrios Tsakiridis.

 

Στάλθηκε από την Αλληλογραφία για τα Windows

 

Από: farhan israk
Αποστολή: Κυριακή, 30 Οκτωβρίου 2022 7:02 μμ
Προς: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Θέμα: Re: [nvda] Unable To Access Documents In Google Docs

 

I really do not know what is wrong with your device. I have been using google docs on google chrome since last October, 2021. It's working completely fine. Try using Google chrome. Main body and comment box is accessible with a keyboard. I have written 500 words today. It is completely working fine as it is expected.

 

On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 1:35 AM Sarah k Alawami <marrie12@...> wrote:

Also try turning on speak dynamic text, if that is turned off the spreadsheet and stuff might not work as expected. I recently had this issue with sheets.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Russell James
Sent: Saturday, October 29, 2022 12:17 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Unable To Access Documents In Google Docs

 

Hi Bhavya,

 

Sorry, that sounds super frustrating!

 

I'm also using Windows 10 and NVDA 2022.3.1

However, I'm using Firefox Nightly.

 

I may use NVDA and Google Docs differently

However, when I arrow around in the body of the document it is spoken as expected.

 

Maybe you can try one of the Firefox or non chrome based browsers to see if things work better as a work around

 

In the Google document I was checking

The summary/outline is accessible to the physical mouse over

However the body of the document is not accessible to the physical mouse over

The comments from other users is accessible to the physical mouse over

 

I hope this helps

 

Russ

 

On Fri, Oct 28, 2022 at 9:52 PM Bhavya shah <bhavya.shah125@...> wrote:

Dear all,

I am using NVDA 2022.3 and the latest stable version of Microsoft Edge
on Windows 10. At least for the last several weeks, I have not been
able to access Google Docs document directly. I Press Ctrl+Alt+Z to
turn screen reader support on and off, switch between browse and focus
modes, and arrow around and Tab around to no avail. While navigating,
I simply get "grouping  focused  off screen" and "Document content
edit  multi line  blank." I have been going into focus mode and going
Ctrl+A followed by Ctrl+c to paste the document text in a separate
text editor to review, which, of course, is a non-ideal work-around.

Have you experienced this issue? Do you know of a more effective
solution? I would truly appreciate any tips or suggestions.

Kind Regards,
Bhavya Shah
B.S. in Mathematical and Computational Science | Stanford '24
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bhavyashah125/



 


locked Re: streaming software that works well with NVDA

Sarah k Alawami
 

Send a message to the chat group and I’ll help you there.  Thanks.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of goshawk on horseback
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 6:33 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] streaming software that works well with NVDA
Importance: High

 

where does one get this software from please?

 

Simon

 

 

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 3:28 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] streaming software that works well with NVDA

 

This is not true anymore.  Obs has gotten several updates, some of which have improved accessibility. We are up to about 28.x. I’ve created some good looking scenes, and the check boxes for visibility and position read. Iv’e gotten grate help from their community; Again if you have any questions take it to chat.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of William
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 4:20 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] streaming software that works well with NVDA

 

I don't think OBS is working well with nvda, at most, I could only say that it is usable.

Some of the UI elements of OBS studio are not accessible with NVDA, like, nvda is unable to interact with the area which is to select the incoming source of audio or video.

 

 

George McCoy 29/10/2022 21:11 寫道:

I agree with sarah. OBS works well with NVDA. I have been streaming live music on Facebook with it since early 2019 with very good results.

 

George

On 10/28/2022 8:40 PM, Jay wrote:

Hello all,

 

I’m hoping this is the right place to post this, but I’m looking for some recommendations for streaming software that works well with NVDa. I have a play station 5, and want to broadcast my game play to services like Twitch, youtube, facebook live, and other platforms but I’m not sure what streaming software works well with NVDA. I heard OBS Studio is somewhat accessible, and it’s doable to use but if there is any other accessible streaming software that might be better than OBS studio, please feel free to let me know.

 

Thanks.


locked Re: streaming software that works well with NVDA

goshawk on horseback
 


where does one get this software from please?
 
Simon
 
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 3:28 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] streaming software that works well with NVDA

This is not true anymore.  Obs has gotten several updates, some of which have improved accessibility. We are up to about 28.x. I’ve created some good looking scenes, and the check boxes for visibility and position read. Iv’e gotten grate help from their community; Again if you have any questions take it to chat.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of William
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2022 4:20 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] streaming software that works well with NVDA

 

I don't think OBS is working well with nvda, at most, I could only say that it is usable.

Some of the UI elements of OBS studio are not accessible with NVDA, like, nvda is unable to interact with the area which is to select the incoming source of audio or video.

 

 

George McCoy 29/10/2022 21:11 寫道:

I agree with sarah. OBS works well with NVDA. I have been streaming live music on Facebook with it since early 2019 with very good results.

 

George

On 10/28/2022 8:40 PM, Jay wrote:

Hello all,

 

I’m hoping this is the right place to post this, but I’m looking for some recommendations for streaming software that works well with NVDa. I have a play station 5, and want to broadcast my game play to services like Twitch, youtube, facebook live, and other platforms but I’m not sure what streaming software works well with NVDA. I heard OBS Studio is somewhat accessible, and it’s doable to use but if there is any other accessible streaming software that might be better than OBS studio, please feel free to let me know.

 

Thanks.


Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

Gene
 

I didn't want to create an issue until I saw whether others had the same experience on the page and to get thoughts about it.  Based on what has been said, it doesn't sound like something important enough to create an issue about, though I'm not sure.

Gene

On 10/30/2022 8:05 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 08:18 PM, Gene wrote:
And since JAWS sees the links as links, I also thought there might be some minor problem the developers might want to examine.
-
Gene, I'm not criticizing you for bringing this topic up, nor for seeking replication.  Bur you or anyone else who says the above (and it happens with some frequency here) who does not create an issue in GitHub (or search to see if one exists, and comment on it) is deluding themselves if all they do is comment here.

The above may not apply to you, I am not certain, but for anyone reading this group, you need to realize that issues in GitHub are the one, and only, way things end up on the official radar of NVDA developers.  If you're counting on one just happening to see something here, then create one, well . . .
--

Brian Virginia, USA  Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045  

There are many people who can only make themselves feel better about themselves by making themselves feel better than others.

    ~ Commenter Looking_in on the Washington Post, 7/10/2014



Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

 
Edited

On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 08:18 PM, Gene wrote:
And since JAWS sees the links as links, I also thought there might be some minor problem the developers might want to examine.
-
Gene, I'm not criticizing you for bringing this topic up, nor for seeking replication.  But you or anyone else who says the above (and it happens with some frequency here) who does not create an issue in GitHub (or search to see if one exists, and comment on it) is deluding themselves if all they do is comment here.

The above may not apply to you, I am not certain, but for anyone reading this group, you need to realize that issues in GitHub are the one, and only, way things end up on the official radar of NVDA developers.  If you're counting on one just happening to see something here, then create one, well . . .
--

Brian Virginia, USA  Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045  

There are many people who can only make themselves feel better about themselves by making themselves feel better than others.

    ~ Commenter Looking_in on the Washington Post, 7/10/2014


Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

Gene
 

One reason I presented the problem is because I didn't know if the problem might be encountered enough to matter.  Since no one has discussed seeing this problem, it may be uncommon to the point where it might be decided to do nothing about it.  Still, I wanted to raise it for discussion.  And since JAWS sees the links as links, I also thought there might be some minor problem the developers might want to examine.

Gene

On 10/30/2022 12:45 PM, Gene wrote:

Also, I don't want what I said to get lost, that JAWS sees the text as links. 

Gene
On 10/30/2022 12:33 PM, Gene via groups.io wrote:
You said you looked using heading elements and that evidently explains the problem.  I looked using links and they aren't shown as links, there is no text.  If I switched to heading elements, I expect I would see them.  The reason I checked with the links list set to display links is because I wanted to see if there might be a difference between what is read on the web page itself and what the links list shows.

I had wondered at first if you were looking at the screen but on further thought, I don't think that would matter.  I would expect the lists to be displayed visually with the same information as the screen-reader speaks.

Gene

On 10/30/2022 11:59 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
I'm off for the afternoon to help build sets for our next production at ShenanArts.  But I went to that webpage again using NVDA and employing the elements list with headings elements.

Every heading element reads correctly.  Moving to that heading gives focus on the link for the video in question.  Activating that link causes the video to play.

So I say again, there's no NVDA issue here, there's an abominable page design here.  Everything works as expected, but the organization is a labryinthine hell for a screen reader user who has no knowledge of the page's organization.  Not what you want when putting a webpage together with screen reader users as the primary demographic.
--

Brian Virginia, USA  Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045  

There are many people who can only make themselves feel better about themselves by making themselves feel better than others.

    ~ Commenter Looking_in on the Washington Post, 7/10/2014





Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

 

On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 02:02 PM, Jackie wrote:
Viewing the source, they're not exactly the standard types of links one would expect.
-
And the source for pages such as this are very short, but trying to drill down into what's actually controlling each and every element presented is nightmarish, too.  That page has 28 lines of HTML, which you can be certain is just the tip of the proverbial iceberg.

I hate where you can't really go through the entire page source (in any meaningful sense of that phrase) by looking at the main page source.  It's often impossible for us mere mortals who don't do HTML coding to even figure out which thing that is shown in the source for the page we should dig into next.
--

Brian Virginia, USA  Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045  

There are many people who can only make themselves feel better about themselves by making themselves feel better than others.

    ~ Commenter Looking_in on the Washington Post, 7/10/2014


accessibility overlays on web sites

Don H
 

I assume that web sites are supposed to make their web sites accessible to those using screen readers. Nothing says they have to do a good job of doing so. I would vote for NVDA somehow hiding itself so these poorly implemented web sites couldn't see that a screen reader is being used. I know the same issue applies to Jaws and Narrator but I know that NVDA always does a better job of making the screen reader user friendly. My most recent issue with a accessible overlay is with a bank web site where instading of being able to read your balances and activity the numbers that show clearly on the screen as a numeric value are seen by NVDA as a spelled out version of the amount even if you attempt to cut and paste it into a document on your computer.


Re: A possible problem in NVDA regarding links

 

Hello all,

Are you refering to this page:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLNC7pndw1rKOpgBJVrx6a6mAKJE9BvxHm
If so, there is no one else here to blame but Google. Because that page is a page for a playlist on YouTube. That is to say - the page is part of the YouTube website.
I'm clarifying this, because if I understood correctly the messages on this subject by some people, they blame the organization "PayOwn Media, LLC" for the problems on it, thinking that the page is created by them. And no - it is not. The organization "PayOwn Media, LLC" is just another user of the YouTube service that has a channel on it and uploads videos there - that's all.
With that said and clarified, I can confirm that there are some accessibility issues on this page. They should be reported to Google though, so that they can eventually be fixed.

______
Best wishes,
Kostadin Kolev

На 30.10.2022 г. в 20:02, Jackie написа:

NVDA says "clickable" on those links. Viewing the source, they're not
exactly the standard types of links one would expect. I have to agree
w/Brian V that the design of the webpage sucks, I guess at least they
have "accessibility labels". Most of these agencies put these webpages
together w/stuff that God only knows what it is, (because most of them
don't), and it looks (and generally acts) like it. But the word
"clickable" tells you it can be clicked (or, hopefully, activated by
means of pressing enter or space on the keyboard. so I can't say I
think this is a problem w/NVDA. And, in actuality, given my look at
the source, I think calling them links isn't really technically
correct, though that is how they function.

On 10/30/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
Also, I don't want what I said to get lost, that JAWS sees the text as
links.

Gene
On 10/30/2022 12:33 PM, Gene via groups.io wrote:
You said you looked using heading elements and that evidently explains
the problem.  I looked using links and they aren't shown as links,
there is no text.  If I switched to heading elements, I expect I would
see them.  The reason I checked with the links list set to display
links is because I wanted to see if there might be a difference
between what is read on the web page itself and what the links list
shows.

I had wondered at first if you were looking at the screen but on
further thought, I don't think that would matter.  I would expect the
lists to be displayed visually with the same information as the
screen-reader speaks.

Gene

On 10/30/2022 11:59 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
I'm off for the afternoon to help build sets for our next production
at ShenanArts.  But I went to that webpage again using NVDA and
employing the elements list with headings elements.

Every heading element reads correctly.  Moving to that heading gives
focus on the link for the video in question.  Activating that link
causes the video to play.

So I say again, there's no NVDA issue here, there's an abominable
page design here.  Everything works as expected, but the organization
is a labryinthine hell for a screen reader user who has no knowledge
of the page's organization.  Not what you want when putting a webpage
together with screen reader users as the primary demographic.
--

Brian - Virginia, USA- Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 22H2, Build 19045

*/There are many people who can only make themselves feel better
about themselves by making themselves feel better than others. /*

    ~ Commenter /Looking_in/ on the /Washington Post/, 7/10/2014