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Re: When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?

Gene
 

But most people use IMAP, not POP these days.  If you use a different computer, all the mail you have saved on the server or that is in the inbox will automatically download to the e-mail program on the computer you are using.

As for efficient, while I haven't used on line interfaces much and I might alter my opinion if I did, I haven't found any interface that is as efficient as an e-mail program where I just move down a list of messages and press enter on one I want to read.

In GMail, for example, If I want to read an e-mail without hearing a lot of verbiage I don't care about, I have to keep switching between having browse mode off and browse mode on.  If I use the browse mode off method GMail provides to move from one message to another and have it read while leaving browse mode off, there is a lot of excessive verbiage that is announced at the beginning of every message.

Gene

On 8/2/2022 8:13 AM, Thomas N. Chan wrote:

You can download emails onto your gmail.
like example, if you have an hotmail or yahoo email, you can set it up whereby it will download like pop email onto a label aka folder. more efficient  as compared to an email client.
I can  move to different computer and see the same email. I delete one, it will be gone from the rest. since  gmail itself allows you to download mails, you can also delete it or leave it on your mail server.
 your email client can only work if you have a working computer. if your computer dies or laptop gone, then where is all your emails?

It might be subjective if email client is faster for some but I can move around in gmail faster than on outlook.


Regards,
Thomas N. Chan


On Tue, Aug 2, 2022 at 3:28 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
I used to think that you needed a different interface for online e-mail with every provider.  I was informed by a knowledgeable person, however, that GMail allows you to use GMail for different providers.  I don't know how this is done nor what providers you can use with the GMail interface.

I don't think any online interface for e-mail is as efficient as an e-mail program for blind users but if people want to use online interfaces, knowing that GMail offers consolidation may be important for some users with different providers.

Gene

On 8/2/2022 2:21 AM, Brian's Mail list account via groups.io wrote:
Oh I'm sure, but the big  niggled I have on web delivered mail is that having accounts on different ISPs each and every interface is totally different, whereas all are the same in a client in most respects. I try to keep things simple.
Brian



Re: Problems with Thunderbird using NVDA

Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Gene,

I am using Windows 11 with Thunderbird. I do see a minor focus issue with Thunderbird.  In particular, when I first launch Thunderbird, sometimes, if you wish to use the numpad keys to read the name/subject of an unopened message, NVDA says 'blank.'  At times just after launch, the status line does not read with the insert + end keystroke.  A simple F6 key press and then tab key press restores functionality.


On 8/2/2022 8:19 AM, Gene wrote:
We'll see.  I don't know how many people on the list are using Windows 11 and Thunderbird but I doubt this is a general problem. 

Gene

On 8/2/2022 7:16 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:

Thank you Gene, it's certainly a problem I can live with.  Just thought someone else might have experienced the same.


Howard


On 8/2/2022 7:04 AM, Gene wrote:
I don't use Windows 11  but I have never had this problem with the portable version and I haven't seen anyone else complain of such a problem. 

Windows 11 is technically similar to Windows 10 and using that version of Windows shouldn't cause the problem.  I use it on Windows 10 without the problem. 

You may try the installed version of Thunderbird if you like.  I suspect there is some sort of minor problem with your installation of Windows 11 that is causing this behavior.  The problem is a minor one and drastic action such as placing a new copy of Windows 11 on the computer and reinstalling everything to see if that solves the problem is, in my opinion, an enormous amount of work that I don't think is justified to solve such a small problem.  I would simply work around it by closing the program and running it when you want to use it again.

If you want to try to eliminate the problem, I have no objection to trying an installed copy of Thunderbird. 

Gene

On 8/2/2022 6:51 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:
Setting up my win11 machine using current NVDA and thunderbird portable.  When I move from thunderbird to another program window (alt plus tab) and then come back to thunderbird (alt plus tab), the list of messages is "not available".  Only after I tab and shift tab does it become available.  I am new to this thunderbird portable; so I'm wondering if it's just a thing with the portable version and maybe should I go back to an installed version which I've used for years with only a different set of problems.


Thank you.

Howard 









-- 
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grievous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement  and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!
Re: Problems with Thunderbird using NVDA

Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Howard,

I have never seen this issue with the installed version.  Maybe try it again on Windows 11.  I think NVDA performs much better with Thunderbird than does JAWS.

On 8/2/2022 7:51 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:
Setting up my win11 machine using current NVDA and thunderbird portable. When I move from thunderbird to another program window (alt plus tab) and then come back to thunderbird (alt plus tab), the list of messages is "not available".  Only after I tab and shift tab does it become available.  I am new to this thunderbird portable; so I'm wondering if it's just a thing with the portable version and maybe should I go back to an installed version which I've used for years with only a different set of problems.


Thank you.

Howard




--
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grievous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!
Re: When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?

Thomas N. Chan
 

You can download emails onto your gmail.
like example, if you have an hotmail or yahoo email, you can set it up whereby it will download like pop email onto a label aka folder. more efficient  as compared to an email client.
I can  move to different computer and see the same email. I delete one, it will be gone from the rest. since  gmail itself allows you to download mails, you can also delete it or leave it on your mail server.
 your email client can only work if you have a working computer. if your computer dies or laptop gone, then where is all your emails?

It might be subjective if email client is faster for some but I can move around in gmail faster than on outlook.


Regards,
Thomas N. Chan


On Tue, Aug 2, 2022 at 3:28 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
I used to think that you needed a different interface for online e-mail with every provider.  I was informed by a knowledgeable person, however, that GMail allows you to use GMail for different providers.  I don't know how this is done nor what providers you can use with the GMail interface.

I don't think any online interface for e-mail is as efficient as an e-mail program for blind users but if people want to use online interfaces, knowing that GMail offers consolidation may be important for some users with different providers.

Gene

On 8/2/2022 2:21 AM, Brian's Mail list account via groups.io wrote:
Oh I'm sure, but the big  niggled I have on web delivered mail is that having accounts on different ISPs each and every interface is totally different, whereas all are the same in a client in most respects. I try to keep things simple.
Brian


Re: Problems with Thunderbird using NVDA

Gene
 

We'll see.  I don't know how many people on the list are using Windows 11 and Thunderbird but I doubt this is a general problem. 

Gene

On 8/2/2022 7:16 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:

Thank you Gene, it's certainly a problem I can live with.  Just thought someone else might have experienced the same.


Howard


On 8/2/2022 7:04 AM, Gene wrote:
I don't use Windows 11  but I have never had this problem with the portable version and I haven't seen anyone else complain of such a problem. 

Windows 11 is technically similar to Windows 10 and using that version of Windows shouldn't cause the problem.  I use it on Windows 10 without the problem. 

You may try the installed version of Thunderbird if you like.  I suspect there is some sort of minor problem with your installation of Windows 11 that is causing this behavior.  The problem is a minor one and drastic action such as placing a new copy of Windows 11 on the computer and reinstalling everything to see if that solves the problem is, in my opinion, an enormous amount of work that I don't think is justified to solve such a small problem.  I would simply work around it by closing the program and running it when you want to use it again.

If you want to try to eliminate the problem, I have no objection to trying an installed copy of Thunderbird. 

Gene

On 8/2/2022 6:51 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:
Setting up my win11 machine using current NVDA and thunderbird portable.  When I move from thunderbird to another program window (alt plus tab) and then come back to thunderbird (alt plus tab), the list of messages is "not available".  Only after I tab and shift tab does it become available.  I am new to this thunderbird portable; so I'm wondering if it's just a thing with the portable version and maybe should I go back to an installed version which I've used for years with only a different set of problems.


Thank you.

Howard








Re: Problems with Thunderbird using NVDA

Howard Traxler
 

Thank you Gene, it's certainly a problem I can live with.  Just thought someone else might have experienced the same.


Howard


On 8/2/2022 7:04 AM, Gene wrote:

I don't use Windows 11  but I have never had this problem with the portable version and I haven't seen anyone else complain of such a problem. 

Windows 11 is technically similar to Windows 10 and using that version of Windows shouldn't cause the problem.  I use it on Windows 10 without the problem. 

You may try the installed version of Thunderbird if you like.  I suspect there is some sort of minor problem with your installation of Windows 11 that is causing this behavior.  The problem is a minor one and drastic action such as placing a new copy of Windows 11 on the computer and reinstalling everything to see if that solves the problem is, in my opinion, an enormous amount of work that I don't think is justified to solve such a small problem.  I would simply work around it by closing the program and running it when you want to use it again.

If you want to try to eliminate the problem, I have no objection to trying an installed copy of Thunderbird. 

Gene

On 8/2/2022 6:51 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:
Setting up my win11 machine using current NVDA and thunderbird portable.  When I move from thunderbird to another program window (alt plus tab) and then come back to thunderbird (alt plus tab), the list of messages is "not available".  Only after I tab and shift tab does it become available.  I am new to this thunderbird portable; so I'm wondering if it's just a thing with the portable version and maybe should I go back to an installed version which I've used for years with only a different set of problems.


Thank you.

Howard







Re: Problems with Thunderbird using NVDA

Gene
 

Also, I see that you said that if you tab and shift tab, the message list becomes available again.  That is such a small thing to do that it is by far the fastest and easiest way to deal with the problem.  it is faster and easier than closing and opening the program again.  There are some very small problems that aren't worth worrying about.  Not every problem has to be solved. 

I don't know what problems you have with the installed version but of all the problems you might have, I can't think of any problem that is more minor and that requires so little to work around than the problem you are discussing.

Gene

On 8/2/2022 6:51 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:

Setting up my win11 machine using current NVDA and thunderbird portable.  When I move from thunderbird to another program window (alt plus tab) and then come back to thunderbird (alt plus tab), the list of messages is "not available".  Only after I tab and shift tab does it become available.  I am new to this thunderbird portable; so I'm wondering if it's just a thing with the portable version and maybe should I go back to an installed version which I've used for years with only a different set of problems.


Thank you.

Howard







Locked BARD

Kenny Nead
 

Does anyone know of a BARD e mail list?

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Tuesday, August 2, 2022 7:05 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with Thunderbird using NVDA

 

I don't use Windows 11  but I have never had this problem with the portable version and I haven't seen anyone else complain of such a problem. 

Windows 11 is technically similar to Windows 10 and using that version of Windows shouldn't cause the problem.  I use it on Windows 10 without the problem. 

You may try the installed version of Thunderbird if you like.  I suspect there is some sort of minor problem with your installation of Windows 11 that is causing this behavior.  The problem is a minor one and drastic action such as placing a new copy of Windows 11 on the computer and reinstalling everything to see if that solves the problem is, in my opinion, an enormous amount of work that I don't think is justified to solve such a small problem.  I would simply work around it by closing the program and running it when you want to use it again.

If you want to try to eliminate the problem, I have no objection to trying an installed copy of Thunderbird. 

Gene

On 8/2/2022 6:51 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:

Setting up my win11 machine using current NVDA and thunderbird portable.  When I move from thunderbird to another program window (alt plus tab) and then come back to thunderbird (alt plus tab), the list of messages is "not available".  Only after I tab and shift tab does it become available.  I am new to this thunderbird portable; so I'm wondering if it's just a thing with the portable version and maybe should I go back to an installed version which I've used for years with only a different set of problems.


Thank you.

Howard





 
Re: Problems with Thunderbird using NVDA

Gene
 

I don't use Windows 11  but I have never had this problem with the portable version and I haven't seen anyone else complain of such a problem. 

Windows 11 is technically similar to Windows 10 and using that version of Windows shouldn't cause the problem.  I use it on Windows 10 without the problem. 

You may try the installed version of Thunderbird if you like.  I suspect there is some sort of minor problem with your installation of Windows 11 that is causing this behavior.  The problem is a minor one and drastic action such as placing a new copy of Windows 11 on the computer and reinstalling everything to see if that solves the problem is, in my opinion, an enormous amount of work that I don't think is justified to solve such a small problem.  I would simply work around it by closing the program and running it when you want to use it again.

If you want to try to eliminate the problem, I have no objection to trying an installed copy of Thunderbird. 

Gene

On 8/2/2022 6:51 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:

Setting up my win11 machine using current NVDA and thunderbird portable.  When I move from thunderbird to another program window (alt plus tab) and then come back to thunderbird (alt plus tab), the list of messages is "not available".  Only after I tab and shift tab does it become available.  I am new to this thunderbird portable; so I'm wondering if it's just a thing with the portable version and maybe should I go back to an installed version which I've used for years with only a different set of problems.


Thank you.

Howard







Problems with Thunderbird using NVDA

Howard Traxler
 

Setting up my win11 machine using current NVDA and thunderbird portable.  When I move from thunderbird to another program window (alt plus tab) and then come back to thunderbird (alt plus tab), the list of messages is "not available".  Only after I tab and shift tab does it become available.  I am new to this thunderbird portable; so I'm wondering if it's just a thing with the portable version and maybe should I go back to an installed version which I've used for years with only a different set of problems.


Thank you.

Howard
Re: ms-teams and switching between two different accounts.

Ann Byrne <annakb@...>
 

Press enter on profile to open a menu. Sign out is at the bottom of the menu.
Because I don't know teams very well, I close it and reopen it and then can find a place to sign in.

At 03:21 AM 8/2/2022, you wrote:

Dear nvda users.



I 'm writing on behalf of a friend of mine who isn't on this list.

Can someone tell me step by step how an nvda user can switch between two different accounts in Microsoft teams?

Your help is sincerely appreciated.
Reading document structure information in PowerPoint with NVDA

Sylvie Duchateau
 

Hello all,

I am trying to read a PowerPoint presentation that has bee made accessible:

Each slide is structured with a heading level 1, headings level 2, lists, images with alternatives.

This information is correctly rendered by another screen reader, but NVDA does not indicate any heading level, and on the contrary to HTML document it does not indicate list with X elements.

I had a look at the user guide, but there is only a shortcut for reading presenter’s note.

I tried to disable my extensions, but nothing changes.

In the document presentation, I checked the checkbox to announce styles, but nothing changes.

I use NVDA 2022.2 with Windows 11 21h02 (build 22000.795) and Office 365.

I tried to search for the issue on NV Access Github web site but cannot find any info.

Is this problem a known issue?

Are you able to read structure in PowerPoint documents with NVDA?

Thank you for any information you may have.

Best

Sylvie
ms-teams and switching between two different accounts.

Michael Micallef at FITA
 

Dear nvda users.

 

I ‘m writing on behalf of a friend of mine who isn’t on this list.

Can someone tell me step by step how an nvda user can switch between two different accounts in Microsoft teams?

Your help is sincerely appreciated.
Re: When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?

Gene
 

I used to think that you needed a different interface for online e-mail with every provider.  I was informed by a knowledgeable person, however, that GMail allows you to use GMail for different providers.  I don't know how this is done nor what providers you can use with the GMail interface.

I don't think any online interface for e-mail is as efficient as an e-mail program for blind users but if people want to use online interfaces, knowing that GMail offers consolidation may be important for some users with different providers.

Gene

On 8/2/2022 2:21 AM, Brian's Mail list account via groups.io wrote:

Oh I'm sure, but the big  niggled I have on web delivered mail is that having accounts on different ISPs each and every interface is totally different, whereas all are the same in a client in most respects. I try to keep things simple.
Brian


Re: When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?

Brian's Mail list account
 

Oh I'm sure, but the big niggled I have on web delivered mail is that having accounts on different ISPs each and every interface is totally different, whereas all are the same in a client in most respects. I try to keep things simple.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Sarah k Alawami" <marrie12@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2022 3:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?


It's not really all that sluggish. It is very very fast if you know the keystrokes and can memorize those, plus you memorize the layout and know where to find the sections you are looking for. I do use both, and both work well for when Ineedthem.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian's Mail list account via groups.io
Sent: Monday, August 1, 2022 12:33 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?

Well if its any consolation, I find the webmail online screen very sluggish, and still return to using a client. Of course I'm sure its very powerful, but I also do not really like all my contacts being on line, Old fashioned I guess.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "William" <xsuper.sillyx@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2022 12:20 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?


Yes, when editing the receiver search field, nvda is in focus mode


Gene 於 31/7/2022 19:34 寫道:
I'm not sure why. Make sure that, depending on what your
screen-reader calls it, you are in forms mode or browse mode is off.

Gene

On 7/31/2022 6:27 AM, William wrote:

Gene,

Thank you very much.

It was strange that in one of the profile of my chrome browser, I
was able to press left arrow to review selected receiver.

But in another profile, pressing left arrow, nvda focused onto the
link to select receiver from contact list.



Gene 於 31/7/2022 18:20 寫道:
When you are in the combo box where you up and down arrow to find
and add more recipients, instead of moving up and down, move to the
left or right. You will move through the addresses you have added.
If you haven't moved yet, move left to move through all addresses.
Once you are on an address, to remove it, press the delete key.

Gene

On 7/31/2022 12:26 AM, William wrote:
Hello,

When I am composing a new email in gmail web, I add sender by the
following ways:

1. after the compose new window is open, nvda focus is on the
search field to enter receiver email

2. I enter keywords of the receiver email or name, then I press up
or down arrow to look at the suggestion available

3. I press enter to select that particular email as the receiver
of the email

4. after pressing enter, nvda will be focused on the empty search
field when I can repeat step 2 and 3 to enter extra receivers


After doing the above steps, say I have selected 3 receivers, and
later I found that I have to delete some of the receiver email
address from the current email.



Can any one instruct me how can I use nvda to remove some of the
receivers?

Thank you.
Re: When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?

Thomas N. Chan
 

I can breeze through emails since by default every email is group by conversation
I second that.
x to select it, # to say, goodbye into the bin.
r to reply email, f to forward.
believe me, I really read a lot of emails. 
What can you do if you have multiple email accounts? use email client to download all of them in into the same inbox or browse to different folder to see one by one?
All I did was, open different tab in my browser then ctrl - 1 to 9 or ctrl - tab. how easy can it be?
I can even google chat to different people in different account, one for work, one for clients etc and friends.




Regards,
Thomas N. Chan


On Mon, Aug 1, 2022 at 10:48 PM Sarah k Alawami <marrie12@...> wrote:
It's not really all that sluggish. It is very very fast if you know the keystrokes and can memorize those, plus you memorize the layout and know where to find the sections you are looking for. I do use both, and both work well for when Ineedthem.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian's Mail list account via groups.io
Sent: Monday, August 1, 2022 12:33 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?

Well if its any consolation, I find the webmail online screen very sluggish, and still return to using a client. Of course I'm sure its very powerful, but I also do not really like all my contacts being on line, Old fashioned I guess.
 Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "William" <xsuper.sillyx@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2022 12:20 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?


> Yes, when editing the receiver search field, nvda is in focus mode
>
>
> Gene 於 31/7/2022 19:34 寫道:
>> I'm not sure why. Make sure that, depending on what your
>> screen-reader calls it, you are in forms mode or browse mode is off.
>>
>> Gene
>>
>> On 7/31/2022 6:27 AM, William wrote:
>>>
>>> Gene,
>>>
>>> Thank you very much.
>>>
>>> It was strange that in one of the profile of my chrome browser, I
>>> was able to press left arrow to review selected receiver.
>>>
>>> But in another profile, pressing left arrow, nvda focused onto the
>>> link to select receiver from contact list.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Gene 於 31/7/2022 18:20 寫道:
>>>> When you are in the combo box where you up and down arrow to find
>>>> and add more recipients, instead of moving up and down, move to the
>>>> left or right. You will move through the addresses you have added.
>>>> If you haven't moved yet, move left to move through all addresses.
>>>> Once you are on an address, to remove it, press the delete key.
>>>>
>>>> Gene
>>>>
>>>> On 7/31/2022 12:26 AM, William wrote:
>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>
>>>>> When I am composing a new email in gmail web, I add sender by the
>>>>> following ways:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. after the compose new window is open, nvda focus is on the
>>>>> search field to enter receiver email
>>>>>
>>>>> 2. I enter keywords of the receiver email or name, then I press up
>>>>> or down arrow to look at the suggestion available
>>>>>
>>>>> 3. I press enter to select that particular email as the receiver
>>>>> of the email
>>>>>
>>>>> 4. after pressing enter, nvda will be focused on the empty search
>>>>> field when I can repeat step 2 and 3 to enter extra receivers
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> After doing the above steps, say I have selected 3 receivers, and
>>>>> later I found that I have to delete some of the receiver email
>>>>> address from the current email.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Can any one instruct me how can I use nvda to remove some of the
>>>>> receivers?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>












Re: When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?

Sarah k Alawami
 

It's not really all that sluggish. It is very very fast if you know the keystrokes and can memorize those, plus you memorize the layout and know where to find the sections you are looking for. I do use both, and both work well for when Ineedthem.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian's Mail list account via groups.io
Sent: Monday, August 1, 2022 12:33 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?

Well if its any consolation, I find the webmail online screen very sluggish, and still return to using a client. Of course I'm sure its very powerful, but I also do not really like all my contacts being on line, Old fashioned I guess.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "William" <xsuper.sillyx@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2022 12:20 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] When composing email in gmail web how to delete a receiver?


Yes, when editing the receiver search field, nvda is in focus mode


Gene 於 31/7/2022 19:34 寫道:
I'm not sure why. Make sure that, depending on what your
screen-reader calls it, you are in forms mode or browse mode is off.

Gene

On 7/31/2022 6:27 AM, William wrote:

Gene,

Thank you very much.

It was strange that in one of the profile of my chrome browser, I
was able to press left arrow to review selected receiver.

But in another profile, pressing left arrow, nvda focused onto the
link to select receiver from contact list.



Gene 於 31/7/2022 18:20 寫道:
When you are in the combo box where you up and down arrow to find
and add more recipients, instead of moving up and down, move to the
left or right. You will move through the addresses you have added.
If you haven't moved yet, move left to move through all addresses.
Once you are on an address, to remove it, press the delete key.

Gene

On 7/31/2022 12:26 AM, William wrote:
Hello,

When I am composing a new email in gmail web, I add sender by the
following ways:

1. after the compose new window is open, nvda focus is on the
search field to enter receiver email

2. I enter keywords of the receiver email or name, then I press up
or down arrow to look at the suggestion available

3. I press enter to select that particular email as the receiver
of the email

4. after pressing enter, nvda will be focused on the empty search
field when I can repeat step 2 and 3 to enter extra receivers


After doing the above steps, say I have selected 3 receivers, and
later I found that I have to delete some of the receiver email
address from the current email.



Can any one instruct me how can I use nvda to remove some of the
receivers?

Thank you.
Re: object out of screen - what does it mean?

Sarah k Alawami
 

It is I believe used to update cell phones from said company. I've seen this not just in software, but on some websites, however it is totally random when it does happen. Should the objects be able to be gotten to when off screen like this?

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian's Mail list account via groups.io
Sent: Monday, August 1, 2022 12:20 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] object out of screen - what does it mean?

I am not aware of that software, at the risk of seeming to be thick, what exactly does it update?
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Alexandre Alves Toco" <alexandretoco@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2022 2:14 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] object out of screen - what does it mean?


Hello Brian!

It happens for me in a application called samsung update.


Em 31/07/2022 04:28, Brian's Mail list account via groups.io escreveu:
Funny you should mention this. Is this on web sites? I've seen it
several times, but its hard to duplicate it, so I wondered if it
might be a browser issue. It was in Firefox for me, but its hard to
debug something that happens randomly.
Brian
Re: Article on Screen Reader History (including NVDA)

Gene
 

this message is long but I've answered a number of points individually that you raise.

I know read to end doesn't skip content because what I read makes sense and ideas or words or phrases are not omitted.  Of course, it is possible that someone could design a screen-reader incorrectly and that read to end wouldn't work properly but that is improper design.  I've used a number of screen-readers and I've never had read to end skip lines or parts of lines in a properly designed screen-reader.

Do I know the intended use is documented?  Look at the user guide.  Look at the training material.  Look at any good training material put out by a competent teacher or agency.  The question isn't whether the instructor says, this is the appropriate way to use NVDA.  The point is, what is discussed in how to do something and what isn't?  Your method is not discussed in any material I've ever seen regarding any screen-reader and is therefore, presumably not considered appropriate.

If you yourself said that you use your method and have no problems, than I would say, fine.  I think its as ridiculous to move manually line by line using down arrow through a one-hundred line document to read it as it is to move the mouse line by line but if it works properly and you want to do so, do so.  But you yourself say it isn't working.  And have you tried read to end to see how much more pleasant it is to just let the screen-reader read? 

Give screen-reader developers some credit.  Do you think they would use methods that are not reliable and skip content?  Users would complain as well.

You ask, why does the feature exist if it doesn't work completely?  I don't know if there are problems with the implementation of the feature.  You would have to discuss that with developers and provide specific reproducible examples and have them evaluate the behaviors or problems you are discussing.  Since people generally don't use the mouse as you do, people in general won't discuss the problem.  Most blind people don't even use a physical mouse with a screen-reader.

Let's say, for the sake of argument, that the feature does have bugs and that they are corrected allowing you to move line by line down a document and read it that way on a web site and elsewhere.

Then, you may get into other problems.  The web page, as displayed on the screen may not be formatted as it is in the virtual buffer in browse mode.  I don't know if that would cause material to be read in incorrect order or broken up at times in ways it isn't using browse mode.  And should browse mode even be on if you are going to read as you are?  Sighted people can't scroll through a web page article when browse mode is being used.  A sighted user or a blind user who knows more about this would have to discuss this further.  As I understand it, a sighted person reads what is on the screen, then moves to the next screen, reads that, then moves to the next screen, etc.

My understanding is that when browse mode is being used, the sighted way of moving through a document doesn't work properly.

I've seen sighted people complain that they can't move through documents when browse mode is on.  I've seen that discussed on lists, also.

It isn't as you say, a question of my way or the highway.  Its a question of what works ;properly and well and what doesn't.  What is reality telling you?  Again, what does the fact that you are the only one saying you had accessibility problems reading the article telling you?

Gene

On 8/1/2022 8:50 AM, Gene via groups.io wrote:

There are times when it is not proper use to use a screen-reader in certain ways.  That is because of how the Windows and program interfaces are designed and it is because of how blind people work in those environments as well.

I'm not telling you in this case in an arbitrary statement that you are using a screen-reader inappropriately.  Reality is telling you that.  You can disagree with me but not with reality. 

The reality is that you said you had accessibility problems reading an article that was sent to the list as a link.  A lot of people read the article.  You are the only one who said there are accessibility problems with it.  At some point, if everyone else is not having a problem you are having, its time to ask or consider whether you are doing something correctly.

I'm not pressuring or forcing you to do anything.  Its up to you. 

Gene

On 8/1/2022 8:26 AM, Russell James wrote:

Jean I find it interesting that you think the intended use of screen readers is so black and white :-)

Do you know if the intended use for nvda is documented?

Why does the feature I'm using exist if it doesn't work completely?

Sounds like my way or the highway!

How do you know that your way works without skipping content?

Russ
Re: Article on Screen Reader History (including NVDA)

tim
 

Actually if you look at windows or even apples os. You will find that most of those icons we see with a screen reader as text, the sighted see pictures.

That is why its so easy for the sighted to use a computer. You just click on what ever you move the mouse to. Most sighted people only use a keyboard when they have to actually type in a text editor or email.

So just talking to some one on a call on a help desk. You have to remember most don't want short cuts unless its mouse. They just want to know on what to click on.

I also had a lot of that working for verizon fios.



On 8/1/2022 3:22 AM, Thomas N. Chan wrote:

For your info, sighted people use pointers or physical pointers to point  to a picture or a text to put a point  across during the presentation. 
Some of them are laser pointers or even just a mouse pointer
this is how they work, and not how we work.
I have been doing helpdesk in a sighted world for a long time, and visual is the way sighted people understand and this is how they put across to us.
Yes, keyboard shortcuts might be more efficient, but sighted people just remember that icon how they look like, a printer icon for print, a document icon  for them  to save.

If you did read my response previously, how many screen  reader users are aware of a tooltip  or a popup text box when a mouse pointer is put on that icon or  on a particular toolbar?
because we just use keyboard shortcuts to accomplish  the same thing.

workforce is not getting younger.
 why IG and  titok are popular  for that reason. they are driven, by visual stuff. 



Regards,
Thomas N. Chan


On Sun, Jul 31, 2022 at 7:56 AM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
However, if I understand what the person is doing, he is not using the screen-reader as intended.  that has not been spoken of by anyone but me.  If I misunderstand what is being done, I'd like to know. 

My understanding is that the person is reading the text of an article by moving a physical mouse down the screen line by line and causing the screen-reader to speak the text in that manner.  Not only is that not the intended use of screen-readers, but it isn't the intended use for sighted people. 

If you use something in a way not intended, you may have problems. 

Gene

On 7/30/2022 4:30 PM, Thomas N. Chan wrote:
Exactly my point.
Most of the time screen reader users are still focused on how to let sighted folks see what we are doing.
but we don't see how sighted folks see what they are doing. 
For example, if they put the mouse pointer on top of an icon, it will popup a box aka tooltip, does the screen reader read that popup?
we are not focus on, how we get onto the icon and tell them to click on that.
We want to focus on where they click on that icon and find out what icon is that. we need to figure out what icon, how to access that icon. then tell them, this is what they did wrong, they should click on, the other icon instead.


I don't need to tell  them, I move my focus to the right icon and they should do that. 
how in the first place, how do we know, they move focus the right icon? how do we know that, after they did it wrong or right?

Regards,
Thomas N. Chan


On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 11:13 PM Russell James <4rjames@...> wrote:
Sorry for the delay in my response

Fortunately, Thomas seems to understand the value for some users to use what was called mouse tracking!

I have called this explore by mouse but it is essentially leveraging the mouse tracking and reading content with the physical mouse.

Similar to explore by touch on Android devices...

Which was something I learned from window-Eyes and have never stopped doing.
I have never used JAWS so have nothing to add there...

Unfortunately, this access method has always had multiple issues with NVDA.
Especially when the content is located near an image on the right or if the content includes hyperlinks.
Of course, if you don't know there is text after a hyperlink you would not know it was not being spoken...
Likewise with the text to the left of an image on a web page...

As with many things, screen reader users don't all use their tool the same way...

Russ

On Fri, Jul 29, 2022 at 9:12 AM Josh Kennedy <joshknnd1982@...> wrote:
in jaws it is called mouse echo, insert+space, letter e as in echo. then use the following commands  and also both jaws and NVDA offer visual highlighting so sighted people can follow along with what you are doing. in jaws it is in settings center I think in visual highlighting. 
The following commands are available in the Mouse Echo layer.
Toggle mouse echo On/Off = O.
Set mouse echo to character = C.
Set mouse echo to word = W.
Set mouse echo to line = L.
Set mouse echo to paragraph = P.
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