Date   

Re: Status Bar Keystroke

Janet Brandly
 

Glad it helped. I think they forgot to mention which keyboard layout they were talking about. I always use laptop mode. In fact, I just bought an external keyboard which doesn’t have the number pad on the right. It’s much narrower and more portable and takes up much less room.

 

Janet

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Kingsbury
Sent: August 20, 2022 10:54 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Status Bar Keystroke

 

Hi Janet

Thanks for this. Insert and End alone did nothing for me. But when I pressed Insert Shift End in Word, it worked. because I was in laptop mode. When I switched to desktop mode, Insert End worked.

David


Re: Status Bar Keystroke

David Kingsbury
 

Hi Janet

Thanks for this. Insert and End alone did nothing for me. But when I pressed Insert Shift End in Word, it worked. because I was in laptop mode. When I switched to desktop mode, Insert End worked.

David


The art of web development with screen readers.

accessible tech malayalam
 

New batch starts from 1st September 2022.


Technology is proving its abilities in various aspects of human life.

After the rise  of the internet era, websites are playing a major role in the modern generation in multiple situations such as online booking, digital reading, and even online schooling.


With the Global School of Accessibility, you can learn the art of developing websites with corporate level expertise and 100 % accessibility.

Our industry oriented training will enable you to understand the job seeking patterns and will help you analyze the latest trends in the corporate world of web development.

By completing this course with a score of 80 % or above, your talents will be enough for you to apply in any company as a web developer.

Also, the grand set of employers connected to the global school of accessibility will be waiting for your talent to make you a well paid employee.


Prerequisites.


• Intermediate knowledge in computer and screen reader.

• Ability to understand English language.

• Good internet connectivity.

• A laptop with Windows 10.

• 15 to 20 hours in a week.

Note : no programming knowledge is required.


Key Objectives


• Basics of html and CSS.

• Web hosting and domain management.

• Web development with various scripts such as wordpress, drupal etc.

• Basics of search engine optimization.

• Techniques to develop websites for commercial clients.


Apply now for free:


Contact us for more info.

Email: support@...

WhatsApp: +918943031760



--
with best regards, Haroon kareem T.K


Re: Math Reading Issues (pronunciation of x^3, y^3)

Brian's Mail list account
 

OK, but assumedly you are using at least Windows 10, so NVDA will default to one core I think I'm right in saying. though it may not suit everyone, try changing the synth to Espeak and see if there is a change. Sometimes Microsoft voices tend to assume too much and this can screw things up. I do not know what voice is default for Jaws these days, but its still probably Eloquence, which like Espeak is a non human voice and therefore can say most things correctly.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joy Holly" <sjoyholly@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2022 7:49 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Math Reading Issues (pronunciation of x^3, y^3)


Want to preface by saying in no way was I hoping anyone here would do
troubleshooting I can do, was just looking for feedback to the question "is
this sort of math reading error common/known" so I could rule out it being
something with the LMS, with the version of Mathjax used, etc. to widen my
knowledgebase before knowing what to try out next.

I will now answer my own question, being given the hint by you all to
experiment with the set synths and voices. I had not done this because the
goal on our side is to provide accessible and readable math, with the
responsibility for the customization needed for this screenreader or that
being with the user.

This reading error occurs also in FF, and I should have said this (but
Chrome is our target browser since it is the one used by the schools.)

The default synth setting is what we are using since we adjusted nothing
after installation. It is Windows OneVoice with the voice Microsoft David.
I tries the other two OneVoice voice options; the pronunciation issue
remained. So then I changed the synth setting to Microsoft Speech API v. 5,
using the Microsoft Dave voice, and now it reads "x cubed" as expected!

Thank you for the breadcrumbs leading me to the information I needed most,
which was essentially confirmation that the math is accessible, and the
reading issue here lies with NVDA specifications that need tweaking.

Very grateful!

Joy

On Fri, Aug 19, 2022, 1:50 PM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

On Fri, Aug 19, 2022 at 01:42 PM, Rui Fontes wrote:

To you "eekup" seems an english message?

For me it is not an english message...

-
Which is precisely the point and the problem. It's isolated to cubed
variables, and one of them, the X one, is at least far closer to what it
should be than the Y one is.

All other instances referenced make it crystal clear that the announcement
is both correct, and in English.

I don't know how that could possibly have been clearer from the initial
problem statement, message #98716
<https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda/message/98716>. This is one of the
best-written complex problem statements I've ever had the privilege to read
on this group.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

*The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his
ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.*

~ Vance Packard





Re: Access to Windows 10 Games: Suggestion for compatibility update or add-on for NVDA

 

Hi,

It might be possible that Solitaire Collection might be showing you game hints. Try pressing Escape and see if you can navigate around the game afterwards.

As for Windows 10 games tutorials, perhaps we need to ask someone to produce some as it can benefit many screen reader users (other screen reader users, too I imagine).

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: Access to Windows 10 Games: Suggestion for compatibility update or add-on for NVDA

David Mehler
 

Hello,

Trying to keep this somewhat NVDA-focussed does anyone have any audio
tutorials/walkthroughs of NVDA and win10 gamesplay? This is I think
something that would be good to have since IMO I do not believe that
win10 games being accessible is widely known, speaking for myself I
hadn't even considered the possibility and didn't know before today.
Thanks.
Dave.

On 8/19/22, Iris Finn <mixdose@...> wrote:
Sounds incredibly complicated! I hate to say this, but now I have another
problem! I've been trying it out on my partner's computer and it worked for
a while, but while playing Pyramid, I needed to bring up a new deal. Neither
Enter nor Space would work to do this, then, subsequently, NVDA stopped
reading any card buttons with arrows at all. Could this be a setting within
NVDA that needs to change, or a bug within the game app -- which, I know is
outside of the scope of this list. I just thought the NVDA part would be
worth asking.
On 20 Aug 2022, at 3:09 am, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> wrote:


Hi Iris, You're welcome.

Yes, it wasn't until recently that Microsoft made improvements to
Solitaire Collection in terms of accessibility. Back in say, 2015 (when
Windows 10 made its debut), cards and card decks were not labeled
properly; rather, they were labeled using a UIA (UI Automation) facility
that I haven't even thought of, something Narrator did support then (that
facility was called "localized control type", a text representing how
screen readers should report what the control is to users but localized
for various languages; in Solitaire Collection, cards and card decks were
"shown" (presented to screen readers) as an unknown control with the
actual card suit and rank seen as a distinct control type, localized to
various languages, including, surprisingly enough, United States English;
how this is even possible is way beyond the scope of this forum as it
touches multilingual user interface). This changed a few weeks ago with
the release of Solitaire Collection 4.13, with cards and card decks having
actual labels in a form that NVDA can better understand (technical: UIA
name property; the internals of this is again beyond the scope of this
forum as we need to go into geeky side of UIA support from NVDA).

Although I don't have extensive knowledge of parts of UI Automation and
deeper parts of NVDA as several members here, you can count me in as a
resident NVDA developer (or used to be as my immediate occupation is a
university instructor and a graduate student). And no, my contributions
are not as widely applied as say, Tyler Spivey's.

Cheers,

Joseph






Re: Access to Windows 10 Games: Suggestion for compatibility update or add-on for NVDA

Iris Finn
 

Sounds incredibly complicated! I hate to say this, but now I have another problem! I've been trying it out on my partner's computer and it worked for a while, but while playing Pyramid, I needed to bring up a new deal. Neither Enter nor Space would work to do this, then, subsequently, NVDA stopped reading any card buttons with arrows at all. Could this be a setting within NVDA that needs to change, or a bug within the game app -- which, I know is outside of the scope of this list. I just thought the NVDA part would be worth asking.


On 20 Aug 2022, at 3:09 am, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> wrote:



Hi Iris, You're welcome.

Yes, it wasn't until recently that Microsoft made improvements to Solitaire Collection in terms of accessibility. Back in say, 2015 (when Windows 10 made its debut), cards and card decks were not labeled properly; rather, they were labeled using a UIA (UI Automation) facility that I haven't even thought of, something Narrator did support then (that facility was called "localized control type", a text representing how screen readers should report what the control is to users but localized for various languages; in Solitaire Collection, cards and card decks were "shown" (presented to screen readers) as an unknown control with the actual card suit and rank seen as a distinct control type, localized to various languages, including, surprisingly enough, United States English; how this is even possible is way beyond the scope of this forum as it touches multilingual user interface). This changed a few weeks ago with the release of Solitaire Collection 4.13, with cards and card decks having actual labels in a form that NVDA can better understand (technical: UIA name property; the internals of this is again beyond the scope of this forum as we need to go into geeky side of UIA support from NVDA).

Although I don't have extensive knowledge of parts of UI Automation and deeper parts of NVDA as several members here, you can count me in as a resident NVDA developer (or used to be as my immediate occupation is a university instructor and a graduate student). And no, my contributions are not as widely applied as say, Tyler Spivey's.

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: Status Bar Keystroke

Janet Brandly
 

For laptops it's insert shift end.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ann Byrne
Sent: August 19, 2022 6:09 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Status Bar Keystroke

insert+end (e n d)
At 07:03 AM 8/19/2022, you wrote:

Hi all,

I know you can press F6 a few times to get to the Status bar. Does NVDA
also have a keystroke combination to reveal it like JAWS has Insert
Page Down?

Thanks,

David





Re: Math Reading Issues (pronunciation of x^3, y^3)

 

On Fri, Aug 19, 2022 at 04:39 PM, Joy Holly wrote:
I will put it on my to-do list. It's definitely an annoying reading bug.
-
Joy,

Another one of those seemingly hair-splitting things that probably isn't important here, but could be:  The Feedback Hub in Windows 10/11 can only be used to communicate with Microsoft regarding a synthesizer that they maintain (or anything else you can possibly think of that Microsoft maintains).

I'm saying this more for the historical record than anything else.  If the synth that's misbehaving is issued by some other software house, then their technical support is where the cage-rattling needs to occur.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Re: Possible Bug with Punctuation/Symbol Pronunciation Dialog - Can others replicate?

tim
 

It wasn't there 4 years ago when I started using it over my mac.


On 8/19/2022 12:57 AM, Quentin Christensen wrote:

Brian,

Good question.  What I believe is happening, is when you look at say the sentence ending exclamation mark, what NVDA reads is the following block of text:
! sentence ending; Replacement: bang; Level: all; Preserve: always

Depending on your punctuation settings, it is reading the semi-colons (;) and colons (:), between each element.  Which stands out because you aren't expecting them.  I don't recall noticing it earlier - when you say you noticed it in 2022.2, do you recall it NOT being there earlier?

It might be worth raising an issue for.

Quenti.n

On Fri, Aug 19, 2022 at 2:12 PM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
These are the instructions I've written for editing pronunciations for symbols/punctuation:
---------------
1. Hit NVDA + N, P, P [NVDA Menu, Preferences, Punctuation/Symbol Pronunciation]
2. In the filter box, either enter the character for which you wish to change the replacement OR the replacement phrase you no longer wish to have used.  It's often more efficient to enter the replacement phrase (e.g., tick, bang) than the character, as all instances of where that replacement is used will come up in the Symbols section, which is where you find entries to make changes.
3. Hit TAB once to land in the first returned result in the symbols list to double check that it's one you wish to change.  If it is, then . . .
4. Hit ALT + R to be thrown directly to the Replacement Edit box.  Change the replacement to whatever you wish for it to be.
5. Hit SHIFT + TAB to be thrown back to the Symbol list, you will be on the symbol you last changed the replacement for.  Hit down arrow to advance to the next returned symbol in the list.  If it's one you wish to change, jump back to Step 3.
6. Once you have done Steps 3 through 5 for all symbols for which you wish to change the replacement, then navigate to the OK button for the dialog and activate it.
7. You're done with symbol editing.
 
NOTE:  You are most likely to want to edit the replacement for the "naked" character.  For example, if you wish single quotation marks to be announced as "single quote," then once you've entered "tick" in the Filter by edit box, once you tab to the Symbols list down arrow until you hit the solitary/naked instance of the single quote character, as opposed to the one for in-word, or left, or right.
---------------

When I do this in NVDA 2022.2, whether I Filter by individual single quote character for tick or the word tick, the actual symbol is never announced when I jump to the Symbol list in Step 2 the first instance is announced as "in dash word semi," even though what can be seen visually is the phrase "in-word" followed by space followed by the single quote character.  The same is true when "bang" is used as the filter by criteria.

This is definitely not consistent across all characters, most of which first announce the character, followed by semi, followed by replacement then the actual replacement word(s) followed by semi, etc.

What are others getting if they enter either "tick" or "bang" in the Filter by box, then start exploring the Symbols returned in the Symbols list?  I double checked my Default dictionary and cannot see anything I've done there that should cause this issue.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: Math Reading Issues (pronunciation of x^3, y^3)

 

Hi,

Hopefully one last thing: I think it might be helpful to tell accessibility engineers (at Canvas) to inform technical authors and curriculum writers about things to be aware of when using screen readers to access the online content (hopefully the docs would be written from the perspective of the student/teacher/parent/support specialist/anyone willing to review the course materials and the tech implementation used; if folks need guidance on wording and such, feel free to contact Brian, I, and others who are either instructors or have teaching experiences, especially folks with assistive tech experience).

P.S. I might as well save this conversation somewhere as my university uses Canvas for LMS (learning management system).

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: Math Reading Issues (pronunciation of x^3, y^3)

Joy Holly
 

Thanks! I will put it on my to-do list. It's definitely an annoying reading bug.


On Fri, Aug 19, 2022, 4:32 PM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
Joy,

In Windows 10 and 11, the Feedback Hub is the very best way to report issues, and fairly easy, too.

--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Re: Math Reading Issues (pronunciation of x^3, y^3)

 

Joy,

In Windows 10 and 11, the Feedback Hub is the very best way to report issues, and fairly easy, too.

--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


locked Re: apostrophe pronunciation

Gene
 

There is a problem somewhere.  When I write, I hear ' when writing an apostrophe in a word.  I Hear it at any punctuation level.  The level of punctuation affects if you hear certain punctuation when listening by word, phrase, document, etc.  But you always hear all punctuation spoken when you type and the key echo is on. 
Gene

On 8/19/2022 2:34 PM, Dave Grossoehme wrote:

Yes when you are writing the word and spell it don't the ' is not heard.  If you read the information back it is heard, but not when you write the word as I'm in this message, but the ' is heard when writing the word I'm.

Dave


On 8/19/2022 3:06 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Fri, Aug 19, 2022 at 02:53 PM, Dave Grossoehme wrote:
The reason I ask this is because as the default don't when you write it is don t. 
-
Did you intend to omit an apostrophe on the last "don't" in the above sentence?  Don't is always written with an apostrophe for the contraction, and that sentence, as written, is suggesting that it should be omitted.  I suspect a typo, but for a topic like this I don't wish to leave anything this critical as an assumption.

Clarification, please.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard



Re: Possible Bug with Punctuation/Symbol Pronunciation Dialog - Can others replicate?

Gene
 

I reverted to factory settings and set punctuation to most. 
I don't think semicolons  are announced by default below most.  Maybe that's one reason people haven't complained.  At any rate, the extraneous marks are read using factory default settings, except the default punctuation setting which I raised.

Gene

On 8/19/2022 1:25 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

To answer Gene's question, see my explanation on column/row header announcement internals.

Come to think of it, does this happen if things are "back to defaults" - not only settings, but with speech dictionary entries removed? You can replicate what I'm talking about iwth a fresh portable NVDA telling NVDA to not copy user settings whatsoever. I mention speech dictionaries as I know that some folks added regular expression entries that can cause NVDA (more precisely, Python) to recognize certain patterns and act differently (not a high probability, but something to investigate).

Cheers,

Joseph



Re: Math Reading Issues (pronunciation of x^3, y^3)

Joy Holly
 

I would have no idea how to make a report to the developers of the Microsoft OneCore voices synthesizer, although I agree it would be a helpful and noble thing to do. Is there a Wonky Synthesizer Developer forum? I'm willing to report it. (Although my time is stretched trying to get this course reviewed and fixed by the deadline.) I'm not against waving problems under the noses of the right people to fix them--hooray for that!, but I will admit to feeling a bit exhausted as the sheer number of problems-that-should-be-fixed (specifically when trying to make a 600 page math course accessible) is daunting.





On Fri, Aug 19, 2022 at 3:11 PM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 19, 2022 at 02:49 PM, Joy Holly wrote:
Thank you for the breadcrumbs leading me to the information I needed most, which was essentially confirmation that the math is accessible, and the reading issue here lies with NVDA specifications that need tweaking.
 
-
Joy,

I am not trying to beat a dead horse here, as I've been where you are myself.  You can say, accurately, that an NVDA setting for voice may need tweaking, but it is critical to note that the issue does not lie with NVDA (nor JAWS, nor Narrator) but with the synthesizer in use.

There is nothing for the developers of NVDA (or JAWS, or Narrator) to fix in an instance like this.  A report could be made to the developers of the wonky synthesizer so they are aware of this odd bobble when reading mathematical expressions, but it would be up to the synth developers to fix it, not the developers of the screen readers that can send text to that synth.

This is not as hair-splitting as it seems, as getting issues under the noses of the right people to fix them is the quickest way to get them fixed (and that's only if the brains above those noses care). 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


locked Re: apostrophe pronunciation

Dave Grossoehme
 

Yes when you are writing the word and spell it don't the ' is not heard.  If you read the information back it is heard, but not when you write the word as I'm in this message, but the ' is heard when writing the word I'm.

Dave


On 8/19/2022 3:06 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Fri, Aug 19, 2022 at 02:53 PM, Dave Grossoehme wrote:
The reason I ask this is because as the default don't when you write it is don t. 
-
Did you intend to omit an apostrophe on the last "don't" in the above sentence?  Don't is always written with an apostrophe for the contraction, and that sentence, as written, is suggesting that it should be omitted.  I suspect a typo, but for a topic like this I don't wish to leave anything this critical as an assumption.

Clarification, please.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Re: Math Reading Issues (pronunciation of x^3, y^3)

 

On Fri, Aug 19, 2022 at 02:49 PM, Joy Holly wrote:
Thank you for the breadcrumbs leading me to the information I needed most, which was essentially confirmation that the math is accessible, and the reading issue here lies with NVDA specifications that need tweaking.
 
-
Joy,

I am not trying to beat a dead horse here, as I've been where you are myself.  You can say, accurately, that an NVDA setting for voice may need tweaking, but it is critical to note that the issue does not lie with NVDA (nor JAWS, nor Narrator) but with the synthesizer in use.

There is nothing for the developers of NVDA (or JAWS, or Narrator) to fix in an instance like this.  A report could be made to the developers of the wonky synthesizer so they are aware of this odd bobble when reading mathematical expressions, but it would be up to the synth developers to fix it, not the developers of the screen readers that can send text to that synth.

This is not as hair-splitting as it seems, as getting issues under the noses of the right people to fix them is the quickest way to get them fixed (and that's only if the brains above those noses care). 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


locked Re: apostrophe pronunciation

 

On Fri, Aug 19, 2022 at 02:53 PM, Dave Grossoehme wrote:
The reason I ask this is because as the default don't when you write it is don t. 
-
Did you intend to omit an apostrophe on the last "don't" in the above sentence?  Don't is always written with an apostrophe for the contraction, and that sentence, as written, is suggesting that it should be omitted.  I suspect a typo, but for a topic like this I don't wish to leave anything this critical as an assumption.

Clarification, please.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


locked Re: apostrophe pronunciation

 

I suspect Dave G's latest question, and the one I'm about to ask, are one and the same and probably all revolve around a combination of Level and Preserve.

I am going to use the standard NVDA term, tick, for the single quote or apostrophe when referring to initial states.  I decided to play with the in-word tick and the tick that stands by itself, and wanted the former to be pronounced as apostrophe and the latter to be pronounced as single quote.

I edited the entries in the symbol list in the dialog such that I thought this should happen, but what I'm getting is "single quote" even when reading character by character in a word such as "don't."  Essentially, the only change for tick that is honored is an across the board replacement of single quote, regardless of exactly where that tick occurs.  I would have expected "apostrophe" to be announced when going character by character through don't, but single quote to be announced for something like, 'I saw you!."   And for something like, 'I'm here,' I'd expect the following: Single quote I apostrophe M space H E R E comma single quote.

I'm not getting that.  What's the magic combination of level and preservation for the in-word tick that I'd need to use to get it to consistently announce as apostrophe when reviewing characters?
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard

4201 - 4220 of 102727