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Re: In-Process AND a beta both out today
Quentin Christensen
Hi Robert, Oh I am not voicist! (Is that a word? I don't have a specific preference of one voice over another). I'm glad it is working even better for you now! On Fri, Jun 17, 2022 at 1:36 PM Robert Mendoza <lowvisiontek@...> wrote:
--
Quentin Christensen Training and Support Manager Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/ Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/ User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess Twitter: @NVAccess |
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Re: holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
Monte Single
Yes, Ron,
And there is also a large group of people, in any aspect of society, who trumpet loud and wide, “you get what you pay for”. I am glad to make a small contribution to nvda rather than supporting jaws.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: June 16, 2022 11:50 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
Hi Group, On 6/16/2022 11:31 PM, Ravindran V.S. wrote:
-- Signature: For a nation to admit it has done grievous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice; For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue! |
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Re: holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
Ron Canazzi
Hi Group,
I hope NVDA never goes commercial. In the US now-of-days, there is a persistent and radical libertarian philosophy that has taken hold of a large minority of the people saying in essence: 'If you don't pay, you don't play.' Without getting into a political discussion on this issue, people who advocate this don't realize just what profound changes would result if this philosophy (as it appears likely) takes over the body politic entirely. Just think of Europe from the middle ages to the nineteenth century. Having said that, people should be appreciative of the great work done by the creators of NVDA and should be grateful and not complain so much. A small donation--even from unemployed blind people to NVDA would be in order. Since it is well known that millions (I believe over 70 million at last report) of people in the world use NVDA, just imagine if everyone gave the equivalence of five dollars US a year. That would be 350 million dollars US yearly. As far s as code factory Eloquence, I am having no problem with the SAPI 5 version of the product. What issues are there with this product? On 6/16/2022 11:31 PM, Ravindran V.S.
wrote:
-- Signature: For a nation to admit it has done grievous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice; For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue! |
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Re: Language issue with NVDA
Sean Budd (NV Access)
Can you please test 2022.2beta1. I believe we fixed this issue in that release: https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2022-2beta1/
Kind Regards, Sean Budd NV Access Software Developer |
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Re: In-Process AND a beta both out today
Robert Mendoza
Quentin , On 6/16/2022 2:07 PM, Quentin
Christensen wrote:
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Re: holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
Ravindran V.S.
Dear Mike, If my understanding is correct of your message, Please note, ever since NVDA released as a free screen reader millions of Blind users have got into some kind of technical or computer literacy and use of technology. If not still a vast majority would not be able to access computers due to the high cost of the commercial products. Also, NVDA has created many job opportunities to many Visually Impaired Persons in several countries. So, I urge that this should continue as the current way it is as an open source product and accessible to all Blind people. People in the poor countries, and the developing countries are mainly depending on this screen reader. Who may be heavily using the product, but may not be in a position or afford to donate towards this cause. Therefore, I kindly request to all the developers and contributors to keep and continue this as an open source and free product, or at least to the people in the poor countries. We even get the computers through donations, under this circumstances how could we spend hundreds or thousands of Dollars to the commercial Screen Readers? I live in Sri Lanka, and now even we almost starving , under this situation cannot think of purchasing any screen reader or anything other than considered to be essential items. Which some time may cost the job of the Blind people as well, who are depending on NVDA for their work . So, for delay of any Add-Ons should not deny access of a screen reader for many Blind people. Thank you in advance for understanding. NVDA is a blessing to many Blind.
Ravi.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of mike mcglashon
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 9:44 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
Quoting: My own view is that these add-ons should be updated in the Alpha or Beta stages, not after release. Either that, or NVDA should not keep breaking compatibility with them. End quote:
Amen to this. If NVDA were a commercial software instead of “charitable open source code”, these practices might not be tolerated as easily. I wish sometimes that NVDA would “actually charge” for its software instead of hiding behind “donations” then we could demand excellence. It is strictly my belief that we as a society give too much leeway to “charitable” products.
I say these things as a “donor” to NVDA.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
No, you’re not alone. It makes work also for the average user, who gets their NVDA just right with add-ons, only to find them broken in the next version.
My own view is that these add-ons should be updated in the Alpha or Beta stages, not after release. Either that, or NVDA should not keep breaking compatibility with them.
All the best
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tyler Wood
As a random interjection I find it quite disturbing how easily add ons are losing compatibility from one minor version to the next. This is a trend I as a user am not a fan of. It means more work for developers, more issues by the end user if add ons become unsupported, or at least, unsupported according to NVDA itself, and less time to actually make improvements for the developers who are already placing their doubtlessly limited and free time into this wonderful hobby of creating resources for NVDA to take advantage of. I am truly curious to know what I, as a user, am benefiting from with this so called fragmentation. Previously add ons would work without issue, now it’s a guessing game as to which add ons will be disabled and stop working when I’d like to update NVDA from, again, one minor version to the next.
As it stands right now, I’m running a portable version of the latest NVDA due to the above, with my main install remaining an older version. Am I alone in viewing this slightly worrying trend?
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of mattias
Lol we got the same answer..
Skickades från E-post för Windows
Från: Supanut Leepaisomboon
So I just got a reply from Codefactory, to a ticket regarding compatibility with NVDA 2022.1 that I submitted way back in April. Below is their response:
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Re: "Recognition failed" whenever I try to use NVDA+R
Joshua Tubbs
Oh... yes, I am using NVDA+R, completely missed the typo in my message. As for screen curtain, yes it is off. NVDA says Recognition failed every time though, and it wouldn't say it if it was on and would instead instruct the user to turn screen curtain off. I'm just trying to figure out what would cause it to fail like this. Maybe I'll grab a portable version and see if it works but I doubt it. On Thu, Jun 16, 2022 at 5:59 AM Luke Davis <luke@...> wrote: Joshua Tubbs wrote: |
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Re: Does NVDA have this feature that Window-eyes has?
Luke Davis
Brian Vogel wrote:
this is the regular expression one would use:(\+|-|\*|\=){3,}--Brian, I have not tested the above, nor what I am going to say next, but I'm curious why you are re-inventing the bracket expression? AFAIK, the Re above could be more efficiently, and clearly, written as: [-*\+\=]{3,} https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/basedefs/V1_chap09.html#tag_09_03_05 A more complete separator line catcher might be: [-*\+\=._]{4,} I used 4 as the minimum, so it does not catch a non-UTF-8 ellipsis (...). Luke |
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Re: Recommendations for NVDA Add-Ons
Bob Cavanaugh
It all depends on what you're using NVDA for. Personally, I only run
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
three addons, and am probably going to remove one. They are Numpad Nav Mode, Addon Updater, and NV Speech Player, though that's the one I'm thinking of removing as I don't like its voice. Addon Updater is the essential one if you're running any addons, otherwise it really depends on how you use the program. On 6/16/22, Mo Khan <mk3386751@...> wrote:
Which nvda addons would you recommend please? much appreciated. thank you. |
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Re: Recommendations for NVDA Add-Ons
Mo,
There are just too many, covering an awful lot of territory, to be able to make broad general recommendations. That being said, the following add-ons are "must haves" because of how they enhance NVDA's core code or applications you may be using: 1. Add-On Updater. 2. Add-Ons Documentation 3. Mozilla Apps Enhancements (if you use Thunderbird and/or Firefox) 4. Windows App Essentials You can explore, and obtain, NVDA add-ons from the following two sites: NVDA Add-Ons Directory (hosted by the Spanish-Speaking NVDA Community Association) --Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044 The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment. ~ Dorothy Nevill |
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Re: Recommendations for NVDA Add-Ons
That is a rather open-ended question. What do you want NVDA to do for you that it does not currently?
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mo Khan
Sent: June 16, 2022 2:37 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: [nvda] Recommendations for NVDA Add-Ons
Which nvda addons would you recommend please? much appreciated. thank you. Mo. |
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Recommendations for NVDA Add-Ons
Mo Khan
Which nvda addons would you recommend please? much appreciated. thank you. Mo. |
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Re: holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
On Thu, Jun 16, 2022 at 12:14 PM, mike mcglashon wrote:
My own view is that these add-ons should be updated in the Alpha or Beta stages, not after release. Either that, or NVDA should not keep breaking compatibility with them.- NVAccess is not the owner or maintainer of the vast majority of add-ons. Thus, they logically have zero responsibility for them. The compatibility-breaking releases are announced many months in advance and the developer community (including add-on developers) are on notice that tweaking, even if it's just manifest tweaking, will be necessary. This is not the slightest bit different than what happens with commercial software, Windows being the perfect example. Microsoft announces when a new version (or feature update) is coming well in advance and all third-parties (equivalent of the add-on developers) are on notice that they need to update to keep pace. This is not optional. There is core code and there is ancillary code. Ancillary code follows core code, or should. There have been times, and there are some add-on developers, who are consistently proactive and whose add-ons are always updated before actual release date, often by the time the beta comes out. We've had a couple of rough years with backwards-compatibility breaking NVDA releases. But NVDA absolutely has to keep pace with Windows and all the software it is meant to give you access to. That's far more critical in the big picture than the occasional add-on breakage (much of which could be avoided, but sometimes not if an add-on has been dropped by its original developer and there was no transition plan for someone else to pick it up). -- Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044 The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment. ~ Dorothy Nevill |
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Re: Does NVDA have this feature that Window-eyes has?
Oops, a typo in my first description. I am only looking for plus signs, hyphens, and asterisks, in any combination, repeated a minimum of 3 times. I did not include the equal sign. If one wished to, this is the regular expression one would use:
(\+|-|\*|\=){3,} -- Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044 The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment. ~ Dorothy Nevill |
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Re: Does NVDA have this feature that Window-eyes has?
My solution to this is to create default dictionary entries to handle common "separator line" repetitions and actually have NVDA say, "separator line." I don't care what, precisely, the chosen character sequence is.
Here is the regular expression I use for a "long" separator line of 3 or more characters in sequence. Additional characters could be added with the or (pipe) operator if you have someone who uses something else in combination with + or = or -, etc. (\+|-|\*){3,} and my replacement is "Separator line." For common short, 2-character separators, I use this regular expression: (-|\*|\+){2}\s+$ And that regular expression captures 2 characters that are hyphens, asterisks, or plus signs followed by any number of white space characters anchored by the end of the line. -- Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044 The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment. ~ Dorothy Nevill |
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Re: Does NVDA have this feature that Window-eyes has?
I hear 9 equals 9 equals etc. sounds like it does have this to my ear. Is that not what you mean?
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 9:01 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] Does NVDA have this feature that Window-eyes has?
Hi Gene, |
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Re: holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
Tyler Wood
Hard agree here. While I appreciate the effort maintaining add ons from version to version and announcing when fixes have been implemented from version to version, I also feel like this shouldn’t strictly be needed and, again, is taking time away from limited development time. Just my view. I feel like it’s a huge regression and step backwards with very little benefit apart from more questions re: addon support, fragmentation and add ons that will slowly but surely lose support and force a user who relies on it to continue using an older version of NVDA. Very unfortunate, but I’m just a user, not a developer.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of mike mcglashon
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 11:14 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
Quoting: My own view is that these add-ons should be updated in the Alpha or Beta stages, not after release. Either that, or NVDA should not keep breaking compatibility with them. End quote:
Amen to this. If NVDA were a commercial software instead of “charitable open source code”, these practices might not be tolerated as easily. I wish sometimes that NVDA would “actually charge” for its software instead of hiding behind “donations” then we could demand excellence. It is strictly my belief that we as a society give too much leeway to “charitable” products.
I say these things as a “donor” to NVDA.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
No, you’re not alone. It makes work also for the average user, who gets their NVDA just right with add-ons, only to find them broken in the next version.
My own view is that these add-ons should be updated in the Alpha or Beta stages, not after release. Either that, or NVDA should not keep breaking compatibility with them.
All the best
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tyler Wood
As a random interjection I find it quite disturbing how easily add ons are losing compatibility from one minor version to the next. This is a trend I as a user am not a fan of. It means more work for developers, more issues by the end user if add ons become unsupported, or at least, unsupported according to NVDA itself, and less time to actually make improvements for the developers who are already placing their doubtlessly limited and free time into this wonderful hobby of creating resources for NVDA to take advantage of. I am truly curious to know what I, as a user, am benefiting from with this so called fragmentation. Previously add ons would work without issue, now it’s a guessing game as to which add ons will be disabled and stop working when I’d like to update NVDA from, again, one minor version to the next.
As it stands right now, I’m running a portable version of the latest NVDA due to the above, with my main install remaining an older version. Am I alone in viewing this slightly worrying trend?
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of mattias
Lol we got the same answer..
Skickades från E-post för Windows
Från: Supanut Leepaisomboon
So I just got a reply from Codefactory, to a ticket regarding compatibility with NVDA 2022.1 that I submitted way back in April. Below is their response:
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Re: holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
mike mcglashon
Quoting: My own view is that these add-ons should be updated in the Alpha or Beta stages, not after release. Either that, or NVDA should not keep breaking compatibility with them. End quote:
Amen to this. If NVDA were a commercial software instead of “charitable open source code”, these practices might not be tolerated as easily. I wish sometimes that NVDA would “actually charge” for its software instead of hiding behind “donations” then we could demand excellence. It is strictly my belief that we as a society give too much leeway to “charitable” products.
I say these things as a “donor” to NVDA.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 12:06 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
No, you’re not alone. It makes work also for the average user, who gets their NVDA just right with add-ons, only to find them broken in the next version.
My own view is that these add-ons should be updated in the Alpha or Beta stages, not after release. Either that, or NVDA should not keep breaking compatibility with them.
All the best
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tyler Wood
As a random interjection I find it quite disturbing how easily add ons are losing compatibility from one minor version to the next. This is a trend I as a user am not a fan of. It means more work for developers, more issues by the end user if add ons become unsupported, or at least, unsupported according to NVDA itself, and less time to actually make improvements for the developers who are already placing their doubtlessly limited and free time into this wonderful hobby of creating resources for NVDA to take advantage of. I am truly curious to know what I, as a user, am benefiting from with this so called fragmentation. Previously add ons would work without issue, now it’s a guessing game as to which add ons will be disabled and stop working when I’d like to update NVDA from, again, one minor version to the next.
As it stands right now, I’m running a portable version of the latest NVDA due to the above, with my main install remaining an older version. Am I alone in viewing this slightly worrying trend?
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of mattias
Lol we got the same answer..
Skickades från E-post för Windows
Från: Supanut Leepaisomboon
So I just got a reply from Codefactory, to a ticket regarding compatibility with NVDA 2022.1 that I submitted way back in April. Below is their response:
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Re: Does NVDA have this feature that Window-eyes has?
Rui Fontes
Not only presents information differently... In NVDA you can not configure how many characters untill starting to announce x equals...
If I remember correctly, in Jaws you could configure that...
Rui Fontes
Às 16:35 de 16/06/2022, Chris Mullins
escreveu:
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Re: holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
Steve Nutt
No, you’re not alone. It makes work also for the average user, who gets their NVDA just right with add-ons, only to find them broken in the next version.
My own view is that these add-ons should be updated in the Alpha or Beta stages, not after release. Either that, or NVDA should not keep breaking compatibility with them.
All the best
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tyler Wood
Sent: 23 May 2022 20:16 To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] holding off on 2022.1 due to Code Factory dragging their feet
As a random interjection I find it quite disturbing how easily add ons are losing compatibility from one minor version to the next. This is a trend I as a user am not a fan of. It means more work for developers, more issues by the end user if add ons become unsupported, or at least, unsupported according to NVDA itself, and less time to actually make improvements for the developers who are already placing their doubtlessly limited and free time into this wonderful hobby of creating resources for NVDA to take advantage of. I am truly curious to know what I, as a user, am benefiting from with this so called fragmentation. Previously add ons would work without issue, now it’s a guessing game as to which add ons will be disabled and stop working when I’d like to update NVDA from, again, one minor version to the next.
As it stands right now, I’m running a portable version of the latest NVDA due to the above, with my main install remaining an older version. Am I alone in viewing this slightly worrying trend?
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of mattias
Lol we got the same answer..
Skickades från E-post för Windows
Från: Supanut Leepaisomboon
So I just got a reply from Codefactory, to a ticket regarding compatibility with NVDA 2022.1 that I submitted way back in April. Below is their response:
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