Date   

open live writer is not accessible yet.

 

hey guys, this windows desktop client looks like it is gonna be a great blog editor and overall blogging software. Only problem is, the editor is not accessible to NVDA and I am assuming JAWS. the menus and options are accessible, but the editor itself is made out of some kind of HTML frame. NVDA treats it like a web page rather than a text editor. The accessibility thread is below but it is basically me trying to get others to understand how a screen reader works and why they should make open live writer accessible.

https://github.com/OpenLiveWriter/OpenLiveWriter/issues/394


Re: new technology challenge

mcLeod stinnett
 

--
from mack I checked every box on the page but I can't press the button to advance to the next page. apparently a signature is still required, thank you for all your replies.


Re: NVDA and Firefox

Don H
 

Thanks for helping a old man do this right. I was trying to do it with instructions I found when Googling the problem and could not get them to work. Your instructions were easier and worked perfect.
Thanks

On 5/19/2018 11:32 AM, Gene wrote:
You're probably doing something wrong. Changes in Firefox should have nothing to do with reading menus and dialogs in general.
Use this procedure, which was the procedure before the changes to the program.
New major steps start on new lines.
Use the command control shift b to open the library window dealing with book marks.
Open the menus with alt.
Right arrow to import and backup.
Down arrow through the menu to the item that matches what you want to do.  Press enter and work through the wizard.
If you have questions, ask here.
When you are finished, close the window and return to the main window with alt f4.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Don H <mailto:lmddh50@adams.net>
*Sent:* Saturday, May 19, 2018 10:46 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* [nvda] NVDA and Firefox
I am finding that the latest version of NVDA and latest version of
Firefox has some issues.
After installing Firefox I follow the directions to import bookmarks
from another browser and NVDA will not read the listed option to import
bookmarks.  Sighted help says the import option is there but as I
indicated you can't get to it with NVDA. Anyone else seeing this
problem or am I doing something wrong.


Re: Sound Forge 12.5

Jitendra Kumar
 

Those scripts are from jim snowman
Snowmanradio.com, and as you know, they are for JAWS.
I herd somewhere that new soundforge are becoming accessible, magics
is listening to accessibility feedbacks.
But I know that much for sure, Chris, the developer of goldwave
listens always, when I developed and updated JAWS scripts for
Goldwave, I had him changed many parts, feature-sets and other things
to improve goldwave.
Try writing soundforge people, perhaps you get a luck.

On 5/19/18, Lenron <lenron93@gmail.com> wrote:
I downloaded the demo of sound forge 12.5 and had no luck with it with
NVDA. So decided to stick with reaper.

On 5/19/18, Steve Nutt <steve@comproom.co.uk> wrote:
Hi,

No I was referring to What Chris Gilland said about Sound Forge being
completely accessible. No way is it.

All the best

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Christopher
Gray
Sent: 17 May 2018 17:19
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

I'm not understanding what the mix paste dialog has to do with my
original
question. Maybe more detail could be helpful.

However, I think this whole discussion is missing the fundamental point
that
in Soundforge 12.5, you really can't even get to square one in terms of
use.

Opening a file and selecting a piece of it to delete or move is
fundamental
to most tasks. It doesn't work in NVDA. Keeping your place in a file is
absolutely necessary in order to perform a multitude of tasks in sound
editing.
Stability of your location in NVDA doesn't exist right now.

Soundforge 10 does work in Jaws, Cobra and Window-Eyes. Soundforge 12.5
does work in Jaws with scripts. If I'm going to be a serious NVDA user,
I
need it to work in NVDA. I have no doubt this is equally true for the
many
other blind Soundforge users out there, and there are a lot of them.

Chris

On Thu, 17 May 2018, Steve Nutt wrote:

Hi Chris,

Well try the mix paste dialogue then, it is inaccessible with any
screen reader, unless of course, you just accept the defaults.

All the best

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of
Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: 16 May 2018 18:44
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

Uh, I'm not meaning hear to be rude, but as a professional sound
engineer, I can say with absolute certainty, that unless there is
functionality I'm not seeing, which is unlikely, I use Soundforge
almost daily with no scripts, unless they come preinstalled with JAWS,
and I'm able to do quite a lot. I can edit, mix, master, etc. I've
been able to ever since version 4.5 way back in the days, which is when
I
first started using it.

Anyway, I mean this with all due respect, but, alas, I digress.

Chris.


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

Yes, I am told that Jaws works well with the Version 12 series. Brian
Hartgen, I believe, has a comprehensive set of Jaws scripts and
tutorials.
Cobra had its own scripts for Soundforge 9 and 10, but 12 is new and
Baum had developed no

replacement before its current dormancy.

Soundforge has always required scripting and I sincerely doubt one can
get anywhere by contacting them about accessibility issues.

Chris


On Wed, 16 May
2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:

Does anyone know if jaws is OK with the new version. I was not aware
that nvda had been tested with any version since it went mega
commercial.
I'm using Goldwave here, but obviously the program you are using has
a chequered career and has been written by lots of different folk
over the years, I'd not be surprised if accessibility is quite low on
their
radar.
We
would normally say, if you are a paying customer and it used to work
before,
that you should be able to have a word with them about changes like
this.
I think the general advice is to contact them, and then if they seem
not
to
want to fix it, take either further action or see if anyone can write
a patch for nvda, but if the program costs money it can be difficult
to find
somebody to do it.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: "NVDA Mailing List" <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 5:49 PM
Subject: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5


Hello:

As some will know, Magix now owns and updates Sound Forge. The
most recent release is 12.5.

This version is not working very well at all with NVDA. Even the
simplest of activities, highlighting a segment of audio and getting
it
to
play back is not working for me. Also, my position in a sound file
tends
to jump around in ways I don't understand. Suddenly, I might find
myself
2-3 minutes into a file for no reason at all.

Anybody know of a fix for this?

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council
of the Blind in
your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help
you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live
broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.







****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown
below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.













****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council
of
the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I
can
help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice,
Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past
Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.










--
Lenron Brown
Cell: 985-271-2832
Skype: ron.brown762



--
Skype:
Jeet.delhi


Re: NVDA and Firefox

Gene
 

You're probably doing something wrong.  Changes in Firefox should have nothing to do with reading menus and dialogs in general. 
 
Use this procedure, which was the procedure before the changes to the program.
New major steps start on new lines.
Use the command control shift b to open the library window dealing with book marks.
Open the menus with alt.
Right arrow to import and backup. 
Down arrow through the menu to the item that matches what you want to do.  Press enter and work through the wizard. 
If you have questions, ask here.
 
When you are finished, close the window and return to the main window with alt f4.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Don H
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 10:46 AM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA and Firefox

I am finding that the latest version of NVDA and latest version of
Firefox has some issues.
After installing Firefox I follow the directions to import bookmarks
from another browser and NVDA will not read the listed option to import
bookmarks.  Sighted help says the import option is there but as I
indicated you can't get to it with NVDA.  Anyone else seeing this
problem or am I doing something wrong.




Re: Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi everyone,

As I said multiple times, Sets isn’t something you will find in Version 1803 (build 17134). When I and others who are actually using Sets refer to sets, we refer to using it in post-1803 preview builds (17600 series).

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 4:39 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi Gamages,

 

I tried following the steps in the referenced article and I got down to the multi tasking item, selected it but did not see any item labeled sets.

 

I do have the latest update for Spring 2018.

 

 

On 5/19/2018 3:38 AM, The Gamages via Groups.Io wrote:

Gene,

 

If you read my message again, you will note that I wanted to postpone updates and sets etc, not dismiss them out of hand, so you are putting words in my mouth.

However, thank you for the link to turn off sets.

 

Best Regards, Jim.

 

From: Gene

Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 3:34 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

I believe I read that sets is off by default but I'm not sure.  If not, you can turn them off.  Here is an article that describes how. 

Perhaps, instead of just rejecting the feature out of hand, a little time might be spent learning about them and trying them to see if they would be useful. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Gene

----- Original Message -----

 

Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 4:59 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hello,

 

Having followed this thread with interest, I am still not sure whether the “sets” issue is on by default or not, if it’s not, then I don’t see the problem, just don’t turn it on until problems with screen readers are resolved. I haven’t got the latest update yet, I have my working hours set to6 am to 12 midnight and the computer is off outside those hours, I got a message recently  something like, “we couldn’t find a time to download updates”, could this be a way of stopping these updates to windows ten? or am I dreaming?, if it works, it could b a way of postponing them until all problems with screen readers are resolved.

 

I should say that I have Eset smart security on my system and this largely disables Windows defender anyway.

 

To Steve, I bet you are sad that Window eyes is now defunkt? I also noted from one of FS webinar that Jaws is likely to do away with the 40 minute mode in favour of a 30 day trial, Lots of people can’t afford the price of Jaws, I am lucky enough to have had it for years, Long live NVDA for those who are not in my position. I do understand that Steve runs a well known business and needs to have everything working to do his job, but Jaws hasn’t always been so brilliant, and still isn’t with some third party programs.

 

 

Best Regards, Jim.

 

From: Steve Nutt

Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 8:19 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Well if I was on NVDA only today, I couldn’t do my job.  This is why it’s always good to have more than one screen reader.

 

Besides, you’re probably not on Windows 10 1803 Spring Creators, which is where these issues started for me.

 

But saying I should be using NVDA and not JAWS doesn’t really add value to this thread, I merely reported that NVDA is broken for me on several machines.

 

All the best


Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: 16 May 2018 17:51
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

NVDA is broken? How so? I am on NVDA 2018.1.1. I always tell people thinking about using JAWS that they should be long on NVDA and short on JAWS, since NVDA is free and open source, and provides the same quality. It is kind of like John Wayne’s advice to be long on ears and short on jaws, but with my screen reader twist.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:48 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi,

 

I have to say, over all, Windows 10 is snappier than Windows 7 ever was.

 

It’s just these glitches that get us.

 

What’s odd with this particular issue is that NVDA and Narrator are quite broken, but JAWS is a happy screen reader.  So they are obviously doing some serious hacking to get UIA to work as well as it does with JAWS.

 

All the best

 

Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 16 May 2018 17:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

That is only true if a lot of users, sighted users, get annoyed enough to matter.  A lot of the changes that inconvenience blind users until they learn how to use them may be intuitive and quickly understood by sighted users.  and, in the case of screen-reader problems, sighted people wouldn't have any of those problems.  Also, as in the new feature of sets, they may not be on by default.  As I recall what I read, sets is off by default.

 

But every time a new major update to Windows comes out, I see enough blind users have problems that I'm in no hurry to get Windows 10.  Even if the problems are temporary, such as screen-reader problems that are dealt with not too long after the upgrade, Windows 10 has nothing I want that justifies even relatively minor inconveniences time after time.

 

I'll get it when I get a new computer.  I won't upgrade a machine that is working very well with an earlier version of Windows.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 10:47 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

I think the one thing I'm really annoyed about is that Microsoft keep on
fiddling with things that used to work and making them not work. I have
actually given  up on 10 as a working platform, unless Microsoft can simply
provide a system stable and just with security updates like windows 7. They
are not doing themselves any good by bringing out new versions of windows
every6 months or so in my view, they are going to make Windows 7 into the
keep hold of system just like XP if they are not more careful. Fine have new
features but do not change the whole concept and still call it windows 10.
that is just silly. That is my feeling after being exposed to their messing
about. its as if the developers who used to regularly screw up Skype have
been let loose on the innards of Windows!
Hides behind sofa.  Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Nutt" <steve@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803


> Oh and isn't it time NVDA installed Win 10 essentials automagically if Win
> 10 is detected?  New users shouldn't certainly have to go hunting for
> addons
> for their screen reader.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
> Sent: 16 May 2018 15:43
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
> Hi,
>
> I just downloaded Win 10 essentials stable today, but it doesn't seem to
> make much difference.
>
> I must play a bit more.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian's Mail
> list account via Groups.Io
> Sent: 16 May 2018 13:17
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
> I expect Joseph will be along soon to ask about the  version of win 10
> essentials you have, but have you tried the pre release master snap?
> If that fails too then somebody in the development team needs to try to
> isolate what makes some machines work and others not.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal E-mail to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Nutt" <mailto:steve@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:31 PM
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
>
>> Hi Jacob,
>>
>>
>>
>> I have three machines here, all on 1803.  None of them work at all
>> well with NVDA in Windows 10, in fact, File Explorer is pretty much
>> unusable, as is Outlook.
>>
>>
>>
>> At this point, I'm glad I have JAWS as well.  But I don't know why
>> NVDA is so broken with 1803, more so than JAWS.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jacob
>> Kruger
>> Sent: 16 May 2018 09:10
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve, this sounds almost like an iteration of what I was mentioning -
>> it seems to fluctuate/vary quite a bit on/off on my one windows 10
>> 1803 machine, which is a lenovo laptop, whereas on my slightly lower
>> hardware specification desktop machine, that does however have a solid
>> state operating system drive in it, it actually seems to react a bit
>> more consistently, in terms of reading out list items, like in file
>> explorer, to me, and, this is with both of them running windows 10
>> 1803 pro 64 bit, and, currently both running NVDA master snapshot.
>>
>>
>>
>> Stay well
>>
>>
>>
>> Jacob Kruger
>> Blind Biker
>> Skype: BlindZA
>> "Resistance is futile..but, acceptance is versatile..."
>>
>> On 5/16/2018 10:03 AM, Steve Nutt wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>>
>> I recently reported that Outlook message lists were not reading for me.
>>
>>
>>
>> It is in fact worse than that, lists in general don't seem to be reading.
>> For example, File Explorer in Windows 10 is completely silent for me now.
>>
>>
>>
>> JAWS is reading lists quite happily.
>>
>>
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Computer Room Services
>>
>> 77 Exeter Close
>>
>> Stevenage
>>
>> Hertfordshire
>>
>> SG1 4PW
>>
>> Tel: +44(0)1438-742286
>>
>> Mob: +44(0)7956-334938
>>
>> Fax: +44(0)1438-759589
>>
>> Email:  <mailto:steve@...> steve@...
>>
>> Web:  <http://www.comproom.co.uk/> http://www.comproom.co.uk
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>



-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


NVDA and Firefox

Don H
 

I am finding that the latest version of NVDA and latest version of Firefox has some issues.
After installing Firefox I follow the directions to import bookmarks from another browser and NVDA will not read the listed option to import bookmarks. Sighted help says the import option is there but as I indicated you can't get to it with NVDA. Anyone else seeing this problem or am I doing something wrong.


Problems When tried Shutting Down NVDA

 

Hello,
Do you guys have these problems?
Since yesterday I  just can't shutdown my NVDA by the task manager.
When I tried "taskkill /f /im nvda.exe" it gives me a error message.
And that's the only way I found to fix the bug that freezes my computer 'til I restart it. If I can  be faster than the bug, I'm able to give the command to shut down the task and then it's alright.

Chheers,
Marcio


Re: gethub

Jason White
 

I would add that the Git command line tools work well with screen readers, including NVDA. If you plan to use those, there are good books available, such as the Pro Git book:

https://git-scm.com/book/en/v2

 

 

From: <nvda@nvda.groups.io> on behalf of Quentin Christensen <quentin@...>
Reply-To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Date: Friday, May 18, 2018 at 09:35
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] gethub

 

Hi Chris,

 

I think you mean "Github".  The source code for NVDA is kept on GitHub, as well as our issue repository.  So, if you want to file a bug, that's the best place.

 

If you are looking for issues, you'll find them here: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues - there is a search edit where you can type keywords about your problem.  If you can't find an existing issue, then there is a "New Issue" button (note, you can browse issues without an account, but you'll need a free account to create issues).  

 

If you want to contribute code or download the source code, you can do that from GitHub as well, and if you want to go down that track (fantastic, it would be great to have you on board!) you'll want to browse through the developer guide: https://www.nvaccess.org/files/nvda/documentation/developerGuide.html and probably join the developer mailing list as well: https://sourceforge.net/p/nvda/lists/nvda-devel/

 

Kind regards

 

Quentin.

 

On Fri, May 18, 2018 at 11:15 PM, Christopher Gray <chris@...> wrote:

Hi:

Where can I find documentation on NVDA and Gethub?

Thank you.

Chris


****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of the Blind in
your Will or Estate Plan?  Contact me as shown below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone:     (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax:       (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz?  Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M. Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.





 

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 

Official NVDA Training modules and expert certification now available: http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

 

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess 
Twitter: @NVAccess 


Re: Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Gamages,


I tried following the steps in the referenced article and I got down to the multi tasking item, selected it but did not see any item labeled sets.


I do have the latest update for Spring 2018.



On 5/19/2018 3:38 AM, The Gamages via Groups.Io wrote:
Gene,
 
If you read my message again, you will note that I wanted to postpone updates and sets etc, not dismiss them out of hand, so you are putting words in my mouth.
However, thank you for the link to turn off sets.
 
Best Regards, Jim.
 
From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 3:34 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
 
I believe I read that sets is off by default but I'm not sure.  If not, you can turn them off.  Here is an article that describes how. 
Perhaps, instead of just rejecting the feature out of hand, a little time might be spent learning about them and trying them to see if they would be useful. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Gene
----- Original Message -----
 
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 4:59 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
 
Hello,
 
Having followed this thread with interest, I am still not sure whether the “sets” issue is on by default or not, if it’s not, then I don’t see the problem, just don’t turn it on until problems with screen readers are resolved. I haven’t got the latest update yet, I have my working hours set to6 am to 12 midnight and the computer is off outside those hours, I got a message recently  something like, “we couldn’t find a time to download updates”, could this be a way of stopping these updates to windows ten? or am I dreaming?, if it works, it could b a way of postponing them until all problems with screen readers are resolved.
 
I should say that I have Eset smart security on my system and this largely disables Windows defender anyway.
 
To Steve, I bet you are sad that Window eyes is now defunkt? I also noted from one of FS webinar that Jaws is likely to do away with the 40 minute mode in favour of a 30 day trial, Lots of people can’t afford the price of Jaws, I am lucky enough to have had it for years, Long live NVDA for those who are not in my position. I do understand that Steve runs a well known business and needs to have everything working to do his job, but Jaws hasn’t always been so brilliant, and still isn’t with some third party programs.
 
 
Best Regards, Jim.
 
From: Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 8:19 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
 

Well if I was on NVDA only today, I couldn’t do my job.  This is why it’s always good to have more than one screen reader.

 

Besides, you’re probably not on Windows 10 1803 Spring Creators, which is where these issues started for me.

 

But saying I should be using NVDA and not JAWS doesn’t really add value to this thread, I merely reported that NVDA is broken for me on several machines.

 

All the best


Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: 16 May 2018 17:51
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

NVDA is broken? How so? I am on NVDA 2018.1.1. I always tell people thinking about using JAWS that they should be long on NVDA and short on JAWS, since NVDA is free and open source, and provides the same quality. It is kind of like John Wayne’s advice to be long on ears and short on jaws, but with my screen reader twist.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:48 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi,

 

I have to say, over all, Windows 10 is snappier than Windows 7 ever was.

 

It’s just these glitches that get us.

 

What’s odd with this particular issue is that NVDA and Narrator are quite broken, but JAWS is a happy screen reader.  So they are obviously doing some serious hacking to get UIA to work as well as it does with JAWS.

 

All the best

 

Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 16 May 2018 17:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

That is only true if a lot of users, sighted users, get annoyed enough to matter.  A lot of the changes that inconvenience blind users until they learn how to use them may be intuitive and quickly understood by sighted users.  and, in the case of screen-reader problems, sighted people wouldn't have any of those problems.  Also, as in the new feature of sets, they may not be on by default.  As I recall what I read, sets is off by default.

 

But every time a new major update to Windows comes out, I see enough blind users have problems that I'm in no hurry to get Windows 10.  Even if the problems are temporary, such as screen-reader problems that are dealt with not too long after the upgrade, Windows 10 has nothing I want that justifies even relatively minor inconveniences time after time.

 

I'll get it when I get a new computer.  I won't upgrade a machine that is working very well with an earlier version of Windows.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 10:47 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

I think the one thing I'm really annoyed about is that Microsoft keep on
fiddling with things that used to work and making them not work. I have
actually given  up on 10 as a working platform, unless Microsoft can simply
provide a system stable and just with security updates like windows 7. They
are not doing themselves any good by bringing out new versions of windows
every6 months or so in my view, they are going to make Windows 7 into the
keep hold of system just like XP if they are not more careful. Fine have new
features but do not change the whole concept and still call it windows 10.
that is just silly. That is my feeling after being exposed to their messing
about. its as if the developers who used to regularly screw up Skype have
been let loose on the innards of Windows!
Hides behind sofa.  Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Nutt" <steve@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803


> Oh and isn't it time NVDA installed Win 10 essentials automagically if Win
> 10 is detected?  New users shouldn't certainly have to go hunting for
> addons
> for their screen reader.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
> Sent: 16 May 2018 15:43
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
> Hi,
>
> I just downloaded Win 10 essentials stable today, but it doesn't seem to
> make much difference.
>
> I must play a bit more.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian's Mail
> list account via Groups.Io
> Sent: 16 May 2018 13:17
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
> I expect Joseph will be along soon to ask about the  version of win 10
> essentials you have, but have you tried the pre release master snap?
> If that fails too then somebody in the development team needs to try to
> isolate what makes some machines work and others not.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal E-mail to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Nutt" <mailto:steve@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:31 PM
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
>
>> Hi Jacob,
>>
>>
>>
>> I have three machines here, all on 1803.  None of them work at all
>> well with NVDA in Windows 10, in fact, File Explorer is pretty much
>> unusable, as is Outlook.
>>
>>
>>
>> At this point, I'm glad I have JAWS as well.  But I don't know why
>> NVDA is so broken with 1803, more so than JAWS.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jacob
>> Kruger
>> Sent: 16 May 2018 09:10
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve, this sounds almost like an iteration of what I was mentioning -
>> it seems to fluctuate/vary quite a bit on/off on my one windows 10
>> 1803 machine, which is a lenovo laptop, whereas on my slightly lower
>> hardware specification desktop machine, that does however have a solid
>> state operating system drive in it, it actually seems to react a bit
>> more consistently, in terms of reading out list items, like in file
>> explorer, to me, and, this is with both of them running windows 10
>> 1803 pro 64 bit, and, currently both running NVDA master snapshot.
>>
>>
>>
>> Stay well
>>
>>
>>
>> Jacob Kruger
>> Blind Biker
>> Skype: BlindZA
>> "Resistance is futile..but, acceptance is versatile..."
>>
>> On 5/16/2018 10:03 AM, Steve Nutt wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>>
>> I recently reported that Outlook message lists were not reading for me.
>>
>>
>>
>> It is in fact worse than that, lists in general don't seem to be reading.
>> For example, File Explorer in Windows 10 is completely silent for me now.
>>
>>
>>
>> JAWS is reading lists quite happily.
>>
>>
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Computer Room Services
>>
>> 77 Exeter Close
>>
>> Stevenage
>>
>> Hertfordshire
>>
>> SG1 4PW
>>
>> Tel: +44(0)1438-742286
>>
>> Mob: +44(0)7956-334938
>>
>> Fax: +44(0)1438-759589
>>
>> Email:  <mailto:steve@...> steve@...
>>
>> Web:  <http://www.comproom.co.uk/> http://www.comproom.co.uk
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: Sound Forge 12.5

Lenron
 

I downloaded the demo of sound forge 12.5 and had no luck with it with
NVDA. So decided to stick with reaper.

On 5/19/18, Steve Nutt <steve@comproom.co.uk> wrote:
Hi,

No I was referring to What Chris Gilland said about Sound Forge being
completely accessible. No way is it.

All the best

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Christopher
Gray
Sent: 17 May 2018 17:19
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

I'm not understanding what the mix paste dialog has to do with my original
question. Maybe more detail could be helpful.

However, I think this whole discussion is missing the fundamental point
that
in Soundforge 12.5, you really can't even get to square one in terms of
use.

Opening a file and selecting a piece of it to delete or move is fundamental
to most tasks. It doesn't work in NVDA. Keeping your place in a file is
absolutely necessary in order to perform a multitude of tasks in sound
editing.
Stability of your location in NVDA doesn't exist right now.

Soundforge 10 does work in Jaws, Cobra and Window-Eyes. Soundforge 12.5
does work in Jaws with scripts. If I'm going to be a serious NVDA user, I
need it to work in NVDA. I have no doubt this is equally true for the many
other blind Soundforge users out there, and there are a lot of them.

Chris

On Thu, 17 May 2018, Steve Nutt wrote:

Hi Chris,

Well try the mix paste dialogue then, it is inaccessible with any
screen reader, unless of course, you just accept the defaults.

All the best

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of
Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: 16 May 2018 18:44
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

Uh, I'm not meaning hear to be rude, but as a professional sound
engineer, I can say with absolute certainty, that unless there is
functionality I'm not seeing, which is unlikely, I use Soundforge
almost daily with no scripts, unless they come preinstalled with JAWS,
and I'm able to do quite a lot. I can edit, mix, master, etc. I've
been able to ever since version 4.5 way back in the days, which is when I
first started using it.

Anyway, I mean this with all due respect, but, alas, I digress.

Chris.


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

Yes, I am told that Jaws works well with the Version 12 series. Brian
Hartgen, I believe, has a comprehensive set of Jaws scripts and
tutorials.
Cobra had its own scripts for Soundforge 9 and 10, but 12 is new and
Baum had developed no

replacement before its current dormancy.

Soundforge has always required scripting and I sincerely doubt one can
get anywhere by contacting them about accessibility issues.

Chris


On Wed, 16 May
2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:

Does anyone know if jaws is OK with the new version. I was not aware
that nvda had been tested with any version since it went mega
commercial.
I'm using Goldwave here, but obviously the program you are using has
a chequered career and has been written by lots of different folk
over the years, I'd not be surprised if accessibility is quite low on
their
radar.
We
would normally say, if you are a paying customer and it used to work
before,
that you should be able to have a word with them about changes like
this.
I think the general advice is to contact them, and then if they seem
not
to
want to fix it, take either further action or see if anyone can write
a patch for nvda, but if the program costs money it can be difficult
to find
somebody to do it.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: "NVDA Mailing List" <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 5:49 PM
Subject: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5


Hello:

As some will know, Magix now owns and updates Sound Forge. The
most recent release is 12.5.

This version is not working very well at all with NVDA. Even the
simplest of activities, highlighting a segment of audio and getting
it
to
play back is not working for me. Also, my position in a sound file
tends
to jump around in ways I don't understand. Suddenly, I might find
myself
2-3 minutes into a file for no reason at all.

Anybody know of a fix for this?

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council
of the Blind in
your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help
you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live
broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.







****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown
below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.













****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council
of
the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can
help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice,
Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past
Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.









--
Lenron Brown
Cell: 985-271-2832
Skype: ron.brown762


Re: Call me stupid but..

Greg Wocher
 

Hello,
On the drive page, after hitting the download, you have to search the page for the accept link. I ran into this issue as well.

Greg Wocher

On May 19, 2018, at 3:22 AM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io <bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

I did that and nothing actually happened which is why I mentioned it here. Not sure that the other site will be up to date. Does it still just download the stub?
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Vlad Dragomir" <vladdragomir1983@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 3:18 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Call me stupid but..


Hello,

Alternatively, you can go to drive.google.com, press space on Settings, and enter on Download Backup and Sync.

All the best,

Vlad.



Re: Sound Forge 12.5

Steve Nutt
 

Hi,

No I was referring to What Chris Gilland said about Sound Forge being
completely accessible. No way is it.

All the best

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Christopher
Gray
Sent: 17 May 2018 17:19
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

I'm not understanding what the mix paste dialog has to do with my original
question. Maybe more detail could be helpful.

However, I think this whole discussion is missing the fundamental point that
in Soundforge 12.5, you really can't even get to square one in terms of use.

Opening a file and selecting a piece of it to delete or move is fundamental
to most tasks. It doesn't work in NVDA. Keeping your place in a file is
absolutely necessary in order to perform a multitude of tasks in sound
editing.
Stability of your location in NVDA doesn't exist right now.

Soundforge 10 does work in Jaws, Cobra and Window-Eyes. Soundforge 12.5
does work in Jaws with scripts. If I'm going to be a serious NVDA user, I
need it to work in NVDA. I have no doubt this is equally true for the many
other blind Soundforge users out there, and there are a lot of them.

Chris

On Thu, 17 May 2018, Steve Nutt wrote:

Hi Chris,

Well try the mix paste dialogue then, it is inaccessible with any
screen reader, unless of course, you just accept the defaults.

All the best

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of
Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: 16 May 2018 18:44
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

Uh, I'm not meaning hear to be rude, but as a professional sound
engineer, I can say with absolute certainty, that unless there is
functionality I'm not seeing, which is unlikely, I use Soundforge
almost daily with no scripts, unless they come preinstalled with JAWS,
and I'm able to do quite a lot. I can edit, mix, master, etc. I've
been able to ever since version 4.5 way back in the days, which is when I
first started using it.

Anyway, I mean this with all due respect, but, alas, I digress.

Chris.


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of
Christopher Gray
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 1:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5

Yes, I am told that Jaws works well with the Version 12 series. Brian
Hartgen, I believe, has a comprehensive set of Jaws scripts and tutorials.
Cobra had its own scripts for Soundforge 9 and 10, but 12 is new and
Baum had developed no

replacement before its current dormancy.

Soundforge has always required scripting and I sincerely doubt one can
get anywhere by contacting them about accessibility issues.

Chris


On Wed, 16 May
2018, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:

Does anyone know if jaws is OK with the new version. I was not aware
that nvda had been tested with any version since it went mega commercial.
I'm using Goldwave here, but obviously the program you are using has
a chequered career and has been written by lots of different folk
over the years, I'd not be surprised if accessibility is quite low on
their
radar.
We
would normally say, if you are a paying customer and it used to work
before,
that you should be able to have a word with them about changes like
this.
I think the general advice is to contact them, and then if they seem
not
to
want to fix it, take either further action or see if anyone can write
a patch for nvda, but if the program costs money it can be difficult
to find
somebody to do it.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gray"
<chris@moblind.org>
To: "NVDA Mailing List" <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 5:49 PM
Subject: [nvda] Sound Forge 12.5


Hello:

As some will know, Magix now owns and updates Sound Forge. The
most recent release is 12.5.

This version is not working very well at all with NVDA. Even the
simplest of activities, highlighting a segment of audio and getting
it
to
play back is not working for me. Also, my position in a sound file
tends
to jump around in ways I don't understand. Suddenly, I might find
myself
2-3 minutes into a file for no reason at all.

Anybody know of a fix for this?

Chris

****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council
of the Blind in
your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can help
you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen
to Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.







****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri
Council of the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown
below and I can help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global
Voice, Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific
Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to
Past Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.













****************************************
Have you considered Annual Giving or including a gift to Missouri Council of
the Blind in your Will or Estate Plan? Contact me as shown below and I can
help you with this.

----------------------------------------
Christopher Gray, Executive Director
Missouri Council of the Blind

5453 Chippewa
St. Louis, MO 63109
Phone: (314) 832-7172
Toll-free: (800) 342-5632
Fax: (314) 832-7796

Like Jazz? Want to know more about jazz?
Tune into "A Journey into Jazz" with the Jazz Guys on the Global Voice,
Chris and Don.
Listen live each Wednesday at 00:00 Utc, 7:00 P.M. Eastern, 4:00 P.M.
Pacific Find us by going to theglobalvoice.info/broadband.pls.
Can't listen live? go to theglobalvoice.info and choose the "Listen to Past
Shows" link any time during the week after each live broadcast.
You can also go to the link www.jazzguys.libsyn.com for the podcasts!
Or, subscribe to us through iTunes or TuneIn Radio.


Re: Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

Steve Nutt
 

Hi,

 

Yes, you need to check some of the checkboxes first, on stuff you want to clean up.

 

All the best


Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jessica D
Sent: 17 May 2018 17:17
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi,

I just tried that, but it won’t work.

I pressed ok, but the program closed.

Is that expected behavior?

 

Thanks,

Jessica

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 12:15 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi Jessica,

 

Run the Disk Clean-Up Utility.  This will free heaps of space if you’ve had lots of updates.

 

All the best


Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jessica D
Sent: 17 May 2018 17:07
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi,

I can’t even install 1803, even though it’s finally showed up on my system.

Apparently, I’m running out of storage, and cannot free any.

 

Other than a clean install, what can I do to free up space?

 

Thanks,

Jessica

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Joseph Lee
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 12:04 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi,

No, Sets is turned off by default not because it is actually turned off, but because many of you running Windows 10 won’t see it for a while. If you are using Version 1803 (build 17134), rest assured that Sets isn’t part of that release; it is, however, part of recent Windows Insider Preview builds.

As for Sets and NVDA (as of Insider Preview build 17672): it is usable. There are some oddities when you actually launch Sets and try to search for things, but for the most part, it is usable. Part of the usability came due to what NVDA already provides, will provide in 2018.2, future work, and my “writings”:

  • What NVDA already provides: support for Microsoft Edge.
  • What NVDA will provide in 2018.2: app notification announcement in Windows 10 Version 1709 and later.
  • Future work: foundations to support Sets will be laid in the next few months.
  • My writings: Windows 10 App Essentials 18.05.2 (tomorrow) will let you see how Sets work in code (as far as the add-on is concerned).

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 7:34 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

I believe I read that sets is off by default but I'm not sure.  If not, you can turn them off.  Here is an article that describes how. 

Perhaps, instead of just rejecting the feature out of hand, a little time might be spent learning about them and trying them to see if they would be useful. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Gene

----- Original Message -----

 

Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 4:59 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hello,

 

Having followed this thread with interest, I am still not sure whether the “sets” issue is on by default or not, if it’s not, then I don’t see the problem, just don’t turn it on until problems with screen readers are resolved. I haven’t got the latest update yet, I have my working hours set to6 am to 12 midnight and the computer is off outside those hours, I got a message recently  something like, “we couldn’t find a time to download updates”, could this be a way of stopping these updates to windows ten? or am I dreaming?, if it works, it could b a way of postponing them until all problems with screen readers are resolved.

 

I should say that I have Eset smart security on my system and this largely disables Windows defender anyway.

 

To Steve, I bet you are sad that Window eyes is now defunkt? I also noted from one of FS webinar that Jaws is likely to do away with the 40 minute mode in favour of a 30 day trial, Lots of people can’t afford the price of Jaws, I am lucky enough to have had it for years, Long live NVDA for those who are not in my position. I do understand that Steve runs a well known business and needs to have everything working to do his job, but Jaws hasn’t always been so brilliant, and still isn’t with some third party programs.

 

 

Best Regards, Jim.

 

From: Steve Nutt

Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 8:19 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Well if I was on NVDA only today, I couldn’t do my job.  This is why it’s always good to have more than one screen reader.

 

Besides, you’re probably not on Windows 10 1803 Spring Creators, which is where these issues started for me.

 

But saying I should be using NVDA and not JAWS doesn’t really add value to this thread, I merely reported that NVDA is broken for me on several machines.

 

All the best


Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: 16 May 2018 17:51
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

NVDA is broken? How so? I am on NVDA 2018.1.1. I always tell people thinking about using JAWS that they should be long on NVDA and short on JAWS, since NVDA is free and open source, and provides the same quality. It is kind of like John Wayne’s advice to be long on ears and short on jaws, but with my screen reader twist.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:48 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi,

 

I have to say, over all, Windows 10 is snappier than Windows 7 ever was.

 

It’s just these glitches that get us.

 

What’s odd with this particular issue is that NVDA and Narrator are quite broken, but JAWS is a happy screen reader.  So they are obviously doing some serious hacking to get UIA to work as well as it does with JAWS.

 

All the best

 

Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 16 May 2018 17:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

That is only true if a lot of users, sighted users, get annoyed enough to matter.  A lot of the changes that inconvenience blind users until they learn how to use them may be intuitive and quickly understood by sighted users.  and, in the case of screen-reader problems, sighted people wouldn't have any of those problems.  Also, as in the new feature of sets, they may not be on by default.  As I recall what I read, sets is off by default.

 

But every time a new major update to Windows comes out, I see enough blind users have problems that I'm in no hurry to get Windows 10.  Even if the problems are temporary, such as screen-reader problems that are dealt with not too long after the upgrade, Windows 10 has nothing I want that justifies even relatively minor inconveniences time after time.

 

I'll get it when I get a new computer.  I won't upgrade a machine that is working very well with an earlier version of Windows.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 10:47 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

I think the one thing I'm really annoyed about is that Microsoft keep on
fiddling with things that used to work and making them not work. I have
actually given  up on 10 as a working platform, unless Microsoft can simply
provide a system stable and just with security updates like windows 7. They
are not doing themselves any good by bringing out new versions of windows
every6 months or so in my view, they are going to make Windows 7 into the
keep hold of system just like XP if they are not more careful. Fine have new
features but do not change the whole concept and still call it windows 10.
that is just silly. That is my feeling after being exposed to their messing
about. its as if the developers who used to regularly screw up Skype have
been let loose on the innards of Windows!
Hides behind sofa.  Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Nutt" <steve@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803


> Oh and isn't it time NVDA installed Win 10 essentials automagically if Win
> 10 is detected?  New users shouldn't certainly have to go hunting for
> addons
> for their screen reader.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
> Sent: 16 May 2018 15:43
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
> Hi,
>
> I just downloaded Win 10 essentials stable today, but it doesn't seem to
> make much difference.
>
> I must play a bit more.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian's Mail
> list account via Groups.Io
> Sent: 16 May 2018 13:17
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
> I expect Joseph will be along soon to ask about the  version of win 10
> essentials you have, but have you tried the pre release master snap?
> If that fails too then somebody in the development team needs to try to
> isolate what makes some machines work and others not.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal E-mail to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Nutt" <mailto:steve@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:31 PM
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
>
>> Hi Jacob,
>>
>>
>>
>> I have three machines here, all on 1803.  None of them work at all
>> well with NVDA in Windows 10, in fact, File Explorer is pretty much
>> unusable, as is Outlook.
>>
>>
>>
>> At this point, I'm glad I have JAWS as well.  But I don't know why
>> NVDA is so broken with 1803, more so than JAWS.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jacob
>> Kruger
>> Sent: 16 May 2018 09:10
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve, this sounds almost like an iteration of what I was mentioning -
>> it seems to fluctuate/vary quite a bit on/off on my one windows 10
>> 1803 machine, which is a lenovo laptop, whereas on my slightly lower
>> hardware specification desktop machine, that does however have a solid
>> state operating system drive in it, it actually seems to react a bit
>> more consistently, in terms of reading out list items, like in file
>> explorer, to me, and, this is with both of them running windows 10
>> 1803 pro 64 bit, and, currently both running NVDA master snapshot.
>>
>>
>>
>> Stay well
>>
>>
>>
>> Jacob Kruger
>> Blind Biker
>> Skype: BlindZA
>> "Resistance is futile...but, acceptance is versatile..."
>>
>> On 5/16/2018 10:03 AM, Steve Nutt wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>>
>> I recently reported that Outlook message lists were not reading for me.
>>
>>
>>
>> It is in fact worse than that, lists in general don't seem to be reading.
>> For example, File Explorer in Windows 10 is completely silent for me now.
>>
>>
>>
>> JAWS is reading lists quite happily.
>>
>>
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Computer Room Services
>>
>> 77 Exeter Close
>>
>> Stevenage
>>
>> Hertfordshire
>>
>> SG1 4PW
>>
>> Tel: +44(0)1438-742286
>>
>> Mob: +44(0)7956-334938
>>
>> Fax: +44(0)1438-759589
>>
>> Email:  <mailto:steve@...> steve@...
>>
>> Web:  <http://www.comproom.co.uk/> http://www.comproom.co.uk
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

 

 


Re: Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

Gene
 

Yes, I didn't realize that.  Sorry for the error.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 2:38 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

Gene,
 
If you read my message again, you will note that I wanted to postpone updates and sets etc, not dismiss them out of hand, so you are putting words in my mouth.
However, thank you for the link to turn off sets.
 
Best Regards, Jim.
 
From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 3:34 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
 
I believe I read that sets is off by default but I'm not sure.  If not, you can turn them off.  Here is an article that describes how. 
Perhaps, instead of just rejecting the feature out of hand, a little time might be spent learning about them and trying them to see if they would be useful. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Gene
----- Original Message -----
 
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 4:59 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
 
Hello,
 
Having followed this thread with interest, I am still not sure whether the “sets” issue is on by default or not, if it’s not, then I don’t see the problem, just don’t turn it on until problems with screen readers are resolved. I haven’t got the latest update yet, I have my working hours set to6 am to 12 midnight and the computer is off outside those hours, I got a message recently  something like, “we couldn’t find a time to download updates”, could this be a way of stopping these updates to windows ten? or am I dreaming?, if it works, it could b a way of postponing them until all problems with screen readers are resolved.
 
I should say that I have Eset smart security on my system and this largely disables Windows defender anyway.
 
To Steve, I bet you are sad that Window eyes is now defunkt? I also noted from one of FS webinar that Jaws is likely to do away with the 40 minute mode in favour of a 30 day trial, Lots of people can’t afford the price of Jaws, I am lucky enough to have had it for years, Long live NVDA for those who are not in my position. I do understand that Steve runs a well known business and needs to have everything working to do his job, but Jaws hasn’t always been so brilliant, and still isn’t with some third party programs.
 
 
Best Regards, Jim.
 
From: Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 8:19 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
 

Well if I was on NVDA only today, I couldn’t do my job.  This is why it’s always good to have more than one screen reader.

 

Besides, you’re probably not on Windows 10 1803 Spring Creators, which is where these issues started for me.

 

But saying I should be using NVDA and not JAWS doesn’t really add value to this thread, I merely reported that NVDA is broken for me on several machines.

 

All the best


Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: 16 May 2018 17:51
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

NVDA is broken? How so? I am on NVDA 2018.1.1. I always tell people thinking about using JAWS that they should be long on NVDA and short on JAWS, since NVDA is free and open source, and provides the same quality. It is kind of like John Wayne’s advice to be long on ears and short on jaws, but with my screen reader twist.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:48 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi,

 

I have to say, over all, Windows 10 is snappier than Windows 7 ever was.

 

It’s just these glitches that get us.

 

What’s odd with this particular issue is that NVDA and Narrator are quite broken, but JAWS is a happy screen reader.  So they are obviously doing some serious hacking to get UIA to work as well as it does with JAWS.

 

All the best

 

Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 16 May 2018 17:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

That is only true if a lot of users, sighted users, get annoyed enough to matter.  A lot of the changes that inconvenience blind users until they learn how to use them may be intuitive and quickly understood by sighted users.  and, in the case of screen-reader problems, sighted people wouldn't have any of those problems.  Also, as in the new feature of sets, they may not be on by default.  As I recall what I read, sets is off by default.

 

But every time a new major update to Windows comes out, I see enough blind users have problems that I'm in no hurry to get Windows 10.  Even if the problems are temporary, such as screen-reader problems that are dealt with not too long after the upgrade, Windows 10 has nothing I want that justifies even relatively minor inconveniences time after time.

 

I'll get it when I get a new computer.  I won't upgrade a machine that is working very well with an earlier version of Windows.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 10:47 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

I think the one thing I'm really annoyed about is that Microsoft keep on
fiddling with things that used to work and making them not work. I have
actually given  up on 10 as a working platform, unless Microsoft can simply
provide a system stable and just with security updates like windows 7. They
are not doing themselves any good by bringing out new versions of windows
every6 months or so in my view, they are going to make Windows 7 into the
keep hold of system just like XP if they are not more careful. Fine have new
features but do not change the whole concept and still call it windows 10.
that is just silly. That is my feeling after being exposed to their messing
about. its as if the developers who used to regularly screw up Skype have
been let loose on the innards of Windows!
Hides behind sofa.  Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Nutt" <steve@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803


> Oh and isn't it time NVDA installed Win 10 essentials automagically if Win
> 10 is detected?  New users shouldn't certainly have to go hunting for
> addons
> for their screen reader.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
> Sent: 16 May 2018 15:43
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
> Hi,
>
> I just downloaded Win 10 essentials stable today, but it doesn't seem to
> make much difference.
>
> I must play a bit more.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian's Mail
> list account via Groups.Io
> Sent: 16 May 2018 13:17
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
> I expect Joseph will be along soon to ask about the  version of win 10
> essentials you have, but have you tried the pre release master snap?
> If that fails too then somebody in the development team needs to try to
> isolate what makes some machines work and others not.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal E-mail to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Nutt" <mailto:steve@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:31 PM
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
>
>> Hi Jacob,
>>
>>
>>
>> I have three machines here, all on 1803.  None of them work at all
>> well with NVDA in Windows 10, in fact, File Explorer is pretty much
>> unusable, as is Outlook.
>>
>>
>>
>> At this point, I'm glad I have JAWS as well.  But I don't know why
>> NVDA is so broken with 1803, more so than JAWS.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jacob
>> Kruger
>> Sent: 16 May 2018 09:10
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve, this sounds almost like an iteration of what I was mentioning -
>> it seems to fluctuate/vary quite a bit on/off on my one windows 10
>> 1803 machine, which is a lenovo laptop, whereas on my slightly lower
>> hardware specification desktop machine, that does however have a solid
>> state operating system drive in it, it actually seems to react a bit
>> more consistently, in terms of reading out list items, like in file
>> explorer, to me, and, this is with both of them running windows 10
>> 1803 pro 64 bit, and, currently both running NVDA master snapshot.
>>
>>
>>
>> Stay well
>>
>>
>>
>> Jacob Kruger
>> Blind Biker
>> Skype: BlindZA
>> "Resistance is futile..but, acceptance is versatile..."
>>
>> On 5/16/2018 10:03 AM, Steve Nutt wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>>
>> I recently reported that Outlook message lists were not reading for me.
>>
>>
>>
>> It is in fact worse than that, lists in general don't seem to be reading.
>> For example, File Explorer in Windows 10 is completely silent for me now.
>>
>>
>>
>> JAWS is reading lists quite happily.
>>
>>
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Computer Room Services
>>
>> 77 Exeter Close
>>
>> Stevenage
>>
>> Hertfordshire
>>
>> SG1 4PW
>>
>> Tel: +44(0)1438-742286
>>
>> Mob: +44(0)7956-334938
>>
>> Fax: +44(0)1438-759589
>>
>> Email:  <mailto:steve@...> steve@...
>>
>> Web:  <http://www.comproom.co.uk/> http://www.comproom.co.uk
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


Re: Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

The Gamages
 

Gene,
 
If you read my message again, you will note that I wanted to postpone updates and sets etc, not dismiss them out of hand, so you are putting words in my mouth.
However, thank you for the link to turn off sets.
 
Best Regards, Jim.
 

From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 3:34 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
 
I believe I read that sets is off by default but I'm not sure.  If not, you can turn them off.  Here is an article that describes how. 
Perhaps, instead of just rejecting the feature out of hand, a little time might be spent learning about them and trying them to see if they would be useful. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Gene
----- Original Message -----
 
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 4:59 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
 
Hello,
 
Having followed this thread with interest, I am still not sure whether the “sets” issue is on by default or not, if it’s not, then I don’t see the problem, just don’t turn it on until problems with screen readers are resolved. I haven’t got the latest update yet, I have my working hours set to6 am to 12 midnight and the computer is off outside those hours, I got a message recently  something like, “we couldn’t find a time to download updates”, could this be a way of stopping these updates to windows ten? or am I dreaming?, if it works, it could b a way of postponing them until all problems with screen readers are resolved.
 
I should say that I have Eset smart security on my system and this largely disables Windows defender anyway.
 
To Steve, I bet you are sad that Window eyes is now defunkt? I also noted from one of FS webinar that Jaws is likely to do away with the 40 minute mode in favour of a 30 day trial, Lots of people can’t afford the price of Jaws, I am lucky enough to have had it for years, Long live NVDA for those who are not in my position. I do understand that Steve runs a well known business and needs to have everything working to do his job, but Jaws hasn’t always been so brilliant, and still isn’t with some third party programs.
 
 
Best Regards, Jim.
 
From: Steve Nutt
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 8:19 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
 

Well if I was on NVDA only today, I couldn’t do my job.  This is why it’s always good to have more than one screen reader.

 

Besides, you’re probably not on Windows 10 1803 Spring Creators, which is where these issues started for me.

 

But saying I should be using NVDA and not JAWS doesn’t really add value to this thread, I merely reported that NVDA is broken for me on several machines.

 

All the best


Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Walker, Michael E
Sent: 16 May 2018 17:51
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

NVDA is broken? How so? I am on NVDA 2018.1.1. I always tell people thinking about using JAWS that they should be long on NVDA and short on JAWS, since NVDA is free and open source, and provides the same quality. It is kind of like John Wayne’s advice to be long on ears and short on jaws, but with my screen reader twist.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:48 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

Hi,

 

I have to say, over all, Windows 10 is snappier than Windows 7 ever was.

 

It’s just these glitches that get us.

 

What’s odd with this particular issue is that NVDA and Narrator are quite broken, but JAWS is a happy screen reader.  So they are obviously doing some serious hacking to get UIA to work as well as it does with JAWS.

 

All the best

 

Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 16 May 2018 17:00
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

That is only true if a lot of users, sighted users, get annoyed enough to matter.  A lot of the changes that inconvenience blind users until they learn how to use them may be intuitive and quickly understood by sighted users.  and, in the case of screen-reader problems, sighted people wouldn't have any of those problems.  Also, as in the new feature of sets, they may not be on by default.  As I recall what I read, sets is off by default.

 

But every time a new major update to Windows comes out, I see enough blind users have problems that I'm in no hurry to get Windows 10.  Even if the problems are temporary, such as screen-reader problems that are dealt with not too long after the upgrade, Windows 10 has nothing I want that justifies even relatively minor inconveniences time after time.

 

I'll get it when I get a new computer.  I won't upgrade a machine that is working very well with an earlier version of Windows.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 10:47 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803

 

I think the one thing I'm really annoyed about is that Microsoft keep on
fiddling with things that used to work and making them not work. I have
actually given  up on 10 as a working platform, unless Microsoft can simply
provide a system stable and just with security updates like windows 7. They
are not doing themselves any good by bringing out new versions of windows
every6 months or so in my view, they are going to make Windows 7 into the
keep hold of system just like XP if they are not more careful. Fine have new
features but do not change the whole concept and still call it windows 10.
that is just silly. That is my feeling after being exposed to their messing
about. its as if the developers who used to regularly screw up Skype have
been let loose on the innards of Windows!
Hides behind sofa.  Brian

bglists@...
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Nutt" <steve@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803


> Oh and isn't it time NVDA installed Win 10 essentials automagically if Win
> 10 is detected?  New users shouldn't certainly have to go hunting for
> addons
> for their screen reader.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
> Sent: 16 May 2018 15:43
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
> Hi,
>
> I just downloaded Win 10 essentials stable today, but it doesn't seem to
> make much difference.
>
> I must play a bit more.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian's Mail
> list account via Groups.Io
> Sent: 16 May 2018 13:17
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
> I expect Joseph will be along soon to ask about the  version of win 10
> essentials you have, but have you tried the pre release master snap?
> If that fails too then somebody in the development team needs to try to
> isolate what makes some machines work and others not.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal E-mail to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Nutt" <mailto:steve@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2018 12:31 PM
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>
>
>> Hi Jacob,
>>
>>
>>
>> I have three machines here, all on 1803.  None of them work at all
>> well with NVDA in Windows 10, in fact, File Explorer is pretty much
>> unusable, as is Outlook.
>>
>>
>>
>> At this point, I'm glad I have JAWS as well.  But I don't know why
>> NVDA is so broken with 1803, more so than JAWS.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jacob
>> Kruger
>> Sent: 16 May 2018 09:10
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] Problems with NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve, this sounds almost like an iteration of what I was mentioning -
>> it seems to fluctuate/vary quite a bit on/off on my one windows 10
>> 1803 machine, which is a lenovo laptop, whereas on my slightly lower
>> hardware specification desktop machine, that does however have a solid
>> state operating system drive in it, it actually seems to react a bit
>> more consistently, in terms of reading out list items, like in file
>> explorer, to me, and, this is with both of them running windows 10
>> 1803 pro 64 bit, and, currently both running NVDA master snapshot.
>>
>>
>>
>> Stay well
>>
>>
>>
>> Jacob Kruger
>> Blind Biker
>> Skype: BlindZA
>> "Resistance is futile..but, acceptance is versatile..."
>>
>> On 5/16/2018 10:03 AM, Steve Nutt wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>>
>> I recently reported that Outlook message lists were not reading for me.
>>
>>
>>
>> It is in fact worse than that, lists in general don't seem to be reading.
>> For example, File Explorer in Windows 10 is completely silent for me now.
>>
>>
>>
>> JAWS is reading lists quite happily.
>>
>>
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Computer Room Services
>>
>> 77 Exeter Close
>>
>> Stevenage
>>
>> Hertfordshire
>>
>> SG1 4PW
>>
>> Tel: +44(0)1438-742286
>>
>> Mob: +44(0)7956-334938
>>
>> Fax: +44(0)1438-759589
>>
>> Email:  <mailto:steve@...> steve@...
>>
>> Web:  <http://www.comproom.co.uk/> http://www.comproom.co.uk
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


Re: Call me stupid but..

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

This page does not exist.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
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Please address personal E-mail to:-
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Vlad Dragomir" <vladdragomir1983@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 3:18 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Call me stupid but..


Hello,

Alternatively, you can go to drive.google.com, press space on Settings, and enter on Download Backup and Sync.

All the best,

Vlad.


Re: Call me stupid but..

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I did that and nothing actually happened which is why I mentioned it here. Not sure that the other site will be up to date. Does it still just download the stub?
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Vlad Dragomir" <vladdragomir1983@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 3:18 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Call me stupid but..


Hello,

Alternatively, you can go to drive.google.com, press space on Settings, and enter on Download Backup and Sync.

All the best,

Vlad.


Re: new technology challenge

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I had a wonderful one the other day though. A GDPR data storage request by a healthcare organisation with two serious oversights
1. The privacy and terms and conditions were not written yet, and
2. Click on the picture which has a shopfront to prove you are not a robot!
I think in this case though you are right there should not be any need for the signature, unless those at the company are thick as planks.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Sarah k Alawami" <marrie12@gmail.com>
To: "nvda list list" <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 2:10 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] new technology challenge


You will need sighted help for this either borrowing a pair of eyes or have soneone remote in via team viewer and do it that way.

Take care

On May 18, 2018, at 6:08 PM, mcLeod stinnett <macks75205@gmail.com> wrote:


--
from mack have win 7 64 bit desktop pc mouse and keyboard. and n v d a 2017.3 my dentist sent me an online form to sign and complete, to save me time on my first visit. however, I can't get past the first page, I can check all the boxes but it says to use your cursor to sign your name below. can a blind person do this, do you need a smart phone, or one a pc with one of those interactive pencils to sign in the box. I don't know how a blind would move a cursor around to make letters without one of those interactive pencil
here is the link,
https://blairconditt.dentalsymphony.com/patient/newpatient.aspx I do have someone to help me when I go to the office, I was just trying to submit the form online, so I would not have to arrive early and bother a sighted person to fill out the paperwork.



Re: Strange behavior of NVDA and Windows 10 at machine startup

 

Hello all,

As I said yesterday, I'll disable NVDA from startup for me as a user and for the sign-in screen and enable Narrator there instead. I've done it, and here are the results. When I booted my machine this morning, Narrator started on the lock/sign-in screen, but that did not invoke the "Ease of access" menu. Otherwise, the behavior is the same: moments after the lock screen appears, it displays user information such as weather forecast, upcoming alarms, etc. So, Microsoft definitely has changed something about how the lock screen works in Windows 10 version 1803. I don't mind those changes, but the appearance of the "Ease of access" menu invoked it seams by NVDA is something that should be fixed.

Strangely enough, I've powered on my "Insider Preview" virtual machine last night and now it does not have this behavior, even though previously it did. The only difference in it now in comparison with before is that now it is running a RS5 (build 17672) of Windows 10 and when the problem occurred it was running RS4 builds of Windows 10 (builds 17134 and older). So, my guess is that maybe there is a bug in Windows 10 RS4, which was fixed in RS5 builds. Let's hope so... I'll keep an eye on things.

BTW: And in answer to a question I think was from Sarah - no, I'll don't have any intentions whatsoever to disable my lock screen, at least for now - I like it this way. 😀

______
Best wishes,
Kostadin Kolev


На 18.5.2018 г. в 10:06, Kostadin Kolev написа:

Hello all,

As I said in my previous message, I've disabled "Fast Boot" yesterday. That however, did not help for the strange behavior - this morning I turned on my PC and the behavior was the same. So, "Fast Boot" is not to blame here.

I'll leave it be as it is for now, until I can gather some useful technical information and eventually report this to Microsoft.

One more thing that I'll try is to disable NVDA at startup for me as a user and for the lock/sign-in screen and instead enable Narrator for that. If the problem with the appearing "Ease of access" menu persists even after that, I'll definitely report this to Microsoft.

______
Best wishes,
Kostadin Kolev


На 17.5.2018 г. в 17:33, Kostadin Kolev написа:

Hello all,

Chris, it is not so. Firstly, I don't hear Narrator speaking and in such a case I should, because it uses a different voice from NVDA. Secondly, I don't see the Narrator Cursor on the screen and with my settings I should, if Narrator is running. Thirdly, I checked in Control Panel -> Ease of access -> Change sign-in settings and Narrator there is not set to run neither on the lock screen, nor after I sign in.

Part of the described in my first message behavior (the one about displaying user information on the lock screen) might be considered as normal, specially if Microsoft have done some changes as to how things load after a "Fast Boot". But I don't think displaying the "Ease of access" menu without me invoking it manually could be considered a normal behavior. And some more food for thought: shouldn't the user's things and information be loaded after he signs in and not before that (?).

I could, and probably will, contact Microsoft about this, but firstly I wanted to ask if I'm the only one experiencing this. I don't think so, because I've experienced it in my virtual machine with Windows 10 Insider Preview, but I've attributed it to the slowness of the virtual machine. Apparently that is not the case.

I've temporarily disabled "Fast Boot" and will test how things go.

______
Best wishes,
Kostadin Kolev


На 17.5.2018 г. в 15:35, Chris via Groups.Io написа:

It sounds like you have both narrator and nvda to start on the login screen, check settings in both narrator and nvda

 

As for the other stuff you can change them in settings > personalization > lock screen

 

So nothing unusual at all really 😃

 

 

 

From: Kostadin Kolev
Sent: 17 May 2018 13:06
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Strange behavior of NVDA and Windows 10 at machine startup

 

Hello all,

I've noticed this strange behavior after the update of Windows 10 to version 1803. The behavior is the following. When the machine starts and Windows 10 loads, it gets to the lock screen as it should. Initially it all looks normal, but only for a while. Moments after that, the lock screen displays not only the time and date as it normally does, but user-specific information as well (e.g. weather forecast, upcoming alarms, etc.). Not only that, but the NVDA startup sound is heard, as if the desktop copy of NVDA is loaded, even though it should load only when the specific user signs in. I can't tell for sure if the desktop copy of NVDA loads, because my NVDA settings for the desktop and secure screen copies of it are the same. On top of that, the "Ease of access" menu appears and NVDA starts reading its menu items one by one. This happens when I power up the machine with "Fast Boot" enabled. I haven't tried with "Fast Boot" disabled, but when I restart the machine, the behavior described above does not occur. So, it must be related to "Fast Boot" somehow. And this did not occur before the update to version 1803 of Windows 10.

Has anyone else experienced the behavior described above? Have you found any solutions besides turning off "Fast Boot"? Turning off "Fast Boot" is also a solution, but I'd prefer to keep it on if possible.

______
Best wishes,
Kostadin Kolev