Date   

hims Qbraille XL list

Afik Souffir
 

 

Hello all

 

I've created a Qbraille XL list for your questions and suggestions.

 

Feel free to join and distribute it out.

 

The subscription address is

q-braille-xl+subscribe@groups.io

 

 

 

 

 

 

Cordialement,

 

Afik Souffir

 

Portable: 0505782208

Addresse email

Afik.souffir@outlook.com

 

 


Re: Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

CARLOS-ESTEBAN
 

Hello.

Well, a possible option is use the reader mode of the browsers. In Firefox and new Microsoft Edge press f9.

In Chrome, go to the page chrome://flags. In the edit box search, write "reader mode" and press enter. After, press tab and enabled this feature.

Restart Chrome and after you can press f6, and tab two times for the button enable reader mode and press enter.

An other solution is use the add-on Virtual Revieu, but I dont know if this addon work in web pages.

Regards.


El 7/8/2020 a las 9:46, Felix G. escribió:
Hi!
I've been reading along and I know this feeling. I often refer to it
as the user experience that nobody designed. On the one hand there's a
screen reader developer, on the other there's an app developer or web
designer. They don't know each other, and yet their decisions converge
on our experience of their products. In the sighted world nobody would
get away with it, but we get translations of translations, almost
never what someone consciously designed.
Best,
Felix


Am Do., 6. Aug. 2020 um 17:58 Uhr schrieb Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>:
On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 10:34 AM, Gene wrote:

People would never put up with a human reader announcing all this clutter.

I'd say that's absolutely true, but they'd probably also expect a human reader to say something about the fact that there is a figure/image present and what it illustrates as a part of the reading, unless the person their reading for has explicitly requested they only read the main text.

I actually feel your pain, and have had exactly that same feeling many, many times with multiple screen readers.  I hope that someday there arrives AI sophisticated enough to screen read the way "your average sighted person" would likely take in looking at content.  Heaven knows we virtually never look at scads of the navigation links and the like at the outset, but the main page content first.

But at this point in time, since a screen reader itself has no idea, really, of what it is you (any you) are looking for on a given page it offers "way too much" rather than allowing you to possibly miss the presence of something.

It would be nice if all of these sorts of things were arranged in "chunks" of announcements that fit a certain class, and that you could have the option of turning off the entire class with one checkbox, or going through the individual things announced and unchecking the ones you explicitly don't want while retaining the others.  And do I ever know what a PITA that would be to code, and for the user to slog through, but in any really complex system where a high level of customization is wanted or needed, this is how its obtained.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde






--

Carlos Esteban Martínez Macías.

Músico (pianista) y también ayuda a usuarios ciegos con el uso de lectores de pantalla y tecnología.

Experto certificado en el lector de pantalla NVDA.


Musicien (pianist) and also help to the blind people in the use of screen readers and technology. Certified expert in the screen reader NVDA.


Re: Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

Gene
 

I don't know who is interested in the topic of what is announced during web page navigation but I'm going to start a topic on what is helpful and useful and what is just clutter on the chat list so those interested may want to join. The chat list is a low traffic list.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Joseph Lee
Sent: Friday, August 07, 2020 10:21 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

Hi,
It's a combination of user expectations, what document writers wrote, and specifications. In case of "figure/out of figure", it's more towards ARIA specs, how web authors wrote their sites 9including which framework is in use), and how NVDA got such an information.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, August 7, 2020 8:19 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

I should clarify, based on what Brian said, that I don't object to the text being read in this instance or in general. I object to figure and out of figure being announced . Just as I object to announcement of bloc quotes being on. Its not the text being read I object to but people in general don't benefit from hearing such information. It seems to me that the designers should consider what is useful infrmation in terms of navigating and in terms of what people generally use when determining what should be announced by default. I don't know how they determine what is announced.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Felix G.
Sent: Friday, August 07, 2020 9:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

Hi!
I've been reading along and I know this feeling. I often refer to it as the user experience that nobody designed. On the one hand there's a screen reader developer, on the other there's an app developer or web designer. They don't know each other, and yet their decisions converge on our experience of their products. In the sighted world nobody would get away with it, but we get translations of translations, almost never what someone consciously designed.
Best,
Felix


Am Do., 6. Aug. 2020 um 17:58 Uhr schrieb Brian Vogel
<@britechguy>:

On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 10:34 AM, Gene wrote:

People would never put up with a human reader announcing all this clutter.

I'd say that's absolutely true, but they'd probably also expect a
human reader to say something about the fact that there is a
figure/image present and what it illustrates as a part of the reading,
unless the person their reading for has explicitly requested they only
read the main text.

I actually feel your pain, and have had exactly that same feeling
many, many times with multiple screen readers. I hope that someday
there arrives AI sophisticated enough to screen read the way "your
average sighted person" would likely take in looking at content.
Heaven knows we virtually never look at scads of the navigation links
and the like at the outset, but the main page content first.

But at this point in time, since a screen reader itself has no idea,
really, of what it is you (any you) are looking for on a given page it
offers "way too much" rather than allowing you to possibly miss the
presence of something.

It would be nice if all of these sorts of things were arranged in "chunks"
of announcements that fit a certain class, and that you could have the
option of turning off the entire class with one checkbox, or going
through the individual things announced and unchecking the ones you
explicitly don't want while retaining the others. And do I ever know
what a PITA that would be to code, and for the user to slog through,
but in any really complex system where a high level of customization
is wanted or needed, this is how its obtained.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

~ Oscar Wilde




Re: Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

 

Hi,
It's a combination of user expectations, what document writers wrote, and specifications. In case of "figure/out of figure", it's more towards ARIA specs, how web authors wrote their sites 9including which framework is in use), and how NVDA got such an information.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, August 7, 2020 8:19 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

I should clarify, based on what Brian said, that I don't object to the text being read in this instance or in general. I object to figure and out of figure being announced . Just as I object to announcement of bloc quotes being on. Its not the text being read I object to but people in general don't benefit from hearing such information. It seems to me that the designers should consider what is useful infrmation in terms of navigating and in terms of what people generally use when determining what should be announced by default. I don't know how they determine what is announced.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Felix G.
Sent: Friday, August 07, 2020 9:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

Hi!
I've been reading along and I know this feeling. I often refer to it as the user experience that nobody designed. On the one hand there's a screen reader developer, on the other there's an app developer or web designer. They don't know each other, and yet their decisions converge on our experience of their products. In the sighted world nobody would get away with it, but we get translations of translations, almost never what someone consciously designed.
Best,
Felix


Am Do., 6. Aug. 2020 um 17:58 Uhr schrieb Brian Vogel
<@britechguy>:

On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 10:34 AM, Gene wrote:

People would never put up with a human reader announcing all this clutter.

I'd say that's absolutely true, but they'd probably also expect a
human reader to say something about the fact that there is a
figure/image present and what it illustrates as a part of the reading,
unless the person their reading for has explicitly requested they only
read the main text.

I actually feel your pain, and have had exactly that same feeling
many, many times with multiple screen readers. I hope that someday
there arrives AI sophisticated enough to screen read the way "your
average sighted person" would likely take in looking at content.
Heaven knows we virtually never look at scads of the navigation links
and the like at the outset, but the main page content first.

But at this point in time, since a screen reader itself has no idea,
really, of what it is you (any you) are looking for on a given page it
offers "way too much" rather than allowing you to possibly miss the
presence of something.

It would be nice if all of these sorts of things were arranged in "chunks"
of announcements that fit a certain class, and that you could have the
option of turning off the entire class with one checkbox, or going
through the individual things announced and unchecking the ones you
explicitly don't want while retaining the others. And do I ever know
what a PITA that would be to code, and for the user to slog through,
but in any really complex system where a high level of customization
is wanted or needed, this is how its obtained.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

~ Oscar Wilde




Re: Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

Gene
 

I should clarify, based on what Brian said, that I don't object to the text being read in this instance or in general. I object to figure and out of figure being announced . Just as I object to announcement of bloc quotes being on. Its not the text being read I object to but people in general don't benefit from hearing such information. It seems to me that the designers should consider what is useful infrmation in terms of navigating and in terms of what people generally use when determining what should be announced by default. I don't know how they determine what is announced.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Felix G.
Sent: Friday, August 07, 2020 9:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

Hi!
I've been reading along and I know this feeling. I often refer to it
as the user experience that nobody designed. On the one hand there's a
screen reader developer, on the other there's an app developer or web
designer. They don't know each other, and yet their decisions converge
on our experience of their products. In the sighted world nobody would
get away with it, but we get translations of translations, almost
never what someone consciously designed.
Best,
Felix


Am Do., 6. Aug. 2020 um 17:58 Uhr schrieb Brian Vogel <@britechguy>:

On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 10:34 AM, Gene wrote:

People would never put up with a human reader announcing all this clutter.

I'd say that's absolutely true, but they'd probably also expect a human reader to say something about the fact that there is a figure/image present and what it illustrates as a part of the reading, unless the person their reading for has explicitly requested they only read the main text.

I actually feel your pain, and have had exactly that same feeling many, many times with multiple screen readers. I hope that someday there arrives AI sophisticated enough to screen read the way "your average sighted person" would likely take in looking at content. Heaven knows we virtually never look at scads of the navigation links and the like at the outset, but the main page content first.

But at this point in time, since a screen reader itself has no idea, really, of what it is you (any you) are looking for on a given page it offers "way too much" rather than allowing you to possibly miss the presence of something.

It would be nice if all of these sorts of things were arranged in "chunks" of announcements that fit a certain class, and that you could have the option of turning off the entire class with one checkbox, or going through the individual things announced and unchecking the ones you explicitly don't want while retaining the others. And do I ever know what a PITA that would be to code, and for the user to slog through, but in any really complex system where a high level of customization is wanted or needed, this is how its obtained.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

~ Oscar Wilde




Re: Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

 

On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 10:46 AM, Felix G. wrote:
but we get translations of translations, almost never what someone consciously designed.
-
Because, at least to some extent, that's what happens when you translate one sense to another.  There is no way to make a great deal of what "makes perfect sense" in the sensory idiom for which it was designed to have that perfect sense in another.  All accessibility is a workaround.

Not that I don't understand what you're saying, as I've said it, too, but it is not something you can ever entirely get away from.

And you also say, "In the sighted world nobody would get away with it."   And to a large extent, that's true, but that's not because it's "the sighted world" but because the things designed are being primarily designed with the sense of sight in mind.   Given that the vast majority of the world can see, and that the medium itself is meant to be consumed via sight, that's what makes the most sense, wouldn't you say?

Expecting websites and print media to be primarily designed with the blind in mind would be akin to expecting music to be composed primarily with the deaf in mind.  [And that's not to excuse plain sloppiness and inaccessibility, either.]
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: Unnecessary verbiage that wastes my time

Felix G.
 

Hi!
I've been reading along and I know this feeling. I often refer to it
as the user experience that nobody designed. On the one hand there's a
screen reader developer, on the other there's an app developer or web
designer. They don't know each other, and yet their decisions converge
on our experience of their products. In the sighted world nobody would
get away with it, but we get translations of translations, almost
never what someone consciously designed.
Best,
Felix


Am Do., 6. Aug. 2020 um 17:58 Uhr schrieb Brian Vogel <@britechguy>:


On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 10:34 AM, Gene wrote:

People would never put up with a human reader announcing all this clutter.

I'd say that's absolutely true, but they'd probably also expect a human reader to say something about the fact that there is a figure/image present and what it illustrates as a part of the reading, unless the person their reading for has explicitly requested they only read the main text.

I actually feel your pain, and have had exactly that same feeling many, many times with multiple screen readers. I hope that someday there arrives AI sophisticated enough to screen read the way "your average sighted person" would likely take in looking at content. Heaven knows we virtually never look at scads of the navigation links and the like at the outset, but the main page content first.

But at this point in time, since a screen reader itself has no idea, really, of what it is you (any you) are looking for on a given page it offers "way too much" rather than allowing you to possibly miss the presence of something.

It would be nice if all of these sorts of things were arranged in "chunks" of announcements that fit a certain class, and that you could have the option of turning off the entire class with one checkbox, or going through the individual things announced and unchecking the ones you explicitly don't want while retaining the others. And do I ever know what a PITA that would be to code, and for the user to slog through, but in any really complex system where a high level of customization is wanted or needed, this is how its obtained.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

~ Oscar Wilde




Nvda and Thunderbird

Jarek.Krcmar
 

Hello everyone,
I already have a problem with Thunderbird solved.
1. In Thunderbird it is necessary to uncheck the status bar, 2. in Nvda Presentation of objects it is necessary to uncheck context help and notifications.
Regards

--
Jarek


Re: Object Navigation - Where and How Do You Use It?

Chris Mullins
 

Hi Brian

I understand you are using Object navigation in this case to gain knowledge of how to use it but I thought I would make you aware of the Virtual Review add-on.  With Virtual Review installed, pressing NVDA+Ctrl+w when the About window is in focus, will open a temporary textual window containing the information from the About window you can’t access in situe using the keyboard.  You can arrow around the virtual review window to read the info then press escape to dismiss it and return focus back to the About window itself.

 

Cheers

Chris

 

 

from the  In

 

From: Brian Vogel
Sent: 06 August 2020 23:41
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Object Navigation - Where and How Do You Use It?

 

On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 06:35 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:

You can’t use keyboard commands to look at various system information displayed on that screen – you must use object navigation to read them.

-
Thank you for this specific example.   Again, this is very handy for me to have as I now have a specific location where playing with object navigation gets me a result I cannot get otherwise, and I've been told what that result would be.  I just went through the list of items near the top of the About pane and got "status green" for each after it was read, and had no idea of exactly how I was supposed to (or even if I could) get to that information via NVDA.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 

 


Re: Speech crackling/breaking up in latest NVDA

Sharni-Lee Ward
 

Oops, sorry, thought I was responding to someon in private.


For context, I checked Asus Live Update, and was able to get the information that there were no new updates via the NVDA+b command. The interface was otherwise inaccessible, even with review commands.

On 7/08/2020 2:09 pm, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:

I told you, the interface is inaccessible. I cannot press any buttons to do anything with. I was lucky to get the information I did.

On 7/08/2020 1:56 pm, Shaun Everiss wrote:

Well you could always check and open live update and make sure nothing is in the cue.



On 7/08/2020 11:12 am, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:

I already have Asus Live Update installed. It runs in the background, right? It should have been doing its thing during the whole year I've had this computer, right?

On 7/08/2020 9:05 am, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 06:43 PM, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:
X507UAR
-
Support Page:  https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-Laptop-X507UA/HelpDesk_download/

When I select the what's noted above in the CPU/BIOS dropdown, along with Windows 10 for the OS, there are a number of very recent updates, particularly recent is the BIOS/UEFI update from June of this year.  The most recent Audio driver is noted as being from August 2019.

There is also a download link for a utility called ICESound (that comes in a ZIP file) from February 2020 that is described: It is intelligent audio enhancement software that improves the audio quality in sound experiences on laptops.

Most importantly, Asus has a system updater utility, Asus Live Update, that checks for all the device driver and other updates that are applicable to your computer, and when these are provided by the computer's manufacturer I strongly recommend that they be used.  They make keeping all the essentials for your computer current much more easily than anything else will.  I'd download and install that and let it do its thing as soon as is reasonably possible.  I suspect you'll have a bunch of things identified as needing updates.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: Speech crackling/breaking up in latest NVDA

Sharni-Lee Ward
 

I told you, the interface is inaccessible. I cannot press any buttons to do anything with. I was lucky to get the information I did.

On 7/08/2020 1:56 pm, Shaun Everiss wrote:

Well you could always check and open live update and make sure nothing is in the cue.



On 7/08/2020 11:12 am, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:

I already have Asus Live Update installed. It runs in the background, right? It should have been doing its thing during the whole year I've had this computer, right?

On 7/08/2020 9:05 am, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 06:43 PM, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:
X507UAR
-
Support Page:  https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-Laptop-X507UA/HelpDesk_download/

When I select the what's noted above in the CPU/BIOS dropdown, along with Windows 10 for the OS, there are a number of very recent updates, particularly recent is the BIOS/UEFI update from June of this year.  The most recent Audio driver is noted as being from August 2019.

There is also a download link for a utility called ICESound (that comes in a ZIP file) from February 2020 that is described: It is intelligent audio enhancement software that improves the audio quality in sound experiences on laptops.

Most importantly, Asus has a system updater utility, Asus Live Update, that checks for all the device driver and other updates that are applicable to your computer, and when these are provided by the computer's manufacturer I strongly recommend that they be used.  They make keeping all the essentials for your computer current much more easily than anything else will.  I'd download and install that and let it do its thing as soon as is reasonably possible.  I suspect you'll have a bunch of things identified as needing updates.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: Speech crackling/breaking up in latest NVDA

 

Another thing, on the asus page I linked to after chosing the uar model, there is a bios update and utilities to do this, this is recent and will effect all hardware, it may or may not fix issues with the chips, there are chipset software updates to.



On 7/08/2020 10:43 am, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:

System Model: VivoBook 15_ASUS Laptop X507UAR

I scrolled through the pages but couldn't find my sound driver listed, and it said there were no problems found.


On 7/08/2020 7:49 am, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 05:38 PM, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:
The make is Asus and I don't know off the top of my head what the model is.
-
Unfortunately, then, I'm stuck.  There are, literally, thousands of Asus computer models, and without the specific model it's impossible to determine what the most recent drivers Asus has for a given computer are.

The only way I know of that you might be able to get the model number, as what's provided varies by maker, is using the DXDIAG command.  Hit Winkey+R, enter DXDIAG in the open edit box, then hit Enter.  You'll get a message about needing to connect to the internet to check certain things which it's fine to OK, then after about 15-30 seconds a window will pop up with the title DirectX Diagnostic Tool and it is open to its System tab.  In that tab, what's shown to the right of the label System model is the model.  There is also an Sound tab where the driver information for your sound device (usually output device, e.g., speakers/headphones) is shown.  What's important is the Date shown for the sound driver since you'd be checking on your computer's Drivers & Software page to see if the driver they offer is newer than what you have (also make a note of the version number, too, as there are times when an updated package is released, but the driver in it is the same version as an earlier package).

 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: Speech crackling/breaking up in latest NVDA

 

This is the driver page for your system.

https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-Laptop-X507UA/HelpDesk_Download/

This is the latest universal audio.

https://dlcdnets.asus.com/pub/ASUS/nb/DriversForWin10/Audio/Audio_DCH_Realtek_Win10_64_VER6087161.zip

If you do have the latest drivers you may try the following.

1. 

https://free-codecs.com/download_soft.php?d=b9e38b11547e289f79ed0ff68bc7e2c9&s=501&r=&f=realtek_hd_audio_codecs.htm

This is the latest generic universal by pal1000 on github which is mirrored by freecodecs.

These are built from microsoft sources.

These may or may not work as the case may bee.

You will need to remove the older drivers and switch to a ms driver before you try to even install these and if you need any enhancements or extras things may not work, these are really basic.

The other one is.

https://free-codecs.com/download_soft.php?d=25ea0ac7e6234e8fd36ec32fd8b62756&s=501&r=&f=realtek_hd_audio_codecs.htm

These were the last package before alanfox2000 was shut down.


These are no longer the latest drivers and will have some issues but they do have a modified installer and will be later than your drivers.

Finally, you could simply uninstall the realtech drivers and sound drivers completely and use microsoft drivers than use the drivers from windowsupdate.

These may have issues and may be utter crap but they may work.



On 7/08/2020 10:43 am, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:

System Model: VivoBook 15_ASUS Laptop X507UAR

I scrolled through the pages but couldn't find my sound driver listed, and it said there were no problems found.


On 7/08/2020 7:49 am, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 05:38 PM, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:
The make is Asus and I don't know off the top of my head what the model is.
-
Unfortunately, then, I'm stuck.  There are, literally, thousands of Asus computer models, and without the specific model it's impossible to determine what the most recent drivers Asus has for a given computer are.

The only way I know of that you might be able to get the model number, as what's provided varies by maker, is using the DXDIAG command.  Hit Winkey+R, enter DXDIAG in the open edit box, then hit Enter.  You'll get a message about needing to connect to the internet to check certain things which it's fine to OK, then after about 15-30 seconds a window will pop up with the title DirectX Diagnostic Tool and it is open to its System tab.  In that tab, what's shown to the right of the label System model is the model.  There is also an Sound tab where the driver information for your sound device (usually output device, e.g., speakers/headphones) is shown.  What's important is the Date shown for the sound driver since you'd be checking on your computer's Drivers & Software page to see if the driver they offer is newer than what you have (also make a note of the version number, too, as there are times when an updated package is released, but the driver in it is the same version as an earlier package).

 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: Speech crackling/breaking up in latest NVDA

 

Well you could always check and open live update and make sure nothing is in the cue.



On 7/08/2020 11:12 am, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:

I already have Asus Live Update installed. It runs in the background, right? It should have been doing its thing during the whole year I've had this computer, right?

On 7/08/2020 9:05 am, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Thu, Aug 6, 2020 at 06:43 PM, Sharni-Lee Ward wrote:
X507UAR
-
Support Page:  https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ASUS-Laptop-X507UA/HelpDesk_download/

When I select the what's noted above in the CPU/BIOS dropdown, along with Windows 10 for the OS, there are a number of very recent updates, particularly recent is the BIOS/UEFI update from June of this year.  The most recent Audio driver is noted as being from August 2019.

There is also a download link for a utility called ICESound (that comes in a ZIP file) from February 2020 that is described: It is intelligent audio enhancement software that improves the audio quality in sound experiences on laptops.

Most importantly, Asus has a system updater utility, Asus Live Update, that checks for all the device driver and other updates that are applicable to your computer, and when these are provided by the computer's manufacturer I strongly recommend that they be used.  They make keeping all the essentials for your computer current much more easily than anything else will.  I'd download and install that and let it do its thing as soon as is reasonably possible.  I suspect you'll have a bunch of things identified as needing updates.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: A possible bug

Sam Taylor
 

Correct, they are not seen as headings.


On 7/08/2020 11:58 am, Gene wrote:
Are you saying they aren't seen as headings?  I see them as links but not as headings, unlike every other article on the page.

Gene
-----Original Message----- From: Sam Taylor via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:53 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug



I can confirm that these are seen as links when using latest JFW both with Firefox and MSEdge. I therefore don't believe this to be an NVDA issue.





On 7/08/2020 11:46 am, Gene wrote:
I haven't asked The Times.  I thought it was a problem with NVDA since mhy old version recognizes them as headings.  I haven't used JAWS to any extent for years but it might be useful for someone using a current JAWS to see if these links are seen as headings.

Gene
-----Original Message----- From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:42 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug

When I use a very old version of NVDA, they are reported as headings when I
move from heading to heading with report headings turned on.  I don't know
what the last version was that this occurs.  I can also move to the articles
when using filter by headings in the elements list of the old version.

I don't know how old a version of NVDA needs to be used.  I use Windows 7
and I still use 13.x much of the time because it does almost everything I
want.  I play around with new versions at times.

All other articles on the page are reported as headings in the new NVDA.  So
why aren't these and how often, on other pages, may material be being
missed?

Evidently, there is something different about these headings but what?

Gene
-----Original Message----- From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug


Hi Gene,

It looks like those articles aren't marked up as headings.  If you go to the
Opinion heading, you can then press TAB or K to go to the links for the
pieces, but they aren't reported as headings.  Looking in the elements list,
I can find them in the links but not headings.

Pages like the New York Times are quite complex and it's likely something
has been missed somewhere along the line.  What did the NYT people have to
say?

Quentin.


On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 8:24 AM Gene mailto:gsasner@... wrote:
I'm using the latest beta, I haven't switched to the production version.

This appears to be a bug and it may result in information being missed.  On
The New York Times home page, using Firefox or Brave, I haven't yet tested
with Chrome, but Brave is Chrome-based, when you get to the opinion part of
the page, the articles in that section aren't seen as headings.  All other
articles are seen as headings and using a very old NVDA, the articles in the
opinion section are seen as headings.  This is using Windows 7.

I just tested with NVDA 2019.2.21 and the same thing happens so this likely
bug has been around for some time.

I also just tested with Chrome and the same thing occurs.  All articles in
the opinion section are skipped and the screen-reader moves directly to the
editor's picks heading.  It needs to be determined what is causing this
problem and that may help determine its seriousness.

Gene















Re: A possible bug

Gene
 

Are you saying they aren't seen as headings? I see them as links but not as headings, unlike every other article on the page.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Sam Taylor via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:53 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug



I can confirm that these are seen as links when using latest JFW both with Firefox and MSEdge. I therefore don't believe this to be an NVDA issue.





On 7/08/2020 11:46 am, Gene wrote:
I haven't asked The Times. I thought it was a problem with NVDA since mhy old version recognizes them as headings. I haven't used JAWS to any extent for years but it might be useful for someone using a current JAWS to see if these links are seen as headings.

Gene
-----Original Message----- From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:42 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug

When I use a very old version of NVDA, they are reported as headings when I
move from heading to heading with report headings turned on. I don't know
what the last version was that this occurs. I can also move to the articles
when using filter by headings in the elements list of the old version.

I don't know how old a version of NVDA needs to be used. I use Windows 7
and I still use 13.x much of the time because it does almost everything I
want. I play around with new versions at times.

All other articles on the page are reported as headings in the new NVDA. So
why aren't these and how often, on other pages, may material be being
missed?

Evidently, there is something different about these headings but what?

Gene
-----Original Message----- From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug


Hi Gene,

It looks like those articles aren't marked up as headings. If you go to the
Opinion heading, you can then press TAB or K to go to the links for the
pieces, but they aren't reported as headings. Looking in the elements list,
I can find them in the links but not headings.

Pages like the New York Times are quite complex and it's likely something
has been missed somewhere along the line. What did the NYT people have to
say?

Quentin.


On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 8:24 AM Gene mailto:gsasner@... wrote:
I'm using the latest beta, I haven't switched to the production version.

This appears to be a bug and it may result in information being missed. On
The New York Times home page, using Firefox or Brave, I haven't yet tested
with Chrome, but Brave is Chrome-based, when you get to the opinion part of
the page, the articles in that section aren't seen as headings. All other
articles are seen as headings and using a very old NVDA, the articles in the
opinion section are seen as headings. This is using Windows 7.

I just tested with NVDA 2019.2.21 and the same thing happens so this likely
bug has been around for some time.

I also just tested with Chrome and the same thing occurs. All articles in
the opinion section are skipped and the screen-reader moves directly to the
editor's picks heading. It needs to be determined what is causing this
problem and that may help determine its seriousness.

Gene


Re: A possible bug

Sam Taylor
 

I can confirm that these are seen as links when using latest JFW both with Firefox and MSEdge. I therefore don't believe this to be an NVDA issue.


On 7/08/2020 11:46 am, Gene wrote:
I haven't asked The Times.  I thought it was a problem with NVDA since mhy old version recognizes them as headings.  I haven't used JAWS to any extent for years but it might be useful for someone using a current JAWS to see if these links are seen as headings.

Gene
-----Original Message----- From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:42 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug

When I use a very old version of NVDA, they are reported as headings when I
move from heading to heading with report headings turned on.  I don't know
what the last version was that this occurs.  I can also move to the articles
when using filter by headings in the elements list of the old version.

I don't know how old a version of NVDA needs to be used.  I use Windows 7
and I still use 13.x much of the time because it does almost everything I
want.  I play around with new versions at times.

All other articles on the page are reported as headings in the new NVDA.  So
why aren't these and how often, on other pages, may material be being
missed?

Evidently, there is something different about these headings but what?

Gene
-----Original Message----- From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug


Hi Gene,

It looks like those articles aren't marked up as headings.  If you go to the
Opinion heading, you can then press TAB or K to go to the links for the
pieces, but they aren't reported as headings.  Looking in the elements list,
I can find them in the links but not headings.

Pages like the New York Times are quite complex and it's likely something
has been missed somewhere along the line.  What did the NYT people have to
say?

Quentin.


On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 8:24 AM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
I'm using the latest beta, I haven't switched to the production version.

This appears to be a bug and it may result in information being missed.  On
The New York Times home page, using Firefox or Brave, I haven't yet tested
with Chrome, but Brave is Chrome-based, when you get to the opinion part of
the page, the articles in that section aren't seen as headings.  All other
articles are seen as headings and using a very old NVDA, the articles in the
opinion section are seen as headings.  This is using Windows 7.

I just tested with NVDA 2019.2.21 and the same thing happens so this likely
bug has been around for some time.

I also just tested with Chrome and the same thing occurs.  All articles in
the opinion section are skipped and the screen-reader moves directly to the
editor's picks heading.  It needs to be determined what is causing this
problem and that may help determine its seriousness.

Gene









Re: A possible bug

Gene
 

I haven't asked The Times. I thought it was a problem with NVDA since mhy old version recognizes them as headings. I haven't used JAWS to any extent for years but it might be useful for someone using a current JAWS to see if these links are seen as headings.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:42 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug

When I use a very old version of NVDA, they are reported as headings when I
move from heading to heading with report headings turned on. I don't know
what the last version was that this occurs. I can also move to the articles
when using filter by headings in the elements list of the old version.

I don't know how old a version of NVDA needs to be used. I use Windows 7
and I still use 13.x much of the time because it does almost everything I
want. I play around with new versions at times.

All other articles on the page are reported as headings in the new NVDA. So
why aren't these and how often, on other pages, may material be being
missed?

Evidently, there is something different about these headings but what?

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug


Hi Gene,

It looks like those articles aren't marked up as headings. If you go to the
Opinion heading, you can then press TAB or K to go to the links for the
pieces, but they aren't reported as headings. Looking in the elements list,
I can find them in the links but not headings.

Pages like the New York Times are quite complex and it's likely something
has been missed somewhere along the line. What did the NYT people have to
say?

Quentin.


On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 8:24 AM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
I'm using the latest beta, I haven't switched to the production version.

This appears to be a bug and it may result in information being missed. On
The New York Times home page, using Firefox or Brave, I haven't yet tested
with Chrome, but Brave is Chrome-based, when you get to the opinion part of
the page, the articles in that section aren't seen as headings. All other
articles are seen as headings and using a very old NVDA, the articles in the
opinion section are seen as headings. This is using Windows 7.

I just tested with NVDA 2019.2.21 and the same thing happens so this likely
bug has been around for some time.

I also just tested with Chrome and the same thing occurs. All articles in
the opinion section are skipped and the screen-reader moves directly to the
editor's picks heading. It needs to be determined what is causing this
problem and that may help determine its seriousness.

Gene








--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Web: www.nvaccess.org
Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess


Re: A possible bug

Gene
 

When I use a very old version of NVDA, they are reported as headings when I move from heading to heading with report headings turned on. I don't know what the last version was that this occurs. I can also move to the articles when using filter by headings in the elements list of the old version.

I don't know how old a version of NVDA needs to be used. I use Windows 7 and I still use 13.x much of the time because it does almost everything I want. I play around with new versions at times.

All other articles on the page are reported as headings in the new NVDA. So why aren't these and how often, on other pages, may material be being missed?

Evidently, there is something different about these headings but what?

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2020 8:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] A possible bug


Hi Gene,

It looks like those articles aren't marked up as headings. If you go to the Opinion heading, you can then press TAB or K to go to the links for the pieces, but they aren't reported as headings. Looking in the elements list, I can find them in the links but not headings.

Pages like the New York Times are quite complex and it's likely something has been missed somewhere along the line. What did the NYT people have to say?

Quentin.


On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 8:24 AM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
I'm using the latest beta, I haven't switched to the production version.

This appears to be a bug and it may result in information being missed. On
The New York Times home page, using Firefox or Brave, I haven't yet tested
with Chrome, but Brave is Chrome-based, when you get to the opinion part of
the page, the articles in that section aren't seen as headings. All other
articles are seen as headings and using a very old NVDA, the articles in the
opinion section are seen as headings. This is using Windows 7.

I just tested with NVDA 2019.2.21 and the same thing happens so this likely
bug has been around for some time.

I also just tested with Chrome and the same thing occurs. All articles in
the opinion section are skipped and the screen-reader moves directly to the
editor's picks heading. It needs to be determined what is causing this
problem and that may help determine its seriousness.

Gene








--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Web: www.nvaccess.org
Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess


Re: A possible bug

Quentin Christensen
 

Hi Gene,

It looks like those articles aren't marked up as headings.  If you go to the Opinion heading, you can then press TAB or K to go to the links for the pieces, but they aren't reported as headings.  Looking in the elements list, I can find them in the links but not headings.

Pages like the New York Times are quite complex and it's likely something has been missed somewhere along the line.  What did the NYT people have to say?

Quentin.

On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 8:24 AM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
I'm using the latest beta, I haven't switched to the production version.

This appears to be a bug and it may result in information being missed.  On
The New York Times home page, using Firefox or Brave, I haven't yet tested
with Chrome, but Brave is Chrome-based, when you get to the opinion part of
the page, the articles in that section aren't seen as headings.  All other
articles are seen as headings and using a very old NVDA, the articles in the
opinion section are seen as headings.  This is using Windows 7.

I just tested with NVDA 2019.2.21 and the same thing happens so this likely
bug has been around for some time.

I also just tested with Chrome and the same thing occurs.  All articles in
the opinion section are skipped and the screen-reader moves directly to the
editor's picks heading.  It needs to be determined what is causing this
problem and that may help determine its seriousness.

Gene






--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager