Date   

Advisory: if upgrading to Windows 10 Version 1803, NVDA 2018.1.1 is required

 

Hi everyone,

 

The following advisory is rated “major” due to high impact:

 

Toward end of development for Windows 10 Version 1803, Microsoft changed a critical component in Windows OneCore speech synthesizer (specifically, bitrate). This causes OneCore synthesizer to sound a bit funny, including higher pitch. NV Access has just released a release candidate for NVDA 2018.1.1 which will correct this problem. Because of this, you need to be running 2018.1.1 for best experience with Windows 10 Version 1803.

 

Thank you.

Cheers,

Jospeh


Re: I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

Sharni-Lee Ward
 

Correction, I have a github account that I just found again. I'd clean forgotten the password but I was able to recover it. I'll have to make several separate issues to cover the things I've noticed. Hope I won't be too annoying...


On 28/03/2018 11:07 AM, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:
That's a lot of work! I'm sorry for my judgmental initial subject line. It's just that I was very very used to the way Espeak pronounced words like "Possible," beforehand (I was only reminded of this after sending the other messages on this topic) and the slurring in certain words and phrases was very distracting for me. I'm getting accustomed to it, but that doesn't necessarily mean I like it.

It's becoming clear to me, as this thread goes on, that less people use Espeak NG than I had assumed. I figured, since it was the default synth that came with NVDA, that more people used it, and therefore more people would notice the oddities, and therefore you'd heard this stuff before a lot of times. I also didn't know how much work was being done behind the scenes, although in hindsight that was an assumption on my part and I apologise. I still want these issues to be fixed, but throwing a fit the way I did wasn't really helpful to anyone, and I apologise for that, too.

I don't have a Github account, or know the terms used to explain stuff on there. Most of what I see on the Espeak NG dev list confuses the heck out of me. xD

As for the person that said Espeak sounded very mechanical, I'll admit that's part of the reason I use Linda almost exclusively. The other female variants either sound overly synthetic or have weird echos/breathiness that sounds even odder to me. The male variants didn't play nicely with maxed inflection, and anyways, as a woman, I like my computer to have a female voice. So Linda it is. Once you get used to her, she's like an old friend, although I admit she sounds very robotic coming out of speakers.

On 28/03/2018 5:17 AM, Reece H. Dunn wrote:
On Mon, Mar 26, 2018 at 01:42 am, Shaun Everiss wrote:
Espeakng is nice, better than espeak but I do wish the pronounciations
could be corrected, I mean there was nothing wrong with the old ones.
Taking the regression in the pronunciation of "resignedly" as an example, this was caused by a fix to words like "allegedly" and "reputedly" that were misporounced in espeak. The issue is that those words without the -edly suffix end in an 'e', while "resignedly" does not. The fix ended up adding an 'e' to "resign" when removing the -edly suffix, causing it to sound strange. I did not detect this because the word list I was using to compare the old and new pronunciations did not contain "resignedly".

If there are any pronunciations that are wrong, let me know and I can fix them (even if you just say which words they are). If you say things like "espeak-ng sounds wrong", or "espeak-ng is broken", then I cannot fix that as I don't know what needs changing.

Additionally, from espeak I have fixed the pronunciations for: manoeuvred, reckon, Frances (the name), sponging, Southend, Austen, aurora, recollect, ignoramus, straightforward, hippopotamuses, multiple, muse, soothsay, Orion. eta. theta. zeta, lambda, delta, thermal, sage, palazzo, cherish, resemble, visage, egress, chew, praiseworthy, racquet(ball), pureblood, d's, h's, k's, o's, p's, t's, y's, z's, and more. I have also fixed sir, nosir, and yessir in the Scottish English accent.



Re: I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

Sharni-Lee Ward
 

That's a lot of work! I'm sorry for my judgmental initial subject line. It's just that I was very very used to the way Espeak pronounced words like "Possible," beforehand (I was only reminded of this after sending the other messages on this topic) and the slurring in certain words and phrases was very distracting for me. I'm getting accustomed to it, but that doesn't necessarily mean I like it.

It's becoming clear to me, as this thread goes on, that less people use Espeak NG than I had assumed. I figured, since it was the default synth that came with NVDA, that more people used it, and therefore more people would notice the oddities, and therefore you'd heard this stuff before a lot of times. I also didn't know how much work was being done behind the scenes, although in hindsight that was an assumption on my part and I apologise. I still want these issues to be fixed, but throwing a fit the way I did wasn't really helpful to anyone, and I apologise for that, too.

I don't have a Github account, or know the terms used to explain stuff on there. Most of what I see on the Espeak NG dev list confuses the heck out of me. xD

As for the person that said Espeak sounded very mechanical, I'll admit that's part of the reason I use Linda almost exclusively. The other female variants either sound overly synthetic or have weird echos/breathiness that sounds even odder to me. The male variants didn't play nicely with maxed inflection, and anyways, as a woman, I like my computer to have a female voice. So Linda it is. Once you get used to her, she's like an old friend, although I admit she sounds very robotic coming out of speakers.

On 28/03/2018 5:17 AM, Reece H. Dunn wrote:
On Mon, Mar 26, 2018 at 01:42 am, Shaun Everiss wrote:
Espeakng is nice, better than espeak but I do wish the pronounciations
could be corrected, I mean there was nothing wrong with the old ones.
Taking the regression in the pronunciation of "resignedly" as an example, this was caused by a fix to words like "allegedly" and "reputedly" that were misporounced in espeak. The issue is that those words without the -edly suffix end in an 'e', while "resignedly" does not. The fix ended up adding an 'e' to "resign" when removing the -edly suffix, causing it to sound strange. I did not detect this because the word list I was using to compare the old and new pronunciations did not contain "resignedly".

If there are any pronunciations that are wrong, let me know and I can fix them (even if you just say which words they are). If you say things like "espeak-ng sounds wrong", or "espeak-ng is broken", then I cannot fix that as I don't know what needs changing.

Additionally, from espeak I have fixed the pronunciations for: manoeuvred, reckon, Frances (the name), sponging, Southend, Austen, aurora, recollect, ignoramus, straightforward, hippopotamuses, multiple, muse, soothsay, Orion. eta. theta. zeta, lambda, delta, thermal, sage, palazzo, cherish, resemble, visage, egress, chew, praiseworthy, racquet(ball), pureblood, d's, h's, k's, o's, p's, t's, y's, z's, and more. I have also fixed sir, nosir, and yessir in the Scottish English accent.


Re: email list for open office users

Tony Ballou
 

Hi Rosemarie, 


No problem, the calc shortcut keys are up now. They are the same in both programs I  think, which is why there's only one file.   


Tony

On 3/27/2018 12:50 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

Oh wow! I'm looking forward to the shorcut keys for kelp. They'll come in handy--especially since I want to start creating a budget. Thanks so much for all your help.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tony Ballou
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 7:02 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] email list for open office users

 

Hi Gang,

 

I've got the keyboard shortcuts for open and libre office writer coming up. They will be in separate posts that way there's no room for confusion. Will have the open and libre office calc shortcuts for you once I get back from working out. 

 

Tony

 

 

On 3/27/2018 2:13 AM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

You're right. The list of shortcut keys for open office and libre office will be helpful for all of us.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ervin, Glenn
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2018 8:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] email list for open office users

 

That sort of thing is not a clutter to the list, it will help all.

I save such list messages for later reference.

Glenn

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tony Ballou
Sent: Sunday, March 25, 2018 10:47 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] email list for open office users

 

Hi Guys,

 

Let me dig them up and I'll make sure you get them. 

 

Tony

 

On 3/25/2018 6:47 PM, David Moore wrote:

I would really like those key commands as well Please!

I am very interested in using both and picking which one appeals to me more!

Thanks a lot, in advance.

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Sunday, March 25, 2018 4:42 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] email list for open office users

 

Hi, Tony,

 

I'd love to have a list of the keyboard shortcuts for both open office and libre office. If you'd like, you can send them to me off list so we don't clutter up the list. My email address is knitqueen2007@....

 

Rosemarie

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tony Ballou
Sent: Sunday, March 25, 2018 12:20 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] email list for open office users

 

Hi Rosemarie, 

 

I've been messing around with both open and libre offices writers for about 1 year and a half or so, and found keyboard shortcut lists for both.  I also found the keyboard shortcuts for open office calc.  If you want I can send you those.  I'm not sure if there is an email list, for blind users of these programs though.  I haven't seen anything come across the boards about one. It would be interesting to know if such list are out there. 

 

Tony

On 3/23/2018 3:20 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:

Hi, everyone,

 

Is there an email list for open office users? I'd especially like to learn kelp and writer.

 

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

Rosemarie

 

 

 

 

 

 



Re: Qwiklabs virtual machines

Günther Rühmann
 

Hello Ali,

I am working on a virtual Desktop in a VMWare environment. NVDA works fine excelt the log on window on a linux-based zero Client. - with this exceütopn everything works fine.

Best regards
Günther

Am 27.03.2018 um 18:56 schrieb Ali Colak <alish54@gmail.com>:

Hello all,
I am currently doing a course where I have to work with virtual
instances of windows and Linux on google Qwiklabs environment. I have
tried both using Google's chrome environment with the RDP ap, and
tried using the windows remote ap. neither works with a screen reader.
Any suggestions? I know that some people have worked before with
bootable virtual machines before, but they were booting from an actual
physical drive and not connecting remotely I believe.
Thanks for your help
Ali



Re: I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

Gene
 

The add on is poor because there are lots of artifacts in the Eloquence speech. 
 
To other points, you have made certain statements that need further consideration.  Slowness in the SAPI version may be a problem on some machines and not others.  Some people complain of slow responsiveness and others not.  In a lot of cases, you can't generalize from one or two experiences of people.  I've mentioned the SAPI 5 demo a number of times but I haven't given any information on questions like responsiveness because I've seen reports that cancel each other out.  But the demo is available for anyone to try.
 
Regarding the NVDA dictionary, have you tested to see how well entries are read that have been done with E-Speak running with other synthesizers?  I haven't.  But without actual testing or reading reports from people who tested properly for a specific synthesizer, I wouldn't say anything except to try NVDA, the copy containing your dictionary, with the demo, and see how well it works.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Brandon Cross
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 10:33 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

I don't know where to begin, so I'll just pick a point in all this thread and go from there. It is not logical to assume the developers will make a change for just one person, therefore, might I suggest creating an issue on github with specific problems bullet pointed, and ask everyone in the list to look at this and reply to the issue if they have similar problems. To whoever was saying whether or not Eloquence dictionaries will be applied to eSPeak ones or not, no, definitely not, Eloquence has hard and fast rules and is most inflexible in changing its pronunciation, eSpeak bends more easily, so the same modifications you would need to make eSpeak say a name correctly would most likely not work in Eloquence. I would recommend against buying a sapi addon unless it will only be used for long reading, as navigating the system and so forth, these voices have too much latency to be practical. I would also recommend against purchasing the vocalizer / eloquence addon for NVDA made by code factory. This addon is quite frankly junk. The Eloquence portion of it crackles and pops, and this behavior has been tested on two machines. It also uses extremely long pauses at punctuation marks like a comma or period. It cannot be configured to be shorter.

One option left to the OP is to obtain NVDA from source code via github and they would then have the ability to place whatever version of eSpeak they would wish to use, then build it. This is a long view scenario, and would require certain knowledge of how to clone a git repository, as well as using scons to build it. Also, the repo doesn't come with scons, so finding that is another challenge.

I don't use eSpeak, I don't like it, can't stand it, never could. Now, aside from that, I have noticed an unpleasant quality of the voice that appears in most variants since the switch to NG. I cannot describe this quality accurately. Suffice it to say that it appears almost as a random series of very light clicks is injected into the speech stream. This is highly distracting as it just sounds terrible. Again, this has been tested on at least 3 machines and found to be the case among all of them. Keeping in mind that this machine has no trouble running higher quality human sounding concatinative synths, so I doubt its a performance issue. I have cooked up my own variants and they are affected as well. Maybe I will record it, because I can't put it into words, it is definitely not the voice crackling, or breaking up, it is as if someone hijacked the audiostream, modifying it memory to include these tiny little clicks and then let it pass to the sound card that way.


On Tue, Mar 27, 2018 at 10:43 AM, Ervin, Glenn <glenn.ervin@...> wrote:
If I run it too fast, I may understand it all, but I cannot retain the information, my puny brain needs time to process it for retention.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Shaun Everiss
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 2:14 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

I know people that can run speech as fast as it would go, 300-600 wpm.

But I was never able to do that, when in university, I ran at 200-300wpm at a stretch.

Once out of university I dropped back to 120, simply put yes I could get the gist but I could never understand things at that speed.

As an admin and support person I need to understand what the heck my speech is saying.

Testing websites and stuff will give me inaccessible things, broken things and really bad things, running fast will not get me anywhere.




On 27/03/2018 7:29 p.m., Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:
> Well, it's a good thing the only career I intend on having is that of a fantasy writer, then, isn't it? :D
>
> On 27/03/2018 5:05 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:
> If you had a job that involved listening like a customer service rep, you'd have no choice but to get used to listening to your screen reader at a faster speed.
>
>
>
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Sharni-Lee Ward
> Sent: Monday, March 26, 2018 1:19 PM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Subject: Re: [nvda] I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?
>
>
> I'll admit I've not heard Eloquence outside of Jaws and the addon I was sent some years back. I didn't know the version in Jaws was different to Eloquence on its own. The one in the addon I have doesn't pause very long between sentences. Also, I just do not like to speed up my synth too much. I still think of how some of you can listen to something at the highest rate possible and understand it. I've tried increasing it a little, but it's just not enjoyable for me.
>
>
>
> That said, I'm now very used to Espeak, and it may not be an improvement over Eloquence in the opinion of some, but it was definitely an improvement over Microsoft Anna, which was what I had been stuck with via Narrator until I discovered NVDA. Espeak is the voice of NVDA to me now, and other synths fall short in many ways.
>
> On 26/03/2018 7:20 PM, Gene wrote:
> You wrote:
> I don't like Eloquence because it isn't as crisp as Espeak. I have compared
> it to A.M radio in the past, and Espeak to FM/CD Quality sound.
>
> That is a very inaccurate comparison.  E-Speak has more high end in the s sounds and the voice may have a little more high end but hardly comparable to FM radio or CD quality sound.  and why is the difference of perhaps two thousand or three thousand KHZ, by my estimate, from, let's say, around 7000KHZ in Eloquence to about nine hundred or one thousand KHZ in E-Speak of any real importance?  I would imagine you talk on the phone without worrying about such things.
>
> Eloquence has much better understandability of speech at higher speeds, and pronounces a lot more words correctly.
>
> Also, I don't know if you are talking about Eloquence as modified by the producers of JAWS or Eloquence, as it is unmodified.  The JAWS designers customized it.  If you are saying it isn't crisp because you are thinking of JAWS Eloquence, that's not an accurate representation of what unmodified Eloquence sounds like. Also, the JAWS modifiers took out pauses at periods.  That seriously degrades reading, that the modified version doesn't pause at periods.
>
> You may be pleasantly surprised if you try the demo of the HTML version.  If you haven't heard unmodified Eloquence, you don't know what it really sounds like.
>
> Gene
>
>
>









Keyboard shortcuts for open and libre office calc

Tony Ballou
 

Hi folks,


Here's the second half of this ballgame. 


Tony


Open and libre office calc keyboard shortcuts

Open office and libre office calc keyboard shortcuts

 

 Modifier Key

Key

Description of shortcut

  Shift

1

Two decimal places, thousands separator

  Shift

2

Standard exponential format

  Shift

3

Standard date format

  Shift

4

Standard currency format

  Shift

5

Standard percentage format (two decimal places)

  Shift

6

Standard format

Alt  

C

Copies or moves the current field into the “column” area

Alt  

D

Copies or moves the current field into the “data” area

 

Delete

Removes the current field from the area

 

Down Arrow

Moves the focus down one item in the current dialog area

 

Down Arrow

Moves the current field down one place

 

End

Selects the last field in the current layout area

 

End

Move the current field to the last place

 

Home

Selects the first field in the current layout area

 

Home

Moves the current field to the first place

 

Left Arrow

Moves the focus one item to the left in the current dialog area

 

Left Arrow

Moves the current field one place to the left

Alt  

O

Displays the options for the current field

Alt  

R

Copies or moves the current field into the “row” area

 

Right Arrow

Moves the focus one item to the right in the current dialog area

 

Right Arrow

Moves the current field one place to the right

 

Tab

Changes the focus by moving forwards through the areas and buttons of the dialog

  Shift

Tab

Changes the focus by moving backwards through the areas and buttons of the dialog

 

Up Arrow

Moves the focus up one item in the current dialog area

 

Up Arrow

Moves the current field up one place

Alt  

Down Arrow

Increases the height of current row

 

F1

Displays the ooo help browser. When the help browser is already open f1 jumps to the main help page

  Shift

F1

Displays context help

 

F1

Displays the note that is attached to the current cell

 

F11

Opens the styles and formatting window where you can apply a formatting style to the contents of the cell or to the current sheet

  Shift

F11

Creates a document template

  Shift

F11

Updates the templates

 

F12

Groups the selected data range

 

F12

Ungroups the selected data range

 

F2

Switches to edit mode and places the cursor at the end of the contents of the current cell. If the cursor is in an input box in a dialog that has a minimize button, the dialog is hidden and the input box remains visible. Press f2 again to show the whole dialog

 

F2

Opens the function wizard

  Shift

F2

Moves the cursor to the input line where you can enter a formula for the current cell

 

F3

Opens the define names dialog

 

F4

Shows or hides the database sources menu

  Shift

F4

Rearranges the relative or absolute references (for example, a1, $a$1, $a1, a$1) in the input field

 

F5

Shows or hides the navigator

  Shift

F5

Traces dependents

  Shift

F5

Moves the cursor to the name box

 

F7

Checks spelling in the current sheet

  Shift

F7

Traces precedents

 

F7

Opens the thesaurus if the current cell contains text

 

F8

Turns additional selection mode on or off. In this mode, you can use the arrow keys to extend the selection. You can also click in another cell to extend the selection

 

F8

Highlights cells containing numeric values (not text)

 

F9

Recalculates all of the formulas in the sheet

 

F9

Updates the selected chart


Re: Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

Tony Ballou
 

Hi,


Open and libre office are both freeware, and come with the following apps:

writer, which is a word processor, calc which is a spreadsheet program,
Math which is used to create formulas, impress which is a presentation
package, a drawing program, and a database program. Hope this helps.


Tony

.

On 3/27/2018 1:06 PM, Casey wrote:
hi what all comes with open office and is it all free?

Also how well does it work with Jaws 2018 as well?




On 3/27/2018 9:32 AM, zahra wrote:
hi.
thanks so much for list of shortcuts.
for users who want to download libreoffice:
www.libreoffice.org/download
God bless you all!

On 3/27/18, Kerryn Gunness via Groups.Io
<k_gunness=yahoo.ca@groups.io> wrote:
very nice
where could i downlode lebrea office?

   ----- Original Message -----
   From: Tony Ballou
   To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
   Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 10:12 AM
   Subject: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer


   Hi,




   Here are the keyboard shortcuts for Libre office writer.





   Tony







                           Keyboard shortcuts for Libre office writer



               Keyboard shortcut

   Command



   Control-a

    Select All



   Control-b

   Bold text



   Control-c

   Copies highlighted Text to the clipboard

   Control-x

   Cuts highlighted text to the clipboard

   Control-v

    Pastes the highlighted text from the clipboard to the location
that you
specify



   keep in mind that when the text is copied, it appears in both the
original
and the specified location.

   When the text is cut it appears in the specified location only



   Control-Shift-v

   Paste Special

   pastes formatting, and formatted text from the clipboard



   control-alt-shift-V

   Pastes unformatted text from the clipboard



     control-E

   Centers text



   Control f

   Find text



   Control            -g

   Go To



   control-H

   Find and replace Text



   Control-I

   Italicize text



   Control-J

   Justify Text



   Control-l

   Left align text



   Control-r

   Right align text



   Control-n

   Creates a new blank Document



   Control-o

   Brings up the open file dialog box



   Control-P

   Brings up the Print Dialog box



   Control-S

   Saves the current open Document.  If it is a new one, the save as
dialog
box will open where you can give it a specific file name, save it
with a
specific file format extension such as .txt, .rtf, .doc, .docx, or
in the
case  of programs like open and libre office, .odt; and a specific
location
such as a folder on your hard drive, or external storage device.



    Control u

   Underlines text



   Control-y

    redoes your last action



   control-z

    undoes your last action



   Control-Shift-P

   inserts superscript



   Control-shift-b

   Inserts subscript



   Control-Enter

   Page break



   Navigation Keyboard shortcuts



   left arrow

   moves one character to the left



   shift-left arrow

   highlights the character to the left



   Right arrow

   moves one character to the right

   Shift-right arrow

   Highlights the character to the right



   up arrow

   moves up one line



   Shift-up arrow

   Highlights text in an upward direction



   Down arrow

   Moves down one line



   Shift-down arrow

   Highlights text in a downward direction



   Control -left arrow

   moves one word to the left



   control-right arrow

   moves one word to the right



   Control-shift-left arrow

   Highlights the word to the left



   Control-Shift-right arrow

   Highlights the word to the right



   Control-up arrow

   moves to the beginning of the previous paragraph



   Control-shift-up arrow

    highlights the text to the beginning of the paragraph

   Control-Down arrow

   Moves to the end of the paragraph



   Control-Shift-down arrow

   Highlights the text to the end of the paragraph



   Home

   Moves to the beginning of the line

    shift-home

   Highlights the text from the cursor position to the beginning of
the line



    End

   Moves  to the end of the line

   Shift-end

   Highlights the text from the cursor position to the end of the line



   Control-home

   moves the cursor to the beginning of the document





   Control-End

   Moves the cursor to the end of the document



   Control-shift-home

   Highlights the text from the cursor position to the beginning of the
document



   Control-shift-end

   highlights the text from the cursor position to the end of the
document



   Page up

   moves the cursor up one screen

   (this is approximately 24 lines)



   Page down

   Moves the cursor down one screen

   (This is approximately 24 lines)



   Shift-page up

   Highlights the text up by one screen



   Shift-page down

   Highlights the text down by one screen



   Control-Backspace

   Ce



   Deletes the text to the beginning of the word



   Control-delete

   Deletes the text to the end of the word



   Control-shift-backspace

   deletes the text to the beginning of the sentence



   Control-shift Delete

   Deletes the text to the end of a sentence

















Re: Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

JM Casey <crystallogic@...>
 

Hi.
Neither Open office nor Libre Office contain an e-mail program within their suites.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Casey
Sent: March 27, 2018 4:13 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

Hi what does it have for e-mail programs?




On 3/27/2018 2:58 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:
Hi,

Open office has writer (for word processing), impress (like PowerPoint), draw (for pictures), kelp (like excel), formula ((for doing math equations) and database. Open office is free and open source. I don't use jaws so I don't know how well it works with it.

Hope this helps somewhat.

Rosemarie

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Casey
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 10:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

hi what all comes with open office and is it all free?

Also how well does it work with Jaws 2018 as well?




On 3/27/2018 9:32 AM, zahra wrote:
hi.
thanks so much for list of shortcuts.
for users who want to download libreoffice:
www.libreoffice.org/download
God bless you all!

On 3/27/18, Kerryn Gunness via Groups.Io <k_gunness=yahoo.ca@groups.io> wrote:
very nice
where could i downlode lebrea office?

----- Original Message -----
From: Tony Ballou
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 10:12 AM
Subject: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer


Hi,




Here are the keyboard shortcuts for Libre office writer.





Tony







Keyboard shortcuts for Libre office
writer



Keyboard shortcut

Command



Control-a

Select All



Control-b

Bold text



Control-c

Copies highlighted Text to the clipboard

Control-x

Cuts highlighted text to the clipboard

Control-v

Pastes the highlighted text from the clipboard to the location
that you specify



keep in mind that when the text is copied, it appears in both
the original and the specified location.

When the text is cut it appears in the specified location only



Control-Shift-v

Paste Special

pastes formatting, and formatted text from the clipboard



control-alt-shift-V

Pastes unformatted text from the clipboard



control-E

Centers text



Control f

Find text



Control -g

Go To



control-H

Find and replace Text



Control-I

Italicize text



Control-J

Justify Text



Control-l

Left align text



Control-r

Right align text



Control-n

Creates a new blank Document



Control-o

Brings up the open file dialog box



Control-P

Brings up the Print Dialog box



Control-S

Saves the current open Document. If it is a new one, the save
as dialog box will open where you can give it a specific file name,
save it with a specific file format extension such as .txt, .rtf,
.doc, .docx, or in the case of programs like open and libre office,
.odt; and a specific location such as a folder on your hard drive, or external storage device.



Control u

Underlines text



Control-y

redoes your last action



control-z

undoes your last action



Control-Shift-P

inserts superscript



Control-shift-b

Inserts subscript



Control-Enter

Page break



Navigation Keyboard shortcuts



left arrow

moves one character to the left



shift-left arrow

highlights the character to the left



Right arrow

moves one character to the right

Shift-right arrow

Highlights the character to the right



up arrow

moves up one line



Shift-up arrow

Highlights text in an upward direction



Down arrow

Moves down one line



Shift-down arrow

Highlights text in a downward direction



Control -left arrow

moves one word to the left



control-right arrow

moves one word to the right



Control-shift-left arrow

Highlights the word to the left



Control-Shift-right arrow

Highlights the word to the right



Control-up arrow

moves to the beginning of the previous paragraph



Control-shift-up arrow

highlights the text to the beginning of the paragraph

Control-Down arrow

Moves to the end of the paragraph



Control-Shift-down arrow

Highlights the text to the end of the paragraph



Home

Moves to the beginning of the line

shift-home

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the beginning of
the line



End

Moves to the end of the line

Shift-end

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the end of the
line



Control-home

moves the cursor to the beginning of the document





Control-End

Moves the cursor to the end of the document



Control-shift-home

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the beginning of
the document



Control-shift-end

highlights the text from the cursor position to the end of the
document



Page up

moves the cursor up one screen

(this is approximately 24 lines)



Page down

Moves the cursor down one screen

(This is approximately 24 lines)



Shift-page up

Highlights the text up by one screen



Shift-page down

Highlights the text down by one screen



Control-Backspace

Ce



Deletes the text to the beginning of the word



Control-delete

Deletes the text to the end of the word



Control-shift-backspace

deletes the text to the beginning of the sentence



Control-shift Delete

Deletes the text to the end of a sentence
















--

Casey


Re: Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

Casey <cwollner@...>
 

Hi what does it have for e-mail programs?

On 3/27/2018 2:58 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:
Hi,

Open office has writer (for word processing), impress (like PowerPoint), draw (for pictures), kelp (like excel), formula ((for doing math equations) and database. Open office is free and open source. I don't use jaws so I don't know how well it works with it.

Hope this helps somewhat.

Rosemarie

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Casey
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 10:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

hi what all comes with open office and is it all free?

Also how well does it work with Jaws 2018 as well?




On 3/27/2018 9:32 AM, zahra wrote:
hi.
thanks so much for list of shortcuts.
for users who want to download libreoffice:
www.libreoffice.org/download
God bless you all!

On 3/27/18, Kerryn Gunness via Groups.Io <k_gunness=yahoo.ca@groups.io> wrote:
very nice
where could i downlode lebrea office?

----- Original Message -----
From: Tony Ballou
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 10:12 AM
Subject: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer


Hi,




Here are the keyboard shortcuts for Libre office writer.





Tony







Keyboard shortcuts for Libre office writer



Keyboard shortcut

Command



Control-a

Select All



Control-b

Bold text



Control-c

Copies highlighted Text to the clipboard

Control-x

Cuts highlighted text to the clipboard

Control-v

Pastes the highlighted text from the clipboard to the location
that you specify



keep in mind that when the text is copied, it appears in both the
original and the specified location.

When the text is cut it appears in the specified location only



Control-Shift-v

Paste Special

pastes formatting, and formatted text from the clipboard



control-alt-shift-V

Pastes unformatted text from the clipboard



control-E

Centers text



Control f

Find text



Control -g

Go To



control-H

Find and replace Text



Control-I

Italicize text



Control-J

Justify Text



Control-l

Left align text



Control-r

Right align text



Control-n

Creates a new blank Document



Control-o

Brings up the open file dialog box



Control-P

Brings up the Print Dialog box



Control-S

Saves the current open Document. If it is a new one, the save as
dialog box will open where you can give it a specific file name, save
it with a specific file format extension such as .txt, .rtf, .doc,
.docx, or in the case of programs like open and libre office, .odt;
and a specific location such as a folder on your hard drive, or external storage device.



Control u

Underlines text



Control-y

redoes your last action



control-z

undoes your last action



Control-Shift-P

inserts superscript



Control-shift-b

Inserts subscript



Control-Enter

Page break



Navigation Keyboard shortcuts



left arrow

moves one character to the left



shift-left arrow

highlights the character to the left



Right arrow

moves one character to the right

Shift-right arrow

Highlights the character to the right



up arrow

moves up one line



Shift-up arrow

Highlights text in an upward direction



Down arrow

Moves down one line



Shift-down arrow

Highlights text in a downward direction



Control -left arrow

moves one word to the left



control-right arrow

moves one word to the right



Control-shift-left arrow

Highlights the word to the left



Control-Shift-right arrow

Highlights the word to the right



Control-up arrow

moves to the beginning of the previous paragraph



Control-shift-up arrow

highlights the text to the beginning of the paragraph

Control-Down arrow

Moves to the end of the paragraph



Control-Shift-down arrow

Highlights the text to the end of the paragraph



Home

Moves to the beginning of the line

shift-home

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the beginning of
the line



End

Moves to the end of the line

Shift-end

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the end of the
line



Control-home

moves the cursor to the beginning of the document





Control-End

Moves the cursor to the end of the document



Control-shift-home

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the beginning of
the document



Control-shift-end

highlights the text from the cursor position to the end of the
document



Page up

moves the cursor up one screen

(this is approximately 24 lines)



Page down

Moves the cursor down one screen

(This is approximately 24 lines)



Shift-page up

Highlights the text up by one screen



Shift-page down

Highlights the text down by one screen



Control-Backspace

Ce



Deletes the text to the beginning of the word



Control-delete

Deletes the text to the end of the word



Control-shift-backspace

deletes the text to the beginning of the sentence



Control-shift Delete

Deletes the text to the end of a sentence
















--

Casey


Re: Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

JM Casey <crystallogic@...>
 

I'm just trying Open office for the first time. So far only taken the word processor, Writer, for a spin. It seems very accessible, though I have heard it will not tell you as much information about graphics if you use a screen-reader. It seems to work well with both nVDA and JAWS 18 (I don't have JAWS 2018, but I imagine the results will be much the same). I think people will like the old-style menus, if you're one of those who hates Microsoft's ribbons. I don't hate them, but I confess the old menus seem less clunky from my perspective.

Now, anyone got any opinions on Open Office VS Libre Office? They seem quite similar suites.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: March 27, 2018 3:58 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

Hi,

Open office has writer (for word processing), impress (like PowerPoint), draw (for pictures), kelp (like excel), formula ((for doing math equations) and database. Open office is free and open source. I don't use jaws so I don't know how well it works with it.

Hope this helps somewhat.

Rosemarie

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Casey
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 10:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

hi what all comes with open office and is it all free?

Also how well does it work with Jaws 2018 as well?




On 3/27/2018 9:32 AM, zahra wrote:
hi.
thanks so much for list of shortcuts.
for users who want to download libreoffice:
www.libreoffice.org/download
God bless you all!

On 3/27/18, Kerryn Gunness via Groups.Io <k_gunness=yahoo.ca@groups.io> wrote:
very nice
where could i downlode lebrea office?

----- Original Message -----
From: Tony Ballou
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 10:12 AM
Subject: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer


Hi,




Here are the keyboard shortcuts for Libre office writer.





Tony







Keyboard shortcuts for Libre office writer



Keyboard shortcut

Command



Control-a

Select All



Control-b

Bold text



Control-c

Copies highlighted Text to the clipboard

Control-x

Cuts highlighted text to the clipboard

Control-v

Pastes the highlighted text from the clipboard to the location
that you specify



keep in mind that when the text is copied, it appears in both the
original and the specified location.

When the text is cut it appears in the specified location only



Control-Shift-v

Paste Special

pastes formatting, and formatted text from the clipboard



control-alt-shift-V

Pastes unformatted text from the clipboard



control-E

Centers text



Control f

Find text



Control -g

Go To



control-H

Find and replace Text



Control-I

Italicize text



Control-J

Justify Text



Control-l

Left align text



Control-r

Right align text



Control-n

Creates a new blank Document



Control-o

Brings up the open file dialog box



Control-P

Brings up the Print Dialog box



Control-S

Saves the current open Document. If it is a new one, the save as
dialog box will open where you can give it a specific file name, save
it with a specific file format extension such as .txt, .rtf, .doc,
.docx, or in the case of programs like open and libre office, .odt;
and a specific location such as a folder on your hard drive, or external storage device.



Control u

Underlines text



Control-y

redoes your last action



control-z

undoes your last action



Control-Shift-P

inserts superscript



Control-shift-b

Inserts subscript



Control-Enter

Page break



Navigation Keyboard shortcuts



left arrow

moves one character to the left



shift-left arrow

highlights the character to the left



Right arrow

moves one character to the right

Shift-right arrow

Highlights the character to the right



up arrow

moves up one line



Shift-up arrow

Highlights text in an upward direction



Down arrow

Moves down one line



Shift-down arrow

Highlights text in a downward direction



Control -left arrow

moves one word to the left



control-right arrow

moves one word to the right



Control-shift-left arrow

Highlights the word to the left



Control-Shift-right arrow

Highlights the word to the right



Control-up arrow

moves to the beginning of the previous paragraph



Control-shift-up arrow

highlights the text to the beginning of the paragraph

Control-Down arrow

Moves to the end of the paragraph



Control-Shift-down arrow

Highlights the text to the end of the paragraph



Home

Moves to the beginning of the line

shift-home

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the beginning of
the line



End

Moves to the end of the line

Shift-end

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the end of the
line



Control-home

moves the cursor to the beginning of the document





Control-End

Moves the cursor to the end of the document



Control-shift-home

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the beginning of
the document



Control-shift-end

highlights the text from the cursor position to the end of the
document



Page up

moves the cursor up one screen

(this is approximately 24 lines)



Page down

Moves the cursor down one screen

(This is approximately 24 lines)



Shift-page up

Highlights the text up by one screen



Shift-page down

Highlights the text down by one screen



Control-Backspace

Ce



Deletes the text to the beginning of the word



Control-delete

Deletes the text to the end of the word



Control-shift-backspace

deletes the text to the beginning of the sentence



Control-shift Delete

Deletes the text to the end of a sentence
















--

Casey


Re: microsoft turn round on skype

Gene New Zealand <hurrikennyandopo@...>
 

Hi


Or we could also learn to use the app version if using windows 10 or the web version which seems pretty accessible so far. As long as you install the plug in for the web browser.


Gene nz



On 3/28/2018 7:17 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:
Well the issue aparently was in its installer.

So ms seems to have fixed it and lets hope classic skype continues for some time yet even if it never changes, even if its never updated I can take that.

In fact unless its needed we as blind people really don't need skype updated anyway for what we use it for.




On 28/03/2018 3:18 a.m., Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
I have a feeling a lot of people got into contact with Microsoft who used Skype 7 as an accessible program for blind who were employed, and think of the scandal if the news hit the streets that blind people put out of Work by crazy Microsoft decision?

Not good on the brownie points and probably not much help for those working in government departments using it if blind as well.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 2:03 AM
Subject: [nvda] microsoft turn round on skype


Hi all.

Today I recieved a skype update.

I was surprised I thought ms had abandond skype 7.

But no, aparently not.

If you download skype select the tablet tab and you can get classic skype.

I updated from skype itself, and I still had skype classic.

What this means, is interesting in itself.

We can choose classic again, I do wander if people complained to ms a lot and they finally saw reason.

For me it means at least for the short term till ms decides to plonk skype classic yet again I can continue to work with skype classic on win7 and maybe on 10.

I am not apposed to updating skype, but skype7 is accessible, and I have been using it for ages.

Bar the occasional calls and such there are a lot of things skype 8 and uaps are missing.

Maybe its the big improvement ms is making with skype, and maybe they realise they are not there yet.

Fact is, skype just got an update dispite what they said about an insecure installer.

That for me at least for now means progress.

Eventually I will probably get a smartphone maybe an ios device, the fact is I will have loads of uses for other forms of communication.

If skype gets to rubbish, I may simply close down skype entirely.

My ms account's main focus is mainly for knfb reader but to be hones bar the apps I purchaced there is little keeping me and microsoft online friends at all.

It used to be music, music, apps, skype.

Now its just some apps and with the apps being well who knows, and no music, there is just 1 app I brought, and skype.

Hardly any of my contacts talk on skype with me anymore bar the nvda dev group, and if it gets to hairy I will get rid of that group, there were also test groups about to for different things but I will now try to find nonskype things to do the tests with.















--
Check out my website for NVDA tutorials and other blindness related material at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net Regardless of where you are in New Zealand if you are near one of the APNK sites you can use a copy of the NVDA screen reader on one of their computers. To find out which locations (or location) is near to you please visit http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries (Aotearoa People's Network Kaharoa). To find an NVDA certified expert near you, please visit the following link https://certification.nvaccess.org/. The certification page contains the official list of NVDA certified individuals from around the world, who have sat and successfully passed the NVDA expert exam.


Re: Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Hi,

Open office has writer (for word processing), impress (like PowerPoint), draw (for pictures), kelp (like excel), formula ((for doing math equations) and database. Open office is free and open source. I don't use jaws so I don't know how well it works with it.

Hope this helps somewhat.

Rosemarie

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Casey
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 10:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer

hi what all comes with open office and is it all free?

Also how well does it work with Jaws 2018 as well?




On 3/27/2018 9:32 AM, zahra wrote:
hi.
thanks so much for list of shortcuts.
for users who want to download libreoffice:
www.libreoffice.org/download
God bless you all!

On 3/27/18, Kerryn Gunness via Groups.Io <k_gunness=yahoo.ca@groups.io> wrote:
very nice
where could i downlode lebrea office?

----- Original Message -----
From: Tony Ballou
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 10:12 AM
Subject: [nvda] Keyboard shortcuts for Libre Office writer


Hi,




Here are the keyboard shortcuts for Libre office writer.





Tony







Keyboard shortcuts for Libre office writer



Keyboard shortcut

Command



Control-a

Select All



Control-b

Bold text



Control-c

Copies highlighted Text to the clipboard

Control-x

Cuts highlighted text to the clipboard

Control-v

Pastes the highlighted text from the clipboard to the location
that you specify



keep in mind that when the text is copied, it appears in both the
original and the specified location.

When the text is cut it appears in the specified location only



Control-Shift-v

Paste Special

pastes formatting, and formatted text from the clipboard



control-alt-shift-V

Pastes unformatted text from the clipboard



control-E

Centers text



Control f

Find text



Control -g

Go To



control-H

Find and replace Text



Control-I

Italicize text



Control-J

Justify Text



Control-l

Left align text



Control-r

Right align text



Control-n

Creates a new blank Document



Control-o

Brings up the open file dialog box



Control-P

Brings up the Print Dialog box



Control-S

Saves the current open Document. If it is a new one, the save as
dialog box will open where you can give it a specific file name, save
it with a specific file format extension such as .txt, .rtf, .doc,
.docx, or in the case of programs like open and libre office, .odt;
and a specific location such as a folder on your hard drive, or external storage device.



Control u

Underlines text



Control-y

redoes your last action



control-z

undoes your last action



Control-Shift-P

inserts superscript



Control-shift-b

Inserts subscript



Control-Enter

Page break



Navigation Keyboard shortcuts



left arrow

moves one character to the left



shift-left arrow

highlights the character to the left



Right arrow

moves one character to the right

Shift-right arrow

Highlights the character to the right



up arrow

moves up one line



Shift-up arrow

Highlights text in an upward direction



Down arrow

Moves down one line



Shift-down arrow

Highlights text in a downward direction



Control -left arrow

moves one word to the left



control-right arrow

moves one word to the right



Control-shift-left arrow

Highlights the word to the left



Control-Shift-right arrow

Highlights the word to the right



Control-up arrow

moves to the beginning of the previous paragraph



Control-shift-up arrow

highlights the text to the beginning of the paragraph

Control-Down arrow

Moves to the end of the paragraph



Control-Shift-down arrow

Highlights the text to the end of the paragraph



Home

Moves to the beginning of the line

shift-home

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the beginning of
the line



End

Moves to the end of the line

Shift-end

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the end of the
line



Control-home

moves the cursor to the beginning of the document





Control-End

Moves the cursor to the end of the document



Control-shift-home

Highlights the text from the cursor position to the beginning of
the document



Control-shift-end

highlights the text from the cursor position to the end of the
document



Page up

moves the cursor up one screen

(this is approximately 24 lines)



Page down

Moves the cursor down one screen

(This is approximately 24 lines)



Shift-page up

Highlights the text up by one screen



Shift-page down

Highlights the text down by one screen



Control-Backspace

Ce



Deletes the text to the beginning of the word



Control-delete

Deletes the text to the end of the word



Control-shift-backspace

deletes the text to the beginning of the sentence



Control-shift Delete

Deletes the text to the end of a sentence
















--

Casey


Re: I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

Reece H. Dunn
 

On Mon, Mar 26, 2018 at 02:34 pm, Bhavya shah wrote:
On that note, I would like to bring to your attention, Reece, the fact
that ESpeak-NG’s Emoji support was specifically removed from NVDA, as
far as I recollect, since it was causing major freezes/crashes with
certain characters in some languages, one of which included Hindi and
plagued me for a brief while as I was testing an RC build of NVDA. It
would be deeply appreciated if you could take a look at what happened
in this regard, because Emoji support is still something many people
are desirous of, or at least I am at least.
I have identified and fixed the issue with some Tamil characters causing eSpeak NG to freeze on Sunday. I have made other various stability fixes to the codebase as well. Hopefully, that should address the main issues with enabling emoji support.

Thanks,
Reece


Re: I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

Sarah k Alawami
 

I actually listen at over 100 percent. I do mud, but even then I do listen at a very very fast rate wiht espeak and the 1 core and on my mac. I can even hack that to listen at about 130 percent if I wanted to.

Take care

On Mar 26, 2018, at 11:05 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria <knitqueen2007@...> wrote:

If you had a job that involved listening like a customer service rep, you'd have no choice but to get used to listening to your screen reader at a faster speed.
 
 
 
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Sharni-Lee Ward
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2018 1:19 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?
 

I'll admit I've not heard Eloquence outside of Jaws and the addon I was sent some years back. I didn't know the version in Jaws was different to Eloquence on its own. The one in the addon I have doesn't pause very long between sentences. Also, I just do not like to speed up my synth too much. I still think of how some of you can listen to something at the highest rate possible and understand it. I've tried increasing it a little, but it's just not enjoyable for me.

 

That said, I'm now very used to Espeak, and it may not be an improvement over Eloquence in the opinion of some, but it was definitely an improvement over Microsoft Anna, which was what I had been stuck with via Narrator until I discovered NVDA. Espeak is the voice of NVDA to me now, and other synths fall short in many ways.

 
On 26/03/2018 7:20 PM, Gene wrote:
You wrote:
I don't like Eloquence because it isn't as crisp as Espeak. I have compared 
it to A.M radio in the past, and Espeak to FM/CD Quality sound.
 
That is a very inaccurate comparison.  E-Speak has more high end in the s sounds and the voice may have a little more high end but hardly comparable to FM radio or CD quality sound.  and why is the difference of perhaps two thousand or three thousand KHZ, by my estimate, from, let's say, around 7000KHZ in Eloquence to about nine hundred or one thousand KHZ in E-Speak of any real importance?  I would imagine you talk on the phone without worrying about such things.  
 
Eloquence has much better understandability of speech at higher speeds, and pronounces a lot more words correctly.  
 
Also, I don't know if you are talking about Eloquence as modified by the producers of JAWS or Eloquence, as it is unmodified.  The JAWS designers customized it.  If you are saying it isn't crisp because you are thinking of JAWS Eloquence, that's not an accurate representation of what unmodified Eloquence sounds like. Also, the JAWS modifiers took out pauses at periods.  That seriously degrades reading, that the modified version doesn't pause at periods. 
 
You may be pleasantly surprised if you try the demo of the HTML version.  If you haven't heard unmodified Eloquence, you don't know what it really sounds like.  
 
Gene
 



Re: I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

 

For me I grew up with synthetic voices.

The fact is, real sapi voices of high grade are good for well reading things but maybe not speech.

Ofcause the reason I have used high quality engines is because of well the lack of them in windows mainly, ms seems to have ok ish voices and while I was thinking about buying the high quality code factory voices, with all the issues with speech resetting at startup each time, I am thinking of getting and using the english accented voices for ms that ms has installed and forgetting others.

I have old scansoft 32 bit realspeaks if I want to use it but the ms voices could be almost as good.

On 28/03/2018 3:38 a.m., Ervin, Glenn wrote:
For me, it’s not that the eSpeak voices aren’t clear, or intelligible, it’s more that they sound too robotic, even with the settings set different.
To me, all variations of eSpeak have a mechanical tone to them, not smooth like Eloquence, which although does still sound synthetic, just is less, well, mechanical sounding.
However, I would select eSpeak over the more human-sounding voices if there was no Eloquence.
Glenn

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 12:08 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

I'm using the American voice and it's great. I'm using the Max varient and I think he's the clearest of all the voices. The female 5 voice is pretty clear too.



From: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Sarah k Alawami
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2018 8:30 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

I use the american variant for espeak. It is the best one out there, I think it is the klat one I use. That sounds like chocolate to my ear.

On Mar 26, 2018, at 4:03 PM, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com>> wrote:

I've tried other synths in the past, and know their issues from sometimes painful experience. Some of the Speech Platform voices cannot even pronounce the "n" in my name and mispronounce so many other things that it's honestly too frustrating to work with them at all. The Vocaliser voices I've tried are equally frustrating. If I somehow get them to say the word correctly, they don't stress the right syllables and I have no idea how to change that behaviour.

I may consider buying the legal Eloquence addon if it is as good as you say, but that will have to be at a time when my finances are not so tight.

On 27/03/2018 8:42 AM, Gene wrote:
You don’t know how the Eloquence synthesizer would work with the dictionary you already have. Your generalization about other synthesizers is just that, a generalization. You don't know if it applies to Eloquence.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com>
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2018 3:30 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

I will add that one of my favourite features to work with in NVDA is the
Speech Dictionary. Espeak might have some issues out of the box, but it
is quite receptive to alternative pronunciations via the Speech
Dictionary, and I have made liberal use of it. Other synths are more
annoying to work with on that score.


On 27/03/2018 2:16 AM, Ervin, Glenn wrote:
I would never use the "human sounding" voices for using the computer, however, for reading long articles, or a short book, I would not want to use something like Eloquence, or heaven's sake, not eSpeak.
The human-sounding voices are good for strictly listening, where there is little or no keyboard input.
Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rob Hudson
Sent: Sunday, March 25, 2018 1:12 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

Lino Morales <linomorales001@gmail.com<mailto:linomorales001@gmail.com>> wrote:
This is what talking books are for. Regardless of what synth I use. You realize bla hearing a book ready by a speech synth would be? Boring. It would put me to sleep.
But not all books are made into audio books. In fact, the vast majority are not. And if you're into online fiction, synth reading is the only game in town.








Re: microsoft turn round on skype

 

Well the issue aparently was in its installer.

So ms seems to have fixed it and lets hope classic skype continues for some time yet even if it never changes, even if its never updated I can take that.

In fact unless its needed we as blind people really don't need skype updated anyway for what we use it for.

On 28/03/2018 3:18 a.m., Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
I have a feeling a lot of people got into contact with Microsoft who used Skype 7 as an accessible program for blind who were employed, and think of the scandal if the news hit the streets that blind people put out of Work by crazy Microsoft decision?

Not good on the brownie points and probably not much help for those working in government departments using it if blind as well.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2018 2:03 AM
Subject: [nvda] microsoft turn round on skype


Hi all.

Today I recieved a skype update.

I was surprised I thought ms had abandond skype 7.

But no, aparently not.

If you download skype select the tablet tab and you can get classic skype.

I updated from skype itself, and I still had skype classic.

What this means, is interesting in itself.

We can choose classic again, I do wander if people complained to ms a lot and they finally saw reason.

For me it means at least for the short term till ms decides to plonk skype classic yet again I can continue to work with skype classic on win7 and maybe on 10.

I am not apposed to updating skype, but skype7 is accessible, and I have been using it for ages.

Bar the occasional calls and such there are a lot of things skype 8 and uaps are missing.

Maybe its the big improvement ms is making with skype, and maybe they realise they are not there yet.

Fact is, skype just got an update dispite what they said about an insecure installer.

That for me at least for now means progress.

Eventually I will probably get a smartphone maybe an ios device, the fact is I will have loads of uses for other forms of communication.

If skype gets to rubbish, I may simply close down skype entirely.

My ms account's main focus is mainly for knfb reader but to be hones bar the apps I purchaced there is little keeping me and microsoft online friends at all.

It used to be music, music, apps, skype.

Now its just some apps and with the apps being well who knows, and no music, there is just 1 app I brought, and skype.

Hardly any of my contacts talk on skype with me anymore bar the nvda dev group, and if it gets to hairy I will get rid of that group, there were also test groups about to for different things but I will now try to find nonskype things to do the tests with.







Re: I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

Reece H. Dunn
 

On Mon, Mar 26, 2018 at 01:42 am, Shaun Everiss wrote:
Espeakng is nice, better than espeak but I do wish the pronounciations
could be corrected, I mean there was nothing wrong with the old ones.
Taking the regression in the pronunciation of "resignedly" as an example, this was caused by a fix to words like "allegedly" and "reputedly" that were misporounced in espeak. The issue is that those words without the -edly suffix end in an 'e', while "resignedly" does not. The fix ended up adding an 'e' to "resign" when removing the -edly suffix, causing it to sound strange. I did not detect this because the word list I was using to compare the old and new pronunciations did not contain "resignedly".

If there are any pronunciations that are wrong, let me know and I can fix them (even if you just say which words they are). If you say things like "espeak-ng sounds wrong", or "espeak-ng is broken", then I cannot fix that as I don't know what needs changing.

Additionally, from espeak I have fixed the pronunciations for: manoeuvred, reckon, Frances (the name), sponging, Southend, Austen, aurora, recollect, ignoramus, straightforward, hippopotamuses, multiple, muse, soothsay, Orion. eta. theta. zeta, lambda, delta, thermal, sage, palazzo, cherish, resemble, visage, egress, chew, praiseworthy, racquet(ball), pureblood, d's, h's, k's, o's, p's, t's, y's, z's, and more. I have also fixed sir, nosir, and yessir in the Scottish English accent.


Re: I take it there have been no improvements to the flawed espeak ng in 2017.4?

Rui Fontes
 

Around US$93 according Google...

You can use the installer in:
http://tiflotecnia.net/eloquence_sapi5_tiflo.exe
It will works as a demo during one or two weeks.

Regards,

Rui Fontes
Tiflotecnia, Lda.


Às 18:43 de 27/03/2018, Ronald J Glaser escreveu:

how much does that translate into for us dollars?
On 3/27/2018 12:31 PM, Rui Fontes wrote:
Hello!
Às 16:24 de 27/03/2018, Casey escreveu:
Hi does this have fast response time when you read with it?
Yes, it haves.


Às 16:24 de 27/03/2018, Casey escreveu:
Also can you only use it with NVDA or other speech synth as well like Jaws?
No, it is SAPI5, so you can use it with any app that uses SAPI5 protocole, like Narrator and so on...


Às 16:24 de 27/03/2018, Casey escreveu:
And how much does it cost to purchase this if you decide to purchase it.
We are asking 75 EUR.

Best regards,

Rui Fontes
Tiflotecnia, Lda.



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a friend like You
Makes The Day Go Right!


Help Setting Up Windows 10 Laptop for Android Phone Duties?

Kenny <kwashingtonbox@...>
 

Good day!


I'm doing something that should had been done a while ago.


I'm going to stop using my Nexus 5x phone as my main source of receiving News, sports and Tweets.


Just purchased a FULL HD DELL LATITUDE 14 ULTRABOOK CORE™ i7 8GB 256GB SSD WINDOWS 10 LAPTOP PC to take over these duties.


This is my question to the list.


I relied on Apps like Bleecher Report, NBC/ABC/AP News and Twitter to receive instant push notifications to my Android phone which was read out by TalkBack 6.1.


Is there someway for me to set this same behavior up on the Windows 10 Ultrabook I brought?


Should I install similar apps from the MS store? How about use the Google Chrome browser to access these apps instead?


Just not sure which way works the best. Not only that, works well with NVDA 2018.1?


I'm also not sure if this question is appropriate to post to this list at all. If there's another I can post to for assistance, please share the subscription details so I can do so.


Any help would be greatly appreciated.


-Kenny