Date   

Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

 

On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 04:56 PM, Gene wrote:
Is there any connection between the born on date and the BIOS date?
In the case of my old HP laptop, I have to believe that these are one and the same.  It is actually presented with the label "Born On Date," which I found quite amusing when I first saw it.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Gene
 

Is there any connection between the born on date and the BIOS date?  I can see the BIOS date when I look at computer information with a screen-reader but I don't think I have access, without a sighted person looking at the screen during bootup, to the born on date.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 3:50 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 04:30 PM, Gene wrote:
How long have you observed machines to be reliable, if some sort of average can be given?
I'd say 8 years and up to 10, if not longer.   And by reliable I mean power up and do what they were designed to do, not more than they were designed to do.

I have very, very seldom seen a computer, as in a whole system, fail due to age.  At one time keyboards tended to get very flaky relatively quickly, and those days are long gone.  If we're talking a desktop system grabbing a new keyboard is cheap and fast, laptops, well, cheap but getting the things installed can be hell.  There was also a time when internal HDDs were prone to failure around the 5 year mark.   I haven't seen that be routine for a very long while now, either.  Many external HDDs will go that distance, and more, and they tend to be more "delicate" than internal HDDs.

I always find it interesting in my car hobby how people like to complain about electronics.  If/when old electronics fail they are a grand PITA to replace or revive, but my daily driver right now is a 1989 DeVille with what was then the high tech LED dash, and every bit of it still works.   I see automotive electronics, and other electronics designed for "severe service" (and laptop components fall under this category) hold up to beatings you'd never think they'd survive.  The first time (yes, there has been more than one) I saw my partner's Toshiba Satellite drop from the height of the top of his truck bed to the pavement I thought for sure we were done.  It survived that, at least one other incident dropping from that height, plus a lot of other abuse.  It still functions just fine, too, including the touch screen, but the AMD A6 APU was getting a bit long in the tooth and the hinge on the lid is slightly wonky, so a new one was acquired.  We still have it, and use it, as backup when we don't want to take "the good computer" somewhere.  I'll have to look at what it's "born on" date is in UEFI when I next boot it up.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Lino Morales
 

Totally agree with Tyler here. I want a nice some of your bank account Sarah. Now can we talk about WIN 10 for cripes sake? Geez!

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> on behalf of Tyler Wood <tcwood12@...>
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 4:05:47 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications
 

Hi,

I had to stop reading when you mentioned 16 gb of ram on a machine for a school setting.


You wouldn't touch a machine that is a year old is fine, but please stop spouting the below as facts when it is your opinion and has absolutely nothing to do with the discussion at hand. Not everyone has the finances to buy the best of the best and what is quote on quote yucky for you may suffice for someone else. My surface book is coming up on 4 years old and there is absolutely nothing wrong with its performance. A reasonable processor paired with, perhaps, slightly above average ram (8 gb, for instance) with a sufficient amount of storage. In a school environment, there is, unless video editing is involved, no need for a high end graphics card, no need for 32 gb of ram and no need for something that is not refurbished. I would recommend new if at all possible, but understand that some may not be able to afford that and that is completely fine.

On 1/11/2019 3:48 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

Actually I would not let even that student touch anything over a year old. I don't care if it still works. Many companies don't support let's say a 7 year old machine the school might be giving to their students. If the school can afford it let them buy refirbs that are a year old if that is even possible as long as they have 8 or 16 gigs of ram and the students can use them for class but anything over a year old at least in terms of school settings is yucky to me.

I know a family member who is at their office still using windows I think it's 7. They refuse to upgrade the their machines are 10 years old, but what would you expect from most people who don't really care about this stuff.


If I could afford it I would replace my computers every year or 2 even though they still work. It's staying up to date with technology and going with the best if you can, at least to me.


On 11 Jan 2019, at 12:34, Brian Vogel wrote:

Sarah,

            You really seem to be spinning out over these last several posts.   This really is not about you, or your needs or wants, but trying to offer advice regarding how best to make buying decisions related to computers in general.

             It's not that your needs are wrong, but they're utterly irrelevant to what I've seen as the broader point of this whole topic.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

 

On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 04:30 PM, Gene wrote:
How long have you observed machines to be reliable, if some sort of average can be given?
I'd say 8 years and up to 10, if not longer.   And by reliable I mean power up and do what they were designed to do, not more than they were designed to do.

I have very, very seldom seen a computer, as in a whole system, fail due to age.  At one time keyboards tended to get very flaky relatively quickly, and those days are long gone.  If we're talking a desktop system grabbing a new keyboard is cheap and fast, laptops, well, cheap but getting the things installed can be hell.  There was also a time when internal HDDs were prone to failure around the 5 year mark.   I haven't seen that be routine for a very long while now, either.  Many external HDDs will go that distance, and more, and they tend to be more "delicate" than internal HDDs.

I always find it interesting in my car hobby how people like to complain about electronics.  If/when old electronics fail they are a grand PITA to replace or revive, but my daily driver right now is a 1989 DeVille with what was then the high tech LED dash, and every bit of it still works.   I see automotive electronics, and other electronics designed for "severe service" (and laptop components fall under this category) hold up to beatings you'd never think they'd survive.  The first time (yes, there has been more than one) I saw my partner's Toshiba Satellite drop from the height of the top of his truck bed to the pavement I thought for sure we were done.  It survived that, at least one other incident dropping from that height, plus a lot of other abuse.  It still functions just fine, too, including the touch screen, but the AMD A6 APU was getting a bit long in the tooth and the hinge on the lid is slightly wonky, so a new one was acquired.  We still have it, and use it, as backup when we don't want to take "the good computer" somewhere.  I'll have to look at what it's "born on" date is in UEFI when I next boot it up.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Gene
 

That's fine,  but when you say you wouldn't do something in a conversation like this, if you don't specify that you are not making a general statement of advice, the implication is that others shouldn't do it.  If you said that you would do whatever, and then said what you said at the end of your message, people wouldn't be taking issue with it in the way they are.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 3:31 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Hehahahahaha. 20011? Well, I know we are in 2019. I do know what you menat, but I would not buy a machine that old at all. My buddies mac is starting to finally show its age and it's 6 years old. He went to go sell it and didn't, they would have only given him 50 cents for it. Um? Wow?

True I'm not the normal computer user, but I never was even when I was learning how to use windows in 2001, or was it 2002? I wanted to learn it all, do it all, use all the power I could.

Take care

On 11 Jan 2019, at 13:14, Gene wrote:

I wouldn't pay a lot of money for a three-year-old machine and less for older ones.  And I would be unlikely to buy a machine from a private person, regardless of how new it is unless I was going to reformat it or use the Windows 10 feature to return the machine to the original Windows state.  Who knows what malware might be on the machine. 
 
But a one year limit for a typical user is arbitrary and not applicable. 
 
The kinds of uses being discussed, browsing, e-mail, word processing, streaming, etc. are not intensive operations.  Computers purchased five six, eight years ago, if reasonably powerful, can perform them today.  I have a laptop from 20011 that was about a $500 machine when it was purchased.  it still performs those tasks very well. 
 
The general advice is that when a computer becomes five years old, it shouldn't be considered reliable, and that is one reason I wouldn't spend a lot of money on a machine three years old or older.  But many machines work for eight or ten or more years so if the price is right, it's a good gamble if you want to gamble. 
 
Gene 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 2:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Actually I would not let even that student touch anything over a year old. I don't care if it still works. Many companies don't support let's say a 7 year old machine the school might be giving to their students. If the school can afford it let them buy refirbs that are a year old if that is even possible as long as they have 8 or 16 gigs of ram and the students can use them for class but anything over a year old at least in terms of school settings is yucky to me.

I know a family member who is at their office still using windows I think it's 7. They refuse to upgrade the their machines are 10 years old, but what would you expect from most people who don't really care about this stuff.


If I could afford it I would replace my computers every year or 2 even though they still work. It's staying up to date with technology and going with the best if you can, at least to me.


On 11 Jan 2019, at 12:34, Brian Vogel wrote:

Sarah,

            You really seem to be spinning out over these last several posts.   This really is not about you, or your needs or wants, but trying to offer advice regarding how best to make buying decisions related to computers in general.

             It's not that your needs are wrong, but they're utterly irrelevant to what I've seen as the broader point of this whole topic.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Gene
 

I didn't say you should buy one.  I said that it is still very useable as a demonstration that you can buy a machine that, if it is reasonably powerful, not a power user machine, but in the moderate price range, it should be expected to be very useable for years.  That is, of course, if the machine meetts your needs, and we are talking about typical uses, and if your needs don't change dramatically regarding the power of machine you need.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 3:31 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Hehahahahaha. 20011? Well, I know we are in 2019. I do know what you menat, but I would not buy a machine that old at all. My buddies mac is starting to finally show its age and it's 6 years old. He went to go sell it and didn't, they would have only given him 50 cents for it. Um? Wow?

True I'm not the normal computer user, but I never was even when I was learning how to use windows in 2001, or was it 2002? I wanted to learn it all, do it all, use all the power I could.

Take care

On 11 Jan 2019, at 13:14, Gene wrote:

I wouldn't pay a lot of money for a three-year-old machine and less for older ones.  And I would be unlikely to buy a machine from a private person, regardless of how new it is unless I was going to reformat it or use the Windows 10 feature to return the machine to the original Windows state.  Who knows what malware might be on the machine. 
 
But a one year limit for a typical user is arbitrary and not applicable. 
 
The kinds of uses being discussed, browsing, e-mail, word processing, streaming, etc. are not intensive operations.  Computers purchased five six, eight years ago, if reasonably powerful, can perform them today.  I have a laptop from 20011 that was about a $500 machine when it was purchased.  it still performs those tasks very well. 
 
The general advice is that when a computer becomes five years old, it shouldn't be considered reliable, and that is one reason I wouldn't spend a lot of money on a machine three years old or older.  But many machines work for eight or ten or more years so if the price is right, it's a good gamble if you want to gamble. 
 
Gene 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 2:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Actually I would not let even that student touch anything over a year old. I don't care if it still works. Many companies don't support let's say a 7 year old machine the school might be giving to their students. If the school can afford it let them buy refirbs that are a year old if that is even possible as long as they have 8 or 16 gigs of ram and the students can use them for class but anything over a year old at least in terms of school settings is yucky to me.

I know a family member who is at their office still using windows I think it's 7. They refuse to upgrade the their machines are 10 years old, but what would you expect from most people who don't really care about this stuff.


If I could afford it I would replace my computers every year or 2 even though they still work. It's staying up to date with technology and going with the best if you can, at least to me.


On 11 Jan 2019, at 12:34, Brian Vogel wrote:

Sarah,

            You really seem to be spinning out over these last several posts.   This really is not about you, or your needs or wants, but trying to offer advice regarding how best to make buying decisions related to computers in general.

             It's not that your needs are wrong, but they're utterly irrelevant to what I've seen as the broader point of this whole topic.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Gene
 

The student described the machines as being grossly underpowered by today's standards.  The student described specific uses of the machine which are not computer intensive uses.
 
Also, of course machines become dated but the machines with the most advanced technology become dated much faster than those with more midlevel technology and unless you need the most advanced performance, there is no reason to purchase the leading edge machines. 
 
If you buy the leading edge machines, lower priced machines start having the technology you paid a premium for and you have spent unnecessary money for a machine that you could get the equivalent of in six months or a year for much less money.  Some people want or need the leading edge machines, most people need machines that aren't anywhere near that powerful.
 
The statement you are quoting is meaningless as a generalization.  And what does it mean? What does a general term like "outdated" mean?  It's far too undefined as a term to tell us anything as you use it. 
 
(If I buy a moderately priced machine that meets my needs now, will likely do so years from now, and if I don't expect my needs to change to the point where the machine will become inadequate over many years of use, what does outdated mean?
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 3:29 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

I said if I could, I would. I can't, but remember, once the compute rleaves the store it's alreadyout of date. I can't remember wher I heard that but is' like that with any device.

The student here did say on this list that even the sighted people are complaining about the machines so they have to be bad.

Take care

On 11 Jan 2019, at 13:08, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 03:48 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
If I could afford it I would replace my computers every year or 2 even though they still work. It's staying up to date with technology and going with the best if you can, at least to me.
OK.   Uh, the reasoning is horribly flawed for the average user, but OK.

Business settings don't even do this, why a home user or a student would or should eludes me entirely.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Uninstall Norton Anti Virus

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Please though set a restore point beforehand.
I'm almost certain using the avast removal tool is why I now have no dialogues that will work in Dropbox, but I never noticed at the time and now its too late. Its just as well it was not something more serious!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 5:24 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Uninstall Norton Anti Virus


One can never swear that anything will necessarily work with the screen reader, but it's worth going to the Norton Remove and Reinstall Tool ( https://support.norton.com/sp/en/us/home/current/solutions/v60392881_EndUserProfile_en_us ) page, downloading it, and trying it as your removal method.
--

Brian *-* Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763

*A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.*

~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


Re: Uninstall Norton Anti Virus

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

In cases of software as invasive as Norton, and of course as inaccessible, I tend to always fall back to a sighted human being!

Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Morne van der Merwe" <mornevdmerwe@telkomsa.net>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 5:18 PM
Subject: [nvda] Uninstall Norton Anti Virus


Good day list,



I have an Acer laptop with Windows 10 and the latest version of NVDA.



Norton Anti Virus is pre-installed on this Acer laptop. I would like to use
Windows Defender instead.



I tried to uninstalled Norton with no success. I followed the steps whitch
you would follow to uninstall a program. NVDA doesn't give me any feedback
after I hit enter to uninstall Norton. I tried Golden Cursor to read the
screen also with no success.



Is there a way to uninstall Norton while NVDA is giving feedback?



Any help would be appreciated.



Kind regards

Morné


Re: Slightly OT: Hardware speech synthesizer

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Well I find the very cheap usb Behringer sound device that can interface using good old phono plugs very good, and the only reason I do not like internal cards is that some hardware or maybe its drivers, truncate the speech at times, particularly on laptops.
Some internal hardware also seems to be prone to buzzes whines and other pick up from inside the machine which may not notice too much on speakers, but plug in headphones and its very irritating. The Behriinger has a headphone socket and its own volume control.

Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Devin Prater" <r.d.t.prater@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 4:23 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Slightly OT: Hardware speech synthesizer


On modern computers, I don’t see much of a benefit to it, unless you’re using Emacspeak where the hardware DecTalk is still a good experience with it. On older computers, or computers with fussy sound cards, it may be a good experience.

On Jan 11, 2019, at 10:19 AM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io <bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

The real question though is this. Can they be more efficient in real terms than the inbuilt espeak?
I did some tests back in the xp days when I had access to one, and to me at least there was nothing much in it.
Of course the old interface used a serial port on my old computer, so it could well be that this ancient device was a bottleneck.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
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----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian K. Lingard" <bkl@ncf.ca>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 3:22 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Slightly OT: Hardware speech synthesizer


Dear Felix & List:

I believe the triple talk synthesizer is still manufactured. So is the Votrax Personal Speech System by the Federal Screw Works.
Brian K. Lingard


From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf of Felix G.
Sent: January 11, 2019 7:26 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Slightly OT: Hardware speech synthesizer

Hello everyone,
I am thinking of getting a hardware speech synthesizer because I feel it might improve my efficiency by making me independent of existing sound resources on machines. I am aware hardware speech synthesizers are an ancient concept, so I would like to ask around are they still being manufactured for end users. If so, which ones are being produced as I am writing this?
All the best,
Felix







Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Sarah k Alawami
 

Hehahahahaha. 20011? Well, I know we are in 2019. I do know what you menat, but I would not buy a machine that old at all. My buddies mac is starting to finally show its age and it's 6 years old. He went to go sell it and didn't, they would have only given him 50 cents for it. Um? Wow?

True I'm not the normal computer user, but I never was even when I was learning how to use windows in 2001, or was it 2002? I wanted to learn it all, do it all, use all the power I could.

Take care

On 11 Jan 2019, at 13:14, Gene wrote:

I wouldn't pay a lot of money for a three-year-old machine and less for older ones.  And I would be unlikely to buy a machine from a private person, regardless of how new it is unless I was going to reformat it or use the Windows 10 feature to return the machine to the original Windows state.  Who knows what malware might be on the machine. 
 
But a one year limit for a typical user is arbitrary and not applicable. 
 
The kinds of uses being discussed, browsing, e-mail, word processing, streaming, etc. are not intensive operations.  Computers purchased five six, eight years ago, if reasonably powerful, can perform them today.  I have a laptop from 20011 that was about a $500 machine when it was purchased.  it still performs those tasks very well. 
 
The general advice is that when a computer becomes five years old, it shouldn't be considered reliable, and that is one reason I wouldn't spend a lot of money on a machine three years old or older.  But many machines work for eight or ten or more years so if the price is right, it's a good gamble if you want to gamble. 
 
Gene 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 2:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Actually I would not let even that student touch anything over a year old. I don't care if it still works. Many companies don't support let's say a 7 year old machine the school might be giving to their students. If the school can afford it let them buy refirbs that are a year old if that is even possible as long as they have 8 or 16 gigs of ram and the students can use them for class but anything over a year old at least in terms of school settings is yucky to me.

I know a family member who is at their office still using windows I think it's 7. They refuse to upgrade the their machines are 10 years old, but what would you expect from most people who don't really care about this stuff.


If I could afford it I would replace my computers every year or 2 even though they still work. It's staying up to date with technology and going with the best if you can, at least to me.


On 11 Jan 2019, at 12:34, Brian Vogel wrote:

Sarah,

            You really seem to be spinning out over these last several posts.   This really is not about you, or your needs or wants, but trying to offer advice regarding how best to make buying decisions related to computers in general.

             It's not that your needs are wrong, but they're utterly irrelevant to what I've seen as the broader point of this whole topic.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Gene
 

How long have you observed machines to be reliable, if some sort of average can be given?
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 3:23 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 04:14 PM, Gene wrote:
The general advice is that when a computer becomes five years old, it shouldn't be considered reliable,
And I will say, without reservation, that my observations as a tech support professional in the field for years now indicate that the general advice is wrong.

Whether it's practical for the intended purposes, if demands have ramped up, is one thing.  But I seldom see machines starting to become unreliable in any meaningful sense when they're only 5 years old.  And that's with platter HDDs and lots of in-field use, if some reasonable care is applied.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Sarah k Alawami
 

I said if I could, I would. I can't, but remember, once the compute rleaves the store it's alreadyout of date. I can't remember wher I heard that but is' like that with any device.

The student here did say on this list that even the sighted people are complaining about the machines so they have to be bad.

Take care

On 11 Jan 2019, at 13:08, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 03:48 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
If I could afford it I would replace my computers every year or 2 even though they still work. It's staying up to date with technology and going with the best if you can, at least to me.
OK.   Uh, the reasoning is horribly flawed for the average user, but OK.

Business settings don't even do this, why a home user or a student would or should eludes me entirely.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

 

On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 04:14 PM, Gene wrote:
The general advice is that when a computer becomes five years old, it shouldn't be considered reliable,
And I will say, without reservation, that my observations as a tech support professional in the field for years now indicate that the general advice is wrong.

Whether it's practical for the intended purposes, if demands have ramped up, is one thing.  But I seldom see machines starting to become unreliable in any meaningful sense when they're only 5 years old.  And that's with platter HDDs and lots of in-field use, if some reasonable care is applied.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Gene
 

I wouldn't pay a lot of money for a three-year-old machine and less for older ones.  And I would be unlikely to buy a machine from a private person, regardless of how new it is unless I was going to reformat it or use the Windows 10 feature to return the machine to the original Windows state.  Who knows what malware might be on the machine. 
 
But a one year limit for a typical user is arbitrary and not applicable. 
 
The kinds of uses being discussed, browsing, e-mail, word processing, streaming, etc. are not intensive operations.  Computers purchased five six, eight years ago, if reasonably powerful, can perform them today.  I have a laptop from 20011 that was about a $500 machine when it was purchased.  it still performs those tasks very well. 
 
The general advice is that when a computer becomes five years old, it shouldn't be considered reliable, and that is one reason I wouldn't spend a lot of money on a machine three years old or older.  But many machines work for eight or ten or more years so if the price is right, it's a good gamble if you want to gamble. 
 
Gene 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2019 2:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Actually I would not let even that student touch anything over a year old. I don't care if it still works. Many companies don't support let's say a 7 year old machine the school might be giving to their students. If the school can afford it let them buy refirbs that are a year old if that is even possible as long as they have 8 or 16 gigs of ram and the students can use them for class but anything over a year old at least in terms of school settings is yucky to me.

I know a family member who is at their office still using windows I think it's 7. They refuse to upgrade the their machines are 10 years old, but what would you expect from most people who don't really care about this stuff.


If I could afford it I would replace my computers every year or 2 even though they still work. It's staying up to date with technology and going with the best if you can, at least to me.


On 11 Jan 2019, at 12:34, Brian Vogel wrote:

Sarah,

            You really seem to be spinning out over these last several posts.   This really is not about you, or your needs or wants, but trying to offer advice regarding how best to make buying decisions related to computers in general.

             It's not that your needs are wrong, but they're utterly irrelevant to what I've seen as the broader point of this whole topic.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

 

On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 03:48 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
If I could afford it I would replace my computers every year or 2 even though they still work. It's staying up to date with technology and going with the best if you can, at least to me.
OK.   Uh, the reasoning is horribly flawed for the average user, but OK.

Business settings don't even do this, why a home user or a student would or should eludes me entirely.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Tyler Wood
 

Hi,

I had to stop reading when you mentioned 16 gb of ram on a machine for a school setting.


You wouldn't touch a machine that is a year old is fine, but please stop spouting the below as facts when it is your opinion and has absolutely nothing to do with the discussion at hand. Not everyone has the finances to buy the best of the best and what is quote on quote yucky for you may suffice for someone else. My surface book is coming up on 4 years old and there is absolutely nothing wrong with its performance. A reasonable processor paired with, perhaps, slightly above average ram (8 gb, for instance) with a sufficient amount of storage. In a school environment, there is, unless video editing is involved, no need for a high end graphics card, no need for 32 gb of ram and no need for something that is not refurbished. I would recommend new if at all possible, but understand that some may not be able to afford that and that is completely fine.

On 1/11/2019 3:48 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

Actually I would not let even that student touch anything over a year old. I don't care if it still works. Many companies don't support let's say a 7 year old machine the school might be giving to their students. If the school can afford it let them buy refirbs that are a year old if that is even possible as long as they have 8 or 16 gigs of ram and the students can use them for class but anything over a year old at least in terms of school settings is yucky to me.

I know a family member who is at their office still using windows I think it's 7. They refuse to upgrade the their machines are 10 years old, but what would you expect from most people who don't really care about this stuff.


If I could afford it I would replace my computers every year or 2 even though they still work. It's staying up to date with technology and going with the best if you can, at least to me.


On 11 Jan 2019, at 12:34, Brian Vogel wrote:

Sarah,

            You really seem to be spinning out over these last several posts.   This really is not about you, or your needs or wants, but trying to offer advice regarding how best to make buying decisions related to computers in general.

             It's not that your needs are wrong, but they're utterly irrelevant to what I've seen as the broader point of this whole topic.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

Sarah k Alawami
 

Actually I would not let even that student touch anything over a year old. I don't care if it still works. Many companies don't support let's say a 7 year old machine the school might be giving to their students. If the school can afford it let them buy refirbs that are a year old if that is even possible as long as they have 8 or 16 gigs of ram and the students can use them for class but anything over a year old at least in terms of school settings is yucky to me.

I know a family member who is at their office still using windows I think it's 7. They refuse to upgrade the their machines are 10 years old, but what would you expect from most people who don't really care about this stuff.


If I could afford it I would replace my computers every year or 2 even though they still work. It's staying up to date with technology and going with the best if you can, at least to me.


On 11 Jan 2019, at 12:34, Brian Vogel wrote:

Sarah,

            You really seem to be spinning out over these last several posts.   This really is not about you, or your needs or wants, but trying to offer advice regarding how best to make buying decisions related to computers in general.

             It's not that your needs are wrong, but they're utterly irrelevant to what I've seen as the broader point of this whole topic.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back

 

 


Testers for issues on Github

Adriani Botez
 

Dear all,

 

is there anybody using AVG antivirus or Avira anti virus who would like to test if some issues are still reproducible? Please give me your github name and I will mark you in the specific issues.

 

Thank you and best regards

Adriani

 

 


Re: Minimum Specs for NVDA with Other Intensive Applications

 

Sarah,

            You really seem to be spinning out over these last several posts.   This really is not about you, or your needs or wants, but trying to offer advice regarding how best to make buying decisions related to computers in general.

             It's not that your needs are wrong, but they're utterly irrelevant to what I've seen as the broader point of this whole topic.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back