Date   

Re: Switching from Desktop to Laptop Keyboard

 

Hi,

This works if the laptop keyboard has an embedded numpad. I know at least one brand that doesn’t even include an embedded numpad (ThinkPad is a notable case). I think, at this point, we may need more info from Rechell regarding what computer she’s got and tasks at hand.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2018 8:35 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Switching from Desktop to Laptop Keyboard

 

Joseph,

          Not that all you say is not true, but given the dearth of information we have about the actual hardware being used Ms. Schwartz may be putting the proverbial cart before the horse.  I know a lot of folks who have laptops that, when using them "as though they were a desktop," elect to use and external keyboard (and mouse, where appropriate).   In the case of some of my screen reader users (JAWS or NVDA) they simply presume that if they drop the external keyboard that they must switch to laptop keyboard layout.  That is generally not the case unless one has a netbook, or similar, where the number pad is not a part of the keyboard.  Since I know of relatively few people who have laptops smaller than a 15" screen, they generally have a number pad on their keyboard.

           I just wanted to point out that if the laptop has a number pad as part of its keyboard there is no need to go to laptop layout.  I've never used laptop layout in either NVDA or JAWS and all I use are laptops with their native keyboards.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

The terrible state of public education has paid huge dividends in ignorance.  Huge.  We now have a country that can be told blatant lies — easily checkable, blatant lies — and I’m not talking about the covert workings of the CIA. When we have a terrorist attack, on September 11, 2001 with 19 men — 15 of them are Saudis — and five minutes later the whole country thinks they’re from Iraq — how can you have faith in the public? This is an easily checkable fact. The whole country is like the O.J. Simpson jurors.

      ~ Fran Lebowitz in Ruminator Magazine interview with Susannah McNeely (Aug/Sept 2005)

 

 


Re: Switching from Desktop to Laptop Keyboard

Gene
 

Just get a USB numpad and you can use the desktop layout, which you are using.  I vigorously dislike the laptop layout.  The desktop layout has consistent patterns in its layout, the laptop layout has a much less consistent layout. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2018 10:01 AM
Subject: [nvda] Switching from Desktop to Laptop Keyboard

Hello,

 

I have been using NVDA on a laptop that is connected to an external keyboard.


I need to temporarily travel, and will need to use the native laptop keyboard.

 

Am I need to go through a complete learning curve again ( I see from the user’s guide that many of the commands are different) or is there nay workaround or tips on this?

 

Thanks,

Rechell Schwartz

Guardian Life Insurance Companyn

IT - BTS Group UI/UX

(212)919-3853

 


 


----------------------------------------- This message, and any attachments to it, may contain information that is privileged, confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that any use, dissemination, distribution, copying, or communication of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the message and any attachments. Thank you.



Re: Switching from Desktop to Laptop Keyboard

 

Joseph,

          Not that all you say is not true, but given the dearth of information we have about the actual hardware being used Ms. Schwartz may be putting the proverbial cart before the horse.  I know a lot of folks who have laptops that, when using them "as though they were a desktop," elect to use and external keyboard (and mouse, where appropriate).   In the case of some of my screen reader users (JAWS or NVDA) they simply presume that if they drop the external keyboard that they must switch to laptop keyboard layout.  That is generally not the case unless one has a netbook, or similar, where the number pad is not a part of the keyboard.  Since I know of relatively few people who have laptops smaller than a 15" screen, they generally have a number pad on their keyboard.

           I just wanted to point out that if the laptop has a number pad as part of its keyboard there is no need to go to laptop layout.  I've never used laptop layout in either NVDA or JAWS and all I use are laptops with their native keyboards.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

The terrible state of public education has paid huge dividends in ignorance.  Huge.  We now have a country that can be told blatant lies — easily checkable, blatant lies — and I’m not talking about the covert workings of the CIA. When we have a terrorist attack, on September 11, 2001 with 19 men — 15 of them are Saudis — and five minutes later the whole country thinks they’re from Iraq — how can you have faith in the public? This is an easily checkable fact. The whole country is like the O.J. Simpson jurors.

      ~ Fran Lebowitz in Ruminator Magazine interview with Susannah McNeely (Aug/Sept 2005)

 

 


Re: Effective Use of Say All

Gene
 

You don't have to stop speech with a specific keystroke, though you can.  Shift tab back to the link, the Windows command to move backward, or use shift k, the NVDA link to move to the previous link.  Speech is stopped when you press any key on the keyboard.  That is standard for any screen-reader.  If you press a key that does something, speech stops and something happens, a letter is written, the menus open, whatever the key or combination of keys do.  Control does nothing by itself which is why it is used as the stop speech and take no other action key.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2018 9:56 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Effective Use of Say All

Hi I am not just trying to resume reading where it left off. I may want to select a link on the nav bar that it just announced. How can I do that if:

 

  • Scenario 1: I am able to act quickly enough without shutting the speech off?
  • Scenario 2: I shut the speech off with the Shift key. Now I want to get the link or the textbox that was just announced.

I looked at the user’s guide and tried Insert + Numpad Enter but it brought me back to an object that was announced too far back.

 

Thanks,

Rechell Schwartz

Guardian Life Insurance Company

IT - BTS Group UI/UX

(212)919-3853

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 7:56 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Effective Use of Say All

 

[EXTERNAL]

 

While Say all is reading (or indeed while NVDA is reading anything), you can either:

- Press CONTROL to stop speech.  This works with any synthesizer, but you will need to issue a new command to have NVDA start speaking again.

 

- Press SHIFT to pause speech.  This works with some but not all synthesizers (it works with Windows OneCore and eSpeak NG at least).  This is sometimes more responsive, and you can also press SHIFT again to keep reading from the same point.

 

Regards

 

Quentin.

 

On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 10:50 AM Rechell Schwartz via Groups.Io <rechell_schwartz=glic.com@groups.io> wrote:

Thank you. That was very helpful. How can I stop the Say All to select an item that was just read?

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 7:16 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Effective Use of Say All

 

[EXTERNAL]

 

Re changing the speed, do you mean you've adjusted NVDA's speech rate generally (with NVDA+control+arrows or via the voice settings) but say all is still fast?

 

Say All uses its own configuration profile, so it is possible to have it read differently to when you are navigating around a document with the arrows, for instance.  You can even have it use a different synthesizer if you want.

 

To customise how Say All reads:

 

1) Press NVDA+control+p to open the configuration profiles dialog (or press NVDA+n, then C).

2) Press down arrow to find the one called "Say All".

3) Tab once to "Manual activate" and press enter.  The profile is loaded, and the dialog closes.

4) NVDA is now using the Say All profile.  Make any changes you like, adjust the speed, change the synthesizer or the punctuation level etc as you would normally.

5) Open the configuration profiles dialog again (NVDA+control+p or NVDA+n then c).

6) Press TAB once to the "Manual deactivate" button and press enter to close the profile.  NVDA returns to the normal profile, and will use the settings you just adjusted when you use Say all.

 

You can use the same steps to edit any other profiles.  You can also create profiles and have them triggered when you load certain applications.  To do that, first start the program you want to trigger a profile, then go into the configuration profiles dialog, create a "New" profile with the button marked new, tab to "Use this profile for", then right arrow to "current application (name)" and enter.

 

Any time you are in that program now, the profile you setup is used.  The difference with say all is that because the profile is used whenever you are in that program, to make changes to the profile, simply make them while that program is active - eg if you have a profile for Firefox, when in Firefox, if you slow the speech rate down, that change will be made in the firefox profile, and will take effect whenever you are in Firefox from now on.

 

Regards

 

Quentin.

 

 

On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 9:53 AM Rechell Schwartz via Groups.Io <rechell_schwartz=glic.com@groups.io> wrote:

Hello,

 

Suppose as the screen reader is reading through a bunch of links (which it does VERY quickly), I want to stop it at a certain link and select it. What is the most efficient approach?

 

Also, is there a way to slow the reading of the Say All metadata? I have selected the appropriate speed in the NVDA setup menu, but it only applies this reduced speed to the actual screen text, and NOT the metadata.

 


 

 

----------------------------------------- This message, and any attachments to it, may contain information that is privileged, confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that any use, dissemination, distribution, copying, or communication of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the message and any attachments. Thank you.

 


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

 

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

 

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: Switching from Desktop to Laptop Keyboard

 

Hi,

Most commands that uses Numpad are shifted to main keyboard area on laptop layout. In a way, the laptop layo8ut commands makes slightly more sense (especially object navigation commands, but that’s a bit ahead of the story at the moment).

Speaking of commands, tasks and what not: if I’m not mistaken, based on conversations we had so far, I think you’re having a conflict between an important task or two at hand and suddenly being thrusted into a new screen reader world. Am I correct? If yes, I advise focusing more on the task at hand and how to accomplish it using concepts and commands more than keyboard layout.

To others: some of you might say that it is important to teach people how to use screen readers and commands. I’d argue that, sometimes it is better to let people focus on their work more than the technology that gives them access to information on screen. For this reason, a screen reader expert (or a prospective one) must not only become a teacher, but also a counsellor willing to listen, diagnose, and offer pragmatic solutions that fits the context at hand. Many expert certification programs (including the one offered by NV Access) tells you how things work and what to do for given situations (or simulations), but they won’t teach you how to become a good listener and diagnosing issues beyond the technology they’re teaching; becoming a good listener and able to recognize, diagnose, and offer solutions and advice for issues beyond NVDA takes time to master (and even if we try to teach uniformity, people have different worldviews within their minds and souls).

I may need to devote an entire thread regarding what it truly means to be an NVDA expert and influential add-on developer…

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Rechell Schwartz via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2018 8:01 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Switching from Desktop to Laptop Keyboard

 

Hello,

 

I have been using NVDA on a laptop that is connected to an external keyboard.


I need to temporarily travel, and will need to use the native laptop keyboard.

 

Am I need to go through a complete learning curve again ( I see from the user’s guide that many of the commands are different) or is there nay workaround or tips on this?

 

Thanks,

Rechell Schwartz

Guardian Life Insurance Companyn

IT - BTS Group UI/UX

(212)919-3853

 


 

 

----------------------------------------- This message, and any attachments to it, may contain information that is privileged, confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that any use, dissemination, distribution, copying, or communication of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the message and any attachments. Thank you.

 


Re: Switching from Desktop to Laptop Keyboard

 

Rechell,

           What is the make & model of the laptop?   You should only need to switch to laptop layout if it's a smaller/older laptop that does not have a numberpad as part of the built-in keyboard.  You also have the option of acquiring an external numberpad, and they're cheap and small, if you want some thing portable for travel and happen to have a laptop sans number pad on the keyboard.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

The terrible state of public education has paid huge dividends in ignorance.  Huge.  We now have a country that can be told blatant lies — easily checkable, blatant lies — and I’m not talking about the covert workings of the CIA. When we have a terrorist attack, on September 11, 2001 with 19 men — 15 of them are Saudis — and five minutes later the whole country thinks they’re from Iraq — how can you have faith in the public? This is an easily checkable fact. The whole country is like the O.J. Simpson jurors.

      ~ Fran Lebowitz in Ruminator Magazine interview with Susannah McNeely (Aug/Sept 2005)

 

 


Switching from Desktop to Laptop Keyboard

Rechell Schwartz <rechell_schwartz@...>
 

Hello,

 

I have been using NVDA on a laptop that is connected to an external keyboard.


I need to temporarily travel, and will need to use the native laptop keyboard.

 

Am I need to go through a complete learning curve again ( I see from the user’s guide that many of the commands are different) or is there nay workaround or tips on this?

 

Thanks,

Rechell Schwartz

Guardian Life Insurance Companyn

IT - BTS Group UI/UX

(212)919-3853

 


 


----------------------------------------- This message, and any attachments to it, may contain information that is privileged, confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that any use, dissemination, distribution, copying, or communication of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the message and any attachments. Thank you.



Re: Effective Use of Say All

Rechell Schwartz <rechell_schwartz@...>
 

Hi I am not just trying to resume reading where it left off. I may want to select a link on the nav bar that it just announced. How can I do that if:

 

  • Scenario 1: I am able to act quickly enough without shutting the speech off?
  • Scenario 2: I shut the speech off with the Shift key. Now I want to get the link or the textbox that was just announced.

I looked at the user’s guide and tried Insert + Numpad Enter but it brought me back to an object that was announced too far back.

 

Thanks,

Rechell Schwartz

Guardian Life Insurance Company

IT - BTS Group UI/UX

(212)919-3853

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 7:56 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Effective Use of Say All

 

[EXTERNAL]

 

While Say all is reading (or indeed while NVDA is reading anything), you can either:

- Press CONTROL to stop speech.  This works with any synthesizer, but you will need to issue a new command to have NVDA start speaking again.

 

- Press SHIFT to pause speech.  This works with some but not all synthesizers (it works with Windows OneCore and eSpeak NG at least).  This is sometimes more responsive, and you can also press SHIFT again to keep reading from the same point.

 

Regards

 

Quentin.

 

On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 10:50 AM Rechell Schwartz via Groups.Io <rechell_schwartz=glic.com@groups.io> wrote:

Thank you. That was very helpful. How can I stop the Say All to select an item that was just read?

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 7:16 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Effective Use of Say All

 

[EXTERNAL]

 

Re changing the speed, do you mean you've adjusted NVDA's speech rate generally (with NVDA+control+arrows or via the voice settings) but say all is still fast?

 

Say All uses its own configuration profile, so it is possible to have it read differently to when you are navigating around a document with the arrows, for instance.  You can even have it use a different synthesizer if you want.

 

To customise how Say All reads:

 

1) Press NVDA+control+p to open the configuration profiles dialog (or press NVDA+n, then C).

2) Press down arrow to find the one called "Say All".

3) Tab once to "Manual activate" and press enter.  The profile is loaded, and the dialog closes.

4) NVDA is now using the Say All profile.  Make any changes you like, adjust the speed, change the synthesizer or the punctuation level etc as you would normally.

5) Open the configuration profiles dialog again (NVDA+control+p or NVDA+n then c).

6) Press TAB once to the "Manual deactivate" button and press enter to close the profile.  NVDA returns to the normal profile, and will use the settings you just adjusted when you use Say all.

 

You can use the same steps to edit any other profiles.  You can also create profiles and have them triggered when you load certain applications.  To do that, first start the program you want to trigger a profile, then go into the configuration profiles dialog, create a "New" profile with the button marked new, tab to "Use this profile for", then right arrow to "current application (name)" and enter.

 

Any time you are in that program now, the profile you setup is used.  The difference with say all is that because the profile is used whenever you are in that program, to make changes to the profile, simply make them while that program is active - eg if you have a profile for Firefox, when in Firefox, if you slow the speech rate down, that change will be made in the firefox profile, and will take effect whenever you are in Firefox from now on.

 

Regards

 

Quentin.

 

 

On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 9:53 AM Rechell Schwartz via Groups.Io <rechell_schwartz=glic.com@groups.io> wrote:

Hello,

 

Suppose as the screen reader is reading through a bunch of links (which it does VERY quickly), I want to stop it at a certain link and select it. What is the most efficient approach?

 

Also, is there a way to slow the reading of the Say All metadata? I have selected the appropriate speed in the NVDA setup menu, but it only applies this reduced speed to the actual screen text, and NOT the metadata.

 


 

 

----------------------------------------- This message, and any attachments to it, may contain information that is privileged, confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that any use, dissemination, distribution, copying, or communication of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the message and any attachments. Thank you.

 


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

 

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

 

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA

 

On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 06:48 AM, Rick wrote:
Clearly, NVDA cannot simply look at the color format to determine a number’s negativity, it must look at the underlying value of the cell.
Which is what it should be doing and should be reporting.  That is the data.  I have been saying this all along.

The visual formatting elements are for those that have vision, the sensory apparatus to apprehend it.  It is to aid them with knowing something about the value, but that is separate from the value itself.

I really don't get what's difficult about this in any way, shape, or form.  If something's defined at the cell level as numeric (regardless of whether currency, etc.) its actual value must be reported accurately.  Since there is one major conventional formatting for negative numbers in accounting that relies on color only, and omits the pivotal piece of information about the nature of the value, it's the value that should be spoken.

Even if custom formatting using color is applied to indicate something about positive values that are out of range (which definitely happens) that custom formatting is not of any use to someone who can't see it, but they would need to know in their heads what the acceptable ranges are if they are in a position where evaluating same were part of their job.

Most of the world is sighted, and the use of color to assist the sighted world is never going to go away, nor should it.  It's a perfectly legitimate tool for the majority of users.  But whether it's used or not does not increase nor decrease the burden on those who have no access to it, as they'd need to know what it represents in context and keep that information in their heads (or another external prosthetic memory) to refer to when dealing with those figures.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

The terrible state of public education has paid huge dividends in ignorance.  Huge.  We now have a country that can be told blatant lies — easily checkable, blatant lies — and I’m not talking about the covert workings of the CIA. When we have a terrorist attack, on September 11, 2001 with 19 men — 15 of them are Saudis — and five minutes later the whole country thinks they’re from Iraq — how can you have faith in the public? This is an easily checkable fact. The whole country is like the O.J. Simpson jurors.

      ~ Fran Lebowitz in Ruminator Magazine interview with Susannah McNeely (Aug/Sept 2005)

 

 


Re: OCR programs

Abdurrahman Taş
 

Hi all, Does OmniPage support arabic documents? İf yes, how can reach this program?
Best regards.

Rui Fontes <rui.fontes@tiflotecnia.com> şunları yazdı (22 Eki 2018 13:55):

FineReader, from Abbyy, and OmniPage, from Nuance, are the two best OCR in the world...

Which is the best? Maybe anyone knows... Both are very, very good!

Rui Fontes


Às 04:03 de 22/10/2018, enes sarıbaş escreveu:
hi all,
Is finereader the best OCR package available? Or are there better ones?


Re: Advantages of NVDA over narrator on public terminals

erik burggraaf <erik@...>
 

1, multi-language support, particularly in officially bylingual or culturally diverse regions.

2, ability to provide braille support built in particularly for the deaf-blind and considering low cost options such as orbit and brailleme.

3, Configuration options for custom apps that require extra overhead, although this is terrible design practice and should be avoided.

4, touch screen support for keosks that are touch based.

5, Frequent but optional updates to ensure stability, compatibility and performance.

6, Entities implementing NVDA in public spaces for accessible computing or terminal applications can and should pay something to support the development, but have the flexibility to choose when and how much.

That's what strikes me off the top of my head.

Hope this helps,

Erik

On October 21, 2018 1:32:23 AM "hurrikennyandopo ..." <hurrikennyandopo@...> wrote:

Hi guys,


I got asked this question about the advantages of NVDA over Narrator on public terminals where ever these may be...


I am talking about public terminals that the sighted can use where ever these may be. Places like libraries, information centres airports (where these terminals are) as well etcetera. The commercial screen readers are not in the picture because of price.


The question is below:


" My question to you is what advantages would it give our blind or visually impaired customers having both Windows 10 Narrator and NVDA available to use on public computers? I would be interested in supporting installing it at if there were advantages and we could work thru any technical issues. Let me know what you think".


This same question could also come up at any IT department that is approached to install NVDA to a public terminal (where ever these may be). The above is used as an example.

I am guessing that for any technical information - that could be pointed towards the developers of the NVDA project.


They could be using a windows 7 machine right up to Windows 10.


Looking forward to your feedback on advantages of NVDA over Narrator. Thanks everyone.


Gene NZ



--
Check out my website for NVDA tutorials and other blindness related material at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net Regardless of where you are in New Zealand if you are near one of the APNK sites you can use a copy of the NVDA screen reader on one of their computers. To find out which locations (or location) is near to you please visit http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries (Aotearoa People's Network Kaharoa). To find an NVDA certified expert near you, please visit the following link https://certification.nvaccess.org/. The certification page contains the official list of NVDA certified individuals from around the world, who have sat and successfully passed the NVDA expert exam.


Re: Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA

Richard Wells
 

I have seen this issue intermittently over the last three or four versions of Windows 10 and NVDA and I only use stable ones as well.


On 10/23/2018 5:47 AM, farhan israk wrote:

I started using Windows 10 in January, 2018. Since then I'm facing this problem. I don't use insider version. I use stable version of Windows 10 and regularly update it. Now I'm using Windows 10 1803. For this reason I use jaws. There I don't face this type of problem. But, I want to use nvda. How to send debug log?


On Tue, 23 Oct 2018, 2:02 pm Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io, <bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:
You have to admire the creativity of auto spell check sometimes, How a mis
spelling of the word sighted, became segregated is anyone's guess.
 Still it could have been worse, it could have put in a rude word instead!
 grin. Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io"
<bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 5:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA


> Yes sometimes it seems that nvda is reading an old buffer. I seem to think
> some recent work is going on in this regard actually, but normally, simply
> bringing up a menu, then cancelling it will wake up the new buffer. I'm
> not sure why this sometimes happens but suspect nvda is reading a large
> amount of text its already  buffered for reading and has missed the fact
> that the text has gone as this is in the web page buffer, not the nvda
> speech one.
> As for announcing about emails coming in, this is what segregated people
> might see in the tray or via a balloon or whatever alert type is used. I
> suspect that this can be turned off in two ways, You can do it globally in
> the settings of nvda, which in my view is dangerous, or in the software
> that is sending them, ie do not put alerts in ... add where according to
> the software here!
>
> Dropbox is always doing this as its active all the time and if you have
> shared folders when somebody changes something on one of those you get an
> alert about it.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal E-mail to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rechell Schwartz via Groups.Io"
> <rechell_schwartz=glic.com@groups.io>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 4:50 PM
> Subject: [nvda] Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA
>
>
> Hello,
>
> Is there anyway to stop NVDA from start announcing my emails when I am
> viewing a web page?
> Also, when I switch to another web page, it still keep reading out the
> contents of the previous web page. What do I need to do to get NVDA to
> cancel the old context and switch to the new context?
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> ----------------------------------------- This message, and any
> attachments to it, may contain information that is privileged,
> confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the
> reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified
> that any use, dissemination, distribution, copying, or communication of
> this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in
> error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete
> the message and any attachments. Thank you.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>






Re: Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA

Rechell Schwartz <rechell_schwartz@...>
 

I am sending mine too since I had problems too.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2018 7:42 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA

 

[EXTERNAL]

 

HI Farhan,

 

In Windows 10:

1) Press WINDOWS+E to open File Explorer

2) Press alt+d to go to the address bar (File Explorer has an address bar now)

3) type: %temp% and press ENTER (That's the word temp with a percent sign before and after)

4) In the folder that opens, look for "nvda.log" and "nvda-old.log"  they are your last two NVDA logs (or current and last if NVDA is currently running).

5) Copy whichever one has the relevant information and paste it into a message / add it as an attachment to me at info@... (you can reply here if you paste the text in the body, but if you attach the file itself, send it to me directly as you can't send attachments to the group).

 

Regards

 

Quentin.

 

On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 9:47 PM farhan israk <fahim.net.2014@...> wrote:

I started using Windows 10 in January, 2018. Since then I'm facing this problem. I don't use insider version. I use stable version of Windows 10 and regularly update it. Now I'm using Windows 10 1803. For this reason I use jaws. There I don't face this type of problem. But, I want to use nvda. How to send debug log?

 

On Tue, 23 Oct 2018, 2:02 pm Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io, <bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

You have to admire the creativity of auto spell check sometimes, How a mis
spelling of the word sighted, became segregated is anyone's guess.
 Still it could have been worse, it could have put in a rude word instead!
 grin. Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io"
<bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 5:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA


> Yes sometimes it seems that nvda is reading an old buffer. I seem to think
> some recent work is going on in this regard actually, but normally, simply
> bringing up a menu, then cancelling it will wake up the new buffer. I'm
> not sure why this sometimes happens but suspect nvda is reading a large
> amount of text its already  buffered for reading and has missed the fact
> that the text has gone as this is in the web page buffer, not the nvda
> speech one.
> As for announcing about emails coming in, this is what segregated people
> might see in the tray or via a balloon or whatever alert type is used. I
> suspect that this can be turned off in two ways, You can do it globally in
> the settings of nvda, which in my view is dangerous, or in the software
> that is sending them, ie do not put alerts in ... add where according to
> the software here!
>
> Dropbox is always doing this as its active all the time and if you have
> shared folders when somebody changes something on one of those you get an
> alert about it.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal E-mail to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rechell Schwartz via Groups.Io"
> <rechell_schwartz=glic.com@groups.io>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 4:50 PM
> Subject: [nvda] Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA
>
>
> Hello,
>
> Is there anyway to stop NVDA from start announcing my emails when I am
> viewing a web page?
> Also, when I switch to another web page, it still keep reading out the
> contents of the previous web page. What do I need to do to get NVDA to
> cancel the old context and switch to the new context?
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> ----------------------------------------- This message, and any
> attachments to it, may contain information that is privileged,
> confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the
> reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified
> that any use, dissemination, distribution, copying, or communication of
> this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in
> error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete
> the message and any attachments. Thank you.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>




 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

 

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


 


----------------------------------------- This message, and any attachments to it, may contain information that is privileged, confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that any use, dissemination, distribution, copying, or communication of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the message and any attachments. Thank you.



Re: can't exit out of winamp

Brice Mijares
 

You probably mean win Key plus tab. Point is, win amp isn't ready for prime time.

On 10/22/2018 7:48 PM, Robert Doc Wright godfearer wrote:
you can press winKey +t
arrow to the task and press the applications key
arrow up to close window and enter
or
prss control+shift+escape to open processes
arrow down to the offending process and press alt+e to end it.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rosemarie Chavarria" <knitqueen2007@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 7:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't exit out of winamp
I did set it to classic view. The only way I could exit was to reboot the computer. I shouldn't have to do that every time I want to exit.
-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 6:45 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't exit out of winamp
did you set it to classic view?
there is a  skin that is called classic view that you need to make sure it is selected
the other skins are not blind friendly
hth
Hank
On 10/22/2018 6:43 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:
That didn't work either. I just tried it.



-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Brice Mijares
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 6:42 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't exit out of winamp

You may try alt space bar follow by c.

On 10/22/2018 6:37 PM, Rosemarie Chavarria wrote:
Hi, everyone,

I tried exiting winamp but this new version isn't responding. Is
there a different way to get out? I tried alt f-4 and x but it didn't work.
To be honest, I hate this version of winamp!

Rosemarie






--
check out my song on youtube
https://youtu.be/YeWgx2LRu7Y


How to size and position an Embedded object in Power Point

Rick
 

I am using the latest version of Power Point desktop app on a Windows 10 pro computer with the latest released version of NVDA, no addins.

 

Power Point provides the capability to embed objects into a presentation (e.g. Visio document). This provides the capability to open the embedded object in Power Point with the native application for editing. It also preserves the resolution and can reduce file size. If I select one of these embedded objects and press the application key, I am presented with several options (e.g. format object and edit alt text). If this were a graphic (like a jpeg, png, etc.) I would be presented with a third option to size and position the graphic.

 

If I choose the option to format the object, an older, non-accessible dialog appears. There are visual tabs, one of which allow one to change the size and position of the embedded object, but I cannot find a way to navigate to these tabs. If a sighted person selects one of these tabs using the mouse, I am able to edit the size and position, but I cannot find a way to select any of these tabs using the keyboard. I have used all the current NVDA navigation methods (screen and object review) along with the traditional CTRL+Tab key combination without success.

 

Any ideas?

 

Rick

 


Re: Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA

Quentin Christensen
 

HI Farhan,

In Windows 10:
1) Press WINDOWS+E to open File Explorer
2) Press alt+d to go to the address bar (File Explorer has an address bar now)
3) type: %temp% and press ENTER (That's the word temp with a percent sign before and after)
4) In the folder that opens, look for "nvda.log" and "nvda-old.log"  they are your last two NVDA logs (or current and last if NVDA is currently running).
5) Copy whichever one has the relevant information and paste it into a message / add it as an attachment to me at info@... (you can reply here if you paste the text in the body, but if you attach the file itself, send it to me directly as you can't send attachments to the group).

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 9:47 PM farhan israk <fahim.net.2014@...> wrote:

I started using Windows 10 in January, 2018. Since then I'm facing this problem. I don't use insider version. I use stable version of Windows 10 and regularly update it. Now I'm using Windows 10 1803. For this reason I use jaws. There I don't face this type of problem. But, I want to use nvda. How to send debug log?


On Tue, 23 Oct 2018, 2:02 pm Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io, <bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:
You have to admire the creativity of auto spell check sometimes, How a mis
spelling of the word sighted, became segregated is anyone's guess.
 Still it could have been worse, it could have put in a rude word instead!
 grin. Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io"
<bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 5:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA


> Yes sometimes it seems that nvda is reading an old buffer. I seem to think
> some recent work is going on in this regard actually, but normally, simply
> bringing up a menu, then cancelling it will wake up the new buffer. I'm
> not sure why this sometimes happens but suspect nvda is reading a large
> amount of text its already  buffered for reading and has missed the fact
> that the text has gone as this is in the web page buffer, not the nvda
> speech one.
> As for announcing about emails coming in, this is what segregated people
> might see in the tray or via a balloon or whatever alert type is used. I
> suspect that this can be turned off in two ways, You can do it globally in
> the settings of nvda, which in my view is dangerous, or in the software
> that is sending them, ie do not put alerts in ... add where according to
> the software here!
>
> Dropbox is always doing this as its active all the time and if you have
> shared folders when somebody changes something on one of those you get an
> alert about it.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal E-mail to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rechell Schwartz via Groups.Io"
> <rechell_schwartz=glic.com@groups.io>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 4:50 PM
> Subject: [nvda] Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA
>
>
> Hello,
>
> Is there anyway to stop NVDA from start announcing my emails when I am
> viewing a web page?
> Also, when I switch to another web page, it still keep reading out the
> contents of the previous web page. What do I need to do to get NVDA to
> cancel the old context and switch to the new context?
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> ----------------------------------------- This message, and any
> attachments to it, may contain information that is privileged,
> confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the
> reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified
> that any use, dissemination, distribution, copying, or communication of
> this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in
> error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete
> the message and any attachments. Thank you.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>






--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: can't exit out of winamp

Robert Doc Wright godfearer
 

I wihsh I knew why my experience is so different than yours. i have not had a problem since installing it. I'm running it on windows 10 pro which shouldn't make a difference.

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 11:17 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't exit out of winamp

Pressing the alt key and arrowing up to C and hitting enter would close the program but I couldn't even do that in the new version.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 8:06 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't exit out of winamp

 

I don't know about the new version of Winamp.  In the old versions, presssing just alt by itself brings up a menu something like what is referred to as the system menu.  You will see, if you up or down arrow through the menu, a close item.  the command for it is c. 

But when I tried c, it didn't work.  Press alt, up arrow, its much shorter, until you get to close and press enter.  Does that close the program? 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

 

Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 8:37 PM

Subject: [nvda] can't exit out of winamp

 

Hi, everyone,

 

I tried exiting winamp but this new version isn't responding. Is there a different way to get out? I tried alt f-4 and x but it didn't work. To be honest, I hate this version of winamp!

 

Rosemarie

 

 


Re: determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA

Rick
 

Hello Gene:

 

It’s not that the cells aren’t being read it is that the value reported in some cells is not negative. You can still select all the cells and apply formatting to change this behavior.

 

Excel is like a table in Word, a grid of data. Typically, one row would be considered a header that would contain descriptions of the columns of data below them. Then, under this header row would be rows of data, which can be textural, numeric or a combination of both. In the case of an accounting sheet, the row contents might be similar to a checking account register, with items like transaction number, description, vendor, amount and balance. Only the amount and balance should be formatted as numbers, most likely currency.

 

You can label header rows and columns so that descriptions are also spoken when reading a cell’s content. Moving around the cells does not require the typical table navigation commands like used in browse mode. Simply using the arrow keys will allow you to move up, down, left and right a cell at a time.

 

Rick

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 10:44 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA

 

Rick and all

To use the format option you speak of, wouldn't that mean that all the cells would have to be selected first?  The very cells that aren't indicated when reading?  If so, that's a classic catch 22.  I don't use Excel but if it works the way programs usually work, to change something, it must be selected first. 

 

If that isn't how Excel works, it would be interesting and useful to know.

 

Laurie

I find your objection that undesired reading might occur if the way things are read is changed to be without merit.  first, the problem is that what is needed to be read isn't read at all.  Assumedly, other color methods for indicating states or attributes of numbers would not be identical to this means of indicating negative.  If they were, sighted users wouldn't know what is meant.  So the screen-reader should be able to recognize this specific case while not causing problems.  But if a problem is found, it can be corrected while still solving the current problem. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 4:13 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA

 

Excellent post-- thank you Rick!

And, for whatever it's worth, I hope that NVDA maintains the way it reads such things currently since we could end up with some unwanted/unforeseen consequences if simply reading the color displayed is replaced with something else. Thanks,
LM

--------------------------------------------
On Mon, 10/22/18, Rick <softwarethatworks@...> wrote:

Hello Mary and Quentin:
After following this thread since its beginning, I took some time to open Excel and play with number formatting. Excel essentially provides 4 standard ways to format negative numbers and currency:
• With a leading negative sign
• Bright red without a negative sign
• With parenthesis
• Bright red with parenthesis
The case Mary seems to describe is the second, where negative numbers are simply bright red without a negative sign. As Quentin pointed out, you could set NVDA to alert for color changes to signal negative numbers.
This case clearly violates WCAG guideline 1.4.1, do not use color alone to convey meaning. While I understand that it may be a common practice to format negative numbers in red, one would hope this practice would be deprecated as we move towards a more accessible world. This is not only bad for screen reader users but also a problem with printing on black and white printers and for people with some forms of color blindness.
Mary, are you able to contact the spreadsheet creator and explain the accessibility issue with the chosen display format? Otherwise, are you able to edit the spreadsheet to change the formatting option? If you select the range of cells, press the application key and select format cells. Tab a few times to get to how negative numbers are formatted and choose a more accessible format for yourself. The first tab should get you to the category, which is probably currency. The next tab is for number of digits after the decimal point. Next is the currency symbol. One more tab gets you to the negative number format. Now, use the up and down arrow to select your desired format (the top one is the conventional negative number sign). Remember, if you choose a format which uses parenthesis that your NVDA symbol level is set to most or all or you will not hear left parenthesis spoken when the number is spoken.
I formatted some negative numbers to display in the inaccessible format and ran the built-in accessibility checker. Sadly, it reported no errors. I reported this issue to Microsoft so hopefully it will be corrected in future versions.
Rick
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 11:12 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA
Thanks, Quentin, for answering the question. I didn’t send the sheet I have a long, because it’s not something that I personally have control of. It’s an organization who owns the sheet. So I didn’t feel right about just sending it out since it’s financial. With regard to the question of what should be overwritten or not, it seems to me that if this color convention is well-established, any sighted person using the sheet is going to know that red means negative. Therefore, the important information is not the color it’s the state of the number. So it should be overwritten. What you want is the message conveyed by the color, not just knowledge of the color. As a blind person, you might not know that red  means negative, so you might not get the message. It would be like those talking signals they have where it says the walk sign is on. It doesn’t say the green light is on. I suppose most everybody knows that a green light means walk. But they convey the message about walking, rather than the fact that the light is green or that the little stick figure is on or whatever the picture is. Another example is the dots which means that there is a dialog box. Some screen readers like Jaws used to say…. Others would say opens a dialogue or has dialogue. I think the ones who say opens or has dialogue got it right, and the ones who say… Didn’t get it right. Why on earth would I necessarily know or need to know that… Means there’s a dialogue that will open if you click this.
Mary

On Oct 21, 2018, at 9:46 PM, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
I did also reply to Brian's other thread on this topic, and while I'm just personally interested in the discussion, I realised no-one has actually answered Mary's original question yet.  While you can't specifically have NVDA decode negative numbers which aren't formatted as such, you can have NVDA report when the font colour changes.  This would be most useful where you spreadsheet contains say all black text except for negative numbers.  To do that, press NVDA+CONTROL+D to open the document formatting options, then press alt+c to jump to "colour".  Press spacebar to toggle whether that is checked (you want it checked to report colour changes), and press ENTER to close the settings.  Now when you get to a negative number, NVDA should report it as "bright red".
As for why it is reported as "bright red 18.00" and not "-18.00", basically, that's what the person who setup the spreadsheet told Excel to tell us.  A sighted user on the same sheet doesn't see "-18.00", they see "18.00" in bright red, and interpret that to mean -18.  In the same way if the actual contents of the cell are "=A1-B1" they see the number, not the formula, unless you press CONTROL+` to toggle displaying formulas instead of values.
I can see Brian's argument for overriding the specified formatting here, but would have to then ask back - in which cases should we override what the creator of the spreadsheet has deliberately setup, and in which cases should we defer to what they wanted?
Regards

Quentin.
On Fri, Oct 19, 2018 at 4:20 PM Pranav Lal <pranav.lal@...> wrote:
Hi all,

Can someone share a sample sheet with this kind of formatting?

Pranav


--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager
Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
www.nvaccess.org 
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA

Rick
 

Hello Brian et.al.

 

Assuming that the NVDA community wants the screen reader to change its behavior and indicate negative numbers as such and not as formatted, what is the precise desired behavior? I use the word precise because that is what the NVDA developers need in order to apply new behavior.

 

Let’s take the example of bright red to indicate a negative number. Clearly, NVDA cannot simply look at the color format to determine a number’s negativity, it must look at the underlying value of the cell. For example, in the industry where I work, we use conditional formatting to apply red to values that are out of a particular range. Once NVDA determines that the cell contains a negative number, it can then speak its value. However, I would want that value spoken with the applied formatting (e.g. currency, number of decimal places, color, bold, italic, etc.)

Now, what if the value is formatted to use parenthesis to indicate a negative number? Should NVDA speak a negative number or read the parenthesis? If it speaks a negative number, again, it must retain the remaining formatting as above.

 

As Quentin pointed out, his choices for number and currency formatting are different than mine, suggesting variants due to localization. NVDA would need to consider these variants when applying formatting.

 

This all works well when moving around from cell to cell and the whole cell value is spoken. What should happen when using the numpad keyboard to read a cell’s content one character at a time? Should it inject a phantom negative sign or should it read the cells content as formatted? What if parenthesis are present, should it ignore them? Currently, when reading by word using the numpad, the negative sign is treated as a separate word. Again, should NVDA inject a phantom negative sign for numbers formatted not to use a negative sign?

 

I am also concerned that having NVDA check each cell for poorly formatted numbers could impose a performance degradation, resulting in slower response to reading a cell’s content. I would hope that this could be a feature that could be disabled. I, for one, will never create a spreadsheet using these formatting mechanisms.

 

One last caveat to consider. Only Excel knows the underlying numeric value of these cells. If the cells are copied to Word, only the formatted characters are copied. If the worksheet is printed to a pdf, only the formatted values are present. If the worksheet is printed and later scanned using OCR, only the formatted value is present.

 

While a band-aid could be applied to NVDA to manage poorly formatted negative numbers in Excel, it does not change the fact that these formats exist outside of Excel and that we as screen reader users must be able to deal with interpreting these archaic methods of representation. Even sighted people must understand the underlying meaning of color to decide if it means a negative number or a out of range value, or whatever the designer meant to convey with color. As I stated earlier, use of color alone to convey meaning violates one of the Web Content Accessibility Guidelines. Educating content creators is another avenue that must not be overlooked.

 

Rick

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 10:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] determining the color of a text in Excel with NVDA

 

Mary,

          Thank you.  The long and the short of it is that if accessibility software, any accessibility software, when working with numeric values does not actually speak those numeric values it is creating inaccessibility.   Formatting is nothing but a visual convenience that means something to those with the sensory apparatus to apprehend it.  It is not the essence of the thing.

           Speaking numbers as numbers, currency as currency, text as text, is what determines accessibility.  In the case of Excel, given the preponderance of numeric data contained in spreadsheets, absolutely dictates that a screen reader would indicate to the user what is actually there, and what a sighted reader knows is actually there (and would read that way, too).  If I were being asked to read a negative number, presented to me in any way, to someone who cannot see I would say "negative" or "minus" the value, period.  It's the only way the essential information can be conveyed.  The same should be true regardless of the formatting style chosen for a numeric cell.  Its value is the one and only thing of significance if one is trying to communicate actual meaning.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

The terrible state of public education has paid huge dividends in ignorance.  Huge.  We now have a country that can be told blatant lies — easily checkable, blatant lies — and I’m not talking about the covert workings of the CIA. When we have a terrorist attack, on September 11, 2001 with 19 men — 15 of them are Saudis — and five minutes later the whole country thinks they’re from Iraq — how can you have faith in the public? This is an easily checkable fact. The whole country is like the O.J. Simpson jurors.

      ~ Fran Lebowitz in Ruminator Magazine interview with Susannah McNeely (Aug/Sept 2005)

 

 


Re: Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA

farhan israk
 

I started using Windows 10 in January, 2018. Since then I'm facing this problem. I don't use insider version. I use stable version of Windows 10 and regularly update it. Now I'm using Windows 10 1803. For this reason I use jaws. There I don't face this type of problem. But, I want to use nvda. How to send debug log?


On Tue, 23 Oct 2018, 2:02 pm Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io, <bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:
You have to admire the creativity of auto spell check sometimes, How a mis
spelling of the word sighted, became segregated is anyone's guess.
 Still it could have been worse, it could have put in a rude word instead!
 grin. Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io"
<bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 5:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA


> Yes sometimes it seems that nvda is reading an old buffer. I seem to think
> some recent work is going on in this regard actually, but normally, simply
> bringing up a menu, then cancelling it will wake up the new buffer. I'm
> not sure why this sometimes happens but suspect nvda is reading a large
> amount of text its already  buffered for reading and has missed the fact
> that the text has gone as this is in the web page buffer, not the nvda
> speech one.
> As for announcing about emails coming in, this is what segregated people
> might see in the tray or via a balloon or whatever alert type is used. I
> suspect that this can be turned off in two ways, You can do it globally in
> the settings of nvda, which in my view is dangerous, or in the software
> that is sending them, ie do not put alerts in ... add where according to
> the software here!
>
> Dropbox is always doing this as its active all the time and if you have
> shared folders when somebody changes something on one of those you get an
> alert about it.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal E-mail to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rechell Schwartz via Groups.Io"
> <rechell_schwartz=glic.com@groups.io>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2018 4:50 PM
> Subject: [nvda] Sometimes I Can't Stop NVDA
>
>
> Hello,
>
> Is there anyway to stop NVDA from start announcing my emails when I am
> viewing a web page?
> Also, when I switch to another web page, it still keep reading out the
> contents of the previous web page. What do I need to do to get NVDA to
> cancel the old context and switch to the new context?
>
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