Date   

Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

Gene,

          The problem being, much like the ribbon interface being here and here to stay, the ships of automatic mode switching off and use of verbal mode prompts being used have sailed long ago and are not coming back.

           Even if I agreed with your positions in the abstract, and I don't, the best thing for beginning students is to learn using the out of the box defaults.  This is for the very simple reason that other than some minor tweaking, if that, most people don't do tons of customization away from the defaults.  Being able to sit in front of any random machine that uses software you're familiar with, and being able to use it without hitting unnecessary stumbling blocks, is so hugely valuable as to be unable to be ignored or waved away.

            I don't, and won't, ever presume that someone who's using a screen reader will never be using it anywhere except their own home/office, and that being able to sit down and just "hit the ground running" on a machine unfamiliar to them is something they'd want, without even asking the question.  That's how general education works, then once the foundations and defaults are known, personalization decisions get made then (and, if you're smart, you'll record what you've done, when you're doing it, because I have yet to meet anyone who remembers what they've done weeks/months/years later when they need or want to re-create it).
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.  The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body.  What you do and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

      ~ Brian Vogel

 


Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

Gene
 

I'm not making a general statement that spoken words are better.  I'm saying that when someone begins learning the Internet, they are thinking about all sorts of things.  I think that hearing the words will both help remember the terms and what they mean and that it will make it a little easier for the beginning student.


I also think that automatic mode switching should be off for beginning students. 


Gene

On 5/28/2021 11:14 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 12:11 PM, Gene wrote:
But I think it is important for those beginning to learn web navigation to hear what mode they are in.
-
And they do.  You just want to insist that using spoken words is "better."  I don't think it is given how frequently mode changes (as things are set up by default) and that extra verbosity just gets in the way.  The two sounds are quite distinct and not used otherwise contextually.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.  The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body.  What you do and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

      ~ Brian Vogel

 


Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Hi, Brian,


I'm in total agreement with you here. When I first learned NVDA, I didn'twant to always hear "browse mode" or "focus mode". I chose to hear the sounds rather than the words "browse" and "focus" modes. To be honest, I hate extra verbage. It drives me batty after a while.


Rosemarie



On 5/28/2021 9:14 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 12:11 PM, Gene wrote:
But I think it is important for those beginning to learn web navigation to hear what mode they are in.
-
And they do.  You just want to insist that using spoken words is "better."  I don't think it is given how frequently mode changes (as things are set up by default) and that extra verbosity just gets in the way.  The two sounds are quite distinct and not used otherwise contextually.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.  The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body.  What you do and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

      ~ Brian Vogel

 


Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 12:11 PM, Gene wrote:
But I think it is important for those beginning to learn web navigation to hear what mode they are in.
-
And they do.  You just want to insist that using spoken words is "better."  I don't think it is given how frequently mode changes (as things are set up by default) and that extra verbosity just gets in the way.  The two sounds are quite distinct and not used otherwise contextually.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.  The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body.  What you do and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

      ~ Brian Vogel

 


Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

Gene
 

Students can use whatever they want as they progress, but I see nothing wrong with having spoken repetitions reinforcing learning in a case like this. 
 
I’m not generalizing about interfaces.  But I think it is important for those beginning to learn web navigation to hear what mode they are in.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 11:03 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode
 
On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 11:27 AM, Gene wrote:
Also, for those learning NVDA, I don’t think sound should be used.  Repetition is important in learning and hearing actual words would help those learning both become more aware of the terms and perhaps be more aware of when they are in which mode.
-
Sorry, Gene, but sound indicators for a very great many things, and outside of NVDA, are so common as to be virtually ubiquitous.  More common that word or phrase announcements, I'd say.

You, any you, are best off learning the actual default conventions of whatever it is your using, and then, and only then, changing things to suit your personal liking.  Knowing how to use the native interfaces of everything you use, before customizing them, saves a heck of a lot of heartache if you are someone who finds themselves having to use the software other than on your own equipment.  I used to heavily customize for clients, and early on back in the day, until I saw just how many times they had to jump on to another machine (most were students in college, but not all) and they'd have no idea at all what the native interfaces were telling them.  Not good.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.  The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body.  What you do and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

      ~ Brian Vogel

 


Re: NVDA Remote for iOS (was RE: [nvda] NVDARemote)

Hareth
 

Thanks for the clarification, appreciated.
I just couldn't stop my self pointing the differ between security and
an app service features .

On 5/28/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 11:53 AM, Hareth wrote:


Wrong!
-
Hareth, believe it or not, this is not aimed at you, specifically (see my
previous message) but I am asking everyone to now please either steer back
to the NVDA-centric, and only NVDA-centric, focus for this topic or take it
to the Chat Subgroup.

We, and I included myself in this, are getting very far away from anything
that's actually related to NVDA specifically and, thus, it's off-topic
here.

I'd prefer not to have to lock this topic, as there could be something
specific to it that someone has yet to say, but I will if I must if it
remains "off the rails."
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.
The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression,
which are contained in and actuated by the body. What you do and say is the
clearest indicator of who you are.

~ Brian Vogel






Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 11:27 AM, Gene wrote:
Also, for those learning NVDA, I don’t think sound should be used.  Repetition is important in learning and hearing actual words would help those learning both become more aware of the terms and perhaps be more aware of when they are in which mode. 
-
Sorry, Gene, but sound indicators for a very great many things, and outside of NVDA, are so common as to be virtually ubiquitous.  More common that word or phrase announcements, I'd say.

You, any you, are best off learning the actual default conventions of whatever it is your using, and then, and only then, changing things to suit your personal liking.  Knowing how to use the native interfaces of everything you use, before customizing them, saves a heck of a lot of heartache if you are someone who finds themselves having to use the software other than on your own equipment.  I used to heavily customize for clients, and early on back in the day, until I saw just how many times they had to jump on to another machine (most were students in college, but not all) and they'd have no idea at all what the native interfaces were telling them.  Not good.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.  The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body.  What you do and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

      ~ Brian Vogel

 


Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

Gene
 

I seldom use JAWS, but I find the sounds to be unpleasant. 
 
But I’m concerned in this case with one use of the sounds.  I think that when yu use NVDDA space to toggle browse mode off and on, speech is preferable.  And JAWS doesn’t have sounds when you toggle the Virtual PC cursor off and on with JAWS key z. 
 
If someone wants to say that they would  rather hear sounds when browse mode is automatically turned off and on when you move through a page, that makes sense.  I think the sound for browse mode off is a poor choice, but my objection is to not having speech when you use the NVDA key space toggle as the default..
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 10:38 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode
 

The sounds is simply another indicator of what is going on. Do the sounds associated with forms mode in Jaws bug you as well?

 

I hear two things in the higher pitched sound. A manual typewriter key sound, and a short square wave tone at around 1,400 Hz, or 6th octave F. the other sound for that toggle appears to be simply a short square wave at 440 Hz or rth octave A.

 

 

On 2021-05-28 11:27 a.m., Gene wrote:
If it were a typing sound, it might make more sense.  But it is something like a high pitched camera sound you might heare on a phone.  It doesn’t have any association with a mode and I find the sound to be grating and annoying. 
 
Also, for those learning NVDA, I don’t think sound should be used.  Repetition is important in learning and hearing actual words would help those learning both become more aware of the terms and perhaps be more aware of when they are in which mode. 
 
Gene
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 10:06 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode
 

The typing sound means focused mode, the bop noise means browse mode, it makes sense actually.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 7:47 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

NVDA space toggles browse mode off and on.  But if you are using sound for the notification, I don’t know which sound means what and I don’t like using sounds instead of speech in such ways.  I have NVDA set to say browse mode when it is on and focus mode when it is off.  If you want to change from sound to speech, I’ll explain how to do it. 

 

Also, by default, NVDA automatically changes from Browse Mode to focus mode and back again depending on what structures you move to in a web page and how you move.

 

I am very much against this being default behavior.  I think it is confusing to new students of NVDA and causes them to concentrate on learning when the automatic changes occur when what they should be concentrating on is when to use which mode.  Manually changing from mode to mode, in my opinion, helps create understanding and helps concentration be on what it should be on, not a secondary consideration.

 

You can change this behavior as well, if you want.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: anthony borg

Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 9:29 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

Hi gene

I am referring to the internet and brouser mode. Sorry if I wasn’t very clear with what I was asking.

Regards

 

Anthony

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 28 May 2021 14:45
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

It isn’t clear what you are asking about.  Are you asking about navigating using what in JAWS would be called the PC cursor?  You may be asking about the Internet and browse mode but that should be clarified. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: anthony borg

Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 3:18 AM

Subject: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

Hi can someone explain to me what is the commands to toggle on or off the NVDA’s normal navigation mode please?

Thanks in advance

 

Anthony


Re: NVDA Remote for iOS (was RE: [nvda] NVDARemote)

 

On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 11:53 AM, Hareth wrote:
Wrong!
-
Hareth, believe it or not, this is not aimed at you, specifically (see my previous message) but I am asking everyone to now please either steer back to the NVDA-centric, and only NVDA-centric, focus for this topic or take it to the Chat Subgroup.

We, and I included myself in this, are getting very far away from anything that's actually related to NVDA specifically and, thus, it's off-topic here.

I'd prefer not to have to lock this topic, as there could be something specific to it that someone has yet to say, but I will if I must if it remains "off the rails."
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.  The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body.  What you do and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

      ~ Brian Vogel

 


Re: NVDA Remote for iOS (was RE: [nvda] NVDARemote)

Hareth
 

Wrong!
Your implying that all NVDA remote are bunch of fools.
any app cross platforms use the same remote connection protocol are
included your blanket judgement, that includes you if you in use of
it.
All what the other platforms app developers is creating a way to
facilitate that protocol to be used from another OS.
Vulnerability to hackers is altogether a security matter need to be
dealt with by the initial development of the NVDA remote support
addon, and not by who ever try to connect to their product.
above all that smartphones by far much secured compared to windows PC.
And for tools for the utilization of NVDA support, I rarely needed
anything more than a keyboard plus the device talking to me for what
is going on on the other device to give support for most of the cases
I've dealt with.
those new methods would indeed add a new accessible tool to our arsenal.

On 5/28/21, tim <z2004a1@gmail.com> wrote:
Only if your a fool to give support without the tools you really need and a
remote on phone don't get it.

It was a fool that wanted that simpleness and a hacker made them pay for
there it10ts! That move shut down a major pipeline.

If my clients can not wait until I get to the tools I need to fix them. Then
they can find another tech! I don't do work that needs another tech to clean
up.


On 5/28/2021 9:35 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 07:39 AM, Mallard wrote:

I mean... Ever heard of providing support while on a train or the like,
thus unlikely ot have a computer handy?


Sighted people can do that. I'd love to think that blind people will be
able to do that too.
-
Other than by talking phone, no, not really. I seldom see techs doing
anything "heavy duty" remotely if not seated in front of a machine where
all the tools they use are at their disposal or are actually sitting in
front of "the patient."

I'd certainly not try to provide (sighted) remote support using my
smartphone while traveling other than to talk someone through what they
could try as DIY troubleshooting. I can't do anything significant without
a real keyboard. I doubt I'm alone in being someone who does not have
such on them, even in folding Bluetooth format, at all times.

Note well, all of the above is to address the misconception that sighted
techs are routinely providing the kind of remote support that would
typically require a computer and keyboard while out and about with only
their smartphones. I've never once encountered that. That scenario is,
in my experience and observation, about as realistic as most of the
computer hacking in entertainment where everyone gets in with about 5
second's effort.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their
actions. The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and
expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body. What you do
and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

~ Brian Vogel


locked Re: Question about SAPI 4 version of eloquence

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

I meant I can't find the download link for it.



On 5/28/2021 8:48 AM, Rosemarie Chavarria via groups.io wrote:

I can't find the sownload link for it.



On 5/28/2021 8:38 AM, Crayton Benner via groups.io wrote:
Last time I tried it, it worked fine with windows 10 no problems. 




On Friday, May 28, 2021, 11:31, Rosemarie Chavarria <knitqueen2007@...> wrote:

Will it work with windows 10 or is it for older systems?



On 5/28/2021 7:16 AM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
also did you know that viavoice outloud sapi4 tts is available to download for free on IBM's publically available and open ftp site? It's buried inside of some folders on ftp.software.ibm.com ... But yes it is there for anybody to go grab and install and use. 


locked Re: Question about SAPI 4 version of eloquence

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

I can't find the sownload link for it.



On 5/28/2021 8:38 AM, Crayton Benner via groups.io wrote:
Last time I tried it, it worked fine with windows 10 no problems. 




On Friday, May 28, 2021, 11:31, Rosemarie Chavarria <knitqueen2007@...> wrote:

Will it work with windows 10 or is it for older systems?



On 5/28/2021 7:16 AM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
also did you know that viavoice outloud sapi4 tts is available to download for free on IBM's publically available and open ftp site? It's buried inside of some folders on ftp.software.ibm.com ... But yes it is there for anybody to go grab and install and use. 


locked Re: Question about SAPI 4 version of eloquence

Crayton Benner <craybay3198@...>
 

Last time I tried it, it worked fine with windows 10 no problems. 




On Friday, May 28, 2021, 11:31, Rosemarie Chavarria <knitqueen2007@...> wrote:

Will it work with windows 10 or is it for older systems?



On 5/28/2021 7:16 AM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
also did you know that viavoice outloud sapi4 tts is available to download for free on IBM's publically available and open ftp site? It's buried inside of some folders on ftp.software.ibm.com ... But yes it is there for anybody to go grab and install and use. 


Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

Chris Smart
 

The sounds is simply another indicator of what is going on. Do the sounds associated with forms mode in Jaws bug you as well?


I hear two things in the higher pitched sound. A manual typewriter key sound, and a short square wave tone at around 1,400 Hz, or 6th octave F. the other sound for that toggle appears to be simply a short square wave at 440 Hz or rth octave A.



On 2021-05-28 11:27 a.m., Gene wrote:
If it were a typing sound, it might make more sense.  But it is something like a high pitched camera sound you might heare on a phone.  It doesn’t have any association with a mode and I find the sound to be grating and annoying. 
 
Also, for those learning NVDA, I don’t think sound should be used.  Repetition is important in learning and hearing actual words would help those learning both become more aware of the terms and perhaps be more aware of when they are in which mode. 
 
Gene
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 10:06 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode
 

The typing sound means focused mode, the bop noise means browse mode, it makes sense actually.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 7:47 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

NVDA space toggles browse mode off and on.  But if you are using sound for the notification, I don’t know which sound means what and I don’t like using sounds instead of speech in such ways.  I have NVDA set to say browse mode when it is on and focus mode when it is off.  If you want to change from sound to speech, I’ll explain how to do it. 

 

Also, by default, NVDA automatically changes from Browse Mode to focus mode and back again depending on what structures you move to in a web page and how you move.

 

I am very much against this being default behavior.  I think it is confusing to new students of NVDA and causes them to concentrate on learning when the automatic changes occur when what they should be concentrating on is when to use which mode.  Manually changing from mode to mode, in my opinion, helps create understanding and helps concentration be on what it should be on, not a secondary consideration.

 

You can change this behavior as well, if you want.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: anthony borg

Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 9:29 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

Hi gene

I am referring to the internet and brouser mode. Sorry if I wasn’t very clear with what I was asking.

Regards

 

Anthony

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 28 May 2021 14:45
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

It isn’t clear what you are asking about.  Are you asking about navigating using what in JAWS would be called the PC cursor?  You may be asking about the Internet and browse mode but that should be clarified. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: anthony borg

Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 3:18 AM

Subject: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

Hi can someone explain to me what is the commands to toggle on or off the NVDA’s normal navigation mode please?

Thanks in advance

 

Anthony


locked Re: Question about SAPI 4 version of eloquence

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Will it work with windows 10 or is it for older systems?



On 5/28/2021 7:16 AM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
also did you know that viavoice outloud sapi4 tts is available to download for free on IBM's publically available and open ftp site? It's buried inside of some folders on ftp.software.ibm.com ... But yes it is there for anybody to go grab and install and use. 


Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

Gene
 

If it were a typing sound, it might make more sense.  But it is something like a high pitched camera sound you might heare on a phone.  It doesn’t have any association with a mode and I find the sound to be grating and annoying. 
 
Also, for those learning NVDA, I don’t think sound should be used.  Repetition is important in learning and hearing actual words would help those learning both become more aware of the terms and perhaps be more aware of when they are in which mode. 
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 10:06 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode
 

The typing sound means focused mode, the bop noise means browse mode, it makes sense actually.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 7:47 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

NVDA space toggles browse mode off and on.  But if you are using sound for the notification, I don’t know which sound means what and I don’t like using sounds instead of speech in such ways.  I have NVDA set to say browse mode when it is on and focus mode when it is off.  If you want to change from sound to speech, I’ll explain how to do it. 

 

Also, by default, NVDA automatically changes from Browse Mode to focus mode and back again depending on what structures you move to in a web page and how you move.

 

I am very much against this being default behavior.  I think it is confusing to new students of NVDA and causes them to concentrate on learning when the automatic changes occur when what they should be concentrating on is when to use which mode.  Manually changing from mode to mode, in my opinion, helps create understanding and helps concentration be on what it should be on, not a secondary consideration.

 

You can change this behavior as well, if you want.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: anthony borg

Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 9:29 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

Hi gene

I am referring to the internet and brouser mode. Sorry if I wasn’t very clear with what I was asking.

Regards

 

Anthony

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 28 May 2021 14:45
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

It isn’t clear what you are asking about.  Are you asking about navigating using what in JAWS would be called the PC cursor?  You may be asking about the Internet and browse mode but that should be clarified. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: anthony borg

Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 3:18 AM

Subject: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

Hi can someone explain to me what is the commands to toggle on or off the NVDA’s normal navigation mode please?

Thanks in advance

 

Anthony


Re: nvda and latest windows update

 

On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 10:52 AM, tim wrote:
because even though everyone was told things may break. They seem to not get it!
-
And this is always the case with alpha and beta software.  The only difference this time is that we're virtually certain that specific types of breakages are going to occur in advance of their actually occurring.  There are times where this is common, and not just with NVDA.  When any kind of tectonic shift in underlying code occurs, this can and does happen.  It's a game of whack a mole for a couple of days to a couple of weeks as the next breakage pops up, gets reported, and then gets fixed.  Lather, rinse, repeat.

Things eventually settle back to normal.

But the move to NVDA 2021.1 requires the warning Bette Davis gave in All About Eve:  Fasten your seatbelts, it's going to be a bumpy night!

But that's all it's going to be.  We will have the morning after, too.

Comparing notes about what the specific bumps are can make sense at times, though.  Others, not so much.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.  The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body.  What you do and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

      ~ Brian Vogel

 


Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 11:06 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
The typing sound means focused mode, the bop noise means browse mode, it makes sense actually.
-
I agree, and I prefer it this way.  There's enough verbosity to deal with otherwise.

But, like so many things, the default can be changed if one wishes it so.  Some default needs to be picked regardless of what it may be.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.  The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body.  What you do and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

      ~ Brian Vogel

 


Re: NVDA's normal navigation mode

Sarah k Alawami
 

The typing sound means focused mode, the bop noise means browse mode, it makes sense actually.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 7:47 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

NVDA space toggles browse mode off and on.  But if you are using sound for the notification, I don’t know which sound means what and I don’t like using sounds instead of speech in such ways.  I have NVDA set to say browse mode when it is on and focus mode when it is off.  If you want to change from sound to speech, I’ll explain how to do it. 

 

Also, by default, NVDA automatically changes from Browse Mode to focus mode and back again depending on what structures you move to in a web page and how you move.

 

I am very much against this being default behavior.  I think it is confusing to new students of NVDA and causes them to concentrate on learning when the automatic changes occur when what they should be concentrating on is when to use which mode.  Manually changing from mode to mode, in my opinion, helps create understanding and helps concentration be on what it should be on, not a secondary consideration.

 

You can change this behavior as well, if you want.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 9:29 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

Hi gene

I am referring to the internet and brouser mode. Sorry if I wasn’t very clear with what I was asking.

Regards

 

Anthony

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 28 May 2021 14:45
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

It isn’t clear what you are asking about.  Are you asking about navigating using what in JAWS would be called the PC cursor?  You may be asking about the Internet and browse mode but that should be clarified. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 3:18 AM

Subject: [nvda] NVDA's normal navigation mode

 

Hi can someone explain to me what is the commands to toggle on or off the NVDA’s normal navigation mode please?

Thanks in advance

 

Anthony


Re: NVDA Remote for iOS (was RE: [nvda] NVDARemote)

Sarah k Alawami
 

Actually I would love that. I have most of the tools I need, via ssh, but I am the exception

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 6:35 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: NVDA Remote for iOS (was RE: [nvda] NVDARemote)

 

On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 07:39 AM, Mallard wrote:

I mean... Ever heard of providing support while on a train or the like, thus unlikely ot have a computer handy?


Sighted people can do that. I'd love to think that blind people will be able to do that too.

-
Other than by talking phone, no, not really.  I seldom see techs doing anything "heavy duty" remotely if not seated in front of a machine where all the tools they use are at their disposal or are actually sitting in front of "the patient."

I'd certainly not try to provide (sighted) remote support using my smartphone while traveling other than to talk someone through what they could try as DIY troubleshooting.  I can't do anything significant without a real keyboard.  I doubt I'm alone in being someone who does not have such on them, even in folding Bluetooth format, at all times.

Note well, all of the above is to address the misconception that sighted techs are routinely providing the kind of remote support that would typically require a computer and keyboard while out and about with only their smartphones.  I've never once encountered that.  That scenario is, in my experience and observation, about as realistic as most of the computer hacking in entertainment where everyone gets in with about 5 second's effort.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

I do not understand why some seek to separate a person from their actions.  The self is composed of an individual’s thoughts, actions, and expression, which are contained in and actuated by the body.  What you do and say is the clearest indicator of who you are.

      ~ Brian Vogel

 

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