Date   

Re: possible eloquence solution

 

I agree.

Windows servicing model doesn't handle old licences that well.

On 7/19/2018 1:32 AM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
Oh my that would be excellent! I would just love it, if eloquence and my copy of jaws were tied into my microsoft account or my windows account! then I could update windows without fear of losing anything! The cost of sapi5 eloquence is not really bad. because $70 for 10 languages comes out to around $7 per language. Not bad. It's the stupid licensing system that has to catch up to the 21st century. that is the major issue i do not like about how eloquence and other nuance products are registered. I did purchase sapi5 eloquence. i just disagree with their activation methods.



Re: possible eloquence solution

 

Hmmm well for us/uk language it appears espeak ng has gotten better unless that is I have just gotten used to it, yes, they have screwed up a few things but nothing more has been screwed up.

Espeak pre ng was better in some ways but oh well.

On 7/19/2018 12:51 AM, Elshara Silverheart wrote:
Espeak used to be good. but Espeak NG is trash to the extent that
they're messing up language pronounciations that worked better before
they edited them. Chinese being one such example of this even to a non
Chinese Speaker.
That synth is pure filth and speaks of low grade quality. This is why
Jaws succeeded due to Eloquence. Dectalk often sounds like someone's
talking with their lips close together. I'd actually say festival is a
better synth. I wish it was used more and developed.

On 7/18/18, Shaun Everiss <sm.everiss@gmail.com> wrote:
Espeak is good enough, it reminds me of the keynote and its quite good.

Bar my phone eloquence never interested me, nuance actually tried to
write a 16 bit eloquence, but I doubt bar improving the quality of the
voices, so you hear a 8 bit synth digitally orgmented to a 16 bit one,
which just sounds crappy because it is obvious that the convert doesn't
sound right at all.

Dectalk is another, but to be honest, orpheus1 was my prefered synth,
after that, espeak the first one.

Vocaliser and realspeak were my synths of choice and if I hadn't pulled
that off a server a friend had ages ago I would never have any advanced
tts, they are just to expensive for sapi.

At least the third party stuff is.

But the robotic crap while not good for reading its low resource and
quite usefull for just about everything else.

The higher non crappy stuff is fine for reading but put it on a slower
system, and its almost not even worth running it long term.




On 7/18/2018 7:09 PM, Tyler Wood wrote:
I despise modern voices for doing anything but light reading. Espeak
is decent, but in my view the best two synths for fast reading remain
Eloquence and doubletalk. If I want to get correct spellings I'll use
a more modern voice. ...but then you get random pauses for no reason,
mis pronouncing random words like bourbon and expanding acronyms that
I don't want.


I can't win.



On 18-Jul-2018 1:52 AM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
Yes I'm sure you know that several attempts were made by nv access to
have a licence system that was not too onerous, but no. I do think
myself, that its rubbish but acknowledge a lot find it good. it
obviously is a personal thing.
I to do  agree that modern voices are unintelligible at fast, even
moderate speeds.

I as you know made the variant Quincy for UK English espeak and am
happy with it in the main if they would stop mucking about with words
that sounded right before. However I do also feel that the speech
player in Espeak project was very good and I'd like to see somebody
take this up again to make it better for the US market. One has to
realise at the moment though that the biggest growth area for nvda is
the Indian Subcontinent, and maybe other languages than English.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
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----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Nutt" <steve@comproom.co.uk>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2018 4:31 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] possible eloquence solution


Why should they do this?  You’re effectively stopping Code Factory
from making money.  Just buy Eloquence and be done with it. Besides,
Microsoft wouldn’t maintain it.



All the best


Steve



From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Josh
Kennedy
Sent: 17 July 2018 13:11
To: nvda@groups.io
Subject: [nvda] possible eloquence solution



It seems like unless this problem is solved it will keep coming up.
So I just went into feedback hub and I recommend all of you do the
same. I wrote the following feedback to Microsoft.

Please purchase all rites to CodeFactory Nuance Eloquence TTS. Offer
it as a free downloadable sapi5 and OneCore voice addons under ease
of access in windows10. And on the Microsoft website as sapi5 for
windows7 users. Also please maintain the android version so it keeps
working and perhaps lower the price to $2 or $3. Nuance CodeFactory
licenses are too restrictive. Adding Eloquence to microsoft’s voice
portfolio would benefit those with hearing impairments. So if
Microsoft owned it, whenever you buy a copy of windows or a new pc,
you also pay for the rite to use eloquence on any pc you buy.and if
you don’t want it, you just do not go into ease of access and
download it. Nuance copyright is stuck back in the 80s and early 90s
and has to change. If not, this issue will probably keep cropping up.





Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>;  for
Windows 10
















Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Sarah k Alawami
 

Yes, flexable is probably a better term. And yes I ave to agree. I used to be a jaws fan until 2010 and I have not looked back. I had to use jaws for one of my jobs in 2015  an di complained heavely, but it was  jaws or nothing at all. Since I needed the work I used jaws. It sucked for 2 years.

On Jul 18, 2018, at 11:49 AM, Gerardo Corripio <gera1027@...> wrote:

Definitely sad the approach of those guys. NVDA is definitely more how can I call it? I can't think of the word, right now, but more like apart from being free, flexible. Yes there are things it can't do yet, but hopefully someday it can, but for our needs?


El 18/07/2018 a las 12:56 p.m., Sky Mundell escribió:
No they don't. Its like going back to the days of the institutions

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Don H
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 10:53 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

VFO has no interest in people having a choice.







-- 
Gera
Enviado desde Thunderbird




Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Gerardo Corripio
 

Definitely sad the approach of those guys. NVDA is definitely more how can I call it? I can't think of the word, right now, but more like apart from being free, flexible. Yes there are things it can't do yet, but hopefully someday it can, but for our needs?

El 18/07/2018 a las 12:56 p.m., Sky Mundell escribió:
No they don't. Its like going back to the days of the institutions

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Don H
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 10:53 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

VFO has no interest in people having a choice.





--
Gera
Enviado desde Thunderbird


Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Sarah k Alawami
 

I do actully agree. Is theer a way we can call him out on his bogus statements and prove him wong? I mean, let’s face it, jaws has to die, nvda is over all the best screen reader I’ve used, and free to.

On Jul 18, 2018, at 11:40 AM, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> wrote:

Hi,
I see.
Based on what Eric Damery is saying and the overall context (starting at around 16 minutes into the podcast), his statement is somewhat justified when we plug in latest happenings with Narrator. I say “somewhat justified” because there are truths to what he is trying to say (with some bias): with speed of development with Narrator these days, Microsoft and some advocates will say that Narrator is enough.
But when we take this argument apart, you’ll see business side of things: clearly, for many of us using third-party screen readers for various reasons, Narrator isn’t enough, and third-party screen readers are still required to fill the gap or provide additional features.
Also the claim that open-source community could suffer as a result of Windows 10’s development speed, this argument is not new. Given proprietary nature of Narrator’s code, this is a valid concern. However, I would like to echo sentiments expressed by some on this forum and other places where open-source community did shine in times like this, and from business side of things, the claim is a form of subtle advertisement. We now have numerous proofs to challenge that claim: Windows 10 App Essentials is one such example.
I have no comment on claims that companies and agencies would not recommend NVDA because it is open-source at this time.
My overall assessment and recommendation is that proofs and context matter. Thus, I advise being careful about making a news out of just one statement from a business executive, because as it stands, we might lose based on taking things out of context.
Cheers,
Joseph
 
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io<nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 10:21 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA
 
Joseph,
 
You can find the podcast episode on this page:
 
 
Hope this helps,
 
Chris
 


On Jul 18, 2018, at 12:52 PM, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> wrote:

Hi all,
To Brian: we need the link to that podcast please to we can verify assertions made here.
Cheers,
Joseph
 
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io<nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sky Mundell
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 9:50 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA
 
That’s great Devin!
 
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io[mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 9:49 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA
 
The assistive tech department here teaches NVDA, and other low-cost solutions, although iPhone is still taught for blind people, but Android is used by many low-vision people.

 

On Jul 18, 2018, at 11:40 AM, Sky Mundell <skyt@...> wrote:
 

Yes there are deliberate lies going on with those blind organisations about alternative products. What they fail to take into account is that there are cutbacks going on in education, employment, and funding can only go so far. Not only that, but when the cutbacks begin to bite, these organisations will be forced to seek out cheaper things such as NVDA. At that point, they may go with NVDA. What also surprises me is that VFO hasn't even put up their prices yet!

-----Original Message-----
From: 
nvda@nvda.groups.io[mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of mikolaj holysz
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 9:21 AM
To: 
nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Same thing happens over here, in POland. Altix, the local distributor of 
JAWS, has recently released a series of articles about Jamie leaving NV 
Access for Mozilla even though he did this a long time ago and about all 
the features NVDA doesn't have and JAWS does. I've even heart accounts 
of people who were told by altix representatives that NVDA is dangerous 
to their computers and that it might fry their motherboards, though I 
don't know if those who retold the story were speaking the truth or 
merely exaggerating.

This seems like pressure from Freedom Scientific to promote JAWS.

W dniu 2018-07-18 o 17:33, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io pisze:

I have just listened to the latest issue of Techtalk from the RNIB in 
the uk on Audioboom, and there is an interview with the software man at 
VFO about what they sell and future plans, and the guy asked him about 
NVDA Though not actually  trashing it, he used that old ploy that one of 
the programmers has now left to go to Mozilla and nobody will install 
NVDA in a business system because its open source etc. anyway, go and 
have a listen and see what you think. I guess his job is to big up his 
own company, but I noticed, dear old Dolphin never even got mentioned!
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.








 



Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

 

Hi,

I see.

Based on what Eric Damery is saying and the overall context (starting at around 16 minutes into the podcast), his statement is somewhat justified when we plug in latest happenings with Narrator. I say “somewhat justified” because there are truths to what he is trying to say (with some bias): with speed of development with Narrator these days, Microsoft and some advocates will say that Narrator is enough.

But when we take this argument apart, you’ll see business side of things: clearly, for many of us using third-party screen readers for various reasons, Narrator isn’t enough, and third-party screen readers are still required to fill the gap or provide additional features.

Also the claim that open-source community could suffer as a result of Windows 10’s development speed, this argument is not new. Given proprietary nature of Narrator’s code, this is a valid concern. However, I would like to echo sentiments expressed by some on this forum and other places where open-source community did shine in times like this, and from business side of things, the claim is a form of subtle advertisement. We now have numerous proofs to challenge that claim: Windows 10 App Essentials is one such example.

I have no comment on claims that companies and agencies would not recommend NVDA because it is open-source at this time.

My overall assessment and recommendation is that proofs and context matter. Thus, I advise being careful about making a news out of just one statement from a business executive, because as it stands, we might lose based on taking things out of context.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris Chaffin
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 10:21 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

 

Joseph,

 

You can find the podcast episode on this page:

 

 

Hope this helps,

 

Chris

 


On Jul 18, 2018, at 12:52 PM, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> wrote:

Hi all,

To Brian: we need the link to that podcast please to we can verify assertions made here.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sky Mundell
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 9:50 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

 

That’s great Devin!

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 9:49 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

 

The assistive tech department here teaches NVDA, and other low-cost solutions, although iPhone is still taught for blind people, but Android is used by many low-vision people.

 

On Jul 18, 2018, at 11:40 AM, Sky Mundell <skyt@...> wrote:

 

Yes there are deliberate lies going on with those blind organisations about alternative products. What they fail to take into account is that there are cutbacks going on in education, employment, and funding can only go so far. Not only that, but when the cutbacks begin to bite, these organisations will be forced to seek out cheaper things such as NVDA. At that point, they may go with NVDA. What also surprises me is that VFO hasn't even put up their prices yet!

-----Original Message-----
From: 
nvda@nvda.groups.io[mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of mikolaj holysz
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 9:21 AM
To: 
nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Same thing happens over here, in POland. Altix, the local distributor of 
JAWS, has recently released a series of articles about Jamie leaving NV 
Access for Mozilla even though he did this a long time ago and about all 
the features NVDA doesn't have and JAWS does. I've even heart accounts 
of people who were told by altix representatives that NVDA is dangerous 
to their computers and that it might fry their motherboards, though I 
don't know if those who retold the story were speaking the truth or 
merely exaggerating.

This seems like pressure from Freedom Scientific to promote JAWS.

W dniu 2018-07-18 o 17:33, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io pisze:

I have just listened to the latest issue of Techtalk from the RNIB in 
the uk on Audioboom, and there is an interview with the software man at 
VFO about what they sell and future plans, and the guy asked him about 
NVDA Though not actually  trashing it, he used that old ploy that one of 
the programmers has now left to go to Mozilla and nobody will install 
NVDA in a business system because its open source etc. anyway, go and 
have a listen and see what you think. I guess his job is to big up his 
own company, but I noticed, dear old Dolphin never even got mentioned!
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.








 


Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Cristóbal
 

What is the point of all this outrage exactly? Shocking that VFO may throw some shade at a direct competitor? What? Is Microsoft supposed to tout the benefits and all the reasons why someone should switch to a Mac or a Chromebook?

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Don H
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 10:53 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

VFO has no interest in people having a choice.


Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Sky Mundell
 

No they don't. Its like going back to the days of the institutions

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Don H
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 10:53 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

VFO has no interest in people having a choice.


Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Don H
 

VFO has no interest in people having a choice.


Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Sarah k Alawami
 

For the original poster , do you have a link to this podcast? I’m just cuirous is all, if you do can you provide it here and the time stamp to go to to hear the interview?

Blessings and happy Wednesday

On Jul 18, 2018, at 10:34 AM, JM Casey <crystallogic@ca.inter.net> wrote:

Well said.



-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of ely.r@comcast.net
Sent: July 18, 2018 1:30 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

There is a new group of adults who will be wanting to continue their computer access. They are the wave of "senior boomers." It is an entire generation who though they did not "grow up" using technology, have adapted pretty well to it. The statistics regarding vision loss in that population are staggering. Many of those people have PCs at home.
I will be shortly starting classes at our local library on NVDA. I refute to teach access thinking that the cost of JAWS may well put it beyond the reach of many, particularly those on a fixed income. I will be sure to ask my students to pay something for NVDA, but pay what they can afford.

The model that helped to create WindowEyes and JAWS was a good starting point. Those products gave us the ability to show that computer use for a job was doable. We have passed that time. Computer access for anyone with vision loss should be a right, and not a right based on our income or our employer.

Like all change, there will be bumps, but products like NVDA are showing a new path to access.
Rick

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of JM Casey
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 12:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

It's probably true that most larger organisations are going to go the JAWS route, if they already have an iT department that is familiar with accessibility concerns. However, as I've done several job interviews in the last year that require on-site tests/use of software, I can definitely say that the price tag and other issues involved in getting JAWS to work are a hurdle that companies will not cross. This is the very reason I started using NVDA more regularly in the first place; I had no choice if I was going to do those interviews. One company did try to install the 40 minute demo of JAWS and was not able to get it to work at all, though they didn't tell me the reason.

I still use both, but if I hadn't been able to obtain a cheap JAWS license from my former employer, Canada's chief "blindness organisation", I wouldn't be using JFW at all. Freedom Scientific might trash and disparage as much as they like; in the end I think their model just isn't very practical. They depend on government and corporate grants/licenses because they know that most blind individuals can't pay their exorbitant prices. I recently looked into Open Book and that thing is something like four or five times the price of a high quality mainstream OCR package. Just unbelievable.



-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of mikolaj holysz
Sent: July 18, 2018 12:21 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Same thing happens over here, in POland. Altix, the local distributor of JAWS, has recently released a series of articles about Jamie leaving NV Access for Mozilla even though he did this a long time ago and about all the features NVDA doesn't have and JAWS does. I've even heart accounts of people who were told by altix representatives that NVDA is dangerous to their computers and that it might fry their motherboards, though I don't know if those who retold the story were speaking the truth or merely exaggerating.

This seems like pressure from Freedom Scientific to promote JAWS.

W dniu 2018-07-18 o 17:33, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io pisze:
I have just listened to the latest issue of Techtalk from the RNIB in
the uk on Audioboom, and there is an interview with the software man
at VFO about what they sell and future plans, and the guy asked him
about NVDA Though not actually trashing it, he used that old ploy
that one of the programmers has now left to go to Mozilla and nobody
will install NVDA in a business system because its open source etc.
anyway, go and have a listen and see what you think. I guess his job
is to big up his own company, but I noticed, dear old Dolphin never even got mentioned!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.















Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

JM Casey <crystallogic@...>
 

Well said.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of ely.r@comcast.net
Sent: July 18, 2018 1:30 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

There is a new group of adults who will be wanting to continue their computer access. They are the wave of "senior boomers." It is an entire generation who though they did not "grow up" using technology, have adapted pretty well to it. The statistics regarding vision loss in that population are staggering. Many of those people have PCs at home.
I will be shortly starting classes at our local library on NVDA. I refute to teach access thinking that the cost of JAWS may well put it beyond the reach of many, particularly those on a fixed income. I will be sure to ask my students to pay something for NVDA, but pay what they can afford.

The model that helped to create WindowEyes and JAWS was a good starting point. Those products gave us the ability to show that computer use for a job was doable. We have passed that time. Computer access for anyone with vision loss should be a right, and not a right based on our income or our employer.

Like all change, there will be bumps, but products like NVDA are showing a new path to access.
Rick

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of JM Casey
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 12:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

It's probably true that most larger organisations are going to go the JAWS route, if they already have an iT department that is familiar with accessibility concerns. However, as I've done several job interviews in the last year that require on-site tests/use of software, I can definitely say that the price tag and other issues involved in getting JAWS to work are a hurdle that companies will not cross. This is the very reason I started using NVDA more regularly in the first place; I had no choice if I was going to do those interviews. One company did try to install the 40 minute demo of JAWS and was not able to get it to work at all, though they didn't tell me the reason.

I still use both, but if I hadn't been able to obtain a cheap JAWS license from my former employer, Canada's chief "blindness organisation", I wouldn't be using JFW at all. Freedom Scientific might trash and disparage as much as they like; in the end I think their model just isn't very practical. They depend on government and corporate grants/licenses because they know that most blind individuals can't pay their exorbitant prices. I recently looked into Open Book and that thing is something like four or five times the price of a high quality mainstream OCR package. Just unbelievable.



-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of mikolaj holysz
Sent: July 18, 2018 12:21 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Same thing happens over here, in POland. Altix, the local distributor of JAWS, has recently released a series of articles about Jamie leaving NV Access for Mozilla even though he did this a long time ago and about all the features NVDA doesn't have and JAWS does. I've even heart accounts of people who were told by altix representatives that NVDA is dangerous to their computers and that it might fry their motherboards, though I don't know if those who retold the story were speaking the truth or merely exaggerating.

This seems like pressure from Freedom Scientific to promote JAWS.

W dniu 2018-07-18 o 17:33, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io pisze:
I have just listened to the latest issue of Techtalk from the RNIB in
the uk on Audioboom, and there is an interview with the software man
at VFO about what they sell and future plans, and the guy asked him
about NVDA Though not actually trashing it, he used that old ploy
that one of the programmers has now left to go to Mozilla and nobody
will install NVDA in a business system because its open source etc.
anyway, go and have a listen and see what you think. I guess his job
is to big up his own company, but I noticed, dear old Dolphin never even got mentioned!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.



Re: Question About New Add-on And Wx4

John Isige
 

Install the snapshot as a portable copy. Then just exit regular NVDA and
switch to it whenever you want to do development or testing.

On 7/18/2018 11:06, Jim Homme wrote:

Hi,

With Joseph’s announcement about WX4, if I want to start a new add-on
that uses one of the NVDA dialogs, do I need to get an NVDA snapshot?
If so, how do I run that and keep everything separate from stable NVDA?

Thanks.

Jim

==========

Jim Homme

Product Manager

Digital Accessibility

Bender Consulting Services

412-787-8567

https://www.benderconsult.com/our%20services/hightest-accessible-technology-solutions

People with disabilities, access job openings at
https://www.benderconsult.com/careers/job-openings


Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

erik burggraaf <erik@...>
 

That's against the law here fortunately.  Employers have to take your preference into consideration in the accommodation process.  Fortunately NVDA plays much better ball on old systems than jaws does and I've had prospective employers tell me they prefer it after comparing the two.

Employers aren't required to do what you tell them to do.  If I walked into a shop that already had jaws I couldn't expect them to replace it with NVDA.  That's never happened yet though.

Best,

Erik

On July 18, 2018 1:07:58 PM "Sarah k Alawami" <marrie12@...> wrote:

I brought that up  at the jobs I work for and they just say either use jaws or don’t work for us. It’s not fair really. And the blindness organizations don’t really care anyway. They are just there for the money, or lck thereof.

On Jul 18, 2018, at 9:40 AM, Sky Mundell <skyt@...> wrote:

Yes there are deliberate lies going on with those blind organisations about alternative products. What they fail to take into account is that there are cutbacks going on in education, employment, and funding can only go so far. Not only that, but when the cutbacks begin to bite, these organisations will be forced to seek out cheaper things such as NVDA. At that point, they may go with NVDA. What also surprises me is that VFO hasn't even put up their prices yet!

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io[mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of mikolaj holysz
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 9:21 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Same thing happens over here, in POland. Altix, the local distributor of 
JAWS, has recently released a series of articles about Jamie leaving NV 
Access for Mozilla even though he did this a long time ago and about all 
the features NVDA doesn't have and JAWS does. I've even heart accounts 
of people who were told by altix representatives that NVDA is dangerous 
to their computers and that it might fry their motherboards, though I 
don't know if those who retold the story were speaking the truth or 
merely exaggerating.

This seems like pressure from Freedom Scientific to promote JAWS.

W dniu 2018-07-18 o 17:33, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io pisze:
I have just listened to the latest issue of Techtalk from the RNIB in 
the uk on Audioboom, and there is an interview with the software man at 
VFO about what they sell and future plans, and the guy asked him about 
NVDA Though not actually  trashing it, he used that old ploy that one of 
the programmers has now left to go to Mozilla and nobody will install 
NVDA in a business system because its open source etc. anyway, go and 
have a listen and see what you think. I guess his job is to big up his 
own company, but I noticed, dear old Dolphin never even got mentioned!
Brian

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Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

ely.r@...
 

There is a new group of adults who will be wanting to continue their computer access. They are the wave of "senior boomers." It is an entire generation who though they did not "grow up" using technology, have adapted pretty well to it. The statistics regarding vision loss in that population are staggering. Many of those people have PCs at home.
I will be shortly starting classes at our local library on NVDA. I refute to teach access thinking that the cost of JAWS may well put it beyond the reach of many, particularly those on a fixed income. I will be sure to ask my students to pay something for NVDA, but pay what they can afford.

The model that helped to create WindowEyes and JAWS was a good starting point. Those products gave us the ability to show that computer use for a job was doable. We have passed that time. Computer access for anyone with vision loss should be a right, and not a right based on our income or our employer.

Like all change, there will be bumps, but products like NVDA are showing a new path to access.
Rick

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of JM Casey
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 12:38 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

It's probably true that most larger organisations are going to go the JAWS route, if they already have an iT department that is familiar with accessibility concerns. However, as I've done several job interviews in the last year that require on-site tests/use of software, I can definitely say that the price tag and other issues involved in getting JAWS to work are a hurdle that companies will not cross. This is the very reason I started using NVDA more regularly in the first place; I had no choice if I was going to do those interviews. One company did try to install the 40 minute demo of JAWS and was not able to get it to work at all, though they didn't tell me the reason.

I still use both, but if I hadn't been able to obtain a cheap JAWS license from my former employer, Canada's chief "blindness organisation", I wouldn't be using JFW at all. Freedom Scientific might trash and disparage as much as they like; in the end I think their model just isn't very practical. They depend on government and corporate grants/licenses because they know that most blind individuals can't pay their exorbitant prices. I recently looked into Open Book and that thing is something like four or five times the price of a high quality mainstream OCR package. Just unbelievable.



-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of mikolaj holysz
Sent: July 18, 2018 12:21 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Same thing happens over here, in POland. Altix, the local distributor of JAWS, has recently released a series of articles about Jamie leaving NV Access for Mozilla even though he did this a long time ago and about all the features NVDA doesn't have and JAWS does. I've even heart accounts of people who were told by altix representatives that NVDA is dangerous to their computers and that it might fry their motherboards, though I don't know if those who retold the story were speaking the truth or merely exaggerating.

This seems like pressure from Freedom Scientific to promote JAWS.

W dniu 2018-07-18 o 17:33, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io pisze:
I have just listened to the latest issue of Techtalk from the RNIB in
the uk on Audioboom, and there is an interview with the software man
at VFO about what they sell and future plans, and the guy asked him
about NVDA Though not actually trashing it, he used that old ploy
that one of the programmers has now left to go to Mozilla and nobody
will install NVDA in a business system because its open source etc.
anyway, go and have a listen and see what you think. I guess his job
is to big up his own company, but I noticed, dear old Dolphin never even got mentioned!
Brian

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Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.



Re: Lost the pound sign

Chris Mullins
 

Hi

It’s not a physical layout it’s a logical one.  Try  pressing the Windows key+spacebar repeatedly to cycle around the available keyboard mappings.  NVDA will read out the different keyboard layouts you have available. These  depend on which language packs you have installed on your machine.

 

Cheers

 

Chris

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Sakina
Sent: 18 July 2018 15:42
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Lost the pound sign

 

Friend,

For 7 years I have been using the same keyboard. It I am sure is not US keyboard.

Since last night, it always did the proper action.

When I just want letter 3 it gave and still gives letter 3

And used to with shift key give me # pound sign

But now when I need pound sign instead it says number.

Sakina

Letter 3 by itself.

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Chris via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 3:33 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Lost the pound sign

 

That’s odd, mine says pound sign as it should

I guess you are using US keyboard layout rather than the UK keyboard

 

 

From: Ian Blackburn
Sent: 18 July 2018 15:21
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Lost the pound sign

 

When the computer says the word number in that situation it means the pound sign

 


On 18 Jul 2018, at 10:18 pm, Sakina <sakina.gable@...> wrote:

Dear Gene and friends,

Thank you for your help regarding adding new email address in my people app.

I am sorry for I am not too clever and am still trying to figure it out. Sadly, I do not have many addresses and therefore would be happy doing it manually.

For now I am cutting and pasting the address in the to field.

Now today please I have lost my pound sign in my word document. I always used to press shift key and press number 3 for the pound sign.

Now when I press shift key and number 3 it keeps saying number.

I do not know what I must have pressed accidently on the key board   as I am one hundred % user of keyboard and do not know  what to do.

I will greatly appreciate any help.

Always thanking you all

Sakina

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

 

 


Re: Lost the pound sign

 

Oops, that should have been SHIFT+Number Row 3.

When I'm in UK keyboard format I get the pounds sterling symbol and if I'm in US keyboard mode I get the number/hashtag/pound sign symbol.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A little kindness from person to person is better than a vast love for all humankind.

           ~ Richard Dehmel

 

 


Re: VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Chris Chaffin
 

Joseph,

You can find the podcast episode on this page:


Hope this helps,

Chris


On Jul 18, 2018, at 12:52 PM, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> wrote:

Hi all,

To Brian: we need the link to that podcast please to we can verify assertions made here.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sky Mundell
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 9:50 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

 

That’s great Devin!

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 9:49 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

 

The assistive tech department here teaches NVDA, and other low-cost solutions, although iPhone is still taught for blind people, but Android is used by many low-vision people.

 

On Jul 18, 2018, at 11:40 AM, Sky Mundell <skyt@...> wrote:

 

Yes there are deliberate lies going on with those blind organisations about alternative products. What they fail to take into account is that there are cutbacks going on in education, employment, and funding can only go so far. Not only that, but when the cutbacks begin to bite, these organisations will be forced to seek out cheaper things such as NVDA. At that point, they may go with NVDA. What also surprises me is that VFO hasn't even put up their prices yet!

-----Original Message-----
From: 
nvda@nvda.groups.io[mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of mikolaj holysz
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2018 9:21 AM
To: 
nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] VFO not complimentary about NVDA

Same thing happens over here, in POland. Altix, the local distributor of 
JAWS, has recently released a series of articles about Jamie leaving NV 
Access for Mozilla even though he did this a long time ago and about all 
the features NVDA doesn't have and JAWS does. I've even heart accounts 
of people who were told by altix representatives that NVDA is dangerous 
to their computers and that it might fry their motherboards, though I 
don't know if those who retold the story were speaking the truth or 
merely exaggerating.

This seems like pressure from Freedom Scientific to promote JAWS.

W dniu 2018-07-18 o 17:33, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io pisze:

I have just listened to the latest issue of Techtalk from the RNIB in 
the uk on Audioboom, and there is an interview with the software man at 
VFO about what they sell and future plans, and the guy asked him about 
NVDA Though not actually  trashing it, he used that old ploy that one of 
the programmers has now left to go to Mozilla and nobody will install 
NVDA in a business system because its open source etc. anyway, go and 
have a listen and see what you think. I guess his job is to big up his 
own company, but I noticed, dear old Dolphin never even got mentioned!
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.






 


Re: Lost the pound sign

 

On Wed, Jul 18, 2018 at 11:42 AM, Brian's Mail list account wrote:
This is a £ ie pound sign and this is a # ie hash or number sign.
Er, while you're not wrong that the pounds sterling sign is referred to as the pound sign, the symbol used at the start of a hashtag, often referred to as a number sign, is also referred to, and not infrequently, as the pound sign [programmers tend to do this a lot, as do people in telecommunications].

I do not believe the issue is with the pounds sterling symbol, but because the original poster was used to hearing # announced as "pound sign" and it's now being announced as "number."

I also just tried changing my keyboard from English, US, to English UK (UK Keyboard) and it is making no difference whatsoever in how # is being pronounced (number) or £ is being pronounced (pounds sterling) while it does change what gets typed when SHIFT+Number Row 2 is pressed.


 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A little kindness from person to person is better than a vast love for all humankind.

           ~ Richard Dehmel

 

 


Re: possible eloquence solution

Rui Fontes
 

/Sorry, but /Vocalizer from NVDA allows you to create an activated copy on your portable NVDA...

Rui Fontes


Às 18:07 de 18/07/2018, Richard Wells escreveu:

The other major issue for me with using Authorized Eloquence is accessing NVDA Portable. If Eloquence is the default synthesizer in the portable NVDA, it won't speak on an unlicensed machine. This also goes for Nuance high-quality voices.
On 7/18/2018 3:23 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:
My issue and my only issue with product activation licences in general is the fact that depending how they are constructed ie eloquence, that you have to deactivate it on each major update, thats fine in reality however because there is a 6 month basically new os update it gets a bit well annoying there should be a way to assign a licence to your machine or in the case of win10 an account or something.

And it doesn't have to be like that.

For example windows manages to stay activated on each system update.

Mostly.

Then again maybe its not happened to me.

I have had on my cloud system I admin to reactivate the icloud and some other accounts whenever I update my bios for example but still everything stays up.

I also have issues where machines and licences have a 3 unit limit, in a bit of software I use for dvd extraction, you assign your machine to an id from an account online, if that changes you have to reassign that machine to the single id but at least you can do it yourself as many times as you need.




On 7/18/2018 6:52 PM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
Yes I'm sure you know that several attempts were made by nv access to have a licence system that was not too onerous, but no. I do think myself, that its rubbish but acknowledge a lot find it good. it obviously is a personal thing.
I to do  agree that modern voices are unintelligible at fast, even moderate speeds.

I as you know made the variant Quincy for UK English espeak and am happy with it in the main if they would stop mucking about with words that sounded right before. However I do also feel that the speech player in Espeak project was very good and I'd like to see somebody take this up again to make it better for the US market. One has to realise at the moment though that the biggest growth area for nvda is the Indian Subcontinent, and maybe other languages than English.
Brian

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----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Nutt" <steve@comproom.co.uk>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2018 4:31 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] possible eloquence solution


Why should they do this?  You’re effectively stopping Code Factory from making money.  Just buy Eloquence and be done with it. Besides, Microsoft wouldn’t maintain it.



All the best


Steve



From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Josh Kennedy
Sent: 17 July 2018 13:11
To: nvda@groups.io
Subject: [nvda] possible eloquence solution



It seems like unless this problem is solved it will keep coming up. So I just went into feedback hub and I recommend all of you do the same. I wrote the following feedback to Microsoft.

Please purchase all rites to CodeFactory Nuance Eloquence TTS. Offer it as a free downloadable sapi5 and OneCore voice addons under ease of access in windows10. And on the Microsoft website as sapi5 for windows7 users. Also please maintain the android version so it keeps working and perhaps lower the price to $2 or $3. Nuance CodeFactory licenses are too restrictive. Adding Eloquence to microsoft’s voice portfolio would benefit those with hearing impairments. So if Microsoft owned it, whenever you buy a copy of windows or a new pc, you also pay for the rite to use eloquence on any pc you buy.and if you don’t want it, you just do not go into ease of access and download it. Nuance copyright is stuck back in the 80s and early 90s and has to change. If not, this issue will probably keep cropping up.





Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>;  for Windows 10












.



Re: Questions About Internet Explorer

JM Casey <crystallogic@...>
 

If you want, you can even just delete them through file explorer, as I believe iE saves items by default in a subfolder of your documents.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris via Groups.Io
Sent: July 18, 2018 1:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Questions About Internet Explorer

 

Try a right click on the website in the favourites menu and select delete

 

 

From: Ibrahim Ajayi
Sent: 18 July 2018 18:02
To: nvda@groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Questions About Internet Explorer

 

Hello:

Please I'll like to find out how I can remove saved websites from the

favorites menu of IE.  I cannot find any option to remove it in the

add to favoirtes dialog box.  So, how can I go about removing this

unwanted websites.

Secondly, how can I find or access the history menu on IE.  Unlike

what you have on firefox, where you have a history menu just before

bookmarks, there is no such thing on IE.  I am made to understand that

there is a history menu on IE.  Please where can I find or access it.

Kind regards.

Ibrahim.